Yo Discraft, any plans to run the XL in ESP??
(long time XL fan)

Yo Discraft, any plans to run the XL in ESP??
(long time XL fan)



HMMM.....interesting :eek:

Yo Discraft, any plans to run the XL in ESP??
(long time XL fan)



HMMM.....interesting :eek:



Totally Dreamy! :cool:

DEFINITELY....an ESP XL would be VERY nice! Such a great disc.

Any plans for an ESP Flick in the near future?


whit

I want one.

Yo Discraft, any plans to run the XL in ESP??
(long time XL fan)



Hi Mattlock,

Very good chance!

Any plans for an ESP Flick in the near future?


whit



Hey Whit,

No plans for an ESP Flick right now.

Dont know if it has already been asked but is there a chance of the Reaper being released in esp plastic?

There was an unstamped ESP XL up for auction at CHills at the Mills a couple weeks ago. I think that and a X Banger went for $50 or so.

Dont know if it has already been asked but is there a chance of the Reaper being released in esp plastic?



Hi JD,

There are no plans at this time for an ESP Reaper. Right now only the most popular models will be added as we go.

Yo Discraft, any plans to run the XL in ESP??
(long time XL fan)



Hi Mattlock,

Very good chance!



ESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXLESPXL !!!!!!!!! :D:D:D:D:D:D

Keith-

What about an ESP Challenger? That would be a killer disc!

ESP Marauder? Z Marauder?? FLX Marauder??? Anything????

I know me and about four other guys would be real interested :D. As far as cult classics - I think the Marauder fans are more diehard than the Comet fans, even if there are far less of them. Other will come around. Market it as a long controllable mid, not a driver anymore.

I'm still waiting for a straight, throwable, durable putter. GT's and Magnets don't work (for me). The Challenger is too overstable except for a beat D, which is what I use now, but during the season it will only last a month, tops. Sooo...
How about getting DGA to do some proline Reef's so I can add to my dwindling stock of X APX's and then doing something with the mold since it's just sitting there?
An ESP XS would be cool as well.

Any chance of seeing some X surges in production any time soon?

I know this question has had to have been asked before, but I didn't feel like going through a hundred pages of posts. Is there and ESP Challenger in the works?

ESP FLX Challanger.......... That would be super sweet!

Hello all,

No ESP Challengers in the works right now.

And...

After 9 years at Discraft I'm moving on to a sunnier climate. My final duties will be the PIAS tradeshow and the Gentleman�s Club Challenge in Vegas, then the Memorial presented by Discraft. At that time I will remain in Scottsdale, AZ and be working with my longtime friend Dan Ginnelly.

I want to thank Discraft and Jim Kenner personally for everything he has done for me. I look forward to still working closely with Discraft so everyone can see that they are the best disc manufacturer in the World!

I'm excited to work with the AZDGC and Spinners on the Green to make disc golf even more popular than it already is in Arizona. I'll be keeping everyone posted on the scene in AZ and promotions going on at the Spinners website.

I've enjoyed answering everyone�s questions on the DISCussion board and will continue to do so to the best of my ability.

Can't wait to see everyone in NV and AZ!!!

Spinners website ???
I dont think the moderator will like that :o:D

Thanks Keith for the years of dedication and hard work...
Those guys out in AZ sure are lucky...

P.S.- On your way out the door , push for the FLX Challenger , I will toss you a 5 spot next time our paths cross... :cool:

Good luck with everything Keith, keep in touch.

Is Jim promoting someone in-house to fill your position or will they be interviewing? :D

Before you leave Keith, Push out a few FLX Predators. I promise they will be the most money disc EVER!

When is Discraft going to release the ESP Buzz SS to the public? I see it's only a fund raiser disc at the moment.

Thanks for EVERYTHING Keith!!

Thanks for EVERYTHING Keith!!



Ill second that!!! You will be greatly missed!!! See you in 4 days in Vegas :D

Thanks for all you've done up there Keith.
Never got that soft Breeze through, eh? Too bad :p

I didn't post much, but I read every word. I love the new discs coming out!!!
The ESP Comets and ESP Flashes rock!!!!!
Thanks for all the info you have given us and good luck in the future!!!!

Hello all,

No ESP Challengers in the works right now.

And...

After 9 years at Discraft I'm moving on to a sunnier climate. My final duties will be the PIAS tradeshow and the Gentleman�s Club Challenge in Vegas, then the Memorial presented by Discraft. At that time I will remain in Scottsdale, AZ and be working with my longtime friend Dan Ginnelly.

I want to thank Discraft and Jim Kenner personally for everything he has done for me. I look forward to still working closely with Discraft so everyone can see that they are the best disc manufacturer in the World!

I'm excited to work with the AZDGC and Spinners on the Green to make disc golf even more popular than it already is in Arizona. I'll be keeping everyone posted on the scene in AZ and promotions going on at the Spinners website.

I've enjoyed answering everyone�s questions on the DISCussion board and will continue to do so to the best of my ability.

