Gee, I'm so thrilled and humbled to be number 1,000 on this thread...

At any rate, just wanted to ask Dave whether he has any plans for an understable (but long-flying) driver along the lines of the Sidewinder. That seems to be an empty spot in the Gateway lineup.

I would say they are NOT quite as overstable as an E blaze, but they do resist turn just as well. The fade is still there, they just get more penetration before cutting.
The flexed E are now flying pretty flat like a Sabre, but they still fade at the very end of the flight.
The thinner flight plate of the hybrid seems have it fading differently than either the E Sabre or E Blaze.
I probably need to use one on the course to get a better idea of what the exact difference is.

Gee, I'm so thrilled and humbled to be number 1,000 on this thread...

At any rate, just wanted to ask Dave whether he has any plans for an understable (but long-flying) driver along the lines of the Sidewinder. That seems to be an empty spot in the Gateway lineup.



I think there may be plans for this. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
Anyways I like what i am hearing especially since I have 0 "e" sabres and I love My "e" blazes. Hope to try some soon.

The Scream should fill the gap.
It's hard to tell of the exact stability, but were shooting for the speed of the Spirit but stability of the E Sabre, But isnt everybody?

The Scream should fill the gap.
It's hard to tell of the exact stability, but were shooting for the speed of the Spirit but stability of the E Sabre, But isnt everybody?



****...there goes having to beat up Illusions!!!!

LOL. Well that's what we are hoping for! Dave, talked to Justin yesterday and the MCO check got there for the discs and Titan. Thanks a bunch again! Also he is sending me a few hybrids to scope out, so I will get back to you soon on the results. :D:D

Dave,

How do you expect the Hybrid to turn out in S plastic? I find that some discs, like the Spirit, are much more overstable in S and some, like the Sabre FX, are slightly less high speed overstable in S.

Thanks!

Dave,

How do you expect the Hybrid to turn out in S plastic? I find that some discs, like the Spirit, are much more overstable in S and some, like the Sabre FX, are slightly less high speed overstable in S.

Thanks!



Yeah, I'm anxious to see what plastic its better in...I'm partial to overstable drivers, so I'm guessing for me its "E".

So I just got my hands on one of the Nike E Spirits. WOW. The plastic feels a lot like the original opaque CE (Innova) stuff, or maybe the new Innova Special Blend, but a little more flexible. Its great. Way more flexible than my other E Spirit, but it feels MUCH heavier. Much more comfortable in the hand, with a less rigid rim and more weight behind it. Only 3 grams heavier though. Cant wait to throw it, and I hope you run many more discs in this type of plastic.

So I just got my hands on one of the Nike E Spirits. WOW. The plastic feels a lot like the original opaque CE (Innova) stuff, or maybe the new Innova Special Blend, but a little more flexible. Its great. Way more flexible than my other E Spirit, but it feels MUCH heavier. Much more comfortable in the hand, with a less rigid rim and more weight behind it. Only 3 grams heavier though. Cant wait to throw it, and I hope you run many more discs in this type of plastic.



They are pretty beefy to start...but I, just like many other team members, have one thats been in the bag over a year, and its GMoney.

Oh, and he just got several thousand punds of the most recent batch and should be eventually running every mold but the Demon and Illusion. (Too much mass for those molds.)

Chris,
I cant figure out how to start a thread on the Gateway open.
It is September 17 changed from the 18th and it is still at Creve coeur.
Can you start a thread under pdga events and I will add the flyer?

Chris,
I cant figure out how to start a thread on the Gateway open.
It is September 17 changed from the 18th and it is still at Creve coeur.
Can you start a thread under pdga events and I will add the flyer?



I'm all over it.

To bring this thread back to life...any new news from Gateway?

To bring this thread back to life...any new news from Gateway?



The new Hybrid is out! :)
I'll be getting mine in the next few days, so I'll throw the crap out of them and post.

Read some talk earlier about a beadless wizard. Dave, have you found a time to schedule this, and if so, got an idea when this will be released?

[quote
The new Hybrid is out! :)
I'll be getting mine in the next few days, so I'll throw the crap out of them and post.

[/QUOTE]

Is it approved :eek: or is it a proto :D?

[quote
The new Hybrid is out! :)
I'll be getting mine in the next few days, so I'll throw the crap out of them and post.



Is it approved :eek: or is it a proto :D?

[/QUOTE]

I'm not the one to answer, but either way it won't find tourney use until I fully learn it.

Need some help. i want to try out some Gateway Discs and need to ask for some comparisons.
Here is what I throw.
Champion TeeBirds
Rocs (all types)
Champion Firebirds
Champion Sharks
KC Pro Aviars
Champion Leopards

Now, I would like to know what Gateway Discs would be close to what I am currently throwing. The Wizard for sure will replace my Aviars, but how about my other discs ? I like to be able to throw my drivers hard and flat without having them turnover on me, also like to throw drivers with anny for some certain shots. Midrange disc need to be nice and stable, preferably only one mold in my bag for midrange shots, anything comparable to KC Rocs ? Thanks for any help with this.

I thought Innova made the only discs worth throwing? :o

Aviar = Wizard (soft / super soft)
Rock = ElementX / beaten Demon / beaten Blaze
Shark = retooled E Element
Firebird = Illusion / Spirit / Hybrid??
Teebird = old E Blaze / CE Sabre / Hybrid??
Leopard = old E Sabre

old = those G-i number discs :o

Champion TeeBirds <font color="red">New "E" Sabre....maybe "E" Hybrid...I'll get back to you when I throw mine </font>
Rocs (all types) <font color="red"> "S" ElementX for straight to slight hyzer and "E" Blaze for strong hyzers </font>
Champion Firebirds <font color="red"> No brainer..."E" Spirit! Same stability, but faster and longer flying!! </font>
Champion Sharks <font color="red"> "E" Element...best kept secret around! </font>
KC Pro Aviars <font color="red"> Firm "S" Wizards </font>
Champion Leopards <font color="red"> Do you use these as longer Rocs? If so, try a "S" Sabre </font>




You will absolutly fall in love with the Blaze, Spirit and Element!!!!

I still have that box of sample discs, I'll let Bob Benner throw some. It's just impossible to get Gateway discs out here, without paying retail. I'd still love to try some of the "h" plastic, the box Dave sent me had "s" plastic discs. Gateway makes the right kind of discs for a lot of people, especially big arms.

Finding something like the shark in gateway might be hard, might be better off trying to find a flippy sabre, or beat one in or something. For the firebird, i'd say the spirit is probably what your're looking for, illusion would probably not be stable enough. And hopefully the hybrid will be like the teebird only better.

Champion TeeBirds <font color="red">New "E" Sabre....maybe "E" Hybrid...I'll get back to you when I throw mine </font>
Rocs (all types) <font color="red"> "S" ElementX for straight to slight hyzer and "E" Blaze for strong hyzers </font>
Champion Firebirds <font color="red"> No brainer..."E" Spirit! Same stability, but faster and longer flying!! </font>
Champion Sharks <font color="red"> "E" Element...best kept secret around! </font>
KC Pro Aviars <font color="red"> Firm "S" Wizards </font>
Champion Leopards <font color="red"> Do you use these as longer Rocs? If so, try a "S" Sabre </font>




You will absolutly fall in love with the Blaze, Spirit and Element!!!!


Actually, I use the Leopard for long rollers. They seem to hold their line pretty well. Thanks for the info on the discs. I can live without a disc that is comparable to the Champion Shark as long as I have a nice overstable midrange. I like rocs, and prefer only carrying one type of midrange disc, but a few of the same mold beat in at different levels. Thanks again for your help :cool:

Bob,
There are several of our discs that have very roc-like qualities.
The E element-X, and S Blaze work well for the straight to slightly overstable mid-range shots, while the S demon or E blaze will work great for the overtsable stuff.
For turnover, most of the bigger arms just throw the wizard or broken in S Blaze, while players with less power may use either E, H or S elements or even element-X's.

A demon could be he one disc, but it takes quite a while to get straight flying ones and they almost always need to be thrown hard.
I see a lot of different players use a wide variety of our discs in mid-range situations.
It just depends on your style.
Even the Sabre can be used as mid-range, but the player must really be able to control the speeds and heights of his/her throws!

After the latest runs of E hybrids, we were able to get a less overstable version than the 1st few and they are flying like faster less overstable Blazes, that get more forward penetration and hold an anhyzer much longer when reversed right out of the hand.
Definitely great into the wind as it hardly gets effected at all, even when thrown low.
I would say the Hybrids are closer to CE teebirds ( the non TL ones), the ones that are really beefy.
We may still sharpen up the nose some on the hybrid and may even make a new less concave wing that could be used on all of our discs in this category ( Sabre, Blaze, Hybrid and demon) and would make them all less overstable.

Hi David is the Hybrid approved by the PDGA yet ?

