Politics - Economics [Archive] - Page 2

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bravo

Dec 22 2008, 08:47 PM

teachers in thee public school system may have good intentions but the curriculum that is approved for class is approved by the same government that doesnt want the people they govern to learn the truth for if enough people knew the truth there would be an uprising that the government couldnt control

Pizza God

Dec 23 2008, 03:52 PM

Cerberus willing to give up Chrysler equity stake (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Cerberus-willing-give-up-its/story.aspx?guid={DE789072-C67D-435E-BDA1-761966587739})

The article is mostly about what "should" have been done to save the Auto industry (private equity, not public)

But I posted this for one reason, this should have been in the headline.

"Unless Chrysler's labor costs can achieve parity with the foreign transplants, and without the restructuring of Chrysler's debt, Chrysler cannot be restored to long-term health and the government loan will be unlikely to be fully repaid ," Cerberus said.

Pizza God

Dec 23 2008, 10:56 PM

Pizza God

Dec 24 2008, 12:56 PM

Can America spend its way to economic recovery? (http://features.csmonitor.com/politics/2008/12/23/can-america-spend-its-way-to-economic-recovery/)

Pizza God

Dec 24 2008, 07:02 PM

Keynesian Economics Is Wrong: Bigger Gov't Is Not Stimulus
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Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 12:24 PM

This is one of the better articles I have come across against the FED

The Truth About U.S. Banking (http://www.republicoflakotah.com/?p=428)

While there, check out the web site it is listed on. the Republic of Lakotah considers themselves seceded from the USA based on broken treaties.

Now there is a Bank of Lakotah, but I don't think it is affiliated with the Republic of Lakotah. (I know the guy who worked with them to coin there money)

Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 12:32 PM

Chinese Savings Helped Inflate American Bubble (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/26/world/asia/26addiction.html?_r=2&partner=rss&emc=rss)

analysts figure China owns $1 of every $10 of America�s public debt.

Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 12:44 PM

California Home Sales Rise 83 Percent, Prices Fall (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601206&sid=aV9YN0DQglAQ&refer=realestat e)

Yes, wow classic Economics at work.

As the price falls, demand will increase resulting in more sales and a quick recovery of the fall. (a bubble bursting is not always a bad thing for all people.)

When a home that sold for $400K is now selling for $200K, those that could not afford the $400K are now able to afford a home.

This is why we are not seeing a mortgage problem in Texas. Our homes are not super inflated as the Left Coast or East Coast.

Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 12:53 PM

U. of C. economist rips federal bailouts - Critics say school's philosophy led to financial collapse (http://www.suntimes.com/business/1349637,CST-FIN-school26.article)

They wrote a petition attacking Paulson's proposal, sent it to economists nationwide and collected 230 signatures.

By the end of November, the government had committed $8.5 trillion, or more than half the value of everything produced in the country in 2007, to save the financial system.

The argument against Austrian Economic is not all that true, we do not have a "free market system", we have a "managed" free market system as proposed by Keynes. We have never fully implemented Friedman's ideology. If we had, we would not be bailing out all the companies that abused the system.

Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 01:03 PM

This is good stuff

The Worst Predictions About 2008 (http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/content/dec2008/db20081224_028134.htm?campaign_id=rss_topStories)

Pizza God

Dec 26 2008, 01:13 PM

yet another article that says not enough regulations was the problem. when it was the Regulations that really caused this mess when you look deeper.

Yes, it is true some deregulation let to bubbles. However the regulations left in effect helped create that effect.

You have to remember that lobbiest work to remove regulations that they view as holding them back, however they will not remove regulations that will keep them in check.

Then, as the article states (as many other articles state) when our government backs these loads the derivatives are based on, it gives a false sense of security. How can the investment fail if the government is backing the loans???

The Great Clash of '09 - A looming battle over re-regulation (http://www.newsweek.com/id/176830)

Pizza God

Dec 27 2008, 05:42 PM

Pizza God

Dec 28 2008, 03:15 PM

Bailout of Long-Term Capital: A Bad Precedent? (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/28/business/economy/28view.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss)

Pizza God

Dec 28 2008, 03:19 PM

The year the bubble burst (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/economics/article5403293.ece)

Pizza God

Dec 28 2008, 03:33 PM

Ah, this is a good one

By Peter Schiff

There's No Pain-Free Cure for Recession (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123033898448336541.html)

Pizza God

Dec 30 2008, 08:00 PM

Even Time knows mistakes are being made

Fighting the Last Depression: The Fed's Policy Errors (http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1868969,00.html?xid=rss-topstories)

Pizza God

Dec 30 2008, 10:08 PM

'This is economic war!' Jarislowsky warns (http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=1123647)

Pizza God

Dec 31 2008, 12:32 AM

Pizza God

Dec 31 2008, 07:17 PM

Listen to what Marc Faber says

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Pizza God

Jan 02 2009, 12:33 PM

Apparently, after laughing at Ron Paul in the Debates, Fred Thompson listened...................

<embed src="http://blip.tv/play/Ad3iNI+MAQ" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="480" height="390" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed>

Pizza God

Jan 08 2009, 03:59 PM

I mentioned this movie back in August when it came out

CNN to show documentary 'I.O.U.S.A.' (http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117998167.html?categoryid=13&cs=1&nid=2562)

That is this Saturday at 2pm, unfortunately for me, I don't have cable and I will be at the Campaign for Liberty Convention in Dallas all day.

Pizza God

Jan 11 2009, 07:27 PM

Pizza God

Jan 11 2009, 08:31 PM

Pizza God

Jan 11 2009, 08:37 PM

This is one you have to read, it has quotes from both Henry Paulson and Peter Schiff

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Pizza God

Jan 12 2009, 12:59 PM

A great editorial that basically says what I have been advocating in this thread and been saying for the last year.

The Fed Creates a Crisis and Hampers the Recovery (http://www.campaignforliberty.com/article.php)

Pizza God

Jan 14 2009, 07:32 PM

http://www.texasinsider.org/images/news/cartoons/Benson011409.jpg

Pizza God

Jan 14 2009, 10:05 PM

Pizza God

Jan 14 2009, 10:08 PM

Pizza God

Jan 15 2009, 12:36 AM

This is an amazing interview. In this video, the explain how Jim Rogers made his money and give a quick history on him. Then a great interview that says everything I have been trying to post on this thread. (one reason I have posted several of his video's)

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lilbigarm

Jan 15 2009, 02:48 PM

don't take this the wrong way but you might need to get a job.

Pizza God

Jan 15 2009, 06:40 PM

I would probably make more than working for myself. 90 hr per week at the store gets old. But I do get to research between making orders and paperwork.

Typical day for the Pizza God

9:30am get up
10am arrive at work, eat breakfast and check my emails
work all day making dough
making orders
taking care of business
free time spent reading headlines and this discussion board.
11pm usually finish up paperwork and watch a movie before heading home around 1-2am.

Days like today, I have only spent about 30min today reading. However while I do paperwork and even while typing this, I have YouTube video's going on with News and sometimes entertainment. (I subscribe to several people who post news)

Pizza God

Jan 15 2009, 07:28 PM

Obama's budget director pick sounds alarm (http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/01/14/america/13weborszag.php)

At present, the United States has "significant maneuvering room" because it can borrow money at low interest rates, Orszag said, and "our debt is viewed as the safest investment in the world."

But, he said, if the United States continues to spend beyond its means, "that perception could shift," and that "could not only trigger a fiscal crisis, but also severely limit our ability to respond flexibly to any future economic difficulties."

this is what I have been saying may happen if we keep up our current pace........

Pizza God

Jan 18 2009, 06:49 PM

Jim Rogers in 2003 talking about the Housing Bubble

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BTW, most of this is in english, this came from Dutch TV.

side note, he sold this house a little over a year ago, he talks about it in one of the other video's I posted a while back.

Pizza God

Jan 18 2009, 09:26 PM

This is from the Young Turks, but I want you to listen to Congress grilling the FED.

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And you wonder why I advocate ending the FED.

Pizza God

Jan 20 2009, 08:26 PM

Grover Norquist (Americans for Tax Reform) on The Bush Economic Legacy

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Pizza God

Jan 21 2009, 05:35 PM

This was yesterday 1/20/09

This may be a reason for the big drop in the Dow yesterday.