Can't wait to see everyone in NV and AZ!!!



After this winter I can't blame you!

Just b/c Keith moved on doesn't mean that a thread with so much useful info in it should die. Keep the questions coming here.....

I thought I remembered somewhere on here that the torque was going to be retooled again sometime and re-released to be what they were originally looking for. Is this true?

Also...any chance we will ever see the surge in elite-x plastic?

Do you have any plans to make a FLX Flash, I would love you Discraft guys if you does it ;)

It's a DGLO fundraiser disc. The ones I seen were quite domey though

I thought I remembered somewhere on here that the torque was going to be retooled again sometime and re-released to be what they were originally looking for. Is this true?plastic?



Yes I have read somewhere also, I think it was on this thread....

When will the ESP Flash come out? The Z Flash is my favourite disc

When will the ESP Flash come out? The Z Flash is my favourite disc



I seen them as fundraisers for great lakes open. Sunking has them. I think they are on sportdiscs.com or sumthing like that

Speaking of Z-Flashes, does anybody know if any BLUE Z-Flashes were made <170g? I've seen a few blue ones greater than 170g, but never lower. Ideally, I would love to get a blue one in the 166-168g range. Am I looking for something that doesn't exist?

nanook

i use to have a bunch of them that were around 168 so there are some out there

Speaking of Z-Flashes, does anybody know if any BLUE Z-Flashes were made <170g? I've seen a few blue ones greater than 170g, but never lower. Ideally, I would love to get a blue one in the 166-168g range. Am I looking for something that doesn't exist?

nanook



I lost a 164 blue flash at Bowling Green (white course, hole 5) right into the woods.

Sweet, thanks for the responses guys. Guess I'll keep looking...

nanook

took me a while to find this thread, but is there any chance of ESP wildcats, flicks, or Talons??

Were there any white FLX discs made? I'm looking for them in Buzzz version. Thanks.

took me a while to find this thread, but is there any chance of ESP wildcats, flicks, or Talons??



Looks like a Dcraft representative will have to fill the position of MB Liaison.

SERG, I haven't seen a white FLX disc. I have however seen a whitish, clear FLX surge. That was a test disc tho.

took me a while to find this thread, but is there any chance of ESP wildcats, flicks, or Talons??



Looks like a Dcraft representative will have to fill the position of MB Liaison.

SERG, I haven't seen a white FLX disc. I have however seen a whitish, clear FLX surge. That was a test disc tho.



I have white FLX XLs.

Were there any white FLX discs made? I'm looking for them in Buzzz version. Thanks.



Hey Serg,

Originally no white FLX discs were produced because... it was run for cold weather/snow play. I'm sure you'll see some now as the weather has turned.

I can tell you that we've had a string of days in the 100's here in AZ and people are still loving the FLX discs. I think that it will retain its properties in the heat just like it does in the cold.

I was just asked if there is going to be a FLX Challenger soon ?

There already is one!!! I have 2 up for sale........They are orange with a green stamp if anyone wants them!!!

I have white FLX XLs.


What would it take to get one off your hands?

Is there any difference in the flight of a first run Flick and the present mold? Are the first run molds popular?

Is there any difference in the flight of a first run Flick and the present mold? Are the first run molds popular?



First off, a good majority of the first runs were 150 class. The heavy 1st runs were pretty wicked overstable, where the subsequent runs were not as consistantly so. I haven't thrown a newer one to compare it to.

it is a 173 chartreuse with a red foil stamp with no scrapes or dings going to throw it today for the first time

Is there any difference in the flight of a first run Flick and the present mold? Are the first run molds popular?



First off, a good majority of the first runs were 150 class. The heavy 1st runs were pretty wicked overstable, where the subsequent runs were not as consistantly so. I haven't thrown a newer one to compare it to.



1st runs were 2.0 stability where you could get a slight flip out of them and then they would come back. The newer molds are 2.5 and dont flip easy but throw them into a few trees and then you will have a 2.0 stable flick. Also if you like to throw a flick grab a Venom if you can still find them cause they fly like nice.

I can tell you that we've had a string of days in the 100's here in AZ and people are still loving the FLX discs. I think that it will retain its properties in the heat just like it does in the cold.



Great to hear from you Keith! It is also great news to hear that the FLX will stand up to 100+ degree temps. So, yall have already had 100 degree days? OUCH!...i guess it's better than being buried under a blanket of snow for 4 months. :D

...yes the leg is still giving me probs. It felt like a noodle after the physical demand that "The Cup" required. I guess i found my kryptonite. SuperHero's just aren't made like they used to be. :p
http://www.rugbybahamas.com/images/cuckoo%20man.JPG

I can tell you that we've had a string of days in the 100's here in AZ and people are still loving the FLX discs. I think that it will retain its properties in the heat just like it does in the cold.



I've been throwing mine as well here in Wisconsin...not quite 100 but in the 80's. Hopefully we'll some white one's soon.
Thanks for the reply.

