the Firebird (F) is the fx mold!! :p



Nope!!! The F just means firebird not L or X. I am referring to The CE FX and the new champion Firebirds.

I don't know for sure if the molds are different but they do fly different...
Dave?

[/QUOTE]

You obviously haven't done much reading up-thread, because Dave has posted numerous times over the past 4-5 years that there are only two, Firebird mold variants: F and FL, and that the CE "FX" firebirds were from the F mold.

Big brothers know everything. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif



LOL!!! :p

If it is different FL molds, then why call them the same.

Just another reason why I hate how innova names their discs. For example. There are two different runs of BS beasts that have the 2x stamp on them. One of them is the original 1x barry mold. The other is the new mold. Yet if you look at a picture from the top, you can't tell a difference.

I don't even want to know how many different starfire molds there are out there.

Original Firebirds were FLs. They were marked as F's on the back. Then innova started using the FX mold for the CE firebirds and marked it as FX.


Correction: Innova started using the REGULAR Firebird molde for CE FIrebirds and marked them "FX."

The FL mold was designed to compensate for the increased overstability of CE discs when compared to their DX and KC counterparts, in order to maintain consistent flight characteristics across the line. Innova began running CE Firebirds in the regular (F) mold, which were marked "FX," in response to player demand for a more overstable version of the Firebird.

Dave-- looking for some help on your plastics. Im writing a paper for my materials engineering class. Can you give me any technical information about what kind of polymers are used in your various plastics? Or some sort of link? The most important to me is the types of polymers in DX versus Champion. thank you for your help.

SL Othrower, we use proprietary blends of TPOs and TPUs. Basically DX is a proprietary blend of polyolefins and Pro, Champion, and Star are blends of Urethenic plastics.

You obviously haven't done much reading up-thread

[/QUOTE]

ok next time i'll try to go through all posts in the last 4-5 years before i ask a question /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Dave, I have noticed that my CE f's/fx's, new or used, fly way straighter and a good 60 ft further than champion plastic. What are your expectations for the STAR/SB?

t_mojo, no. There is only one Firebird and one FL. It_doesn't_matter had a good summary, except he should have said the original CE type Firebird was the L mold. The original DX was the F(X) type.



then there must be a DRASCTIC difference in how the "proline" plastic and old CE plastic cooled, because the pro FL bottom wing is completely flat (like a starfire L) and CE FL's are flat for the outer portion with a slight angle towards where you grip it.

You obviously haven't done much reading up-thread



ok next time i'll try to go through all posts in the last 4-5 years before i ask a question /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

[/QUOTE]If you were smart, you'd just do a search for the term(s) you're looking for, and if you were really smart, you'd search for those terms just in posts by Dave.

t_mojo, no. There is only one Firebird and one FL. It_doesn't_matter had a good summary, except he should have said the original CE type Firebird was the L mold. The original DX was the F(X) type.



then there must be a DRASCTIC difference in how the "proline" plastic and old CE plastic cooled, because the pro FL bottom wing is completely flat (like a starfire L) and CE FL's are flat for the outer portion with a slight angle towards where you grip it.

Luke, FWIW, I'm looking at my Proline FLs, and it's there's a definite flare on the bottom wing, though it's not as pronounced as the flare on my CE FLs.

i guess im not smart then :p,


i'll try taken some of that Ginkobiloba stuff..... :D:D:D

I would expect the Star plastic to be more like CE. Between F and FL, I would expect the FL to fly straighter and farther.

that is really great to hear, Thanks Dave

Hi Dave,
A couple of questions about the Rhyno...
Since the SE Soft was discontinued, I have tried Pro Line and Pro Rhynos, but neither compare to those later run SE's. Will you ever produce these again, or do i need to stock up now? Also, what are the chances of getting a Glo Rhyno?

Dave we all want to know about any plans on a Des Reading disc?

there I asked and it was not hard at all.

rocportian, not a good chance for glow rhynos at this time. Soft Pro Rhynos will still be made. If you mean as soft as the original run, maybe not. They were very difficult to make. We will make them as soft as is practical.

We plan on doing a limited edition champions signature disc which will feature Des and our other 2005 Champions. Not sure which disc at this point.

any plans for the coyote right now? will it get the STAR treatment? and possibly a DX version?

Ching stamped DX coyote? sweet

: ) :

Friar, no plans for DX right now, but definitely Star. Coyote is in my bag and I would like a little extra grip myself.

Friar, no plans for DX right now, but definitely Star. Coyote is in my bag and I would like a little extra grip myself.



Yes!!!!

Dave, I know the timetable for Star Tbirds is a few weeks, do you have an estimate on the Sidewinders?

Dave not so much a question as a request. Star or Special Blend plastic doesn't matter that much to me. What I would NOT like to see happen is issuing these with the old Star stamp. I know that the stamp molds for the most part have been destroyed but please do not release anything new with the Star stamp.

I'm a huge fan of the stamp on the older discs. I think releasing new disc with this stamp will cause alot of confusion about what's new and what's old. Plus I believe this confusion will decrease old prototype Star stamped disc values. And yes there are alot of us out there who collect and pay good money for these older Star stamped discs.

Thanks again for taking time to answer all the questions.

Looks like you can get some of the STAR Sidewinders tomorrow!

Or if you do use the star stamp, put the year somewhere in the stamp(if possible)

How about a re-design of the star stamp? If Innova was interested, I think a lot of people on the board would be interested in some sort of competition to design a new star stamp.

Star Sidewinders are already available (at least they were) with the NorCal stamp on them. On a further note, the Japan Open will begin selling their Star Sidewinders tomorrow morning. Check discgolfvalues.com....they may still have a few of the NorCal stamps left.

I already got one of the NorCal Star Tbirds.....SWEET!!!! Cant wait for the normal run of these to be released!!!

Not really a question for Dave, but for anyone who may know.....
I ran across a store that has a Champion Glow Coyote. Does anyone have any info or pictures of this disc?

This is directly from his website.....

Coyote
CHAMPION
(new 06/05) MP B $13.00

CHAMPION
GLOW-Ltd Ed
(new 10/05) MP B $14.00

I've been wanting to try more mids (only have one KC Pro Roc) and have been hearing great things about the Coyote. I've also been wanting a Glow model & didn't really care which one.... ( I could get a glow Roc for $9.50)

Edit: I guess I'm getting one regardless. I just told him to hold one for me. But If anyone knows anything let me know.....I didn't know they could do Glow in champ plastic :confused:

Edit#2: nevermind. I found a picture of it on wrightlifes website. Sweet looking disc.... Glad the person I'm getting it from is only charging $14, not wrightlifes, $20. :D

dave how about for the new star line putting some redesigned pics on the discs. like the dx plastic with pics but more new age designed and maybe smaller and off centered to give it a unique design yet not a picture covering the entire disc. Maybe a smaller new pic with star name above pic kinda arched and the disc name below pic arched. just an idea. I would love to see some higher end plastic with the pics as I like the pics on dx discs. thanks for listening

Not really a question for Dave, but for anyone who may know.....
I ran across a store that has a Champion Glow Coyote. Does anyone have any info or pictures of this disc?