Dave,
Gonna start a new thread on the hybrid/blaze just because this one has many posts already. Makes it hard to sort.

Is it Started yet?

so dave... you got any results for this weekend? how was the weather?

Kid won by 2 or 3 over me and George was a few back of me. ( we played a few holes in the dark and I was catching Justin and then he hit a jump put to stay up by 2 on the 2nd to last hole), then I let him off the hook for the win by stopping the tourney because of dark, when he couldnt find his drive on the final hole.

So your hobbies are boys huh :cool:

The weather was really nice you should have come down, we had 3 frisbee chicks ;)

bringing the thread back to life....

so dave,
can we get an update on what is new and happening at Gateway?
maybe i should just go read the hybrid thread....

jen

Actually Justin and I spent the last 2 days desiging a 27 hole course about an hour away in Centralia Illinois.
The land is about as good as it gets for disc golf.
There is a recreational nine, a pretty tough 9 and a monster 9.
The baskets should go in within next week or 2.
We have another 27 holes going in a city 30 minutes south of St Louis 9 rec holes in one park and 18 championship holes in another about 2 miles away.

All 54 holes will be Titan -pro-24's.
I cant wait to play these courses.

BTW,
9 Titans went into a park in Tampa Last week and was designed and installed by Johnny and Jen McCray!

Hey Dave I tried looking back in the thread but couldn't find what I was looking for.

I remember reading about a Wizard that wouldn't dimple on the flight plate unless you wanted it to. I currently have a soft and like the feel of it I just don't like that it is getting the dimples. What are your recommendations?

If you can find ones with the engraving in a 4" radius in the center they shouldn't dimple.
We thickened the flight plate about .004-.005 and it seems to keep them from dimpling even in the supersoft!

TB: You may want to send MattCoppel a message about how he did his.
I traded him a QK for a few wizards &amp; one of them he sent had 5 perfect dimples in it. I didn't ask him how he did it, but he said it was intentional (increased drag).
The intentionally dimpled one says "Wizard" on the cape. I have another one that is stamped "Wizard Putt &amp; Approach by Gateway" underneath the guy (which was the new one he sent me)

Im sure if i searched i could find this answer, but im lazy and i want an expert opinion.

Im looking for a firebird type midrange. i know you guys have some really overstable plastic, so im thinking i need to get some gateway in my bag.

i once had a Z wasp as an overstable mid, but im flipping it like crazy now, and i need something more. much more. so i dont have to worry about it every becoming flippy, and ill forever have a <300 hyzer disc.

Im sure if i searched i could find this answer, but im lazy and i want an expert opinion.

Im looking for a firebird type midrange. i know you guys have some really overstable plastic, so im thinking i need to get some gateway in my bag.

i once had a Z wasp as an overstable mid, but im flipping it like crazy now, and i need something more. much more. so i dont have to worry about it every becoming flippy, and ill forever have a <300 hyzer disc.



Demon. Plain and simple...its a Firebirdish disc you can't throw over 300' if you tried!!! You won't be dissapointed!!!

or a e-blaze! not as overstable as the demon, but very useful!

How different is the S Demon from the H demon? iive never tried gateway plastics before, so i dont know how the Bottom line plastic would wear.

Hello Gateway Guys,

I would like to say congrats on your "superglow" discs. I am entering a "Day-Glo" event coming up and needed some new stuff. I got an "E" wizard in superglow, and I've got to say, it dominates all other glow plastic.

Problem is, I'm unable to find any decent drivers in glow plastic. I was wondering if you ever made your sabre or illusion in "superglow". If so, could you point me in the right direction to purchase one. Thanks for helping me out.

Dave, saw the new midnight proto style Wizards at SunKing, and wanted to thank you for running some of this plastic. I was wondering if you have any plans to run it in a different color (pink!), or have any of the original protos hanging around in your stock that weren't black. I really wouldn't care if they were mis-stamps; I love the proto plastic, but I've been playing a lot more nite golf, and trying to to drive with a putter off the tee at 9:00 and spot your disc is like trying to find a needle in a haystack.
-Chris

Hey David I sent you an email about 2 weeks ago concering some gateway stuff did you ever get it.

so i dont know how the Bottom line plastic would wear.



I find it wears very slowly and evenly. In other words they'll get less overstable over time, but you probalby won't notice much of a difference from round to round. I have an S Blaze that I've been using for a year now that looks pretty beat in, but I still use it mostly for hyzer shots. I have a Demon that's a few months old and is still super overstable and hasn't really changed since I got it.

If you can find ones with the engraving in a 4" radius in the center they shouldn't dimple.
We thickened the flight plate about .004-.005 and it seems to keep them from dimpling even in the supersoft!


What engraving are you talking about? I'll take a look at some next time I'm in the new shop in Madison carrying Gateway :D

or a e-blaze! not as overstable as the demon, but very useful!



I would still say Demon...I personally use a Blaze for most hyzer situations, however Blazes can get some distance if you are good at throwing with additional height...Demons are designed for midrange situations.

If you can find ones with the engraving in a 4" radius in the center they shouldn't dimple.
We thickened the flight plate about .004-.005 and it seems to keep them from dimpling even in the supersoft!


What engraving are you talking about? I'll take a look at some next time I'm in the new shop in Madison carrying Gateway :D



Where it usually says "Gateway Disc Sports....PDGA Approved...Putt and Approach etc...."

The newer ones are circled close to the center, wherease that was traditionally out towards the edges.

Just wanted to chime in here. I was so impressed with my gateway Wizards, that I picked up a couple more gateway discs.

I got an E-Sabre and an S Element X recently. This mornings round, my two best shots were with these discs.

I shanked my drive on the first hole, so I had a tough approach. I tried the Element X instead of my usual go-to Z wasp. Long, low, straight, just a touch of fade at the end ... left the disc in the shadow of the basket for a drop in par.

It was the sabre shot that really impressed me. 290 feet with a tight corridor starting just past the halfway point. I usually go with a hyzer flip, or a helix shot that's got to turn into that corridor perfectly. Today, I took my sabre, and just threw it straight down the corridor, just right of the pin. It flew arrow straight, at the very end of it's flight, it faded left, and hit the top of the cage.... one inch higher and it would have aced.

great disc, they will stay in the bag.

Just wanted to chime in here. I was so impressed with my gateway Wizards, that I picked up a couple more gateway discs.

I got an E-Sabre and an S Element X recently. This mornings round, my two best shots were with these discs.

I shanked my drive on the first hole, so I had a tough approach. I tried the Element X instead of my usual go-to Z wasp. Long, low, straight, just a touch of fade at the end ... left the disc in the shadow of the basket for a drop in par.

It was the sabre shot that really impressed me. 290 feet with a tight corridor starting just past the halfway point. I usually go with a hyzer flip, or a helix shot that's got to turn into that corridor perfectly. Today, I took my sabre, and just threw it straight down the corridor, just right of the pin. It flew arrow straight, at the very end of it's flight, it faded left, and hit the top of the cage.... one inch higher and it would have aced.

great disc, they will stay in the bag.



Cool story...I'm glad you like the Sabre...as my overall distance increases, I've been using my Sabres more and more.

KC,
Do you live in KC?
What courses do you like the best?

KC,
Do you live in KC?
What courses do you like the best?



No. My name is Kasey. KC is a quicker way to type it.

I live in Huntsville, AL... home of the 1983 Worlds Championship....rumor says possibly the 2007 worlds too... Luckily, we have 4 local courses. My favorite is the course on Redstone Arsenal, but it's on an army base and I can't get on the base very often. UAH is a professional level course, and it makes me feel like I am no good at this stupid game. I spend most of my time at Brahan Springs, a nice wooded short technical course.... makes me glad you make durable plastic discs.

I thought it was going to be at the NDGC from now on. :confused: :confused:

i don't know. It's a rumor, not a fact. Dean Tannock, and Lavonne Wolfe are pushing for here. It'd be cool, but I doubt it. Maybe a supertour event rather than worlds is more likely.

yeah we are getting another stop on the NT schedule in Tx and i am pretty sure they wanted to have a stationary worlds from now on.

I was hoping we could get the AM worlds in St Louis for 2007 or 2008.

I am hearing rumors the pdga courses may never really happen

why not? I am talking about pro worlds so if you meant AMs nevermind. :D

I was hoping we could get the AM worlds in St Louis for 2007 or 2008.




Yeah, that would be cool.

I was hoping we could get the AM worlds in St Louis for 2007 or 2008.




Yeah, that would be cool.



But you can't play HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! :D:D

I was hoping we could get the AM worlds in St Louis for 2007 or 2008.




Yeah, that would be cool.



But you can't play HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! :D:D



Yeah, so what??!!! :oI may be helping out, seeing how I'm going to be moving there soon! (Hopefully)

I was hoping we could get the AM worlds in St Louis for 2007 or 2008.




Yeah, that would be cool.




