aha. paid for playing disc golf. that is hilarious. earlier, i thought i was greedy.

KC Journal Day 7:

Lorelei and I played our last round at Worlds this year and she shot an 89 at Waterworks!
She came in second to Gabriella Gray who is also from Georgia giving the state first and second places in her division!

I finished my last round at Swope by starting with a birdie on Hole 7 and 2 ace run birdies on 5 and 6. I started ace running holes from #1 (except 4 which I can't get closer than 50 feet to) as that was the only way to cash :)

We went to the PDGA Awards, Hall of Fame Ceremony and dinner at Grinders, which has EXCELLENT food, but apparently didn't realize that a few hundred Disc Golfers would actually be showing up all at the SAME TIME to eat. :)

Brian Hoeniger accepted and read Brian Sullivans' acceptance speech, Lynne Warren spoke about spreading the joy of Disc Golf friendships and communication, during her speech and Crazy John Brooks said the award was for all the people in Frisbee sports even stating "Power to the people" when holding up his award at the end of his speech / sililoqy. It was great to talk to him before he went on stage and he thanked me afterward for helping to calm his nerves before going on stage. I had thanked him for all he has done for the sport and getting people involved as well as just talking to this new "kid" (35 year old) player in 1996 when I first went to KC which was my second PDGA Event and first out of state Event. He had some kind words for me also.

I also thanked Jack Lowe for the job he's done as well as everything he did to make sure that the Juniors that signed up for the bus transportation had the most fun at Worlds!

We left before the main band came on as Lorelei and Dawn were beat from the round at Waterworks.

Later on are the Finals are at Blue Valley where I'll be helping out in some capacity. I should see all the groups play through, and will hopefully get to congratulate all of the winners as I did the last 2 years.

More tomorrow night,

Keith

Looking back at the last few pages disgusts me, but I wont vent right now. I too wish we seen more photos of all this excitment. How nice would it be to get some live scoring of the finals. Does anybody know if the semis are different than the finals. I think it is an 18 hole round, and then a final 9. Now to get live coverage of that would be awsome.

North Carolina, all over the lead card adv men (boys), and well represented throughout. Matt Keatts, and Lil Wiggs now that would be a battle to the end. You can be assured, Keatts will be a bit at a dissadvantage knowing Lil Wiggs has no end to the energy tank. Both great guys, wish I were there. Good luck Carolina.

Yes Big Wigg, its the Journey, I enjoy playing with the Cupcake, and feel alone when she is not around. it will be missed one day.

Live scoring of the 18-hole semifinals starts at 8am CDT with hole by hole pictures and commentary on the Open Men. PDGA Radio is doing a live online radio broadcast of the finals and live scoring will be available for several divisions this afternoon besides the Open Men and Women.

It seams every year there is at least one North Carolina advanced player in contention. It's obvious that challenging courses will produce quality players... and no surprise this year there are 3 (I'm sure more) NC players that have a chance to win.

But to me, the big story is that there are two Florida players who are well positioned to win Advanced too.

Beckett Carduff is from Ocala, FL and is a super nice guy. He is active with his club and helped produce their recent PDGA event on the Fab Fla Tour. I'm proud of Beckett's top notch play in KC... he's 5 off the pace so don't count him completely out.

David Muntean III, I'm happy to say is right in the mix. Two strokes out... I would love to see him win this lil' tourney. David is a great guy, classy and calm. He's had a solid year on the FFT and recently asked me about a team sponsorship with Discraft. I really hope he wins.... I don't think FL has had an Advanced division World Champion ever. Pro level play is very near David's future.

Good luck to everyone in the Semis!

What time is the FINAL and how many holes is it?
I was never able to see the cut line anywhere, I looked everywhere.

Live scoring of the 18-hole semifinals starts at 8am CDT with hole by hole pictures and commentary on the Open Men. PDGA Radio is doing a live online radio broadcast of the finals and live scoring will be available for several divisions this afternoon besides the Open Men and Women.

Perhaps you can share ,where all this will be on line.

Perhaps you can share ,where all this will be on line.

Been posted several times, but here it is again...Don't expect constant play-by-play, I will have a fixed broadcasting point, and due to the layout of BLUE Valley I will only be able to see a couple holes, I will try the best I can though, that I can guarantee.

Here is the link for Saturday's LIVE show which is scheduled to start at 3pm and run until 6 or 7pm depending on when things wrap up at Blue Valley Park.

http://preview.tinyurl.com/mltnbb (Then Click "Proceed to site")

Or copy/paste this: mms://75.125.198.226:2355

It may prompt you to "Allow" it to run the program, please do so, it's simply a Windows Media Player window which will then stream the show online.

The link won't actually work until right before the show starts on Saturday at 3pm (Central), but make sure to spread it around to anyone who might be interested in listening to it.

Also if you're going to be in KC for the finals at Blue Valley, feel free to find my location stop by and say hi, It'll be a free-form show so who knows what to expect, besides disc golf coverage like it's never been heard before!

Thanks,
Steve Kuzenski
PDGA Radio's Host/Producer

I wonder if Keats has smirked even one grin? I love playing with the guy, I love trying to make him laugh, heck, talk during a round. He is a great guy and has always had game, he just has decided to get serious about it. (great timing Matt)

Wiggins is an am player and he has denied cash and has had MANY opportunities to take it. He will be taking cash very readily soon enough. What is wrong with him being sponsored with merchandise. All am's get some free merchandise along the way, should we be considered pros? I understand what you saying, I just don't think it is an argument that has a case.

Gallops, Friend, Sult playing well too.

Well, NC in the house........finish up fellas!

Let's not forget about Cheebo (aka Brian Baldwin), two from the triad in top 20 (hoping for top 10)!

Looking back at the last few pages disgusts me
Care to expand on that rocky?

It seams every year there is at least one North Carolina advanced player in contention. It's obvious that challenging courses will produce quality players... If you are saying that every year North Carolina has an amateur man in contention because North Carolina has good courses, your premise is entirely unrelated to your conclusion. How do good courses prevent 970 rated amateurs from going pro? Every year North Carolina has good amateurs in contention because every year North Carolina has top amateurs who haven't taken sanctioned cash. I suspect this has more to do with the calibre of the pros down there, and the opportunities to play for unsanctioned cash. I'm not going to single anyone out, but some of these guys only have one or two tournaments in their stats for this year. Do they not play tournaments or are they cashing every weekend at unsanctioned stuff? I don't know. I'm asking. The fact that our top amateurs can cash every weekend and stay amateur is just another reason why we don't have amateurs in this sport.

There is a battle in Open right now....Avery goes up 2 after Josh takes a 6 on what looks like a par 3. c'mon Avery...would love to see Avery get his first world title!

Care to expand on that rocky?

The Gent from Oklahoma. No matter what we say, with his blinders on, he'll never know.

The Gent from Oklahoma. No matter what we say, with his blinders on, he'll never know.

Matt and Josh only 1 stroke back now

First off - These guys playing in am ALL have their amateur status under the rules of the sport. Complaining about that status is NOT there fault - under our rules, whether they are legit or not, they are ams. It really is that simple.

Let's remember the spirit of golf is NEVER forcing someone to play professionally. Bobby Jones won major's in the sport of golf and NEVER turned pro.

So once again, these players, under our rules, are Ams. Blame the PDGA for their standards, not the players playing under the rules! On this board we read about people cheating and people breaking the rules to gain advantage and then we read about people FOLLOWING the rules and we read the same crap. I don't get it....

And as I've posted many times, NC produces talent because of the courses. The competition doesn't hurt (and the unsanctioned cash comment is ridiculous - unsanctioned events, except the homegrown tour, are vastly under attended and overshadowed by sanctioned events here. If you want to point fingers at unsanctioned cash you point to Southern Nationals, not NC.

The courses in NC teach people to throw a disc properly - hyzer pop up. This throw allows the player to throw all types of discs from very flippy to very stable. It is the proper way to throw straight and the way to throw accurate. Our courses are technical and short allowing for players to learn how to scramble and learn how to putt.

It is amazing when I travel to other parts of the country, like worlds, to play. Everyone looks at me like I'm crazy for throwing a straight shot or how do I throw such flippy stuff. It's simple, it's the way I learned to play - and the style we learn here in NC, unlike other styles, can be adjusted to fit any course you step on. The big over the top thumber / spiker hyzer approach would not work here and those players get destroyed in NC. Many top players have struggled here (see Dave Feldberg and Barry Schultz).

So in summary, don't ruin these players, and one case, this kids week. They are playing under the rules we have as a sport and have no control over the fact that the rules are the way they are. Also, take note about our great state - if we CONTINUE to produce talent, both pro AND am, then is it really b/c we bag? There is no such thing as coincidence, as a police officer might say....

Live scoring just changed the GM div. to say "finals", and switched it to 9 holes.
Is this it?

every year North Carolina has top amateurs who haven't taken sanctioned cash. I suspect this has more to do with the calibre of the pros down there, and the opportunities to play for unsanctioned cash.

Bruce,
what exactly are you saying? what is unsanctioned cash?????? are you talking about monthlies? There are alot of wildley unfounded accusations flying around this discussion board right now and i will post on here at length to defend my fellow N.C. Ams if i have to!

I'm not going to single anyone out, but some of these guys only have one or two tournaments in their stats for this year. Do they not play tournaments or are they cashing every weekend at unsanctioned stuff? I don't know. I'm asking. The fact that our top amateurs can cash every weekend and stay amateur is just another reason why we don't have amateurs in this sport.

Top Am's cashing every weekend? You did say you don't know and are asking so i'll answer. No there is not alot of unsanctioned stuff in N.C. we have a small unsanctioned series called the home grown tour that travels to back yard courses accross the sate. there are 13 or 14 events a year (last sunday of the month and a few others sprinkled in) Keatts may have played 1 or 2 of these in the last few years but probably didn't cash. N.C. has a sanctioned event pretty much ever weekend and Keatts and Wiggins play alot.

I am not going to include David in this bacause plain and simnple a 14 year old BOY should not fill any preasure to turn Pro until he is an adult. as for Matt look at his stats. last year this time he was a 950 rated golfer. that is am as am gets. Every Am should have his chance to compete for a world title. it happend last year qith Jeremy Koling and it looks like it ia happening again. the classic case of hitting your stride and getting good quick. Matt has done it right as did Jeremy. he was an am at the beginning of the year..caught fire jumped up his rating while waiting for worlds and declined cash until it was his time time to go to worlds.

N.C. is breading some good golfers but it is doing it right. it does not deserve All this Hate.

i look forward to your response Bruce. in the past i have enjoyed and aggreed with alot of your post.

Matt and Josh only 1 stroke back now

Thanks Rocky

Avery by 2 now.....wow what a battle. wish i was there

Live scoring just changed the GM div. to say "finals", and switched it to 9 holes.
Is this it?

Grandmasters are playing Semifinals right now at Rosedale. Please ignore previous weirdness. :)

whew! thanks, jeffrey.

i don't think anyone has been hating on any players. people have been pointing out the lack of credibility that disc golf's "am" and "pro" distinctions carry. they're playing within the rules, good luck to them all.

these NC boys sure have been getting defensive for some reason. i wouldn't have noticed/cared where the top "ams" were from if they hadn't been constantly pointing it out.

Is Jim gonna pull it off?

i hope so. he seems to do his best in the clutch.

Look, the way you win an amateur PDGA World or National Championship is either (a) the North Carolina way, you get really good and don't go pro, or (b) the Michigan way, you get good, go pro, cash a lot, and then get your am back! 970 rated players from Illinois can't win at Am Worlds because they went pro three years ago.

Here's a list of Illinois' top amateur talent

<TABLE cellPadding=3 border=0 25px><TBODY><TR><TD>Brad Seegert (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=29924)</TD><TD>29924</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>979 </TD><TD>17 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Randy Moore (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=30974)</TD><TD>30974</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>979 </TD><TD>11 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Ben Douglas (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=33287)</TD><TD>33287</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>978 </TD><TD>44 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Todd Fanning (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=24707)</TD><TD>24707</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>977 </TD><TD>40 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Chase Roberts (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=20460)</TD><TD>20460</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>977 </TD><TD>42 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>John Hoffmann (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=27487)</TD><TD>27487</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>975 </TD><TD>23 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Clark Wright (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=31256)</TD><TD>31256</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>974 </TD><TD>16 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Shawn E. Harmon (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=5956)</TD><TD>5956</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>974 </TD><TD>33 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Dana Vicich (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=26228)</TD><TD>26228</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>970 </TD><TD>31 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Roger Reyes (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=14240)</TD><TD>14240</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>969 </TD><TD>19 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Grant Lonie (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=33747)</TD><TD>33747</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>969 </TD><TD>44 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Sean Butler (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=22076)</TD><TD>22076</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>968 </TD><TD>39 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Except they are all pro because Illinois amateurs don't play am until they are rated 980 or 990. They mostly go pro around 950 to 960.

I'm not calling anyone a bagger. I'm just saying that only reason why North Carolina is dominating in Advanced is because North Carolina dominates in advanced amateurs who don't go pro.

Anyone can dominate in an amateur division if they play in an amateur division where most of the players are 20 ratings points below them. I hope to do that next year in Am Grand and, who knows, maybe Terry will go dominate in Am Senior again. But it won't be because Michigan produces amazing old guy amateur talent. It will just be because we've never gone pro.

Meanwhile, Val is tearing it up and the Women's Championship is over with 14 holes to play. Des has lost six throws to Val this round.

speaking of all these scared to go pro NC Boys....anyone know what is going on with them?