This is directly from his website.....

Coyote
CHAMPION
(new 06/05) MP B $13.00

CHAMPION
GLOW-Ltd Ed
(new 10/05) MP B $14.00

I've been wanting to try more mids (only have one KC Pro Roc) and have been hearing great things about the Coyote. I've also been wanting a Glow model & didn't really care which one.... ( I could get a glow Roc for $9.50)

Edit: I guess I'm getting one regardless. I just told him to hold one for me. But If anyone knows anything let me know.....I didn't know they could do Glow in champ plastic :confused:

Edit#2: nevermind. I found a picture of it on wrightlifes website. Sweet looking disc.... Glad the person I'm getting it from is only charging $14, not wrightlifes, $20. :D



glow coyote is slightly more stable than the champ coyote

Thanks IDM.
So by "a bit more stable" you mean a bit more overstable?
Inny's website has the coyote listed as 4 speed 4 glide -1 turn 1 fade.
Sooooo.... Does "more stable" mean it will have less turn (like 0 turn) & more fade? Or just more fade?

I'm going to get it regardless. He has a 176g on hand so I told him to hold it for me.

I've thrown both the glow and the champion Coyote (several of both), and I would say they are very close to the same. If the glow is "a bit more stable" it only means that it will have less than -1 high speed turn, or 0 high speed turn, but still a 1 fade (and I would say that when new a little more than 1 fade).

I think the weight of the discs is more important than the difference in plastic, i.e., heavier Coyotes will be more stable than light ones. Lighter Coyotes tend to have a higher -turn. Just like any other disc IMO.

I know this because I started throwing the glow as soon as they came out, but with winter coming (glows will get lost in the snow), I purchased a couple of brightly colored champions (same weights). The change in plastic didn't require any change to my throw.

The Coyote is a great disc, but it can be a little touchy, I think it requires a lot of finesse to throw well (especially if you are used to power throwing a KC Roc or Z Buzzz, these discs hold their lines better), but once you get it dialed ... it's a winner. I think what turns some (power) players off about this disc is that it is understable right out of the bag, and it has a different rounded rim, unlike a Roc or Z Buzzz. New, it does have more fade than a lot of traditional Roc throwers like (or so a local [Innova sponsored] Roc throwing Pro has told me, but hey, he throws Rocs if you get my drift). However, once a champion Coyote is broken in, it's a sweet disc (breaking in champion plastic takes awhile), and should start to fade less, giving it a more DX Roc or broken-in Roc type flight.

To truly see how much less stable a Coyote is compared to a KC Roc or Z Buzzz, just try to throw it sidearm ... the Coyote will wobble or turnover, and will probably not go where you want it to go. You can try this with any disc to see how it's stability compares to another. Of course, if you don�t intend to throw the Coyote sidearm, then it�s not a problem. For me, this is the only problem I have with the Coyote. I like discs that do the same thing when thrown backhand, or sidearm � Keeps my bag simpler.

It also makes a great backhand roller. The problem most people find is that the coyote is not a power disc, like Boneman said, its a finesse disc. If you normal hyzer flip rocs and buzzz's, then you have to throw this disc with like 70-80% of that power. I love mine, personally. If you throw it with a hyzer angle hard, it'll fly pretty straight and glide ALOT. If you throw it soft and flat, its a nice, natural S-er. Its great for holding anny lines and goes a long way.

Yeah. Coyotes rule. And like it was said above, I think its more of a high speed turning issue between the Glo and the normal Champion. I used to think they were alot more overstable, but I think they are pretty much identical. I thinkk the Star version will be flippier though.

Special Blend? whats so special? it scuffs and cuts just like the pro plastic. Both of my sb orcs now look just like my pros. whats up with that? maybe you guys at innova should put a little more champion in that "special Blend"

Thanks IDM.
So by "a bit more stable" you mean a bit more overstable?
Inny's website has the coyote listed as 4 speed 4 glide -1 turn 1 fade.
Sooooo.... Does "more stable" mean it will have less turn (like 0 turn) & more fade? Or just more fade?

I'm going to get it regardless. He has a 176g on hand so I told him to hold it for me.



It has a little less high speed turn IMO

I have thrown my SB orcs and rocs dead into trees at full speed and they havent worn out any faster than standard champion plastic. It seems like they would but they don't.

Both the Star Sidewinders and TeeBirds are being run now. The Sidewinders might beat the TeeBirds out first.

rickb, we are creating a new stamp

what do the new stamps look like?

Dave Feldberg Orc!!! he deserves it!

He deserves it, but not as much as Des.

I'll probably get ripped for this...but out of curiosity, why does Feldberg deserve it???

What's up Chase? You coming to BC in a week or so?

why not?

Great news on the SB sidewinders Dave! Do you know what weights will be available?

rickb, we are creating a new stamp


Use the old Star stamp like you did with the Dolphin, Rhyno, Raven, Peagus, ........ That was a cool way to release a new run, and not be like the original Star stamp.

jaymo, the stamps are still being worked on.

Mr_Zoonker, the weights should be 150gm to 175 gms

Unless I'm wrong (and I could be), Dave Feldberg won the USDGC and was the National Tour Champion, not to mention the money leader. Maybe thats just one absolutely stellar season, but thats gotta be worth one disc.

Yeah but being a two time FPO champ isn't????? :confused:

Yeah but being a two time FPO champ isn't????? :confused:



I doubt there is anyone in disc golf that deserves a signature disc more than DES., minus the ones that already have them!!! A definate ambasadeur to our sport and such an inspiration to so many women !! :D

Unless I'm wrong (and I could be), Dave Feldberg won the USDGC and was the National Tour Champion, not to mention the money leader. Maybe thats just one absolutely stellar season, but thats gotta be worth one disc.

As much of an acoomplishment as winning the USDGC and the NT Championship are, I would point out that neither Barry Schultz, who won the USDGC in 2001 nor 2001 World Champ Cam Todd, who was sponsored by Innova at the time�who shared Player of the Year honors�received a signature disc. Barry did not receive a Signature disc until he won both the World Championship and the USDGC in 2003.

I don't know Innova's criteria for awarding signature discs (as opposed to commemorative discs) are, but it is at least worth noting that, to this point, only multiple-time USDGC and Open and Women's World Champions have received signature discs. On that basis, and wthout in any way meaning to disparage Dave's accomplishments this year, I would think that a two-time World Champion and two-time Player of the Year (Des Reading) would have a superior claim to receiving signature disc.

I'll probably get ripped for this...but out of curiosity, why does Feldberg deserve it???