You and your girlfriend still together?
But you can't play HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! :D:D



Yeah, so what??!!! :oI may be helping out, seeing how I'm going to be moving there soon! (Hopefully)

O david would find a way. Maybe dress like a women and enter as a AM women. To bad because ROSS would beat him.

Dr.Schmidt

Dr. Ross? :D:D

nikki Ross, that chick that one three in a row.

DR.Schmidt
TEAM GDS
TEAM LONG TEE
www.par72discgolf.com (http://www.par72discgolf.com)

Oh I though you mean the infamous Dr. Ross. :D:D

hahahh

Dr

i hope this dosent sound like a stupid question, but is there any possible way for me to buy a glo wizard? i figure they are limited, but there is one on ebay, and id much rather buy straight from you guys, so i know where my money is goin. and what type of plastic is that? i was planning on buying a firm wizard before, or possibly an E. i cant use flimsy plastic, even if it does soposedly catch the chains better.

they have some glow E that is quite stiff. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

how can i buy it though? its not on the website...

call the shop 314-487-5204 :D:D

Hey everyone, I have a few questions. I just recently got turned on to a few Wizards and decided to try them. Whooo boy! They are the best putter I have ever used! So I started reading this to get some info about other Gateway discs because they are pretty rare around here. I like how helpful everyone is on giving advice to people new to Gateway discs. Anyway, I was wondering what Gateway disc is comparable to the Z Xpress? That is my favorite driver for annys. and rollers. Also, when you say that you "flexed" a disc what technique do you use to do that? Thank you.

alright, ill try calling the shop later today....

i hope this dosent sound like a stupid question, but is there any possible way for me to buy a glo wizard? i figure they are limited, but there is one on ebay, and id much rather buy straight from you guys, so i know where my money is goin. and what type of plastic is that? i was planning on buying a firm wizard before, or possibly an E. i cant use flimsy plastic, even if it does soposedly catch the chains better.



I was the one who won that auction... got it in on friday ... glow E plastic is SWEEEEEET!!!! great feel, great glow.

Wizards rule. and not even the super soft is flimsy

Hey everyone, I have a few questions. I just recently got turned on to a few Wizards and decided to try them. Whooo boy! They are the best putter I have ever used! So I started reading this to get some info about other Gateway discs because they are pretty rare around here. I like how helpful everyone is on giving advice to people new to Gateway discs. Anyway, I was wondering what Gateway disc is comparable to the Z Xpress? That is my favorite driver for annys. and rollers. Also, when you say that you "flexed" a disc what technique do you use to do that? Thank you.


Flexed means taking the discs at 10 and 2 like a steering wheel and flexing it back and forth 2 or so inches, just to get it out of perfect roundness.
You can also hold your hands closer together or farher a part to get a more direct flex on the nose of the dics.

Anyway, I was wondering what Gateway disc is comparable to the Z Xpress? That is my favorite driver for annys. and rollers.



I don't think Gateway has anything like the Xpress yet. An E Element would be the closest stabilitywise but is more of a midrange and the Sabre is the closest speed and distancewise, but won't turn over nearly as easily. It will also take more height to get the same distance.

A really beat in S-Illusion will act like an Express

I was wondering if GDS has ever thought of producing a round (4 inch) window sticker with the Wizard logo?
White or Black outline with a clear backing. Maybe put Wizard by Gateway underneath in smaller letters.
That would be so awesome. I'd gladly put it on my truck.
(I just measured the actual stamp &amp; a 4 inch sticker would be perfect)

Just an idea. I'd buy one &amp; I'm sure a lot of other people would too.

sounds good to me

i know i would

I know David Mac is a music fan..... but I'm wondering if he's into old school hard rock/heavy metal like Uriah Heep. Since they have a great record called "Demons & Wizards", I thought I'd ask.......

No he digs the Hippie stuff. :D:D

Thanks for the help everyone! I will look into getting an E Element, it sounds similar to my first run Buzzzs. David, thanks for the flexing tip.I have a 176 Proto Illusion S that I took to the park today. After a little bending it went from being very (for me at least) overstable to holding a nice long S curve with a slight left fade. I know the more I throw it the better it will get!

I want that proto. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I actually bought 2 of them on E bay. The 176 and a 173 that says 1st. run on the bottom. They are white with a G on top.

Yeah I throw them a lot.

I am hoping they will go as far as my Flashes. Are the newer S Illusions as stiff as the Protos?

Yeah but flatter. Get a "H" if anything. :D

I will get one of those when I place my order on Wed. Thanks.

No Prob

sorry for the semi thread jack, but, does anyone have a backpag bag they want to get rid of? preferably full of gateway plastic? :D
pm me..

It appears as if the 2007 AM Worlds will be in Milwaukee, WI. :eek: :eek: :eek: :o:confused: :cool::cool:

Sweet maybe I should've stayed AM. Actually Chris H might try to play ADV in this tournament like he has done before. :D

LOL! Wouldn't suprise me. Dave I will have a check in the mail for you shortly. :cool:

I just picked up the only Gateway disc at our last tourney... not sure what it is... its appears to be overstable, until i throw it... then it's understable... it says G1i on the bottom... thanks!

--Deuce

I bought some real light weight nike illusions while in ST. Louis, but someone at the airport wanted to take one of them. nice disc tho

I just picked up the only Gateway disc at our last tourney... not sure what it is... its appears to be overstable, until i throw it... then it's understable... it says G1i on the bottom... thanks!

--Deuce



Its a Sabre...these fly really REALLY straight if you have a smooth throw. Also, these are more of an old school type disc...they need to be thrown high nose down to fly far. If you try to throw them like a Spirit/Wraith/Crush all they will do is turn and burn no farther than a midrange....but get them in the air and they will be your friend.

Deucey, those were the "good" sabres IMO...I can throw the g1 half decent, but the green E sabre we got for pre-registering at a gds event in April or May sometime turned a lot of my friends off to gateway.

What was the problem with the Green E Sabres, too straight?
Too overstable, too understable, too green :D

If youre used to throwing flat overstable discs, it will take more than a few random throws to figure out the Sabres.
But for players who do figure out the Sabre, I'm sure they will tell you how valuable the disc is to their line-up.

It is hard to believe someone ( or "a lot of people") would be turned off on a whole company by one disc. :confused:

I'm from an Innova dominated area..I swear, it's like a dictatorship around here at times. I was throwing it as a second shot on almost every hole(except for woods) and no matter how I threw it, it was just understable. Anyone(deuce, woj) that has seen me throw, will back me up on the fact that I have a noodle arm, can't even break 250 with a mid (roc, wasp, element-x, demon) or 300 with a driver.

Disclaimer: I am in no means trying to turn this into a bash Dave or Gateway topic..I've kept every other Gateway Disc in my bag until the darn tree gnomes got ahold of them, can't live without my G5i demon, and would use more if it was easier to get here.

I'm from an Innova dominated area..I swear, it's like a dictatorship around here at times. I was throwing it as a second shot on almost every hole(except for woods) and no matter how I threw it, it was just understable. Anyone(deuce, woj) that has seen me throw, will back me up on the fact that I have a noodle arm, can't even break 250 with a mid (roc, wasp, element-x, demon) or 300 with a driver.




I have the opposite problem with Sabres...I can't get them to turn over enough.

I can see how people who are used to throwing all Innova would be turned off by the Sabre. It doesn't really fly like any Innova disc I've thrown and it does take some getting used to. The fact that they are green probably makes it worse. I already have a negitive view of the E Hybrid because the only color I could get was green and I lost it almost immediately. The S Hybrid, on the other hand, is a whole different story. ;)

Can I Have,
Sorry to hear the disc doesnt work so well for you.
Have you let others throw it?
It sounds like you may have a little too much turbulance in your release for the Sabre, Thats kinda why we made the Hybrid!
Maybe you should use it as a roller disc or pass it along to someone with less power.

Garu,
Too bad about the E Hybrid,
That Batch of green was from some of the Nike Spirit rejects.
I now the plastic is really durable but of course Green gets lost too easy on grassy courses.

If someone wants to trade me something for a Sabre I'd be up for it.
I have a 170g Champ eagle with a crappy die job, or a 170g Quarter K. That's about all I have that I would trade out that's worth an equal trade.


Also, could someone at GDS reply to my question above about the stickers.

Thanks.

I already have a negitive view of the E Hybrid because the only color I could get was green and I lost it almost immediately. The S Hybrid, on the other hand, is a whole different story.



So I've been taking some gateway plastic for a test. I also got a pea green E hybrid and dull orange E Illusion. The hybrid isn't my cup of tea....but the illusion I maxed way past my orcs. Very nice stuff. Curious how it would break in through the woods.

One comment...I have this dull orange in that illusion and an element-X. That has to be one of the worse colors in my area. For a drivers...its a nightmare at stafford in the fall. Great stuff though....just gotta believe its gonna by parked under the basket.

isnt that always the first place you look under and in the basket

If someone wants to trade me something for a Sabre I'd be up for it.
I have a 170g Champ eagle with a crappy die job, or a 170g Quarter K. That's about all I have that I would trade out that's worth an equal trade.


