I have no idea how "weights" are achieved in certain instances. I'm intrigued. "Weighting Agent?" I'm sure the amount varies between Champion, Star, Etc.

So, what weight do discs generally come out at?
Meaning no or hardly any weighting agent.
Do all discs have some amount of "agent"?
Is the agent spread uniformly across the disc's plastic?
Does this "agent" affect the set-up of discs or make them harder of softer?
So many questions.
.

Good questions, but some are too difficult to cover here, such as the first two.
The generic weight of any disc depends mainly on the mass of the mold and the specific gravity of the plastic. Weighting agents, (which are usually metal salts) are added in various degrees to achieve various weights over the generic weight. The weighting agents are mixed in to achieve a relative uniform density. Yes, the weighting agent does affect the set-up of discs and usually makes them harder.

Time ,Space Thing? IT is still the 25th here

after watching the oceans 13 film i now know what the weighting agents look like in the early stages of plastic dice manufacturing.

after watching the oceans 13 film i now know what the weighting agents look like in the early stages of plastic dice manufacturing.

Many different types. Tungsten powder has a specific gravity of about 19gm/ccm. It would probably be the heaviest available. Tungsten oxide is about 7.2gm/ccm. For those who don't know; water is the base at 1gm/ccm.

Any disc whose plastic has a specific gravity lower than 1, will float. Unweighted DX and R-Pro will float. Unweighted Pro, Champion, Star, and Echo Star, will not.

I was wondering when the Vulcan will be released for the rest of Innovas dealers?

Dave, is it too late to turn in 2010 CFR certificates?

Dave, is it too late to turn in 2010 CFR certificates?

Its never to late as far as i know, I won schawg the year after turning some in. So i think they will roll over to 2011 drawings.

I was wondering when the Vulcan will be released for the rest of Innovas dealers?

We are shooting for mid January. It depends when the East Office is ready.

I have noticed this, I have a few of these myself. There is also the KC pro stamped 11x teebirds as well. In order of stability, from most stable to least it seems to go KC Pro 11x, CAL 11x, and then CA 11x.

i ran across one of these the other day. i tend to prefer the pearly 11x cal teebirds myself, and a buddy of mine said he had a pearly teebird and wanted to get rid of it because it wasn't as stable as his other teebirds. the disc had the regular 11x distance driver stamp, and sure enough it was marked as a TL on the back. comparing it with a teebird in my bag it was definitely a TL. i thought it was strange because up until this point i hadn't seen a 11x stamped TL...i know the CE teebirds and TL's had the same stamp. i also thought it was strange because i haven't run across a pearly TL either. anybody have any idea how common these discs may be?

Hey Dave,

At the Piney Woods Open a feww weeks ago LSDiscs had some prototypes which had X-Clone looking tops matched with a wing from a Boss or other driver. Lars explained that they were made in an attempt to make 150 class molds more overstable for use at the Japan Open. While that sounds somewhat credible I was wondering if you had anything to say about these discs.

hey Dave- just finally had to replace my last champ gator. was dissappointed that the only option i thought existed was the beadless star. An order came in yesterday and i was very pleased to see that the star gator i ordered had a bead and appeared to be the x-mold! thanks alot! are all gators now going to be the beaded x-mold? i would think they should be. now if you could just get them to come out flat (mine has a massive, poppy-top dome, but i can fix that) we would have our beloved gator back. thanks again-

Hey Dave,

At the Piney Woods Open a feww weeks ago LSDiscs had some prototypes which had X-Clone looking tops matched with a wing from a Boss or other driver. Lars explained that they were made in an attempt to make 150 class molds more overstable for use at the Japan Open. While that sounds somewhat credible I was wondering if you had anything to say about these discs.

Well I am not DAve, but the disc is the XB, go up a couple of pages and read all about it.

hey Dave- just finally had to replace my last champ gator. was dissappointed that the only option i thought existed was the beadless star. An order came in yesterday and i was very pleased to see that the star gator i ordered had a bead and appeared to be the x-mold! thanks alot! are all gators now going to be the beaded x-mold? i would think they should be. now if you could just get them to come out flat (mine has a massive, poppy-top dome, but i can fix that) we would have our beloved gator back. thanks again-

I did the beadless X mold as I thought the beaded would be too crazy over stable, but apparently I was wrong. The beaded X will stay. The dome comes and goes with the plastic batches we get from the manufacturers. Right now we are molding relatively flat, however the Gator isn't in right now. Hopefully, we will be in a flat plastic trend when we run them again.

i ran across one of these the other day. i tend to prefer the pearly 11x cal teebirds myself, and a buddy of mine said he had a pearly teebird and wanted to get rid of it because it wasn't as stable as his other teebirds. the disc had the regular 11x distance driver stamp, and sure enough it was marked as a TL on the back. comparing it with a teebird in my bag it was definitely a TL. i thought it was strange because up until this point i hadn't seen a 11x stamped TL...i know the CE teebirds and TL's had the same stamp. i also thought it was strange because i haven't run across a pearly TL either. anybody have any idea how common these discs may be?

Ive got a few of these...pearly champion tee bird tls from 2003. Most were tournament stamped discs. The see through last run ce tis are from a similar time frame... If it had an 11x stamp on it, it was probably a miss stamped disc. Sweet flying grippy durable champion plastic.

I did the beadless X mold as I thought the beaded would be too crazy over stable, but apparently I was wrong. The beaded X will stay. The dome comes and goes with the plastic batches we get from the manufacturers. Right now we are molding relatively flat, however the Gator isn't in right now. Hopefully, we will be in a flat plastic trend when we run them again.


So can you tell us what are you molding now? There are a few discs that I prefer much more when the flat plastic is used. Star Destroyers and Champion Monarchs top the list and seem to be the hardest for me to get my hands on.

Thanks

Hey Dave is there any chance of different color glow disc's coming out? Maybe orange or red? Thanks.

So can you tell us what are you molding now? There are a few discs that I prefer much more when the flat plastic is used. Star Destroyers and Champion Monarchs top the list and seem to be the hardest for me to get my hands on.

Thanks

We haven't run those two yet. Firebirds, TeeBirds, Starfires are a few that got run fairly flat.

Hey Dave is there any chance of different color glow disc's coming out? Maybe orange or red? Thanks.

Maybe, but all the other glow colors don't glow as well as green. Blue, orange, and red are comparatively dull.

(mine has a massive, poppy-top dome, but i can fix that)

can you tell us how this is done?

Thanks Dave

Ok Dave I have a night shift orc and I love it!

Any chance of another "night shift" mold coming out in the future?

Besides the Boss I was thinking another small rim disc.

Thanks!

Ok Dave I have a night shift orc and I love it!

Any chance of another "night shift" mold coming out in the future?

Besides the Boss I was thinking another small rim disc.

Thanks!

I would like a case of Nightshift orcs, destroyers (so money for years), and teebirds. If we all band together then they have to make them right? please?

i have a few nightshift orcs if yall are interested. pm me :)

has anyone noticed different colors of max weight star beasts being more stable than others?

Hi Dave,
recieved a R-PRo Tank (..from Sharon/Mark Molnar), my question; it is marked which what looked as "P 1s" or "P Ls" ? Was it a test shot for a new model?

has anyone noticed different colors of max weight star beasts being more stable than others?

Dark blue with some dome are the most stable

I know a top 25 ranked player in the world that swears by them...

why in the world would someone want an over stable beast.