What's up Chase? You coming to BC in a week or so?




Hope so. Im about 60% sure I will now, but that could change.

Unless I'm wrong (and I could be), Dave Feldberg won the USDGC and was the National Tour Champion, not to mention the money leader. Maybe thats just one absolutely stellar season, but thats gotta be worth one disc.




Feldburg had a amazing year, no doubt. He will probably have more of them in the future, hes a great golfer.
Des is more than just a champion on the course, shes a champion off and with the Edge program she comes into contact with the future of this sport daily. IMO, those reasons alone, not to mention shes the best female player in the world, makes it hard to believe she doesnt have her own signature disc.

cam todd teebird?

yeah why is there no Des disc?

I just like signature discs, and think everyone should have one...
I have one, but it's written with a sharpie ;)

cam todd teebird?



cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.

cam todd teebird?



cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.

As Will points out, the Cam Todd Teebirds were custom stamped, not general production signature-series discs, such as KC, JK, and Barry Schultz.

And they are rare.

cam todd teebird?



cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.



I have one!!!!!!!! :o:o

cam todd teebird?



cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.



I have one!!!!!!!! :o:o



Does it have cigarette holes burnt in it ?

what's the title of this thread?

Unless I'm wrong (and I could be), Dave Feldberg won the USDGC and was the National Tour Champion, not to mention the money leader. Maybe thats just one absolutely stellar season, but thats gotta be worth one disc.

As much of an acoomplishment as winning the USDGC and the NT Championship are, I would point out that neither Barry Schultz, who won the USDGC in 2001 nor 2001 World Champ Cam Todd, who was sponsored by Innova at the time�who shared Player of the Year honors�received a signature disc. Barry did not receive a Signature disc until he won both the World Championship and the USDGC in 2003.

I don't know Innova's criteria for awarding signature discs (as opposed to commemorative discs) are, but it is at least worth noting that, to this point, only multiple-time USDGC and Open and Women's World Champions have received signature discs. On that basis, and wthout in any way meaning to disparage Dave's accomplishments this year, I would think that a two-time World Champion and two-time Player of the Year (Des Reading) would have a superior claim to receiving signature disc.



I don't think anyone can argue with that, it's long overdue. Who has the final say and what do we need to do to help convince them?

cam todd teebird?



cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.



I have one!!!!!!!! :o:o



and I want one !!! :D:D

I found it in the pond after 2002 worlds and I think Jeff turner for H-town has one too

[/QUOTE]

cam todd teebirds were run just for cam todd. I don't know the numbers produced but they are somewhat rare.

[/QUOTE]

Close but not correct. The "Cam Todd" Teebird was run by Cam Todd not for Cam Todd. Cam wanted a Teebird different from the normal run CE's and convinced the folks at Innova to let him choose a stamp, the Innova bar stamp, and stamp them himself.
While he was doing this the Winnicrew was also stamping X amount of Teebirds on the west coast with the same stamp. So there are 2 different versions of CE Teebirds with the Innova bar stamp. Cams were all max weight, white or orange in color and had an extra couple of specs of silver stamp about a inch above the stamp. He was a great golfer but left the discs in the stamping machines just a hair too long, thus the extra silver dots.
Not sure of the actual total ran by him but I bought the last 50 from him a couple of years ago. I believe both he and the Crew maybe stamped 100 per coast.
Last ones I sold were ranging $45 to $75 each.

I have one on Ebay right now with 2 hours left, check the Ebay thread for link.

I used to have an old beat up Polaris LS, it was white plastic that felt exactly like my CE Valk and CE Eagle. I lost it this season and when I went to my local disc shop to purcahse a new one, it seems as if the plastic has completely changed. The new one has what appears to me as more of the new Innova Pro plastic. Am I imaginig this?
Both discs are the same weight, color, but my old Polaris had a stability of 1.6 and the new one doesn't have a stability rating.
One more point of interest, the old Polaris was able to hit anything and be barely nicked (if at all) and always hold it's flight characteristics, while the new one hits a tree and was bent immediatly.

What's up with this?

Dustin

What's up with this?

Dustin



It's part of Innova's new educational program about hitting the line not the tree

: ) :

What's up with this?

Dustin



It's part of Innova's new educational program about hitting the line not the tree

: ) :



LOL :D


nice tuck, couldn't have said it better myself!

dwridener, the 1.6 on your old LS wasn't the stabilty, but rather the run number. Millenium used to number their discs with a run number( I think this is a great idea, but whatever) The 1.6 run was a bit stiffer plastic. The new LS's are not marked with a run number and they are more "gummy" like the innova pro plastic.

Dave,


I came across a disc today that I don't know. It is mint pink with hot blue stamp say The ACE San Marino 173G.

Can you tell me about this disc please? Thanks.

Josh

There was an old-school disc called the Ace. That's probably what you have. They re-made the Ace a few years ago. It was a different mold, and I believe it was only available in one weight. I think the target market was sporting goods stores.

I think this is a great idea, but whatever) The 1.6 run was a bit stiffer plastic



I too think its a cool idea, the problem here (In their eyes) is that if a particular run is junk for some reason, they will have too many duds they can't move. With no lables, not too many people can tell....I don't blame them though, when you get down to it, its all an issue of the bottom line.

Hi some more info about the Ace (or Classic Ace):
http://www.discgolfsweden.se/discar/discar_sokdisc.aspx?DiscId=1872

dwridener, the 1.6 on your old LS wasn't the stabilty, but rather the run number. Millenium used to number their discs with a run number



I was told the first digit was the mold and the second number was the run. More specifically when the first digit was increased, that indicated that the mold had been tweaked.
When the SuperSoft discontinued the system at 1.19 or 1.20 I was told that it was a combination that most players did not express interest in the numbering system and that it took a new hotstamp every time the run changed. Also with the SuperSoft in particular, the design took two stamping operations (there was a pen index mark on the rim so the rotation would be accurate).
I believe all the Millinneum stamping is done east coast and it was an added production & time expense for every mold.
Also with the variations caused by a change in environmental conditions within each run, the system impled more uniformity than might have existed.
For example there are at least two different feels in the Omega SuperSoft 1.2 Prototype, I bet the run quantity/time was much smaller than today.

Dave, what was an average number of discs (per design) when you ran them in 1990 ? 2005?
Would a run in 1990 last more than one day/shift? How long?
Are the runs in 2005 going several days/weeks?
How many injection machines were in use in 1990? 2005?
Thanks

fossil, you are right about your information. In 1990 runs were definitely smaller than now. We only had one shift and three machines. A week was an average run making about 2000 discs. 2005 we have eight machines and two shifts. A week makes about 3500. There's no 2nd shift on fridays. An average run is two weeks. High volume discs takes more time, and low volume discs less.