Well Jim didn't win it. I bet that he went for it on the last hole and went ob...

I'm the one noticing the phenomenon and you're the one putting a negative characterization on it. Just so we're all clear here. To me it is a curious local cultural thing that apparently does not extend into the old guy culture because I'm not seeing Am GrandMasters dominated by North Carolina. To you it is bagging or fear. Whatever. Just so we're clear, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying it's there, whatever the reason.

Well Jim didn't win it. I bet that he went for it on the last hole and went ob...

it ain't over yet! that's the semis according to jeffrey. they're on the 10th.

on the live scoring it says finalls, but all the better that they play 18

Josh Anthon got that 6 and then he got seven birdies on the next nine holes to take the lead back.

Avery down 1 now, 2 holes left

I'm the one noticing the phenomenon and you're the one putting a negative characterization on it. Just so we're all clear here. To me it is a curious local cultural thing that apparently does not extend into the old guy culture because I'm not seeing Am GrandMasters dominated by North Carolina. To you it is bagging or fear. Whatever. Just so we're clear, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying it's there, whatever the reason.

Maybe they like it in that division?

I never was an amateur btw.

its funny to me that people think im bashing on someone..i had questions about the sponsorship of ams..still no-one has answered the incentive question?..and if you think ganging up on an Okie will do any good..check the tulsa thread..we bash each other for practice.
heres my first post bashing wiggins.."im glad he can play so well at an early age and from what i hear hes a great young-adult i dont want this to seem like im picking on him but in my eyes sponsership is for pros "....oooooo i have an opinion..start bashing

im sure im not the only one that thinks an amateur being given incentives to win /place/w/e is not the same as just a normal sponsorship.this quote of big wig leads me to believe there are incentives....
"He has never received cash from Innova for personal achievements."
am i the only one that sees this implies he receives "something" for personal achievements.not cash but something of cash value?
what if they gave him a car,a house,5 gold bars,diamonds,stocks,oooops still no cash all good...where do you draw the line?

Please ignore: "Grandmasters - Finals" on the live scoring window!

They are playing Semifinals right now and will play a 9-hole 4,193' Finals layout at Blue Valley later today!

Avery down 1 now, 2 holes left

OOPS, just in Josh bogeys, Avery birdey hole 17. Avery back up 1

OOPS, just in Josh bogeys, Avery birdey hole 17. Avery back up 1And, ten holes to go. they have a Final Nine.

these NC boys sure have been getting defensive for some reason. i wouldn't have noticed/cared where the top "ams" were from if they hadn't been constantly pointing it out.
That's Hilarious

Maybe they like it in that division?

I never was an amateur btw.And I never was a pro! :D

all the baggin talk YET wiggins, who can play under 16 or under 19, is playing advanced MEN.

Yet I've yet to hear a word about the 1000 rated player playing under 16....

its funny to me that people think im bashing on someone..i had questions about the sponsorship of ams..still no-one has answered the incentive question?..and if you think ganging up on an Okie will do any good..check the tulsa thread..we bash each other for practice.
heres my first post bashing wiggins.."im glad he can play so well at an early age and from what i hear hes a great young-adult i dont want this to seem like im picking on him but in my eyes sponsership is for pros "....oooooo i have an opinion..start bashing

im sure im not the only one that thinks an amateur being given incentives to win /place/w/e is not the same as just a normal sponsorship.this quote of big wig leads me to believe there are incentives....
"He has never received cash from Innova for personal achievements."
am i the only one that sees this implies he receives "something" for personal achievements.not cash but something of cash value?
what if they gave him a car,a house,5 gold bars,diamonds,stocks,oooops still no cash all good...where do you draw the line?

who cares if there are incentives... if that is your concern then start a thread to talk about it. if 'bagging' is a concern then start a thread to talk about it. if your concern is 'this is a message board not a blog' then start a thread on that.

lets try to get back to worlds talk here

Go Kinkel, Wiggins & Keatts!!!

and I really would like to see a Jenkin's sweep!!!

what if they gave him a car,a house,5 gold bars,diamonds,stocks,oooops still no cash all good...where do you draw the line?

I hope our sport gets big enough to where we would have to deal with that.

Has anyone heard any scores from the Am divisions this moring?

And I never was a pro! :D
When I started (1985) it was all one division....what did I know?
As long as you have fun,who cares where you play.....

Look, the way you win an amateur PDGA World or National Championship is either (a) the North Carolina way, you get really good and don't go pro, or (b) the Michigan way, you get good, go pro, cash a lot, and then get your am back! 970 rated players from Illinois can't win at Am Worlds because they went pro three years ago.

Here's a list of Illinois' top amateur talent

<TABLE cellPadding=3 border=0 25px><TBODY><TR><TD>Brad Seegert (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=29924)</TD><TD>29924</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>979 </TD><TD>17 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Randy Moore (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=30974)</TD><TD>30974</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>979 </TD><TD>11 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Ben Douglas (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=33287)</TD><TD>33287</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>978 </TD><TD>44 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Todd Fanning (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=24707)</TD><TD>24707</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>977 </TD><TD>40 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Chase Roberts (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=20460)</TD><TD>20460</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>977 </TD><TD>42 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>John Hoffmann (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=27487)</TD><TD>27487</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>975 </TD><TD>23 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Clark Wright (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=31256)</TD><TD>31256</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>974 </TD><TD>16 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Shawn E. Harmon (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=5956)</TD><TD>5956</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>974 </TD><TD>33 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Dana Vicich (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=26228)</TD><TD>26228</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>970 </TD><TD>31 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Roger Reyes (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=14240)</TD><TD>14240</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>969 </TD><TD>19 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Grant Lonie (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=33747)</TD><TD>33747</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>969 </TD><TD>44 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR><TR><TD>Sean Butler (http://www.pdga.com/player-stats?PDGANum=22076)</TD><TD>22076</TD><TD>IL </TD><TD>USA </TD><TD>968 </TD><TD>39 </TD><TD>M Pro</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Except they are all pro because Illinois amateurs don't play am until they are rated 980 or 990. They mostly go pro around 950 to 960.

I'm not calling anyone a bagger. I'm just saying that only reason why North Carolina is dominating in Advanced is because North Carolina dominates in advanced amateurs who don't go pro.

Anyone can dominate in an amateur division if they play in an amateur division where most of the players are 20 ratings points below them. I hope to do that next year in Am Grand and, who knows, maybe Terry will go dominate in Am Senior again. But it won't be because Michigan produces amazing old guy amateur talent. It will just be because we've never gone pro.
Put whatever spin u want. matt and david where both 950 rated at the begining of the year. played pro and declined cash to go to worlds and then Matt i am sure as Jeremy did will play open and except as soon as this tournament is done so he could say he had his chance to be champ. there is nothing wrong with the way we do it here in N.C. i could see all of your points if you had a player playing in mulitiple am champs. but plain and simple that is not how we do it down here. And i have to aggree with MTL's post. David could have played age protected this year but didn't.....what a bagger

all the baggin talk YET wiggins, who can play under 16 or under 19, is playing advanced MEN.

Yet I've yet to hear a word about the 1000 rated player playing under 16....

Why isn't Wiggins playing <16 then?

That's where he belongs and would have had the most competition.

However, let's not argue about am/pro, but enjoy this worlds with a close race in open.

Avery up by 2 going into the shootout, they said they will have more divisions on live scoring. Hope advance men is one of them

And I never was a pro! :D

Wow! Finally an accurate statement!

anyone know 'Slim Belcher'? i haven't checked past years but it seems pretty impressive/amazing to have someone who just joined playing at that level (unless he just never registered in the past and has been playing for a little while).

Carolina also has another youngster who played intermediate at Mid Carolina Chiro who was prettttty impressive, and Lil Cogg isn't far back. Thery'e just multiplying

Why isn't Wiggins playing <16 then?

That's where he belongs and would have had the most competition.

However, let's not argue about am/pro, but enjoy this worlds with a close race in open.

I also don't understand why Oscar is playing in the <16 division.
He got 2nd in the Open in Stockholm a month ago?
And also the highest rated Am player of them all with his rating of 1000

Talking with Dave Wiggins, Sr.

Matt Keatts leads by 3 over Dave Wiggins Jr. and David Muntean.

He also said Blaine fell off the lead group.

Scott Ryther fills out the final 9

Let's go Keatts and Wiggins!

Just got the word, Keatts by three with only the finals left. They start at 2:00. Bring it Home Keatter!!

Wat to go David, and Matt

I also don't understand why Oscar is playing in the <16 division.
He got 2nd in the Open in Stockholm a month ago?
And also the highest rated Am player of them all with his rating of 1000

maybe because he's 15 or 16 and really wanted a World Title before moving up... he's young... maybe he'll be 1010 and trying for Am Worlds next year. Good for him if thats what he wants before he gets older and decides to swim with the big fish where evidently you need to shoot 1050 rated every round to win.

anyone know 'Slim Belcher'? i haven't checked past years but it seems pretty impressive/amazing to have someone who just joined playing at that level (unless he just never registered in the past and has been playing for a little while).

He moved to KC from California about 3 months ago. No, Slim hasn't been playing competitively long, but played the game for a long time in Cali. He's got a GIANT epic thumber and a lot of natural athletic ability that let's him throw a backhand far. A thumber has a lot of potential to tear up some of the Advanced courses.

in other worlds related news, local golfer shawn johnson won the DGA fundraiser disc basket raffle. there had been a local fundraising effort to buy new permanent baskets for all of the C positions at patapsco DGC. shawn has donated the DGA baskets. already a world class facility, the permanent c pins will make patapsco one of the best. new teepads are almost already finished as well.

How many make the finals in each division? I haven't had any luck finding the information online. I assume top 4 but how are the ties handled?

He moved to KC from California about 3 months ago. No, Slim hasn't been playing competitively long, but played the game for a long time in Cali. He's got a GIANT epic thumber and a lot of natural athletic ability that let's him throw a backhand far. A thumber has a lot of potential to tear up some of the Advanced courses.

awesome... crazy coming out party for him then finishing so high up!

and with the thumber comment you're really making me wish I made it to worlds this year... someday... someday

How many make the finals in each division? I haven't had any luck finding the information online. I assume top 4 but how are the ties handled?

in the past they have played off to break ties, anthon missed the finals in highbridge by getting knocked out in a playoff and apparently threw a fit.

awesome... crazy coming out party for him then finishing so high up!

and with the thumber comment you're really making me wish I made it to worlds this year... someday... someday

Stack, have you ever thrown a thumber,lol, go wiggins and keatts. Mini Thumber taught Lil Wig how to throw thumber.

Five would have been taken into the Finals this year if two tied for 4th. But no ties this year for Finals.

Thanks, I didn't know if it would have been a sudden death tie breaker or a 3-hole cumulative set up. I guess it's irrelevant now.

One throw separates first from second in Advanced Women. Now that Paige is out of it, Go, Becca!

Well grease me up and take me for a spin. The advanced women get live scoring for their final nine.

Well grease me up and take me for a spin. The advanced women get live scoring for their final nine.

and avd men, this is gonna be awsome

and avd men, this is gonna be awsome
http://www.pdga.com/announcements/worlds-finals-live-scoring


where is the link to the actual live scoring?

they should have already tee'd off @ 3pm EST correct?

Go Phil!!!
Can Brad make it a 1-2 finish for team GEORGIA?!!

http://www.pdga.com/announcements/worlds-finals-live-scoring

Stack, go to pdga schedule, click on pro worlds at kc, click on live scoring


where is the link to the actual live scoring?

they should have already tee'd off @ 3pm EST correct?

, it has adv men and women

If you go to the PDGA Tour drop down menu, hover, click on schedule, click on the cup next to pro worlds, that page has a link to live scoring.

Is anyone else listening to the PDGA Radio live broadcast? It's pretty distorted on my computer, and I have a very high-speed connection.

yeah theo, it's distorted, tough to listen to. commercials too...



why no ratings for the semis? sorry if already asked...

Yeah; The sound quality is poor at best.

I couldn't get it to play. I'm listening to Sara Groves. The top two Advanced Women are tied. On the break between semis and finals I cut the grass, delivered a side job and collected $300. I just threw that in because the last two sentences seem to be of about equal importance to everyone else watching live scoring. :D

One thing is for sure, we'll have a new Open World Champ this year. None of the finalists have a title yet

Btw, first major ever for Climo where he finishes out of top ten...

Maureen birdies and takes the lead with one to play.

Come on MO. NC has yet to have a Women's advanced world champion.

Why do I feel like Climo is still the best?

of course the live scoring link for the Ams would be under the pro score sheet... why wouldn't i think to look there ;)

Mo wins! Another title for NC! and with 2 holes left and Keatts up by 6 i'm thinking its a safe bet to say congrats to him as well!!!

pdga radio sounds really bad. It is very hard to putt up with!

On the break between semis and finals I cut the grass, :D


push or riding?

Why do I feel like Climo is still the best?

Why do I feel that if Climo decided to play masters at Worlds, he could easily add another 10 world championships to his resume.

push or riding?48 inch deck walk behind. But I only cut the front and back. The way back was already cut.

Yeah, but Phil would have gave him a run this year

Somebody get the word to Kuzenski to back off of the mic. That's what is causing all the distortion.

please I dont know how much longer I can take this!!!!!!!!!!!!

CONGRATS VAL ON THE THREE-PEAT !!

des with three 2nds in a row after her win in augusta, nice shooting !




quote "Why do I feel that if Climo decided to play masters at Worlds, he could easily add another 10 world championships to his resume. "


you bite your tongue rickb !! :)

Alright thats all I can take of the crappy radio sound/coverage! plus what is the point of live radio without play by play? On the other hand I have listened to every PDGA radio broadcast....... just not a fan of the way this is being played out!