I said stable Brad, not overstable...

and having a stable beast is nice because it hyzer-flips nicely and has lots of glide.

Hi Dave,
recieved a R-PRo Tank (..from Sharon/Mark Molnar), my question; it is marked which what looked as "P 1s" or "P Ls" ? Was it a test shot for a new model?

Test shots for possible reintroduction. Don't remember the marking.

Ok Dave I have a night shift orc and I love it!

Any chance of another "night shift" mold coming out in the future?

Besides the Boss I was thinking another small rim disc.

Thanks!

Yes.

I said stable Brad, not overstable...

and having a stable beast is nice because it hyzer-flips nicely and has lots of glide.



thats what a destroyer is for.

Dark blue with some dome are the most stable

I know a top 25 ranked player in the world that swears by them...

the orange ones seem to be very stable as well, i dont use beasts for over-stability so i was trying to figure out which ones are less stable. i was throwing the yellow ones and they had a nice turn, but i cant find many of them.

yeah when I say "stable" I mean it is straight...

if your looking for something understable just throw a lighter disc...

if that does not work try the orc...

yeah when I say "stable" I mean it is straight...

if your looking for something understable just throw a lighter disc...

if that does not work try the orc...

Isn't the Orc More Stable? I have the Old Mold Beast that flies similar to the Orc til they get beat. I thought when they retooled the Beast they made it little understable than the Orc becasue these two where too close in flight. Correct me if I am wrong as I havent thrown the new mold beasts.

Bravo My Destroyers do not Hyzer flip like a Beast will. You must be snapping the hell out of them. Or using Beat Destroyers

yeah when I say "stable" I mean it is straight...

if your looking for something understable just throw a lighter disc...

if that does not work try the orc...

nah i dont want to throw anything light, and as dave has said, light doesnt always mean less stable.

i was just looking for a normal star beast, the orange one was freakishly overstable for a beast.
i got some white ones and they are normal like the yellow ones. the plastic looks the same as well.

Isn't the Orc More Stable? I have the Old Mold Beast that flies similar to the Orc til they get beat. I thought when they retooled the Beast they made it little understable than the Orc becasue these two where too close in flight. Correct me if I am wrong as I havent thrown the new mold beasts.

Bravo My Destroyers do not Hyzer flip like a Beast will. You must be snapping the hell out of them. Or using Beat Destroyers



my destroyers are my long balls. they imediately replaced my wraiths as such.
the old mold beasts i have in my bag have replaced the orcs altogeather.
the best orcs that i have thrown for consistancy and control were the tulsa worlds special blends.(multiple aces with different disc all were tulsa orcs.)
when i throw a beast i dont expect the disc to finish stable at all.
when i throw my destroyers they flip nicely and rarely flip understabel,however they finish very straight at the end of their flight.

Hey Dave, will they ever make regular production Star Groove's? Thank's.

Dave,

Love the fact the XD got made in champion plastic for the Asia Open.
Any chance that they will be put into production. Please Please Please make this happen and the Star XDs

Hey Dave,

Just check to see if your still doing the CFR drawings? Still showing November as the last month on your website.

Thanks in advanced!!

Josh

Hey Dave, will they ever make regular production Star Groove's? Thank's.

Maybe, but they're not on the schedule right now.

Dave,

Love the fact the XD got made in champion plastic for the Asia Open.
Any chance that they will be put into production. Please Please Please make this happen and the Star XDs

Probably not regular production, but we will run all plastics from time to time and will have them available through channels other than CFR at some point.

Hey Dave,

Just check to see if your still doing the CFR drawings? Still showing November as the last month on your website.

Thanks in advanced!!

Josh

Far as I know we are. I will check it out this morning. Thanks for the heads up.

Probably not regular production, but we will run all plastics from time to time and will have them available through channels other than CFR at some point.

Thanks Dave. I won't be trading or selling my Champ XDs then LOL.

Hey Dave,

Just check to see if your still doing the CFR drawings? Still showing November as the last month on your website.

Thanks in advanced!!

Josh

The CFR winners have been picked and notified for December and January. The web site had not been updated, but will be soon.

Hey Dave, will they ever make regular production Star Groove's? Thank's.

If anyone is looking for star grooves i have some, they are echo star, send me a PM

dave,
the 2005 usdgc ken climo 4x glow rocs are amazingly durable, predictable flying discs, and the secondary market has steadily started going through the roof, pricewise.

my question is what do you remember about the manufacturing, comments, etc about the disc when it came out? i have also heard that the glow champion plastic used for them was in fact CE plastic - is that true?

thank you for your time.


http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x443/leswhite6082/2005kenclimo.jpg

Doubtful... Glow Champion does age like CE though, and is usually slightly more overstable for some reason. Throwers I have talked with have said the "Battle Roc" is actually a better Roc than the original '01s, or even a poor mans '01. Not anymore really, as the Battles are getting very pricey.

dave,
the 2005 usdgc ken climo 4x glow rocs are amazingly durable, predictable flying discs, and the secondary market has steadily started going through the roof, pricewise.

my question is what do you remember about the manufacturing, comments, etc about the disc when it came out? i have also heard that the glow champion plastic used for them was in fact CE plastic - is that true?

thank you for your time.


http://i1182.photobucket.com/albums/x443/leswhite6082/2005kenclimo.jpg

Sorry, I don't remember what exactly was the difference, if any. I have heard quite a few times about glow Champion being generally better than regular Champion.

Dave, I am a Pig lover. IMO I think it is the best headwind putter out there. Will they ever make a Champ Pig? If so, when? Thanks!

Dave, I am a Pig lover. IMO I think it is the best headwind putter out there. Will they ever make a Champ Pig? If so, when? Thanks!

I can't say right now, but I suspect we can't make them light enough in Champion. If we can, we probably will at some point.

I can't say right now, but I suspect we can't make them light enough in Champion. If we can, we probably will at some point.


Would the same problems apply for Star / Echo Star?

Would the same problems apply for Star / Echo Star?

Yes. Specific gravity for those materials is much higher than for R-Pro or DX. The same volume of plastic is heavier for the high tech plastics.

Dave
A friend was asking Why the Teerex isn't made in Pro Plastic?

Dave,

I was throwing the Wedge today and was thoroughly surprised by the disc. I really enjoyed the flight, however I don't want to invest in the DX for durability reasons. The star first run stamps are pretty limited and retailers have marked them up. Is there a chance we will see the Wedge run in star with the stock stamp? The disc is very versatile and I would really like to have one in my bag for utility and tough "out" shots.

Also, I really like the feel of the new Tanks. Hope to see more of these.

Thanks,
Zach J

Is the DX TeeRex stamp, with graphic of a T. Rex, ever used for other plastics? Why not?

Dave
A friend was asking Why the Teerex isn't made in Pro Plastic?

Not sure right now, but probably because our supply of Pro plastic is iffy at times. Sometimes we have a lot, and sometimes we can't get it. A couple of years ago we had to restrict the models to a few.

Is the DX TeeRex stamp, with graphic of a T. Rex, ever used for other plastics? Why not?

We only use images for DX as a way to differentiate for normal stamped stock.

i also wondered why there wasn't a champion teerex? i know there is the teerex-x, but quite the same thing.

i also wondered why there wasn't a champion teerex? i know there is the teerex-x, but quite the same thing.