Would it be accurate to think that in 1990 you were producing 2 or 3 designs at one time and today 6 to 8 different designs? (Taking in account change over time for the molds and equipment repair/maintenance).
With high demand products do you have identical molds so you can run the same design on two or more machines simultaneously? or is there one dedicated mold group (three piece) per design, thus only run on one machine at a time?
I know this is an imprecise question because you have explained before that parts of a mold group are used with multiple designs. i.e. part 'A' might be used in 3 different designs.
Thank you.

Not a question but a opinion and yes we all have 'em......

I got my glow Coyote in today.
Wow! What a weird disc. I've never seen anything that domey.
I do like the rounded rim compared to my KC Pro Rocs curved & beaded rim. It feels really good in the hand and perfect for my grip (fan)
I noticed the glow wasn't that strong, but I only put in light for a couple minutes.... I have it "charging" now, I'll see if that helps.
All in all this is one cool disc. Can't wait to see how it actually flys.

(plus I wanted to leave a good feedback to discsunlimited.net (http://discsunlimited.net/), they were $6 cheaper than everyone (on the Coyote) and got it too me in 2 days (plus they gave me a cool keychain with a flashlight on it.. (well I did buy a few other discs as well...v)

I also got another Sidewinder & a full color stamped DX Teebird (the colorwheel design).
Both sweet discs. Keep up the good work Dave.

fossil, all the discs we produce at any one time are different designs. We have never produced the same disc in two different machines at the same time.

That's what I thought.
My question was more directed toward duplication of machine parts for a product with the vagaries of a golf disc than toward Innova's production specifics.
Thanks for your time.

so does anyone know where I can get an older run Polaris? say 1.6?
Thanks
Dustin

Academy. They carry a lot of millenium stuff and you can always find old ones on the racks. :D

Do they have a website?

Dustin

It is a sports store like Oshman's. Mayve they don't have the in MI

so does anyone know where I can get an older run Polaris? say 1.6?
Thanks
Dustin



How many do you want? And do you just want the 1.6 or some older like the 1.1 & 1.2. I've got em.

Dave-
It's me again...

Are we still on target for a RAM run soon?
Any more thought on DX Glow Rams or is that out of the question? What about those tests of CFR RAMS?

You're my boy, Blue!

#23474

Hey Dave, does Innova have any accounting positions open. Working a company like that would be soo cool.

troof, I don't know when a Ram run is going to happen. Possibly over the winter. The test for CFR will happen at the
same time. Glow Rams are unlikely in DX.

luckyg71, sorry no accounting positions available.

How about disc-tester? Or maybe disc-retriever for when the disc-tester tests discs? Count me in!

Glow Rams are unlikely in DX.



Is it a issue with wieghting material vs. weights of the glow plastic? Is it hard to spec out a glow vs regular plastic?

Thanks for scratching that itch, Dave! :D

troof, the are more issues regarding demand, glow, and run size, besides making the weight correct. But yes, it is hard to spec out glow vs regular.

How about any Soft Glow JK Aviar X's ? :D

troof, the are more issues regarding demand, glow, and run size, besides making the weight correct. But yes, it is hard to spec out glow vs regular.



Thanks dave, I'm always a student... /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Donny, those are possible, but unlikely soon.

Dave,

It's been a while since anyone has posted just to let you know how cool it is that you come to these forums and answer questions. Just wanted to post a great big <font color="blue"> </font> THANK YOU!

KClofty, I haven't said it in a while either, but I want to thank you and the others for the feedback you give me. Both negatives and positives help me to get a feel for how we are doing. So even though this forum does take time to do, it is time well spent.

No, Dave, Thank you.

Id have to say Big Ups to Dave as well for answering mundane questions and prolly the same questions over again and just trying to give us what we want period.

Dave, Id buy you a beer if I ever saw you out at a bar somewhere.

Cheers!

Dave -

Could you give us any insight to what sort of molds you are working up in your secret lair? I love my Innova drivers, even though I throw a mixed bag. I've been able to develop an unhealthly love for my Coyote, and I can't wait to see it in the STAR plastic. I wish I could find an Innova midrange in budget that worked like a Z-Buzzz, but I suppose you have to let the USDGC and the collectors have their thing.

Will Innova release any new putters soon? I'd love a "Thin molded" Aviar. Lower profile, maybe if you could take 1/8'' out of the middle, or more? That would be a great putter.

And, is there any way you could give us an updated schedule of STAR plastic runs, and expected releases? I'm hoping to be able to get my grubby little hands on maybe a SW soon. And then, who knows?

Thanks for your excellent work, as always Dave. Keep it up, and keep it in!

Kool-Keith, the alternative to a Roc in our line is a Shark.

We are making putters out of a new formulation, but it is the same putter. A lower profile Aviar would be an XD or Classic Roc.

Sidewinders are ready for release. TeeBirds will be ready soon. After that, I'm not sure what we will be releasing, but we have run Beasts and Stingrays. We have also run Star Wraiths, but they are still in the CFR program for now. We might try Star putters as we are running the regular putter now.

We have one big boy disc in the pipeline, but it won't be released until next year some time.

Thanks Dave -

Your work helped me win my very first tournament today! (novice division)

I haven't had a Shark to throw yet, but I've held one. The bottom of the rim seems a little "sharp" to me - I don't know if it would be comfortable to throw. I'll try to find one to borrow first, but I'd like to fill that spot in the bag with Champion plastic instead of Z. I'm not a brand guy like some of the people out there, but I do prefer the feel of the Champion plastic over the Z any day. I've had some Z that was so slick it was, for me, unthrowable.

I can't wait to see some of the STAR plastic showing up! I dig my STAR Orc - for me, it's almost like a completely different disc. The extra grip that the STAR plastic gives seems to allow me alot more snap, and I can usually will go farther, straighter without the fade of my Champion Orcs.

Is this a common experience with your testers?

Thanks Dave. Can't wait for STAR Coyotes, and STAR Stingrays.

Keith

Kool-Keith, yes most of our testers like the extra grip of the Star plastic. You might want to wait on the Shark until it comes out in Star. I think the Star Coyote is the only thing that is going to get my Champion Coyote out of my bag. I had a Champion TeeBird in my bag for years. It's been replaced with a Star TeeBird. My Sidewinder is now Star. So far only the Star Beast didn't replace my Champion Beast.

dave--do you know where to get the cfr star wraiths? also why did you like the champ beast better than star beast? last-- what is this new "big boy" disc? speed of a wraith but more overstable? thx again

steven, the cfr Star Wraith should be available soon. The first 500 have been sent to be dyed for Pro Worlds. I didn't like the Star Beast because it was too high speed stable for my taste. I like my Beast to have a little turn I can use for long turnovers and sidearm rollers. Yes, the big boy is as you describe.

sorry for all the questions--[thanks for answering them] but do you feel that the star plastic makes the drivers slightly more [over]stable? and in your experience, does the star plastic make the drivers "break-in" faster and moreso than the champ plastic? and do you anticipate running the leopard and spider in star? thank you

steven, yes, I think Star plastic might make most drivers slightly more stable, and I think they do break in slightly faster too. We will run the leopard and Spider in Star.

steven, yes, I think Star plastic might make most drivers slightly more stable, and I think they do break in slightly faster too. We will run the leopard and Spider in Star.