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Pizza God

Jan 25 2009, 05:22 PM

A very good interview out of US New and World Report
Peter Schiff: Let the Housing Market Crash (http://www.usnews.com/blogs/the-home-front/2009/1/23/peter-schiff-let-the-housing-market-crash.html)

mmm, exactly what I have been saying. No wonder I like Peter Schiff so much.

mugilcephalus

Jan 26 2009, 11:12 AM

I do like Schiff but think you should read this. Shedlock has really been on(and in) the money the past few years.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/01/peter-schiff-was-wrong.html

Pizza God

Jan 26 2009, 01:34 PM

The title says it all. This is where you taxpayer money is going

General Motors to Invest $1 Billion in Brazil Operations -- Money to Come from U.S. Rescue Program (http://www.laht.com/article.asp?CategoryId=12396&ArticleId=320909)

Pizza God

Jan 26 2009, 04:53 PM

What is funny is how much he actually agrees with Schiff on some things.

What he says about all the other central banks cutting rates is the same thing I said is propping up the American dollar right now.

Pizza God

Jan 26 2009, 04:58 PM

I posted this back on 12/10/08

Big Rate Cut by Canada�s Central Bank (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/10/business/worldbusiness/10canada.html?partner=rss&emc=rss)

Why???

Because they need to flood there currency to keep the American Dollar from crashing.

If you remember a few months ago, I posted where the Canadian Dollar was worth more than the American Dollar.

I also found this interesting

On Tuesday, The Globe and Mail, a Toronto newspaper, reported that Chrysler was threatening to shut two assembly plants in Ontario, which employ about 8,000, if it did not receive 1.6 billion Canadian dollars ($1.26 billion) in aid.

Pizza God

Jan 27 2009, 05:49 PM

Some more education on Obama's plan from the CATO institute.

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Pizza God

Jan 31 2009, 02:57 PM

I do like Schiff but think you should read this. Shedlock has really been on(and in) the money the past few years.

http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/01/peter-schiff-was-wrong.html

After reading this hit piece on Peter Schiff, you need to read this rebuttal
Peter Schiff Rebuttal- A Response to My Critics (http://marketoracle.co.uk/Article8564.html)

Pizza God

Jan 31 2009, 09:29 PM

If you want to know where I am coming from, watch this speech

Monetary Lessons from America's Past

Presented by Thomas E. Woods, Jr., at "Our Enemy, Inflation," the Mises Circle in Houston, sponsored by Jeremy S. Davis. Recorded Saturday, 24 January 2009.

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mugilcephalus

Feb 02 2009, 01:32 AM

I read it. I read most things from both of these guys. Shedlock focuses more on the facts and technical trends while Shciff seems locked in more on the simplified picture(more dollars=inflation). I'm not saying that Schiff will be wrong but if you're actually looking investing a large sum of money I'd take Shedlock. Schiff referring to him as being small-time is laughable.

bredemeyer

Feb 02 2009, 03:06 PM

Bailouts = Corporate Welfare. I'm glad to hear that out of touch suits and Brazilians workers will have a job next year...

--Latin American Herald Tribune--

General Motors to Invest $1 Billion in Brazil Operations -- Money to Come from U.S. Rescue Program

By Russ Dallen
Latin American Herald Tribune staff

SAO PAULO -- General Motors plans to invest $1 billion in Brazil to avoid the kind of problems the U.S. automaker is facing in its home market, said the beleaguered car maker.

According to the president of GM Brazil-Mercosur, Jaime Ardila, the funding will come from the package of financial aid that the manufacturer will receive from the U.S. government and will be used to "complete the renovation of the line of products up to 2012."

"It wouldn't be logical to withdraw the investment from where we're growing, and our goal is to protect investments in emerging markets," he said in a statement published by the business daily Gazeta Mercantil.

Meanwhile, he cut the company's revenue forecast for this year by 14% to $9.5 billion from $11 billion, as the economic crisis began to cause rapid slowdowns in sales.

GM already announced three programs of paid leave, and Ardila added that GM Brazil "is going to wait and see how the market behaves in order to know what decision to take" with regard to possible layoffs.

For Ardila, the injection in Brazil's automobile sector of 8 billion reais ($3.51 billion) recently announced by the federal and state governments of Sao Paulo "has already begun to revive sales," which fell by 12% in October.

The executive said that the company will operate a "conservative" scenario in 2009 with an estimated production of 2.6 million units, and another more "optimistic" that contemplates sales of 2.9 million.

This year sales will reach 2.85 million vehicles, which represents a growth of 15% over last year.

http://www.laht.com/article.asp?CategoryId=12396&ArticleId=320909

Pizza God

Feb 02 2009, 11:32 PM

Top 10 Reasons to Oppose the Stimulus (http://www.freedomworks.org/informed/issues_template.php?issue_id=3059&utm_campaign=Hel p%20us%20stop%20the%20wasteful%20spending%20in%20W ashington&utm_medium=Email&utm_source=VerticalResp onse&utm_term=click%20here!)
___________________________________________

On Peter Schiff, he tends to emphasize what very well may happen if our government stays on it's present course.

Shoot, Jim Rogers is taking all his holdings out of US Dollars and has moved to China :confused:

Pizza God

Feb 02 2009, 11:37 PM

This is out of an email from my Congressman.

This bill, quite frankly, was an attempt to sneak hundreds of billions of dollars in pork into an �emergency� bill under the guise of �stimulus.� The bill, which has 11,391 so-called �vitally-important� pork projects, includes:

� $300,000,000,000 to bailout state governments

� $136,000,000,000 to create no less than 32 new federal government programs

� $6,700,000,000 to renovate and improve federal buildings
$6,000,000,000 to colleges and universities that already have billion dollar endowments

� $4,190,000,000 for a housing slush fund for ACORN and similar groups under the guise of �neighborhood stabilization activities�

� $4,000,000,000 to �develop rural communities�

� $2,800,000,000 to expand broadband

� $2,400,000,000 for a carbon capture program

� $2,250,000,000 for national parks which is equal to the entire annual budget of the National Park Service

� $2,000,000,000 for child care subsidies

� $2,000,000,000 for non-specific �other activities�

� $1,000,000,000 for Amtrak (which hasn�t turned a profit since its inception 4 decades ago)

� $1,000,000,000 for periodic censuses

� $800,000,000 to clean up Superfund sites

� $650,000,000 for DTV transition coupons

� $600,000,000 to replace older vehicles for federal bureaucrats

� $500,000,000 for the Bureau of Reclamation

� $426,000,000 to construct facilities at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention

� $400,000,000 for climate change research

� $335,000,000 to treat and prevent STDs

� $200,000,000 to repair the grass on the National Mall (including $21 million for sod)

� $88,000,000 for the General Services Administration to cover moving costs and furniture

� $50,000,000 for the National Endowment for the Arts

� $44,000,000 for repairs to the U.S. Dept. of Agriculture headquarters in D.C.

� $2,500,000 for a duck pond in California

� $750,000 for a skateboard park in Minnesota

� $200,000 for a dog park in California

� Money for a mob museum in Nevada

� Money for California winemakers

� Money for a basketball court in Ohio

� Money for snowmaking in Minnesota

� Money for a prostitute rehab program

� Money for traffic video cameras

� Provisions protecting Miami yacht-repair companies from paying for workers� compensation

If these projects are worthy, they should be considered in the regular budget and appropriations process and not buried deep in a massive 700 page �emergency� economic �stimulus� bill. Instead of considering these controversial, non-stimulus items during the normal legislative process, Pelosi sheepishly smuggled the most egregious pork projects into the bill. If she truly believed money for contraception and abortions were stimulating, she should have kept them in. After speaking to the President, however, she flipped her script.

Oh yea, anyone remember that Obama said he wanted to pass a Stimulus plan WITHOUT any Pork in it???????????????

FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(The Omnibus Stimulus plan in going to the senate, where the Republicans could stop it if they want to.

If we are going to rebuild the Republican party, every true Conservative Republican will vote against this government waist bill.

Please read the last link (10 reasons against the plan) to understand why this bill is wrong, no matter who supports it.

Pizza God

Feb 03 2009, 02:33 PM

http://www.texasinsider.org/images/news/cartoons/Ramirez020209.jpg

Pizza God

Feb 05 2009, 07:08 PM

My favorite Governor

The Moral Bankruptcy Behind the Bailouts (http://www.texasinsider.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=6068&mode=& order=0&thold=0)

Pizza God

Feb 06 2009, 11:51 PM

Jim Roger talks about the American Currency and tells why it "seems" to be doing well at the moment.

