Without seeing a picture of the disc or a description of the hot stamp and engraving on the back, its impossible to tell you.
The method of mixing each batch to get the right flex and weight is a very challenging task (a cross between math, science and art) and will always produce runs of discs in between the 2's,4's, 7's and 9's.

Here's what we want players to know about our putters.

Gateway Putter flexibility document:

Here are Gateway we manufacture and Market a WIDE range of flexibilities and surface grips for our PUTT and APROACH discs, ( Wizard, Warlock and Magic)
Our manufacturing techniques have come from over 10 years of extensive R&D producing the BEST polymer blends for golf discs in the industry. Hopefully we have produced something special that meets your needs as an individual customer.
If you are very particular or looking for something specific, the best case scenario is to get in front of a large selection and flex around on them a bit to find that perfect one. Everyone seems to like something different, which is why we make so many different types of putters. If Gateway putters are not available in your area, please ask your local dealer to contact us or contact us directly and we will try and get their location set up.

An IMPORTANT note: The marketing of our putter variations is not just based on flexibility , but also on surface complexion and surface Hardness!
Even though we only state 4 flexibilities in our marketing materials, SSS (Super-Stupid-Soft), SS (Super-Soft), Soft and Medium), We actually produce runs that have a range of more like 1-10.

Here�s a rundown on the differences we offer:
A 1 is the softest surface and floppiest we make (think ssss),,, though most SSS we make, we shoot for are 2).
An SS is a 4, a Soft is a 7 and a Medium is a 9 which wont really flex that much unless you really apply pressure (1/2 of the M�s are probably closer to a 10 for players that just like firm discs).
There are many runs that fall in between these target numbers like 1,3, 5, 6 and 8.
Again our marketing of SSS, SS, Soft and medium is not only flex, but surface complexion.
There are formulas that we use when shooting for lets say,,, a 4 (Super Soft) and within in each class there is at least 1 polymer that is proprietary to that particular class.
A Medium has a % of a talc filled polypropylene (PP), a soft has a % of a regular PP, the SS has no PP and a SSS has no PP and a soft rubber TPV or TPE less than 70 A shore.

All recipes for production runs have 2 materials in common, a 90A shore TPV that is compounded with a mineral which is the �concentrate� that makes the discs heavy and a non mineral filled 80A shore TPV that weighs .93 that is the base.
The concentrate weighs over 2.0 density and the target for a 175 putter would only be 1.4 density.
PP weighs .90 and the talc filled pp weighs 1.7.
The method of mixing each batch to get the right flex and weight is a very challenging task (a cross between math, science and art) and will always produce runs of discs in between the 2's,4's, 7's and 9's.

The one GREAT thing about dry blending our batches as opposed to having a master batch produced for us for each flex, is the fact a dry blended match allows the softest of the materials to migrate to the surface of the part.
So in all 4 flexes, Medium, Soft, SS and SSS, regardless of the flex, the softest material will migrate to the surface making for soft, tacky, grippy discs even if they are not that flexible.. The SSS has no PP added and a rubber that is less than 70 a shore which not only makes it softer in the surface but the most flexible as well.
(Please read Wizard Hype for the design engineering of our putters and look for a new ORGANIC Eco-friendly line coming soon)
http://www.gdstour.com/disc_golf_articles.php



Thanks for the incredibly informative reply. You make the best putters on the market, hands down. I asked my question because I used to putt with Wizards and never found one with this plastic...In all stiffnesses (or at least 3-9), there seem to be two different surface "feels". One is rubbery (if someone sat on you and rubbed the disc on your skin it would probably leave a burn mark), and the other is chalky (like pencil eraser). I have long been familiar with the chalky, but those Warlocks with the rubbery feel stick to my hands like nothing else ever has. The rubbery ones are super abrasion-resistant too, where the chalkys tend to chunk up a little more. I've literally tried to beat one of my softest rubbery Warlocks in by bashing it into palm trees and cement--it flew straighter on the day I beat it up, but the next time I played it was overstable again!

Anyway, I love the Warlock, and I love the fact that I can throw my putter as much as I want without have to cringe each time it hits something.

Hey Dave just wanted to see how things were going and say congrats to Nikko so far. I'm still throwing all Gateway and am moving to college tomorrow to play disc golf 5 days a week again which will be sweet.

Hey Dave just wanted to see how things were going and say congrats to Nikko so far. I'm still throwing all Gateway and am moving to college tomorrow to play disc golf 5 days a week again which will be sweet.



Where are you going to school?

Question: i love wizards i use them for all putts. i need help on my jump putt, wizards hyzer out. i know i can just play the hyzer but i am good a the straight line. should i go magic or warlock for jump putt straight putt with little to no fade.

when it comes to putters and up shots what are your set ups? ie. i putt with ss wizard, drive with s wizard? is anybody using diff stiffness for putting then driving, or do you use the same disc. what about long putts?

Question: i love wizards i use them for all putts. i need help on my jump putt, wizards hyzer out. i know i can just play the hyzer but i am good a the straight line. should i go magic or warlock for jump putt straight putt with little to no fade.



If you are having issues with your jump putts hyzering out, I would try the magic. I use the magic for jumpers that are over 40. The Warlock will still have the hyzer finish just like the wizard. Also, the magic makes a nice approach disc from 150 and in.

when it comes to putters and up shots what are your set ups? ie. i putt with ss wizard, drive with s wizard? is anybody using diff stiffness for putting then driving, or do you use the same disc. what about long putts?


I putt with a firm wizard, jump putt with a proto magic and use a firm wizard and e-magic for short drives.

when it comes to putters and up shots what are your set ups? ie. i putt with ss wizard, drive with s wizard? is anybody using diff stiffness for putting then driving, or do you use the same disc. what about long putts?



I putt with two Med Glow Wizards. I drive with New Med Wizards for hyzers, Med Warlocks for Str8 and Hyzer fade, and Med "Beat up" Wizard for Srt8 to Anhyzers. Still working the Magic in to my game, its the only Soft disc I use, 100ft to 200ft im slowly calling on this disc more and more.

I putt with glow Warlocks, and jump putt with warlocks, drive and throw long approaches with organic wizards and short approaches that I need to fly straight or flip up I use the first run black SS Magics.

Mac,
I don't know how many people loved the light "Baby-Blue Illusions", but I love them. Now they're gone. What can be done about that? Is it just me or do you have a market that loves these things as much as me to recreate more runs like these? I hope so because I was throwing the hell out of these things. Call Shawn Sinclair ASAP about these things, because I've been hounding him for more. Send Shawn a bunch of the new Assassins and If you can find them anywhere, a bunch of the light baby blue Illusions (Please Please).
-Scott

I use the Baby Blue Illusions as my main driver too.

one of the gas stations in OKC has about 8-10 of the

Mac,
I don't know how many people loved the light "Baby-Blue Illusions", but I love them. Now they're gone. What can be done about that? Is it just me or do you have a market that loves these things as much as me to recreate more runs like these? I hope so because I was throwing the hell out of these things. Call Shawn Sinclair ASAP about these things, because I've been hounding him for more. Send Shawn a bunch of the new Assassins and If you can find them anywhere, a bunch of the light baby blue Illusions (Please Please).
-Scott


Are you throwing the first or second run of the BB Illusions? Because there is a big difference. The 1st runs were a lot less overstable when compared to the 2nd runs.

Which one did Gurthie win the distance contest with?

Which one did Gurthie win the distance contest with?



I'm pretty sure 1st runs b/c G told me they were flippy...but then again lots of things are flippy for GG!

Yeah Geezus has sick D and GiZZo hits some sick putts.

1st run baby blue (they're almost white) and they are dead nutz straight to understable. They BOMB! We want more! The other run is sick overstable, almost un-throwable.
-Scott

I use one from the 1st run for hyzer flip to anhyzer and another from the 2nd run that I throw flat that does a huge s

There was a run of white E Illusions that are a bit more under stable than the Baby Blue, but really similar in flight.
Most are stamped with a black hot stamp and some have a QC on the bottom.

The E Illusions are a bit hard to produce because of the mass on the rim. Hopefully we will have that mold back in soon and get some ran.

There was a run of white E Illusions that are a bit more under stable than the Baby Blue, but really similar in flight.
Most are stamped with a black hot stamp and some have a QC on the bottom.


I have a couple of these bad boys and I would agree with Dave that they do fly a bit more understable than the first run baby blues. The plastic is a bit grippier too than the first run baby blues.

Joe, if you have any more those Illusion QC discs please PM me if you're willing to part with a few.

I still have several 2nd run BB Illusions that are hard to sell because they are so stable, but I have a couple that I use for a forehand S.

Joe, if you have any more those Illusion QC discs please PM me if you're willing to part with a few.



Unfortunately I only have two left. So...no can do on the parting. If I get anymore of them, I will let you know.

Just added the Assasin to my bag, love this thing & the way mine seems to raise up a bit if I get a low release (not sure if they're all like this but mine is very domey)

Kudos to Dave for the support of fundraising tournaments, w/o it I probably wouldn't have stumbled across this disc that will no doubt shave some strokes off my score.

Is that the one from Helping HollyWoods? If so, you are just NOW throwing it? LOL

No, I'm just now adding it to my daily/tourney bag :) With all my "touring" this summer I didn't want to try & learn a new disc in a week. Having a few weeks in between my last tourney & the one coming up this weekend I auditioned a few new discs that I've picked up over the summer. The Assassin is the only one that made the cut.

Oh, & did you notice the official name of the new bag? Ozark Back Pack... I gotta think I at least partially inspired that :)

Well, we have a big stack of them in weights from 175 to 172. If you need another one let me know.

Hey David, can you tell us more about these Hemp Wizards that Marshall Street has? Are they the same as the original Organics or a completely new plastic? And also, will they be available in Warlocks and Magics soon?

I just wanted to take a quick second to thank Dave for making the E-Magic and E-Assassin. These two disc's were invaluable to me this past weekend. I am astounded at the distance I can get from the assassin, every time I throw it.

Are there any particular Assassins that are more stable than others? I love the feel of the Assassin and it's long, straight flight when new, but after a round it usually starts turning over and getting flippy fast. It's forced me to take the Assassin out because I cannot rely upon it anymore until more stable runs come out.

I found the oranges and yellows are about the same. The red were deffinately less stable

I am still throwing my proto red one (174g) and it is still straight stable for me. Now, my other red one (170g) flies a big old s-curve when thrown with some hyzer. When thrown flat it flies a long anhyzer. The Assassin/Magic combo got me a lot of deuces this past weekend and got me the "W".

