Dave, any chance of a star roc ever being produced? :confused:

The star roc is reserved for the USDGC.

Thanks

Hey Dave, just gots to say WOW, TThe Star Orc is awesome, Flies like a first run Champ Orc with more glide. It is going right into the bag for CharloTTe this weekend and USDGC....it is that predictable. Thanks.

Tried the Max yesterday as well.....best description is definitel a faster Firebird X. BUT it is definitely not the same flight for Hook Thumbers. It is way understable for my overhand. I think the hook on the edge of the Firebird is all the difference.
The Max will definitely fill in a space in my bag, but not until after USDGC.
Thanks again Dave
C Ya in 4 days
Schweb

Hi Dave, Fred Salaz just received the InnColor discs for the KY States Doubles event this Saturday and the Singles event this Sunday at Idlewild. half are Star TeeRex's (bottom says STR) and half are SB Wraiths. (bottom says SBWR). are these a special blend or are they Star and "SWR" would be too easily confused with Sidewinders?

The InnColor discs are really sweet -- this year is Idlewild hole 2 (long pin).
http://rjohnston7.photosite.com/~photos/tn/4291472_1024.ts1158171695045.jpg
i don't see them up yet in the InnColor gallery, but ^ here ^ is what they look like if anyone is interested.

for more info on the disc or event, click here (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=595475&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1&PHPSESSID=)

Hey Schweb...

You say the Star Orcs are like the 1st run champ orcs? I had a few of those but my supply was starting to dwindle so I tried to get into the wraith, but still love my Orcs. If you say the Stars are like the first run champs... I am ALL OVER THAT!

cheers

Sorry that was to read " I am not a Rock expert" I have many ROC's, Can't say how many some one will tell my Wife.



:D :D, I have the same problem!!

I have a few rock's but an expert.

The San Marino and Ontario Have the same Big Bird Stamp both have two rings around the stamp.the Rancho has a similar big bird stamp except the rings are broken not compelete circles. that is in DX Plastic


Pix�s of the "big birds", first San Marino:
http://www.seeroccity.com/pick.cgi?gallery=ne for example picture 76 on the left side
Ontario:
http://www.seeroccity.com/pick.cgi?gallery=nw for example picture 157 on the left side
Rancho
http://www.seeroccity.com/pick.cgi?gallery=se for example picture 210 on the left side

Hey Dave, just gots to say WOW, TThe Star Orc is awesome, Flies like a first run Champ Orc with more glide. It is going right into the bag for CharloTTe this weekend and USDGC....it is that predictable. Thanks.

Tried the Max yesterday as well.....best description is definitel a faster Firebird X. BUT it is definitely not the same flight for Hook Thumbers. It is way understable for my overhand. I think the hook on the edge of the Firebird is all the difference.
The Max will definitely fill in a space in my bag, but not until after USDGC.
Thanks again Dave
C Ya in 4 days
Schweb



Hey Brian, I noticed the UD difference too. The Firebird turns slower. I like the fast travel and fast flip for #4 USDGC. Your UD is too good to switch. Mine isn't. See ya Monday.

Hi Dave, Fred Salaz just received the InnColor discs for the KY States Doubles event this Saturday and the Singles event this Sunday at Idlewild. half are Star TeeRex's (bottom says STR) and half are SB Wraiths. (bottom says SBWR). are these a special blend or are they Star and "SWR" would be too easily confused with Sidewinders?



SWR and SBWR are the same. SBWR were the first run. It wasn't done for the confusion thing, but funny you mention that. Last year at the USDGC I was throwing a sidearm drive on the #5 lake hole tee shot. I thought I had a SBWR and I actually had a SBSW. Both white. The Sidewinder is at the bottom of the lake now.

LOL :D

... during the USDGC too though :eek:

ouch .

Hey Dave ,

Is it possible to make Star Plastic in UV or Glow material ?

My apologies if you already answered this.

Hey Dave ,

Is it possible to make Star Plastic in UV or Glow material ?

My apologies if you already answered this.



It's possible, but the opaque nature of the Star plastic would mask the effects. It's easy to do glow Champion on the other hand.

In the last few monthes I've really enjoyed trying all my old favorite Innova discs out in the new Star plastic. I play around lots of gator infested water holes, so I've replaced most of my favorite discs many times over. I've noticed that the Star plastic in most discs (Teebird and Wraiths in particular) varies from a stiff, slicker plastic that allows a little light through, to a softer, grippier plastic that allows almost no light through, and all combinations in between. I find the stiffer plastic to be far more durable and fly more stable (holding the line better), even when new. I hope that Star plastic stays available in this stiffer form for those of us who prefer them. Is the variation intentional, or should we expect to see Star plastic become more universal?

Dave, Thanks for all the great plastic. With the success of Star plastic how are the sales of Champion plastic holding up? I am curious if Champion plastic will be phazed out?

In the last few monthes I've really enjoyed trying all my old favorite Innova discs out in the new Star plastic. I play around lots of gator infested water holes, so I've replaced most of my favorite discs many times over. I've noticed that the Star plastic in most discs (Teebird and Wraiths in particular) varies from a stiff, slicker plastic that allows a little light through, to a softer, grippier plastic that allows almost no light through, and all combinations in between. I find the stiffer plastic to be far more durable and fly more stable (holding the line better), even when new. I hope that Star plastic stays available in this stiffer form for those of us who prefer them. Is the variation intentional, or should we expect to see Star plastic become more universal?



Good observation. The variation is intentional. I wish we could do just one mix type and please everyone, but we can't. Some people like the stiffer more stable stuff and some people like the softer grippier less stable stuff. Also the plastic varies with weight and disc type. Some discs are only available in a very narrow range of weight, but even in that narrow range we can make them stiffer or softer.

Dave, Thanks for all the great plastic. With the success of Star plastic how are the sales of Champion plastic holding up? I am curious if Champion plastic will be phazed out?



I thought it might originally, but there is no sign that it will be phased out. Although most people like the added grip of the Star plastic, some people still prefer the Champion over the Star. Add to that the lower cost, and I think it will be around for a long time.

Hey Dave whats the most stable colors in the star line or does it vary disc to disc?

Dave is currently in Rock Hill for the USDGC. He might not have a lot of extra time to check in here this week.

Hey Dave whats the most stable colors in the star line or does it vary disc to disc?



I'm not Dave, but I've thrown many different Star molds and individual discs and I have found that the stiffer the plastic the more stable/overstable the disc will be.

Hey Dave whats the most stable colors in the star line or does it vary disc to disc?



I'm not Dave, but I've thrown many different Star molds and individual discs and I have found that the stiffer the plastic the more stable/overstable the disc will be.



I also keep hearing (and have noticed somewhat) that dark blue and dark red are the most stable colors. But yeah, a stiffer white or yellow should beat out a softer red or blue for overstability.

Hey Dave, question on the skeeters. I picked one up from Brinster this past weekend at Animalfest and he told me this was supposed to be a "neutral" flier.... which jives with everything I have since read about the DX Skeeters. But the disc I have a is a total pig! all the thing wants to do is hyzer on me. I usually touch 400' with a pro wraith, and throwing the skeeter along with a new ESP Torque (which discraft rates as a stability rating of 2), I can get the Torque to ride a straight line for MUCH longer than my Skeeter before the disc hyzers out. Thrown anhyzer, I also get far less left-to-right (RHBH) action with the Skeeter since it pulls itself out of the turn seemingly as soon as it can.

I heard rumors of Skeeters coming out in Star plastic which A)i understand are supposed to only be in CFR runs right now and B)are supposedly also going to be much more overstable than their DX counterparts. My question is... despite the fact that my disc has the normal DX "first run" stamp on it, is it possible the one I have is a Star? It certainly FEELS like star plastic anyway, but from what I understand you guys have been retooling the DX plastic as well so I'm not sure if my hands are getting fooled.

I actually have a second question... is it true the original name for the Skeeter was going to be the Hobbit? Someone on another forum told me that, and that would make sense since my disc has "HOB" written on the bottom. Just wondering :) And apologies if this may have been answered earlier, this thread's kind of long to go hunting too far back hehe.

I also have a first run skeeter with a scratched out HOB on the bottom, 174gm, and i would say that "neutral" is a pretty good discription. It almost flies like a fast putter, not much fade.