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Pizza God

Feb 07 2009, 12:24 AM

Pizza God

Feb 07 2009, 01:01 AM

Fed Up: The popular uprising against central banking (http://www.amconmag.com/article/2009/feb/09/00016/)

I very much enjoyed reading this article by Tom Woods.

Pizza God

Feb 07 2009, 01:12 AM

Marc Faber (Dr. Doom) talks about Americans new monetary policy.

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Pizza God

Feb 07 2009, 01:18 AM

some more of that interview. The USA as Junk bond status :D

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Pizza God

Feb 08 2009, 12:20 AM

Keynes can't help us now (http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-ferg6-2009feb06,0,6972232.column)
Governments cling to the delusion that a crisis of excess debt can be solved by creating more debt.

Pizza God

Feb 08 2009, 12:21 AM

Japan�s Big-Works Stimulus Is Lesson (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/06/world/asia/06japan.html?_r=2&partner=permalink&exprod=permali nk)

In the end, say economists, it was not public works but an expensive cleanup of the debt-ridden banking system, combined with growing exports to China and the United States, that brought a close to Japan's Lost Decade. This has led many to conclude that spending did little more than sink Japan deeply into debt, leaving an enormous tax burden for future generations.

Pizza God

Feb 09 2009, 06:15 PM

Pizza God

Feb 09 2009, 06:18 PM

I have a bad feeling that this is the beginning of the end of the USA as we know it.

U.S. Taxpayers Risk $9.7 Trillion on Bailouts as Senate Votes (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aGq2B3XeGKok&refer=news)

The stimulus package the U.S. Congress is completing would raise the government�s commitment to solving the financial crisis to $9.7 trillion, enough to pay off more than 90 percent of the nation�s home mortgages.

Pizza God

Feb 09 2009, 07:08 PM

We Are All Socialists Now (http://www.newsweek.com/id/183663)

Pizza God

Feb 10 2009, 11:20 PM

Instead of stimulus, do nothing � seriously (http://www.csmonitor.com/2009/0209/p09s01-coop.html)

Pizza God

Feb 11 2009, 01:27 AM

In yesterdays Wall Street Journal.

How Government Created the Financial Crisis (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123414310280561945.html)

Many are calling for a 9/11-type commission to investigate the financial crisis. Any such investigation should not rule out government itself as a major culprit. My research shows that government actions and interventions -- not any inherent failure or instability of the private economy -- caused, prolonged and dramatically worsened the crisis.

John B. Taylor is a Keynesian economist. Just about everything in this opt-ed piece is the Austrian argument against Keynesian economics :o

Pizza God

Feb 12 2009, 06:18 PM

Pizza God

Feb 12 2009, 09:13 PM

Pizza God

Feb 12 2009, 10:26 PM

Pizza God

Feb 13 2009, 05:04 PM

This is why I like Jim Rogers, he tells it like it is.

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kkrasinski

Feb 17 2009, 04:05 PM

Hidden in the Stimulus Bill (http://www.reason.com/stimulus/bills/HR1_8zPRZn20090217150313.html#telecom) :mad:

Pizza God

Feb 17 2009, 04:30 PM

Hidden in the Stimulus Bill (http://www.reason.com/stimulus/bills/HR1_8zPRZn20090217150313.html#telecom) :mad:

You were not suppose to see that

Pizza God

Feb 18 2009, 06:09 PM

Pizza God

Feb 19 2009, 01:24 PM

We must print more money, says Bank of England (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/we-must-print-more-money-says-bank-1625947.html)

Pizza God

Feb 19 2009, 03:52 PM

Wholesale inflation takes biggest jump in 6 months (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/W/WHOLESALE_PRICES?SITE=NCWIN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE= DEFAULT)

This article may have been written today, but as of a few moments ago, the whole sale price for gas had dropped by nearly 20 cents per gallon.

Pizza God

Mar 02 2009, 08:16 PM

Economic crisis threatens the idea of one Europe (http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/03/01/europe/union.php?page=1)

interesting, the Central banks of the EU have been devaluing there currency by lowering there interest rates. This is one of the reasons the Dollar has remained as strong as it has. If some of the things in this article come true, what effect would it have on the Dollar. The Euro was about to become the standard currency of the world, replacing the Dollar. If that were to happen, it would have destroyed the Dollar and we truly would have a Banana Republic currency.

As long as there is demand for the Dollar, there is some hope for our future. If the dollar crashes, I hate to think of what we will have to live with. Lets hope this does not happen.

Pizza God

Mar 03 2009, 06:09 PM

wow, I have written several things that this article states. Of course that is because it's author is from the Austrian Economic school.

Banana Republic, U.S.A (http://www.firstprinciplesjournal.com/print.aspx?article=1223&loc=b&type=cbbp)

Indeed we should do something�but, as usual, it�s exactly the opposite of what the federal government intends to do. We should cut the government�s budget as drastically as possible, thereby releasing resources for use by the productive sector. (That worked pretty well in stopping the terrible depression of 1920�21.)