I love the Assassin. Even with a torn Labrum, I threw one about 500 ft. the other day flat land! That was my only good throw before my arm went dead.

Are there any particular Assassins that are more stable than others? I love the feel of the Assassin and it's long, straight flight when new, but after a round it usually starts turning over and getting flippy fast. It's forced me to take the Assassin out because I cannot rely upon it anymore until more stable runs come out.


I have peach colored Assassin that flies pretty much the same as when I first threw it.
The Assassin is a straight flying stable disc,,, with too much torque or off axis rotation it may flip,,, with out enough spin or power and it may be a bit too over stable.

Some auctions for Gateway throwers - mostly putters. 1 Urethane Speed Demon. (http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZputtsmcgee)

Hey David, can you tell us more about these Hemp Wizards that Marshall Street has? Are they the same as the original Organics or a completely new plastic? And also, will they be available in Warlocks and Magics soon?


About 7 years ago we ran some Hemp Material that we received from the UK. We did the run for Chris Himing who was from Australia living in Texas working for Millennium.
I think we ran about 250 discs, mostly Sabres and Demons.
There was a small amount of resin left over along some of the poorly molded parts thay I hung on to all this time.
I ground up the bad parts and mixed in the help resin adding it to a SS batch of Black and WAAAAALLA about 120 black hemp putters!!! The thing is this product cannot be shipped to the US any longer so this will probably be the last batch.
I do have about 20 overweight Demons (190-210grams) that i can use for a batch that could make another 50, but I may just put the overweight HEMP Demons on E bay.

This particular run of Hemp Wizards only has a hint of the original smell and they molded up a lot flatter than regular Wizards as the Hemp decrease the amount of shrinkage. They have a really grippy surface and are flexible in the flight plate and a little firm around the rim.
I have heard several people comment on how great they feel, but most wish they were not all black.

If you like black putters, try one of these you'll be Jammin!

Whats the work on the VooDoo or any new mids?

Per the interview on PDGA Radio Dave said that due to great sales on the Magic the Voodoo is being delayed as to not cut into sales.

Dave, saw the Organic Illusion on Marshall Street. How do these fly compared to the average run of Illusions?

wouldn't mind seeing an organic run demon, if they could be anything like the old hemp demon that would be awesome!!!!!

Organic Spirit, Blaze, Sabre, Demon, Diablo DT, and Element-X and I'm set.

looking for the clear, plastic (CE style plastic) blaze. I have a couple but looking for more if anyone has any let me know.... Also the same in spirits.....

ask jeremy at double d about the picture I sent him when he asked for clear discs :)

well I have seen Caker's secret stash and it makes me sick. So that's why I have to result to the forum..... I asked him by the way, waiting on response... Dave those e magics feel great, haven't rhown them to much but playing with them tomorrow

Yes, the E Magics feel really good. I'm a Wizard man myself, but the E Magics make me want to throw them. Might have to have a few for the back yard practicing before I put them in the bag. Have a few guys that come in the store who throw Magics that really like the way they feel too.

hey Dan, how are you?
Havent talked to you in a while, you should try and make it down to Ozark Mountain for our event on the 25th and 26th of October. you will be more than welcome to sell discs there if you like.
BTW, we have assassin in again, but they are going fast

hey Dan, how are you?
Havent talked to you in a while, you should try and make it down to Ozark Mountain for our event on the 25th and 26th of October. you will be more than welcome to sell discs there if you like.
BTW, we have assassin in again, but they are going fast




Are they E assassins? If so how do I get some?

Dave,

Did you "dome up" the E magics and warlocks on purpose, or did it just happen that way? Does it make them more overstable?

Dave,

Did you "dome up" the E magics and warlocks on purpose, or did it just happen that way? Does it make them more overstable?


I would say yes!
Most runs of E in our putters are a little domey as the polymer shrinks more than "S" causing it to rise up in the center! Typically its the smoother plastic that causes them to be more overstable more than the shape when we are talking about putters.
The magics are such a straight flying disc and they are basically just as straight in E, but the Wizards are noticeably more overstable, not so sure about the Warlocks!

hey Dan, how are you?
Havent talked to you in a while, you should try and make it down to Ozark Mountain for our event on the 25th and 26th of October. you will be more than welcome to sell discs there if you like.
BTW, we have assassin in again, but they are going fast




Are they E assassins? If so how do I get some?



call the shop before we sell out :)

Ive got a few of the E Magics now and the dome didn't seem to affect the one I was throwing this past weekend any. It turned nice a slow straight out of the box. Great Disc

Are they E assassins? If so how do I get some?

[/QUOTE]

call the shop before we sell out :)

[/QUOTE]

Not the question i was trying to ask. I got excited and didn't read the post right. :confused: I thought it said E assassins as in the clear z/champion style plastic.... LOL i need to read better!

The white E Warlocks are more overstable.

BTW, I'm loving my new Ozark backpack. I never realized a backpack bag would be so much more comfortable than my old tour bag with Quadshocks. It keeps the weight close to my body so it feels like my bag is part of me instead of wobbling around and sometimes feeling like I'm having to fight it climbing hills or going through rough. :D

yes I think the Ozark back pack at $85 is surely the best bag for the money on the market!
www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com (http://www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com) to check out some pics!

Hey Dave, I was out throwing one of your new organic runs (a magic that you sent me), and while attempting to make a longer putt, I missed and it hit some rocks. The rocks took a giant chunk out of the rim. I really like the feeling of the organic plastic, but is there any way to make it more durable?

I'd like to echo everyone else's sentiment about the E Magic. It's a very straight flying disc, even in E, and you can absolutely crush one on flip-up line. I thought I would cry when I lost my wizard from 2003, but this disc has filled the gap nicely.

how does the magic compare to an innova dx aero?

how does the magic compare to an innova dx aero?



The magic feels smaller in the hand diameter-wise. Not sure on what the actual measurements are though. The Magic also has a blunter nose to it. The Magic's speed is probably a hair bit slower than the Aero as well.

by far the magic is one of the best putters out there. I have switched over to them. I get a great straight putting line. The E magics are great driving putters, flip up and glide like a motha... All around great addition to the gateway line up. Any one who has not thrown one is missing out.. Thrown with good form these things are dead straight off the pad, I have hit more basket from 150 out with these than any other approach disc.

does it have as little low speed fade as the aero?

does it have as little low speed fade as the aero?


low speed fade after flying flat is just about a zero.

Chris,,, I suggest you stop missing putts and hitting the rocks :D

Hey Dave - doing pretty good here. Do you have any info on the Ozark tourney? I couldn 't find it on the PDGA tour. If I can get somebody to work the store and get someone to come with me I might just be able to do that. Always love to play new courses and tourneys. Especially since I don't get to do much of either anymore.

Hey Dave - doing pretty good here. Do you have any info on the Ozark tourney? I couldn 't find it on the PDGA tour. If I can get somebody to work the store and get someone to come with me I might just be able to do that. Always love to play new courses and tourneys. Especially since I don't get to do much of either anymore.


The event is October 25th and 26th and I HIGHLY recommend camping. the courses are awesome and we will have a long sleeve tee shirt and 1 or 2 discs in the players packs!

It will be a B-Tier with $1,000.00 guaranteed for 1st in open!
we will get the sanctioning done and a flyer ready soon with online registration.
If you have time you should get there on Friday to play the courses!

Long time wizard user here, I've recently decided on my favorite wizard for putting.

Looks like this
http://i1.ebayimg.com/04/i/000/f0/60/5d59_2.JPG

Is 167, stiff yet tacky and super money. It feels sorta like the black plastic used on the larger part of a GGGT stash mini.

Umm... I guess I just wanted to say thanks for making them and I will buy a stack when I find one.



I totally agree and I was wondering if you know where any of these can be had at 165g?

Regards from Denmark

we have some from that run at our shop right now, but I'm not sure if they are 165 grams or not though.
That big stamp has only been used since the beginning of the year, we used to use it for the soft and medium, but now we just use it for the Soft. ( which even though they are soft on the surface, they are still not so flexible because of the design). If you like flexible with your soft try Super soft!

Plastic for the large stash minis is straight LDPE ( low density polyethylene) and actually not that much like the Wizard plastic which is mostly TPV ( thermo plastic vulcanized rubber) and 5-10% polypropylene, then filled with minerals like Talc, calcium carbonate and/or Barium.

We are developing a set of stash mini's trying to make one a driver and the other a putter. Once we have the molds we should be able to use our putter materials in the minis, but I'm not sure what minis that heavy will fly like!

The real goal will be to just make sure they fit together snugly! :cool::cool:

Information on 2 new discs on my blog!!!

http://gatewaydiscs.blogspot.com/

Voodoo sounds awesome, esp. as a driving putter, but I'm sad to hear about the ELX being discontinued. I better start stocking up. Do you think you could show us some pics of the Voodoo? I like the idea of the top and bottom being the same.

Is the Voodoo deeper rimmed than the Wizard?

Voodoo sounds awesome, esp. as a driving putter, but I'm sad to hear about the ELX being discontinued. I better start stocking up. Do you think you could show us some pics of the Voodoo? I like the idea of the top and bottom being the same.



I am right there with you about the ELX!

Is there gonna be an ART contest for the VooDoo? I dig looking at all the cool stuff people come up with for the discs

i've got some nice nike EL Xs if someone wants them :)

semi-clear red color. couple of them new, others in very good condition.

Is there gonna be an ART contest for the VooDoo? I dig looking at all the cool stuff people come up with for the discs



I am thinking about doing a contest for the voodoo art, but need to get the discs shipped out by the end of next week.

If we are going to do an art contest it will be a quick one!

I just have to say,,, the discs is really GREAT off the tee.
I am totally impressed by the flight when thrown hard.
From the looks of the shpae it seems like it would turn over rather easily, yet it has just as much resistance to turn as the Wizard and is noticeably faster.
The disc just feels great in the hand and comes out smooth and flying fast for a putter!
the fade at the end is predictable being a little more over=stable than a Wizard at slower speeds and a little less over=stable at higher speeds!
I gave away 100 Voddoo's at this weekends club championship here in St Louis and heard nothing but rave reviews about the performance.

BTW,,,,
A Glow Voodoo will be in the players package at Ozark event in 2 weeks and hopefully we will have the retooled ELX ready by then too!