To confuse everyone more, I ask: Are the star drivers (specifically teebird), after they've initially broken in, about as stable as a seasoned champion? Are they more or less stable?
Also, do you have an estimated release date for the star Aviar?

thanks dave

DSProAviar, the Star TeeBirds seem to start off a liitle overstable but break in to fly stable, like a regular Champion. We have not set a release date for the Star Aviar yet.

dave any thoughts on a "star" starfire? i loved the pro starfire but they beat up too fast, so started using the champion starfire but they were too slick for my meager grip......thanks.

Mr. Toad, we are planning to run both the regular Starfire Star and the SL Star.

how are those Star Teebirds looking Dave???

Mr. Toad, we are planning to run both the regular Starfire Star and the SL Star.



thanks dave that'll be a couple more strokes off my scores.. :D

jaymo, I am very happy with the Star TeeBirds. They look, feel, and fly great IMO.

We will run the leopard and Spider in Star.



Need a winter throw tester...lets say in MI for those spiders, Dave?

:D:D:D ;) ;)

Dave,

Thanks for the partnering program with the 06 Worlds CFR Wraiths. It worked out well for me and the EIEIO. Hopefully it's helping out the Augusta Worlds just as nicely.

Howdy from out East Dave. A couple guys were throwing those new super light primy, er premey Rocs. They felt like the lightweight Zephyr plastic or the Bulldog or whatever. Tell me about this new run and please let me know how to pick one up. Zonedriven doesn't have them, and they are my regular pro shop, and I don't want to E'bay for it. Are there any online retailers who are selling these to your knowledge? Thanks again and props on the Wraith, pushing the envelope.
Jeb Bryant #24658

Jeb, I'm not sure why Zonedriven doen't have them, but discgolfvalues.com either has them or can get them quickly. There are two types. The 113 gm regular Roc and the 95 gm Classic Roc.

You the man Dave.

hey ive been throwing those too :D with the wind they're awesome...against the wind :mad:not so good.!
dave was this an attempt to provide another mta disc for us?

Mr Toad, our first MTA Roc was the classic. I set a masters world record of 14 something with it, that has since been broken. The next was the 113gm Roc. Then the Lynx, which was later replaced by the Lynx-like Condor at 138 gms.

Dave, can you direct me where to find info about getting custom stamped discs for an event here? Last year they went with the other company (and they did a fine job by the way), but I think I may have convinced the powers that be to go with "THE" brand. I was told that they couldn't find the info to get the custom stamped discs (and maybe even some of the really cool Inncolor style). Since I throw almost exclusively Innova (and have for many years now), this would really be a plus for the event. Thanks, any help would be greatly appreciated.
Rock

Dave, I have a question about Star plastic. Will you be able to make "Gummy" versions of some of the discs like you do with the lighter weight regular champion plastic? Seems this would be extremely grippy material.

Sweet !!!!! Gummy , Star Stamped , Glow JK Aviar X's !!!!! :D Just kidding !!!!

Dave, can you direct me where to find info about getting custom stamped discs for an event here?

See here (http://innovadiscs.com/discs/rustyguide.html)

Rock, you can call or email sam.ferrans@innovadiscs.com or 909-481-6266. That's the west coast. We do INNColor. The east coast does full color.

CE-DiscGolfer, yes, we will be able to do gummy Star versions. That being said, I don't know whether they would be any grippier than regular gummy at this time, but I would guess they would be.

Thanks Felix and Dave. I hope we can send some extra business your way.

When are the STAR FAQ's (http://innovadiscs.com/images/faqbanner.jpg) being run?

Dave,

A while back I ordered a few discs off the net, I believe from everythingdiscgolf.com or discgolfstore.com. Anyway, the discs were champion beasts with what they called a Prism Dye. I've occasionally seen a few other discs on Ebay with the same type of dye. Anyway, I lost one of these discs, and I really don't want to bust out the other one, because I don't know where to get more, but the disc has a lot of sentimental value to me, and i've gotten my longest drives with it. Can you give me some more information about this run?

thanks,
Dustin

One more question. Is there a minimum order for custom stamped or Inncolor discs? I am going to be getting married soon and was hoping to get a small run of about 25 custom discs to give out to a few friends and families as momentos.
Thanks
Dustin

you might be better off getting mini's made...

i got mini's when I got married 9/18/2004

dwridener, I don't understand if you are talking about the pearlescent plastic or the dye for I-dye. If it's the I-dye, I can't help you. If it's the pearlescent plastic, it might be a lower weight disc. Regardless, the look of the plastic is mostly irrelevant. Older Champion Beasts were a little more stable than the newer Champion Beasts. Can't help you any more than that, I don't think. Sorry.

dwridener, you are in the east coast area. You need to call 803-366-50-28. Our minimums on hotstamps would be 100. You might want to ask about full color, which the east coast does on dx.

I was refering to the dye on the disc. The dye job looked like the Pink Floyd "Dark Side of the Moon" album cover, and it seemed to be a factory dye job. I'll try and upload a picture of it if I can get my camera to work. I emailed both online retailers about the disc and neither responded. I've only ever seen 3 of them, but they came in 167-169g only. I bought 2, and a friend bought 1 after he saw mine. His was slightly different however, because his was a Barry Schultz signature disc. Thanks

Dustin

Its not factory if its the Dark Side of the Moon. Those are done ( or were first done ) by Ed Burde. He also was the first I seen to do the Steal Your Face dye. That was along time ago. Im pretty sure he hooks up Skysouth with dyes, so check there.

Ed Burde says glow.

Dave,
When will Innova come out with a high speed driver with a thumbtrac? It can only be better than the Slipstream


_jeremiah

Older Champion Beasts were a little more stable than the newer Champion Beasts.



Are you happy with the retooled/newer Beasts or are you planning to make a change with the next run?

C of P, Thumtracs are not good on high speed drivers.

scoob, yes, I am happy with the retool. We needed a fast, long disc, with some turnover. The Starfire L and Orc already filled the slight high speed turn niche.

Thanks Dave,

I was thinking they werent good either. Oh and by the way.... The Wraith is AWESOME!

Dave,
I've heard a rumor that the rhyno is being phased-out. Any troof to this? Should I stock-up now?

thnx

Hey Dave, when is the STAR plastic going to make it to vendors?

CE-DiscGolfer, yes, we will be able to do gummy Star versions. That being said, I don't know whether they would be any grippier than regular gummy at this time, but I would guess they would be.