No question just a comment: Got an ESP Meteor in my players pack for DGLO, immediately loved it. Played a fun round from Monster shorts and lost it, but then grabbed two more (that weren't black! Bad color gah!) with my winnings. So smooth and straight, its like throwing my [innova putter name censored], but with more glide. The putter goes 280, this thing nets me 360 on the same line.

The Meteor seems like a beat (or really light) Comet to me.

You're right Greg. That's why it was named the Meteor because of it's Comet-like qualities.

Here is an interesting question...

I have 2 avengers. Some weight , same stamp.
one fly's like an Avenger . The other one is the most overstable disc in my bag ( more so than the predator ).

I am not crazy , John Maiero confirmed this for me...

N.E. thoughts

Here is an interesting question...

I have 2 avengers. Some weight , same stamp.
one fly's like an Avenger . The other one is the most overstable disc in my bag ( more so than the predator ).

I am not crazy , John Maiero confirmed this for me...

N.E. thoughts



May be you should get Pee Wee to confirm it for you, just to be on the safe side!!

Here is an interesting question...

I have 2 avengers. Some weight , same stamp.
one fly's like an Avenger . The other one is the most overstable disc in my bag ( more so than the predator ).

I am not crazy , John Maiero confirmed this for me...

N.E. thoughts



May be you should get Pee Wee to confirm it for you, just to be on the safe side!!



No dats funny!

i did throw both of DiscBoomers Avengers. One fly just like a Z-avenger should, the other would give my Z-Xtreme a run for it's money.

BTW, there are no e's in my name. Just a's,i's,o's, and u's. :D

Speaking of Z-Xtremes.....i think there's enough interest for another run.....i still have 15 or so first runs plus a few Timmy Gill editions, but i'd be willing to buy 50 more if Discraft ran them again. Hint...Hint...

Here is an interesting question...

I have 2 avengers. Some weight , same stamp.
one fly's like an Avenger . The other one is the most overstable disc in my bag ( more so than the predator ).

I am not crazy , John Maiero confirmed this for me...

N.E. thoughts



May be you should get Pee Wee to confirm it for you, just to be on the safe side!!



No dats funny!

i did throw both of DiscBoomers Avengers. One fly just like a Z-avenger should, the other would give my Z-Xtreme a run for it's money.

BTW, there are no e's in my name. Just a's,i's,o's, and u's. :D

Speaking of Z-Xtremes.....i think there's enough interest for another run.....i still have 15 or so first runs plus a few Timmy Gill editions, but i'd be willing to buy 50 more if Discraft ran them again. Hint...Hint...



ESP Xtreme now that might be interesting, but I am still waiting on a Flick so we shall see.

i did throw both of DiscBoomers Avengers. One fly just like a Z-avenger should, the other would give my Z-Xtreme a run for it's money.

[/QUOTE]

That isn't totally crazy, sometimes it does happen. Feel from the center of the disc out towards the edge. The more overstable one should feel like it has a little dip or raise near the rim. That is something that can happen when molded but isn't typical.

Maybe it's a Flick with an Avenger stamp.

I have a few of the white sun king ghost stamped ESP Avengers in the 165-168 range and they fly much more overstable than my max weight Predators.

For you Discraft players, I was an INNOVA man for nearly a year and 1/2, and these past 3 months I have been Gateway/QuestAT, but after Larry Bledsoe let me throw some of his discs, I am considering switching to Discraft. I already have experience with the Buzzz and believe it to be the best disc ever, and the Surges are very nice, but what would be the best discs to start out with? I was practicing with my Surges not too long ago, and was getting phenomenal distance, but I'm looking more for straight and accurate discs like a TeeBird, and a strong headwind fighting disc like a Star Max, but easier to throw.

The Discraft discs I have already are an Z Surge, ESP Surge, X XL, D Drone, Soft Challenger, and an ESP Tracker. Unfortuntely I sold my FLX Buzzz, and FLX Surge after switching to Gateway/Quest.

I'm looking into purchasing another FLX Surge, and ESP Predator, Z Xpress, Z Wasp, FLX Challenger, ESP SS Avenger, and ESP XL

Would these discs, including the ones I have be good when switching to Discraft, and encompass all my needs when on the course?

Well...here's my two cents. Headwind disc, Z or ESP Predator...best headwind disc there is. For a straight disc, I would suggest the XS or Tracker. These things are pretty straight, with the tracker having just a touch more stability than the XS. I think the tracker is like a 1.6 or 1.7 and the XS is a 1.5 I do believe.

I would suggest getting the following to start: Z-Predator, ESP Avenger SS, FLX Challenger and either an ESP Buzzz or a Z Buzzz along with a D Buzzz.

So overstable would be your Predator. Your straight disc so far could be your tracker that you have already. Your understable could be the Avenger SS. The mid's I mentioned should cover pretty much anything.

You never mentioned a putter, but I highly recommend the Challenger. I prefer the Cam Todd Challengers myself.