Josh within 1, go Avery!

Somebody get the word to Kuzenski to back off of the mic. That's what is causing all the distortion.

No doubt...It's painfull.:confused:

sound input is wayyy too high on the radio broadcast

Does anyone know how to get a hold of this guy? I want to listen but it's like having wasps shoved in my ears. Back off guy...:mad:

Avery up by 3 after an eagle!

CONGRATULATIONS to Phil Arthur!!!!!!

Carolina also has another youngster who played intermediate at Mid Carolina Chiro who was prettttty impressive, and Lil Cogg isn't far back. Thery'e just multiplyingHighest rated player in the PDGA? An am from North Carolina! :D

Josh within one again, come on Avery!

Josh makes it four in a row to tie Avery.

Tied up with 2 to go.

Holy. Freakin. Crap.

They really need live video..

Tied before last hole. Will Josh birdie his 6th hole in a row to take the title?

MAJOR drama!!!!!

Playoff!!!!!!

Tie?

Wow.. Playoff

Congrats Matto on 3rd place finish.. way to represent the SN!

Back to hole one it seems like.

I wonder if they're splitting the cash and just playing for the title.

no way.play to win it all 4 sure

In the playoff, Anthon and Jenkins both pushed the 803' Finals hole#1 with a par 4.

On to Finals hole#2.

On to second playoff hole.

wow, Cale had a bad hole!

On to third.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3-eavMSBnk

PLAYOFFS?!

discraft plastic doesn't fly that far....

On to third.

I hope somebody is filming this and put it online

I hope somebody is filming this and put it online

So do I.

On to the fourth!

more info here http://twitpic.com/cfr61

click on the pdga worlds link on there to go to the next picture link

On to hole five, this is where Josh had his birdie streak.

Man, we have a playoff going on for the Worlds Championship and there isn't a live feed?

This is INTENSE!

Avery wins!

Avery wins.... Jenkins sweep!!!!

wonder what disc he'll get his name on?

congrats to the new champ; Avery Jenkins !!!!!
wooohooo

I would like to address several things mention on this thread. If you don't want to read it, I get it. Here we go.

The advanced division is the highest division for players who have not accepted cash at PDGA events. It is not ratings based. It's not reasonable to expect players to "move" up merely because they play well. Tiger owned the USGA Am events for years playing in all the "age" protected divisions. He played in several PGA events long before he ever actually turned pro. There are multiple examples of players playing their entire golf careers as amateurs.

IMO, there are many reasons for the success of NC players.

1. From my experience, players progress quickly in this sport to a certain level (950-980 rating). Progressing to a 1000 player from this level (950-980) may take some time even for the best players (Jeremy Koling is a great example). Not really NC specific, but a good explanation none the less for why a player could seem to be "too good" for the advanced field.

2. In NC (like many places around the country), the competition at PDGA events borders on the insane. Playing good comp. week in and week out makes the player tougher mentally. Literally, you can play a competitive, tournament style event every weekend from actual PDGA events to local singles in NC - and I mean every weekend!

3. NC is blessed with incredible talents like Stan McDaniel, Schwebbie & Michael Jo whom absolutely go out of their way to cultivate players. Everyone will attest to their openess to play with ANYONE and have fun doing it. JJ, Smalls, Big Jerm, Buddy Tritt, Matt Keats, Lil Wig, Blaine Kinkel all will tell you how much these men have helped them to become much better players.

4. Stan McDaniel is a huge force in this state. First, he is an incredible ambassador of the game. Time and time again, I've seen Xelum spend an hour showing a novice how to throw after playing a round. Many times, the person has no idea a HOF is showing him the ropes. Second, his courses are delicious, sadistic tracks that leave you bleeding, screaming and smiling. His passion for course design has led to brilliant, subtle and not so sublte holes. His courses often demand the players' utmost focus and expertise to execute.

5. Buddy, Big Jerm, Keats, et al played Open denying cash (Buddy and Big Jerm did it mostly prior to the rule change that allowed players to accept merch in lieu of cash thereby "donating" just for the learning experience of playing better comp.) There was little "bagging" going on.

So what do I mean by all of this? IMO, most players want to win a World title. Jackie Smalls, Big Jerm, Matt Keats all attended one am Worlds - the one they won. It's not like they have been trying for multiple years bagging their way advanced fields. We are fortunate to have a very strong DG community in NC. The local clubs promote DG tounies, and cultivate new players with weekly dubs and singles. Heck, the Charlotte weekly singles event rivals many C tiers for the quality of competition. Here in Charlotte, we are blessed with a strong club, an excellent relationship to park & rec(thanks in great part to another HOF Alan Beaver), perfect topography for DG and a designer that can maximize the terrain, powerful competition, and excellent comradery. We are proud (and you would be too) of our champions. Sometimes it comes across the wrong way apparently, but we mean no harm. I think we just want to show our support and pride.

Finally, NO WAY does Lil Wig receive any "compensation" from his sponsors for wins (except mayble some ice cream from Dad). It is my understading, sponsored ams from Innova and Discraft receive an allotment annually and the option to purchase at cost above their allotment.

I know it's long and rambly, but I couldn't stand the misunderstandings. I hope this clears it up.:)

Congrats to Avery!

and....David and Avery are roommates.....now THAT is crazy!

Team GEORGIA finishes 1st AND 2nd in Pro Masters!!
Way to go Phil and Brad. We be proud!

TREMENDOUS thanks to David Gentry and Addie Isbell for dealing with all the obstacles and providing us all with the coverage. WELL DONE!!

Guess you can go to sleep now Tuur.

i would say that for awhile now avery jenkins has been the people's champ. now, he's the world's champ. as a fan, that was great golf to follow. pdga dvd should use this as a springboard to earn merit for televised coverage. way to go from michigan jenkins's.

Guess you can go to sleep now Tuur.

Got a tournament in a few hours.....:-)

I would like to address several things mention on this thread. If you don't want to read it, I get it. Here we go.

Finally, NO WAY does Lil Wig receive any "compensation" from his sponsors for wins (except mayble some ice cream from Dad). It is my understading, sponsored ams from Innova and Discraft receive an allotment annually and the option to purchase at cost above their allotment.

I know it's long and rambly, but I couldn't stand the misunderstandings. I hope this clears it up.:)

ty for this information..it was always my intention to see if there were incentives which thanks to you i now know there are not..congrats to all the world champs..nice 2nd place finish for lil wig definately the youngest to accomplish this feet..special shout out to Joe Rotan advanced master world champ from okieland

Where can I find the PDGA awards winners?

WTG to both Avery and Valerie Jenkins. it felt due and now it's true. great coverage and another great Worlds is in the books.

snippity snip

Great read.

I started playing disc golf before there were many organized events in Va. My solution was to go to NC almost every weekend for an event. They have had a points series and an organized tournament schedule since way before I learned the game. It helped me to learn the game, the rules and how events should be run. NC has many great amateur players mainly because of the foundation that was built many years ago.

Team GEORGIA finishes 1st AND 2nd in Pro Masters!!
Way to go Phil and Brad. We be proud!


Way to go Keats & Lil Wiggie finishing 1st AND 2nd in Advanced!
So that is Justin Jernigan, Jackie Schmalls,Jeremy Kolling & now Matt Keats!
What is that 4 out of the last like 7 years?
RESPECT!
NC does it BIG!!!!!!

Way to go Keats & Lil Wiggie finishing 1st AND 2nd in Advanced!
So that is Justin Jernigan, Jackie Schmalls,Jeremy Kolling & now Matt Keats!
What is that 4 out of the last like 7 years?
RESPECT!
NC does it BIG!!!!!!
Did you forget about David "Wheetie" French from Charlotte! He won in Miami in 2002. Make it 5 out of 8 years! Since 2001 someone has been on the lead card for the final 9 every year except 2003 (the last time it was in KC). And not to mention this is the 2nd time NC went Back to Back. But don't forget the most important thing ya'll! How bout Mo Higgins! What a comeback!

Way to go Keats & Lil Wiggie finishing 1st AND 2nd in Advanced!
So that is Justin Jernigan, Jackie Schmalls,Jeremy Kolling & now Matt Keats!
What is that 4 out of the last like 7 years?
RESPECT!
NC does it BIG!!!!!!

and David 'Wheetie' French from Charlotte a year or 2 before Justin

Congrats Avery. May you sleep well the next few nights.
Good run Josh A. Maybe California will get it next time.

How awesome is the competition these days? Pretty awesome if
you ask me.

925 PM CDT - Just finished having dinner in my hotel room. Left Blue Valley at 630 PM, awards ceremony still going on. It is my opinion that the information that you had available to you here was comparable to the information we had as spectators at Blue Valley. I say that not knowing exactly how the live feed went, but there was nothing at tourney sites indicating scores of the groups out on the course - you had to be following the division you were interested in and look at the scoreboard carried there to see how the finalists were faring. This is not a criticism of the WDGC staff, since I have not seen any other WDGC where you could see how the groups were faring out on the course. From what I read here, you had that advantage.

I didn't see everything, of course, but does anyone have any general questions they would like to ask of a tournament competitor and non-semifinal participant?

Bill, how big was the crowd for the finals?

After seeing how the usdgc and vibram open do their coverage i have to say this was very poor.........step it up!!

NC's run of top 30 at am worlds....

2002
David "Wheetie" French - 1st
Paul Piper - 3rd
Rob Leder - 12th
Scotty Faison - 13th
Mike Bonkoski - 23rd
Justin Jablonski - 27th

2003
OOPS!!

2004
Justin "JJ" Jernigan - 1st
Robert "MTL" Leonard - 26th

2005
Jack Schmalfeld - 1st
Eddie Ogburn - 4th
Chad Kawaminami - 12th

2006
Jeb Bryant - 4th

2007
Henry Childress - 6th
Patrick Byrd - 7th

2008
Jeremy Koling - 1st
Buddy Tritt - 4th

2009
Matt Keatts - 1st
David Wiggins, Jr - 2nd
Brian "Cheebo" Baldwin - 21st

Not to mention Stewart Krall has won an advanced grandmasters title, Marueen Higgins won adv. women this year, and we have had multiple world titles with Andrew Coggin and Wiggins, Jr.

Throw in some top 4 masters with Larry Leonard and Brian McRee, 2 top 10s from Schwebby and another from Walt Haney in open, and it's safe to say NC has the best talent on this planet.

Well if you're gonna talk world champs from NC- you can't leave out 3x masters champ Stan McDaniel.

Bill, how big was the crowd for the finals?

The crowd was huge following the last few groups - I would say easily around 750-1000 people including hundreds that were NOT Worlds competitors! :)

NC's run of top 30 at am worlds....

2002
David "Wheetie" French - 1st
Paul Piper - 3rd
Rob Leder - 12th
Scotty Faison - 13th
Mike Bonkoski - 23rd
Justin Jablonski - 27th

2003
OOPS!!

2004
Justin "JJ" Jernigan - 1st
Robert "MTL" Leonard - 26th

2005
Jack Schmalfeld - 1st
Eddie Ogburn - 4th
Chad Kawaminami - 12th

2006
Jeb Bryant - 4th

2007
Henry Childress - 6th
Patrick Byrd - 7th

2008
Jeremy Koling - 1st
Buddy Tritt - 4th

2009
Matt Keatts - 1st
David Wiggins, Jr - 2nd
Brian "Cheebo" Baldwin - 21st

Not to mention Stewart Krall has won an advanced grandmasters title, Marueen Higgins won adv. women this year, and we have had multiple world titles with Andrew Coggin and Wiggins, Jr.

Throw in some top 4 masters with Larry Leonard and Brian McRee, 2 top 10s from Schwebby and another from Walt Haney in open, and it's safe to say NC has the best talent on this planet.

um... cough... Stan... cough ;)

edit: hong kong phooey beat me to this post

Worlds Journal Day 8: Last entry from Kansas City.

First off a HUGE thanks to Addie Isbell (PDGA Memberships Manager) for the way she covered the mixup with some of the Junior Divisions Awards! It was very much appreciated by ALL the families involved.

Now on to the day -
Today we got up and headed to Blue Valley for the finals for most of the divisions being contested this year. It started at 10:30 AM and used holes 1,2, and 3 of the course used during competition - then 5 holes that were better left undescribed as this is a family message board - and ended on a hole that was in a good viewing area, but unfortunately for the earlier playing groups also crossed the park entrance road which created several issues with cars driving through the "fairway" and it also played differently for the different divisions with the road NOT being OB for groups until the last 4 Pro groups starting with the Grandmaster pros.
It was a beautiful day after the clouds cleared with a nice breeze of 10-15 MPH for most of the day.
I helped direct traffic around the confluence of holes 4,5, and 6 for several of the early groups keeping the players headed in the right direction as well as keeping the spectators from hanging out near the temp basket. Then as the Pros started I watched them following them on 1 then 3,4,5 and 6 then went to watch the next group tee off on 1 before going back to watch the groups come in on 9 so I could have them all sign the "Shirt of Champions". tm

It was great watching Val win her 3rd title and then Phil Arthur wins Masters before the thrilling 14 hole "final 9" between Avery and Josh Anthon which I thought would end on the 9th hole when Josh who teed first was 80 feet out, and when Matt Orum had just thrown his disc 8 feet PAST the basket myself and the entire gallery thought that Avery would do something similar and that would be it - but he was about 55 short and they both got 3's and continued back to hole 1. Then on Hole 5 the second time around, Avery put his drive 24 feet away and Josh was about 60 right. when he missed the putt, Avery put his in and won his first title. He was then almost tackled by Val as she rushed up the hill to give him a big hug.