gotcha

Mar 04 2009, 09:08 AM

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 02:00 PM

"You cannot legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the wealthy
out of freedom. What one person receives without working for, another
person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to
anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody
else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to
work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the
other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody
else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is about
the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it."

~~~~~ The late Dr. Adrian Rogers, 1931 - 2005

YAWN!

Robert Reich

After more than a quarter century, the era of Reaganomics is over, replaced by Obamanomics.

The first principle of Reaganomics was that lower taxes on the wealthy made them work harder and invest more, and the benefits trickle down to everyone else. Rarely in economic history has a theory been more tested in the real world and proven so wrong. Nothing trickled down. After the Reagan tax cuts, the median wage slowed, adjusted for inflation. After George W. Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy, the median wage actually dropped.

Meanwhile, most of the income went to the top. In 1980, just before the Reagan revolution, the richest 1 percent took home 9 percent of total national income. But by 2007, the richest 1 percent was taking home 22 percent. Obamanomics, by contrast, will increase taxes on the top, and it will use these proceeds to raise the living standards of average Americans by giving them lower taxes, better schools, and more affordable health insurance.

Reaganomics' second principle was that deregulated markets function better. Well, energy markets were deregulated and we wound up with Enron. Carbon emissions weren't controlled, and now we face global warming. Financial markets were deregulated and we have a global meltdown. Obamanomics, by contrast, accepts important roles for government: Creating incentives for non-fossil based energy, setting an overall cap on carbon emissions, and ensuring the solvency and security of financial companies.

The third and least well-known principle of Reaganomics is that government can keep the economy moving full tilt by spending like crazy and not worrying too much about budget deficits. Reagan's big spending was on national defense. Some of us called it "military Keynesianism." Problem was, it didn't stop when the economy got to capacity, thereby threatening inflation. Obama's stimulus intends to avoid this by reducing deficits as the nation moves back toward full capacity.

Under Reaganomics, government is the problem. It can still be a problem. But Obanaomics at least recognizes there are even bigger problems out there that can't be solved without government.

The data is pretty clear, we've been taking from the poor to give to the rich for the past 24 years. Oh yeah, and it worked really well... /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 02:02 PM

Now, on a different note. Obama pledged to end Pork spending. His stimulus package is full of it. Write your Congress person and demand better.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/05/obama.pork/

It is time for us to tell those guys in Washington that they need to spend our money wisely.

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 02:08 PM

BTW - what's so amazing about the whole take care of the rich thing and you can't spread the wealth propaganda is that the very people who've been hosed by the process are often those who support it the most. The rich don't pay taxes or at least not nearly what they get out of the tax base. Remember, their companies use the infrastructure, they build companies in the most vibrant economy in the world, they get educated in universities, all supported by tax dollars, they fly on planes developed with federal dollars, and land in airports paid for with federal dollars. They ship on an interstate system developed with tax dollars, and BOY, they shouldn't have to pay for any of it. And of course, they don't. Not only don't they pay for it, but they don't provide better jobs and more money for the rest of us like they've always claimed they do... They simply pocket the difference.

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 02:21 PM

BTW - the whole socialist argument is hilarious. We're all socialists, we're just in deep denial. So Za, your house is on fire, the fire-engines show up, and your response is, nope, no stinkin' socialist organization is putting out this fire? Same for the police when you're getting robbed at your Pizza store, same for many hospitals, same for the FDIC, same for public education, and that big one, what's it called, oh yeah, the army...

We play this little verbal game about socialism. The reality is that what we really mean when we say socialist is anything where someone can make a lot of money. If you apply the principals of socialism to non or low profit areas it's quite acceptable. But if you apply it something where the rich can make a lot of money, like banks, well then it is socialism and you're a bum. Problem is that the banks are socialist too. Have been since the great depression. In a non-socialist free market world, when the bank guys do the pooch, you lose your money. Everyone here willing to write off their investments and cash in their banks, banks that should be gone at this point? Oh you dirty socialists...

Now, of course Obama, who may nationalize some banks, is being called a socialist because he meets the definition with this activity. Even here, he is not a socialist. His plan is simply to have the banks pay back the loans to the people who provided the money, that would be you and me. That isn't socialism, that is free market capitalism. You use my money, I own you. Of course that's the last thing that the idiots who invested in those bad deals want, they want to be dumb and have us bail them out, and still get paid.

You want to make it on the up and up, when they pay back or we sell off their assets, simply write my taxes down, I'm happy with that.

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 02:31 PM

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 03:35 PM

While I'm on a roll

Here is an article on what AIG did to put themselves in the boat they're in... That boat would of course be the Titanic.

Joe Nocera

Next week, perhaps as early as Monday, the American International Group is going to report the largest quarterly loss in history. Rumors suggest it will be around $60 billion, which will affirm, yet again, A.I.G.�s sorry status as the most crippled of all the nation�s wounded financial institutions. The recent quarterly losses suffered by Merrill Lynch and Citigroup � �only� $15.4 billion and $8.3 billion, respectively � pale by comparison.
At the same time A.I.G. reveals its loss, the federal government is also likely to announce � yet again! � a new plan to save A.I.G., the third since September. So far the government has thrown $150 billion at the company, in loans, investments and equity injections, to keep it afloat. It has softened the terms it set for the original $85 billion loan it made back in September. To ease the pressure even more, the Federal Reserve actually runs a facility that buys toxic assets that A.I.G. had insured. A.I.G. effectively has been nationalized, with the government owning a hair under 80 percent of the stock. Not that it�s worth very much; A.I.G. shares closed Friday at 42 cents.
Donn Vickrey, who runs the independent research firm Gradient Analytics, predicts that A.I.G. is going to cost taxpayers at least $100 billion more before it finally stabilizes, by which time the company will almost surely have been broken into pieces, with the government owning large chunks of it. A quarter of a trillion dollars, if it comes to that, is an astounding amount of money to hand over to one company to prevent it from going bust. Yet the government feels it has no choice: because of A.I.G.�s dubious business practices during the housing bubble it pretty much has the world�s financial system by the throat.
If we let A.I.G. fail, said Seamus P. McMahon, a banking expert at Booz & Company, other institutions, including pension funds and American and European banks �will face their own capital and liquidity crisis, and we could have a domino effect.� A bailout of A.I.G. is really a bailout of its trading partners � which essentially constitutes the entire Western banking system.
I don�t doubt this bit of conventional wisdom; after the calamity that followed the fall of Lehman Brothers, which was far less enmeshed in the global financial system than A.I.G., who would dare allow the world�s biggest insurer to fail? Who would want to take that risk? But that doesn�t mean we should feel resigned about what is happening at A.I.G. In fact, we should be furious. More than even Citi or Merrill, A.I.G. is ground zero for the practices that led the financial system to ruin.
�They were the worst of them all,� said Frank Partnoy, a law professor at the University of San Diego and a derivatives expert. Mr. Vickrey of Gradient Analytics said, �It was extreme hubris, fueled by greed.� Other firms used many of the same shady techniques as A.I.G., but none did them on such a broad scale and with such utter recklessness. And yet � and this is the part that should make your blood boil � the company is being kept alive precisely because it behaved so badly.
When you start asking around about how A.I.G. made money during the housing bubble, you hear the same two phrases again and again: �regulatory arbitrage� and �ratings arbitrage.� The word �arbitrage� usually means taking advantage of a price differential between two securities � a bond and stock of the same company, for instance � that are related in some way. When the word is used to describe A.I.G.�s actions, however, it means something entirely different. It means taking advantage of a loophole in the rules. A less polite but perhaps more accurate term would be �scam.�
As a huge multinational insurance company, with a storied history and a reputation for being extremely well run, A.I.G. had one of the most precious prizes in all of business: an AAA rating, held by no more than a dozen or so companies in the United States. That meant ratings agencies believed its chance of defaulting was just about zero. It also meant it could borrow more cheaply than other companies with lower ratings.
To be sure, most of A.I.G. operated the way it always had, like a normal, regulated insurance company. (Its insurance divisions remain profitable today.) But one division, its �financial practices� unit in London, was filled with go-go financial wizards who devised new and clever ways of taking advantage of Wall Street�s insatiable appetite for mortgage-backed securities. Unlike many of the Wall Street investment banks, A.I.G. didn�t specialize in pooling subprime mortgages into securities. Instead, it sold credit-default swaps.