I love my Skeeter. It replaced my putter and all my midranges. I was using the Goblin for approaches but the Skeeter has more range. I carried a Star Coyote for slight turnovers and straight upshots and a DX Roc for hyzer approaches or upshots with a hard fade at the end of the flight. The Skeeter replaces them all. I can throw it hyzer and it stays hyzer, or I can throw it dead straight. It also makes a wonderful turnover disc for all ranges. The Skeeter is probably the best controlled turnover disc I own.

I am currently throwing the Star Skeeter. For me, it is not more stable than the DX, if anything, I feel it is more neutral. I am throwing max weight. My Star Skeeter tends to land flat no matter what type of flight it has. The Goblin had more fade and much less glide for me.

BTW, So Cal Championships will have the CFR Star Skeeters available in a few days. Mark at discgolfvalues.com has graciously agreed to list them on his site.

Suzette, have you thrown the QMS, and if so, how does the Skeeter compare?

so apparently i have the only Overstable skeeter ever made? :confused: :cool:

...and you threw it??? You THREW a Hobbit?? /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Suzette, have you thrown the QMS, and if so, how does the Skeeter compare?



This is the Ask Dave thread, the Ask Discette thread is over at So Cal Disc Golf. ;) ;)

I just couldn't resist talking about the Skeeter as I really do love this disc. I know a few ladies around here that have switched to the Skeeter as well. They are only using it for upshots though, not for putting.

Daves gone golfin' in SC... :cool:

Daves gone golfin' in SC... :cool:



Rough Life /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

:cool:

Daves gone golfin' in SC... :cool:



we have serious plastic addicts wanting to know the answers to questions he's answered thousands of times -- but does Dave stay in Rancho and at the computer? No. he goes to the USDGC and plays disc golf :mad: [ :D]

Isnt there someone who could fill his spot while he is gone, I mean it is a big company? :confused:

Dave's not here, maaaaan. :p

Isnt there someone who could fill his spot while he is gone, I mean it is a big company? :confused:



Dave has some BIG shoes to fill. Plus he isn't the only one playing/working at USDGC this week.

Discette, you can fill 'em...If you have questions for Dave, I'm sure his better half could answer them on her thread. Ask Discette (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=597695&Main=359598#Post59 7695)

Discette, you can fill 'em...If you have questions for Dave, I'm sure his better half could answer them on her thread. Ask Discette (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=597695&Main=359598#Post597695)



NOT!!! Besides, I could fit both my feet in one of Dave's shoes with room to spare!

Isnt there someone who could fill his spot while he is gone, I mean it is a big company? :confused:



No there isn't. Dave is the man. Harold is probably the only other person who could answer 1/2 of what Dave responds to, and I'm sure he is HEAVILY involved in the USDGC. Dave designed all the discs, is closely involved in the molding process, and somehow seems to remember just about everything. I don't know what your definition of a big company is, but compared to manufacturers from other industries Innova is tiny. My local store can't even get discs from Innova this week. This thread and this board is what it is because of the dedication of Dave, so let him have a little time to himself. Even though it seems crazy to many, Dave will come back and go through all the pages he missed and respond to every question like he always does. Once again, Dave is the man! :cool:

what was that quote from Harold about Dave? ... Dave knows more about discs, disc design, and disc flight than everyone else in the world combined (okay that's not it but there was some quote Harold said about Dave that was just about that deferential and complimentary...)

Hi there. (http://marylandnomads.com/index.php?topic=7.0)

Hey any chance of Star RoadRunners soon i know its a new disc itself but its an amazing/un-noticed disc. This thing can do everything, everyone should try this disc out, effortless throws go forever, i love it, will it be available at all if not soon, Great disc truly and it rolls forever

Hey any chance of Star RoadRunners soon i know its a new disc itself but its an amazing/un-noticed disc. This thing can do everything, everyone should try this disc out, effortless throws go forever, i love it, will it be available at all if not soon, Great disc truly and it rolls forever



http://discgolfvalues.com/store/view_product.php?product=06_USMSBRR2

What differences does the SB plastic this disc is made in have to the champion??

SB was the precursor to Star plastic. click here (http://www.innovadiscs.com/faq/plastictype.html) for more info...

Hey Dave whats the most stable colors in the star line or does it vary disc to disc?



I think this was answered adequately by others on this thread, but to reiterate, the blue and red seem to be a little more stable than other colors. Stiffness does sometimes add stability too but it depends on other factors.

Dave you are a hard working man!!! You were at the USDGC just this past weekend and here you are at it.....


Thank you again..

Josh

Hey Dave, question on the skeeters. I picked one up from Brinster this past weekend at Animalfest and he told me this was supposed to be a "neutral" flier.... which jives with everything I have since read about the DX Skeeters. But the disc I have a is a total pig! all the thing wants to do is hyzer on me. I usually touch 400' with a pro wraith, and throwing the skeeter along with a new ESP Torque (which discraft rates as a stability rating of 2), I can get the Torque to ride a straight line for MUCH longer than my Skeeter before the disc hyzers out. Thrown anhyzer, I also get far less left-to-right (RHBH) action with the Skeeter since it pulls itself out of the turn seemingly as soon as it can.

I heard rumors of Skeeters coming out in Star plastic which A)i understand are supposed to only be in CFR runs right now and B)are supposedly also going to be much more overstable than their DX counterparts. My question is... despite the fact that my disc has the normal DX "first run" stamp on it, is it possible the one I have is a Star? It certainly FEELS like star plastic anyway, but from what I understand you guys have been retooling the DX plastic as well so I'm not sure if my hands are getting fooled.

I actually have a second question... is it true the original name for the Skeeter was going to be the Hobbit? Someone on another forum told me that, and that would make sense since my disc has "HOB" written on the bottom. Just wondering :) And apologies if this may have been answered earlier, this thread's kind of long to go hunting too far back hehe.



The original name for the Skeeter was the Hobbit. The Skeeter is not an overstable disc and your account is the first I have heard that anyone had a way overstable Skeeter. Either you got a freak, it is not a Skeeter of either type material, or something is going on that I am not yet aware of. If it is a freak, it would be much more likely to be DX than Star.

Hey any chance of Star RoadRunners soon i know its a new disc itself but its an amazing/un-noticed disc. This thing can do everything, everyone should try this disc out, effortless throws go forever, i love it, will it be available at all if not soon, Great disc truly and it rolls forever



We will do Star Roadrunners at some point. We are coming out of a molding crunch, so we will be able to get it in the schedule within the next couple of months, I believe. It probably won't be available this season, but will be next.

hey Dave--what discs [and plastics] were the guys in the usdgc distance comp throwing--thx

Dave,

Did Mark Stubbs actually play in the USDGC? I didn't see anything. 2006 US Disc Golf Championship Sponsor's Exemption - Mark Stubbs - Richland, MI

Did Mark at least show up to experience the USDGC? I'm just surprised he didn't play.

I know allot of people participated in the CFR program just for a chance to get drawn for USDGC Exemption; along with helping out the fundraising cause of course.

Just a suggestion maybe next year you might want to pick alternative 2nd or 3rd drawing incase players cannot attend the USDGC because it is the greatest program you guys and gals run next to the EDGE program of course.

He didn't go. He was marked for par +4 on every hole the first day. Same with Johnny Sias.

Post deleted by widiscgolf

I've heard rumors of a Barry Leopard. Any truth to this??

Dave,
I just recently got a bunch of STAR discs as my payout for a tourney and none of them say "PDGA Approved". All they say on top is...
"STAR ORC
DISTANCE DRIVER

INNOVA
DISC GOLF"
And on the bottom is "INNOVA CHAMPION DISCS,INC. RANCHO CUCAMONGA CA. USA 91730 www.INNOVADISCS.COM (http://www.INNOVADISCS.COM)
PATENT NO. 4,568,297"
So, are these PDGA Approved? If so, why was that left off of the stamp?

Dave,
I just recently got a bunch of STAR discs as my payout for a tourney and none of them say "PDGA Approved". All they say on top is...
"STAR ORC
DISTANCE DRIVER

INNOVA
DISC GOLF"
And on the bottom is "INNOVA CHAMPION DISCS,INC. RANCHO CUCAMONGA CA. USA 91730 www.INNOVADISCS.COM (http://www.INNOVADISCS.COM)
PATENT NO. 4,568,297"
So, are these PDGA Approved? If so, why was that left off of the stamp?



The Orc was approved 1-25-04. All that has to be approved is the mold. The plastic does not matter.