Are you looking for artwork, text, or a combination of both? If you do have one are you planning to choose the best artwork and the best text or just see how it goes?

That is a pretty tight deadline. I would just think we should file this under "next" time unless, the contest is for a future stamp sorta like the new Star discs from Innova have a 1st run stamp and a regular stamp.

We could have them submitted by Thursday by midnight, vote until Tuesday by midnight and that gives 3 days to do work, and 5 days to vote and a couple of days for Dave to put the stamps on. It's very possible.

Why have the artist rush?

Why have Gateway rush to get stamps on a disc?

Take the time & do it right.

i've got some nice nike EL Xs if someone wants them :)

semi-clear red color. couple of them new, others in very good condition.




PM sent

Some people work better under pressure...

Have you made any Glow Assassins?

Hey Dave,

Just wanted to touch base been really busy with school and all but playing disc golf everyday so that is always a good way to relax from school. My game has been improving a lot and still loving all the disc in the bag.

Is there anything you think I should try out. I haven't tried any of the new disc besides the assassin is the newest one in the bag.

Thanks
Justin

Does the VooDoo not have the thumb groove top anymore?

Dave Mac,
Can you send some Glow Voodoo's to Popeyes in Norman OK? Or is there a more direct way to get one?

~Gateway Sure-Grip VooDoo (Soft) - Pre-Order (http://www.sunkingdiscs.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2059)
~Gateway Sure-Grip VooDoo (Glow) - Pre-Order (http://www.sunkingdiscs.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2060)

Any plans on making a slightly deeper putter Like an Aviar-x or Challenger?

I want to see some pics so bad of this disc. Sounds like the perfect putter, although I doubt I'll ever surrender my SS Warlock.

I have one at home. I will try to remember to take some pics and put them up for you.

Whats the skinny on the warrior?

I'm with you Dude, about the Warlock, though I do throw the Magic now also.

The VooDoo was a hit this weekend in Orlando, I had several players buy one based on how comfortble the grip was only to return and buy one or more again after they threw it. Initial feedback remarks included comments on how dead straight neutral it flew with virtually no fade. Looks like a winner Dave, good job.

So what is the eta for Evo Voodoo's? Because I absolutely love the flight pattern but I have never liked how quick the S plastic beats in. So I would say I would just be about ready to replace my putters if I could get them in evo plastic.

How can you not like how S plastic beats in? Have you ever thrown a 3 year old wizard? Pure butta.

I want to see some pics so bad of this disc. Sounds like the perfect putter, although I doubt I'll ever surrender my SS Warlock.



Don't be so sure...I'm a Warlock putter, but I am one of the people that bought a second from Sunking after I putted with it.

The putter feels most like a Challenger in the hand. It is very smooth and rounded and the small bead is barely noticable at all. It feels like a Warlock that fills out a little better in my hand.

Flightwise I have not driven with it yet. For putting it has the same line as a slightly broken in Warlock. The one noticable difference is that the Voodoo has the best float/loft/slow glide of any Gateway putter yet. Essentially it flew the same as my Warlock but required less effort, flew a bit slower, and didn't drop like a Wizard or Warlock. Maybe like a stable Magic.

Anyway the putter is good. It has the best feel yet from Gateway and it flies a little different from their other putters. The float is what I've been looking for.

One strange thing--both Sunking and I noticed that the plastic felt more like Discraft Pro-d as far as tackiness goes that it does any of Gateway's plastic I've felt recently. If I picked one up with my eyes closed I would defintely guess Challenger.

If it feels like the Challenger then that's a turn off. The Challenger's wing just feels too small for my hands, and I cant get a comfy grip on it.

I don't think it feels anything like a challenger. The top is very similar to a magic. If you hold them next to each other, the tops from the parting line up are almost exact. The Voodoo might have a more pronounced downward angle the closer you get to the outer edge. The bottom is more like a more rounded wing of a wizard. The bead is about the same as that of a Challenger though. So far...I would say it has very good glide. It has pretty good stability too. A very straight disc for driving. If I were to rank the stability of the Gateway putters, I would say they compare like this.

Wizard +1
Warlock +.5
Voodoo 0
Magic -.5

I would say that the Voodoo has all of them in the speed and glide department. I was throwing all four molds today out on the practice field and the Voodoo's had about an extra 10 yards of carry out of them. The Warlock/Wizard/Magic were all within the same 20 foot circle at about 250 feet. If I were playing a short technical course, the Voodoo would be a great weapon to have in your arsenal. As for putting with it, I don't know if it will replace my original proto wizard. But...I'm still in the early testing phase :D

Just got 2 VooDoo and 2 New Warriors. Let me say WOW. The Voodoos are a bit deeper than the wizard, which is a big plus. Flies like my beat in 10x's. The worriors are like a beat in roc. I know that gets thrown around a lot, but its domey and on the stiffer side for E plastic. It take very little to get it going. And the best part, THEY ALL HAVE THE MONKEY!!!!

I've only got about 8-10 throws with each, so all of this is very preliminary

Just for clairification, I'm not sure if these are the warriors. It has retooled element on the back are are inbetween an Element and an ELX in stability.

If it feels like the Challenger then that's a turn off. The Challenger's wing just feels too small for my hands, and I cant get a comfy grip on it.


feels SIMILAR to a challenger. mainly the wing, so you may not like it. i'm the same way. you can definitely tell that the weight is distributed differently and it's a little thicker on top than a challenger. my guess is that it's better, simply because gateway makes the best putters :o.... but i'm sticking with my wizards.

I want to see some pics so bad of this disc. Sounds like the perfect putter, although I doubt I'll ever surrender my SS Warlock.



Don't be so sure...I'm a Warlock putter, but I am one of the people that bought a second from Sunking after I putted with it.

The putter feels most like a Challenger in the hand. It is very smooth and rounded and the small bead is barely noticable at all. It feels like a Warlock that fills out a little better in my hand.

Flight wise I have not driven with it yet. For putting it has the same line as a slightly broken in Warlock. The one noticeable difference is that the Voodoo has the best float/loft/slow glide of any Gateway putter yet. Essentially it flew the same as my Warlock but required less effort, flew a bit slower, and didn't drop like a Wizard or Warlock. Maybe like a stable Magic.

Anyway the putter is good. It has the best feel yet from Gateway and it flies a little different from their other putters. The float is what I've been looking for.

One strange thing--both Sunking and I noticed that the plastic felt more like Discraft Pro-d as far as tackiness goes that it does any of Gateway's plastic I've felt recently. If I picked one up with my eyes closed I would definitely guess Challenger.


Thats because Jim ( at discraft) is now using Santoprene in the Challengers like we have for the past 6 years!

we wanted the first run voodoos to be just about all the same feel so we dried the material completely and there was very little experimenting with formulations!.

todays runs of SSS and SS Voodoo's have that good old grainy feel and moisture marks out by the rim!

The E Voodoo's are ready and have our new Evolution art for 2009 on them ( kind of a KC signature look to the stamp).

They are MONEY and dye up SWEET!

Blanks are available for those who like to dye!

Just for clairification, I'm not sure if these are the warriors. It has retooled element on the back are are inbetween an Element and an ELX in stability.



How does it handle the wind?

On about 200-220 ft controled shots, it would turn a bit and just go stright. I'm sure if I threw it harder in the 260+ range, it would have more turn, much like my old beat in KC Rocs

I am sure that David will correct me if i am wrong but, it looks like the Voodoo has the Magic top and the bottom just continues on that exact same radius to the bottom. I only got to throw mine in some VERY windy conditions.

The Warrior (retooled Element X) appears to be a little more overstable than an Element X that I had in the exact same weight. The only difference that I could notice was that the inner rim of the disc is thicker. That thickness makes the disc feel very comfortable in my hand.

They also retooled the Element adding the same thickness on the inner rim.

I putted some more with the Voodoo last night. It definetely has more dome than a Challenger, but it is still seems to have a very flat profile overall. It feels better than any putter I've thrown--so rounded and smooth, grippy yet stiff...The bead had some weird flashing that almost made it feel like a double bead (aka the "Deuce"). I rubbed it off with a microfiber towel and the disc felt even better.

Once again the putt flight seemed similar to my broken in Warlocks, though I must reiterate that the Voodoo has a smoother glide and seems to correct off-axis torque better. This was obvious last night b/c a cold front was coming in and it was very windy. It handled as well as Gateway's other putters in the wind. I love my Warlocks, but I think I might switch to this. I will still drive with Warlocks though b/c the plastic mine are made of is the best I've felt for that purpose.

This disc feels NOTHING like the Magic. The Magic has a squared off wing that feels very uncomfortable to me. This is like a small or no bead Wizard with a symmetrically rounded top and bottom wing.

This disc feels NOTHING like the Magic.



I don't think anybody has said it feels like a magic. I do believe it was stated that the top is very similar to a magic. Just a point of contention.

And I said that I think that it is the Magic top. I compared them side by side and they appeared to be the same.

This disc feels NOTHING like the Magic.



I don't think anybody has said it feels like a magic. I do believe it was stated that the top is very similar to a magic. Just a point of contention.



I should not have been so dramatic... ;) I just meant that it does not feel like a magic in your hand.

No worries man.

Got out and threw the voodoo today. I was very pleased - it holds a dead straight line and flies very fast. Also threw the S assassins, and was surprised by their stability. They are flatter than the E ones I've seen, so I thought they would be a little more under-stable, but they flew really straight and hyzered out slowly(they go pretty far!!). Good stuff Dave!

There are S Assassins now? What else have you been hiding from us Dave? :)

The VooDoo is a hit with me. 1st throw off the teepad, near ace.

I know this is quick, but any chance of a Big Bead Voodoo? A voodoo with a wizard bead would be great. A Voodoo and Voodoo2 combo would be great

I know this is quick, but any chance of a Big Bead Voodoo? A voodoo with a wizard bead would be great. A Voodoo and Voodoo2 combo would be great


yeah,,, yeah bigger bead,,,,,, and I think we might call it the Wizard! :D:cool::confused:

David,

Any chance of ever seeing another run of Ultralight Spirits?