These exotic instruments acted as a form of insurance for the securities. In effect, A.I.G. was saying if, by some remote chance (ha!) those mortgage-backed securities suffered losses, the company would be on the hook for the losses. And because A.I.G. had that AAA rating, when it sprinkled its holy water over those mortgage-backed securities, suddenly they had AAA ratings too. That was the ratings arbitrage. �It was a way to exploit the triple A rating,� said Robert J. Arvanitis, a former A.I.G. executive who has since become a leading A.I.G. Critic.
Why would Wall Street and the banks go for this? Because it shifted the risk of default from themselves to A.I.G., and the AAA rating made the securities much easier to market. What was in it for A.I.G.? Lucrative fees, naturally. But it also saw the fees as risk-free money; surely it would never have to actually pay up. Like everyone else on Wall Street, A.I.G. operated on the belief that the underlying assets � housing � could only go up in price.
That foolhardy belief, in turn, led A.I.G. to commit several other stupid mistakes. When a company insures against, say, floods or earthquakes, it has to put money in reserve in case a flood happens. That�s why, as a rule, insurance companies are usually overcapitalized, with low debt ratios. But because credit-default swaps were not regulated, and were not even categorized as a traditional insurance product, A.I.G. didn�t have to put anything aside for losses. And it didn�t. Its leverage was more akin to an investment bank than an insurance company. So when housing prices started falling, and losses started piling up, it had no way to pay them off. Not understanding the real risk, the company grievously mispriced it.
Second, in many of its derivative contracts, A.I.G. included a provision that has since come back to haunt it. It agreed to something called �collateral triggers,� meaning that if certain events took place, like a ratings downgrade for either A.I.G. or the securities it was insuring, it would have to put up collateral against those securities. Again, the reasons it agreed to the collateral triggers was pure greed: it could get higher fees by including them. And again, it assumed that the triggers would never actually kick in and the provisions were therefore meaningless. Those collateral triggers have since cost A.I.G. many, many billions of dollars. Or, rather, they�ve cost American taxpayers billions.
The regulatory arbitrage was even seamier. A huge part of the company�s credit-default swap business was devised, quite simply, to allow banks to make their balance sheets look safer than they really were. Under a misguided set of international rules that took hold toward the end of the 1990s, banks were allowed use their own internal risk measurements to set their capital requirements. The less risky the assets, obviously, the lower the regulatory capital requirement.
How did banks get their risk measures low? It certainly wasn�t by owning less risky assets. Instead, they simply bought A.I.G.�s credit-default swaps. The swaps meant that the risk of loss was transferred to A.I.G., and the collateral triggers made the bank portfolios look absolutely risk-free. Which meant minimal capital requirements, which the banks all wanted so they could increase their leverage and buy yet more �risk-free� assets. This practice became especially rampant in Europe. That lack of capital is one of the reasons the European banks have been in such trouble since the crisis began.
At its peak, the A.I.G. credit-default business had a �notional value� of $450 billion, and as recently as September, it was still over $300 billion. (Notional value is the amount A.I.G. would owe if every one of its bets went to zero.) And unlike most Wall Street firms, it didn�t hedge its credit-default swaps; it bore the risk, which is what insurance companies do.
It�s not as if this was some Enron-esque secret, either. Everybody knew the capital requirements were being gamed, including the regulators. Indeed, A.I.G. openly labeled that part of the business as �regulatory capital.� That is how they, and their customers, thought of it.
There�s more, believe it or not. A.I.G. sold something called 2a-7 puts, which allowed money market funds to invest in risky bonds even though they are supposed to be holding only the safest commercial paper. How could they do this? A.I.G. agreed to buy back the bonds if they went bad. (Incredibly, the Securities and Exchange Commission went along with this.) A.I.G. had a securities lending program, in which it would lend securities to investors, like short-sellers, in return for cash collateral. What did it do with the money it received? Incredibly, it bought mortgage-backed securities. When the firms wanted their collateral back, it had sunk in value, thanks to A.I.G.�s foolish investment strategy. The practice has cost A.I.G. � oops, I mean American taxpayers � billions.
Here�s what is most infuriating: Here we are now, fully aware of how these scams worked. Yet for all practical purposes, the government has to keep them going. Indeed, that may be the single most important reason it can�t let A.I.G. fail. If the company defaulted, hundreds of billions of dollars� worth of credit-default swaps would �blow up,� and all those European banks whose toxic assets are supposedly insured by A.I.G. would suddenly be sitting on immense losses. Their already shaky capital structures would be destroyed. A.I.G. helped create the illusion of regulatory capital with its swaps, and now the government has to actually back up those contracts with taxpayer money to keep the banks from collapsing. It would be funny if it weren�t so awful.
I asked Mr. Arvanitis, the former A.I.G. executive, if the company viewed what it had done during the bubble as a form of gaming the system. �Oh no,� he said, �they never thought of it as abuse. They thought of themselves as satisfying their customers.�
That�s either a remarkable example of the power of rationalization, or they were lying to themselves, figuring that when the house of cards finally fell, somebody else would have to clean it up.
That would be us, the taxpayers.

Pizza God

Mar 05 2009, 03:52 PM

BTW - the whole socialist argument is hilarious. We're all socialists, we're just in deep denial. So Za, your house is on fire, the fire-engines show up, and your response is, nope, no stinkin' socialist organization is putting out this fire? Same for the police when you're getting robbed at your Pizza store, same for many hospitals, same for the FDIC, same for public education, and that big one, what's it called, oh yeah, the army...

Lyle, that is the argument people make against Libertarianism.

Except it is NOT a valid point.

when you live in an area, you and your neighbors dicide on how much of a fire department and how many roads, how much police protection, and other services you want to have, you FORM A TOWN OR CITY. Now everyone in those towns and city's donate to the city to pay for these perks.

Now if you don't want these perks, you don't move or live in that city.

Does my mother have police protection, NO.
Does my mother have fire protection, NO
Does my mother have city water and sewer, YES, they paid 10K to hook up to the city lines.

For Police Protection, there is sort of the sheriff. but you know what, I have only seen him around 1 time in all the time I have spent in TN.

For Fire Protection, it is a volentery fire department. The county recently built a station on property I sold to them (for $5K)

All the road in my part of the county are State highways or county roads. They were dirt roads (actually rock) up until about 15 years ago.

and yes, we contribute a little to the country to pay for all this.

Lyle O Ross

Mar 05 2009, 06:36 PM

It doesn't work that way and you know it Za; beyond the fact that you took a rural exception to the rule. The way I positioned the argument works for 80 or 90% of the country. Even in most rural areas there is a city fire department and city police. If you're trying to argue that a volunteer fire dept. and a volunteer police dept. will work in say Dallas, I'm going to call you on it.

Pizza God

Mar 05 2009, 07:10 PM

No, I am saying that I moved into a city BECAUSE of the Fire and Police, plus other things that the city has to offer. I have no problem paying my City property Taxes and try to spend most of my money in Carrollton instead of other cities to help my City more.

Yes, I realize that there are many people who do not believe in Property Taxes, however, I feel that is the best way to pay for these services.

BTW, it is possible to have hired out police and Fire departments.

My City of Carrollton got out of the trash collecting business and signed a deal with Texas Waste Management to collect the garbage.

The Cities Road department has to BID on contracts to repair roads too. They do not win all of them. In other words, some outside contractors are used to build roads in Carrollton. (however the City guys do win a majority of them)

A good friend and Disc Golfer Kevin Pineapple Agpalo #10810 worked for the Street department for 25+ years. He use to tell me about those things. Another disc Golfer and former City Employee Brett Wolf had to do the same thing with the Water Department before he left the city for medical reasons.

Pizza God

Mar 06 2009, 02:33 PM

The fear of printing too much money (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7925981.stm)

Pizza God

Mar 08 2009, 12:26 PM

Bernanke Says Fed to �Deploy All Tools� for Economic Revival (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=avh2kzovFhBc&refer=home)

Oh, I guess because they have done such a good job so far :p

Lyle O Ross

Mar 09 2009, 03:24 PM

On a lighter economic note - here's what our great trading partner China has been up to lately. Remember that manufacturing pushed, via them lobbyists, our Congress to open up trade with China so we could move all our jobs over there. This includes a number of militarily sensitive jobs and technologies. Good thing someone got rich!

U.S. Protests 'Harassment' of Navy Ship by Chinese Vessels

By Ann Scott Tyson
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, March 9, 2009; 12:03 PM
The Pentagon today protested what it called harassment and aggressive shadowing of a U.S. Navy ocean surveillance ship by five Chinese vessels in international waters off the South China Sea on Sunday, warning such behavior could lead to collisions or the loss of life.
During the incident, the Chinese vessels "surrounded" the U.S.N.S. Impeccable and closed within 50 feet, with Chinese crew members "waving Chinese flags and telling Impeccable to leave the area," according to a Pentagon statement.
Impeccable sprayed fire hoses at one of the vessels in self-protection, but the Chinese crewmembers stripped to their underwear and the ship "continued closing to within 25 feet," the Pentagon said.
At that point, the Impeccable used a bridge-to-bridge radio to communicate it was leaving the area, but two of the Chinese vessels stopped directly in the path of the U.S. ship, forcing it to conduct an emergency stop.