I throw Buzzes, an ESP XL, a Tsunami, a Predator, a Rogue, and a Surge. I can get just about any line I would ever with this combo. Looking at what you are throwing I would definetely grab an ESP XL. They are much more stable/consistent than the X type. It is an incredibly versatile disc. People ask about it when they see the lines I put it on because other discs won't perform the same way. It flies like a midrange, but is still enough of a driver to be better in the wind and have a more predictable fade.

I would suggest the ESP Avenger (not SS) if you are looking for Tbirdish characteristics. Perhaps a little more stable at first, but overall they feel and fly pretty similar to a new 10X KC Teebird (From what I remember of those discs)...

For you Discraft players, I was an INNOVA man for nearly a year and 1/2, and these past 3 months I have been Gateway/QuestAT, but after Larry Bledsoe let me throw some of his discs, I am considering switching to Discraft. I already have experience with the Buzzz and believe it to be the best disc ever, and the Surges are very nice, but what would be the best discs to start out with? I was practicing with my Surges not too long ago, and was getting phenomenal distance, but I'm looking more for straight and accurate discs like a TeeBird, and a strong headwind fighting disc like a Star Max, but easier to throw.

The Discraft discs I have already are an Z Surge, ESP Surge, X XL, D Drone, Soft Challenger, and an ESP Tracker. Unfortuntely I sold my FLX Buzzz, and FLX Surge after switching to Gateway/Quest.

I'm looking into purchasing another FLX Surge, and ESP Predator, Z Xpress, Z Wasp, FLX Challenger, ESP SS Avenger, and ESP XL

Would these discs, including the ones I have be good when switching to Discraft, and encompass all my needs when on the course?

You have to be crazy switching manufacturers like that. Why not TRY discs from other manufacturers, see what you like, then throw all different brands?! If you're swapping out your entire bag then you're constantly having to learn something new. A few of the discs in my bag i've had for more than a year and i finally feel like I know just what they are going to do. A Venom might fly like a max but i've never thrown one and it's only made in D plastic. You'll probably go to a Z or ESP Pred for your headwind needs. Anyway, you're never going to find a replacement for the Teebird, so good luck with that...

Any word on when the new cryztal flx discs will be available and where to get them? i am soo excited to hear about cryztal flx discs any info on which discs will be produced ? i love my cryztal z buzzz & challengers.

Im still waiting for another run of CryZtal Wasps!!!

Any word on when the new cryztal flx discs will be available and where to get them? i am soo excited to hear about cryztal flx discs any info on which discs will be produced ? i love my cryztal z buzzz & challengers.



Here is what you are looking for! (http://www.playerscup.org/gear.html)

Any chance or enough demand for a run of APX Swirls? That disc in that plastic is hard to mimic.

Mmmmmmm. <font color="blue">Swir</font><font color="orange">lici</font><font color="blue">ous.</font> Obviously i'd like to see another run as well. I think the swirl process produced more headaches than discs. Luckily i still have one or two. ;):D

...and while we are requesting stuff, another run of Z-Xtremes please.

I have a request too...Please run the Surge and Flash in Elite-X...

Check out the DGA Reef for a Swirl replacement. Different colors feel differently, so try as many as you can. I got a blue one that is pretty soft.
For requests, I'd like to see either an APX in some other plastic, pro-line, ESP or the return of the X.
Also, do something else with the Flick. X or ESP maybe?
Thanks

Does discraft have anything new in the works?

Check out the DGA Reef for a Swirl replacement. Different colors feel differently, so try as many as you can. I got a blue one that is pretty soft.
For requests, I'd like to see either an APX in some other plastic, pro-line, ESP or the return of the X.
Also, do something else with the Flick. X or ESP maybe?
Thanks


Tafe, a local disc golfer switched from APX swirl to the DGA Reef. He likes the Reef but they are firmer than the swirl.

...and while we are requesting stuff, another run of Z-Xtremes please.



And Z or ESP Drones. ;)

ESP FLX Drone FTW!!

The newest stuff from Discraft is new permutations, FLX XLs, 150 X Surges. If you go to their website, www.discraft.com (http://www.discraft.com), the new stuff is right there. They keep the website pretty current.

ESP FLX Drone FTW!!



I wish! I actually heard that for some reason the mold won't work for anything but DX :(

ESP FLX Drone FTW!!



I wish! I actually heard that for some reason the mold won't work for anything but DX :(



I was told that any other plastic blend would be too heavy and it wouldn't make PDGA standards for acceptance. One can still dream though, an ESP drone would be MONEY!!!

Any word on when the new cryztal flx discs will be available and where to get them? i am soo excited to hear about cryztal flx discs any info on which discs will be produced ? i love my cryztal z buzzz &amp; challengers.



Here is what you are looking for! (http://www.playerscup.org/gear.html)



i see the flx cryztal buzzz's are out... is there any chance the 'regular' cryztal buzzz might be re-released?

I need a small diameter, overstable mid from Discraft in a premium plastic! Think gator.