I know this is quick, but any chance of a Big Bead Voodoo? A voodoo with a wizard bead would be great. A Voodoo and Voodoo2 combo would be great


yeah,,, yeah bigger bead,,,,,, and I think we might call it the Wizard! :D:cool::confused:



The Voodoo feels deeper than a wizard. That's what I always was wanting with the Wiz

The Voodoo seems to have a thicker flight plate than the Wizard and Warlock. The shoulder seems a little higher as well. I'm thinking that this will help to prevent the flight plate from dropping and dimpling like it can over time with some Warlocks and Wizards. I'm looking forward to picking through some more plastics/rigidities of the Voodoo when they are available. I'm hoping for the rubbery S plastic that my Warlocks are made of....

You have one of those rubbery Warlocks too? That's one of the top reasons why I'll find it hard to surrender my SS Warlock because all the other Warlocks I've felt just dont have that thick rubbery feel that mine does.

I played a couple rounds today. All I havr to say is.....The element is SUPER KICK*SS!!!!! I was pulling these out everytime I would normally pull out my beat rocs. This is definately going to be my winter rocs. I tryed elements (original tooling) out last winter and they didn't have the stability I was wanting, but these have it. And they are consistant too. I had my 2 and my buddies. Every time I threw all 3 they were all within 5 feet of each other. I was using these on 260-300 foot flat holes and a couple 340-360 foot downhill holes and they worked much better than expected. There was only about a 5mph wind and it handled it fine. All the flat and uphill shots were straight shots with only a few feet of hyzer or slight turn overs. I was also getting nice stright shots with a late turnover. On the long down hole shots I tossed some straight shots and big sweeping hyzers. It looked real slow and pretty the whole way.

I'm still on the fence with the Voodoo. I'm still trying to get used to its speed and glide. I kept going past the basket. I'll hopefully get in some more golf tomorrow to get more testing.

Dave,
Any chance these new elements are going to be ran in S plastic? This E is the best E I've felt for your mids. Its domey and stiff with a nice grip. Not stiff like the E demons though

I played a couple rounds today. All I have to say is.....The element is SUPER KICK*SS!!!!! I was pulling these out every time I would normally pull out my beat rocs. This is definitely going to be my winter rocs. I tried elements (original tooling) out last winter and they didn't have the stability I was wanting, but these have it. And they are consistent too. I had my 2 and my buddies. Every time I threw all 3 they were all within 5 feet of each other. I was using these on 260-300 foot flat holes and a couple 340-360 foot downhill holes and they worked much better than expected. There was only about a 5mph wind and it handled it fine. All the flat and uphill shots were straight shots with only a few feet of hyzer or slight turn overs. I was also getting nice straight shots with a late turnover. On the long down hole shots I tossed some straight shots and big sweeping hyzers. It looked real slow and pretty the whole way.

I'm still on the fence with the Voodoo. I'm still trying to get used to its speed and glide. I kept going past the basket. I'll hopefully get in some more golf tomorrow to get more testing.

Dave,
Any chance these new elements are going to be ran in S plastic? This E is the best E I've felt for your mids. Its domey and stiff with a nice grip. Not stiff like the E demons though



yes we have some GLOW S Elements ( threw them quite well all weekend at Ozark) from the new tooling and will eventually get some more runs of them in S, I was waiting to hear more feedback about the thicker rim and the radius increase where the rim meets the flight plate.
With these 2 increases in mass we had to thin up the flight plate from .087 to .072 which is probably the biggest reason the discs are performing better for players with more speed and spin.
The new runs are much more gyroscopic and are staying spinning much MUCH longer.
They are also .015 lower profile because of the change, which is a lot considering a few thousands change is noticeable in the height.
(we have quite a few of the new runs of the E Elements waiting to get stamped with our new Evolution Stamp for 2009)



We are just finishing up with the 3rd retooling of the old ELX now called the Warrior ( old name new disc). The first 2 re tooling's were bit too over stable ( think Blaze but slower).
I am looking for something to compliment the Element with a mid-range speed and glide but not as over stable as a blaze and we are inching there!!

We should get some ran next week hopefuly this re tooling gets us the stability I want!.

OOOOOOH..... Glow S! Do you have any at the shop I could get?

I still have an original Warrior on the shelf.

Trying the VooDoo out tonight. I really like the feel of the black first runs. Like to get some of the E versions.

lovin the voodoo. Feels great and flys just like a slightly beat warlock. The E's are $$$$ they bomb, plus that new stamp is awesome:)

Really liking those warrior I got from you Dave. I think those fly great, pretty beefy but I think they would be a great addition. I know you wanted something not as overstable, but I like this run, very controlable, great for those shots were a blaze would skip or take off. The purple run feel great. Nice and flexy :cool:

Voodoos are great! Fast, off the shelf stable, and wanting to be flippy in a few months! I can see this disc fighting for my beat wizzard driver spot. Great disc Dave!!

As I told David over the wknd. in Evansville, concerning the Voodoo, I'M IN LOVE!!!

This is the perfect putter. I was practicing with them in between rounds at a tournament and I have never thrown a straighter putter in my life. If the discs werent going in the bakset they were at least hitting it. I'm going to practice with them for about a week exclusively for putting and short control shots, but I think I will indeed be taking my Warlock out of the bag. Hate to do it, but the Voodoo just seems to be a superior disc.

I wont be putting with it ever. Im to partial to my wizards, but i will be using it for Annhyzer drives. I think it is faster off the Tee than my beat wizards.

A Wizard will always have a place in my bag as a driver putter and windy putter. But the Voodoo will more than likely become my primary putter. My Warlock never beat in to the point where it was dead straight like the Voodoo, and that tad bit of stability has caused me to miss long putts, but the Voodoo seems to correct this because it is faster, has more glide, and it is straighter.

I here ya!

A Wizard will always have a place in my bag as a driver putter and windy putter. But the Voodoo will more than likely become my primary putter. My Warlock never beat in to the point where it was dead straight like the Voodoo, and that tad bit of stability has caused me to miss long putts, but the Voodoo seems to correct this because it is faster, has more glide, and it is straighter.



I'm putting with my Voodoo instead of my Warlock...but my Warlocks I still love for driving.

Just got a stack of Voodoo's and did a putting session with them. Great disc ... I love it. I got a bunch of the red Sure-grip sunking first runs ... sweet plastic.
Keep up the good work Dave ... I added a couple more Gateway discs to my bag.

I like the voodoo b/c it seems to be the disc I wanted to warlock to be but it won't be in the bag b/c at the end of the day the wizard covers every shot I need from a putter. Great disc though.

I just got a stack of the Evo Voodoo's over the weekend and i absolutely love the feel of the disc and I think it just might have a place in the bag beside the wizard. I only had one problem with the stack that i recieved. One of them was clearly a double stamp which im assuming meant it was a factory second and I paid full price for it. And I know i should take this up with who I bought them from but my suggestion for you is if there could be some kind of X-out stamp so this doesnt happen. Just an idea.

Probably not a factory second unless you can find a flaw in the molding.
More than likely our 4 ft red-dred-locked-hot-stamping-kid thinks double stamps are cool or maybe it was a missed stamped that got out!.

The only E voodoos I threw seemed to be just about the same stability as the S, but Nikko said his E vodoos he was practicing with were more overstable than the the S.
ANY Comments?

There have been 4 runs of E voodoos so far,
A white E that is a medium/soft that has just E on the back and a more flexible E that says EVO.
Theres also a run of pink and orange that I have not thrown yet that a tad firmer and just a handful of red ( less than 20) that are stiff!

I was throwing an "E" Voodoo over the weekend. And I would say the initial part of the flight was similar to that of the "S", but the late fade was more pronounced than the "S"

Probably not a factory second unless you can find a flaw in the molding.
More than likely our 4 ft red-dred-locked-hot-stamping-kid thinks double stamps are cool or maybe it was a missed stamped that got out!.

The only E voodoos I threw seemed to be just about the same stability as the S, but Nikko said his E vodoos he was practicing with were more overstable than the the S.
ANY Comments?

There have been 4 runs of E voodoos so far,
A white E that is a medium/soft that has just E on the back and a more flexible E that says EVO.
Theres also a run of pink and orange that I have not thrown yet that a tad firmer and just a handful of red ( less than 20) that are stiff!



How about the warrior?

Some of the double stamps do look pretty sweet imo. So long as the stamps are alligned neatly. I have a double stamped Magic thats very nice looking.

Dave, I tried to send you a PM ... but I get an error saying your message box is full ... Mr Popular.
I have a couple of questions about some Voodoo you mentioned, and some other things. Drop me a line with your email.

Dave, I tried to send you a PM ... but I get an error saying your message box is full ... Mr Popular.
I have a couple of questions about some Voodoo you mentioned, and some other things. Drop me a line with your email.



david@gdstour.com

I wanna hear more about the new elements. how are they different than the original?

They are more HS stable and can handle a slight wind better. They will take a lot snap with out flipping. This is the closest thing I've thrown to a beat roc. It also doesn't have a ton of low speed fade you see in a lot of premium mids

The inner rim where you grasp the disc is also rounded. It feels VERY comfortable in my hand.

If anyone has any new ones that are 175g+ please PM me. I have alot to trade, and will possibly buy.

I'll trade one if you have a new warrior to trade

I'm still wanting Warriors myself.

to my knowledge there were three runs (or just three colors of plastic) of the warrior as it stands now. There was a pink, purple, and light blue. The light blue are hard and super beefy. The purple is super flexy and still overstable, and the pink haven't thrown. The pruple is like a flex plastic flies like a longer gator with more control. I love it...

My Warrior is red. My Element is white. My Voodoo is glow.

How about the warrior?



Ran some S on Monday and E Tuesday of the 3rd tooling and initial testing results a great with the S being just about dead straight when thrown hard and slightly over stable when you back off on it. ( the E are noticeably more over stable as should be expected but very controllable)
They are similar in fade to the old ELX but have more resistance to turn. with the thinner flight plate, and beefier nose they are much more gyroscopic, giving them MUCH longer spin which results in more glide and penetration, specifically at the end of the flight.
The ELX had a .087 thick flight plate and the Warrior is now .068. What this means is about 20 grams have been transferred from the flight plate to the rim in a 180 gram disc, which is a significantly huge change in weight distribution.

I can't wait to try one of these new Warriors ... gotta be RED though, lol

Hey Dave...you gonna send some Warriors out to the team guys to try?

Was driving with the Voodoo today in a headwind, I'd say about 15mph, and must say the disc was pretty impressive. Obviously had to throw it on a hyzer line, but it flipped up, had some turn and went down pretty straight. I was positive the disc would turn and burn, but with enough hyzer and keeping it low it worked out really well.