That's a good question. Don't know why we never got around to running a Champion TeeRex. We probably should have started with Champion. Maybe it was in CFR, but even then, it should have been released later.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Innova-Teerex-disc-golf-frisbee-disc-Champion-CFR-/220729236468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33647cdbf4

http://cgi.ebay.com/Innova-Teerex-disc-golf-frisbee-disc-Champion-CFR-/220729236468?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33647cdbf4

Yeah. Apparently it has always been in TFR/CFR

i also wondered why there wasn't a champion teerex? i know there is the teerex-x, but quite the same thing.

A champion Teerex was made for the 07, or 08 US Masters. They were released when the proto champ destroyers were released. I heard this was the original Teexex mold, not the Teerex-x. They were all blue and had a gold sparkle stamp. I can't recall how many were made, but I think it was something like 120. I have 2. One used, and one mint if anyone is interested. They aren't very glidey. Mark @ discgolfvalues would have more info on the exact runs.

Dave,
How many of the Star Wedges were made? Thx

Dave,
How many of the Star Wedges were made? Thx

About 1200 of the Star stamped Wedges. A bit more that were not stamped.

About 1200 of the Star stamped Wedges. A bit more that were not stamped.

Dave,

Will we be seeing any stock run's of star Wedges? I really enjoy the DX but it doesnt hold up on the texas ground

thanks,
Zach J

Dave,

Will we be seeing any stock run's of star Wedges? I really enjoy the DX but it doesnt hold up on the texas ground

thanks,
Zach J

Yes, I don't see why not.

Hey Dave,
Any more of these coming out anytime soon? I remember asking you in 2004 about them, and you said they were made when supply justified, or something to that effect. I was just wondering if that was still the case.
Thanks

Hey Dave,
Any more of these coming out anytime soon? I remember asking you in 2004 about them, and you said they were made when supply justified, or something to that effect. I was just wondering if that was still the case.
Thanks

Still the case. We will probably have a more regular supply by this time next year.

Hey Dave,
I have a question about disc weights. I started weighing my plastic, and I have several discs that are marked 175g, but actually weigh anywhere from 176g to 178g, thus making them over weight for PDGA play. I guess I'm wondering how these discs leave the factory without being X-outs, or at least being marked with the correct weight? It also makes it difficult to purchase a disc online, or even in person at a retailer. I'm now looking at replacing a bunch of discs so that I'm not disqualified in my next tournament. Is there a way to reduce the weight of a disc without breaking any rules?

Hey Dave,
I have a question about disc weights. I started weighing my plastic, and I have several discs that are marked 175g, but actually weigh anywhere from 176g to 178g, thus making them over weight for PDGA play. I guess I'm wondering how these discs leave the factory without being X-outs, or at least being marked with the correct weight? It also makes it difficult to purchase a disc online, or even in person at a retailer. I'm now looking at replacing a bunch of discs so that I'm not disqualified in my next tournament. Is there a way to reduce the weight of a disc without breaking any rules?

Dave answered this before, but I cant find the posts.

I think what he said was the discs absorb moisture after they are produced and shipped off, thus gaining mass.

Well if that is the case, there must be a ton of players out there with "illegal" discs that don't even know it. The Japan Open is the only tourney that I am aware of that actually verifies the discs that players use. Am I expected to look past the fact that I, along with many of my competitors, are using over weight discs? It seems that Innova and the PDGA would make a stronger effort to correct this problem if they expect players to follow technical standards. I feel like the weight tolerance (1.5%) used for Super Class events could be applied to regular tournaments and the problem could be somewhat alleviated. Any ideas Dave?

Well if that is the case, there must be a ton of players out there with "illegal" discs that don't even know it. The Japan Open is the only tourney that I am aware of that actually verifies the discs that players use. Am I expected to look past the fact that I, along with many of my competitors, are using over weight discs? It seems that Innova and the PDGA would make a stronger effort to correct this problem if they expect players to follow technical standards. I feel like the weight tolerance (1.5%) used for Super Class events could be applied to regular tournaments and the problem could be somewhat alleviated. Any ideas Dave?

Discs do get mis weighed and mis marked. That's going to happen. Discs made of Star and Champion are hygroscopic and can gain 2 or 3gms after molding. Unfortunately, getting that water out by heating will probably warp the disc. I suppose you could leave it in kitty litter or some other dessicant over night. That might do something.

As I have said before, the only fairly certain way of not getting an overweight disc is either to weigh it before purchase, buy it from an on-line guy who will certify the weight for you, or buy a disc a couple of grams off the max. Our dealers can return unused overweight discs for replacement, so they could offer a verification service to their customers. They don't have to sell over weight discs.

I have a 1st run bar stamp puma I was wondering if is it worth anything or should i take it out of the bag and try it out ?

I have a 1st run bar stamp puma I was wondering if is it worth anything or should i take it out of the bag and try it out ?

Save it. Its worth more now in that bag than it would be in your bag.

Have they changed the 12x firebird mold?

Discs do get mis weighed and mis marked. That's going to happen. Discs made of Star and Champion are hygroscopic and can gain 2 or 3gms after molding. Unfortunately, getting that water out by heating will probably warp the disc. I suppose you could leave it in kitty litter or some other dessicant over night. That might do something.

As I have said before, the only fairly certain way of not getting an overweight disc is either to weigh it before purchase, buy it from an on-line guy who will certify the weight for you, or buy a disc a couple of grams off the max. Our dealers can return unused overweight discs for replacement, so they could offer a verification service to their customers. They don't have to sell over weight discs.

wonder if putting a disc in rice would suck out the moisture? works for wet cell phones...

hey Dave-=
are the newer r-pro rocs the regular rancho mold or are they the roc+ mold?

thanks

hey Dave-=
are the newer r-pro rocs the regular rancho mold or are they the roc+ mold?

thanks

I don't recall but you can tell by the engraving. Both Ranchos say Rancho, but the plus mold has the engraving much closer to the rim.

Hey Dave, I was wondering if we could ever see r-pro destroyer's?

Dave, I have many Champion Edition discs that are less then 10 years old that keep developing a dusty looking film. It covers the disc, and when wiped off leaves kind of a greasy appearance to the plastic. One disc is from the 2001 Worlds in the Twin Cities, its a Millennium JLS. It has never been thrown and is designating . the disc are kept in a dark spot, dry and stacked horizontally . What do you think is causing this. Leopards, T-birds, Firebirds and Valkyries are al involved. SEAS

Hey Dave, I was wondering if we could ever see r-pro destroyer's?

Definitely, if we can develop a tougher R-Pro material.

Dave, I have many Champion Edition discs that are less then 10 years old that keep developing a dusty looking film. It covers the disc, and when wiped off leaves kind of a greasy appearance to the plastic. One disc is from the 2001 Worlds in the Twin Cities, its a Millennium JLS. It has never been thrown and is designating . the disc are kept in a dark spot, dry and stacked horizontally . What do you think is causing this. Leopards, T-birds, Firebirds and Valkyries are al involved. SEAS

That was one of the marks of the original CE. That is something mixed in the plastic that oozes out over time. Sometimes color does this, and sometimes the plasticizing agent used to make the plastic flexible does this. From your description (greasy), I would guess plasticizer. From our point of view, it is random other than we know there is a limit to which a plastic can hold other ingredients such as weighting agent, plasticizer, color, and mold release agents. The limit varies from plastic to plastic.

Dave,

Trying to pinpoint this disc and can't figure out what it could be.
TX States 88' stamp
Thanks for any input.