I need to get rid the innova in my bag, but don't have subs for my star gator, or my big fat 180g champ shark (my 173 torq is close to the shark, but not in production anymore). The drone would be awesome in Z or FLX! But it is still larger diameter than the gator.

Fans will flock to a small diameter overstable mid from discraft!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Try the new Shockwave, made by Discraft for DGA. It is getting great reviews here in AZ as an overstable mid.

What's the diameter on the shockwave?

I'm looking for 21.2 (like the gator). If I remember, Buzzz and Wasp are 21.7 and Torq is 21.5.

Try the new Shockwave, made by Discraft for DGA. It is getting great reviews here in AZ as an overstable mid.



Ok...I have two of the first runs and they are far from overstable. When thrown flat and with about 80% power, they go dead straight. When thrown with 60%, they go dead straight. Has there been any noticeable difference in stability relating to color?

I need a small diameter, overstable mid from Discraft in a premium plastic! Think gator.

I need to get rid the innova in my bag, but don't have subs for my star gator, or my big fat 180g champ shark (my 173 torq is close to the shark, but not in production anymore). The drone would be awesome in Z or FLX! But it is still larger diameter than the gator.

Fans will flock to a small diameter overstable mid from discraft!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Discraft makes a great overstable mid in premium plastic: the ESP Banger-GT. I know its supposed to be a putter, but they are really overstable and can be thrown as hard as you want. To fly straight under 300' I have to throw it with a touch of anhyzer and let it slowly pull out. No other "putter" I know is like that. Besides that I have always wished Discraft would make a stable/overstable version of the Breeze. It feels great in the hand and has good flight characteristics, so if they could make it more high-speed stable it would be the ultimate approach/short drive disc.

So...now that the Surge has been ran in Elite-X in a 150 class weight, what are the chances of getting the Surge in a beefier weight in the Elite-X plastic?

Home run on the ESP Flash. The plastic is a lot better than the one's from the DGLO.

Next wish...ESP Wildcat please...then my bag will be complete.

i have to agree on the ESP flash, its exactly what and ESP flash should be.

The first batch of "Reflection" SuperColor discs are in!!! You can get that great pic on the Surge (http://www.spinnersdiscgolf.com/catalog/item/5052949/5161928.htm) or Buzzz (http://www.spinnersdiscgolf.com/catalog/item/5052949/5161950.htm).

What about the new midrange Impact? Is it the retooled Torque we have been waiting for?

its the name of the ace race disc

I second the ESP Wildcat. Maybe even a FLX Wildcat?

its the name of the ace race disc

Thanx

I had a chance to throw my ESP Flash some more over this past week. It is a lot more understable than the DGLO one's. I am having trouble keeping them in the air long enough to have them flex out of the anhyzer now. I would say they are more understable than the Z.

And yes..."ESP Wildcat"...please.

Are the ESP Flashes your throwing Flat Top or Domey???

Domey

I had a chance to throw my ESP Flash some more over this past week. It is a lot more understable than the DGLO one's. I am having trouble keeping them in the air long enough to have them flex out of the anhyzer now. I would say they are more understable than the Z.

And yes..."ESP Wildcat"...please.



you must be crazy......the DGLO ones sucked and flew so understable its not even useful, the ESP ones are much much much more stable and fly like a ESP flash should, a bit more stable than the Z. BTW im throwing the red/pink domey ESP's

I've got a red/pink flat top and a red/pink domey. I've only thrown the flat top one though.

The DGLO one's that I have fly similar to a Star Wraith in stability. I can even throw it into a headwind and have it come back at the end.

thats really weird i bought one if each of the dglo stamps and they both flew incredibly understable for everyone that threw them. you must have got some freak mutant dglo fundraisers.

sounds like much more thorough testing was in order....

I'm not giving up on the Flash just yet. Now that it is the off season, it's the perfect time to start messing around with new plastic.

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Try the new Shockwave, made by Discraft for DGA. It is getting great reviews here in AZ as an overstable mid.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Ok...I have two of the first runs and they are far from overstable. When thrown flat and with about 80% power, they go dead straight. When thrown with 60%, they go dead straight. Has there been any noticeable difference in stability relating to color?

The first run blue Shockwaves are pretty straight, but the newer 2nd runs are much more stable. I think they are white and orange. Pretty hard to make them hold an anny for long at all.

does anyone know how to tell if the z hawk i have is a first run? i've heard there was only one run of these so all would be first runs but wanted to be sure.

thanks

The first run Z Hawk will have a ghost stamped Z on top of it. There were more than one run of Z Hawks.

What is different about the new Buzz SS from the 2007 Memorial?

It has a modified underside of the nose. Think "Coyote". I haven't had a chance to throw any yet, as I only have one and don't want to get attached since I haven't seen them elsewhere.

They are extremely flippy...your better off throwing a comet

What is different about the new Buzz SS from the 2007 Memorial?

Last I heard they were not going to produce the Buzzz SS. They have the Breeze and the Meteor and the Comet for people who are looking for an understable mid-range.