The awards ceremony covered the top 3-5 players from Every division with the players going up on stage receiving their trophies and making their acceptance speeches. (there was probably 60% that actually stuck around to accept)
One of the highlights which will probably show up on YouTube was that the only juggler of the award winners dropped his GLASS trophy breaking it in several pieces. (sorry Hos :) - I couldn't resist, and it actually came in handy to use for reinacting the missed trophy presentations)
Crazy John then came up to handle the rest of the presentations which re-engergized the crowd - most of whom had been following groups up and down hills for several hours and were exhausted.

Around 8PM Central Time everything was finished and the final cleanup details started taking place, and by 9PM most everyone had driven out of the park with dreams of next year, joys of accomplishments of this year, or thoughts of what could have been.

No matter which group you belonged to, one thing is certain - no one will forget the Kansas City 2009 PDGA Disc Golf Worlds.

Keith Johnson
PDGA # 10444 signing off from KC where my flight leaves in 7 hours.

Just got home after a 7 hour drive and then finishing up the HOF show, I did want to quickly address the comments about the LIVE PDGA Radio broadcast from Saturday.
I had thought it went relatively well for what I had to work with, however It sounds like some people had issues with it, whether it was me or the server I'll figure out and correct in the future when it (hopefully) gets done again. I have yet to listen back to it. However, My main problem from the beginning was the layout of the park and the final 9 course itself along with the need to cover all (or at least most divisions), I also only had about 5-7 days to plan and get everything together and down there (on a limited budget), and then the playoff was just plain unlucky as it meant I couldn't tell anything that was going on during it plus the crowd and players were all over the course and therefore I never got the post-round interviews like I wanted with Avery and Val, and others and I had no access to the internet which meant no scores/leaderboards.live scoring for me at all. My bad, now I know for next time I'll have to a get a wireless internet-laptop card, and battery operated mixer or "broadcast cart" with access to electricity (and make sure my co-host shows up!)
No excuses, just a learning process, hope you enjoyed what you could, something is (almost) always better than nothing, I'll have more after I get some sleep, congrats Avery, Val, and all the other 2009 World Champs!

Please send me any/all comments pros & cons you may have had to [email protected]

Thanks,
Steve Kuzenski

Way to go Team Jenkins!!!

Nice shooting Matty O!!

Glad to see Josh Anthon has made a full recovery from his bicycle accident at the PFDO a few years back. That was crazy to watch Josh!!!

NC's run of top 30 at am worlds....

2002
David "Wheetie" French - 1st
Paul Piper - 3rd
Rob Leder - 12th
Scotty Faison - 13th
Mike Bonkoski - 23rd
Justin Jablonski - 27th

2003
OOPS!!

2004
Justin "JJ" Jernigan - 1st
Robert "MTL" Leonard - 26th

2005
Jack Schmalfeld - 1st
Eddie Ogburn - 4th
Chad Kawaminami - 12th

2006
Jeb Bryant - 4th

2007
Henry Childress - 6th
Patrick Byrd - 7th

2008
Jeremy Koling - 1st
Buddy Tritt - 4th

2009
Matt Keatts - 1st
David Wiggins, Jr - 2nd
Brian "Cheebo" Baldwin - 21st

Not to mention Stewart Krall has won an advanced grandmasters title, Marueen Higgins won adv. women this year, and we have had multiple world titles with Andrew Coggin and Wiggins, Jr.

Throw in some top 4 masters with Larry Leonard and Brian McRee, 2 top 10s from Schwebby and another from Walt Haney in open, and it's safe to say NC has the best talent on this planet.

I think Dawn may have won U16 women in 2007, 2008

What happened to Birgitta? She doesn't have a score for the final 9? Did she get hurt?

The doubles write-up is one of the worst I have ever read! EMac and Liz WON the world title! Who cares what the PDGAs poster boy and his partner did, they lost! The entire write-up is about Dave and Melody and how they played and had a bad spit on the last hole to cost them the win. Lets talk a little bit about how EMac and Liz made great drives and excellent putts to make the come from behind win.


Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.

Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.

I'm certainly ready for that day Smitty.

The doubles write-up is one of the worst I have ever read! EMac and Liz WON the world title! Who cares what the PDGAs poster boy and his partner did, they lost! The entire write-up is about Dave and Melody and how they played and had a bad spit on the last hole to cost them the win. Lets talk a little bit about how EMac and Liz made great drives and excellent putts to make the come from behind win.


Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.


Turnover...turnover

Get OB....OB


Good stuff Smitty

smitty, you have a link to the doubles write-up?

and mtl, this had me cracking up... good thing you didn't just say top 25.. ;)


NC's run of top 30 at am worlds....

2004
Justin "JJ" Jernigan - 1st
Robert "MTL" Leonard - 26th


north carolinians are some proud folk, ain't they?

Just got caught up on the message boards. Big congrats to Matt Keats Am World Champ who was unbeatable when it counted. Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy as they would say. Also a big thanks from me and David Jr. to all our fellow North Carolinians for all their help and support in the past through this tournament and right up to their responses on this message board.

I gotta say, there certainly are some ignorant and spitefully insinuating comments going on here - more than I recall in the past. Another example of no matter what you do, someone is gonna find fault. I've tried at times to post some supportive insights, answer some fair questions, etc. Maybe I will some in the future, who knows. Sometimes it all seems hopelessly juvenile (even among those who are certainly not juveniles) and a waste of time. I've really not got much stomach for that. I'm feeling a bit fatigued by it all right now, so those of you who desire to point out how I'm wrong, feel free. I'm off of here for awhile.

One final comment, NC amateur disc golf is better than most other places simply because the sport is more developed here and has a longer history here than most places. For a long time, stock car racing was dominated by southeasterners for the same reason. Innova located just outside Charlotte and all the people associated with them are very supportive not to mention many others statewide esp in the Raleigh and Eastern NC areas. The state is not that big in its densely populated areas so all the good players (and there are many) show up at most events meaning even "C" tier events typically have 5 or more players rated over 1000. There are tournaments every week and almost all fill by pre-registration. The result of all this is that players of every level - rec to advanced, even to pro are forced to play better just to hold their own. Right now development of the sport is still spotty across the country, but improving. I'm looking forward to the day when the sport is developed nationwide as well as it is in NC. That would really be something. At that point, I bet NC's apparent advantage in the Am ranks would disappear. Then again, I could be wrong. There might be something in the water, or the collard greens.

The doubles write-up is one of the worst I have ever read! EMac and Liz WON the world title! Who cares what the PDGAs poster boy and his partner did, they lost! The entire write-up is about Dave and Melody and how they played and had a bad spit on the last hole to cost them the win. Lets talk a little bit about how EMac and Liz made great drives and excellent putts to make the come from behind win.


Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.


Chris, I have not read the write-up about the doubles event nor was I there, but there is no doubt that Eric and Liz won and big Kudos to them! Everybody has some bad luck and just because it happens on the last hole doesn't mean that Eric and Liz didn't win or that it was a fluke. If you are open to a suggestion, I would offer that phrases like "who cares" don't help you get your point across. I have seen and heard too many of the top players whine and complain and disgrace themselves far beyond what their egos are able to comprehend, so I urge you not to go there. Just state the facts as you see them without the flavor of a political campaign and your point will be well made.

Sincerely, Stan

NC's run of top 30 at am worlds....

2002
David "Wheetie" French - 1st
Paul Piper - 3rd
Rob Leder - 12th
Scotty Faison - 13th
Mike Bonkoski - 23rd
Justin Jablonski - 27th

2003
OOPS!!

2004
Justin "JJ" Jernigan - 1st
Robert "MTL" Leonard - 26th

2005
Jack Schmalfeld - 1st
Eddie Ogburn - 4th
Chad Kawaminami - 12th

2006
Jeb Bryant - 4th

2007
Henry Childress - 6th
Patrick Byrd - 7th

2008
Jeremy Koling - 1st
Buddy Tritt - 4th

2009
Matt Keatts - 1st
David Wiggins, Jr - 2nd
Brian "Cheebo" Baldwin - 21st

Not to mention Stewart Krall has won an advanced grandmasters title, Marueen Higgins won adv. women this year, and we have had multiple world titles with Andrew Coggin and Wiggins, Jr.

Throw in some top 4 masters with Larry Leonard and Brian McRee, 2 top 10s from Schwebby and another from Walt Haney in open, and it's safe to say NC has the best talent on this planet.

And Ron Williams from Charlotte who won the Advanced Masters world title in 2000 or 2001. Surprised the Charlotte guys forgot about that one.

Seems as though every year during Worlds coverage somone from another part of the country gets on the messedup bored and calls "bagger" against the folks from NC. And every year the folks from NC defend our own. The rest of the country should be happy that we didn't send all of our great talent to KC this year. It might have been a top 10 in the advanced field.

It's not baggin. It's the level of competition from every part of the state. The courses we learn to play on. Tight, technical courses to big open bomber courses. You have to have a complete game and an arsenal of shots to succeed in this state as well as a mental toughness. So it's quite simple World. If you want to end NC's reign at the Am worlds, you better step your game up and quit making excuses.

Stan-

I am open to suggestion for sure. When I read the write-up (which can be found on the home page) it just irritated me. Causing me to respond out of frustration. Most from the article and more from the players party.

It just seems degrading that the write-up wasn't a celebration of a great round played by EMac and Liz.

We all have ties to this player and that player and sometimes our emotions get the best of us.

I wish I had been there to see it and to give them their props. I will the next time I get a chance to see them. Thanks for the cool response.

[QUOTE=dwiggmd;1388218]

I gotta say, there certainly are some ignorant and spitefully insinuating comments going on here - more than I recall in the past. Another example of no matter what you do, someone is gonna find fault. I've tried at times to post some supportive insights, answer some fair questions, etc. Maybe I will some in the future, who knows. Sometimes it all seems hopelessly juvenile (even among those who are certainly not juveniles) and a waste of time. I've really not got much stomach for that. I'm feeling a bit fatigued by it all right now, so those of you who desire to point out how I'm wrong, feel free. I'm off of here for awhile.

Having kept up with this thread, and not having commented on the trash that has been flying, it is good to see someone point out the childlike hot air that's been oh so plentiful on this thread.

My thought...........who cares, and it is so apparent you guys just wish you'd been there instead of stuck trying to battle with words and poor subjects.

Congrats to all who attended and I hope everyone makes it back home safe.

found this on youtube of the final putt

i guess pdga doesnt have anything yet... of course

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ORQwMQ9hIA

Thanks for that link. I hope there are a lot more good videos yet to come for those of us who couldn't make the worlds this year.

Thank you for the link. It does seem like a lot of spitefulness and boasting
going on in this thread. Mr Wiggins has been very thoughtful with his words.


Why all the bragging about NC? I don't really understand. I know there are some
great folks from the state but...... The best in the world are from all over the world.
USA, Japan, Sweden, etc. Tons of great players from all over this country.

I personally really don't care that much for the am divisions. Yes, it's a proving ground
but in my opinion it holds our sport back. When you talk to the pioneers of the game
there was one division. Age division is one thing. I really don't care who the best
player under 980 is. That player still is not as good as a 1000 rated player. All the NC
fluff is just that FLUFF. By the way who was the last North Carolina guy to win a major.
Not bashing here just asking because I really don't know. Was it Harold Duvall? I know
he is from Cali but I think he must be considered a NC local by now.

If we really want to elevate the game to the masses we must focus on the best
players and only the best players. The ams (like me) are not going to be the ones
bringing the game to the people. Nobody likes to watch people that are almost
as good as the best. This is I find to be true. Look at triple A baseball or the
Nationwide golf tour.

From what it looks like to me a guy from Oregon won the tournament. A guy from Cali
battled hard for second. What about Barry Schultz with another top ten!

Back off little Wiggins. The kid is already kicking major but and is very professional
in his approach. He will be a force.

A big shout out to Dave Greenwell (B.C.) for another title in
the Grandmasters division. Way to represent Louisville.

What happened to Birgitta? She doesn't have a score for the final 9? Did she get hurt?

Ms. Lagerholm was apparently injured and unable to compete in the Final 9.

Bill Newman and I are still in Kansas City playing casual rounds now that the tournament is over. We played Waterworks this morning with Chuck Kennedy, and Bill took 14 skins to my 4 skins, with Chuck going O'fer and having to pay us both out. :) We ran into Jack Lowe and Rick Rothstein who were still basking in the glow of one of the most successful Worlds ever. Chuck headed back towards Minnesota, and Bill and I headed over to Blue Valley where it was a little strange being in the same place where 750-1000 people were watching disc golf the previous day. It was pretty windy, but needless to say neither Bill or I broke 70 which made us really appreciate Avery's sick round of 53 earlier this week! :cool:

After a late lunch at Blanc Burgers & Bottles (http://www.blancburgers.com/) which is across from McCoy's on Westport and has a killer beer selection, we are preparing for a Monday morning round at WyCo before finally heading back to the northeast U.S.

Thank you John Chapman and Jack Lowe and everyone in Kansas City for being a simply incredible Worlds host! :cool:

Sammy, I think you are missing the point. Most of the bragging is no different than folks going to an NFL game sporting their teams colors. We are proud of the performance of the folks back here in NC. What is the problem with that? If the bragging was done to taunt, then I would not condone it.

I wonder what you mean by "holding our sport back"? Do you mean going mainstream and getting airtime on TV and such? Personally, I don't think this sport will ever grow too far past where it is now. I don't think that the game we love can be adequately captured on the big screen. Even if it can, without an incredibly huge amateur player base I cannot see how it can grow.