Here (http://www.pdga.com/documents/tech_standards/PDGA_approved_discs_and_targets.pdf) is a list of approved discs and targets.

hey Dave--what discs [and plastics] were the guys in the usdgc distance comp throwing--thx



I haven't found out yet. I only heard Avery Jenkins crushed the field with a 570 ft throw. I will find out.

Do you know if they held another drawing for someone who could actually go?



It was too late. He was scheduled to start. It must have been a last minute thing.

I've heard rumors of a Barry Leopard. Any truth to this??



This is true. They should be available in your area soon.

Well I had 2 Champion 2X BS leopards already. So I think that are out already.

Dave,
I just recently got a bunch of STAR discs as my payout for a tourney and none of them say "PDGA Approved". All they say on top is...
"STAR ORC
DISTANCE DRIVER

INNOVA
DISC GOLF"
And on the bottom is "INNOVA CHAMPION DISCS,INC. RANCHO CUCAMONGA CA. USA 91730 www.INNOVADISCS.COM (http://www.INNOVADISCS.COM)
PATENT NO. 4,568,297"
So, are these PDGA Approved? If so, why was that left off of the stamp?



I am not sure why we left it off, but it might have been to simplify the look of the stamp.

Dave I heard a rumor that there was a run of Pro Wraiths that were a blend of Pro & Star? Or SB. Is that true?

Dave,

Will you guys ever make the Beast again without the L bottom plate, maybe for fundraiser or special release?

Also I saw'll your interviews with Billy Crump, Very Cool!!

Thanks for all you do.

Couldnt agree more. I would have begged, charged or stolen to get that tourney. :cool:

hey Dave--what discs [and plastics] were the guys in the usdgc distance comp throwing--thx



pro wraiths

Dave I heard a rumor that there was a run of Pro Wraiths that were a blend of Pro & Star? Or SB. Is that true?



That essentially has been the case for all Pro Wraiths. We changed the Pro formula a couple of years ago to make it a little more durable than the original formula.

Dave,

Will you guys ever make the Beast again without the L bottom plate, maybe for fundraiser or special release?

Also I saw'll your interviews with Billy Crump, Very Cool!!

Thanks for all you do.



Yes, if I can remember to do so. That's a good idea.

Dave,
When can I expect to see the Pro Eagle; perhaps a Feldberg signature edition?

Dave,
When can I expect to see the Pro Eagle; perhaps a Feldberg signature edition?



No Pro Eagle. Dave F. did indicate he, and other team members wanted an Eagle X, which we are going to do in Star plastic next month some time.

is this a campion tee rex with a star stamp?http://community.webshots.com/myphotos?action=viewAllPhotos&albumID=552642692&security=pybskC

That sure looks like it mothergoose.

There were some produced that I know. I have seen and held 2 in my hands. They are awesome. It flew really nice. I didn't like the star teerex feel to it but I will for sure buy a Champion TeeRex when they come out. I liked the grip and feel to it. A friend I know scored one at a local tourney. It was in mixed in a stock of star teerexs. It was champion for sure...and a Tee-Rex.

I heard a rumor of scattered amounts of Champion Tee-Rex's are popping up now.

Pretty sweet.

No Pro Eagle. Dave F. did indicate he, and other team members wanted an Eagle X, which we are going to do in Star plastic next month some time.



That is really good news, really really good news!

is this a campion tee rex with a star stamp?http://community.webshots.com/myphotos?action=viewAllPhotos&albumID=552642692&security=pybskC



It's a Star. Just a variation.

Dave,
When can I expect to see the Pro Eagle; perhaps a Feldberg signature edition?



No Pro Eagle. Dave F. did indicate he, and other team members wanted an Eagle X, which we are going to do in Star plastic next month some time.



Thanks Dave. Would you please explain the difference between an Eagle and an Eagle X?

Dave, I throw a Panther as a turn over mid-range disc. I love the way it flies and feels in the hand. I was told recently that the Gremlin is essentially a stable/overstable version of the Panther mold. I have never seen a Gremlin to confirm this. I will pick up a couple CFR Gremlins if this is true. Thanks for your time.

Dave,
When can I expect to see the Pro Eagle; perhaps a Feldberg signature edition?



No Pro Eagle. Dave F. did indicate he, and other team members wanted an Eagle X, which we are going to do in Star plastic next month some time.



Thanks Dave. Would you please explain the difference between an Eagle and an Eagle X?



The Eagle has a relatively straight beveled edge and the X version has a more concave bevel like a TeeBird. The high and low speed stability of the Eagle X is greater and makes it similar to a TeeBird with a little more speed and a little less carry.

Dave, I throw a Panther as a turn over mid-range disc. I love the way it flies and feels in the hand. I was told recently that the Gremlin is essentially a stable/overstable version of the Panther mold. I have never seen a Gremlin to confirm this. I will pick up a couple CFR Gremlins if this is true. Thanks for your time.



Yes, the Gremlin is a more stable version of the Panther. The CFR version is a little closer to the Panther than the original Gremlin version as we used the small bead bevel of the Panther.

Dave, Is there any chance that the Star Aero will be produced in lighter weights? I know it's made in DX in lighter weights. Why is the weight range on the Star 178-180g and no lighter weights available in this great durable plastic? I would love to have a Star Aero 170-175g for longer putts and upshots.

Dave,

just wanted to give you a public compliment on the Star Monster.

This disc in my opinion is much better tan the Firebird ever could be. It made playing Winthrop much more predictable, and more comfortable in high winds. Great job!

Dave, Is there any chance that the Star Aero will be produced in lighter weights? I know it's made in DX in lighter weights. Why is the weight range on the Star 178-180g and no lighter weights available in this great durable plastic? I would love to have a Star Aero 170-175g for longer putts and upshots.



I am not sure how low the Star will go, but we will try for lower weights next time we run. It might not be possible.

Just curious on the second run of star SL when we might see those and some other colors?

ce

Hi Dave--could you comment on the general flight differences of the wraith and the teerex? the thread about this makes sense to me, as i see not much difference in the 2, with the wraith being straighter and more consistant in flight to me. i do like the shape and feel of the teerex better though. thanks again--steven

Just curious on the second run of star SL when we might see those and some other colors?

ce



Not sure when the Star SL is up next, but we will run more colors, when we run next.

Hi Dave--could you comment on the general flight differences of the wraith and the teerex? the thread about this makes sense to me, as i see not much difference in the 2, with the wraith being straighter and more consistant in flight to me. i do like the shape and feel of the teerex better though. thanks again--steven



I am in the process of retooling the TeeRex to make it consistantly more high speed stable than the Wraith. Right now, it is too close to the Wraith, and inconsistancies in the runs make the flights of Wraiths and TeeRexes overlap to some degree. A preliminary retool made the DX TeeRex fly perfectly, but the Star TeeRex was still problematic. A secondary mold(TeeRex) will be ready to test soon. One way or another, we will solve the problem.

thanks--have the original dx teerex's [i got 2 at a tourney in june] been changed? these were perfect for me, but very similar to the wraith, only better. more durable also, i would assume due to the fact that the wing is not quite as sharp. will the future dx treerex's be different from the ones i got in june? when will they be released? thx again

Dave, if or when you have time, i have some Millenium questions:

when was the first Millenium disc created?
have you ever designed a disc for Millenium and later wished you had kept it for Innova?
Did Millenium approach you to design its discs, or did you have a hand in creating Millenium?

the shape (feel in the hand) of the QMS took me a little while to get used to, but the QMS continues to surprise me as a great disc... and i am testing out the Orion LS. it reminds me a little of the Pro Orc so far...

someone should start a "Questions for John H" Thread for millenium discs.

Allright I'm on it

thanks--have the original dx teerex's [i got 2 at a tourney in june] been changed? these were perfect for me, but very similar to the wraith, only better. more durable also, i would assume due to the fact that the wing is not quite as sharp. will the future dx treerex's be different from the ones i got in june? when will they be released? thx again



Nothing has been permanently changed yet, though the test did indicate we will at least for DX. I threw the first run DX TeeRexes in Japan. When the molding was good, as in the case of the red and blue 150 class, it flew great and was very durable. But in the case of the yellow and purple, they might as well have been Wraiths. The durability is mostly the new plastic, but it does help to be well molded. What I am aiming at is a TeeRex that molds up more consistantly like the red and blue. I still have a couple of yellow 163 and 164 yellow Star Wraiths that were more stable than most of the Star TeeRexes I have tried, so something needs to be done. It will be subtle, I don't want another Monster or Max. I am happy with those. We may have to do a slightly different Star version to get the same result as the DX. At least that is what it looks like now.