WOOHOO! I don't think I could go on without the gummies. & if STAR gummies are even grippier . . .

I'm drooling here thinking about a 150 gummy STAR Teebird! :D

Troof, no troof to that rumor. The Rhyno is a keeper.

luckyg71, the Star Sidewinders and TeeBirds should be out very soon. The Star Sidewinders will be first.

A Star SideWinder. Now I might be drooling. Get me a couple of those and maybe a gummy Star Rhino (hint) and I might have to get rid of my bag.

How can we get these STAR teebirds? or rather where? are they going to be available through all the regular channels? are they CFR only?

Most importantly, when do you think I can expect them up here in Vancouver??? we need grip up here! it's just way too wet.

Hope you had fun at the SO CAL Champs. Did you get to meet the representitives we sent down? That's just a sampling though, we're not all as insane as Glen and Dave. :D

Jaymo, the Star TeeBirds were available at the So Cal Championships. Your friends from Canada have them as they were in the player pack. They are available to tournaments now. They will be available through normal channels as soon as they are hotstamped. I didn't have a chance to meet any of your fellow cannucks yet, but there's still tomorrow. By the way, it was 87 degrees today. :)

well if you see any of them... I think there's three or four of them down there... Brian is in the advanced div. Glen and Dave are in Open.

Tell them to give me their teebirds... :D

By the way, it was 87 degrees today. :)




Thats just wrong........ Snow expected Tuesday. Again.

Fog and 10 degrees (in real temperature, none of this farenheit nonsense)

By the way, it was 87 degrees today. :)



Thats just wrong........ Snow expected Tuesday. Again.



I did the math... and just realized what 87 degrees means in celcius...

**** that is wrong!!! :o

Dave, you were mentioning the latest Aero was a 'correction' of the "re-tooled" Aero, which had a bit of drift...how do I tell the difference?

...how are they different from the circa 1983 Aero?

...why is this one of the few Innova discs with the name molded-into the bottom?

Slo, it's difficult to tell. The nose is a little flatter but you would have to have the two versions next to each other to tell. The are exactly the same as the original version as far as flight goes. We Aero on the bottom as it is a unique disc that doesn't share any parts with any other disc.

I certainly does seem unique. I got a used one from Mike Williams; it does drift a tad. But I can throw it about 260'; much farther than I can manage with an Aviar, and without fade. That's useful!!

...er, which version has the flatter nose?

Will the STAR Teebirds be available before Christmas? Can you tell we're just a little excited about new plastic? :D
Thanks Dave for all you do!

rob, yes the Star Tees should be available in 2 weeks.....I hope. The Star Sidewinders should be available today.

Dave,

Will the Eagle get the STAR treatment? Us Eagle throwers are still smarting from our Pro plastic snub.

Thanks.

Hawk, yes Eagle will get the Star treatment it deserves.

Dave, is the stamp on the Star Sidewinders at Zonedriven (which are sweet by the way) going to be on all runs, or just the 1st runs?

AR, I believe it is the regular stamp.

Hey dave.
Long time no chat. My account got erased in the last crash and they couldn't restore it(it's Greatzky! )

anyway.. I thought that the "Star" Discs were going to the same price as the regular Champion discs? on zonedriven's site they are CFR prices. Is that because of the first run or is that going to be the price??

also.. Can't wait for the Teebirds! I am trying to trade/sell a few of my 11x's so i can get a few of the Star Birds.

-Scott Lewis

Hawk, yes Eagle will get the Star treatment it deserves.



Dave will the EX or the EL or both get the "star treatment" also same question for the aviar. big or small bead?

: ) :

Hi Dave i too was erased in the last crash, formerly i was "robj"...

The stamp on the S.T.A.R. Sidewinders look like this according to your website:

http://innovadiscs.com/images/homepage_only/sidewinder_star.jpg

I had hoped the S.T.A.R line would use some form of a star stamp. these look great. can we look forward to these on all STAR models? (i didn't understand your answer to AR)

Scott, I think our MSRP is the same as Champion was and Champion was lowered one dollar. The MSRP for Star and Champion respectively is $16.99 and $15.99. Actual retail price varies as usual from vendor to vendor.

Rob, that is the stock hotstamp. All the Star line will have that motif.

Friar, we haven't made a decision on whether we will do both Eagle versions in Star. For the first offering, it will be EL. The Aviar will start with the putter version, but we will most likely do the big bead too. The big bead is getting repaired to fix the flashing problem on the bottom.

Robj, I have an update on the availability of the Star TeeBirds. They went on sale today on the west coast, but as we will be shut down for Thanksgiving, Monday will be the day. The East coast will be a couple of days later. Star Sidewinders are available on both coasts now.

Hey Dave, I love the commemorative gold putters you guys released this year, it is some of the best plastic I have ever used. I have converted numerous people out here after watching the flight of the disc and how it takes a beating and keeps on going so much so we actually have a gold club of members who use the putter.(gold members after Austin Powers). The problem w/ that disc, and the only problem, is that it blends in w/ the dirt to well. Even on short putts it can be a problem finding that thing. My question is if you're going to make a champion glow aviar or a silver aviar in the future. The glow aviar would be the best--my personal favorite for plastic(w/ the gold comming in a close second) which I've been trying to convert my whole bag to. Even if it was a CFR we would order a ton of them for our tourneys here in Norcal.
Sorry for the long post. Innova rocks!!!

geo, we will be running Star Aviars at some point in time. That might fit the bill for you.

I hope that you run them in stiff big beads?

Dave,

I vote for putter mold, small bead.

My vote would be small bead driver mold. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

The Aviar will start with the putter version, but we will most likely do the big bead too. The big bead is getting repaired to fix the flashing problem on the bottom.



It looks like everyone will be happy.

Dave:

Not sure if this has been asked or not...but why do the new Star Teebirds say "Fairway Driver" and the Star Sidewinders say "Distance Driver"? Since when did the Teebird get demoted to the "Fairway Driver" category? That seems a bit odd to me.

that is a little odd, but maybe they don't have the category of "straight distance driver" anymore... THat's kindof messed up though....
Can't wait to order a few though. Hope they compare to my 11x's i have :)

-Scott Lewis

P.s. although the teebird is a "straight distance driver" on the innova website it is in the "Fairway driver" category. I'm guessing it's always been in that category or the categories have been changed due to the faster discs that have come out in the last few years.
I guess i have no "Distance" Drivers in my bag then....

i'm looking forward to the day when Orcs and Wraiths say "fairway driver" and the people i am competing against are throwing things faster but more nose angle dependent and harder to be accurate with :D

scott and discchucker, the catagories were just recently changed. Speed 7 discs are now included with the speed 6 and one speed 5 as fairway drivers. And, if you think about it, it is much easier to keep the fairway drivers in the fairway than the higher speed drivers, with the exception of the Viking,

Dave,

Another slap to us Eagle users. ;) Assuming I break my fingers and stretch them to be longer to compensate for bigger rims, my logical move up would be to the Orc correct? Same flight characteristics (-1/+3) and I believe you answered me once before that with two identical throws a player with proper distance ability (400'+ for drivers?) could get 20' extra with an Orc vs. an Eagle. Am I recalling that correctly?