Dave-

Do you have a cure for the curse of the warrior this time around?

I have an original warrior (I throw Blazes regularly). The real problem is getting this song stuck in my head with the Warrior... :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT9t5nkZn8I

Dave-

Do you have a cure for the curse of the warrior this time around?

I have an original warrior (I throw Blazes regularly). The real problem is getting this song stuck in my head with the Warrior... :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT9t5nkZn8I


YUK!!!!

try thinking about the gang movie with the line:
"wariors,,,,,,, come out and plaaaaaaaay! :D

Last night I picked up some asphalt colored organic Voodoos and this is my new putter. The Sunking ones are great, but a little stiff to get good action on metal. The organics are probably the best feeling putters I've ever picked up. They shrunk a bit more than the other Voodoos and are flatter. They are stiffer than SS, probably about a medium soft. They are very chalky with stuff coming off on your hands. They smell like someone threw a tire in the campfire. I'm interested to see how well this plastic holds up over time.

I also bought a white "Evo" Voodoo with a circle stamp that looks a lot like the old Ken Climo discs. The plastic is the best I've felt in Gateway's E putter line. It flexible and rubbery in the flight plate and stiff around the sides. It is very smooth with no imperfections and very little flashing. The disc looks and feels very professionally molded if that makes any sense. Flightwise it is overstable, but with more speed and glide than Wizards/Warlocks. It will take over as my overstable putter-driver. I hope it keeps its stability. The absence of flashing and durable-feeling plastic make me optimistic that it will.

How would you compair the E to the S Voodoos?

Last night I picked up some asphalt colored organic Voodoos and this is my new putter. The Sunking ones are great, but a little stiff to get good action on metal. The organics are probably the best feeling putters I've ever picked up. They shrunk a bit more than the other Voodoos and are flatter. They are stiffer than SS, probably about a medium soft. They are very chalky with stuff coming off on your hands. They smell like someone threw a tire in the campfire. I'm interested to see how well this plastic holds up over time.

I also bought a white "Evo" Voodoo with a circle stamp that looks a lot like the old Ken Climo discs. The plastic is the best I've felt in Gateway's E putter line. It flexible and rubbery in the flight plate and stiff around the sides. It is very smooth with no imperfections and very little flashing. The disc looks and feels very professionally molded if that makes any sense. Flightwise it is overstable, but with more speed and glide than Wizards/Warlocks. It will take over as my overstable putter-driver. I hope it keeps its stability. The absence of flashing and durable-feeling plastic make me optimistic that it will.



I too have an Organic and an E Voodoo, but I find the Organic to be more stable than the E because the flight plate is flat, whereas the E seems to have a bit of a dome.

Dave, where can I find the RED Voodoo E ... PM me!

How would you compair the E to the S Voodoos?


Pretty much how Nikko described...The E comes out of the hand the same as the S, but it fades sooner and harder. The E seems to fly faster and carry farther...

Dude...are they coming out of your hand smooth? I suspect you may be gettng a little off-axis torque on your domey E (I have a hard time getting clean releases off domey putters) if it is flying less stable than the organic.

How would you compair the E to the S Voodoos?


Pretty much how Nikko described...The E comes out of the hand the same as the S, but it fades sooner and harder. The E seems to fly faster and carry farther...

Dude...are they coming out of your hand smooth? I suspect you may be gettng a little off-axis torque on your domey E (I have a hard time getting clean releases off domey putters) if it is flying less stable than the organic.



They fly dead straight, and I dont have to put spin on them like I do with Wizards and Warlocks. But the E virtually take no effort to get going because the dome gives it a little extra glide that allows the putter to carry farther.

The Organic is still dead straight, but with just a tad more fade than the E because of the flat top, and as such I put a little more wrist in it than I do with the E.

But I prefer putting with the Organic because the grip is great, and the E is somewhat slick, but I believe I'll be keeping both in the bag for different purposes.

Sounds like yours is different from mine. I got a white one that says "Evo" on the back. It is defintely OVERstable. I threw it a few times this morning as I walked my dog around the park. I even threw it with anyhyzer and it came out of it.

No, mine says EVO as well, but since the flight plate has a dome, and my Organic is flat, somewhat sunken, it is a tad but more stable, but the EVO glides farther so I can use it more for jump shots, and the Organic for straight putting.

Dave Mac,
Is SunKing the only place to get the Glow VooDoo's ?

Dave Mac,
Is SunKing the only place to get the Glow VooDoo's ?


There were not that many made and most were stamped for the "Ozark Mountain Fall Harvest" event.
I'm pretty sure we have some with that stamp if your interested just email me david@gdstour.com
I think Jeremy at DD also has a few but chances are they will probably go this weekend at the 2 Emporia events.

Sounds like yours is different from mine. I got a white one that says "Evo" on the back. It is defintely OVERstable. I threw it a few times this morning as I walked my dog around the park. I even threw it with anyhyzer and it came out of it.




same with mine, I threw it on the way to my starting hole at a monthly this weekend, and goofed with it between rounds. They are overstable and fast! I love um

David, how much does the new Ozark bag cost? I told my dad I'd like to get a new golf bag for my b-day, and the Ozark is definitely the kind of bag I am needing.

The inner rim where you grasp the disc is also rounded. It feels VERY comfortable in my hand.



Do they still have that nice outter edge for rolling? Are there any produced in plastic other than organic (standard S)?

S is not Organic. Organic is a special blend.

I have only received S & E Warriors. I have not got an Organic from the shop. The outside of the mold is the EXACT same shape as the Element X. So, if you like using that...

I'm talking specifically about the element, not the el-x now the warrior. The only new elements I've seen so far are organics. Is this the only run produced in the re-tooled mold so far?

S is not Organic. Organic is a special blend.

I have only received S & E Warriors. I have not got an Organic from the shop. The outside of the mold is the EXACT same shape as the Element X. So, if you like using that...


Mark,
Are you saying the new warrior is the same shape as the old ELX on the top and nose?
You might want to put them nose to nose for comparison as the nose is a LOT different as is the inner rim and flight late thickness.

son-of-a the,,, Ozark back packs are like $85 and we always throw in a few discs.
www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com (http://www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com) ebay store is suspended for 30 days, if you want a bag just call the shop
Have you given the Warriors I sent up a try yet?
I have a yellow S one doing just about whatever I ask of it.
slight Hyzers slight turnovers and dead straight lazer beams.
I accelerated the break in a period a bit as it was a tad bit too over stable when it was new.
I haven't had much time with the E as I'm starting to throw a lot more S again because I like the feel so much better, but the E do feel really good.

I'm talking specifically about the element, not the el-x now the warrior. The only new elements I've seen so far are organics. Is this the only run produced in the re-tooled mold so far?


no we ran S and E in the Element mold are are stamping them tomorrow.
The Element has the new inner rim and thinner flight plate as well, but we did not touch the top or wing!

additional changes to the molds include retooling the top of the Blurr, Blast and Rage.
What was once a 1" long transition from the nose to the flight plate at about 15 degrees is now 23 degrees for only 3/8ths of an inch, making it much more abrupt which should make it easier to flip up and should stay over longer once it is,

additional changes to the molds include retooling the top of the Blurr, Blast and Rage.
What was once a 1" long transition from the nose to the flight plate at about 15 degrees is now 23 degrees for only 3/8ths of an inch, making it much more abrupt which should make it easier to flip up and should stay over longer once it is,



Sounds interesting. The Blurr should be an even bigger bomber than it already is.

Any word on the DT for the Sabre, Blaze and Demon? Also, any chance you have some G6i's laying around Dave? I am down to my last one now.

Yes, a less stable Blurr would be awesome! Definitely would fly a mile.

And I think we're all wondering what's happening with the DT fairway drivers.

S is not Organic. Organic is a special blend.

I have only received S & E Warriors. I have not got an Organic from the shop. The outside of the mold is the EXACT same shape as the Element X. So, if you like using that...


Mark,
Are you saying the new warrior is the same shape as the old ELX on the top and nose?
You might want to put them nose to nose for comparison as the nose is a LOT different as is the inner rim and flight late thickness.

son-of-a the,,, Ozark back packs are like $85 and we always throw in a few discs.
www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com (http://www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com) ebay store is suspended for 30 days, if you want a bag just call the shop
Have you given the Warriors I sent up a try yet?
I have a yellow S one doing just about whatever I ask of it.
slight Hyzers slight turnovers and dead straight lazer beams.
I accelerated the break in a period a bit as it was a tad bit too over stable when it was new.
I haven't had much time with the E as I'm starting to throw a lot more S again because I like the feel so much better, but the E do feel really good.



Of course I don't have one on me at this exact moment but, I was referring to the part of the disc that would be in contact with the earth for a roller. From what I remembered when I looked at them 2-3 weeks ago it looks like the same part of the disc would be on the ground as the ELX. Of course I did not meant that they are the same disc. I guess I will have to pull them both out and take a look at them again. :o

David-

Do you know any drills that can be done inside (w/ or w/out a disc) that help promote good form?

Thanks

David-

Do you know any drills that can be done inside (w/ or w/out a disc) that help promote good form?

Thanks


off the top of my head I'm thinking the equalizer tied to something and simulating a back hand throw.
about 300 15 foot putts a day keeps the bogie's away!

Yo Dave -- when's the next art contest? Can't wait to do my first Gateway stock stamp :D
Feel free to update any stamps... in contest form!

Love the Wizard, I think it's the best putter on the market... my trusty Glow SS Leaf Stamp won me the Ring of Fire at an A-tier last weekend and most of that prize will go toward Voodoos and Wiz. Not too shabby for a Rec player, thanks to my rockin putter.

I have a Blurr that is understable. It was a run of Blurr that came out really flexible. They are almost like a mix of Nike and Evolution plastic. It is great.

Yo Dave -- when's the next art contest?



We will have a contest for the voodoo art.
I just need to get it up and going.

Yo Dave -- when's the next art contest? Can't wait to do my first Gateway stock stamp :D
Feel free to update any stamps... in contest form!

Love the Wizard, I think it's the best putter on the market... my trusty Glow SS Leaf Stamp won me the Ring of Fire at an A-tier last weekend and most of that prize will go toward Voodoos and Wiz. Not too shabby for a Rec player, thanks to my rockin putter.