Also, if NC fluff is FLUFF, then I gotta tell you that you are really missing out! FLUFF is awesome. Also awesome are the performances turned in by excellent disc golfers from all the other states and the world.

Where you have said that you don't care much for the AM divisions, I have grown disenchanted with the PRO divisions. They are, by far, much less grateful for the money we raise at tournaments and tend to complain very loudly about anything that does not suit them. AMs, in general are far more appreciative. It would suit me never to host another PRO event here in Charlotte and only focus on building the amateur player base.

It is the AM's here in Charlotte who back me up with physical labor to build new courses to bring the sport to the masses.It will have been the AM's backbreaking labor, along with an old Pro mule or two who will have built another 6, or more courses to host the 2012 Worlds here in Charlotte. I don't know how it is done where you live but the AMs here do bring the game to the people. They build courses, they manage our website, they deal with PR, they run leagues,,,and on and on.

My final disagreement is that "Nobody likes to watch people that are almost
as good as the best. " I despise the NBA multimillionaires that act like spoiled brats. I would rather watch female collegiate basketball where most of them play for the love of the game rather than the promise of a huge salary and signing bonus. I enjoy little league baseball more then major league baseball for the same reason. Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy watching great athletes perform well, but they are only the tip, of the tip of the iceberg. The AMs are the masses, the literal foundation of the sport. Without them the PROs have nothing but a small club. That may still be pretty much where we are.

Anyhow, now that I have ticked off a lot of people, I echo the shoutout for Dave Greenwell and Dr. Rick for representing Kentucky. Long live FLUFF in Kentucky, Oregon and everywhere that people play for the love of the game. Wow to the Jenkins, and Josh and Matt and Cale, go FLUFF in Georgia Phil and Brad, good job Oates and McRee, Des is so steady, way to go Elaine, No Spin and Hos and Jim that was a good run, Kathy and Jerry- way to go! Keats, Wiggy, Scott and David, what a battle! Kudos to you all.Mo Higgins and Rebecca, WOW!!! I wish I could have seen your battle. Joe , Marie, Paul, Sue Gary , super tournament for you all. Nageeb, Audrey, Oscar, Nicole, Andrew, Gabriella, Nicholas and Lydia, you all rock.

And I mean every word of it.

Later, Stan

It just seems degrading that the write-up wasn't a celebration of a great round played by EMac and Liz.
I don't think Emac and Liz were on the top card in the second round. When the PDGA is fortunate to have someone cover an event for a story, they usually follow the top card. Better to write about what you saw than guess what you didn't.

It's no disrespect to the winners but we usually don't have the media resources to have multiple card coverage, especially with multiple venues and simultaneous events at Worlds. Volunteers could write stories and some even asked if they could. But to my knowledge, none were turned in for posting. Unfortunately, it won't be the last time someone or team comes from the second card to win and no one saw their excellent shots but the others in their group.

I was at least fortunate to congratulate them as we ate dinner later in the week. Congrats again Emac and Liz.

1st of All Congrats to all the winners!

Especially Georgia's Pride and Joy..... Phil Arthur! What an incredible representative of Disc Golf and the people of Georgia, congrats to Brad for making it 1-2 in Masters it's really cool for me because I get to battle with these guys week in and out here in GA.

A Big HELL YEAH for my homie Mr Twisted Flyer himeself Joe ROTAN for his HUGE victory in the Adv Masters Division...all that time he put into running events instead of playing, the karma caught up to him and he got to really show off what he can do when he gets to play.

Thanks for the KC crew for such a great week of disc golf!


Has anyone heard how the aces were paid? Nailing #2 at Cliff Drive made my week. it was a very crazy week for me there. On my final hole of the tournament I drilled a guy on a motorcyle which kicked back in bounds. Unreal!

As for the North Carolina thing? The years of TONS of GREAT players in NC is over, There used to be a lot of GREAT players in NC but most of them are in Masters, even GM and there are some REAL LEGENDS in NC. Now there is only a handful, obviously Swebbie is and will always be great, MJ is great, but after that there are just a bunch of really GOOD golfers. The major reason that NC has had so many high finishes is because alot of the players are SCARED to play against the MJ's and Schwebbies, So I think the reason for so many high finishes at Am WOrlds is because there are a bunch of sissies play'n AM in NC, move up and getcha some!!! :D 970 golfers are usually playing Open in most parts of the country.

They have some of the best courses in the country to make great players and you have to thank Stan the Man McDaniel for that, when you learn to play golf on great courses it makes good golfers.

And for David Wiggins, he is going to be a great golfer, and if he wants to play Adv at the Majors for 4 or 8 more years he is more than welcome to do that. He is a kid with plans of attending college and who knows if Disc Golf may be considered a major sport in college by the time he gets there, and he has no reason to screw up his eligibility to participate in college disc golf by collecting some measly paycheck.

Why would he turn pro anyway? He doesn't need the money and his future is MUCH more important than a $200 paycheck here or there. I say rock on David Wiggins, become the greatest amateur disc golfer in history, he's a kid, everyone should praise what he is doing.

Now if your 30 and your trying to win 5 Adv Worlds and to become the biggest AM ever, your weak. :D

Has anyone heard how the aces were paid? Nailing #2 at Cliff Drive made my week.
Someone last night said that aces were worth $270.

Stan let me start by saying I respect your attitude. I have never
met you but have heard a ton of positive things that you have done
for our game.

Let me clarify my lack of interest in am tournaments. Really a disc driven
prize system benefits the two major manufacturers more than it
benefits our game. Why prizes and not cash? Most of the players in the
advanced division could compete in Open if they tried. Instead most dislike losing
and not getting paid or something. That's a generalization but I have had
this same conversation with people from all over the country.

What if the pro field had 100 players and they still paid the top 40. Then and only
then a guy like myself (915 rated) could maybe cash. Doubtful but I would have
a better chance than competing against the 15 990 + guys in the area.

I really don't need anymore disc. I still throw the T-Bird and I
don't need some new fancy disc to replace it every quarter. Innova and
Discraft have their business to run as I do mine. I just think it's time
we stop supporting them so much and start supporting the players that
practice, travel and teach all the newcomers.

Once again let me state that I really have no interest in knowing who
won all the different division in a local A,B or C tier tournament. Really it is just
silly. Who is the best 875 and under or who the best 915 and under. Don't get
me wrong competing with in your ability will always be fun on a recreational basis.
My drift here is that the PDGA should be focused on competition between the best.
They should drive players to play up.

This is just my humble opinion. It's great that the am base in NC is strong
and they donate time and labor. In my town it is almost the opposite. Most of
the pros do all the work. The older ones for sure. The ams around here are cool
and do kick in and volunteer but it is the tireless work of the better players that
really get stuff done. That is how I see it at least.

You are right about rooting for your home team. You should root for
NC just like I was rooting for Dave and Rick. A little razzing is fun if done
with taste. Nobody answered that question about NC and majors! (insert
silly icon here)

With all do respect Stan keep doing what you do. You are a legend
and your hard work is respected by many outside the state lines of
North Carolina.

Good night disc golfers!

The doubles write-up is one of the worst I have ever read! EMac and Liz WON the world title! Who cares what the PDGAs poster boy and his partner did, they lost! The entire write-up is about Dave and Melody and how they played and had a bad spit on the last hole to cost them the win. Lets talk a little bit about how EMac and Liz made great drives and excellent putts to make the come from behind win.


Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.


Word!!! I think it would have been 10 times the better story to talk about how EMac overcame a broken hand earlier in the year, and the rapid progression of Liz's game, they got hosed!

Congrats to everyone.....Liz and E-Mac way to pick up a title!!

Avery and Val, too cool! I saw the YouTube video (the only thing I could find unfortunately) and I was nervous watching. Seeing Val and the parents jump in was something special! Enjoy the week and enjoy the feeling.....

Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.

In his defense Dave was the reigning world champ, and is a great ambassador for our game. Obviously the defending champ is going to get the highest amount of worlds coverage.

And Dave's "crew" are not the ones who decide what to write and print(not that you said that, just your post seemed a bit angry at them). I've heard a lot of people complain that certain players get unfair amounts of coverage- but are any of those players working anywhere near as hard to promote themselves? nope.



Word!!! I think it would have been 10 times the better story to talk about how EMac overcame a broken hand earlier in the year, and the rapid progression of Liz's game, they got hosed!

THIS!

especially after Liz had a breakout win @ Medina

Thanks to all that helped put this on, I had a great time and enjoyed every round I got to play. The courses were great, and the parks were amazing, too bad some are in a area I would not want to be in after dark. Everyone one I played with was great and I enjoyed meeting all the new people. I tried to thank everyone one I saw that helped but I know I didnt come close to everyone, so thanks!

Stan, good to se you on here. Reminds me of your car breaking down in Rochester. Best week of practice I ever had.!

Congrats to everyone.....Liz and E-Mac way to pick up a title!!

Avery and Val, too cool! I saw the YouTube video (the only thing I could find unfortunately) and I was nervous watching. Seeing Val and the parents jump in was something special! Enjoy the week and enjoy the feeling.....


Oh yeah, in that YouTube video....I kept waiting on Zeppy to jump out and start hugging Avery! He must not have been in town!! :-)

Just got home after a 7 hour drive and then finishing up the HOF show, I did want to quickly address the comments about the LIVE PDGA Radio broadcast from Saturday.
I had thought it went relatively well for what I had to work with, however It sounds like some people had issues with it, whether it was me or the server I'll figure out and correct in the future when it (hopefully) gets done again. I have yet to listen back to it. However, My main problem from the beginning was the layout of the park and the final 9 course itself along with the need to cover all (or at least most divisions), I also only had about 5-7 days to plan and get everything together and down there (on a limited budget), and then the playoff was just plain unlucky as it meant I couldn't tell anything that was going on during it plus the crowd and players were all over the course and therefore I never got the post-round interviews like I wanted with Avery and Val, and others and I had no access to the internet which meant no scores/leaderboards.live scoring for me at all. My bad, now I know for next time I'll have to a get a wireless internet-laptop card, and battery operated mixer or "broadcast cart" with access to electricity (and make sure my co-host shows up!)
No excuses, just a learning process, hope you enjoyed what you could, something is (almost) always better than nothing, I'll have more after I get some sleep, congrats Avery, Val, and all the other 2009 World Champs!

Please send me any/all comments pros & cons you may have had to [email protected]

Thanks,
Steve Kuzenski

Thanks for all your efforts Steve. Its easy sometimes to be critical of what we don't yet have while forgetting all the work that is going into what we've got.

Just got back from KC today and wanted to first say Congrats to both Lil' Jenks and Big Boy Jenks on an awesome week of golf that will finally give Avery his title so that the family can't razz him anymore.

Matty O, Anthon, and Mr. Classy Leiveska also put down some sick scores with Matty's 1080 round at Cliff being the most impressive since he took a 5 on the last hole!

In the J pool congrats to Nageeb from LA representing SN and Nicole Cazares for representing H-town and bringing back another title.

In the J+ pool you have Lil Wig who made many grown men cry when they realized they were being outdriven and outplayed by a kid half their age! Kid is going to be good but if he really wants to throw far he needs to move from NC to TX and get his 600ft golf shot down.

Jack, Chap, and Rick- Great event and the best run worlds I have played since 04'. I loved seeing new courses like Cliff drive and Thornfield and must say you guys are very lucky to have such a nice spread of courses.

I will be back next year and hopefully shoot better the 1st 6 rounds.

found this on youtube of the final putt

i guess pdga doesnt have anything yet... of course

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ORQwMQ9hIA

"This has been removed by user" too bad it was a cool clip....

Bill Newman and I are still in Kansas City playing casual rounds now that the tournament is over. We played Waterworks this morning with Chuck Kennedy, and Bill took 14 skins to my 4 skins, with Chuck going O'fer and having to pay us both out. :) We ran into Jack Lowe and Rick Rothstein who were still basking in the glow of one of the most successful Worlds ever. Chuck headed back towards Minnesota, and Bill and I headed over to Blue Valley where it was a little strange being in the same place where 750-1000 people were watching disc golf the previous day. It was pretty windy, but needless to say neither Bill or I broke 70 which made us really appreciate Avery's sick round of 53 earlier this week! :cool:

After a late lunch at Blanc Burgers & Bottles (http://www.blancburgers.com/) which is across from McCoy's on Westport and has a killer beer selection, we are preparing for a Monday morning round at WyCo before finally heading back to the northeast U.S.

Thank you John Chapman and Jack Lowe and everyone in Kansas City for being a simply incredible Worlds host! :cool:


Thanks to YOU and the other Scorers for the hard work you put in during the week, with only minor issues - and with having to deal with 936 players for the most part every day, it was a good overall job.

Good to know you or Bill didn't beat my score there at Blue Valley. :)

Many thanks to all of the organizers and volunteers who helped make this Worlds so special. All of my rounds started on schedule, the scores were posted in a timely fashion, there was water on the courses (not counting the rain on Tuesday and Saturday morning!), and the HOF awards ceremony was a treat. I had the pleasure of watching Phil Arthur and Brian McRee shoot solid, superior golf for 5 of my 7 rounds. Phil was a monster at Rosedale on Tuesday and Blue Valley on Wednesday, and I only saw Brian make one really poor throw all week. The round at Rosedale with Phil, MitchMac and Toad was probably my favorite, but all of the rounds were a great pleasure. It was also a treat caddying for Myers during the GM final nine and having a front row seat to some awesome putts. Congrats to Greenwell for holding on to a hard fought victory. And of course the great joy on Avery's and especially Val's faces when he sank the winning put was extra special. What a final nine!