Also, could someone at GDS reply to my question above about the stickers.

Thanks.


Whats the question on the stickers?

I believe it was do you guys create any stickers, like the wizard stamp on a bumper sticker or something like that.

i think lots of people would be interested in one, including myself

Oops. I forget others may not have 50 posts listed per page..... so I'll cut & paste it :)

I was wondering if GDS has ever thought of producing a round (4 inch) window sticker with the Wizard logo?
White or Black outline with a clear backing. Maybe put Wizard by Gateway underneath in smaller letters.
That would be so awesome. I'd gladly put it on my truck.
(I just measured the actual stamp & a 4 inch sticker would be perfect)

Just an idea. I'd buy one & I'm sure a lot of other people would too.

Can I Have,
Sorry to hear the disc doesnt work so well for you.
Have you let others throw it?
It sounds like you may have a little too much turbulance in your release for the Sabre, Thats kinda why we made the Hybrid!
Maybe you should use it as a roller disc or pass it along to someone with less power.




I did pass it along to someone with a little less power, and a lot smoother of a throw. It's still slightly flippy for him as well..it's 174, and he usually throws 170 XL's


Do you have the misprint deal on all your discs? I know about the wizards, but once I get some money(just graduated college) I'm thinking of getting some demons and a few other random discs.

So what's the word on the Demon FX? I just got 2 of them the other week and have thrown one a few times. Is this like the old Sabre FX's and its just cooled on a fixture so it's more overstable? All I know is this thing makes every other Demon I have ever thrown look stable, not overstable by comparison.

Rodney,
Its been so long since I test flew any demons, I'm not sure how stable/overstable they are right now.
If it says FX it was cooled on a fixture and more overstable than other demons from the same run without it written on the back.
What color what stamp is on the discs?


PS,
I'm hoping Justin has sent you discs from our trade by know.

David.

They are both mustard yellow with the Demonhead stamp. One's 174 and the other is 175 with the 175 being the one I'm throwing.

Justin sent me the box from our trade long enough ago that I already threw 2 of the E Wizards into the pond on my home course and have gotten one back. They are almost the overstable putters I was looking for. Is there any plans to run them in the harder E like the Elements? I don't want them as putters but more as a short range driver.

If you haven't sent Brad McCoy the merch for his GDS event in 2 weeks yet please get Justin to drop a couple more of those Demons in there with the stuff. both of us would appreciate it.

Rodney

Rodney,
I will make sure Brad gets some demons as well as some E wizards.
I will look for some firm E and try and send a few of those as well.

Do you guys play much glow golf?
We have plenty of AWESOME Glow Wizards and Sabres as well as some Elements and Element-X's.
Tell brad to let me know if he wants any to sell, we will put a few in the CTP's and ring of fire prizes either way!

David, I know you have a beadless wizard in the works. But I would love an overstable putter with a profile similar to a wizard...is that too much to ask?

David, I know you have a beadless wizard in the works. But I would love an overstable putter with a profile similar to a wizard...is that too much to ask?



Not to be negative, but most would consider the Wizard overstable as is...you may just have some flutter in your release.

I'm a level 5 Chimpanzee, in milk carton-world! I've got a magic gumdrop and everything!

I'm a level 5 Chimpanzee, in milk carton-world! I've got a magic gumdrop and everything!



Wow...not quite sure what to make of this. :confused: :D

We are the Lego Buddhists. We are here to protect you from the Tibetan barley sugar of Innova.

David, I know you have a beadless wizard in the works. But I would love an overstable putter with a profile similar to a wizard...is that too much to ask?



Not to be negative, but most would consider the Wizard overstable as is...you may just have some flutter in your release.



I haven't thrown a new wizard in a while...mine is a really beat up old one with the dots stamp. It flies straight to understable, so I end up using a Rhyno as driving putter, but I hate the thumbtrack on it.

Get an "E" Wiz.

It has a thumbtrack ... hmm, I didn't notice. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
The 1st run Champions do not have a thumbtrack.

Oh ... you said Rhyno ... not Gator. The Gator doesn't have a thumbtrack.

Get an "E" Wiz.



That too. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif :D

What would you liken the E wiz to in terms of stability to say..a D challenger(my go to putter right now)?

Man, I'd get them from him except I'm already getting him to order me a bag so I'm pretty much spent out for now. I definitely want some glow Elements and X's but just cant do it right now.

I dunno as I only throw Wizards but they are BEEFY :D

I know most of the Nike plastic was used in green discs (bad color, but it's supposed to be great plastic)

I was wondering was that color green used in any standard evolution plastics as well. Does that color green mean that it's nike plastic???

Ok.... I'll be specific...
are These (http://cgi.ebay.com/2-new-GATEWAY-E-WIZARD-PUTTERS-160g-disc-golf-frisbee_W0QQitemZ7194458998QQcategoryZ20851QQrdZ1Q QcmdZViewItem) nike plastic?

I know most of the Nike plastic was used in green discs (bad color, but it's supposed to be great plastic)

I was wondering was that color green used in any standard evolution plastics as well. Does that color green mean that it's nike plastic???

Ok.... I'll be specific...
are These (http://cgi.ebay.com/2-new-GATEWAY-E-WIZARD-PUTTERS-160g-disc-golf-frisbee_W0QQitemZ7194458998QQcategoryZ20851QQrdZ1Q QcmdZViewItem) nike plastic?



No, those aren't. As far as I know the only other time Nike plastic has been used other than Spirits (And expiriment Illusions) was a little bit of it in some "E" Hybrids.

Hey guys I have another question maybe someone can answer. I just got a Demon from E bay and it feels different from the S plastic. It feels stiffer and it looks shiny and slick.Is it possibly H plastic? Thanks.

Hey guys I have another question maybe someone can answer. I just got a Demon from E bay and it feels different from the S plastic. It feels stiffer and it looks shiny and slick.Is it possibly H plastic? Thanks.



If it has just the Demon head stamp, its probably just some "S" that ran slicker...there haven't been "H" Demons in some time. They are just as durable as most other "S" and with some weathering actually grip better....you just have to stick with it a while, and soon you will never want to give it up!!

It doesn't have any stamp on it. I like the way it feels, like it may be a little more durable than the S Demon I have. I tend to throw flat to slightly anny. and I love how the Demons fly!

It doesn't have any stamp on it. I like the way it feels, like it may be a little more durable than the S Demon I have. I tend to throw flat to slightly anny. and I love how the Demons fly!




Good to hear...I know a ton of people that are hard core Innova or Discraft guys, but the Demon and Wizard find their ways into those bags!!

Strangly with the exception of JohnE not many gateway throwers use them becasue the BLAZE is the S H I T. :D

Strangly with the exception of JohnE not many gateway throwers use them becasue the BLAZE is the S H I T. :D



I was thinking the same exact thing! I used to use mine a lot, but I haven't had a Demon in bag since joining the team last year.

"Set your game a-Blaze!!!"

Strangly with the exception of JohnE not many gateway throwers use them becasue the BLAZE is the S H I T. :D



I was thinking the same exact thing! I used to use mine a lot, but I haven't had a Demon in bag since joining the team last year.

"Set your game a-Blaze!!!"



Yeah what he said

Have you guys gotten any of the retooled Hybrids.
They seem to be faster now than Sabres but very hard to flip over even when thrown low!.
I think they work best when thrown like a spirit , turned over slighly right out of the hand and right down the middle. I havent gotten one broken in yet and was wodering if anyone has any comments on the new ones.
BTW the new ones will most likely have the Hybrid stamp that looks like 2 orbits around the word Hybrid.
The nose is sharper and the flight plate is thinner.
Players who flip Sabres or cant get enough D out of the blaze should give one a workout!

Hey Dave I need to get a hold of some of the newer stuff and I will gibe Justin a call sometime this week. If I get any I will give you my thoughts. Btw I found a spot in my bag for the hybrid. :D

I'm going to cover a few things here. What's the future of the E plastic of the pearl, yellow, pink and clear Gateway discs? After one round they break in, develop a little more glide and stay that way. Is the H plastic used in the light red and orange Illusions used in other Gateway discs? I really like the way the old orange E Blaze flies and figured that a Blaze in the newer H would fly about the same because the plastic feels the same. I did have a couple of orange Demons in H plastic with a dome that were much less stable than there S counterparts. They had the demon face stamp and everything. I should have kept them.

I'm going to cover a few things here. What's the future of the E plastic of the pearl, yellow, pink and clear Gateway discs? After one round they break in, develop a little more glide and stay that way. Is the H plastic used in the light red and orange Illusions used in other Gateway discs? I really like the way the old orange E Blaze flies and figured that a Blaze in the newer H would fly about the same because the plastic feels the same. I did have a couple of orange Demons in H plastic with a dome that were much less stable than there S counterparts. They had the demon face stamp and everything. I should have kept them.