The U.S. Embassy in Beijing lodged a formal protest over the incident with China's Foreign Ministry during the weekend. Today senior Defense Department officials met with a Chinese defense attach� at the Pentagon to reiterate the protest, according to a defense official.
Under international law, the U.S. military can conduct activities "in waters beyond the territorial sea of another state without prior notification or consent" including in an exclusive economic zone of another country, said Maj. Stewart Upton, a Pentagon spokesman.
The U.S. Navy operates five ocean surveillance ships. Navy ships and aircraft routine operate in the area where the incident took place, Upton said. "Chinese ships and aircraft routinely steam or fly near U.S. Navy ships in this area. However, these actions were considerably more aggressive and unprofessional than what we have seen and greatly increased the risk of collision or miscalculation," he said.
The incident Sunday followed "days of increasingly aggressive conduct by Chinese vessels" and aircraft, including crossing the bows of U.S. ships within 500 yards and conducting fly-bys at altitudes of 400 feet, the Pentagon statement said.
For example, it said on March 5 a Chinese frigate approached the Impeccable and crossed its bow at a range of about 100 yards. Two hours later a Chinese Y-12 maritime surveillance aircraft conducted fly-bys of the U.S. ship at an altitude of 600 feet.
On March 4, it said a Chinese fisheries patrol vessel shone a high-intensity spotlight on the USNS Victorious, another ocean surveillance ship, as it operated about 125 nautical miles from China's coast in the Yellow Sea, and the following day a Y-12 flew overhead at about 400 feet.

I wonder how long it's going to take us to learn that the absolute pursuit of money has it's problems?

Lyle O Ross

Mar 10 2009, 11:58 AM

Hey Za,

This is for you:

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?episode=375

This is an incredible article. It starts slow giving very basic definitions of balance sheets and how they work, but once it gets going and discusses what the banks are doing, it is fascinating and frightening. There's this one part where they read a letter from the Deutsche Bank and they refer to it as blackmail, it is. Then they get to the part where they tell you that the problem is way deeper than the banks, i.e. that our dept to GDP ratio right now looks exactly like it did in 1929....

Pizza God

Mar 10 2009, 05:51 PM

World Bank says collapse has arrived (http://business.theage.com.au/business/world-bank-says-collapse-has-arrived-20090309-8taj.html)

Lyle O Ross

Mar 13 2009, 05:56 PM

So for those of you who haven't been watching, go to Thedailyshow on line and watch the debate between Stewart and CNBCs financial guy Jim Cramer. It's amazing he calls the guy out and shows how the T.V. analysts knew exactly what Wall Street was doing with our money and said nothing. You'll be mad as all get out.

gotcha

Mar 13 2009, 07:27 PM

Red flags were raised years ago by people who saw this financial mess on the horizon. If the Stewart interview with Cramer makes you mad, then you probably shouldn't watch the following videos which are based on historical fact:

How did we get into this financial crisis? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsfMicOgufA)

Shocking video evidence of Democrat cover-up of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs)

Democratic hypocrisy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxMInSfanqg)

Burning down the house. What caused the financial crisis? This is a bombshell..... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RZVw3no2A4)

Pizza God

Mar 16 2009, 03:56 PM

This is one of the things I have worried about

China�s Leader Says He Is �Worried� Over U.S. Treasuries (http://www.texasinsider.org/?p=6376#more-6376)

Make sure you read to the end of the article.

China owns 20 to 25% of our National Debt, in fact, they pretty much own us. If China wanted to destroy America, all they have to do is sell all those treasury notes. That would kill the dollar and be the end of the USA as we know it.

Lets hope it does not come to that.

Pizza God

Mar 16 2009, 04:25 PM

Watch this video

Notice that Bernanke admits the FED is in essence "Printing Money"

He also admits that the FED helped cause the Great Depression.

However when asked if they helped cause this recession, he does not exactly answer the question.

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Pizza God

Mar 23 2009, 03:37 PM

Fed move is a market-changer as the dollar sinks (http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/03/22/business/markets23.php)

The dollar index, which tracks the greenback against a basket of major currencies such as the euro and yen, had one of its biggest weekly slides in decades, at one point testing the steepest slide since 1973, before recovering.

And the part that really should make you worry

The weak dollar, meanwhile, is providing a longer-term worry to many countries because of its role as the world�s reserve currency, held by central banks. It has been the most convincing store of value, but this is changing.

A panel of experts is expected to recommend to the United Nations this week that the world shift to use a basket of currencies as the global reserve. There will be no change in the short term, but the fact that it is being discussed points to the greenback�s weakness.

What has kept the Dollar strong and our country strong is the fact we are the worlds currency. If and when that changes, God help us.

Pizza God

Mar 24 2009, 03:28 PM

China Urges New Money Reserve to Replace Dollar (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/world/asia/24china.html?_r=1&ref=asia)

China is the largest creditor nation right now, because they hold $1 TRILLION Dollars, it is in there best interest right now to say the other thing they said yesterday. That they will keep buying our debt so our country does not collapse.

gotcha

Mar 24 2009, 09:59 PM

Dear Mr.President,
Patriotic retirement:

There's about 40 million people over 50 in the work force-pay them $1 million apiece severance with stipulations.

1) They leave their jobs. Forty million job openings - Unemployment fixed.

2) They buy NEW American cars. Forty million cars ordered - Auto Industry fixed.

3) They either buy a house/pay off their mortgage - Housing Crisis fixed.

gotcha

Mar 25 2009, 09:25 AM

Pizza God

Mar 25 2009, 02:59 PM

Mervyn King warns Gordon Brown to stop spending (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article5971296.ece)

Mervyn King - Governor of the Bank of England (Central Bank of England
Gordon Brown - Prime Minister of England

Just so you know who those people are.

Pizza God

Mar 26 2009, 06:13 PM

I have received this video in several emails today, gotten it on facebook several times and now I think I should post it here.

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Pizza God

Mar 28 2009, 12:34 AM

Socialist Sen. Bernie Sanders grilling Ben Bernaki and mentions the Senate version of HR 1207, the Audit the Fed Bill. (House version has 46 co sponsors now)

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Pizza God

Mar 28 2009, 06:58 PM

I stated several months ago that a one world monetary policy may be in the works. I was called a conspiracy nut because of it. Back then I pointed out that the dollar would have to be devalued to do this. What has been going on lately????

Now some in congress are trying to make sure this does not happen in the US.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/bcPpD71Eo98&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/bcPpD71Eo98&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Pizza God

Mar 28 2009, 09:32 PM

tbender

Mar 30 2009, 10:46 AM

I stated several months ago that a one world monetary policy may be in the works. I was called a conspiracy nut because of it. Back then I pointed out that the dollar would have to be devalued to do this. What has been going on lately????

Now some in congress are trying to make sure this does not happen in the US.

(Deleted video imbed of Bachmann)

And you still should be considered a nut, just like she is.

What she thinks is happening (and trying to prevent via legislation) and what is being discussed globally are two separate things.

Pizza God

Mar 30 2009, 02:31 PM

You are correct in a way, this is a subject I do pay attention to. I truely feel that the dollar is at a pivotal point.

What happened on the commodities market when Gunther said he would be open to a global based currency??? The dollar dropped.

We, as Americans, need to INSIST that our government lives within it's means for US to prosper in the long run.

This can NOT be done by spending our way out of a recession. That leads to more bubbles which have to burst eventually.

There are some that say this is the big burst of the Dollar Bubble which is 35 years in the making.

tbender

Mar 30 2009, 04:03 PM

Thank you Mr. Hoover and Mr. Paul.

Now, back to our regularly scheduled reality...

Pizza God

Mar 30 2009, 04:54 PM

Pizza God

Mar 30 2009, 04:55 PM

Oh, that last interview is for Tony, my Congressman actually sent me this link. He just finished reading this book. I am thinking about getting the book for myself so I can learn more.

gotcha

Mar 30 2009, 05:05 PM

Every American should watch this video. It's not political......it's common sense:

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If you want to email your friends & family, here's the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeYscnFpEyA

tbender

Mar 30 2009, 05:54 PM

Amity Shlaes? Your Congressman (Burgess)? Really? I should trust them? Thanks, but no thanks.

Shlaes ignores GDP increases and unemployment decreases that were happening each year in the New Deal BEFORE Roosevelt slowed it down in 1937...WWII stopped the backslide of 1937 and, yes, pushed the US out of the Great Depression faster than the New Deal was -- but to claim that the New Deal didn't work is a bad conservative talking point. (One of many such points that were rejected in November.)

Most other revisionist conservatives have been doing the same thing as Shlaes did, ignoring lessons learned from Hoover (isn't some Republican currently pitching a 3 year spending freeze?) and vilifying the New Deal. Santayana was right, and I think doubly so for those like Shlaes who intentionally misremember the past.

Another view of Shlaes: http://www.slate.com/id/2169744/pagenum/all

Pizza God

Mar 30 2009, 06:20 PM

Kenny Marchant. (former Mayor of Carrollton, son is on City Council right now, and a former customer of mine [moved into another stores area])

I like Burgess better though.

Pizza God

Mar 30 2009, 06:25 PM

Tony, lets not forget I am a student of the Austrian Economic school. Everything done in the New Deal run's against those principles.

Lyle O Ross

Mar 30 2009, 07:18 PM