Dave,

Trying to pinpoint this disc and can't figure out what it could be.
TX States 88' stamp
Thanks for any input.

Not sure, but if it is a small diameter disc, it would have to be either a Classic Ace or an XD.

Classic Ace? Not the original?

Stamp says 1988, and bottom stamp is Ontario. Wasn't Innova still in San Marino in '88?

Stamp says 1988, and bottom stamp is Ontario. Wasn't Innova still in San Marino in '88?

We were never "in" San Marino. That was a PO box near Tim's parent's house that we used. We started in Temple City and quickly moved to South El Monte. We move to Ontario in 1987-1988. That was the first place we actually did our own molding.

Good stuff, thx for the history.

Dave,

Any ETA on 2011 Innova catalog?

Dave,

Any ETA on 2011 Innova catalog?

It has been sent to the printers, so any day now, I expect.

got mine in GA last week! :)

Hey Dave, I have a 166g 1st run Groove and a 166g regular run, the 1st run is domeyer then the regular run. My question is do they change the molds after the 1st run? Or why is the 1st run domeyer? Thanks!

Hey Dave,

Jay Redding was talking about a new Yeti Pro plastic Aviar coming out soon
What info can you give on these?

Hey Dave, I have a 166g 1st run Groove and a 166g regular run, the 1st run is domeyer then the regular run. My question is do they change the molds after the 1st run? Or why is the 1st run domeyer? Thanks!

All of the runs were supposed to be like the first, but it didn't turn out that way. It's an artifact of the particular batch of material we are using at the time. Not a mold change.

Hey Dave,

Jay Redding was talking about a new Yeti Pro plastic Aviar coming out soon
What info can you give on these?

We will be coming out with it as soon as we get it hot stamped on both coasts. It is a BB Aviar with a firm and grippy Pro plastic. It has a somewhat sunken flight plate that give a solid lower profile grip, and a very straight flight as oppose to other BBs which tend to be a lot more over stable.

That sounds great! A seasoned up KC with bonus grip without having to throw it for a couple years to get it there. Im glad Jay got this. He's an amazing putter and a GREAT person.

Dave- do you anticipate any new discs or plastic types (special blend maybe?) to be added to the CFR program this year?
Thanks

Also, Dave or anyone else- are the CFR Glow FB's all flat? Or is there a mix of flat to domey.

Hey Dave,

I've been hearing rumors of another new driver(s) to be released soon. Any truth to this? If so what's the time frame?

Thanks,

Mike

Dave- do you anticipate any new discs or plastic types (special blend maybe?) to be added to the CFR program this year?
Thanks
.


I am sure we will be adding new discs. New plastic types, I am not sure. We do have some glitter Champion. Just a cool look.

Hey Dave,

I've been hearing rumors of another new driver(s) to be released soon. Any truth to this? If so what's the time frame?

Thanks,

Mike

Yes we have a couple of long range drivers to fill holes on our driver chart. The first is the Ape. This is the XCaliber equivalent to a Boss. The second will be a slightly less stable Wraith like driver that will come in weights down to 158gms in Champion, Pro, or Star plastic.

The Ape is scheduled for release in April, I believe. The other disc, which doesn't have a name yet, will be after that.

If it's a step down in speed from the Ape then perhaps Gibbon or Lemur, or maybe Oraithitan if it turns over? ;)

Hey Dave, I see the Ape is approved. I was wondering what the turn ratings were going to be? And is it going to be a headwind driver? Thanks again!

If it's a step down in speed from the Ape then perhaps Gibbon or Lemur, or maybe Oraithitan if it turns over? ;)

Chuck is not a bad name for a disc.

Hey Dave, I see the Ape is approved. I was wondering what the turn ratings were going to be? And is it going to be a headwind driver? Thanks again!


Definitely a headwind, sidearm, spike for big boys. Numbers are the same as
XCaliber, but one speed number higher. 13,5,0,4.

Chuck is not a bad name for a disc.
Especially if I can get the signature commission...:)

especially if i can get the signature commission...:)
:) :), what about more overstable version of the Zephyr named Chuck...

It would be a great "weather" disc, as it could make its own unlimited amount of wind to counteract that occurring naturally.

Chuck is not a bad name for a disc.

That disc would have to be called "The Professor"

I'm thinking maybe it could be a renamed Birdie - a couple a "chucks" and you're in...

I'm thinking maybe it could be a renamed Birdie - a couple a "chucks" and you're in...

I remember a thread a while back that was about apropos disc golf names and Chuck is definitely one of them. One of our local La Mirada guys has one of the best: Chuck Gunn. Real name. Anyone top that?

Any chance their will be a run of Pirhanas in the near future, DX fundraiser maybe?
The prices on ebay are at $40+, there was a starstamped one that went for over 130!?

Any chance their will be a run of Pirhanas in the near future, DX fundraiser maybe?
The prices on ebay are at $40+, there was a starstamped one that went for over 130!?

No. That mold is gone. We will be bringing back many of the other discontinued discs, though.

Terry Dischinger, a former NBA player & orthodontist I have done DVD production work for. Not a disc golfer, but the #1 disc golf surname of all time.

No. That mold is gone. We will be bringing back many of the other discontinued discs, though.

How's the R Pro Coupe coming along?

Hey Dave,

Do you ever plan on writing a book about how everything got started for Innova?

Who had the ideas, what worked what didn't, company drama.....

A comprehensive history

How's the R Pro Coupe coming along?

CHAMPION RAMS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Come on Dave, run a few tests shots and bring them to the US masters and I"ll take um off your hands.

Hammerhead!
Of course, the Phenix would be something, as it is my sponsor.
I think the best original release would be the ORIGINAL Classic Roc.

How's the R Pro Coupe coming along?

Nothing yet.

Hey Dave,

Do you ever plan on writing a book about how everything got started for Innova?

Who had the ideas, what worked what didn't, company drama.....

A comprehensive history

I doubt if I write anything. I'm not a good writer. If I did write anything, it would be on playing disc golf.

Hammerhead!
Of course, the Phenix would be something, as it is my sponsor.
I think the best original release would be the ORIGINAL Classic Roc.

The Phenix mold is gone, so that can't happen. We are planning on shooting the Classic Roc to the original specs of the Classic San Marino Roc soon.

Where are the Yetis?

Sun King has them on pre order. Order 3 and get free shipping

Where are the Yetis?

They are shipping to dealers today. Realistically, they will be available to individuals by next Monday.

:) :), what about more overstable version of the Zephyr named Chuck...

I get it!

Dave,


I have a question re: Star TL: I have been having a lot of trouble finding these with flat flight plates.(ie. all the star TLs I have seen recently have fairly domey flight plates) Has the mold been tweaked? different materials used resulting in more dome as they cool?.......if you know a good source to find some flat ones that would be great.

thanks, PK

Dave,


I have a question re: Star TL: I have been having a lot of trouble finding these with flat flight plates.(ie. all the star TLs I have seen recently have fairly domey flight plates) Has the mold been tweaked? different materials used resulting in more dome as they cool?.......if you know a good source to find some flat ones that would be great.

thanks, PK

It's not any mold tweaking. It's the different material batches, we are dealing with one right now. One batch produces stiff crystal clear flat discs, and another cloudy, more flexible, and domey discs.

As for where to get one you like; I don't really know, but you could try Mark at discgolfvalues.

Dave I have a question regarding cheetahs, do u think u will run any champ or star models in the future?