Ok I really don't know what you are asking but the same H is used in all of the discs available in that plastic. I know there were some E/H blends but I don't think they were what you are talking about.

The post is a little confusing :o. I wanted to know what E and H plastics are going to be used in future runs of discs. At my local shop I've purchased a couple different E and H plastics in newer runs of discs in the past few months.

Do supersoft wizards have the same stamp as the soft wizard ?(The wizard in the center)

I'm pretty sure the newer E will have a little Nike in them (if dave has a supply of it) and the H should stay how it is in the newest runs.

Do supersoft wizards have the same stamp as the soft wizard ?(The wizard in the center)



Yeah but some have a Supersoft stamp :D

Demons are available in H plastic?

Demons are available in H plastic?



They have been in the past...there might be some at the shop as well. They are obviosuly domier, and stay straighter longer if turned over right out of the hand, but still finish like a Demon.

Demons are available in H plastic?



They have been in the past...there might be some at the shop as well. They are obviosuly domier, and stay straighter longer if turned over right out of the hand, but still finish like a Demon.



I hit an ace a couple years ago with an H-Demon. I think the name for it then was a Scout.

I got a scout from Chris Farnham (sp?), threw it yesterday at my dog that was barking, and I think I got em with it!!!

I guess one could say I hit the dog leg right. :p

Dave, those new runs of "E" Illusions, black Wizards, re-tooled Hybrids, and glo-Sabres are looking and flying great!
Everyone at the GDStour event today were way stoked with them. Can't wait to get out tomorrow and huk some myself. Will call you tomorrow with results and info from the event. Once again thanks a bunch! Those torphies were the shizznit!!! Hasta. :cool:

Scoot_er,

I just got in some E/Nike Blend Illusions and Spirits today. Pretty sweet!!

Give them a good workout and tell me how they work. I will be getting some next week.

The E illusions seem to really glide far without falling off much, nikko says the H seem beefy.
We also ran some E elementX-s that have the orginal stiff CE roc feel and the flight is also very close.
Maybe I should just stamp 2001 CE roc on them :D

were there any E-Evolution SuperGlow Wizards ever run?

When are you expecting to release the Magic?

were there any E-Evolution SuperGlow Wizards ever run?


Yes but I'm not sure we have any left, I know I saw one partially dyed haning n the retail wall.
You can call the shop 324 487 5204 or email [email protected] to find out.

When are you expecting to release the Magic?


sometime after the first of the year.
Ther still are so many people who havent had a chance to buy a wizard in person, most are getting them on line through our vendors.
We need to do a whole lot of work on distribution this year.

You want a factored Wizard?
we have been thinking about factoring 1500 so they are pdga legal.

You want a factored Wizard?
we have been thinking about factoring 1500 so they are pdga legal.



Sure, I would love to try one. Lately, I have liked putting with an Aviar P&A because I can make it hold a straight line with less effort. The Wizard wants to get overstable unless I really gun it at the basket. A less stable Wizard (Wizard-L LMAO!) would be sweet.

If we decide to work on our high speed stuff next we will try and factor a few runs and send some out for responses.
Your on list bug guy.

If we decide to work on our high speed stuff next we will try and factor a few runs and send some out for responses.
Your on list big guy.



Thanks a lot! :D

No he said BUG guy. :DHey Dave go to www.Stickitdg.com (http://www.Stickitdg.com) there is a pretty active Gateway thread and I'm sure they would like you to answer some questions instead of me. :D

yea that would help out alot because your have alot better answers than what we have been giving even though what we have given i think has been working but david if you could go to the site and help out some on the gateway forum it would really be appricated

just started throwing a wizard (first gateway ive ever thrown) and it rocks...the wiz has definately lived up to the hype it gets...thanks for a great disc....i have had problems using putters as drivers but this thing flys great! might have to try some more plastic in the near future...

just ordered 5 wizards :cool:

Did you get any E wizards or did you get other Gateway models besides putters?

just got putters...i requested two E putters (thats what i'm throwing now)

dave
i was wondering if you had any new custom stamps in the works, like the different dead and bonnaroo stamps i have seen and own. the past few summers at different music festivals i have came across alot of cool stamped discs and most of them have been gateway. i was hoping there could be something new in the works for 06, like phish or moe or possible another dead stamp(even though there are a good amount right now). is there any way you could custom stamp like 10-15 discs?
-james s.

If you want to pay for the stamp ( about $50) I would stamp 10 discs for you at rrgeualr wholseale prices
send an email to [email protected] and I will sned you a few documents

Questions:

Which type plastic is perferred in the Illusion?

And is there any glow illusions?

Hey Adam the H is good but I hear d the new ones in E are better.

Dave, were there any wizards made in the nike plastic? What was the color of that plastic? Thanks,

I doubt he would waste the plastic on putters as they are not affected as much when the hit trees or other objects. So what I'm trying to say is no they were only made in driver molds.

I doubt he would waste the plastic on putters as they are not affected as much when the hit trees or other objects. So what I'm trying to say is no they were only made in driver molds.



Yeah, that and they would be pretty light w/o tampering with the mold. (IE making the flight plate thicker...like the CryZtal Challenger mold)

Is that #18 at Blueberry, Matt?

Actually some runs of the Original Orange E Wizards had some of the nike in the mix, but of course we had to add weight filler to get them up to 175.
We also used some in 1 or 2 runs of the white E, but we had 10 or 12 different runs, so it may be hard to tell.
Weve used seveeral different Urethanes similiar to the nike Stuff and have some TPU now that is pretty much the same.
Since each or our molds are of different size almost all runs of E are some sort of blend of 2 TPU's.
The nike or nike(ish) stuff is the closest to Original CE and we try to use as mush as possible in the blends! :cool:

Is that #18 at Blueberry, Matt?




Nope it is from worlds. :D

Wow, that looks almost identical to #18 at Blueberry. It looks as though you drove to the top of the hill and have an anhyzer putt for deuce.

Wow, that looks almost identical to #18 at Blueberry. It looks as though you drove to the top of the hill and have an anhyzer putt for deuce.



In that case yeah your right. BTW I hit the putt for 2 :D

I just got in a new order tonight and also had to unSTICK the UPS guy after he gave me the discs. The new plastic feels so sweet. It is tacky but durable(I know I have already used my teeth and a knife. The feel of the plastic reminds me of the Pro line stuff innova released right after the CE stuff. I get out of school early tomorrow so I will give a review on how the discs fly.

Matt,
Did you get both H and E illusions?
If so how are they reacting to your power and techinque?.
I know the H are a bit springy and feel great in the cold weather, but you shouldnt have to worry about that in Texas.
BTW,
I think Rick is pretty excited about gateway especially the E Wizard.
If you talk to him, make sure he knows most players want Soft and medium Wizards in the S.

How did it Fly? :D

Hey Rt,
Nice to see your still around.
How have you been?

Pretty Good, Just working my tail off and Discin it up, here in San Antonio. Yourself? Plan on placing an order with Gateway disc Sport's soon. The local store is about out and I have aced all of my wizard's and G5i's, they have made it on the wall! :cool:

I don't feel like going back through 116 pages so I'll just ask. If I wanted a straight/slightly overstable driver, would an "S" Hybrid be a good choice, or would something else be better. Also, how are hybrids or the new suggestion at handling headwinds? Thanks.

How far can you throw your Wizards? ( or putter)
An E or S hybrid would be a perfect Sloghtly over stable driver, as long as you can throw your putter 300.If you only have 200 or so (putter power) A hybrid would be more of an overstable mid-range.
If you can throw drivers over 400 than you could do just about anything you want with a hybird up to 350 or so.

I can throw putters (wizard or challenger), with accuracy, max of about 250-280. I can throw them 300ft. but not with great accuracy. I am still figuring out how high to throw putters. I throw mostly teebirds and wasp/buzzz for anything 250-350 if there is no wind. If there is wind I throw wasps, overstable teebirds, and firebirds, maybe an orc. My distance drivers (orc, beast, sidewinder) i can throw about 350-420. I've throw over 420ft, but I have lost alot of distance in the past few months.

What gateway disc flies similar to a Beat-in-Firebird/Overstable-Teebird/Banshee?

H iLlusion or slightly beat Spirit as long as the trajectory is low.

Dave and Justin have hooked me up with some H Spirits and illusions in the past. And the spirit, if you give it some flexing, is just like throwing a slightly beat up orc, but faster. I had one that I flexed a bit too much and it was a great distance disc because I could use it for hyzer flips. The illusion, is ok, but I never could quite get used to it. It is an extremely fast disc though. Either one would be a great disc to replace a beast or an orc. If you are looking for a teebird'ish type disc, the hybrid is the closest thing on the market to a teebird in my opinion. It is a great control driver or fairway driver. It works well as a midrange if you take a little bit off. Anyway...just my two cents worth.