Dave, if or when you have time, i have some Millenium questions:

when was the first Millenium disc created?
have you ever designed a disc for Millenium and later wished you had kept it for Innova?
Did Millenium approach you to design its discs, or did you have a hand in creating Millenium?

the shape (feel in the hand) of the QMS took me a little while to get used to, but the QMS continues to surprise me as a great disc... and i am testing out the Orion LS. it reminds me a little of the Pro Orc so far...



The Tachyon, Aurora MS, and Omega were the first. The Tachyon was a Viper like driver.

I think all of the Millennium discs that I can think of, are keepers, at least as far as the molds go. Whether Millennium sells them, or we do doesn't matter to me as long as they are out there being appreciated. I would love for John to be wildly successful.

Millennium was started by John Houck. I had no hand in creating Millenium, just the discs for them.

thanks for the info Dave. i think if more sellers carried Millenium they would move a lot more discs as their designer (Dave Dunipace) is top notch ;)

i emailed John/Millenium several weeks ago about when SMS's might be released but have yet to receive any reply...

i just traded for some Sirius Orion LS's and can't wait to try them out in the niche between my Champ Roadrunners and Champ & Star (SB) Orcs... (although i also carry a Star TL)

what numbers would you assign the SOLS?

In addition to employing Innova (you) as the designer of its discs, does Millenium (John) use Innova to manufacture their discs and is that why they say INNOVA on the bottom?

also, if that is the case, is it difficult working in runs of Sirius discs with all the Star molds on queue?

I recently purchased a 174g Hydra. Are there any plans to make either the Dragon or another driver as heavy as the Hydra, while still being able to float?

Dave,
I am looking for information on what I was told to be a Cheetah 2 proto in what feels like the original KC/SE plastic. These had star stamps like the SE Banshees from around '95 with no indication on them to let you know the model. The profile of the disc is Cheetahesque, but leaning towards a Valkyrie. Do you remember these? Thanks in advance.

Any word on when Innova will announce the September CFR reward winners?

Any word on when Innova will announce the September CFR reward winners?



Bellinger edged out Boyce.

Here are the September CFR winners. They should be posted on the INNOVA site soon:

Innova T-Shirt - Jeff P - Rosewell, GA
3-Pack Newly Released Discs - Jeff B - Angwin, CA
3-Disc INNOVA Training Set - Khyber E - Wilseyville, CA
USDGC DVD - Michael R - Sunriver, OR
2006 USDGC Partners Pack - Brian F - Covington, KY
DISCatcher� Mini Target - Donny O - San Diego, CA
Champions DVD - Bill MH - Redlands, CA
INNOVA Merchandise Pack - Kevin R - Montgomery, AL
2005 Champions Signature Disc - RT - San Antonio, TX
DISCatcher� Traveler Target - Matt - El Cerrito, CA
INNOVA Ball Cap - Gary D - Plano, TX

thanks for the info Dave. i think if more sellers carried Millenium they would move a lot more discs as their designer (Dave Dunipace) is top notch ;)

i emailed John/Millenium several weeks ago about when SMS's might be released but have yet to receive any reply...

i just traded for some Sirius Orion LS's and can't wait to try them out in the niche between my Champ Roadrunners and Champ & Star (SB) Orcs... (although i also carry a Star TL)

what numbers would you assign the SOLS?

In addition to employing Innova (you) as the designer of its discs, does Millenium (John) use Innova to manufacture their discs and is that why they say INNOVA on the bottom?

also, if that is the case, is it difficult working in runs of Sirius discs with all the Star molds on queue?



SOLS are 9,5,-1,2. Yes, we manufacture for Millennium. In the past we have also manufactured for DGA and Wham-0.

Some Millennium molds are easy to work in queue, and some aren't. The Omega,MS, and JLS are easy to get in. The drivers are more difficult.

I recently purchased a 174g Hydra. Are there any plans to make either the Dragon or another driver as heavy as the Hydra, while still being able to float?



Yes, but we haven't gotten to it yet.

In the past we have also manufactured for DGA and Wham-0.


Dave, is this why Scott Martin is allowed to putt with a 86 Softie?

Whamo must be neutral ground, Discraft lets Larry Labond putt with an 86 softie as well.

In the past we have also manufactured for DGA and Wham-0.


Dave, is this why Scott Martin is allowed to putt with a 86 Softie?



The 86 is produced by Discovering the World now. It's a grandfathered disc.

Dave,

Are you phasing out the TL in the Pro plastic? It doesn't seem to be readily available except in the 174-175 range.

Dave,

Are you phasing out the TL in the Pro plastic? It doesn't seem to be readily available except in the 174-175 range.



Yes, we are phasing out the Pro TL in favor of the Star TL.

Dave,

Are you phasing out the TL in the Pro plastic? It doesn't seem to be readily available except in the 174-175 range.



Yes, we are phasing out the Pro TL in favor of the Star TL.



That makes sense, the Pro got really flippy relatively fast. Star TLs take a while to break in, especially to get them flippy.

I bought up a years supply of the ProLine TL's a month ago. They are the coolest turnover disc I've ever thrown. Like a 50% longer beaten in Roc, I can throw them hard and high and they will turn over at the apex and then just glide absolutely straight forever (almost no low speed fade). I will miss the TLs and hopefully in a year at least one of my Star TL's will be really flippy.

Are thier and monster X in star plastic. I throw my star monster alot but its just not the same as my champ monster x

Are thier any monster X's in star plastic. I throw my star monster alot but its just not the same as my champ monster x



that looks better

Are thier any monster X's in star plastic. I throw my star monster alot but its just not the same as my champ monster x



that looks better



Come on, you can do better! There are still four errors, nine if you count capitilization. ;)

On topic, Dave, Will the Monster X be made in Star plastic? In the CFR program possibly?

their should be 'there' ... the period after plastic should be a question mark ... alot should be 'a lot' ... there should be a comma after a lot ... its should be it's ...

still, the first edit did make it more reader friendly :D

"a lot" is not properly used here. The only time this phrase should be used is when reffering to an actual lot (such as a lot of land).

"a lot" is not properly used here. The only time this phrase should be used is when reffering to an actual lot (such as a lot of land).



for example: Donny O. has a lot of Aviars (they could fill a lot of land) /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I apologize for continuing this off-topic discussion, but the usage of �a lot� is correct. In fact, if you're suggesting that �alot� should be used, it doesn�t even exist as a word.

i had to read it again but it turns out JR isn't saying 'alot' is a word or that the correct spelling of a lot is alot (it isn't). he is saying one should not say 'i throw Monsters a lot', but one could say 'i own a lot of Monsters -- or -- 'i frequently throw Monsters.'

in other words, one shouldn't use 'a lot' if one means often. ;)

( a lot should be used to describe quantity -- not frequency)

So yeah, how about those Innova discs, huh?! I like them a lot. /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Happy Birthday -- i hope you get a lot of Innova discs :D

Hey Dave To the exact model what is the most overstable driver that you make?

Are thier and monster X in star plastic. I throw my star monster alot but its just not the same as my champ monster x



I believe all the Star Monsters were L type.

On topic, Dave, Will the Monster X be made in Star plastic? In the CFR program possibly?



Possibly, but not for a while. Maybe next year.

Hey Dave To the exact model what is the most overstable driver that you make?



That we currently make, probably Monster X. We have had Viper Xs, which were pretty overstable too. I would imagine the MaxX, would be pretty overstable too. Whippet X is a candidate too. Ram X would be way overstable, and might take the cake.

So by chance anyone have the CFR Winners List for Octobers winners yet?

Thanks..

Drawings are held on the last Tuesday of the month. There is still one week to go.

Oops jumped the gun Sue. Forgot the 31st is last Tuesday of month.

Drawings are held on the last Tuesday of the month. There is still one week to go.



How are the winners selected? Draw names from a hat?

Happy Birthday Suzette!!!

Happy B-Day Suzette!!

This may have already been covered, but does anypart of the Star Shark use the Ontario Roc mold. I noticed alot of similarities between the two ?

innova says it offers the champ monster in 165-175gm weights but all online dealers start at 170. Did innova stop making them lighter than 170?

innova says it offers the champ monster in 165-175gm weights but all online dealers start at 170. Did innova stop making them lighter than 170?