Yeti is the best approach disc ever made

Yeti is the best approach disc ever made


How is it really ? Is it like a beat up JK Pro Aviar X ? Is the rim any smaller than a JK ?

Dave I have a question regarding cheetahs, do u think u will run any champ or star models in the future?


Star for sure, Pro too possibly, but I am not sure about Champion. Very hard to run Champion in higher weights of Cheetahs.

How is it really ? Is it like a beat up JK Pro Aviar X ? Is the rim any smaller than a JK ?

straight flyer right out the box..it has a concave flight plate..first ever made like that(that i know of)..it seems to be very close to the Jk but a bit stiffer..
2nd throw with it, threw in from 60 for eagle..

straight flyer right out the box...

I second that, tested mine out a little this morning, so straight! I will be adding one of these to the bag, dead straight line on the first throw. recommend trying one of these!

Sounds like a longer Puppy?

It kinda is, except you can really put some power behind these Yetis. It is crazy how pure stable they are. I liken it to that perfectly beat roc in putter form.

Hi Dave

I just noticed in another thread, Chuck posted that the Innova Wedge has recently been approved.

I saw a lot of great info about the Wahoo, Vulcan and experimental XB in this thread. Can you tell us a little about the Wedge?

Thanks in Advance, and Happy Holidays


get a job

Star for sure, Pro too possibly, but I am not sure about Champion. Very hard to run Champion in higher weights of Cheetahs.

Yay. Regular production or tourney runs only?

Yay. Regular production or tourney runs only?

It wouldn't start as regular production. Probably just limited availabiilty. Maybe tourney too.

straight flyer right out the box..it has a concave flight plate..first ever made like that(that i know of)..it seems to be very close to the Jk but a bit stiffer..
2nd throw with it, threw in from 60 for eagle..


Cool !!! I think I'll get a couple !!!

How old is this? http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/5499424334/

Griffin was approved in 93, but the double ring stamp came later, was it 97-98?

When will Champion Mako in stock come out?

When will Champion Mako in stock come out?

Already out in CFR/TFR program. :)

One of my good buddies, a Las Vegas pro just received the new Innova APE, can you please us about this disc Dave, thanks

One of my good buddies, a Las Vegas pro just received the new Innova APE, can you please us about this disc Dave, thanks

The Ape is the Boss analog of the XCaliber. Same speed as the Boss. Same stability of the Xcaliber. My testing appears to show stability, but not much over stability. It seems to have a much longer straight flight than we thought it would. Kind of like a very long TeeBird.

I am sure someone has probably asked before about a Teebird +, but I have been unable to find a reference.

So, can you tell me what the (+) means as far as the difference between it and a regular teebird?

Thanks in advance.

is this going to be a production disc? the "Ape" and why not a cool name like a
"Silverback Gorilla" now that disc would sell off the shelves, on name alone, imho ;-)

I am sure someone has probably asked before about a Teebird +, but I have been unable to find a reference.

So, can you tell me what the (+) means as far as the difference between it and a regular teebird?

Thanks in advance.

The + mold has a little beefier rim for those that like that feel. The + is easier to make in heavier weights without weighting agents. All the TeeBird molds fly essentially the same. Different molding times and materials would make more difference than the particular mold.

is this going to be a production disc? the "Ape" and why not a cool name like a
"Silverback Gorilla" now that disc would sell off the shelves, on name alone, imho ;-)

The Ape will be a regular production disc.

Dave i would like to offer my disc naming services to you guys ;-)
How bout a future speed 14 disc like a road runner on steroids called the "Pterodactyl" ?

and the "Silver Back" would be a great disc name

On a serious note Dave... i love the rounded flight plate ( is that the part im talking bout? the rim) like on a roadrunner. can you put that convex bottom on a Boss wide rim and get a longer Road Runner?

On a serious note Dave... i love the rounded flight plate ( is that the part im talking bout? the rim) like on a roadrunner. can you put that convex bottom on a Boss wide rim and get a longer Road Runner?

Possibly, but making weight under 175gms would be difficult in Champion or Star. We have a new Pro material that we can make a little lighter. It might work. The wider the rim, the less room, in terms of volume, I have to work with.

cool, interesting. lets say u can put that rounded bottom on a Boss and it weighted closer to 180-185 gms. Even though its not legal, how do u think it would fly, strait to understable???

cool, interesting. lets say u can put that rounded bottom on a Boss and it weighted closer to 180-185 gms. Even though its not legal, how do u think it would fly, strait to understable???

Theoretically, but you can never really tell for sure until you make it.

Dave ,what can u tell us about the newly approved archon?

Dave ,what can u tell us about the newly approved archon?


The Archon is a speed 11 driver that is similar to the Wraith. Right now we haven't done enough testing to give it flight numbers to differentiate it. So far, the difference is our ability to make lower weights in Champion and Star. In Pro, I believe we will be able to get down to below 150gms. We haven't proven that yet. If I had to assign numbers as a guess, I would say 11,5,-2,2. That will be adjusted as we test more.

do you guys have a machine like a pitching machine, Disc throwing machine that you can calibrate to throw the same every time to truely test how dfferent disc fly, or is it all human throwers???

what (disc) is the rim width comparable to? specs say 2.3mm, which would be like an xcal or destroyer, correct?

do you guys have a machine like a pitching machine, Disc throwing machine that you can calibrate to throw the same every time to truely test how dfferent disc fly, or is it all human throwers???

It is a group of former World Champions and golfers with a know set of skills.

what (disc) is the rim width comparable to? specs say 2.3mm, which would be like an xcal or destroyer, correct?

It is in between a Wraith and a Destroyer. It depends on the plastic and molding.

any reason the production c-pd's have the slanted inner rim? was this done intentionally or just something that happens during molding sometimes? I have been noticing this on more recent runs of discs, even those not marked "plus mold".
thanks again

any reason the production c-pd's have the slanted inner rim? was this done intentionally or just something that happens during molding sometimes? I have been noticing this on more recent runs of discs, even those not marked "plus mold".
thanks again

It was not done intentionally and will not be in future runs of C-PDs.

I know its been covered before about premium plastics but could a run of Pro Gazelles be done? I would love to buy a stack of them and it seems like with the Pro orc and valk coming back it might be doable.

I know its been covered before about premium plastics but could a run of Pro Gazelles be done? I would love to buy a stack of them and it seems like with the Pro orc and valk coming back it might be doable.

Pro Gazelles are definitely possible. What in particular would you like to see weight wise, color wise, etc.?

i second the gazelles... i love them... my older 11x are a little flatter than the occasional CCFR's you guys make now... wonder why?

Color is unimportant to me really but obviously bright is good and if they fly like DX I would rather them heavy (172+) but if they were more stable like the KCs then I can deal with less weight.

I'm looking for a Heavy 175 Star Wedge ? Any place I can buy one ?

I'm looking for a Heavy 175 Star Wedge ? Any place I can buy one ?

here is a link... https://www.discgolfvalues.com/store/index.php?searchStr=wedge&act=viewCat&Submit=Go

Will the Ape be available though the custom stamp program? Also what plastics are you planning on pressing them in besides Champion?

here is a link... https://www.discgolfvalues.com/store/index.php?searchStr=wedge&act=viewCat&Submit=Go


Thank You !!! :)

Will the Ape be available though the custom stamp program? Also what plastics are you planning on pressing them in besides Champion?


Right now we only plan on making the Ape in Champion. I'm not sure about custom hot stamping at this point. What other plastics were you interested in?