Dave and Justin have hooked me up with some H Spirits and illusions in the past. And the spirit, if you give it some flexing, is just like throwing a slightly beat up orc, but faster. I had one that I flexed a bit too much and it was a great distance disc because I could use it for hyzer flips. The illusion, is ok, but I never could quite get used to it. It is an extremely fast disc though. Either one would be a great disc to replace a beast or an orc. If you are looking for a teebird'ish type disc, the hybrid is the closest thing on the market to a teebird in my opinion. It is a great control driver or fairway driver. It works well as a midrange if you take a little bit off. Anyway...just my two cents worth.



Well said Joe...I'm anxiously awaiting being able to throw again, including the newer Hybrids....word has it that John E. is loving these.

Chirs B,
Do you have a lot of snow on the ground?
We had a 50 degree day yesterday, 9 of us played 2 rounds at the new course in Centralia. 66 was the best on the long to short and 61 from the short to short, both by Justin.
I shot poorly 73 71( man I need some practice "off the course".

Call me sometime soon!

*
*
Happy holidays to you and all who have supported Gateway this year, From Justin, Ozzy and myself!!

We've actually had a nice few couple of days, I'm just working so much I haven't been able to much but putt in my basement.

I'll give you a call after Christmas and we can work things out.

I have reached a new level in my game. I broke a course record tied one and played within three strokes of those scores all week (in the WIND) all because of Blake_T helping my putting and rolling game out and the new E illusions which freakin bomb. :DToday I played -1 on a course in 25mph winds and the next best score was +7. The SSA for that course is +3 so that was like a 1045 round and I had the 1st three ever on this 795ft dogleg left uphill hole with a ten foot putt so I am stoked. Like two days ago on the same course I played -5 with a moderate wind compared to today but it rated more like 1060. Ok sorry for the rant but the E illusions are SWEET and they are the best flying ones i have thrown in that they have a very good flight pattern. I threw the new STAR Wraith this weekend and it flew suprisingly well but when I threw the Illusion it outdistanced it by like 20ft on a low line. The sweet part was that it was 75 degrees out today. Ok I'm tired Merry Christmas peoples.

I have reached a new level in my game. I broke a course record tied one and played within three strokes of those scores all week (in the WIND) all because of Blake_T helping my putting and rolling game out and the new E illusions which freakin bomb. :DToday I played -1 on a course in 25mph winds and the next best score was +7. The SSA for that course is +3 so that was like a 1045 round and I had the 1st three ever on this 795ft dogleg left uphill hole with a ten foot putt so I am stoked. Like two days ago on the same course I played -5 with a moderate wind compared to today but it rated more like 1060. Ok sorry for the rant but the E illusions are SWEET and they are the best flying ones i have thrown in that they have a very good flight pattern. I threw the new STAR Wraith this weekend and it flew suprisingly well but when I threw the Illusion it outdistanced it by like 20ft on a low line. The sweet part was that it was 75 degrees out today. Ok I'm tired Merry Christmas peoples.



Man...I haven't played on the course in weeks...stop making me jealous! But seriously, I can't wait to throw the newer Illusions.

Is there anyway I could get a deal on a couple of Hybrids? Maybe some X-outs or whatever. I just want to try them out and the only locals that throw gateway throw Speed Demons, Elements, and the occasional Illusion and Spirit.

Yeah you can get 5 for $35 with the mistamp deal. :D

A) I thought that was only for wizards.
2) I only want 2.
iii) Why aren't hybrids on the website or web-store?
d) How come I live within 5 hours of St. Louis and have yet to see any store that sells gateway?

Why don't you give Gateway Disc Sport's a call?
/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

A) I thought that was only for wizards. <font color="red">Pretty sure its for any/all mis-stamps.</font>
2) I only want 2. <font color="red"> You'd have to call and see about this. </font>
iii) Why aren't hybrids on the website or web-store? <font color="red"> It badly needs updating. </font>
d) How come I live within 5 hours of St. Louis and have yet to see any store that sells gateway? <font color="red"> Dunno...request stores to carry more selection. </font>

If you have alocal dealer that may be intersted in selling our discs, have them call of send me there contact info [email protected]
We rarley make outward sales call, only pursue those that contact us or leads reccomended by players.
We already have a hard time keeping up with 10 molds and 3 types of plastic.
We sold neraly 40,000 discs this year and could have sold 100,000 if we had up front capitol to make that many.
We may be selling some stock in our compant in order to raise some capitol.
The paper work is 2/3rds complete and may be sending it out by the end of January after we get a good run of E in all of our molds to show the potential investors.

We sell missed stamped specials of 5 for $35 or 10 for $50 and you can get what ever we have in stock.
Marshall street just bought SEVERA: hundred, so I'm not sure what all we have left!
You may want to ask me by email or call ths shop 314 487 5204 after 10:00 am central

What is gateways longest driver? In what plastic?

Well...I have seen Shawn Sinclair crush the living crap out of an 844 Sabre. But for the normal thrower...I would go with the H or E Spirit right now. Just my opinion.

What is gateways longest driver? In what plastic?



Hey Adam if you are coming to the LSS Macgregor stop I will let you throw some of my stuff. IMO the longest for golf shots is the New E Illusions. :D

Hey Matt,
Yea I picked up an H- Illusion over christmas. Pretty nice disc. I also just came across an E Hybrid. Was wondering about your thoughts on these, I don't know anything about them.

Also, I've seen you putt with Wizards, I was wondering what firmness and plastic you perfer.

Hey Matt,
Yea I picked up an H- Illusion over christmas. Pretty nice disc. I also just came across an E Hybrid. Was wondering about your thoughts on these, I don't know anything about them.

Also, I've seen you putt with Wizards, I was wondering what firmness and plastic you perfer.



I used to use SS wizards put I have recently switched to mediums and E wizards.

I have been throwing around the idea of moving to some Gateway equipment...Devan Owens and Justin Bougher let me throw their Gateway discs sometimes and I have to say I really like a few of em'.

I am already hooked on the Element "S", for me it's the best understable midrange on the market by far.

Keep up the good work fellas,
mc

Does Twisted flyer still have some of our discs avaiable?

how are the new illusions in h? are they more domey [less low speed overstable] than e? i threw a h months ago and really liked it

Steven,
I would say they are a little more domey then past H and are less low speed overstable.
They are a bit easier to flip up from Hyzer with the dome and will glide longer before hyzering.
The H are pretty Gummy and the while E are firmer they still tacky are a bit smoother on the surface. I would say the E are not as domey, but not flat and are more low speed overstable.

For those that do not Know Gateway plastic, our "E" or Evolution Pro-line is VERY SIMILAR to the star plastic, which is basically a mix of high end polymers.

Does Twisted flyer still have some of our discs avaiable?



Yes, but I think Joe might be running a little low...I grabbed the last couple "S" Elements he had.

Have you ever thrown the black E Elements? or E - ELX

Dave...I have some of the first black e-elements that you guys ran. That plastic is without a doubt the grippiest I have ever felt...and durable. When I got mine, it was about 10 degrees outside and even then it still had a ton of grip to it. One of mine has taken some abuse and it hardly even shows any wear. I think a wizard ran in that plastic would be the bomb. Any thoughts Dave? An ELX would be pretty sweet too.

i got one of the black elements when I was at the store before Christmas; I love that plastic. But even better is the soft E hybrid I picked up. The disc flight is amazing (flips up without flipping over), and the plastic is some of the grippiest I've ever felt. Can you run that softer E plastic with some other discs (wizards perhaps?)

Can you run that softer E plastic with some other discs (wizards perhaps?)




The glow "E" Wizards might fit the bill.

I played a round with all Gateway yesterday...The Illusion, Element, Element X, and Wizard are the dopest discs. I shot an 8 down at Emerald Isle and missed a few putts in the beginning. How does the different plastic affect the flight characteristics? I only have S plastic from Gateway, but **** that Illusion is dope.

Joe,
I saw some E wizards today that we just stamped for Ice bowl, they seemed to be have a little S in the mix, making them not so Shiney)

Depending on the mold we have to blend the E differently to get the right weight and stability.
We will be trying get some of the softer E in most of the molds as it seemed to be popular with a lot of players.
I Know the High speed stuff cannot be too soft in the E as they stay too flat and are a lot more overstable without the dome!

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!!!!

I played a round with all Gateway yesterday...The Illusion, Element, Element X, and Wizard are the dopest discs. I shot an 8 down at Emerald Isle and missed a few putts in the beginning. How does the different plastic affect the flight characteristics? I only have S plastic from Gateway, but **** that Illusion is dope.



If I am remembering correctly, Gateway is unusual among disc manufacturers in that their second-tier plastic (in a manner of speaking at least) tends to be the least overstable in any given mold, which I think is because it cools with the most dome. (I may be completely off here but I think I heard that once.)