Check out ebay, there was at elast one 167gr out in the beginning of the week.

Here are the links to innova's stock at both their west coast (http://dealer.innovadiscs.com/glanceca.html) and east coast (http://dealer.innovadiscs.com/stockataglance.pdf) inventory.

This may have already been covered, but does anypart of the Star Shark use the Ontario Roc mold. I noticed alot of similarities between the two ?



Yes, any Shark is similar to the Ontario Roc.

innova says it offers the champ monster in 165-175gm weights but all online dealers start at 170. Did innova stop making them lighter than 170?



We do make them in high sixties, but not that many.

What does the Christmas Season look so far as discs goes?

Dave,

are you able to give a good guess on what the Aurora MS will mold up like in Star/Sirius plastic? i know the Shark in Champ plastic was surprisingly overstable, and (at least in my experience) some discs are more stable in Star while others are not.

what would you guess the SMS will be like in terms of hi and low speed stabilities vs. the QMS?

What does the Christmas Season look so far as discs goes?



basically we are going to try to catch up with the discs we have been unable to produce. Some are: Star: Skeeter, FL, Eagle X, Rhyno, Max, Spider, Gator, etc.

You are making Firebird L's (FL) in star?

Yes Rhyno's and Gators Sweet!!!

Dave,

are you able to give a good guess on what the Aurora MS will mold up like in Star/Sirius plastic? i know the Shark in Champ plastic was surprisingly overstable, and (at least in my experience) some discs are more stable in Star while others are not.

what would you guess the SMS will be like in terms of hi and low speed stabilities vs. the QMS?



I haven't compared them side by side, but the Sirius MS is a fairly straight disc. Low speed overstability is mild, probably between a +1 and +2. High speed stability is good. Into the wind hard throws will produce a slight turn, but not enough to rate it a -1. I would imagine the Q version will produce the same numbers.

sorry if this has been asked and answered, but when is there going to be a big bead star aviar? I've heard of their existence (possibly as a FR disc), but I've not had it confirmed by my own hands. I love my star aviars, but after throwing the KC aviar a few times, I'm about to switch over... my only concern is that the new KC plastic doesn't hold up through an entire tournament for me (playing amongst the hardwoods of North Carolina), so i have to deal with a constantly changing stability. I've tried the champion big beads, but they just didn't fit the bill of a good driver putter. All I want is some stability.

Also, Dave... If you bring back the champ Whippet X or make a star version, I would personally caddy for you for every tournament for a year. I have three champ whippets left and almost cry every time I throw the one in my bag since I know it will one day no longer turn left even as I pull it out of my bag to dry it off.

I hope they come out with the Star Big Bead Aviar.

Josh

I hope they come out with the Star Big Bead Aviar.

Josh



Second! I putt with the 1st run pro aviar. Its now out of production. A star BB would take its place nicely.

Star Big Bead! Star Big Bead! Star Big Bead! :D

Dave - when is Innova going to post the CFR Raffle program winners for last month??

Dave - when is Innova going to post the CFR Raffle program winners for last month??



The winners will be posted after the drawing takes place on October 31st.

sorry if this has been asked and answered, but when is there going to be a big bead star aviar? I've heard of their existence (possibly as a FR disc), but I've not had it confirmed by my own hands. I love my star aviars, but after throwing the KC aviar a few times, I'm about to switch over... my only concern is that the new KC plastic doesn't hold up through an entire tournament for me (playing amongst the hardwoods of North Carolina), so i have to deal with a constantly changing stability. I've tried the champion big beads, but they just didn't fit the bill of a good driver putter. All I want is some stability.

Also, Dave... If you bring back the champ Whippet X or make a star version, I would personally caddy for you for every tournament for a year. I have three champ whippets left and almost cry every time I throw the one in my bag since I know it will one day no longer turn left even as I pull it out of my bag to dry it off.



We are definitely going to run Star BB. Probably soon. If we do any Whippet Xs, it will be Star and will go into the tournament program and stay there unless it has mass appeal.

Dave - when is Innova going to post the CFR Raffle program winners for last month??



The winners will be posted after the drawing takes place on October 31st.



Last month - September.....they were just updated on their site since yesterday...now they are showing up for Sept.

Hi Dave. Couple of questions for you.

#1 Going through my collection the other day I ran across a couple of Ontario mold Stingrays. I know the original mold was San Marino and the current mold for quite awhile is the SM. Any insight on how long you ran the Ont. mold and why you switched back.

#2 I saw you shooing some footage down in Rock Hill before the USDGC. Actually sat back and watched for awhile. I'm hoping you're doing this to release an instruction video. Who better to teach the masses than the person who invents all of our toys.

Keep up the good work and thanks again for taking time out of your life to answer our questions.

Hi Dave. Couple of questions for you.

#1 Going through my collection the other day I ran across a couple of Ontario mold Stingrays. I know the original mold was San Marino and the current mold for quite awhile is the SM. Any insight on how long you ran the Ont. mold and why you switched back.

#2 I saw you shooing some footage down in Rock Hill before the USDGC. Actually sat back and watched for awhile. I'm hoping you're doing this to release an instruction video. Who better to teach the masses than the person who invents all of our toys.

Keep up the good work and thanks again for taking time out of your life to answer our questions.



The Ontario Stingray, AKA flattop, was a short lived try to make the Stingray mold better. It didn't work well as people wanted the slow continuing curve of the original Stingray. We have been using that mold for the Cobra for years as the extra speed and stability wasn't as critical for the Cobra. We only used the Ontario Stingray for a short time. We now use the retooled original mold for both Stingrays and Cobras. At this point both types of Cobras are in the market, but when we run Cobras again, the new type will be the main offering. Stingrays remain essentially unchanged, except for the engraving.

The video we shot at USDGC was mainly for an EDGE instructional video. We may also do a generic, but that's a long way off, on the other side of scripting, dubbing, editing, etc..

Hey Dave, is the champ monster strictly L bottom now? I can't seem to find any x bottoms.

Hey Dave, is the champ monster strictly L bottom now? I can't seem to find any x bottoms.



Yes, for the regular line. If we make any X type, the will go for tournaments only.

We are definitely going to run Star BB. Probably soon. If we do any Whippet Xs, it will be Star and will go into the tournament program and stay there unless it has mass appeal.

[/QUOTE]



Hi Dave,

Just out of curiosity, what is "mass appeal" ? If I promised to send in 2000 emails based on love for the Whippet-X in premium plastic, would that work?

Im pretty sure the Quad Cities bought almost all of them anyways, so you could just do a run for us here. Ill get them out to the other fans around the country, no problem.

At 30-40$ a pop on Ebay, Im looking for Stars.

We are definitely going to run Star BB. Probably soon. If we do any Whippet Xs, it will be Star and will go into the tournament program and stay there unless it has mass appeal.





Hi Dave,

Just out of curiosity, what is "mass appeal" ?

[/QUOTE]

Selling more than 2000 per year.

Dave,

Has the new, new, new Tour bag or Champion bag out for sale yet?

I do remember you saying it was being tested for material etc...


Let me know I was interested in buying one.

Selling more than 2000 per year.

[/QUOTE]

Is that all?

How long would you guesstimate it took to move the Champions?

Selling more than 2000 per year.



Is that all?

How long would you guesstimate it took to move the Champions?



I know a couple of guys that would buy a couple of hundred of them...if they were rams!

I have had a few dozen folks ask me if and when this disc will come out ? 165 -174 grams.

If so,
I gotta get my hands on a few of these ................
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6022/whippetgw7.jpg

I have had a few dozen folks ask me if and when this disc will come out ? 165 -174 grams.

If so,
I gotta get my hands on a few of these ................
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6022/whippetgw7.jpg




If the star whippet is as big a letdown as the star monster, who would want one.

forget this "L" stuff and make some real discs.

STAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS

I have had a few dozen folks ask me if and when this disc will come out ? 165 -174 grams.

If so,
I gotta get my hands on a few of these ................
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6022/whippetgw7.jpg




If the star whippet is as big a letdown as the star monster, who would want one.

forget this "L" stuff and make some real discs.

STAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS



I second that...I have 4 CH Whippets with 2 in my bag and love them. A Star WX will be great.

I've never thrown a Ram, but you've peaked my interest. What do they feel like in the hand? Beaded? Domey?

How do Champ Whippets feel in the hand? I just picked up some KC Whippets and they are very domey. I like the overstableness, but have never liked domey discs.