I'm looking for a Heavy 175 Star Wedge ? Any place I can buy one ?

I believe Star Wedges are going to be released very soon.

Right now we only plan on making the Ape in Champion. I'm not sure about custom hot stamping at this point. What other plastics were you interested in?

Star/ Echo Star

Star/ Echo Star

I 2nd that!

This might have been asked before, but I searched and couldn't find anything.

Why do the molds change so much from 1st run discs to the regular runs?

My first run destroyer and my echo star destroyer look like two different discs when you look at them next to each other, 1st run flat, ES domey. Why do they change so much?

Do you keep every mold you have released? Why don't you ever re-release a really popular mold run, in current plastic types. I can think of... oh about everyone who would love to get the old CE plastic molds in the newer champion plastic. also the 11x firebirds, and any other coveted older discs.

Thank you for your time! Love your discs!

This might have been asked before, but I searched and couldn't find anything.

Why do the molds change so much from 1st run discs to the regular runs?

My first run destroyer and my echo star destroyer look like two different discs when you look at them next to each other, 1st run flat, ES domey. Why do they change so much?

Do you keep every mold you have released? Why don't you ever re-release a really popular mold run, in current plastic types. I can think of... oh about everyone who would love to get the old CE plastic molds in the newer champion plastic. also the 11x firebirds, and any other coveted older discs.

Thank you for your time! Love your discs!

Those flat and domey changes aren't mold changes. They are plastic changes. We have never had a plastic from the manufacturer stay the same for more than a couple of years. Sometimes they change from batch to batch. When the plastic changes, the appearance of the disc changes. This is true for all plastic types we use.

Dave will the Ape come with a first run star stamp? I would like a small stamp to mix it up. Thanks Dave for all your work.

Dave will the Ape come with a first run star stamp? I would like a small stamp to mix it up. Thanks Dave for all your work.

Will be released during next week, but I guess with the normal star-stamp...

Dear Dave -

I was wondering why some Champion Archon's are marked "AC", while others have a "VW" designation. Does "VW" indicate a Valk or Vulcan/Wraith combo? Will they be offered in a regular Star run any time soon?

.

Dear Dave -

I was wondering why some Champion Archon's are marked "AC", while others have a "VW" designation. Does "VW" indicate a Valk or Vulcan/Wraith combo? Will they be offered in a regular Star run any time soon?

.
vw was a code for Vulcan/Wraith hybrid until we figured out a name. Champion Archons will be in fundraising for the foreseeable future. Stars will be released by May. We may have Driver Pro Archons at some point after that in very low weights down to the 140s.

Champ Glow RR please!

Champ Glow RR please!

I'll second that... put me down for 3-4 if you mold them!!

hey guys i looking for a good over stable mid range disc for my bag. i throw alot of flat top Rocs for my mid range shots, which are strait to a little flippy, i have a ton of champion Rocs also- are these more stable? or would anyone suggest a gator?

Hey Dave, how many 1st run "proto-star" champ apes were made? And will we see the ape in star plastic? Thanks!

Hey Dave, how many 1st run "proto-star" champ apes were made? And will we see the ape in star plastic? Thanks!

There were about 2000 on each coast, however, the amount was never specified and could be slightly less due to rejects or mis-stamps. I believe we will run the Ape in Star plastic at some point. Possibly Star-Lite too.

So it seems Innova has started running Champion Eagle Xs once again. Is this true? If so is there any chance that we can get some run in the stiff clear champion plastic instead of this creamy opaque soft champion? Or even in the new Champion Glow?

I also third the Champ Glow RR. I would want like ten of them!

So it seems Innova has started running Champion Eagle Xs once again. Is this true? If so is there any chance that we can get some run in the stiff clear champion plastic instead of this creamy opaque soft champion? Or even in the new Champion Glow?

We have been running Eagle Xs for a few years. The Eagle X is difficult to get up to weight without adding the weighting agent that makes it cloudy. Stiffer can be done, but needs to be within the specs. Champion Glow is much easier and will be available at some point.

Gee thanks for helping me out with my question? Lol

Thanks for the info Dave. I had been told the Champion Eagle X was discontinued. Good to know its readily available in plastics other than the Star

Gee thanks for helping me out with my question? Lol

Sorry, I didn't think you were directing the question at me, but at "guys". So I waited for the guys. However, the Gator was the choice from our line. It is our most over stable mid.

Gee thanks for helping me out with my question? Lol

The gator is very stable. way more stable than a roc. I recommend a champ one. but if you want an honest opinion.(i will prob be attacked for this) but a great stable mid thats not too over stable is a [email protected]:eek::eek: prob one of the best stable mids on the market. and they all fly the same. :D

hey guys i looking for a good over stable mid range disc for my bag. i throw alot of flat top Rocs for my mid range shots, which are strait to a little flippy, i have a ton of champion Rocs also- are these more stable? or would anyone suggest a gator?

You need a first run champ gator, but they usually arent cheap. Another option would be champion viper. The champ rancho roc would be the most stable of the rocs.
This is kind of a void in the Innova line, the gator is very slow and the next step up are discs that arent normal production runs in champion plastic

You need a first run champ gator, but they usually arent cheap. Another option would be champion viper. The champ rancho roc would be the most stable of the rocs.
This is kind of a void in the Innova line, the gator is very slow and the next step up are discs that arent normal production runs in champion plastic

The Viper is SUPER OVERSTABLE:eek::eek::eek:. i would almost hesitate to use it as a mid. more of a trick shot flex shot sort of disc. I agree that this is a void in the Innova line and that is why i suggested the alternative. i see nothing wrong with a mixed bag. i have innova drivers. [email protected]@#craft mids and Gateway putters. i do love the gator though. great for forehand approaches.

Dave,
Will the Vulcan be released in Pro plastic? Thx

The Viper is SUPER OVERSTABLE:eek::eek::eek:. i would almost hesitate to use it as a mid. more of a trick shot flex shot sort of disc. I agree that this is a void in the Innova line and that is why i suggested the alternative. i see nothing wrong with a mixed bag. i have innova drivers. [email protected]@#craft mids and Gateway putters. i do love the gator though. great for forehand approaches.

To me, the champ whippet is more overstable than the viper, although it is not shown that way on the chart. Maybe a star viper would fill this gap as it would be a little less overstable, but the only other thing I can think of without going to another manufacturer is a Q-Sentinel (millennium/innova)

Dave,
Will the Vulcan be released in Pro plastic? Thx

Yes, but we don't have a time frame at this point.

To me, the champ whippet is more overstable than the viper, although it is not shown that way on the chart. Maybe a star viper would fill this gap as it would be a little less overstable, but the only other thing I can think of without going to another manufacturer is a Q-Sentinel (millennium/innova)

maybe its just me then. but i recently purchased a Champ viper and i have a glow champ WX and i throw a lot of forehands. i can flip the whippet but not the viper. it is a meat hook! i wouldnt even attempt to backhand it unless it was a spike or something. Is it possible that the difference in speed is what makes it seem less stable to me?

maybe its just me then. but i recently purchased a Champ viper and i have a glow champ WX and i throw a lot of forehands. i can flip the whippet but not the viper. it is a meat hook! i wouldnt even attempt to backhand it unless it was a spike or something. Is it possible that the difference in speed is what makes it seem less stable to me?