Our club has a small stack of Z Sparkle Buzzz SS. They are the fund raiser disc for the 08 AM Nats.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c275/markthehammer/DiscGolf059.jpg

I have an ESP Buzzz SS that I got at BG Ams but I won't throw it since I heard they probably won't make it to production. I would hate to fall in love with a disc that wasn't legal and weren't made :)

does anyone know how to tell if the z hawk i have is a first run? i've heard there was only one run of these so all would be first runs but wanted to be sure.

thanks





The first run Z Hawk will have a ghost stamped Z on top of it. There were more than one run of Z Hawks.




There was definitely more than one run of Z-Hawks, and not all first run Z-Hawks had the ghost Z. I vividly remember McCoy selling orange 1st run Z-Hawks at the 2002 Pro-Worlds without the ghost Z stamp. They had "Z-Hawk" stamped very small at the top edge of the flight plate. Later runs had a larger "Z-Hawk" stamp in the same spot.

What was different about the Limited Edition ESP Avenger compared the ESP Avenger? The LE was stamped 1.7 as compared to 1.8.

I was told this was the *slightly* straighter ESP Avenger (more like an X).

There have been some ESP tourney stamp Avengers stamped with 1.7. What are these?

I know that the true First Run Buzzzes had Wasp on the inner rim. But today I found a Buzzz with a crazy domey top, a regular run stamp, but Wasp on the rim.

When did the mold change?

I know that the true First Run Buzzzes had Wasp on the inner rim. But today I found a Buzzz with a crazy domey top, a regular run stamp, but Wasp on the rim.

When did the mold change?



I think the history is as follows:

First Run stamped discs had wasp on the inside of the rim.

The 2nd run still had wasp on the rim but were primarily tourney stamped discs. And a few of these may have have been stamped with the production stamp near the end of the run.

My guess is the 2nd run is what you have. If you found it outside then the dome could be a result of the elements?

I thought they were 1st Runs as well, just without the special stamp.

We ran 3 maybe even 4 runs with the Wasp engraving on the inside rim. The ONLY First Runs had "First Run" printed on them.

Are the ESP Buzzzes and Wasps Flat Top like the FLX BUZZZ?? I'm looking to either get a back up for my FLX BUZZZ or pick up a ESP WASP, but I don't like the domey versions of either disc.

-Scott Lewis

Great job on the FLX material... I've had my Buzzz for a while now and It has been great in all conditions from freezing in New york State to 105 degrees in Florida!

Isn't there some kind of a following for the domey WASP-lettered Buzzz's? I have a stack of nice pearly ones with a tourny stamp that I'm looking to hock. How do they fly compared to flatso's?
(pm me for weird Z-Buzzz)

I recently picked up a Z-Tracker, and really love this disc. Currently, these are only available as 2005 Players Cup Edition. Will these be run again any time soon in Z plastic?

Hi WS,

Not sure if Discraft is planning to run anymore but I have some here at Spinners on the Green. Feel free to contact us at 480-941-2513 if you are interested.

Are the ESP Buzzzes and Wasps Flat Top like the FLX BUZZZ?? I'm looking to either get a back up for my FLX BUZZZ or pick up a ESP WASP, but I don't like the domey versions of either disc.

-Scott Lewis

Great job on the FLX material... I've had my Buzzz for a while now and It has been great in all conditions from freezing in New york State to 105 degrees in Florida!



Most of the ESP Buzzzes are very flat. These are some of the straightest discs ever made imo. The ESP Wasps I've seen both flat and domey. You never know how those Wasp tops are going to cool out of the mold.

disc speed: THX for the info.. I wasn't sure about the wasp or Buzzz in ESP or regular Z becuase I don't throw them.
I only throw the 1st run buzzz, D buzz, and FLX Buzzz.
I remembered the D-wasps being flat so I hoped that would be the common style for wasps..
I"m glad that the ESP's Buzzzes are all flat just like the FLX. Keeps the guesswork down.

Zamson: The Domey Z-buzzzes seem to have some type of following. When Mitch was throwing only buzzzes he was Preferring the newer Tennis ball colored domey Buzzzes. I find them to not throw like Buzzzes for me. The dome seems to make them more understable or just easier to Flutter and torque. I haven't thrown a domey Buzzz in a while, but the impression i got was that it changed the flight characteristics.

-Scott Lewis

I have a few domey buzz's (wasp stamp) that are the complete opposite. They seem to throw more overstable and are great in the wind. A must in Nebraska. Any of those for sale? :)

bump for a noob

Say it ain't so!

http://www.discraft.com/bkgnds/predator_x_new.jpg

just in case anyone cared to know the discontinued list is as follows

X Crush
X Tracker(BOOOO!!!!)
Z/X Talon
X Pred
Z/X Storm
Z Breeze
Z Putt'r
X Challenger

my guess is x is being phased out in favor of ESP. i wouls also venture to guess you'll see an ESP Drone, ESP Venom, and Z tracker go into full production...we'll see....

just in case anyone cared to know the discontinued list is as follows

X Crush
X Tracker(BOOOO!!!!)
Z/X Talon
X Pred
Z/X Storm
Z Breeze
Z Putt'r
X Challenger

my guess is x is being phased out in favor of ESP. i wouls also venture to guess you'll see an ESP Drone, ESP Venom, and Z tracker go into full production...we'll see....