I've never thrown a Ram, .... What do they feel like in the hand? Beaded? Domey?



i haven't thrown one either, but from what i've heard when you pick one up it pulls your hand left & downward! (RHBH) :eek: :D

I have had a few dozen folks ask me if and when this disc will come out ? 165 -174 grams.

If so,
I gotta get my hands on a few of these ................
http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6022/whippetgw7.jpg :D

If the star whippet is as big a letdown as the star monster, who would want one.
Well , for myself , the Whippet has always been overstable.

Ram is just too much. If you like the Ram , you would like the Original Phoenix. Those are the Original Overstable War Weapons.

forget this "L" stuff and make some real discs.

STAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS :DSTAR RAMS

[/QUOTE]

There is a few that would throw a Star Ram.

But I need a Fast , Overstable TeeBird TB.
My Champion Teebird is starting to wear out.
A Star Whippet is what I need for specific shots.

Try a Original 185 Phoenix. That plastic is just about Indestructible !!!!

The ram isnt beaded, its whole wing is practically a notch w/ a big abrupt bend in it. Too overstable for me :D
I have to say less overstable than a demon, more overstable than a whippet

I have to say less overstable than a demon, more overstable than a whippet

l when you get a demon beat in though its the bomb or just even a blaze.

The ram has more glide than the whippet IMO.
Most whippets I've thrown have been very close to the CFR WhippetX. I don't care for the WhipX or the CFR viper. Nothing like a good ram.
The ram feel like a birdie in your hand.

Dave, sounds like we've got more ram fans than you thought, heh? :D

Heck I used to love the Ram /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I never threw the rams but the only mid i used to throw were pro classic rocs

I still like the Whippet. Maybe they will make both ?

Unless you can find me a Star Teebird TB XX ?

I have to say less overstable than a demon, more overstable than a whippet

l when you get a demon beat in though its the bomb or just even a blaze.



I like both, but still think i perfer a spirit or a Z pred for all the same shots, I think I can manipulate the flight of them more.

We are definitely going to run Star BB. Probably soon. If we do any Whippet Xs, it will be Star and will go into the tournament program and stay there unless it has mass appeal.





Hi Dave,

Just out of curiosity, what is "mass appeal" ?



Selling more than 2000 per year.

[/QUOTE]

Hmmm, should I put in a pre-order on 2000 Star Zephyr,..... or not :confused: :p?

I still like the Whippet. Maybe they will make both ?

Unless you can find me a Star Teebird TB XX ?



Stiffer, max weight Star TBs are fast and overstable. Same with the Champion Glow TB. Champion TBs are the SSSLLLOWWWESTT TBs ever. A fast TB needs a dense polymer that does not expand too much when cooling.

Star Monster a letdown? Don't let them mess with you Dave, the Star Monster is AWESOME. It lives up to the Distance Driver title. If you want a more overstable version buy the Champion, or an older Champion X. Why would you want the Star to be more overstable, its just going to break in anyway. You can make a disc more overstable, especially a Monster, by throwing it with more hyzer angle. If a disc is too overstable, you can't make it less so by throwing it differently.

Heck I used to love the Ram /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif



Deep down inside, you still do, scoot. ;)

I've seen "nightshift" Orcs on ebay that are made of a more opaque plastic.
What I was wondering is are there any other runs of discs that were experimenting with other plastics.
I just picked up a Champion Teebird that is very opaque, with a thin flexible flight plane. I doesn't look or fell like any other champion Teebirds I've come across. I feels like some of the KC Pro Teebirds I've seen in the white/creamy plastic.

Dave,

Has the new, new, new Tour bag or Champion bag out for sale yet?

I do remember you saying it was being tested for material etc...


Let me know I was interested in buying one.



Yes. The East office is carrying the Champion. Both coasts have the new, new, new Tour.

Selling more than 2000 per year.



Is that all?

How long would you guesstimate it took to move the Champions?

[/QUOTE]

Champion Whippets? If so, I don't have a clue.

Hey Dave

I had a disc golf tournament last saturday with the glow rounds. It came to my head about the wraiths and tee rex

any plans on CFR glow Wraiths and TeeRex in the future??

if so, I ll be the first on the list to order CFR for our Wisinois Deaf Disc Golf Fund Raising.

Thanks in advance

DeafDGolfer

Dave,
Any chance you could make glow Rhynos? I'll take Glow DX or Glow Candy. Thanks.

So the newest or mainstream best bag is call the CHAMPION correct? And you are saying it is available for purchase now?

Are there any new pictures up yet?

I'm looking to know for a future purchase for my B-day that just past.

The new Champion Bags should be available for purchase by the first of December. The new Tour bags are available for purchase now.

Here are the winners of the Sponsor Rewards drawing for October.

INNOVA Merchandise Pack - Bart - Crown Point,IN
Innova T-Shirt Donavan - San Angelo, TX
3-Pack Newly Released Discs - Rebecca - Whitmore Lake, MI
DISCatcher� Traveler Target - Anthony - Redding, GA
3-Disc INNOVA Training Set - Eric - Santa Cruz, CA
USDGC DVD - Becky - Topeka, KS
Champions DVD - Jeff - Granite Bay, CA
2005 Champions Signature Disc - Marc -Bury, UK
DISCatcher� Mini Target - Ben - Raleigh, NC
INNOVA Ball Cap - Erik - Anaheim, CA
2007 USDGC Partners Pack - Gary - Plano, TX

Hey Dave

I had a disc golf tournament last saturday with the glow rounds. It came to my head about the wraiths and tee rex

any plans on CFR glow Wraiths and TeeRex in the future??

if so, I ll be the first on the list to order CFR for our Wisinois Deaf Disc Golf Fund Raising.

Thanks in advance

DeafDGolfer



Yes, there is a chance for both, but no promises until we catch up with regular inventory and projects already scheduled.

Dave,
Any chance you could make glow Rhynos? I'll take Glow DX or Glow Candy. Thanks.



Glow candy maybe. Maybe glow I-dye.

Dave,
Any chance you could make glow Rhynos? I'll take Glow DX or Glow Candy. Thanks.



Glow candy maybe. Maybe glow I-dye.


YES!!!!! Let me know when they are ready!

Any plans to make a cfr t rex? I'm one of the few who still love the champion plastic and can't stand the star but will deal with the pro. I'd also like to see more champion glow plastic in regular production or cfr glow wraith or t rex. I would have my whole bag champion glow if u made it on a regular basis--by far the best plastic you have ever made!!! Keep up the good work, innova for life.

Any plans to make a cfr t rex? I'm one of the few who still love the champion plastic and can't stand the star but will deal with the pro. I'd also like to see more champion glow plastic in regular production or cfr glow wraith or t rex. I would have my whole bag champion glow if u made it on a regular basis--by far the best plastic you have ever made!!! Keep up the good work, innova for life.



We are planning on making a Champion version at some point. Glow is a posibility for CFR.

Dave, Any Chance the TeeRex will come out in pro plastic? I would love to have a slightly more stable Pro Wraith type disc in my bag. Thanks for you time.

Dave,
Any chance you could make glow Rhynos? I'll take Glow DX or Glow Candy. Thanks.



Glow candy maybe. Maybe glow I-dye.



*drool*
"Clean-up...Mark's office!"

Dave, Any Chance the TeeRex will come out in pro plastic? I would love to have a slightly more stable Pro Wraith type disc in my bag. Thanks for you time.



No plans for any Pro TeeRex at this point.

Hey Dave

I had a disc golf tournament last saturday with the glow rounds. It came to my head about the wraiths and tee rex

any plans on CFR glow Wraiths and TeeRex in the future??

if so, I ll be the first on the list to order CFR for our Wisinois Deaf Disc Golf Fund Raising.

Thanks in advance

DeafDGolfer



Yes, there is a chance for both, but no promises until we catch up with regular inventory and projects already scheduled.



Great!! Thanks and I ll keep eye out for it, Hope its due in time before X-mas! ;)

May the Disc Be with You!
Space Cadet

http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=576375&page=7&view=collap sed&sb=5&o=&fpart=3&vc=1

Dave,
When is a Des Reading disc going to come out? She's got three world's. I realize there's a lot on the Innova plate at the moment, but giving the star wraith, leopard, shark, TL, or SL her signature would only require a change in the hot stamp. I'd be the first in line to get a DR big bead star aviar. It would be great to show the women that we are serious about getting them into the sport. DR pro? I bet you've got some other plastics up your sleeves that you're not letting on about.