I would say the forehand has a lot to do with it. I can flatten out a viper backhand, but discs can vary so much that some of them are only slightly overstable and some very overstable. Domey, flat, different weight or run, and the speed is a factor of course although they are both speed 6 I think the viper is a little slower.

Dave,
Any chance the grip on the Ape might be coming to some slower disc (10 or 11 speed)? I know I don't have the arm for the Ape the thing just feels so good in my hands.

Dave,
Any chance the grip on the Ape might be coming to some slower disc (10 or 11 speed)? I know I don't have the arm for the Ape the thing just feels so good in my hands.

If you mean the size and shape of the rim, not really. If you mean the feel of the plastic, yes. There are easier discs to throw with similar rims like the Pro Boss, or Destroyers.

If you mean the size and shape of the rim, not really. If you mean the feel of the plastic, yes. There are easier discs to throw with similar rims like the Pro Boss, or Destroyers.

Yeah I was talking more about the size and shape of the rim. I have smaller hands an unlike the other fast stuff the Ape actually fits perfectly. I think it is the narrow wing, if that is the right word, that I like.

Not all the Apes are the same in the grip size. I found some blue ones that are a little smaller and fit my hand. The guy at the pro shop had the grape,orange and blue in colores and some were a little smaller. I found this out in some of the Boss discs.

I bought the new caddypack bag this weekend at the US Masters and love the bag.

It has more storage space than i could possibly use and is much lighter than my old bag.

The only small complaint I have is the chair. When you sit down the fabric stretches on the frame and sounds like you are passing gas. Yes we had fun at several peoples expence letting them try out the chair.

Do you think this will change as the material wears?

Gee thanks for helping me out with my question? Lol

When I read your first question I thought "invariably somone will recommend a gator" sorry should have posted that. Too overstable for me. My Innova mid is a First run Monster. Not a mid but it works.

Dave,
I recently played the new courses in Jurapa Park in Riverside and Goat Hill in Oceanside. Both nice, do you know of any other courses opening anytime over the next few months in Southern California. Any news with Devour or another 18 holes at Yucaipa or Mojave Narrows. Please let me know. thanks

I bought the new caddypack bag this weekend at the US Masters and love the bag.

It has more storage space than i could possibly use and is much lighter than my old bag.

The only small complaint I have is the chair. When you sit down the fabric stretches on the frame and sounds like you are passing gas. Yes we had fun at several peoples expence letting them try out the chair.

Do you think this will change as the material wears?

Yes; mine is no longer flatulent.

Dave,
I recently played the new courses in Jurapa Park in Riverside and Goat Hill in Oceanside. Both nice, do you know of any other courses opening anytime over the next few months in Southern California. Any news with Devour or another 18 holes at Yucaipa or Mojave Narrows. Please let me know. thanks

I expect Glen Helen in Devore to open in the next few months, but I don't have an exact date. Yucaipa is probably being redesigned in a different, disc golf only area of the part. I am looking over the new area today with the park officials. That will take a while to develop.

Mojave narrows is on the back burner as Pelican lake was destroyed and needs work first.

Dave,
I recently played the new courses in Jurapa Park in Riverside and Goat Hill in Oceanside. Both nice, do you know of any other courses opening anytime over the next few months in Southern California. Any news with Devour or another 18 holes at Yucaipa or Mojave Narrows. Please let me know. thanks

I don't know anything about Rancho Jurupa Park except they bought a course from us. How did that turn out?

Dave, do you think a Gazelle run in the KC Plastic would be feasible? Do you think it would hold up longer than dx?

Dave, do you think a Gazelle run in the KC Plastic would be feasible? Do you think it would hold up longer than dx?

I would be feasible and hold up longer than DX, but until we have a better supply of the KC material, we won't be able to do anything other than Rocs and Aviars.

We will have a Star or Champion Gazelle available.

We will have a Star or Champion Gazelle available.

Is that something that's planned to be run, has already been run and needs to be stamped, or is ready for distribution? Will it be CFR or regular production?

Is that something that's planned to be run, has already been run and needs to be stamped, or is ready for distribution? Will it be CFR or regular production?

It will be part of a Factory Store we are planning. Many of the out-of-production models will be available there. I believe driver Pro and Star have been run, but the store isn't ready yet.

Sweet. Thanks Dave.

It will be part of a Factory Store we are planning. Many of the out-of-production models will be available there. I believe driver Pro and Star have been run, but the store isn't ready yet.



What is the time-schedule for the factory store?

It will be part of a Factory Store we are planning. Many of the out-of-production models will be available there. I believe driver Pro and Star have been run, but the store isn't ready yet.

Are we talking about an online Factory Store or Bricks & Mortar?

What is the time-schedule for the factory store?

Still probably a month away.

Are we talking about an online Factory Store or Bricks & Mortar?

It's actually a brick and mortar, but at first it will be on line only. We don't have the staff to man the walk ins at this point and probably won't until next year at the earliest.

It's actually a brick and mortar, but at first it will be on line only. We don't have the staff to man the walk ins at this point and probably won't until next year at the earliest.

Sounds great! I take it the B&M location will be somewhere near or at the Rancho factory?

Sounds great! I take it the B&M location will be somewhere near or at the Rancho factory?

Yes, it's near the present location of Innova, but Innova is moving back to Ontario this year.

Dave,

could you tell me more about the Millenium QF?

Dave,

could you tell me more about the Millenium QF?

I think I need more name info; like MF, LF, OLF. Q is the plastic type. F is usually the Fade version of the particular model.

I think I need more name info; like MF, LF, OLF. Q is the plastic type. F is usually the Fade version of the particular model.

http://www.herodiscusa.com/japan-opn-qf-blems.html

I have a Pro Groove from 2010 Gentleman's Club Challenge,is this only run of Pro Grooves?Also any chance to find production numbers on this run?

Dave I first got introduced to disc golf with your disks, first disc was a dx shark than to here and back again through your current lineup and some of the discs that were discontinued [i love the ram].

My question is, Discraft makes a disc called the flick which in the 150 class has fight characteristics which I can not find in any Innova lineup disc.

Are there plans to make a similar style disc with a flat top and not so redicuous wide rim underneath. I have your monster which seems to be the closest but the weights are way off.

I did read somewhere[perhaps this thread] that the ape may be in star 150 class weight, any more info on this disc release date? That disc may quench my thirst for a utility meat hook at slower speeds.

Also I have not seen any retailer online [I went to close to 10 online retailers] have the 158g vulcans and other very low weights until recently as advertised did something happen in testing which you may have recalled them? Or were they included in a second production run as only higher weights I have seen were available.

Sorry for the multiple questions.

http://www.herodiscusa.com/japan-opn-qf-blems.html

Looks like a wide rim, but I don't know. I will have to ask the Hero guys.

I have a Pro Groove from 2010 Gentleman's Club Challenge,is this only run of Pro Grooves?Also any chance to find production numbers on this run?

I believe it was the only run, but I don't recall how many we ran. Sorry

Dave I first got introduced to disc golf with your disks, first disc was a dx shark than to here and back again through your current lineup and some of the discs that were discontinued [i love the ram].

My question is, Discraft makes a disc called the flick which in the 150 class has fight characteristics which I can not find in any Innova lineup disc.

Are there plans to make a similar style disc with a flat top and not so redicuous wide rim underneath. I have your monster which seems to be the closest but the weights are way off.

I did read somewhere[perhaps this thread] that the ape may be in star 150 class weight, any more info on this disc release date? That disc may quench my thirst for a utility meat hook at slower speeds.