Tony, lets not forget I am a student of the Austrian Economic school. Everything done in the New Deal run's against those principles.

Why am I not surprised that Za supports a school of thought that doesn't believe in measurement, statistics, or rational observation, but relies on gut instinct and what the individual believes.

Of course that worked so well with Bush and his cronies that the world's economy is in the proverbial toilet.

You're forgetting Za that a large part of the reason we're in the mess we're in is because of the influence of the libertarian ideals on the GOP. That included removal of all controls, i.e. deregulation out the wazoo. If I were you I'd at least be a little embarrassed...

Actually, The New Deal started working quite well, real unemployment fell, and then it suffered a huge set back. The conservatives that FDR had in his cabinet wanted a balanced budget and they argued him into it. So he complied, cut back deficit spending, unemployment rose and the depression was extended until the end of WWII. Who knows what would have happened if those darned conservatives hadn't saved us all. BTW - Keynes told him what the outcome would be. Sounds like he listened to the wrong people.

Pizza God

Mar 31 2009, 12:12 AM

I will answer some posts tomorrow, it is late, but I just came across this article and had to post it.

Russia backs return to Gold Standard to solve financial crisis (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/g20-summit/5072484/Russia-backs-return-to-Gold-Standard-to-solve-financial-crisis.html)

Chinese and Russian leaders both plan to open debate on an SDR-based reserve currency as an alternative to the US dollar at the G20 summit in London this week

MMM, looks like I am right eh???

tbender

Mar 31 2009, 10:30 AM

Bryan, that is true. Austrian v Keynes has become the new ideological debate.

The only problem is, that the Austrianites have had 30 years of practice and it has resulted in where we are now. Free Markets don't work when humans are involved.

And do you understand the difference between global reserve currency and the actual US currency? I assume you do, but again, Bachmann apparently doesn't. Using her as support doesn't help your position at all...it just paints you as a like-minded loon.

Pizza God

Mar 31 2009, 04:02 PM

Bryan, that is true. Austrian v Keynes has become the new ideological debate.

Too busy to get into to much of a debate

BUT, the Republicans have NOT been following Austrian Economics. If they did, they would not have 1) increased spending in the last 8 years, 2) gone into Iraq, 3) bailed out wall street to begin with.

No, the Republicans and Democrats both follow Keynesian Economics. Funny that even Keynes though currency had to be based on something (not FIAT currency)

Milton Friedman won the Nobel Memorial Prize in Economic Sciences. He wrote books about the Great Depression and how Keynes Economics took the recession and turned it into a 10 year depression. (ok the depression technically didn't last all 10 years, we just really didn't snap out of the problem until after WWII)

He was also an opponent of the Federal Reserve and how they let to the problems that led to the stock market crash of '29 and the resulting depression.
______________________________________

I have a lot of work today, I can't really post like I wanted to today. I know this stuff in my head, but like to research it to get the exact fact correct. I get myself in trouble when I post without proof.

Pizza God

Mar 31 2009, 09:18 PM

I post this as a point of interest.

Eagle Forum Warns U.S. Treasury Secretary (http://www.texasinsider.org/?p=7120#more-7120)

tbender

Apr 01 2009, 02:08 PM

Public's Sound And Fury Over Budget Are As Deafening As 'Crickets Chirping'
http://www.nationaljournal.com/congressdaily/cda_20090401_1162.php

Meanwhile, the Republicans finally release their version....and it's Hoover and Bush 43 all over again...5-year spending freeze and more tax cuts for the wealthy...
http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2009/04/01/gop-windfall/
(Warning: Left wing site linked...with non left links in article.)

tbender

Apr 01 2009, 02:15 PM

I post this as a point of interest.

Eagle Forum Warns U.S. Treasury Secretary (http://www.texasinsider.org/?p=7120#more-7120)

Link review:
Schlafy now joining Bachmann in opposing something that isn't being discussed, except by Bachmann.

(And now Bachmann's got 30 cosponsors...all Republicans, go figure...)

Pizza God

Apr 01 2009, 04:47 PM

Ron Paul's HR 1207 (http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.1207.IH:) (Audit the FED bill) now has 50 co-sponsors, including at least 6 Democrats last I heard.

Pizza God

Apr 01 2009, 04:54 PM

On the subject of Obama's budget bill, I started getting "Action Alerts" in just the last few days.

it is going to pass anyways. Most people I know are going to be protesting our Government Spending on April 15th. (not protesting Taxes like one of the articles stated)

As far as the Budget Proposal by the Republicans. What is wrong with freezing government spending for the next 5 years????? Technically that is STILL not balancing the Budget.

The Best way to "Stimulate" the economy is by giving tax cuts. That is what most of the "Stimulus" Done was anyways. And when you do cut taxes, sure, the guys making the most money, usually benefit the most.

2008 I made more money than I have in 10 years, yet no income tax cut is going to save me money. I still didn't pay any taxes and got $745 in EIC. (of which my Accountant is charging me $200 to calculate)

The good news is that I expect to have to pay taxes for the 1st time in 10 years for 2009. (Last time I paid taxes was for the year 1998, ~$5K to be exact)

I also mailed my Rent check last night. On time for the 1st time in 2 years.

tbender

Apr 01 2009, 05:50 PM

Dropping the top 3 marginal tax rates (for $100k+ plus incomes) to 25% helps no one but the wealthy.

The ARRA is 32% tax cuts. The rest (68%) is spending, broken into multiple sections.

Food stamps, extending unemployment benefits, pushing infrastructure development etc. stimulate the economy better than tax cuts. (I can't find the chart right now, but the first two items I listed generate $1.50+ for every $1.00 spent. Tax cuts generate ~$0.60.)

And refer, again, to Hoover about spending freezes at times like these...

I hope your Action Alerts also include calls for legitimate new ideas. You keep parroting more the same stuff that hasn't and still doesn't work.

Pizza God

Apr 01 2009, 11:43 PM

I had a big long explanation of what caused the Stock Market Bubble in 1929 and what the FED did that helped turn a recession into a Depression, but I got busy and the we site timed out. So:

You forget that Hoover signed the LARGEST Tariff in history and the fact that the Federal Reserve that helped cause the Stock Market bubble (by artificially lowering Interest rates) raised interest rates (instead of lowering them as they should have) So saying Hoover did nothing is wrong.

Keynesian Economics was not popular at the time, the FED did the exact opposite of what they would do now.

To make a long story short, when the FED or government does things to STOP a recession, it re inflates the Bubbles and causes them to grow even larger.

Anytime the Government tries to regulate or stimulate the market, it is a bad thing in the long run. The Market will take care of itself. If a company makes bad investments, there stock will drop. Anyone who invested in that company will loose there investment. That is SUPPOSE to be how it works. You invest in good companies, you make money, you invest in bad companies, you loose your money.

Anyways, I have got to get back to work. we just had another very busy night.

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 12:52 PM

So, South Carolina has budget problems that Gov Sanford has been trying to overcome. In the Stimulus plan, a lot of the money for South Carolina were for new programs or programs that would mean that South Carolina would have to come up with even more money now or in the future.

So to make a long story short. Mark Sanford asked Obama if he could apply some of that money to the states debt instead. (South Carolina's budget is 11% interest on the debt) This would save the state a lot of money just like if you make extra payments towards your home.

Obama's administration said NO.

And this is the Democratic responce

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So a governor tries to be fiscally responsible, and the Democrats bash him. This is why we are in the state we are in right now. (not to mention the waist of money putting this add on TV right now)

Lyle O Ross

Apr 02 2009, 01:26 PM

Za, You are funny, what do you think we've been doing for the last 30 years? Giving tax breaks to the rich at the expense of the poor. Meanwhile, the poor are poorer than they've been in 75 years, and the rich are richer. They've gone from holding 9% of the wealth in the 70s to 22%. Giving tax breaks to the rich has just the opposite affect of what Reaganomics predicted.

Here, read this again.

After more than a quarter century, the era of Reaganomics is over, replaced by Obamanomics.
The first principle of Reaganomics was that lower taxes on the wealthy made them work harder and invest more, and the benefits trickle down to everyone else. Rarely in economic history has a theory been more tested in the real world and proven so wrong. Nothing trickled down. After the Reagan tax cuts, the median wage slowed, adjusted for inflation. After George W. Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy, the median wage actually dropped.
Meanwhile, most of the income went to the top. In 1980, just before the Reagan revolution, the richest 1 percent took home 9 percent of total national income. But by 2007, the richest 1 percent was taking home 22 percent. Obamanomics, by contrast, will increase taxes on the top, and it will use these proceeds to raise the living standards of average Americans by giving them lower taxes, better schools, and more affordable health insurance.
Reaganomics' second principle was that deregulated markets function better. Well, energy markets were deregulated and we wound up with Enron. Carbon emissions weren't controlled, and now we face global warming. Financial markets were deregulated and we have a global meltdown. Obamanomics, by contrast, accepts important roles for government: Creating incentives for non-fossil based energy, setting an overall cap on carbon emissions, and ensuring the solvency and security of financial companies.
The third and least well-known principle of Reaganomics is that government can keep the economy moving full tilt by spending like crazy and not worrying too much about budget deficits. Reagan's big spending was on national defense. Some of us called it "military Keynesianism." Problem was, it didn't stop when the economy got to capacity, thereby threatening inflation. Obama's stimulus intends to avoid this by reducing deficits as the nation moves back toward full capacity.