Thanks.

Hawk, your next move up from an Eagle, would be either a Viking or Firebird L. The Orc is a couple of steps up and is much harder to keep in a fairway. But to answer your question; yes you could get 20 or more feet with an Orc versus an Eagle. The Eagles we are making now are the same as the original. We changed to an X version for a couple of years, but are back now. The original version has a straighter flight and more glide than the X version, making it less overstable too.

Dave, I remember from reading your comments that you sometimes mention what a disc "likes" to do; can you tell me what the Aero "likes" to do? Does it "like" to fly a higher line?

...and could you comment on its "torque resistance", and what that means>>>throwing it. :)

Dave,

You do love that Viking don't you? What's the rim size on a Viking compared to an Eagle, and again with an equal throw how much gain could one expect with a Viking?

Thanks.

Glad I have a stack of CE Eagles (EX's so to speak).

Rim on a Viking is similar to a Valkyrie which is similar to an Eagle.

If you're looking for Eagle stability, definitely try the Firebird L. It will be more Eagle-like than a Viking IMO (YMMV).

Slo the Aero does like to fly higher than other golf discs. It does fairly well with nose up too. The Aero is one of our least torque resistent discs, but unless you are trying to get over 300 ft, throwing into a stiff wind, or throwing a flutter shot, you shouldn't notice. When I say torque resistence, I mean the ability of a disc to dampen out off axis torque or flutter.

Hawk, yes I like the Viking sidearm and backhand. For equal throwing power, I would give the Viking 10 to 15 extra feet. The Viking has the same size rim as a Valkyrie, Firebird, Sidewinder, and Roadrunner.

Dave,
Just looking for an update with all of these new molds rolling out of Calli...

what's in your bag now?

Thanks

troof

troof, I have 2 JK Aviars, 1 Coyote, 1 Star Stingray, 1 Champion Leopard, 1 Champion Beast, 1 Champion Viking, 1 Champion Starfire L. The rest have been changing as I have been testing discs: Star Wraith, DX Wraith, Star Sidewinder, Champion Roadrunner, and a test disc.

troof, I have 2 JK Aviars, 1 Coyote, 1 Star Stingray, 1 Champion Leopard, 1 Champion Beast, 1 Champion Viking, 1 Champion Starfire L. The rest have been changing as I have been testing discs: Star Wraith, DX Wraith, Star Sidewinder, Champion Roadrunner, and a test disc.



Waaiit a second..NO TEEBIRD?!?!?!

How is that test disc performing? more D than a wraith?

i love the ch leopard ---maybe a better dx teebird? how is the dx wraith?

How does the star stingray fly compared to a champion stingray? When will the Star stingray be available? Thanks.

DSProAviar, I stand corrected, One Star TeeBird. I will also be looking to potentially add a Star TL and SL when we make them.

Steven the DX Wraiths can go as low as 120gms. I was throwing a 168 gm disc. It had the good DX grip, had real good carry and seemed to have better durability than regular DX. Time will tell on that issue.

Sharky, I don't remember how the Champion Stingrays flew exactly. As I recall, they didn't turn enough for my tastes. The Star Stingrays are the Ontario version and have a good turn at higher speeds. It will turn up to flat from a 30 degree hyzer when thrown 300 ft line drive speed. I wish they were available already, but they haven't been stamped or shipped to the East coast yet. So that will take a week or so.

Dave, now that Innova has added Star plastic, will one of the other plastics be phased out? Do you think it will eventually replace the Champion line?
Thanks.

Lou, we are going to let the market dictate which plastics stay and which go. It could be that the Pro drivers will be phased out if they don't have a strong enough demand.

Dave, during your hot 3rd round at the USDGC, did you say you were using a Wraith as your go-to driver?

Hey Dave ,

Any word yet on these new type of Star run disc's being produced.

Star JK Aviar X ?
Star ORC ?
Star Wraith ?
Star ROC ?

Hey Dave ,

Any word yet on these new type of Star run disc's being produced.

Star JK Aviar X ?
Star ORC ?
Star Wraith ?
Star ROC ?



Orcs are already available as Fund Raisers, have been for months.

And I'm going to assume that the star roc will be reserved for the USDGC fundraiser. There are some star wraiths that are being dyed by j-bird to be released as a fundraiser for 06 worlds soon. And I think dave said that the first star run of putter would be an aviar, but I don't think he's decided on big or small bead.

Did I hear mention of a Star TL...(cleaning drool off of chin)...

Don't tease so much Dave...

A Star TL would sweet.

Dave, forgive me if this has been addressed here, but could you tell me the differences in the DX, Pro and Champ Wraiths. I have been throwing the Proline and it is great! What would be the difference in flight of the other 2 (if any) and also grip factor.

Thanks in advance for your time.

Rob, yes, I used the Wraith for sidearms and backhands.

ScholarshipGiver, The Pro Wraith is a little less high speed stable and has more glide than the Champion, Star, or DX. The DX version is still experimental, but has the best grip and is a little more stable than the Pro and a little less than Champion or Star. The Star grip is almost as good as the Pro and better than the Champion.

troof, , 1 Star Stingray,




....what?!?!? A star Stingray!!! Awesome! I was so disappointed when I heard the rumor that the champion stingray was phazing out. Is it in trial testing, or is it ready to ship?

Thanks Dave!

Thanks Dave!!

troof, the Star Stingray should be ready any day now. As usual, it depends on hotstamping and the East Coast getting them.

Dave,

So what are all the Star Line discs that will be available within the next 30 days?

Josh, only TeeBirds, Sidewinders and Stingrays within the next 30 days. Next in the molding schedule are Beasts, SLs, and Wraiths. These will be available next year early.

Dave,
Will there be a Star MONSTER? I imagine it would be similar to the first run pro line monsters (slightly less stable than the current champion) which have become valuable and rather hard to come by.

bring on the STAR Wraiths...I threw the T-birds today in a (15-20mph) wind and they performed well...a little more stable than i thought,and really good into the wind...flew like the 10X's but with better grip

Dave...any thoughts on a Star Gremlin??? :D:D:D

I know I can't be the only one wanting this one...

OK ...............I'd like a Star Whippet , about 172 grams. :D

I agree, the Star Whippet would be pretty sweet, or a Star Firebird...

I would like to check out the Star Wraith , when it comes out.

How stable ?

I would like to check out the Star Aviar , when it comes out.