Speaking as someone who plays a lot on heavily wooded courses and a fair amount on a course with a lot of gravel, I can give you my own impressions of stability and durability...

S plastic has what most people would probably consider the best grip. It is usually rather stiff, has a dryish grippy texture, and rather misleadingly feels brittle enough to shatter against the first tree...it isn't. S plastic holds up better than DX or Pro-D, in my opinion; it is probably more comparable to Millenium (non-Q) or Elite X plastic in terms of overall durability. S plastic tends to be rather overstable when new, especially in molds that are designed to be overstable such as the Demon and the Speed Demon, because it molds up very flat. However, Gateway in general and S discs in particular is designed to be beaten in to where it flies how it should and then stay there for a long time rather than to fly well out of the box and then become useless after a few tree shots.

H plastic is usually a little slicker and has much more dome and flexibility. In my experience the current H plastic, especially in drivers, is a little more resistant than S to deformity of the rim and flight plate, but more likely to develop uncomfortable nicks and burrs on the edge and rim that may require a little sanding from time to time. Some of the older H plastic was actually a sort of H/S blend, as I understand it, and in particular discs like the Chief and the Scout (as opposed to the H-Wizard or H-Demon as they are now called) are likely to be found in a slightly grippier plastic that especially in the case of the Scout feels a lot like the early Evolution Element-X's...very similar to some of my favorite runs of KC Roc/Aviar plastic in feel, but more resistant to abrasion. H plastic tends to be less overstable than S or E in any given mold, although I think this may be less true for the high-speed drivers.

Evolution plastic has seen what has seemed to me to be a fair amount of variation. Either that or some H and E discs I've used have been mislabeled. Some of the opaque Evolution is almost indistinguishable from some of the H runs except that after using them for a while I tend to notice that the E resists nicks on the edge a little better. Some of the E runs are slicker and more translucent and remind me more of some of the older millenium Quantum runs or of the X/Z blend in which the Riptide and Tsunami were made. Some E that I've used is opaque but flexible and feels almost rubbery but holds up very well, especially to abrasion; this is some of my favorite stuff...it's what my tie-died E Illusions are and I wonder if it might have some of the Nike plastic in it. And then there are the clear Evolution runs and the milky white versions of the Sabre and Element, which are quite frankly the only things I've thrown that seem more indestructible than my favorite runs of Z plastic. These seem to fall between the S and H in terms of stability right out of the box, but especially in the less sharp-edged molds they will probably take longer to break in unless you specifically try to encourage them to do so. In the sharp-edged drivers though it almost seems as if they break in faster than the S...I had a 150 class S Illusion that was almost as overstable as my high-weight Evolution Speed Demon at the time and had probably been used more.

I hope this helps. Bear in mind though, this is only one person's testimony and I have thrown a relatively small amount of S plastic in particular.

And now as something of a shameless plug, the Evolution Sabre is my absolute favorite Gateway disc of all time. I don't have the technique to use it as a distance driver, but it is versatile enough to handle anything from putting (though I have to be careful since I usually use very straight putters and it won't fly dead straight at low speed without a lot of spin) to fairway and tee shots too long for me to throw with a midrange. Forehand or backhand, this disc does everything. The one I'm using now is one of the milky white ones and I have a clear one in storage in case anything happens to it...but so far it's just broken in almost perfectly and gotten stuck there, and despite having gotten some dirt ground in so well I can't ever seem to get it all the way clean it barely seems to have any wear and tear on it at all.

P.S. I am not even a diehard Gateway disciple to be spouting such praise, either. I carry--and use--eight different brands of discs right now. I just happen to think that highly of the Sabre.

Great summery...its nice to see that people are taking notice of the things David is doing!

Can you run that softer E plastic with some other discs (wizards perhaps?)




The glow "E" Wizards might fit the bill.



I've got a glo E Wizard, but this softer plastic dosn't quite have the same feel.

Bob,
I cannot believe how accurate you are with your descrption of our discs and plastic.
the shop or have been to our factory.
If I could get my vendors to become this educated I would surely be way ahead of the competition.
The only thing that stands out as inaccurate is that MOST H is more grippy than most E, but not 100% of the time.


Older H was an S/H blend and some E does have a little S in it as well, especially in the elements. I like the added surface friction combined with a little dome for the E Elements. S elements are great turnovers but E are great straight flyers.
The S/E blend is hard to do without a lot of rejects, so it's not somethng we plan on producing full time.

Like I said we hope to hone in on our runs over the next few months, Especially in the E, and have some larger runs for more consistancy.

While I throw mostly S, except in the spirit and Illusion. I know most people want BRIGHT colored E, so Thats the direction we are heading.

Thanks for making the post and for being so knowledgable of our products!!!

PS,
The E Sabres are the "teebird" of the Gateway lineup!

Bob,
I cannot believe how accurate you are with your descrption of our discs and plastic.
the shop or have been to our factory.
If I could get my vendors to become this educated I would surely be way ahead of the competition.
The only thing that stands out as inaccurate is that MOST H is more grippy than most E, but not 100% of the time.


Older H was an S/H blend and some E does have a little S in it as well, especially in the elements. I like the added surface friction combined with a little dome for the E Elements. S elements are great turnovers but E are great straight flyers.
The S/E blend is hard to do without a lot of rejects, so it's not somethng we plan on producing full time.

Like I said we hope to hone in on our runs over the next few months, Especially in the E, and have some larger runs for more consistancy.

While I throw mostly S, except in the spirit and Illusion. I know most people want BRIGHT colored E, so Thats the direction we are heading.

Thanks for making the post and for being so knowledgable of our products!!!

PS,
The E Sabres are the "teebird" of the Gateway lineup!



Heheh...well, I almost did go all Gateway for a while, and I was very interested in figuring out exactly what kind of plastic I liked best. I did mean to mention though that the only E plastic I'd used that was more grippy than H was those Illusions I have.

I still think it's funny that the Sabre is supposed to be in the same category as the teebird...I never did like teebirds.

[QUOTE]
Bob,
I
I still think it's funny that the Sabre is supposed to be in the same category as the teebird...I never did like teebirds.



It depends on the player.
Most Gateway pros can throw a sabre like a roc or like a teebird, depending on height and speed!
The retooled Hybrids are closer to orgional CE (non TL) teedirds) the overstable ones!

Can you run that softer E plastic with some other discs (wizards perhaps?)




The glow "E" Wizards might fit the bill.



I've got a glo E Wizard, but this softer plastic dosn't quite have the same feel.



I felt an E-Wizard the other day that wasn't very stiff at all. It was actually kind of soft. Which suprised me. Are all the glow E-wizards soft like this?

All of the Glow E are softer then rgeular E wizards.
They feel really great in cold weather, But I havent actually thrpwn one. I heard they are not as overstable as most E, (must be the increased surface friction)!

All of the Glow E are softer then rgeular E wizards.
They feel really great in cold weather, But I havent actually thrpwn one. I heard they are not as overstable as most E, (must be the increased surface friction)!



I prefer the glow "E"....they resist turn just as well as any putter around, but still fade rather normal for a Wizard....these are great for my game!

Whats the story on the Nike plastic? I keep hearing a lot about it but no details. Are these glow E wizards made of it?

Have you ever thrown the black E Elements? or E - ELX



I have not, I'll check with Devan and Justin to see if they have any...Keep up the good work!

mc

I have 8, max weight in new/unthrown.

I throw both the black "E" element and the "E" element x. They are both really good disc I use them for a bunch of different things. I got an ace with my black element about a week or two after I got the disc so you can tell I like it alot.

Whats the story on the Nike plastic? I keep hearing a lot about it but no details. Are these glow E wizards made of it?



We have used some plastic in our discs that is used at the nike plant here in St Louis.
We get some of there regrind and leftover lots from time to time.
The nike plastic we used in the Geeen Spirits is very sililar to orginal CE, it is really hard to run in golf discs and is also way more expensive than most TPU's.

There were a few runs of E Wizards with some of the nike in the mix, but since the mass of the wizard is small we add heavier materials to get them up to wait so they would never be pure TPU and also be max weight.
The only Nike Wizards were Orange and kind of firm!

The other TPU's we use are a grade or so below the nike stuff, but as good as anything anyone else is using and plenty good enough for golf discs!

Were any Illusions run with some of the Nike plastic and dyed? I'm just curious because the box of Illusions I got a while back don't feel like any other Gateway plastic I've tried. They're very smooth, very durable; the flight plate where they're thin is very flexible but the rim isn't; and I have never encountered a plastic this durable with this kind of a slick but not slippery rubbery grip to it. The undyed undersides are mostly a sort of pale slate blue if that helps.

I picked up an Illusion that had a dragon dyed onto it that was advertised as the Nike hybrid plastic. It's exactly as you describe. I believe I bought it from widiscgolf.