Hi Dave--are you planning to run any of the following in dx? starfire, SL, TL, teerex [after modification?], monster, max? thx

I have a stack of DX TeeRexes, and I believe discgolfvalues.com still has some.

http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=576375&page=7&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=3&vc=1

Dave,
When is a Des Reading disc going to come out? She's got three world's. I realize there's a lot on the Innova plate at the moment, but giving the star wraith, leopard, shark, TL, or SL her signature would only require a change in the hot stamp. I'd be the first in line to get a DR big bead star aviar. It would be great to show the women that we are serious about getting them into the sport. DR pro? I bet you've got some other plastics up your sleeves that you're not letting on about.






Id have to agree. I think its a poor choice not to offer Des her own signature model.

I support the arguement that there are other deserving players ( No, not Feldberg. ) out there. I just cannot understand WHY she doesnt have her own disc. Shes the best female player ever, and has proven that through the last 4-5 years, upseeding Juliana.

Her signature disc was probably quite an honor for her, but she deserves more.

http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=576375&page=7&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=3&vc=1

Dave,
When is a Des Reading disc going to come out? She's got three world's. I realize there's a lot on the Innova plate at the moment, but giving the star wraith, leopard, shark, TL, or SL her signature would only require a change in the hot stamp. I'd be the first in line to get a DR big bead star aviar. It would be great to show the women that we are serious about getting them into the sport. DR pro? I bet you've got some other plastics up your sleeves that you're not letting on about.






Id have to agree. I think its a poor choice not to offer Des her own signature model.

I support the arguement that there are other deserving players ( No, not Feldberg. ) out there. I just cannot understand WHY she doesnt have her own disc. Shes the best female player ever, and has proven that through the last 4-5 years, upseeding Juliana.

Her signature disc was probably quite an honor for her, but she deserves more.



Just out of curiousity, why not Feldberg? I'm surprised he doesn't have one already.

[Des is] the best female player ever, and has proven that through the last 4-5 years, upseeding Juliana.



while you make a strong case i think it is debatable -- Juliana cashed at the 2001 USDGC and has 5 World Championships.
and don't count out Juliana just yet to win next year's Worlds. ;)

Hi Dave--are you planning to run any of the following in dx? starfire, SL, TL, teerex [after modification?], monster, max? thx



Of these, all but the TL and SL.

Hi Dave--are you planning to run any of the following in dx? starfire, SL, TL, teerex [after modification?], monster, max? thx



Of these, all but the TL and SL.



I would imagine a DX Starfire would quickly turn to a DX SL after a few hits, heh?

Hi Dave--are you planning to run any of the following in dx? starfire, SL, TL, teerex [after modification?], monster, max? thx



Of these, all but the TL and SL.



I would imagine a DX Starfire would quickly turn to a DX SL after a few hits, heh?



Not necessarily. The Starfire-X has a notch on the wing that increases the stability. Just from what I've thrown of both discs, it would most likely behave like a longer DX Teebird and follow the same break in pattern.

You've never seen me hit a tree. :eek: ;)

http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=576375&page=7&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=3&vc=1

Dave,
When is a Des Reading disc going to come out? She's got three world's. I realize there's a lot on the Innova plate at the moment, but giving the star wraith, leopard, shark, TL, or SL her signature would only require a change in the hot stamp. I'd be the first in line to get a DR big bead star aviar. It would be great to show the women that we are serious about getting them into the sport. DR pro? I bet you've got some other plastics up your sleeves that you're not letting on about.

Kenny did not get his first disc until he won 7 World Titles, I am sure Des is happy with anything Innova has done for her, if they are going to give her another signature line then they will......patience people...that is the besTT policy.

[/QUOTE]Kenny did not get his first disc until he won 7 World Titles, I am sure Des is happy with anything Innova has done for her, if they are going to give her another signature line then they will......patience people...that is the besTT policy.

[/QUOTE]

OK, maybe DR plastic would be a little premature, but Barry has his signature on the beast. Change is created, not waiTTed for.

Kenny did not get his first disc until he won 7 World Titles,



I don't believe that is correct, unless you are just referring to a KC disc...there are aviars and other discs out there with 4x,...ect

That is a stamp not a Line

[Des is] the best female player ever, and has proven that through the last 4-5 years, upseeding Juliana.



while you make a strong case i think it is debatable -- Juliana cashed at the 2001 USDGC and has 5 World Championships.
and don't count out Juliana just yet to win next year's Worlds. ;)





Everything is debatable. Its not a knock on Juliana, but be realistic. She is taking disc golf to another level for women golfers, higher than the one Juliana took it to.

And, as my usual fallback arguement, there arent many people out there representing the game any better than Des is.

Why not Feldburg? Why for?

Dave,
I just saw some SFR gremlins for sale. Could this be a possible mass production disc? It seems a shame that this disc was discontinued. I loved the Panther, but it just didn't have the beef that a Gremlin seems to. I love flat topped, stable mid ranges, of which there seems to be a dearth.

Dave,
I just saw some SFR gremlins for sale. Could this be a possible mass production disc? It seems a shame that this disc was discontinued. I loved the Panther, but it just didn't have the beef that a Gremlin seems to. I love flat topped, stable mid ranges, of which there seems to be a dearth.



We will run the gremlin again, but don't have any plans to put it back in the main line at this point.

[saying Des is the best female player ever is] not a knock on Juliana, but be realistic. [Des] is taking disc golf to another level for women golfers, higher than the one Juliana took it to.



again not to take anything away from Des's accomplishments which are large, but Juliana has the three highest rated rounds
ever shot by a woman disc golfer during PDGA competition:

1036 Korver Juliana Swope (2000 KC Wide Open)

1026 Korver Juliana (2002 Z Boaz open)

1021 Korver Juliana Oakland Park Back (2002 MidAmerica Open)

1019 Reading Des (2005 Dogwood Crosstown NT)

*and* Juliana cashed(!) at the one-division USDGC (2001)

It would be nice if Des did get her own Aviar and/or Roc. Since she uses 10X's in both that may be a way to get the superior 10X plastic back. 11X's are nice but the 10X's beat in more slowly. Just dreaming I guess.

Hey Big Dave,

Any idea what the 2007 Am Worlds fundraiser disc is going to be??

Thanks
SCott

Hey Big Dave,

Any idea what the 2007 Am Worlds fundraiser disc is going to be??

Thanks
SCott



No.

[saying Des is the best female player ever is] not a knock on Juliana, but be realistic. [Des] is taking disc golf to another level for women golfers, higher than the one Juliana took it to.



again not to take anything away from Des's accomplishments which are large, but Juliana has the three highest rated rounds
ever shot by a woman disc golfer during PDGA competition:

1036 Korver Juliana Swope (2000 KC Wide Open)

1026 Korver Juliana (2002 Z Boaz open)

1021 Korver Juliana Oakland Park Back (2002 MidAmerica Open)

1019 Reading Des (2005 Dogwood Crosstown NT)

*and* Juliana cashed(!) at the one-division USDGC (2001)




So, getting discs is about shooting high rated rounds and cashing at the USDGC? How many times has that course been changed since then and has she cashed since then? Your talking about rated rounds, which to me says, Juliana can throw up some amazing rounds. Ive never tried to argue that fact. Right now, Id say shes the best female to play (ever ), but ask me that in a few more years. I promise you, Des will be the best. Des has also been injured most of the season, so her stats from this year are even more impressive. When she was here for a clinic in July, she had a huge pimp limp.

i wasn't trying to lay out what it takes to get a signature disc -- that would be between Innova and its players and probably evolves over time as the game and company does.

i posted what you cited after someone argued Des had clearly taken the Women's game to a new level and that Des is the best female disc golfer ever. I just wanted to point out that while Des is definitely one of the best ever, Juliana does have the top 3 rated rounds ever shot by a woman... and Juliana has cashed at the one-division USDGC (some pretty lofty accomplishments).

the disc question is up to Innova, not us. Also keep in mind that the vast majority of disc buyers are male, so that may make it more difficult... i buy JK discs without hesitation, but some guys are squeamish to be caught throwing a "woman's" disc. (i know that reveals a scary level of insecurity, but it is what it is)...

i will leave this topic alone now since it's Dave's thread.

the disc question is up to Innova, not us. Also keep in mind that the vast majority of disc buyers are male, so that may make it more difficult... i buy JK discs without hesitation, but some guys are squeamish to be caught throwing a "woman's" disc. (i know that reveals a scary level of insecurity, but it is what it is)...