Thanks again to all of the dedicated staff and volunteers for making this even so special. KC is a great town, and I can't wait to get back! Oh yeah...and the 2 1/2 slabs of ribs and 3 pork sammiches last week that blew my diet to hell were definitely worth it!

Cheers, DD

I had no access to the internet which meant no scores/leaderboards.live scoring for me at all. My bad, now I know for next time I'll have to a get a wireless internet-laptop card, and battery operated mixer or "broadcast cart" with access to electricity (and make sure my co-host shows up!)


Please send me any/all comments pros & cons you may have had to [email protected]

Thanks,
Steve Kuzenski

does the PDGA have a internet card for use with live scoring or is it on the host(NT or worlds) to provide it?

In the J+ pool you have Lil Wig who made many grown men cry when they realized they were being outdriven and outplayed by a kid half their age! Kid is going to be good but if he really wants to throw far he needs to move from NC to TX and get his 600ft golf shot down.


Not sure if you're joking or not, but I believe David Wiggins Jr. has thrown an officially recorded 720ft shot.

Not sure if you're joking or not, but I believe David Wiggins Jr. has thrown an officially recorded 720ft shot.


I think it was a little more than that and notice I said "Golf shot"!

"This has been removed by user" too bad it was a cool clip....

yeah that sucks

i wonder why they removed it?

maybe the shot is copyrighted LOL


found another vid.. no putt tho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5TkXTwWcUo

Stan, good to se you on here. Reminds me of your car breaking down in Rochester. Best week of practice I ever had.!

Indeed it was incredible fun. The locals treated us right (Moose? or Hoss?) and the Wegman's food courts were the best. When my grandson (who just turned 2 and my wife and I are raising) gets a little older and I can get away from my parental duties more easily, I may try for another transmission breakdown and shoot for winging it for another week of fun.
Your name was conspicuously absent on the leader board. I hope all is well with you and your family.

Charlotte Worlds 2012. It's not too early to plan.

does the PDGA have a internet card for use with live scoring or is it on the host(NT or worlds) to provide it?
The PDGA has a palm device for following one group and additional live scoring is done when marshals like Juliana have their own palms or iPhones.

[QUOTE=kbmccoy;1388247]As for the North Carolina thing? The years of TONS of GREAT players in NC is over, There used to be a lot of GREAT players in NC but most of them are in Masters, even GM and there are some REAL LEGENDS in NC. Now there is only a handful, obviously Swebbie is and will always be great, MJ is great, but after that there are just a bunch of really GOOD golfers. The major reason that NC has had so many high finishes is because alot of the players are SCARED to play against the MJ's and Schwebbies, So I think the reason for so many high finishes at Am WOrlds is because there are a bunch of sissies play'n AM in NC, move up and getcha some!!! :D 970 golfers are usually playing Open in most parts of the country.

I can't completely disagree with you there Kevin. What I can say is that in the past we always pushed guys to jump up to the pro ranks as soon as they had shown that they could win an event in the advanced field. When they did jump, they had to face the fact that on any given weekend they would have to deal with Carlton Howard, The Beav, Schwebbie, Larry Leonard, Walt Haney, Me, McRee, and that was just in their own backyard. If any other top players showed up , and many did, then they had simply jumped from the amateur pool to the donater pool. I saw many great talents fade away and turn to other outlets after a few years of donating. There is a great attraction to take a stab at the AM worlds and giving it one good run. I can't fault anyone for that. Disc Golf is not a career for hardly any of us who are playing, so why not take a stab at a little fleeting glory? ( Like playing in the Master's Division! ) On the other hand, now that there are scores of events all over the place, there is a much better chance for a player to jump to the Pro field here without having to contend with a lot of elite players.

Anyway, these are just my opinions and perspectives. I wonder how your little one is doing? I know you guys have your hands full now. They sure are hard to keep up with! I can't get James to learn that he is not supposed to throw discs in the house. It is a constant war to try to save our breakables when he gets his hands on a disc.

See you soon, Stan

I wonder if the PDGA had them remove the video on youtube? THey are trying to sell a DVD. Does anyone else think this may be why there was a lack of video coverage this week? I personally wished there would have been more videos of the players playing. OH well maybe next year.

"I kept waiting on Zeppy to jump out and start hugging Avery!"


Too funny Brad. Those are his boys!

The doubles write-up is one of the worst I have ever read! EMac and Liz WON the world title! Who cares what the PDGAs poster boy and his partner did, they lost! The entire write-up is about Dave and Melody and how they played and had a bad spit on the last hole to cost them the win. Lets talk a little bit about how EMac and Liz made great drives and excellent putts to make the come from behind win.


Maybe some day the people in the disc golf world will realize that the world does not revolve around Dave and his crew.

As was pointed out in this thread, Eric McCabe and Liz Lopez came off the second card to win mixed doubles. Unfortunalely the PDGA does not have the resources available to follow every card so the photographers and writers usually follow the lead card and that is what happened in this instance. No disrespect was intended towards anyone but it would have been impossible to write about something that the writer did not see. A spit out from ten feet on the last hole to lose the World Doubles title is a pretty big story, despite what you may think.

Once the dust settled, PDGA Media was there to interview Eric and Liz following their victory and that video was posted on the front page of the website that very night.

http://www.pdga.com/videos/kansas-city-worlds-video-coverage-episode-1

PDGA.com is updated with fresh content on an almost daily basis, far more than at any time in the history of the association and its website. Much of this content is submitted by volunteers so please be thankful that you actually have something to complain about.

Hey Brian,

Any plans to get a couple of highlight videos posted of the worlds? I am sure the pdga had that youtube video pulled, but that type of coverage is awesome to watch for those who could not attend. The excitement is not as fresh if we have to wait several months for the worlds video?

Thanks

Part 1: from Andrew Coggin 3 time Jr world champion

Thank you to everyone that made the 2009 PDGA World Championship one of the best ever.

I would like to thank all those that played on my card. A special thanks to Peter McBride for pushing me and showing me the parts of my game I need to work on.

I would also like to congratulate some fellow World Champions:

Nick Doran - 3 time 10 and under World Champion Move up Bagger.

Nicole “Super Girl” Cazares - Girls 16 and under World Champion

Gabriella Gray - Girls 13 and under World Champion

Lydia Dillen - Girls 10 and under World Champion


I would like to thank my sponsors one more time

Night Owl Graphics Thanks Ben you believed in me before I ever won anything.

Scientific Disc Golf Thanks David Wiggins Sr.

PART 2 : From Wyatt Coggin not Andrew

I don’t want to go into a lot of details or address certain comments directly. I would rather make the statement below.

I wish the United States showed the Pride that Team Sweden showed this year. Much like Team Japan did in Kalamazoo. Let me take that back. It would be to much like North Carolina Pride. People would not like that.

This is the Olympics or the world games to our sport. Until the country comes together for the sport it’s state against state. Which is fine check the record books on world titles. (singles, doubles, field events Andrew from NC alone at 13 has 9 World champion trophies, 3 singles, 3 doubles, 2 putting, 1 distance).

But again I don’t think the Team USA idea would work for us. We would rather talk about and put down other players to much. At the Doubles round for Jr boys 19 and under I saw the top male and top female Swedish pro’s following and encouraging the Swedish team. Wow Pros interested in young players. We should try more of that in this country. Or as far as that goes player of the game supporting other players that sounds like a good thing for the sport.

If you find anything you don’t like in this post please attack me not my son.

May last post was a good example of others on the message board typeing before they think. where I stated pros should help young players

Thank you to the following pros for helping Andrew

Robert "MTL" Leonard
Stan McDaniel
Kirk Yoo
Michael Johansen
Jeremy Koling
Brain Schweberger

added a few more images from the semis at cliff drive and the finals, we had to leave before the mens group came thru. i did see 2 photogs with media badges shooting during the week, maybe they will post their pics also.
congrats to all the champions and thanks to all for putting up with me shooting pics last week.

http://s90.photobucket.com/albums/k266/garyE500/worlds%20semi%20and%20final/?start=0

http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k266/garyE500/worlds%20semi%20and%20final/kc41.jpg

[QUOTE=PDGADirector;1388296]As was pointed out in this thread, Eric McCabe and Liz Lopez came off the second card to win mixed doubles. Unfortunalely the PDGA does not have the resources available to follow every card so the photographers and writers usually follow the lead card and that is what happened in this instance. No disrespect was intended towards anyone but it would have been impossible to write about something that the writer did not see. A spit out from ten feet on the last hole to lose the World Doubles title is a pretty big story, despite what you may think.[QUOTE]

We are talking about Swope Park. Most of the course can be seen from the top of the hill. I watched the 2 lead cards of Open play at WW and can tell you nearly every shot that went down during the final round.

How about the fact that Liz and Melody missed putts at the exact same time. Both from very short range. Liz hits hers and it is a 2 stroke win. As far as the resources, there was a park full of people. Many watching the lead card and others watching the second card. Anyone of those people would have been more then willing to share info on the round by Emac and Liz.

My biggest problem with the article is it is about a failure by one group and not the excellent play of the champions.

It is really to bad that the title was won because of a mess-up.

Hey Brian,

Any plans to get a couple of highlight videos posted of the worlds? I am sure the pdga had that youtube video pulled, but that type of coverage is awesome to watch for those who could not attend. The excitement is not as fresh if we have to wait several months for the worlds video?

Thanks


Hi Brad,

The PDGA encourages people to post disc golf videos on YouTube as it helps us promote our great game. We had absolutely nothing to do with any videos being pulled. Our only limitation on internet videos is that we will not allow anyone to post the entire final 9 (including playoffs) of the worlds as it would be counter productive to our DVD. We are working on a wrap up video that will appear at PDGA.com.

As was pointed out in this thread, Eric McCabe and Liz Lopez came off the second card to win mixed doubles. Unfortunalely the PDGA does not have the resources available to follow every card so the photographers and writers usually follow the lead card and that is what happened in this instance. No disrespect was intended towards anyone but it would have been impossible to write about something that the writer did not see. A spit out from ten feet on the last hole to lose the World Doubles title is a pretty big story, despite what you may think.

Once the dust settled, PDGA Media was there to interview Eric and Liz following their victory and that video was posted on the front page of the website that very night.

http://www.pdga.com/videos/kansas-city-worlds-video-coverage-episode-1

PDGA.com is updated with fresh content on an almost daily basis, far more than at any time in the history of the association and its website. Much of this content is submitted by volunteers so please be thankful that you actually have something to complain about.


Not quite as big as when Markus was spit out in 07 which cost him the win in singles.

Maybe you guys should push for better baskets (the recent survey was a joke) so that these spits do not occur as much in the future since I'm sure I saw 15-20 during my rounds.

Also usually the 2nd card is right next to the 1st card and it is pretty easy to ask what the score is to find out who is winning. You guys slipped on this one a little and it would be better if you just said sorry instead of making lame excuses for why it happened.

BTW I heard very few complaints about the way the event was ran but heard quite a few about the PDGA's involvement so maybe one day you will be able to see how the "P-guys" in pDGA feel about their org.

Part 1: from Andrew Coggin 3 time Jr world champion

Thank you to everyone that made the 2009 PDGA World Championship one of the best ever.

I would like to thank all those that played on my card. A special thanks to Peter McBride for pushing me and showing me the parts of my game I need to work on.

I would also like to congratulate some fellow World Champions:

Nick Doran - 3 time 10 and under World Champion Move up Bagger.

Nicole �Super Girl� Cazares - Girls 16 and under World Champion

Gabriella Gray - Girls 13 and under World Champion

Lydia Dillen - Girls 10 and under World Champion


I would like to thank my sponsors one more time

Night Owl Graphics Thanks Ben you believed in me before I ever won anything.

Scientific Disc Golf Thanks David Wiggins Sr.


Congratulations Andrew. With all the "debate" going on, you and these other players did not get the congrats you deserve. Unfortunately this is what the db has become. Keep up the strong play.

Keatts...whatever you figured out this year please let me know so i can raise my game to your level...congrats champ.

David Jr...don't be disappointed, this was quite a challenge you took on this year. You will have success wherever you decide to take your game to next. Proud to know you and everyone at Scientific Disc Golf.

Almost forgot to send a shout-out to Brad Williams who at only 1002 took down the #1 rated player in the worlds and finished 11th in his 1st worlds ever! Also was -6 after 10 at Cliff drive but finished at +3 so without that kind of blowup he would have finished much higher.

Well it's back to work today after as week of being in Heaven. BOOOOOO!!!!!

I'd like to thank all the people that put in a lot of effort to make this a great week for everyone in attendace. I can not imagine how much work the KC DG club had to put into the courses to get them looking the way they did. Or the amount of planning to make the side activities fun for all.

I'd also like to thank the spotters who gave up their chance to play in this World Class event to help those who's disc may not have gone where they thought they were going. I tried to meet and personally thank all the ones I came across on the course....but if I missed a few THANK YOU!

I'd like to thank the score keepers(Jeff it was good to meet you face to face...HERE WE GO STEELERS!!!). It was amazing to see how well scores were posted in a quick time both between rounds and after rounds were done each day. I'm sure that is a big job keeping up with 10 courses worth of scores coming in twice a day.

Also, I'd like to say I really enjoyed all the cardmates I had along the way at this event. This was my first worlds and my first out of state tourney. Getting to play with people from all across the US, and Serge from Canada was truely a highlight of this trip for me(especially since I left my game at home apparently). While I may not be able to remember everyone's name, I can remember all the different States I played with. Very cool to see the different styles of play from Coast to Coast.