Also I have not seen any retailer online [I went to close to 10 online retailers] have the 158g vulcans and other very low weights until recently as advertised did something happen in testing which you may have recalled them? Or were they included in a second production run as only higher weights I have seen were available.

Sorry for the multiple questions.

We have run Vulcans as light as 158g, but the plastic doesn't always cooperate to go down that low. I believe we are making 160gm of late. The Ape will not go down to 150 class in Star. I believe the Flick is a mid 50s disc, but we don't have anything quite that light except some very flat Firebirds we made recently. Monsters won't get that light.

Looks like a wide rim, but I don't know. I will have to ask the Hero guys.

that would be appreciated thanks

Dave thanks for the in depth response. :) If you get a chance can you get more information about the flat top like Firebirds, which plastic type would they most likely be in, was this run most likely for your upcoming store or perhaps squeaked out by some of your retailers which carry your product. Are they in specific colors I should be looking out for?

Dave thanks for the in depth response. :) If you get a chance can you get more information about the flat top like Firebirds, which plastic type would they most likely be in, was this run most likely for your upcoming store or perhaps squeaked out by some of your retailers which carry your product. Are they in specific colors I should be looking out for?

They are Champion and the most recent run. Regular stock, I believe.

We have run Vulcans as light as 158g, but the plastic doesn't always cooperate to go down that low. I believe we are making 160gm of late. The Ape will not go down to 150 class in Star. I believe the Flick is a mid 50s disc, but we don't have anything quite that light except some very flat Firebirds we made recently. Monsters won't get that light.

I picked up a custom-stamp order last week that had quite a few 158/9g Star Vulcans, so they are out there. I also recently purchased a 157g Vulcan from Utopia Disc Golf. Marshall Street also usually does a great job of stocking lighter plastic. Light golf discs are tricky to find because there proportionally aren't as many of them produced, but they are out there. You have to be diligent in your search. It also helps to befriend a retailer or two - let them know what you're searching for and ask them to keep their eyes open for you. That's what has worked for me and I throw almost exclusively low-150's drivers.

Dave,

could you tell me more about the Millenium QF?

I was told that this was a QOLF. If so, it is similar to a Starfire.

Dave, I am loving the Vulcan. It has gotten me more distance than any other disc! Is there any plans for a little more stable Vulcan? Can you do a Vulcan X? It might be jsut what I'm looking for.

Dave, I am loving the Vulcan. It has gotten me more distance than any other disc! Is there any plans for a little more stable Vulcan? Can you do a Vulcan X? It might be jsut what I'm looking for.

Generally the Champion Vulcans are more stable, but in the run of Star Vulcans we did, there were some very stable heavy Star Vulcans. These were surprisingly stable.

I just came across some very interesting discs this past weekend. They were marked Star DS on the bottom but it was clearly a Destroyer bottom with a Vulcan top. Is this a mistake or was this done on purpose? And if on purpose what was expected to be the flight result with the Vulcan top? Its looks and feels great in the Echo plastic was just wondering what the deal was with this disc. Thanks

Between the Star, Echo Star, and Champ Destroyers which is commonly the easiest to 'flip'? a friend of mine is looking for one that isnt as stable as his current star(pop-top). would a flatter dome help?

Hi Dave. I recently purchased a disc from a friend of mine who goes to the SC factory to pick up discs. He returned with a disc he claimed to be "Rare" according to the employees of the facility. From what he's told me is that the disc is a Star/Champion blend and that very few of these are run every year. It's marked and stamped as a Star Boss but is very clear for Star plastic. Just curious if I got my hands on a gem of a disc or just a really nice feeling boss haha.

Thanks for your time!

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Flatter Destroyers like the first runs were less stable. Generally, discs with a lower parting line height (the imaginary plane that separates the top of the disc from the bottom) are less stable.

I just came across some very interesting discs this past weekend. They were marked Star DS on the bottom but it was clearly a Destroyer bottom with a Vulcan top. Is this a mistake or was this done on purpose? And if on purpose what was expected to be the flight result with the Vulcan top? Its looks and feels great in the Echo plastic was just wondering what the deal was with this disc. Thanks

Nothing on purpose.

[QUOTE=veearesix;1453486]Hi Dave. I recently purchased a disc from a friend of mine who goes to the SC factory to pick up discs. He returned with a disc he claimed to be "Rare" according to the employees of the facility. From what he's told me is that the disc is a Star/Champion blend and that very few of these are run every year. It's marked and stamped as a Star Boss but is very clear for Star plastic. Just curious if I got my hands on a gem of a disc or just a really nice feeling boss haha.

Thanks for your time!

These discs are produced if we transition from Star To Champion while running the same disc.

So I got an x out Archon and LOVE IT!!!! It took some getting used to but once I released with some hyzer it flew straight as an arrow! The archon has the Vulcan top and Wraith bottom. I was wondering if you were planning any other hybrid discs in the future? Also when can I look forward to an Archon in a first run stamp? I cant wait to get my hands on a few of them!

Dave, I was told by someone at crown point worlds last summer that the star katanas marked S/ are stabilized versions. Is this true? And how do you think the echo star plastic katanas fly differently than regular star? Thanks for making the worlds best discs.

So I got an x out Archon and LOVE IT!!!! It took some getting used to but once I released with some hyzer it flew straight as an arrow! The archon has the Vulcan top and Wraith bottom. I was wondering if you were planning any other hybrid discs in the future? Also when can I look forward to an Archon in a first run stamp? I cant wait to get my hands on a few of them!

We will try all combinations at some point. First run Archons will be available about mid May.

Dave, I was told by someone at crown point worlds last summer that the star katanas marked S/ are stabilized versions. Is this true? And how do you think the echo star plastic katanas fly differently than regular star? Thanks for making the worlds best discs.

Katanas marked S are the same as those marked with a Star. There are various degrees of stability within the Star Katanas. Echo Star Katanas were slightly less high speed stable than most regular Stars, but that is only a generality. The most stable Katanas I have seen were Champion.

Hi Dave,
Are all champion material discs made from 2000- 2004 CE? When did champion plastic become what it is today? P.S. I would love a long winded answer.

Thanks, Mark

Hi Dave,
Are all champion material discs made from 2000- 2004 CE? When did champion plastic become what it is today? P.S. I would love a long winded answer.

Thanks, Mark

CE stood for Champion Edition. We eventually dropped the Edition and just called it Champion. It had nothing to do with a material change. The original material we got from the manufacturer changed at some point, as all the material from all the manufacturers changes with each batch run. We have tried many many materials from several manufacturers, but the first two batches we got from one manufacturer was a little tougher than the subsequent runs. That original plastic was a little stiffer too and probably wouldn't pass standards if it were made in Wraiths, Destroyers etc.

Thanks Dave. Would you remember which discs were run with that plastic from the first 2 batches you mentioned? BTW it's great that that you take the time to do this. I for one really do appreciate it! Thank you!

Thanks again,Mark

I would love to get a Original Run Red Candy CE Destroyer !!!! :)

Donny you know there are no CE Destroyers. Besides, you would just give it away anyway!

Hi Dave,

One of my workhorse discs is a 150g gummy Champion TeeBird. I love the grippiness of the gummy plastic, and the proven predictability of the TeeBird's flight. I know you produce some TL's in Champion plastic as part of the TFR/CFR program. Are there ever any of these discs produced in 150-class weights, especially using that great gummy plastic?

Thanks!