Bob.
The Softer E Illusions you guys are describing is not the Nike stuff, but like I said its pretty close.
The only real difference is the Nike stuff is more resistant to oils and chemicals, which is needed for certain applications in molding, but not at all necessary for golf discs.
There are about a 1000 different polyurethanes and it is very hard to find just one that meets the weight, flex and grip for each particular model, thats why blends of 2 or more are usually used.

We just ran a new version of the Nike plasic in the, Wizard Spirit, and Sabre. ( lots of white discs for those who like to dye :cool:)
Justin Test flew the new E Spirits today and said they were really fasts, easy to control and that the plastic was gripppy and extremely durable. He said they were quite similar to the dark green Original NIke Spirits.
They have a very uniform and consitant dome. but not as domey as the last slightly firmer E spirits.
I am anxious to get out and test fly some!

The spec sheets for the new nike stuf is alomst identical to the older nike stuff, and it is a lot more available :cool:

Will be running some of the new E in The Blazes tomorrow!

We just ran a new version of the Nike plasic in the, Wizard Spirit, and Sabre. ( lots of white discs for those who like to dye :cool:)
Justin Test flew the new E Spirits today and said they were really fasts, easy to control and that the plastic was gripppy and extremely durable. He said they were quite similar to the dark green Original NIke Spirits.
They have a very uniform and consitant dome. but bot as domey as the firmer E spirits.
I am anxious to get out and test fly some!

The spec sheeets for the new stuf is alomst identical to the nike stuff, and it is a lot more available :cool:

Will be running some of the new E in The Blazes tomorrow!



Anxious to hear how the Sabres fly in this plastic...can you report on those for me?

(Also...look for a call from me sometime tomorrow or Friday)

Chris,
The E sbares look really similar to the milky white, but they are a bit more firm and a bit more domey.
That special run of white were really really flat and flexible.
The surface while smooth seems to be rather grippy which could make them stand up if not thrown with a high enough trajectory.
We have some red, orange and a salmon color and placed many over the fixtures (EFX) so I'm sure there are some beefy ones than can be thrown low without flipping.
Most are 174-176.
We just started running blazes about midnight tonight in the new Nike stuff.
Give me a call tomorrow, we are putting in a 9 hole and an 18, 30 minutyes south of St louis in Festus. It's supposed to be 60 degrees so I'm sure the boys will try and get a round in afterward!!!

The E blazes are ran and are almost as flat as the last E. They seem to have just as mush resistance to turn and almost as much fade at the end.
They are nice and grippy with a smooth shiney surface.

The plastic is as durable as any we have made and looks almost axactly like the Star discs I have seen.

It has been really windy the last 2 days, hopefully tomorrows 60 degree day will be less windy for more accurate testing.
On a different note;
I thinned out the flight plate of the Hybrid about 15 more thousandths, bringing it down to about .060 thick( It will be a lot closer by looks to the Saber but the saber has a .090 thick flight plate!)
The nose is a bit sharper now too( maybe even sharper than the sabre) and the .015 also makes it a bit lower profile.
I am excited to run these tomorrow and will post some of the results of testing here tommorow night.

I like what your doing with the Hybrid. The one I've been throwing has performed like a more stable Sabre. Similar distance and line, but holds a hyzer line the whole way. The wind is dying down here in Santa Cruz if you need any help testing discs ;).

I'll second the hybrid. It has found a major spot in my bag; It holds hyzers, and when thrown with power, I can flip it flat without flipping it over, and still get a predictable fade at the end. I'll be interested to know how the refined version flies. If you can make the new hybrid in that soft E plastic, that would be great.

Dave...just wanting to check in with where you guys are at with the Scream. Any release dates yet? Also...love the Hybrid. Flies kind of like an 11x Teebird for me.

Very sweet disc.

David,
short question:
I have a retooled Hybrid that says ERX on the bottom, what kind of plastic is that? I like the feel of it compared to the normal Evo.

David,
short question:
I have a retooled Hybrid that says ERX on the bottom, what kind of plastic is that? I like the feel of it compared to the normal Evo.



Its just writen sloppy...its says "EFX"....its E plastic and the FX means it was cooled on a fixture in efforts to make the wing more concave and/or flatter top...both making it more overstable.

Forgot my other question. Any ETA on the Magic yet Dave?

Thanks
JT

Joe,
Not sure yet on the Scream and Magic, I have a few deals in the works to develop a proprietary line of discs for a few different companies.
I am kind of waiting on the deals to go through before releasing any new models.
I may make another top for the Speed demon, Spirit and Illusion wings, but none of the 3 new discs will be called the scream!
Right now we are just trying to get out in front for the first part of the year on our current models in the Evolution plastic.
We are finally putting together larger batches and even running 24 hours a day.
The New blend of E is looking more consistant from model to model now and we think its as good as any E we've prototyped so far. It is basically the nike stuff with a touch of H to adjust weights and flexibilities.

Innovas new Star plastic is almost identical to our Evolution plastic. You will never see the Star plastic in a clear form because of the blending.

This type of blending holds dye very well, for all you tye dyers out there!!!

We are more than willing to send out blank E discs for the true dye artists, just call the shop or emal me at [email protected]

Today we ran about 1200 E Hybrids with the new retooled mold.
The flight plate is about .070 thick compared to .085-.090 of the sabre.
The nose of the Hybird is still a little beefier than the Sabre, but becuase of the slightly higher starting point to a longer transtition over the top ( not so abrupt)blending into the thinner flight plate, It makes the Hybrid noticably faster than a Sabre, even though the nose is a bit more blunt. The air gets over the top now fatsre because of the reduced angle upward.

It is now closer in glide to a Sabre than a Blaze but still has great resistance to turn without hyzering out to quick.
I didnt get a chance to throw any high S shots, mostly just line drives, slight Hyzers and reverses of 8-20 feet high.

The thinner flight plate reduces the overall mass by almost 20%, therefore when both discs weigh 176 grams the density of the Hybrid will be 20% greater. This will make the disc a lot more gyroscopic and also gives it more fade on decleration, not as much as a blaze but more than a Sabre!

Just "throwing" this out there...what gateway driver in what plastic is the easiest to roll?

Also...this is mainly for Dave...but why don't you guys run disc's in the 165g-170g range anymore? I mean, I am sure you do, but it seems like everytime I try to order a 168g-170g E or H Illusion or a 168g-170g E or H Spirit, I am out of luck. Most everything that is available is always 174g-176g. Just curious.

Thanks as always,
JT

H illusion for me.

all of them after you bash then into a cememnt wall for a couple hours and then run them over with your car for a few minutes. Just joking on that one. If I had to pick something that I have thrown I would say a Sabre but I dont throw much Gateway since I was told I would be getting a box in the mail to test and never got it.

Joe,
Illusions have been my rollers of choice for distance, but the Hybrid could replace the sabers for medium and accurate rollers as the nose is a bit more blunt.
I have had great success rolling elements and wizards for shorter shots.

The volume of the Spirit and Illusion molds are almost too large for the weight of the Urethane.
We do have some Spirits down in the high 160's but not too many.
actually we sell every illusions we make in the H and E as soon as we stampo them and are currently backordered close to 1000.
We may have about a 60 dyed H illsuions and 20 dyed E Illsuions at the shop but most are near max weight.
Hopefully we will get them back on line soon, we are just finishing up the retooled Hybrid in the E and wanted to get a few elements and element X-s done before we go full bore on the illsuions.

The mass of the part is also the reason there are no urethane quarter K's.

I see. So...when/if I come across any in that weight range, I should probably snag them. Any chance that you will try to remedy the weighting issue in the future?

Dave...right on the money with the H-Illusion for rolling. One of mine is in a super stiff H plastic and so I did a little flexing and it is now a money roller and turn over driver. Also...got my first ace of the year tonight with a proto element. Money.

JOe, Check your pm and hit me back at [email protected]

I agree, the H-illusions are the best roller I have ever thrown. They stay really str8 and go for days. On that ace note, go my first ace of the year last week with my trusty old mace man wizard. That's ace # 6 on that baby in the last 18 months.

I need some supersoft wizards :confused: :mad:

Dave,
I'm loving the soft E Hybrid I've got, but it's color makes it kinda hard to spot when I play in the woods. I've read about the new runs of Hybrids that you just ran. Do they have the same feel of the soft hybrids, and what colors do they come in?
Also, when I was at the warehouse, I got a heavy (182) black domey E element. I was attempting to determine if the E element could replace my Z Comet, but the heavy one I got dosn't really compare. Do you think an Element at a lower weight may be like my Z Comet?
Thanks.

I would say that an E element has a lot more reistance to turn, especially into a wind or of your realease has a bit of turbulance.
Do you find the Black E too overstable or not enough glide?

The Latest E Hybrids are fairly flexible and very grippy on the surface.
I would prefer something much more firm but This blend is what the maiority of players would want!
They are mostly white, with a few red and of course tye dyed.

Dave...I sent you an email...did you get it?