All and all I had a great Disc Golf Vacation!! The courses you guys have up there are truely amazing, Water Works and Blue Valley put most of the courses I have played to shame. The hotel was amazing, and the KC downtown area was very nice....and safe feeling while walking around after dark. I will be back to KC to play at some point....maybe for a Steelers vs Chiefs game one of these years.

As I said this was my first worlds experience, but I can promise it won't be the last. Don't know if I'll be albe to swing NY next year, but I will be back to worlds at some point. And I bet I bring more San Angeloen's with me next time....as they will be waaay tired of hearing my stories by the nextone and need some of thier own.

Oh, one thing....I was told before heading that way that I would get better BBQ in KC than anywhere in Texas. Well I tried Oklahoma Joe's and while it was pretty good food. You KC guys need to take a trip to Llano, Texas and give Coopers(or Lum's In Junction) a try.....you won't eat KC BBQ again!!! :D hehe........

THANKS TO EVERYONE INVOLVED FOR MAKING THIS A TRIP I WILL NEVER FORGET!

Hi Brad,

The PDGA encourages people to post disc golf videos on YouTube as it helps us promote our great game. We had absolutely nothing to do with any videos being pulled. Our only limitation on internet videos is that we will not allow anyone to post the entire final 9 (including playoffs) of the worlds as it would be counter productive to our DVD. We are working on a wrap up video that will appear at PDGA.com.

My apologies for assuming that...wonder why it was pulled? I sent it to several people because it really captured the moment.....bummer! Looking forward to the wrap up video.

A big thanks to the whole KC Worlds 09 crew for putting a great event. I played like crap and still had a wonderful time. :D

All the rounds that ran really late seemed to have no one playing after them, so the staff seemed to know where the problems would be. Worst case was day one at Cliff Drive, but you have to blame the rain on the am women's pool for slowing that down due to mud. Great job planning by the staff.

I really like being close to everything, so thanks KC. I only had one 25 minute drive, and I had 3.5 hours after my round ended to get there. My wife played the farthest course twice, but it was twice on the same day so they only had to drive out there once. Nice job on that, too. The host hotel was very nice, and having the player meeting and flymart there is the way to go.

Lets not forget to mention Oklahoma Joes BBQ by Rosedale. I'm still wondering if they serve pulled pork and eggs for breakfast, because I would've eaten 3 meals a day there instead of 2 had I known...

Thanks again KC and all the guys I played with. I had a great time shooting poorly for no good reason.

Oh yeah: Steve Ganz owned me out there and took a bunch of my dollars! Nice shooting Steve.

My apologies for assuming that...wonder why it was pulled? I sent it to several people because it really captured the moment.....bummer! Looking forward to the wrap up video.

Brad,

My apologies to you. It has been brought to my attention that marketing director, John Duesler kindly requested that the video be unpublished. To show the finale of our video and what might be the most exciting moment in our sport's history could potentially hurt DVD sales and the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.

John said that the videographer Rob understood and kindly removed the clip. John also spoke with Avery, who was wondering why Rob was asked to do that, but Avery seemed to understand as well.

We will be uploading some additional stories and videos to the website over the next couple of days. The DVD should be really good this year based upon all of the excitement and the close races. You can pre-order one today at:

http://www.pdgastore.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1249003987

Brad,

My apologies to you. It has been brought to my attention that marketing director, John Duesler kindly requested that the video be unpublished. To show the finale of our video and what might be the most exciting moment in our sport's history could potentially hurt DVD sales and the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.

John said that the videographer Rob understood and kindly removed the clip. John also spoke with Avery, who was wondering why Rob was asked to do that, but Avery seemed to understand as well.

We will be uploading some additional stories and videos to the website over the next couple of days. The DVD should be really good this year based upon all of the excitement and the close races. You can pre-order one today at:

http://www.pdgastore.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1249003987

did he think it would be a good idea at first and later decide that it would have changed the complexion of the video that the PDGA would be putting out 3 or 4 days after the event is over?

looking forward to seeing some of the coverage... sounds like an epic battle for sure!

really surprised Avery, the videographer or even the PDGA would be ok with it.

AVERY - would/should want as many people as possible to get views of this awesome moment (as would anyone). But as a sponsored pro who is trying to make his living off this sport he needs to be able to sell/market himself and getting hundreds of thousands... maybe millions of views on youtube would be huge
VIDEOGRAPHER - this is based on the assumption that this was a public park (disregard if this was not)... if its a public park I would imagine anyone could take pictures or video of just about anything they wanted to and put it on the internet. That being said the individual seems to be really accomodating to be willing to take it down.
PDGA - you would think the more coverage the better. I would hope the PDGA would be trying to get some mention of this on a major level instead of just worrying about making money on a DVD. If John was trying to sell ESPN or any other major sports outlet on having some mention of our WORLD championships it would behoove him to be able to point out all of the viral marketing happening on youtube. As it stands now if I'm at ESPN or anywhere else and i get a call/email from John asking for some mention of this... i might go to youtube or google it to see what hype is surrounding it and finding next to none would never give the pdga the time of day since seemingly nobody cares so why should I.

Brad,

My apologies to you. It has been brought to my attention that marketing director, John Duesler kindly requested that the video be unpublished. To show the finale of our video and what might be the most exciting moment in our sport's history could potentially hurt DVD sales and the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.


http://www.pdgastore.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1249003987

Pretty sure I dont understand. So on top of the $50 we pay each year, we have to buy a DVD to watch the winner of our world championships, win...Is that correct? I would also like to see some footage of the 300 AMs, is there a DVD we have to pay for to see that?

Oh, I get it, we couldnt afford to go to the world championships to see it in person, so now we have to watch the DVD.

Maybe I will win one as a CTP prize next year sometime.

Saracasim over...Marketing our sport would be very easy if you used the technologies that exist. PDGA really needs to work on a plan to get the information to the people. You Tube, Tweeter, Wireless internet cards, I mean, set some money aside and get this done!

And people that buy the videos (yes, I buy them...usually in bulk to give away at tourneys) will still buy the DVD if they have alreadly seen/know who wins.

This is great:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G6yiYr4_0s

Thank you to all the organizers and volunteers that made KC 09 possible.

Just think how many people it takes to run an event on one course and then multiply that by 10! Then add a player meeting for 900, a fly mart and a player party and you still won't come close to realizing how many people it took to run this event. Thanks to all the TD's, score keepers, spotters and other volunteers that gave up at least a week of their time so that 900+ players could enjoy the Kansas City courses.

You could tell a lot of people put in a lot of work hours getting the courses ready. There were 10 meter circles painted around every single basket at every single course I played. There were updated tee signs at all courses (except Cliff Drive - which did have awesome new tee pads). I saw evidence of trimming at every single course. While the grass may have been a little long on some courses, it was mowed before we got there. (They can't very well mow them while the players are on them.)

There was water available at every course during the week. While there were some restroom issues early in the week, that seemed to get fixed. The KC crew couldn't control Mother Nature. Yes there was some slippery stuff that first day with the rain, but most players seem well prepared and understand the staff can only do so much.

Jeff L and the rest of the scoring crew did an awesome job. Scores were always posted online everyday by the time I got back to the host hotel. Scores were always available to view on the bulletin boards at the host hotel as well.

The Westin was a very fine hotel with very nice facilities. There is something to be said for being able to ride the elevator to the Player Meeting and Flymart.


My only complaint would be the Final 9 course at Blue Valley. Hole 4 played across Holes 5 AND 6. Not sure why this was done when there was so much room for a more thoughtful and challenging design. It could also have been possible to design a course so the gallery could see all the holes without much effort. However, the way it was set up made it very tough for the gallery to follow. Too much up and down and back and forth and WAAAAAY too much walking...just to get a glimpse of the action. Also, I am not sure why they changed the road to "not OB" on hole 9. We were told it was because the description was poorly worded. However - I really think most players understand ISLAND hole means it is SURROUNDED by OB. Apparently, they were able to correct this misunderstanding for the later groups.

Again, the KC crew and the PDGA crew did an awesome job. Thank you again to everyone who helped make this event possible.

another apparent misstep by JD? why would he pull a youtube video of the event? do you really think it would hurt dvd sales that much? doubtful. And obviously he did this without consulting Brian. I think JD needs to put more thought into his actions. He's done good work up till now but the missteps lately are a PR nightmare.

Just read the write up and it states, "Both players seemed very tight on the first two holes, as each misthrew crucial upshots on hole one, and laid up on hole two to keep things tied up." regarding the first playoff hole. Not true. Anton ran at his 50 footer and almost made it. That left another big putt of 25' which he nailed. Anton can putt! He nailed several really big putts to continually push it.

Congrats to Avery too though as ultimately he won and played very smart in the extra holes. A lot of people in the gallery where questioning why Avery didn'y even attempt to make his 30 footer on Hole 2 of the playoff (it had a sever drop off behind it), but ultiumately he knew what he was doing and won!

It has been brought to my attention that marketing director, John Duesler kindly requested that the video be unpublished. To show the finale of our video and what might be the most exciting moment in our sport's history could potentially hurt DVD sales and the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.

John said that the videographer Rob understood and kindly removed the clip. John also spoke with Avery, who was wondering why Rob was asked to do that, but Avery seemed to understand as well.

We will be uploading some additional stories and videos to the website over the next couple of days. The DVD should be really good this year based upon all of the excitement and the close races.




aha, so... the pdga's official stance is to release video footage of the conclusion of it's world championship months after the event?

Uhoh.. this can't be good.. more lost $ales!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGKhFX9asrk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl8_KxRRxCY

also found another one of the final putt
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8G6yiYr4_0s

Uhoh.. this can't be good.. more lost $ales!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGKhFX9asrk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl8_KxRRxCY

nice!... only 78 views of the 1st and 73 views of the 2nd video so far... will be interesting to see what this gets up to (also hope people 'pull' copies off in case this gets taken down soon as well)

did he think it would be a good idea at first and later decide that it would have changed the complexion of the video that the PDGA would be putting out 3 or 4 days after the event is over?

looking forward to seeing some of the coverage... sounds like an epic battle for sure!

really surprised Avery, the videographer or even the PDGA would be ok with it.

AVERY - would/should want as many people as possible to get views of this awesome moment (as would anyone). But as a sponsored pro who is trying to make his living off this sport he needs to be able to sell/market himself and getting hundreds of thousands... maybe millions of views on youtube would be huge
VIDEOGRAPHER - this is based on the assumption that this was a public park (disregard if this was not)... if its a public park I would imagine anyone could take pictures or video of just about anything they wanted to and put it on the internet. That being said the individual seems to be really accomodating to be willing to take it down.
PDGA - you would think the more coverage the better. I would hope the PDGA would be trying to get some mention of this on a major level instead of just worrying about making money on a DVD. If John was trying to sell ESPN or any other major sports outlet on having some mention of our WORLD championships it would behoove him to be able to point out all of the viral marketing happening on youtube. As it stands now if I'm at ESPN or anywhere else and i get a call/email from John asking for some mention of this... i might go to youtube or google it to see what hype is surrounding it and finding next to none would never give the pdga the time of day since seemingly nobody cares so why should I.

Did you ever stop to think that Rob the videographer might be making a piece on the Jenkins Clan? I'm sure this footage will be in the documentary they are doing, right Rob?

Did you ever stop to think that Rob the videographer might be making a piece on the Jenkins Clan? I'm sure this footage will be in the documentary they are doing, right Rob?

would hope it would be part of this documentary
http://www.averyjenkins7495.com/history/the-filming-of-the-team-jenkins-disc-golf-documentary/
(not sure if the person doing video was the same person or not but it was good quality)

just thought it was sad to go to Avery's site and see it as the featured video and now if you click on it to read 'this video has been removed' He should be able to have a video on his website of him winning Worlds.

ROC ON JENKINS CLAN... looking forward to the documentary even more now!

Not quite as big as when Markus was spit out in 07 which cost him the win in singles.

Maybe you guys should push for better baskets (the recent survey was a joke) so that these spits do not occur as much in the future since I'm sure I saw 15-20 during my rounds.

Also usually the 2nd card is right next to the 1st card and it is pretty easy to ask what the score is to find out who is winning. You guys slipped on this one a little and it would be better if you just said sorry instead of making lame excuses for why it happened.

BTW I heard very few complaints about the way the event was ran but heard quite a few about the PDGA's involvement so maybe one day you will be able to see how the "P-guys" in pDGA feel about their org.

It's not even 48 hours since the last putt was hit at the 2009 World Championships and Matt Hall is already whining and complaining about every little trivial thing he can think of.

Some things just never change. http://www.bearclaws.org/forum/images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif

how can the PDGA stop people form posting videos from a PUBLIC PARK?????

thanks you all who have posted. it is nice to see some actual footage of the so called premiere event in our sport.


what no DOTS :eek:

Well I'm at the Kansas City airport about to depart for my flight home. I am really sad to leave - I honestly loved everything about the city of Kansas City - the friendliness of the people, the food & beer selection, the downtown & suburbs, the courses, the weather, etc. It's a place I wouldn't mind living in, which I haven't found in very many other locales in the United States I've visited.