WOW the talon is gone ?
X pred?
X crush is a great disc.

WOW

Is the storm even made in anything other than z and x? The PDGA stamped ones are in ESP but you can only get them in black... are they going to show up in ESP for full production, or is that mold just dead?

I know that for the most part these aren't bestsellers, but at least a couple are mid-level use discs... just the reaction by itself is showing what an odd move this is.

Well, to be honest, which would you rather sell a $10 disc or a $17 disc?

The difference to Discraft is probably $.15 worth of plastic.

X flies far, but does retain its flight characteristics over its life, something that maybe is becoming the norm. So maybe the perception is that it does not last except in the most true stable molds.

My guess is that "premium" plastic outsells price point plastic 5 to 1. So, why waste time making it???

Seems to me Discraft needs to get a baseline plastic that is better than DX or sell X as cheap as Innova sells DX.

I also find it interesting that Dave said Innova was phasing out Pro plastic and immediately after Discraft announces they are reducing X.

I also find it interesting that Dave said Innova was phasing out Pro plastic and immediately after Discraft announces they are reducing X.



I think the whole phasing out pro plastic was a rumor. Why else would they be releasing new disc in pro? any way if we could get some inside info on why x plastic is going away that would be great thanks.

Discraft is now officially and completely out of my bag.
You already took the X2 and now the Talon. They should reconsider doing this.

Discraft is now officially and completely out of my bag.
You already took the X2 and now the Talon. They should reconsider doing this.



i know a guy with a stack of X2s, i should just buy them all for myself, but if you want some ill tell you who he is.

I have a few grips of X Talons, and I don't throw them anymore. I plan on waiting awhile til going to eBay, but if you want I can come off a few.

I have a bunch myself..the whole point behind me saying this is thats its just a huge mistake. There are several discraft pros that throw them and I know alot of people throughout this region that throw them. I just wonder what Mr. Bennett is going to throw now that they have discontinued his most commonly thrown driver

Is the storm even made in anything other than z and x? The PDGA stamped ones are in ESP but you can only get them in black... are they going to show up in ESP for full production, or is that mold just dead?

I know that for the most part these aren't bestsellers, but at least a couple are mid-level use discs... just the reaction by itself is showing what an odd move this is.



PDGA Storms are X not ESP. As far as I know there was never an ESP Storm.

the new ones PDGA are sending out have an ESP stamp not the old X stamp

just in case anyone cared to know the discontinued list is as follows

X Crush
X Tracker(BOOOO!!!!)
Z/X Talon
X Pred
Z/X Storm
Z Breeze
Z Putt'r
X Challenger

my guess is x is being phased out in favor of ESP. i wouls also venture to guess you'll see an ESP Drone, ESP Venom, and Z tracker go into full production...we'll see....



any word on X plastic avengers?? I love how they beat-in and will hold a straight line forever. If they are being phased out I will have to stock up.

just in case anyone cared to know the discontinued list is as follows

X Crush
X Tracker(BOOOO!!!!)
Z/X Talon
X Pred
Z/X Storm
Z Breeze
Z Putt'r
X Challenger

my guess is x is being phased out in favor of ESP. i wouls also venture to guess you'll see an ESP Drone, ESP Venom, and Z tracker go into full production...we'll see....



any word on X plastic avengers?? I love how they beat-in and will hold a straight line forever. If they are being phased out I will have to stock up.



The X Avenger is a Nate Doss signature disc and I doubt that will be going ANYWHERE since its one of his MAIN drivers and he is their MAIN guy!!!

Any news on thier new discs coming out??

Im praying for 3 new Highspeed drivers in the next 6 months!!!

I'll take those three drivers and raise you an ESP APX. I've only been asking for something with that mold for a few years now. But that driver is definitely needed.

BTW, I saw the new sparkle Buzzz SS for next year's AmNat's. Are these things even legal yet?

BTW, I saw the new sparkle Buzzz SS for next year's AmNat's. Are these things even legal yet?



I've been trying to figure this out as well. I'm sure the numbers are there between the ESP run and the sparkle Z run, but I do not know if it has been sent for approval. I love this disc, it flies sweet. It glides for days while still being fairly stable. It reminds me of a slightly more overstable Coyote. It kicks the Glide's butt and should be Discraft's slightly understable-out-of-the-box mid. The plastic is wild too. I would almost call in sparkle flx Z...

I have a bunch myself..the whole point behind me saying this is thats its just a huge mistake. There are several discraft pros that throw them and I know alot of people throughout this region that throw them. I just wonder what Mr. Bennett is going to throw now that they have discontinued his most commonly thrown driver



Geoff has a pretty good stock and I'm sure some weight to throw around in the office if he ever runs out.