I sell discs for a living, and thats not a problem Ive EVER had to deal with.

the disc question is up to Innova, not us. Also keep in mind that the vast majority of disc buyers are male, so that may make it more difficult... i buy JK discs without hesitation, but some guys are squeamish to be caught throwing a "woman's" disc. (i know that reveals a scary level of insecurity, but it is what it is)...

i will leave this topic alone now since it's Dave's thread.



I think it's important that Dave knows that the disc golfing population (yes, even the scarily insecure males) support giving Des her due. This is a thread to talk to Dave about his discs, but I don't think it has to be a one way street. Innova is successful because they supply players with the discs they want, and this is a heck of a way for Dave to find out what players want. For instance: I want a star BB aviar, a star gremlin, and a rerelease of the champion whippet-x. I'd also like to see Innova (and the players on this site) put money where the talk is regarding getting more women to play disc golf. TDs are doing it by offering added cash to women's divisions and women-friendly amenities (using preferred tees, one player divisions). I think one way Innova could do this is by putting Des's name on a mass produced disc so that women who are playing the sport for the first time can see that their hard work will be rewarded as much as the men's.

I don't think most guys will shy away from buying a Des Reading signature TL because it has a woman's name on it. They might shy away from it due to Innova's description of it as "a great first driver," but that's another issue... I know more men that throw a jk aviar-x than a kc pro aviar. I also know a lot of men who throw bright pink discs because they are really easy to spot in the woods.

Dave is obviously a fantastic disc designer, and I think that he appreciates the feedback we give him, even if it is not always obsequious.

I also would like to see a BB Star, and a Star Whippet. I would even buy it if Des' name was on it. I guess.

Yes BB Star Aviar! HOT SELLER FOR SURE!!!!!

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dave, any thoughts yet on Star Panthers?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



No plans on running Star Panthers as yet.




Any plans yet, I need one bad!!

I think a star viper would be cool....
/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
when are the star gators comming?

I think a star viper would be cool....
/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif




No, no, no, no, NO! We are just getting him to change his mind to the Star Ram...we don't need to stir the pot over a viper... :p :D

Star Whippet-X....oh baby...how nice that would be.

Dave I have a San Marino roc that looks a little funky on the wing ( stripper)
I have compared it too sharks but the top seems quite a bit different. Was there a run of discs with a san marino roc top with a different rim?
What year did the sharks come out?

According to Jeffrey Homburg of the PDGA Technical Standards Committee, the Gremlin was never submitted for approval. In addition he stated "The disc would have to be approved separately if it's marketed under a different name from that for which it was approved." I love the gremlin (especially the star one), but, based upon this I am throwing an illegal disc." Any chance of getting this sumbmitted for approval or working out the issue with the PDGA Technical Standards Committee?

I also know a lot of men who throw bright pink discs because they are really easy to spot in the woods.




Amen!

Don't Knock the Pink Discs
:D

Shark was released around '89 / '90. First run was a mustard color blank. Got mine first week from DTW.

Yes BB Star Aviar! HOT SELLER FOR SURE!!!!!



2nd

Uh oh. Anyone else have troubles with the thead not coming up?

I think a star viper would be cool....
/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
when are the star gators comming?



Star Gators are being molded now. Probably out by December.

I know this is just a pet peeve of mine, but I have heard a lot of grumblings from other players as well, so I know I am not alone in asking what the logic is behind releasing what is basically a new disc under the same name as an old disc. Case in point the "new" Beast versus the original Beast. Also, the original Monster versus the flippy "new" Star Monster. I was looking forward to a Star Monster and when I finally got one, I saw it had a different bottom.

I am all for progress, but for the sake of consistancy I sure wish I could be confident the Monster I order is going to be like the one it is meant to replace.

Forgive me if this has been brought up before, but I didn't want to scroll through 300+ pages of posts ;)

Dave I have a San Marino roc that looks a little funky on the wing ( stripper)
I have compared it too sharks but the top seems quite a bit different. Was there a run of discs with a san marino roc top with a different rim?
What year did the sharks come out?



There was only one mold at that time for Rocs or Sharks.

According to Jeffrey Homburg of the PDGA Technical Standards Committee, the Gremlin was never submitted for approval. In addition he stated "The disc would have to be approved separately if it's marketed under a different name from that for which it was approved." I love the gremlin (especially the star one), but, based upon this I am throwing an illegal disc." Any chance of getting this sumbmitted for approval or working out the issue with the PDGA Technical Standards Committee?



We will resubmit it when we can. Until then, it has already been submitted and approved as a Sniper.

I know this is just a pet peeve of mine, but I have heard a lot of grumblings from other players as well, so I know I am not alone in asking what the logic is behind releasing what is basically a new disc under the same name as an old disc. Case in point the "new" Beast versus the original Beast. Also, the original Monster versus the flippy "new" Star Monster. I was looking forward to a Star Monster and when I finally got one, I saw it had a different bottom.

I am all for progress, but for the sake of consistancy I sure wish I could be confident the Monster I order is going to be like the one it is meant to replace.

Forgive me if this has been brought up before, but I didn't want to scroll through 300+ pages of posts ;)



The new Beast is retooled and will remain that way. The original was too close to the Orc in flight characteristic. The Monster has gone through two variations. The original Monster is what we are running now. There was an interim Monster X.

I think a star viper would be cool....
/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
when are the star gators comming?



Star Gators are being molded now. Probably out by December.





Gaytors before Whippets? I guess it wont be a very Merry Christmas after all.

Gators before Panthers? I have personally never seen anyone throw a Gator.

hey whiners---gators are great. i have seen lots of people throwing them. awesome control midrange. grip feels great. i have had at least one in the bag for years. dx and champ. will get some stars when i lose my last champ.

Gators before Panthers? I have personally never seen anyone throw a Gator.



Craig Leyva throws gators.

ok, that's two, there's a market niche for you! :D Waaahh, I want my Star Panther!! :D

ok, that's two, there's a market niche for you! :D Waaahh, I want my Star Panther!! :D



Make that three.
:D

4

I throw my gator every round.

hey bee_gone didn't you sell me a few gators awhile back. it is defiantly a mainstay in my bag and used often on windy days. that being said please make a star panther i would bet you would send a lot to texas.

Don't confuse Dave with the facts!

lol

:D I have had another 17 people ask me about this disc again !!!!!!! They think I have some secret stash somewhere.

I said , hopefully early next year ?

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/6022/whippetgw7.jpg

Hey Dave, at AM Worlds we got a Champ SL in our players pack, does this mean that this disc is out on the main market, or was this done just for AM Worlds?

Dave,

What is the significance of the tiny number "8" at the bottom of the Classic Roc stamp inside the ring?

it is out on the main market(the SL) i have one in my bag that i picked up from PIAS

Hey Dave, at AM Worlds we got a Champ SL in our players pack, does this mean that this disc is out on the main market, or was this done just for AM Worlds?



The Star SL is the only current mainstream version. The Champion is fundraising.

Dave,

What is the significance of the tiny number "8" at the bottom of the Classic Roc stamp inside the ring?



It was our 8th disc. Eagle, Aero, Aviar, XD, Apple, Coupe, Mini, Classic Roc, Classic Hammer, Ace Stingray, big Roc, Cobra, etc.

Dave,

What is the significance of the tiny number "8" at the bottom of the Classic Roc stamp inside the ring?



It was our 8th disc. Eagle, Aero, Aviar, XD, <font color="red"> APPLE</font> , Coupe, Mini, Classic Roc, Classic Hammer, Ace Stingray, big Roc, Cobra, etc.



Dave, what is an APPLE?

TThanks.

Post deleted by Geoffrey_J

thanks DAVE!!

Apple is large diameter 'ultimate' like disc, kinda like old World Class Frisbees. They have been used for accuracy comp (SC State Championships @ Crooked Creek) freestyle and for tossing back &amp; forth etc.

Gators before Panthers? I have personally never seen anyone throw a Gator.

many people throw Gators, very predictable in the wind......Very overstable.

Hey Dave, at AM Worlds we got a Champ SL in our players pack, does this mean that this disc is out on the main market, or was this done just for AM Worlds?



The Star SL is the only current mainstream version. The Champion is fundraising.



The SL that I have is an Xout. The only thing wrong with it was the stamp(it was stamped as a champ eagle)