Semi-related, I won my first Ring-of-Fire this weekend in pretty windy conditions with my SSS Magic on the First toss!! Granted weather turned a few back but there were 20 people tossing & I nailed the only one with a 35ft jumper. Prize was a free round at a course I wont be driving back to though, fly-18 course in Trafalger, IN. I gave it to my partner, Was still nice to win it though :)

The morale of my little story is THANKS for the sweet putter Dave! It's help take my game to a new level over the course of '08. Hopefully I can conitue to progress, I moved back to Michigan over the weekend so the competition will increase a bit.

Yo Dave -- when's the next art contest? Can't wait to do my first Gateway stock stamp :D
Feel free to update any stamps... in contest form!

Love the Wizard, I think it's the best putter on the market... my trusty Glow SS Leaf Stamp won me the Ring of Fire at an A-tier last weekend and most of that prize will go toward Voodoos and Wiz. Not too shabby for a Rec player, thanks to my rockin putter.




Semi-related, I won my first Ring-of-Fire this weekend in pretty windy conditions with my SSS Magic on the First toss!! Granted weather turned a few back but there were 20 people tossing & I nailed the only one with a 35ft jumper. Prize was a free round at a course I wont be driving back to though, fly-18 course in Trafalger, IN. I gave it to my partner, Was still nice to win it though :)

The morale of my little story is THANKS for the sweet putter Dave! It's help take my game to a new level over the course of '08. Hopefully I can conitue to progress, I moved back to Michigan over the weekend so the competition will increase a bit.



Semi-semi related. The Voodoo has upped my confidence in putting to a degree I never knew I had. The speed and glide, and accuracy is above any putter I've ever thrown, and I'm hitting more putts at farther distances that I have before. 40-50 footers are become pretty common now, and if I'm not getting in the basket I'm certainly hitting it. Misses due to lack of height or the putter stablizing itself is seemingly in the past now.

So, on semi-relatedness........the Magic has really done wonders for my game. I can hit chains now from 60 and in.......but I have yet to actually see the basket stop the putter effectively. I usually kick straight back out, skip through, or ricochet off the chains.

On a different note....Dave, I'll be back in town from Dec. 11th to Jan. 21st. I want to get a few rounds in with you guys and meet to discuss the investments in the company. I'll call you when school is out. P.S. Are the <font color="red"> Titan Portables </font> going to be available? I want to bring one back to Montana.

Yo Dave -- when's the next art contest? Can't wait to do my first Gateway stock stamp :D
Feel free to update any stamps... in contest form!

Love the Wizard, I think it's the best putter on the market... my trusty Glow SS Leaf Stamp won me the Ring of Fire at an A-tier last weekend and most of that prize will go toward Voodoos and Wiz. Not too shabby for a Rec player, thanks to my rockin putter.




Semi-related, I won my first Ring-of-Fire this weekend in pretty windy conditions with my SSS Magic on the First toss!! Granted weather turned a few back but there were 20 people tossing &amp; I nailed the only one with a 35ft jumper. Prize was a free round at a course I wont be driving back to though, fly-18 course in Trafalger, IN. I gave it to my partner, Was still nice to win it though :)

The morale of my little story is THANKS for the sweet putter Dave! It's help take my game to a new level over the course of '08. Hopefully I can conitue to progress, I moved back to Michigan over the weekend so the competition will increase a bit.



Semi-semi related. The Voodoo has upped my confidence in putting to a degree I never knew I had. The speed and glide, and accuracy is above any putter I've ever thrown, and I'm hitting more putts at farther distances that I have before. 40-50 footers are become pretty common now, and if I'm not getting in the basket I'm certainly hitting it. Misses due to lack of height or the putter stablizing itself is seemingly in the past now.



After some flexing my Organic Voodoo is flying dead straight. I too notice that the Voodoo sustains its height in flight more than other putters. When I pull out my Warlocks that I was putting with before the Voodoo they seem like they weigh 200g. I still prefer driving with my Warlocks though. I like the plastic that they are made of better for driving.

I played a couple of rounds with Chris Schmidt last weekend and he gave me a re-tooled E Element and a Warrior to test out. The Warrior looks and feels nice. The nose reminds me of the Gremlin.

I have a few warriors in S and E on the way and am very excited after almost a month of tossing the new elements

I got a few Pink E Warriors from the shop a few days ago. With the snow that we just got I am glad for the color. I has able to throw it a few times in the rain/sleet/snow that was last Saturday at an inter-club challenge (FTF wins again!). It was less overstable than the Red S Warrior that I got over a month ago. I need to throw it in more controlled conditions like "dry" before I say that I love it or not. I have liked it so far though.

The retooled Element has been getting some good comments. I have loaned mine to a few people and I sold some glow elements a few weeks ago.

Also, David if you need some technical help running a contest drop me a line. I would be more than happy to be the point man for it (receiving submissions, hosting submissions, etc).

How would you compare your warriors to the elx?

The first one that I got, the S Red was a LOT more overstable than an ELX. I am thinking that it was one of the ones that David was talking about here, "Yesterday we ran about 150 of them in 3 different formulas and they were a just bit too over-stable for what we were looking for. Kind of a cross between a demon and Gator which wont do much good in a beginners hands." That pretty much sums that disc up.

The hot pink ones that they recently sent me fly much more akin to what I would expect from a retooled ELX. Like I said, it was cold &amp; rain/sleet/snow on Saturday when I was throwing it. Two rounds got me &amp; all my gear soaked in 30 degree weather. My initial thoughts are that it was somewhat similar &amp; that I liked throwing it. I would like to throw it more and in better conditions along side my stack of ELXs to make a comparison. There were no immediate negatives about the disc...

How are the Glo S retooled Elements compared to the retooled E elements?

All of the elements that I have are S or glow so, I could not say...

Just field tested the new Elements and Warriors. Elements cant say much as I was throwing in wind and they flipped. As for the Warrior, I have a yellow S one, and 2 pink E's. The S was MAD overstable, just like a Demon, the E's were dead straight with a nice fade at the end, and a decent resistance to turnover in a headwind.

I can' t believe they changed my favorite disc. The original Element was the bomb. I use it for all my controlled turnovers and tight wooded shots. The best disc that Dave made in my opinion. I'm glad that I have about 30 originals on hand.

Have you thrown the new elements? I've found them much more controlable and easier to get 300+ because they can take a bit more mustard and don't need ae much height

the thinner flight plate and wider rim of the Element allows the disc to spin longer therefore they should go a little farther. They are still great for turnovers just not quite as easy to flip up from hyzer to turnover, but if you turn them your self they hold the line forever.
I like the way they ONLY flip up to straight for me at 60%-70% power as this is how I learned how to throw with Stingrays and aero's back in the day.

I cant say enough great things about the Warrior.
It has really bridged the gap between the Wizard and Sabre for me, especially when I need to turn the disc right our of my hand and keep it lower to the ground flying flat.
It will also hold a nice left to right when thrown nose down and hard or a subtle Hyzer for a LONG way and doesnt seem to get effected by the wind very easily.
I have an S that I accelerated the break in period a bit and can basically do whatever I want with it for anything under 325.
I have had some shots go well over 350 with the Warrior, but would still rather use a Sabre of even an assassin and stay around 60%-70% power.
I used to throw putters 350 because I liked throwing everything at 90% power and felt more accurate up there, but I guess at 44 its better to save the wear and tear on the body and smooth something out there.
Maybe I will try stretching before I play one day! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

BTW,
I watched this Kid Mike O throw 350 foot Hyzers today with the E Warriors while we were working on this new course at Unger Lake here in St Louis!
His throws seemed effortless, but then again he has pretty BIG POWER and can throw spirits close to 500' ( real D not MBD).
He said he thought the warrior was supposed to be a big nosed driver and loved the speed and control he got with it!

I'm patiently waiting to try the Warrior!

I spent two hours at my practice field with the new retooled Element
and the Warrior today.

These discs feel great in the hand. The inside rims are more ergonomic than any other disc I have felt. It took a few throws to get the timing down on my release. The rime caused me to release the disc a bit earlier than usual, which isn't a bad thing.

The s element had the same flight path as a normal of the shelf
s element. It was a bit faster and had more low speed fade, and could handle more power than the old s elements. It is a welcomed change to an already good disc. Cant wait for it to beat in and become my late flipper!!!!!

The Warrior was also faster and seemed to fly smoother than my old ELX. Still overstable and reliable i like it!


They are both worth getting your hands on and trying out!

These discs feel great in the hand. The inside rims are more ergonomic than any other disc I have felt.



I could not agree with you more on that! The way that it is rounded on the inside just is very comfortable to grasp.

Warrior= faster more stable buzzz like flight

Is that an E or an S? Also what color and weight?

This week I have tested an E Element retool (182g scale weight) and an E Warrior (178 scale weight). The Element is white with a cannabis stamp. It is stiff and domey, but feels grippy like Star/ESP plastic. The Warrior is pink with the new Gateway ring stamp. It is more flexible/rubbery than the Element. Both feel very good and in my testing both had pretty hard tree hits and sidewalk slides. The trees did nothing to the discs. The Element got scraped by the sidewalk ride a little, the Warrior didn't show a mark.

Flightwise I was quite impressed with the retooled Element. My first throw with it was 300' at a soccer field with a slight headwind. I threw it about 70-80% and it flipped flat without turning and rode straight. Yesterday I took it to the course. I was just going to throw extra shots with it, but I lost my Meteor in the water halfway through the round and the Element became my turnover mid for the rest of the round. I was very impressed by how well the new Element held its line. I remember the first E element I bought was one of the flippiest discs I've ever had. This new one is NOT flippy. It is slightly straighter (less stable) and slower than a Buzz, but with at least as much glide. I was throwing it hard with slight hyzer or throwing 80% flat and the disc was doing whatever I wanted from straight to anhyzer. It did not feel like a hyzer disc, so I didn't try any. I parked a 320' tunnel anhyzer hole with it and I must say the line was truer than I usually get with my Meteor. I even had shots release slightly anny start to come out on me, but not actually stall and fade. This disc is good and though I'm not ready to change anything in my bag, I'm hanging on to it and I will defintely throw it more.

I did not throw the Warrior as much. It was fast and stable, but not really overstable. Somewhat like a beat Demon I imagine. It could really take some snap, forehand and backhand. It did not carry/glide too much, not nearly as much as the Element or my Buzzes. The grip is great and this disc will be popular with power throwers and forehand guys for sure. The feel and plastic are the best Gateway has put out in its mids in my limited experience.

I would recommend that anyone try these new discs out.