I played WyCo (Wyandotte County Park in Bonner Springs) again this morning with Bill Newman and I truly don't understand why more people didn't rave about how nice this course is. Bill thought it was one of the best he had ever played. It's just a very visually appealing course, with really nice concrete tee pads, professional tee signs, little bridges, wonderful mature tress to keep drives honest, some nice rolling elevation changes, and just enough pro par four holes balanced with tough 3s and deucable par 3s to make for a very sweet layout and just a great golf course. Our battle came to down to the last hole with Bill botching his upshot for a bogey 4 to my par 3 on hole#18 to end in a tie for the round, and I won on the second playoff hole. :)

Goodbye K.C...and thanks for one of the most memorable World Championships ever! :cool:

In the J+ pool you have Lil Wig who made many grown men cry when they realized they were being outdriven and outplayed by a kid half their age! Kid is going to be good but if he really wants to throw far he needs to move from NC to TX and get his 600ft golf shot down.


Why would he want to move to Tejas? To become a mediocre golfers that gets owned by OKIES?

Brad,

My apologies to you. It has been brought to my attention that marketing director, John Duesler kindly requested that the video be unpublished. To show the finale of our video and what might be the most exciting moment in our sport's history could potentially hurt DVD sales and the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.

John said that the videographer Rob understood and kindly removed the clip. John also spoke with Avery, who was wondering why Rob was asked to do that, but Avery seemed to understand as well.

We will be uploading some additional stories and videos to the website over the next couple of days. The DVD should be really good this year based upon all of the excitement and the close races. You can pre-order one today at:

http://www.pdgastore.com/Qstore/Qstore.cgi?CMD=011&PROD=1249003987


I am buying 4 of Rob's videos for sure and I would assume it will be much better than the worlds DVD if they are the same as in the past.

If I were Rob I would have kept it up there considering he has been working on his project for almost 2 years and has put his "own" money into it not just membership dollars.

Oh and most exciting moment is probably an overstatement but I'll let it slide. Barry and Ken might not though since 03 USDGC was pretty sick.

Why would he want to move to Tejas? To become a mediocre golfers that gets owned by OKIES?



Well we did have a guy take 11th who has been playing less than 3 years and this is still his rookie season.

You OKIES need to figure out how to set an alarm and then get back to me! What was the DUDE thinking?

It's not even 48 hours since the last putt was hit at the 2009 World Championships and Matt Hall is already whining and complaining about every little trivial thing he can think of.

Some things just never change. http://www.bearclaws.org/forum/images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif

No just pointing out that the Spit-out thing has happened before within a larger setting. If the PDGA thought it was a big enough issue they would address it on a larger scale by improving our current models of baskets.

BTW I didn't complain about anything! Never said I had a spit, Never said worlds was LAME, NOTHING!

My only beef is the usual which has little to do with the host city as they do not handle the payouts. $10 difference per position is chump change and some players beat me by 10 strokes but only made $90 more than me when he even placed 6 positions higher than I did.

Just doesn't seem like score really matters when the payout is so flat(besides the top). If you are going to do flat payout you have to spread it out not just give the top 5 a steep scale and the rest of the division a flat scale.

Ok so that is all you will get out of me by way of complaining Jeff.

Anyhow, now that I have ticked off a lot of people, I echo the shoutout for Dave Greenwell and Dr. Rick for representing Kentucky. Long live FLUFF in Kentucky, Oregon and everywhere that people play for the love of the game. Wow to the Jenkins, and Josh and Matt and Cale, go FLUFF in Georgia Phil and Brad, good job Oates and McRee, Des is so steady, way to go Elaine, No Spin and Hos and Jim that was a good run, Kathy and Jerry- way to go! Keats, Wiggy, Scott and David, what a battle! Kudos to you all.Mo Higgins and Rebecca, WOW!!! I wish I could have seen your battle. Joe , Marie, Paul, Sue Gary , super tournament for you all. Nageeb, Audrey, Oscar, Nicole, Andrew, Gabriella, Nicholas and Lydia, you all rock.

And I mean every word of it.

Later, Stan


thank you Stan for putting me up in your house, making your kids sleep in the same room while giving me theirs. Thank you for driving me to and from the courses, feeding me and showing me so much kindness.

this was 11 years ago, my first year of disc. stan saw me playing a hole by myself and invited me over to join their group (LL and Snoop.) We need more gentlemen in this sport that are generous, not selfish.
thank you Stan for sharing your joy and vision for the sport we love.
Brock

Brad,

the Worlds DVD is a major annual investment by the PDGA. I hope that you and all of our members understand.



Brian,
where did this investment money come from? some must be from the players dues, right? just asking..... hoping for a member discount ! ;)

and i've seen the vids on youtube, poor quality, shaky, a few missed putts when the camera focused on the back of somebody's head... surely, this can't detract from future sales, but only elevate interest in purchasing a DVD of an exciting PDGA WC finish?

Some things just never change. http://www.bearclaws.org/forum/images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif


kinda like Pro Worlds payout!

more and more tournaments(and thus revenue) every year for the PDGA, yet the PDGA's top event hasn't grown in years.

at least Matt has suggested a reasonable solution to this in the past.

I wonder how much money is being spent for our director to travel to NTs and....take pictures? Care to answer that Brian?



PS- isn't the concern over DVD sales because it almost always loses money?

You OKIES need to figure out how to set an alarm and then get back to me! What was the DUDE thinking?

You should thank him for missing out and doing you and your 11th place boy a favor cuz the DUDE was going to do well. He is just the next in line of OKIES to rule you guys, he just raked a GRAND and a win down in Tejas 3 weeks ago by about 20 strokes.


Speaking for Clint Mac, Mitch Mac, Myself, Coda We all have a GREAT appreciation for all of the great cash you guys raise down there for us. Now that I am playing again I REALLY miss Tejas.

Did you really have 15 spit outs? OUCH!
That stinks. I don't agree at all that the target needs to be
changes. Look at most other sports and you will see that when
you miss by just a little a bigger miss can occur.
Basketball, golf, and soccer are the sports that come to my mind.

Lot's of whining here. Too bad for all you whiners that got
to play disc golf all week in a great town like Kansas City.
Really it's pretty sad.

The PDGA must make decisions and stand by them. It's ok to ask
someone to take a video down. These people are working hard at
what they do. It's going to take time to edit, score and produce this
video. Look at the World Series of Poker as an example.

May last post was a good example of others on the message board typeing before they think. where I stated pros should help young players

Thank you to the following pros for helping Andrew

Robert "MTL" Leonard
Stan McDaniel
Kirk Yoo
Michael Johansen
Jeremy Koling
Brain Schweberger

ha, not sure what I ever did other than have Andrew watch me play a round when he was about 9, but thanks!

It's a pleasure to know you guys!

I get on here and read things about money. Money Money. Cue Pink Floyd.

"The PDGA needs to dump more money into the worlds." "The PDGA needs to pay more people to monitor and report for tournaments." "The PDGA's coverage of the worlds is no where near USDGC or Vibram."

And for the records, I'm not calling out those who posted these things. I 100% agree with them.

However.....

So when the PDGA asks people to not post videos of the 2nd most historic playoff our sport has ever seen and the most historic moment we may ever see at a world championships so they can sell more videos to make more money TO DO THE VERY THINGS PEOPLE WANT, people laugh at it and go ahead and post videos anyway.

I was planning on buying the video basically b/c, as Brian said, it was history. But when I saw it on youtube, my thoughts of chances of buying the video decreased, just as Brian feared. I doubt I am the only one who had this same thought process.

But you know what, I'm going to support our sport and buy the video. I hope others will take the chance to own a piece of history AND financially support our PDGA so the things we need to do as a sport, like the valid requests seen in this thread, can happen.

You should thank him for missing out and doing you and your 11th place boy a favor cuz the DUDE was going to do well. He is just the next in line of OKIES to rule you guys, he just raked a GRAND and a win down in Tejas 3 weeks ago by about 20 strokes.


Speaking for Clint Mac, Mitch Mac, Myself, Coda We all have a GREAT appreciation for all of the great cash you guys raise down there for us. Now that I am playing again I REALLY miss Tejas.


Bring it on Kmac cause we got a guy named E-mac now who will be taking all our money! lol

I was bummed when Coda hurt himself the 2nd round because he was my pick for top 4 ever since he got back on his game a while back. The dude would have taken me down for sure since I had some major blowups at the end of rounds 2-6 and next year I will make sure to give him a call in the morning. The C-tier he played had stacked payout but only a few people knew about it and it is FAR from most. Same weekend Olse shot like 1040+ golf on a SSA 64 course for the tournament.

Anyway just bring it on and you never know I may just start playing more than 3 times a month to make sure the money stays close to home.

Did you really have 15 spit outs? OUCH!


15 Spits is code for "I'm not really a very good putter or I lie" one of the two

I haven't had 15 spits all year but maybe it's either because I can putt a little or I'm honest when my putter hits 2 links of chain on the left side, I realize it was a bad putt not a spit.

unless they were playing on Mach 1's or 2's for 6 rounds :D

E-Mac will always be from KS to me but I'm sure he also appreciates you guys lining his pockets :D

Did you really have 15 spit outs? OUCH!
That stinks. I don't agree at all that the target needs to be
changes. Look at most other sports and you will see that when
you miss by just a little a bigger miss can occur.
Basketball, golf, and soccer are the sports that come to my mind.

Lot's of whining here. Too bad for all you whiners that got
to play disc golf all week in a great town like Kansas City.
Really it's pretty sad.

The PDGA must make decisions and stand by them. It's ok to ask
someone to take a video down. These people are working hard at
what they do. It's going to take time to edit, score and produce this
video. Look at the World Series of Poker as an example.


When did I say I had 15 spits?????????????????


I said I SAW, "SEEN", or SPOTTED 15+ during the rounds and I only had like 2-3 the whole week (I couldn't get them in the chains to start with). There were a few dirty ones though on my card and others.

15 Spits is code for "I'm not really a very good putter or I lie" one of the two

I haven't had 15 spits all year but maybe it's either because I can putt a little or I'm honest when my putter hits 2 links of chain on the left side, I realize it was a bad putt not a spit.

unless they were playing on Mach 1's or 2's for 6 rounds :D

E-Mac will always be from KS to me but I'm sure he also appreciates you guys lining his pockets :D



Do you OKIES still not know how to read? We started teaching that in school 30 years ago here and I assumed you guys had gotten around to it as well.

read what I posted not what he said

I get on here and read things about money. Money Money. Cue Pink Floyd.

"The PDGA needs to dump more money into the worlds." "The PDGA needs to pay more people to monitor and report for tournaments." "The PDGA's coverage of the worlds is no where near USDGC or Vibram."

And for the records, I'm not calling out those who posted these things. I 100% agree with them.

However.....

So when the PDGA asks people to not post videos of the 2nd most historic playoff our sport has ever seen and the most historic moment we may ever see at a world championships so they can sell more videos to make more money TO DO THE VERY THINGS PEOPLE WANT, people laugh at it and go ahead and post videos anyway.

I was planning on buying the video basically b/c, as Brian said, it was history. But when I saw it on youtube, my thoughts of chances of buying the video decreased, just as Brian feared. I doubt I am the only one who had this same thought process.

But you know what, I'm going to support our sport and buy the video. I hope others will take the chance to own a piece of history AND financially support our PDGA so the things we need to do as a sport, like the valid requests seen in this thread, can happen.


I suggested in the past that $10.00 of every 10,000 pdga yearly renewals gets put right into the Worlds Pro purse ...That's 100,000 bucks added. Divided up between divisions probably 50,000 would go to open men... lets build this thing!

please remember that DVD sales can only help toward long term increases in payout, live coverage, and PR for our sport

47 place $160 (-18)
57 place $150 (-1)

Is this a misprint? 17 strokes, $10 difference?

Sorry the_kid I misread what you said.

47 place $160 (-18)
57 place $150 (-1)

Is this a misprint? 17 strokes, $10 difference?
That's misleading and you know it. Everyone who makes the semifinals cashes. So if anyone who is close in score at the cut line tanks in the semis, they still cash and could be 25 throws behind and just $10 back in money. Birgitta qualified for but wasn't able to play in the Finals and still got 4th.

That's misleading and you know it. Everyone who makes the semifinals cashes. So if anyone who is close in score at the cut line tanks in the semis, they still cash and could be 25 throws behind and just $10 back in money. Birgitta qualified for but wasn't able to play in the Finals and still got 4th.

I did not realize that everyone who makes the semis cashes...I've only played 1 Worlds.

-18 $160
-10 $150

This is probably a better example.

-13 $150
-13 $150
-12 $150
-11 $150
-10 $150


ribbons for everyone, because at worlds we are all winners!!

I have to agree with Matt, the more i hear this idea the better it sounds. Take a fration of a large purse and make this event the biggest in the Worlds. It is already great, imagine what it could be with more cash and more infrastructure.

On another note, one thing I don't hear anyone talking about it Matt O. He got royally screwed in the final 9 because no one was there to control the gallery. Matt's approach on the first hole hit the crowd because they where standing in the fairway. This prevented him from getting a 3 on the hole (he got a 4) and he missed the playoff by one stroke. He'd probably never use it as an excuse but his shot was hyzer back right to the basket until it hit the gallery. They really should have had people there directing people where to stand. In the end people like Klimo and Yeti had to step up and tell people to move on several holes.

On another note, one thing I don't hear anyone talking about it Matt O. He got royally screwed in the final 9 because no one was there to control the gallery. Matt's approach on the first hole hit the crowd because they where standing in the fairway. This prevented him from getting a 3 on the hole (he got a 4) and he missed the playoff by one stroke.


Wow, if that's true, it's a shame.

And had he not went OB on 2, he would have won!

The crowd shouldn't have been a problem. A long rope and 10 people would have done a great job at keeping people back.


I don't think we can blame this on KC. Matt and Avery (for that matter) could have asked them to move back. Being close to the top players in the world is one thing that seperates our sport from any other.