Both Driver and Putter's !!!!!

Dave,

I appreciate it. From what I hear from others up in cold country (Wisconsin) the SB plastic is holding up great!! I myself have only thrown the Orc and Roc. I'm on injured reserve right now; I had ankle surgery to repair a tendon this past October. Trust me I've got the disc golf inch badly!!! So I've been learning to put in my recliner. Ha-ha. Keep the great things going Dave!!

Josh

Oh man!!!! Star Firebird FX !!!!!! I'm Drooling!!!!

Star Viper! :D

Please, Dave. All I want for Christmas is a Star Viper. :)

how long would you guess before we see STAR Coyotes and Starfires? My birthday is in March :p /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif :D

i would 2nd the vote put for star gremlins :)

Wood, Star Monsters will happen eventually, but they are down on the action list.

discchucker, I will do the Star Gremlin as a limited edition.

Donny, the Star Wraiths are about the same stability as Champion.

Robj, Star Coyotes and Starfires will probably be out by March. Star SLs are running now, and should be out by the end of January.

Dave,
I have an idea. Why not just post your production schedule....or just a link. There MIGHT be a few drier keyboards around here. :D But thought of a Star Sidewinder or ...... now I gotta go get a towel. :D :D

Hawk, your next move up from an Eagle, would be either a Viking or Firebird L. The Orc is a couple of steps up and is much harder to keep in a fairway. But to answer your question; yes you could get 20 or more feet with an Orc versus an Eagle. The Eagles we are making now are the same as the original. We changed to an X version for a couple of years, but are back now. The original version has a straighter flight and more glide than the X version, making it less overstable too.



"A straighter, less overstable Eagle with more glide" sounds a lot like a Teebird. What are the differences between the two?

Thanks.

Lou, the TeeBird is more high speed stable and low speed overstable. The Eagle would be closer to a TL. The Eagle is a little bit faster than a TeeBird.

Star Monster seems like it would get alot of action!!

Dave, not sure if this is a rumor or not, but i heard Des was getting a signature disc (shark). Will this be run in Star?
Thanks again all mighty Creator :D

The Shark is not scheduled to be run in Star soon. We have no plans for a Des disc per se, but we are planning a 2005 Champions signiture disc, which will include Des. We haven't decided on the disc or the are yet.

The Shark is not scheduled to be run in Star soon. We have no plans for a Des disc per se, but we are planning a 2005 Champions signiture disc, which will include Des. We haven't decided on the disc or the are yet.



I was thinking Coyote, but i guess you might want a disc most Innova Champs carry... (Aviar/Roc) or maybe a new special disc like the Wraith...

decisions; decisons :D

Dave,

I take it since the Star line is $2 more than the Champion plastic; that the Star Line is the top line now from Innova?

Dave - Is it true that there will not be any more runs of the CFR Wraith with the current 2006 Worlds Stamp?

discchucker, I will do the Star Gremlin as a limited edition.



Woohoo!!

Wood, Star Monsters will happen eventually, but they are down on the action list.



that sir is three times dope. CANTWAITCANTWAITCANTWAIT

sidiscgolf, yes, Star is now our top of the line, but I thought it was only $1.00 more.

17684, yes it is true. The tie died Star Wraiths will be the last of the Worlds fundraisers.

discchucker, I will do the Star Gremlin as a limited edition.



Woohoo!!



Oh Dave, I will be clearing the credit card for an order.... :D

Dave, i was looking at some of the world records at the
WFDF website (http://www.wfdf.org/index.php?page=records/index.htm) and it said:
Roller Distance (non-turf):
Open: 1156.00 m Randy Lahm (US) 4/01/01 El Mirage, CA

if i did the translation right: (1156m x 39.37 inches) / 12 that equals 3796.643 feet.
that's just crazy! :Ddo you know anything about it? was it flat ground?

amazingly, I think that roller was an aviar.

The rollers were on a dry lake bed and wind assisted. Sam Ferrans set his record with an Aviar. It was later broken by Randy, but I don't know what he threw. All you had to do was start the roll basically and it would roll to the end of the lake bed.

hello dave,
I am going to be ordering the new Star teebirds tonight or Sunday and I was wondering if the first run Teebirds will have any stamp that shows their first run status or did Zonedriven just list the colors available for the first run.

If They are nothign more than the first colors out then i'll wait because right now only White is available in 175 grams.. But if all the Star Birds will be the same when can I expect you to have the other colors available in max weight?

I'm planning on picking up about 4 so i definately don't want to get white(bad for winter) unless i have to.

-Scott Lewis

I was going by zonedrivens prices. They have the Champion at $13 and the Star at $15. That's where I got the $2 from.

Josh

Greatzky, I am not sure what Zonedriven is offering. I don't think we did any special first run stamp. We have been running multiple colors, but all of the colors might not have gotten to Zonedriven yet.

Sounds good dave. I'll probably order1 or 2 tonight and make another order when the other colors arrive.. I like white discs, but they aren't good for winter and they remind me too much of pro plastic.. I defiantely like the Blue and REd though as I have SPecial blend oRcs and Rocs(of which i throw none) and they look good.

-Scott Lewis

p.s Will the star plastic get more grippy when it gets worn/dirty just like the NIghtshift ORcs or is it just grippier than champion?

Greatzky, they should be very similar to night shift. The main colors are white, blue, yellow, red, and black. There are a smattering of other mixed colors too, such as orange.

I noticed that you've got the star stingrays up on the website, and I had a question about the molding of them. If I remember correctly, you've mentioned the high x-out numbers with the champion stingrays, and I was curious how the star plastic has fixed this, or if you're still getting those high x-out numbers with even this line of plastic.

Dave,
I saw that the Champion Starfire was coming out of the CFR line and into normal production. Which mold is it, the Original, the 2nd Mold (X) or the 3rd Mold (L)?

Thanks!
Mike

Mike, it will be the second variant. We will make two Starfire variants. The Starfire (X) and the Starfire L, which we will refer to as SL. The SL will be Star SL and Pro SL, which is currently called Pro Starfire. The Starfire (X) will be Star and Champion.

Dave,
I got the extreme sports shop acrossed the street from my home course to start carrying Innova discs. They have had much success selling discs, but no one that works there plays disc golf or keeps up on the new discs coming into the market. I went in yesterday to talk to them about bringing the Star line as it becomes available. They asked if Innova sends out new product notification information to all retailers.

Being that the catalog is only updated once a year, how do you currently notify retailers of new product offerings that may be released between catalog printings?

Thanks,
Rob

Got my 150 STAR Teebirds & 150 STAR Sidewinders today! Interesting plastic, much stiffer than I expected, but still very tacky. I'm usually a floppy/gummy 150 Champion driver thrower (153 star stamp Sidewinder & 150 11x Teebird in the bag, among others), & I'll compare the two over the next week or two & report back.