Is that an E or an S? Also what color and weight?



Red S Warrior and Pink E Warrior. Both 175
they are fast and overstable. Not meat hook overstable

The new element I threw was a red s 175. It has more dome, more speed and more stability than the old s elements.

I have not thrown any of them on a course yet. It will be a few days maybe even a week before I go out to a course. Until then all my posts will be from my field practice. I am adding the discs to my practice stack and make observations form there.


So far both discs are Great!

Those domey E El are my goto mids right now with little to no wind. I just got in some S and Glo EL and they are a tad more stable. I took my beat in rocs out of the bag a month ago with no problem.

I got to toss my E and S Warriors today. I had flexy and stiff poppy top Pink E's and white and orangy red S's. All flew about the same just like discspeed described except the orangy red S. It had less HSS but about the same LSS. Kinda like and Eagle and Teebird comparison.

I think I like the warriors, but definately need to toss them some more.

threw my red 175 s retooled element again today. They are more stable and faster than the older version. This thing is a perfect anhyzer disc!

I also threw my Warriors. One pink E and One Red S. They turn almost like a demon but with a smooth flight and quicker penetration! Great disc if you throw buzzzes and want a more overstable version.

Thanks for all the feedback!
Its good to hear players are liking the new inside rim and thinner flightplates of the Element and Warrior.
I felt there was a need for some improvement but didn't really want to add 2 more mid-ranges to the production schedule.
It's always a little scary when you try to fix or change something that is not really broken, but it looks like we got passed that with these 2.

Look for some Clear/translucent EVO releases sometime soon for both of these and eventually the rest of the models.

We are working on a new mold for 3 new under-stable longer winged distance Drivers.
The discs will be 21cm and similar in wing length to the Illusion/ spirit, but with not as much defection angle from nose to the bottom of the wing and little or no concave.
The rim depth will be the minimum 5% of the diameter.

These discs wont be out until after the first of the year.

I can't wait for a clear E EL!!!

I'd love a CE Assassin.... :)

DaveMac...you gonna send me those Warriors?

CE Illusions, Diablo DT, Assassin, Warrior, Element, Sabre, Demon and I'm set!

CE Illusions, Diablo DT, Assassin, Warrior, Element, Sabre, Demon and I'm set!



me too!

Does Gateway have any molds that will be legal for the new Super Class events?

I broke my s warrior today :( I was flexing it in the truck on the way to the course and...... snap it cracked the rim in half. I did notice a small air pocket in the rim right were it broke? So until i get some more S in I will stick to the E warrior

Nice flex there!

Thanks for all the feedback!
Its good to hear players are liking the new inside rim and thinner flightplates of the Element and Warrior.
I felt there was a need for some improvement but didn't really want to add 2 more mid-ranges to the production schedule.
It's always a little scary when you try to fix or change something that is not really broken, but it looks like we got passed that with these 2.

Look for some Clear/translucent EVO releases sometime soon for both of these and eventually the rest of the models.

We are working on a new mold for 3 new under-stable longer winged distance Drivers.
The discs will be 21cm and similar in wing length to the Illusion/ spirit, but with not as much defection angle from nose to the bottom of the wing and little or no concave.
The rim depth will be the minimum 5% of the diameter.

These discs wont be out until after the first of the year.



Dave - if you can run them in some light premium plastic versions, many of us will be very happy.

Dave,
Are you going to attempt to make any Super Class discs in the future?

Dave,
Are you going to attempt to make any Super Class discs in the future?




a big giant wizard would be awesome!!!

Hey Dave, I am going to have to try out those new drivers over the holiday break. I have been looking for a more understable Diablo DT for my controlled turnover drives. See you soon!

Dave,
Are you going to attempt to make any Super Class discs in the future?



We are working on a backyard game that uses catch like disc around 24cm
I could see us producing the 24 cm disc for super class, especially in different plastic.
I will definitely run a SC event here in St Louis or at least get the club to run one this year.
Is there a link to the SC specs?
I see a 23.7CM disc on the approved list and was previously told 24 cm was going to be the rule.
I hope its not some funky rule like 23.6.


As far as premium and lightweight discs go we have the following discs in stock in weights less than 150g and some go all the way down to 105 grams:
Wizard
Magic
Voodoo
Element (older style and new)
Warrior ( new retooled Element-X)
Sabre
Blaze
Demon
Hybrid
Illusion
Spirit
Speed Demon-dt
Rage ( new retooled version not yet released in Golf weight)
Blurr ( new retooled version not yet released in Golf weight)

A few days ago I threw a bunch of Test flight shots with some of the lightweight drivers and had very good results throwing them 360 feet over water on Hole #11 at Unger park. ( currently being constructed)
I think a lot of players would be surprised to see the performance of a 137 gram Spirit, Blurr or Rage and the light weight putters and mid-range work wonders for your technique.

We are putting together some Christmas specials for www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com (http://www.gatewaydiscgolfdirect.com) which will include some light weight sets as well as Golf Bags and Stencil dyes.
They will go up on our E-bay store around December 7th.
anyone interested beforehand can contact me directly david@gdstour.com

Is there a link to the SC specs?



Read your mail. You got an email a few days ago like all of the other manufacturers to comment on the proposed specs.

It's Cyber Monday, we are offering ALL Gateway Discs at $3-$4 off + FREE SHIPPING at $49 - Can ya dig it?

~Gateway Sure-Grip Golf Discs - $5.99-$9.99 (http://www.sunkingdiscs.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&amp;Category=97)
~Gateway Evolution Golf Discs - $5.99-$7.99 (http://www.sunkingdiscs.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&amp;Category=99)
~Gateway Factory Second Golf Discs - $5.99 (http://www.sunkingdiscs.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&amp;Category=199)

Is there a link to the SC specs?



Read your mail. You got an email a few days ago like all of the other manufacturers to comment on the proposed specs.


Oh OK,
I didnt see the Superclass specs at the end in red.
why such funky dimensions?
.08 for wing length/thickness
23.7 for diameter
why not 1.0 width and 24cm.

so the rim depth of a 23.7cm disc needs to be at least 1.54 cm?

are the funky dimensions for these rules to allow certain models or prohibit certain ones?
Are there any traditional style golf discs that would pass with these standards?

are these final?

Is there a link to the SC specs?



Read your mail. You got an email a few days ago like all of the other manufacturers to comment on the proposed specs.


Oh OK,
I didnt see the Superclass specs at the end in red.
why such funky dimensions?
.08 for wing length/thickness
23.7 for diameter
why not 1.0 width and 24cm.

so the rim depth of a 23.7cm disc needs to be at least 1.54 cm?

are the funky dimensions for these rules to allow certain models or prohibit certain ones?
Are there any traditional style golf discs that would pass with these standards?

are these final?





Dave I think you know the answer to half those questions. :p

Just half?

hey scoot,
have you thrown the Warriors yet?
They are the retooled ELX,


on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.

hey scoot,
have you thrown the Warriors yet?
They are the retooled ELX,


on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



951 Present and ready! :D

hey scoot,
have you thrown the Warriors yet?
They are the retooled ELX,


on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.




Haven't thrown the Warrior or VooDoo yet but I will as soon as I see one. I also saw that you retooled the Rage and Blurr so how are they?


Oh and I would like to go all or nothing (although you can't match the Sabre/Blaze) but I might be able to find some people who may be interested.

hey scoot,
have you thrown the Warriors yet?
They are the retooled ELX,


on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



I'm looking for a sponsor :D... 956 now should be 960 after the next rating update

on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



I already throw a few gateway discs the spirit and demon and magic. im not looking for any type of real sponsorship but ill do some campaigning for you. im only 947 and im only playing adv right now. atleast until after am worlds in kc.

oh yeah and thats all thanks to odie! i had never thrown a gateway disc in my life until i met him lol!!!!!

965 in my second year, how does it work exactly?

on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



I already throw a few gateway discs the spirit and demon and magic. im not looking for any type of real sponsorship but ill do some campaigning for you. im only 947 and im only playing adv right now. atleast until after am worlds in kc.


Sponsoring up and coming advanced players is our specialty,,, ask Matt Hall :D:D


Matt,,, why all or nothing?
It seems a mixed bag would give you an advantage, it worked pretty well for Nikko this year!
destroyers ex-calibers spirits (illusion rollers) sabres blazes demon Buzzz'z elements and Wizards

The added advantage of throwing everything would probably be pretty small. It isn't as much the discs as the dumb kid who is playing. I mean ever since switching my game hasn't changed much and the change that has come isn't from the discs.

I must say that I was a bit surprised to see Nikko checking out a choice 2nd FR Buzz that I bought from Geoff Bennett at the Moccasin Lake Open and then showing me the one in his bag. Anyway, I think that its awesome that you let your sponsered players throw mixed bags. I think this is a great move and will help Gateway attract more top up-and-comers.

I threw all Discraft for a year with the hope of a ratings spike and possible sponsership. The ratings spike didn't happen, and in fact I dropped. It wasn't so much the actual discs, but the confidence I have in certain discs to be dependable during crunch time. Also, I learned disc golf using Wizards, Buzzes, and Teebirds. To me these discs compliment one another perfectly. Its hard to believe that these discs are made by different manufacturer's because I put them on such similar lines with respect to distance. Since welcoming all brands of discs back into my bag (and letting go of my dream of sponsership) I have gained much confidence back and I feel like I'm playing "my" game once again. My rating is travelling in the right direction again as well. I can't imagine ever going back to a single brand. Its nice to know that there may still be sponsership opportunities in my future despite a diverse bag. Even though I only throw Gateway putters, with Voodoos, Warlocks, and Wizards taking care of all my short drives, approaches, and putts I probably throw at least 60-70% of my shots with Gateway discs.

on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



I already throw a few gateway discs the spirit and demon and magic. im not looking for any type of real sponsorship but ill do some campaigning for you. im only 947 and im only playing adv right now. atleast until after am worlds in kc.


Sponsoring up and coming advanced players is our specialty,,, ask Matt Hall :D:D




thats what i have been told! i know matt and hes a great golfer. i have converted a few guys from aviar to the magic already! in my mind you cant find a straighter flying disc on the market! especially with the added thickness to the center of the plate! it really holds true to the line! the spirit is one of the most stable if not the most stable thing ive thrown! i had a hard time throwing one at first but seeing odie put it on the big anny line really showed me how to throw it! it helped out at the TEXAS TEAMS CHAMPIONSHIPS in wimberly at circle r ranch! those big holes give you a lot of room to boooooom! are you going to be making any more spirits in the nike plastic?