I'm guessing that it is falling under the Innova X,L mold type classification. I noticed that the Avenger SS isn't on the approved list either. But I remember at AmNat's this year they wouldn't allow the SL in the tourney since it wasn't approved. I'm confused. Gonna buy some anyway though as I like my Buzzz's understable.

Anyone know anything about Z-Cyclones?

I have a green one that is stampless. I was told it was part of the first runs of Z plastic but I figured I would ask on here. It feels a lot different than the new z cyclones. Its really shiny and the plastic is harder than new ones.

Most of the early stuff is rather soft. The best way to tell is the hotstamp is just a small bar of (close to size 8) font, on one area only. Not the dual larger stamps that are on them today.

If I remember correctly it was awhile until they got around to the Z-Cyclone.

The Z-Cyclone was introduced during the first season of Elite-Z plastic as a tournament fund raiser only. The first event was the 2001 Discraft Great Lakes Open.

What are some of the new discs that are in the works for 2008?

What are some of the new discs that are in the works for 2008?



I tell what I would like to see...a new mold based on the Flash with a .9" wing (same as the Destroyer). I fact, just take a Flash and move the bevel line over. The undercut wing should help keep the weight down.

Run it in ESP and keep it domey.

My newest ESP Flashes are nearly as fast as the Destroyer, so it should be interesting. This goes to shown you do not need a solid flat bottom wing for the disc to be fast.

I Would also love to see a faster more stable Flash!!! These things are SICK FAST and the new domey ESPs are pretty darn stable as well :D:D:D I think they should just make the wing on the Surge and Pulse .9 and the same with the Flash and see what happens!!! Could be 3 SICK new highspeed drivers!!! And then maybe ill be able to throw 400 ft hyzers again :eek: :eek: :eek:

I Would also love to see a faster more stable Flash!!! These things are SICK FAST and the new domey ESPs are pretty darn stable as well :D:D:D



I am stunned at the performance I am getting from the domey ESP Flash.

It would be easier to mold a longer winged Flash than say a Surge with a longer wing. The Flash wing has less material, and I understand that Discraft has had issues in the past with making disc come in at the right weight (of course this might be bull). I also think the Flash is more predictable because it has more of a real notch.

i hope we all realize that anything you do to a disc is going to change its flight pattern, a flash with a huge wing will no longer fly like a flash. it wont automatically make it a really fast flash. it would be nice to have a high speed driver that was similar to a flash, but its not as simple as that. but thats not to say that discraft cant do it ( or arent already), but its a different disc altogether

i hope we all realize that anything you do to a disc is going to change its flight pattern, a flash with a huge wing will no longer fly like a flash. it wont automatically make it a really fast flash. it would be nice to have a high speed driver that was similar to a flash, but its not as simple as that. but thats not to say that discraft cant do it ( or arent already), but its a different disc altogether



Yes that is true I would just love to see what that disc would be like!!! The reason the Surge and Pulse dont arent as fast or as far as the Wraith and TeeRex is because the Wraith and TeeRex have a wider wing and the Destroyer is even wider than that :eek: :eek: :eek:

I am more interested in the possibilities of an esp venom! Wide wing, thin flight plate. And with my experiences with esp plastic, more glide. But I'd still trade any high speed driver in for an esp DRONE!!!

I am more interested in the possibilities of an esp venom! Wide wing, thin flight plate. And with my experiences with esp plastic, more glide. But I'd still trade any high speed driver in for an esp DRONE!!!



BOTH of your Christmas wishes may be coming true in 08 :eek: :eek:

I don't think the venom is coming out in any other plastic!

Have you talked to anyone about that??? Because that is not what a little birdie told me...

Does anyone know why all FLX plastic is flat and overstable except for the XL? Also can anyone actually throw an FLX Predator more than 250 before it drops out of the sky??

I can Tokyo, but it doesn't surprise me that you can't.

I can throw one about 325 which is about 50 less than my Z preds... they are a stable pig!

I can Tokyo, but it doesn't surprise me that you can't.



You can throw 250 wow you must have been working hard to get better. :D

so, two questions.

1. how does the crystal flx plastic compare. (compare a z esp or flx buzz to a crystal flx buzz)

2. whats the deal with the buzz ss? i see that its a fundraiser for the usadgc, so is it going to be approved for pdga use? will it be a regular production disc?

2. whats the deal with the buzz ss? i see that its a fundraiser for the usadgc, so is it going to be approved for pdga use? will it be a regular production disc?



I have been echoing this question for awhile with no discerning response. Man, Dave D. and Dave Mac make Discraft look like do do with their lack of representation here.

Well, Keith M doesn't work for Discraft anymore.

There was rumor of the possibility of an ESP Drone.
Any word yet?

I know Keith doesn't work for Discraft anymore, but there are enough sponsored players posting around here that I figured it was worth a shot.