The added advantage of throwing everything would probably be pretty small. It isn't as much the discs as the dumb kid who is playing. I mean ever since switching my game hasn't changed much and the change that has come isn't from the discs.



Matt it depends on your definition of small.
1 stroke a round seems small, but when you deduct 4 strokes from every event you played in it's rather significant, especially in terms of cash won.

I have lots of top players tell me they would throw Wizards if they were not sponsored by Innova and I'm thinking the same would go for the Buzzz.
Same goes for Discraft guys, as a destroyer and Wizard would surely be worth 1 stroke a round.
As you've mentioned the Sabre and Blaze are just 2 discs that I and D do not have and would make most top players long mid-range game a little stronger.

I totally agree with Buzzz and Teebird being huge advantages in anyone's bag.
I just recently got a Lat 64 Core - I couldn't resist that Chameleon plastic. Haven't used it in a round yet but it flew great in the field - similar to my 2FR Buzzz but with more HSS (maybe cause it's new)
Can't wait to try voodoo and warrior!
Dave - rating is up to 949, maybe next year ;)
(j/k I don't really play enough tournaments anyways to warrant a sponsorship.)

Sponsorships come in many forms and Sizes.


My game has improved lately with the addition of the Warrior. Adding the "S" Element to my bag also has me throwing a lot more hyzer released shots which has always been strength.

hey scoot,
have you thrown the Warriors yet?
They are the retooled ELX,


on a different note:
you up for a mixed bag sponsorship for 2009?????
we are looking for 4 - 1000 rated pros to sponsor who are going to tour and would like to throw a mixed bag.
we are also looking for others from 950-999 who are interested in throwing a mixed bag.



Hello Dave,

My name is Micah Moon Winters and I am a recent 971 rated player finishing my rookie year.
I just started throwing the Magic putter and I love it. My game has been improving. I throw Innova drivers, Disccraft mid-range, and the Gateway Magic for putting. (mixed bag)
I would be very interested in the Sponsorship. I am an avid player and volunteer on the courses.
I love the game and intend to play until I'm unable.

Please look me up(16033) and consider me for your proposal! I have a great reputation in the field and will represent your company with pride!

Thank you for your time and feel free to call my house anytime. 512-443-7942

p.s. If you get a weird answering machine (usually music or comedy), you've called the right place.

Moon (Matt--that number is not for you to use:)

i vouch for Micah, he is a good guy and player. And he almost kicked my butt at CODO

Dave
Im up and coming 987 rated PDGA# 21803.
Matt H will vouch for Me.
Im emailing you. Would love to represent your Plastic.
Thanks Keith

Somehow the Warrior has found its way into my bag. This weekend I was playing a tournament and it was windy. I had just cracked a tree really hard with my overstable Buzz in practice, and it was not flying overstable at all. An overstable Buzz is hard to find, and I realized that none of my backups were going to fly quite how I wanted in the wind. I took a chance and put the Warrior in my bag for the second day of the tournament. The disc performed for me each time. I was throwing 300ish straight shots with hyzer finish in varying winds and it held up superbly. It is definetely less overstable than a Demon/Blaze, but moreso than the Buzzz and most ELXs. It seems to be more naturally overstable than a Buzz, butt matches the flight characteristics of the Buzz really well. The Warrior might have a permanent place next to my Buzz.

I have one question Dave,

I got a couple backup Warriors from Sunking and they are real domey, where the one in my bag is flat. I've not thrown them yet to compare, but which way is the disc intended to be? I'm thinking I prefer the feel of the flat one b/c its like my Buzz, but I let you know how the domeys fly.

I have one question Dave,

I got a couple backup Warriors from Sunking and they are real domey, where the one in my bag is flat. I've not thrown them yet to compare, but which way is the disc intended to be? I'm thinking I prefer the feel of the flat one b/c its like my Buzz, but I let you know how the domeys fly.



I didn't hear whether your Warriors were S or E.
We ran some flat and domey in each plastic.
In both plastics the flatter were less over-stable which is kind of odd, typically its the other way around.

I started with a flat Yellow S Warrior and broke it in a bit right off the bat until it was just dead straight.
I since lost in the water and now I'm working with a slightly domey Red S, which started out a little more over-stable than the yellow but after a several intentional tree hits, its tamed down a bit and is now just slightly over-stable and a great compliment to my Glow S element.
Personally I like the feel of a slight dome as opposed to flat, but if there is more demand for flat, than there will be mostly flat ran!


We are getting ready to run some Clear/Translucent Warriors in our new Evolution. My guess is they will wind up being closer to the flat than the domey which is probably what I'm after. (its a little harder to control the dome on the E, epsecially if we are trying to make them clearish)

I think the flat S ones are really similar to the old ching rocs which were a really popular run,,,, so expect some DEAD flat runs for sure,,, at least in the S!! :D

the lighter Colored Pink E are just dead straight for me, but I really dont throw E plastic for mid-range if I dont have to. I'm old school and prefer the S!!

That hot pink E Warrior has actually been my favorite so far. I have that red S and yes, it is pretty overstable. ; )

I guess I will have to get some of those clear Warriors as well. Any chance for a clear Assassin? I knew that you were working on it at one time.

I have one question Dave,

I got a couple backup Warriors from Sunking and they are real domey, where the one in my bag is flat. I've not thrown them yet to compare, but which way is the disc intended to be? I'm thinking I prefer the feel of the flat one b/c its like my Buzz, but I let you know how the domeys fly.



I didn't hear whether your Warriors were S or E.
We ran some flat and domey in each plastic.
In both plastics the flatter were less over-stable which is kind of odd, typically its the other way around.

I started with a flat Yellow S Warrior and broke it in a bit right off the bat until it was just dead straight.
I since lost in the water and now I'm working with a slightly domey Red S, which started out a little more over-stable than the yellow but after a several intentional tree hits, its tamed down a bit and is now just slightly over-stable and a great compliment to my Glow S element.
Personally I like the feel of a slight dome as opposed to flat, but if there is more demand for flat, than there will be mostly flat ran!


We are getting ready to run some Clear/Translucent Warriors in our new Evolution. My guess is they will wind up being closer to the flat than the domey which is probably what I'm after. (its a little harder to control the dome on the E, epsecially if we are trying to make them clearish)

I think the flat S ones are really similar to the old ching rocs which were a really popular run,,,, so expect some DEAD flat runs for sure,,, at least in the S!! :D

the lighter Colored Pink E are just dead straight for me, but I really dont throw E plastic for mid-range if I dont have to. I'm old school and prefer the S!!



Mine is a pink E Warrior that weighs 178. It is only slightly more overstable than a Buzz. If I throw it flat and hard it is dead straight. It holds hyzers very well though where my Buzz would definetly flatten out more. I like the feel of the domey ones and if they are more overstable I will probably prefer them because when my flat one breaks in a little it WILL BE a Buzz more or less. IMO those pink Warriors are the best mids that you guys have made in terms of plastic, feel of the mold, stability, and glide. If I had a box of them in the back of my car I could probably have sold 1/2 by now b/c everyone I let feel or throw it has good things to say.

Agreed. I have let people throw them but, they are mine. MINE I say!

I just placed a small order for some of those if they have any left.


If I had a box of them in the back of my car I could probably have sold 1/2 by now b/c everyone I let feel or throw it has good things to say.

Trying to send you a PM, but your inbox is full.

Question: Can you explain the assasin? Whats is comparable to? What are its strengths?

Question: Can you explain the assasin? Whats is comparable to? What are its strengths?


Think of a Teebird...then kick the speed up a couple of notches and you have yourself an Assassin.

Question: Can you explain the assasin? Whats is comparable to? What are its strengths?


Glide &amp; control are the strengths.
mine rarely flip or fade too hard and go a really long way.

colin try the PM now.

i just bought a proto scout from ebay. can you give me any specs on this? is it over-stable or under-stable? is it pdga approved? flight charicteristics?

Its pretty much an H demon. Not quite as overstable as a demon, but it will hold its own in a wind. they are approved.

I'm not dave mac, but I threw proto scouts when they originally came out

After some more throws with the Warrior I do prefer the flatter ones. They still have a decent dome (not flat like a Buzz), but the overall profile is still fairly low. The other ones are flat on the wing with a quick rising poppy top dome. The dome is pretty extreme, but you can't really feel in in your hand because of the flat wing. These ones did not seem to glide as well as the flat ones. They didn't seem too different in stability, but the domey ones did fade a little harder when they lost speed. It was windy and the domey ones also seemed to catch more lift and airbounces when thrown into the wind. I came to the conclusion that I definetely prefer the lighter pink flat ones. I'm interested in how long these discs will hold their overstability.

Dave,
Do you have a preference of what a mix bag should look like to sponsor? Meaning does one need to carry Gateway Putt, Mid and a Driver for your sponsorship? Or are some guys just putting Gateway? Do you care?
Keith 21803

Just a recommendation to all the guys out there wanting to join up with Team Gateway. I would give David an email directly. He always gets back to me pretty quickly.

david@gdstour.com

Hope to see you all on the team! I have good feelings for 2009. ; )

Dave,
Do you have a preference of what a mix bag should look like to sponsor? Meaning does one need to carry Gateway Putt, Mid and a Driver for your sponsorship? Or are some guys just putting Gateway? Do you care?
Keith 21803


I really want to keep it simple with very few restrictions.
I would think the putters would be the ONLY required discs and something most players should be able to do.
If you are wanting to partner up with Gateway and you can not fit the putters into the line up,, we might not be the best fit for you.


Other than the putters, use whatever works of ours or any other company and help us promote and market Gateway products in your area or wherever you can.

As Mark said, please email me directly david@gdstour.com and we can go from there.

Hey Dave...are you still planning to retool the Blurr and Rage? And if so, any time table?

Thanks
JT

Hey Dave...are you still planning to retool the Blurr and Rage? And if so, any time table?

Thanks
JT


Did it already just haven't ran it in anything but the lightweight/150 class stuff.
I seems to have accomplished making them less overstable, but we will see when we run them in our NEW Evolution.

We just started running our new EVO and have some totally clear Spirits and Speed demons and some translucent red/orange Elements.
this is the same material we used for the milky white Sabres a few years back,,,, grippy, flexible and REALLY durable.
We should start stamping them this week and sending them out!