Under Reaganomics, government is the problem. It can still be a problem. But Obanaomics at least recognizes there are even bigger problems out there that can't be solved without government.

BTW - all the hoopla about the budget is a laugh, Bush's last budget was 3.1 trillion, Obama's is 3.5 the difference being the Bush lied to us by leaving funding for the war out of the budget and Obama has left it in.

Of course the real difference is that Bush set his budget around the rich and powerful and Obama's is around the poor and middle class. Now I wonder, just who it is that buys your pizzas?

Lyle O Ross

Apr 02 2009, 01:46 PM

BTW - SC budget problems were simply made, Sanford, a libertarian, pushed for tax cuts so that there were insufficient funds to cover the state's operations. Read this article, it shows how completely idiotic the state was in how it managed it's money.

http://www.charleston.net/news/2008/aug/14/budget_deficit_equal_tax_cuts50809/

Can you say dumb. So the state's lack of fiscal planning catches up with them, but it looks like Obama might bail them out. "Uh, we mis-planned, cut taxes in areas that were absolutely necessary, without cutting programs to match the tax breaks and now we'd like you to pull our back-sides from the fire."

Well, now they have no choice, they've got to cut the things they should have cut in the first place, things like education, core government functions, law enforcement. One tries not to laugh, but sometimes it's too funny.

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 03:08 PM

So exactly what is the difference between a tax cut and giving people a stimulus??????

Oh, and what is killing the middle class??? INFLATION.

And what hurts the Poor the most??? Minimum Wage laws.

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 03:09 PM

one last question, how long do you really think we can keep up spending more than we have coming in???

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 04:10 PM

�Every fiat currency through history has a finite lifetime and ultimately collapses,� he said. �We�ve had a nice run with this one. But the likelihood that the dollar eventually collapses as a global fiat currency is 100 percent.�

A sneak attack on the U.S. dollar? (http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0309/20723.html)

The article looks at one of the possibilities we are looking at with the Dollar. This is the one I fear the most.

Merkaba311

Apr 02 2009, 04:13 PM

Lyle it seems like you don't recognize the fact that the Democrats and Republicans are both working against the interests of the people who put them in office.

When people talk about taxes, they're typically referring to the income tax. A tax that 60 million people who should file for it every year, don't. The income tax is one of the worst things to ever happen to this country. It allows, if nothing else, our imperialistic foreign policy that has us goose-stepping around the globe in the name of "democracy." The founding fathers declared direct taxes to be unconstitutional if they aren't apportioned because of the corruption that they saw in their own lives. Fascism through taxation is not a new concept.

You and I have very similar desires for our lives and we want the least amount of interference and corruption from people who have authority over us. I used to vote for Democrats until I realized they're just as corrupt and evil as Republicans. It's like being in high school and at any given time you've got a principle and a vice principle, both carry equal authority but occasionally one has to obtain approval from the other. Very rarely they'll disagree over something, but for the most part, one hand washes the other.

The principles are never going to see it your way because their motivation for performing their job comes from a different place than whatever motivated you to earn an appearance before them.

Dems and Repubs do a fantastic job of dividing the populace into certain categories so we fight amongst ourselves, insuring their future jobs. Poor & rich, [censored] & straight, liberal & conservative, etc.

You and Pizza_God may never agree on political issues but what is most important is that you recognize that you both have similar desires for your lives. Regardless of the way you feel politically, politicians are going to ignore 99% of what you want and focus on what motivates them, not what motivates you. You may root for a certain team, but your cheers fall on deaf ears.

When I see an Obama bumper sticker I just assume the person is gullible/ignorant/naive just like I did when I saw Bush bumper stickers. The only cure for that is compassion. Division only serves to further support the status quo.

Most of my friends voted for Obama...none of my friends voted for McCain...some voted for Ron Paul...some voted for Cynthia McKinney. However, I value all of them and their desires to fulfill their dreams equally. I do my best to treat each and every person in my life as if they're my brother or sister.

I'm not saying that you don't feel the same way, but it seems like you carry a lot of angst for people who don't feel exactly like you. My advice is to be compassionate rather than divisive and instead of telling people why they're wrong, tell them why you feel the way that you do, and how "your way" will improve their lives.

Nobody responds well to "this is why you're an idiot" or "I laugh in your face because you're now suffering and I disagree with you." That type of elitism is far more poisonous than greed because it spawns evil of all kinds.

Not to mention, we're most likely in this economic situation as a result of the petty bickering between the left and right that took up the majority of the discussion between politicians while they ignored our amassing debt and the corrupt institution that is the Federal Reserve.

I'll just say that I hope and pray every day that I'm wrong and Obama will save us but that's not to say I'm not preparing for what is most likely going to happen in the next four years. Total economic collapse...the end of the United States...

Lyle O Ross

Apr 02 2009, 04:26 PM

Merk,

Your advice in great general advice. Here's the problem. I've been having this debate with Za for about 8 years now. I used to be very patient and very polite with Za. However, you can post counters to his points politely and with good information, and then he comes back with the same point a month or so later. If you take a position simply because you "think" it is in your best interest despite concrete evidence that the position is flawed, I'm likely to give you a hard time.

Now Za is the rare exception here, he is rarely, in fact almost never combative. On the other hand, there are a number of hugely combative and personalizing people who post here. Most of them will attack, and personally with no real reason whatsoever. They rarely attack your point of view and usually attack you.

BTW - The point of view you're coming from is that of the liberals in this country. You should listen to a great piece that came out two weeks ago on Bill Moyers Journal on PBS. He does an interview with a woman on the golden rule. Very interesting and I think you'd like it.

Last point, if you'll peruse my past posts, you'll see that I clearly state and argue that neither party serves us well. I've argued against much of what Obama is doing, not because I think he's a bad person, but rather because in the name of compromise, he's doing some bad things.

I disagree with your position that politicians are never going to respond to me, a review of history will show that when the people in this country become involved and informed, they act very vocally and in waves and shazam, those politicians respond nicely forgetting that we don't have the money to buy their votes.

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 05:40 PM

I enjoy my political jousting with Tony and Lyle. I wish Pat would post here again. I always enjoyed his posts.

I read a lot of articles, if one in particular catches my eye, I usually re post it here. So sometimes I may post an article or about something I have not talked about in a while.

Pizza God

Apr 02 2009, 08:13 PM

FDR Economist Says Obama Should Put Stimulus First (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=atf_2mZ2XQKw&refer=home)
Lets see, take advice from someone who was an Economist during FDR's days.

only World War II delivered the U.S. from its hard economic times,

Actually, it was not until after WWII did we really get out of the Depression.

Well I do agree with him on this quote

then start paying attention to the deficit. Long-term, �it�s unsustainable,�

Pizza God

Apr 03 2009, 01:08 AM

I posted this here because it is where it belongs.
Ron Paul talks about the Obama Budget and the G20.

This is interesting, even if you don't like Ron Paul

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Pizza God

Apr 04 2009, 12:52 AM

As we now know, the main thing achieve at the G20 was a very large world wide stimulus plan.

But I know how some of you just love these two people.

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Pizza God

Apr 04 2009, 12:55 AM

Wow, even Hanity talking about a Global Currency

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Pizza God

Apr 04 2009, 09:25 PM

Ex-Chairman of A.I.G. Says Bailout Has Failed (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/03/business/03aig.html?_r=1)

Maurice R. Greenberg, the former chairman of the American International Group, said Thursday that the government�s $170 billion bailout had failed and that taxpayers would have been better off letting the company go bankrupt.

Pizza God

Apr 04 2009, 09:33 PM

The Anti-Bono (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/22/magazine/22wwln-q4-t.html?_r=3&ref=books)

I found this interesting.

This is the same argument over the Welfare state.

Pizza God

Apr 05 2009, 02:32 PM

Lou Dobbs on the G20

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tbender

Apr 13 2009, 03:46 PM

What won't be discussed at the Tea Parties...how much those in attendance are in the minority...

http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/n8swksghf0gp7f7t_2az2a.gif

http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/indysheartobama.jpg

First spotted here: http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/bipart...ama-on-economy/ (http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/bipartisanship/poll-over-two-thirds-of-independents-trust-obama-on-economy/)
Gallup Link: http://www.gallup.com/poll/117415/Americans-Confident-Obama-Economy.aspx

Pizza God

Apr 14 2009, 12:50 AM

What won't be discussed at the Tea Parties...how much those in attendance are in the minority...

So question for you, do agree with the Tea Parties, or do you think that the debt our country is charging up is OK?

Do you want your taxes raised so we can pay for more government?

tbender

Apr 14 2009, 11:13 AM

Answer 1: Where were the Tea Parties in 2002 or 2006?

Answer 2: If the money goes to better, smarter government, then yes. (See new DoD budget, Healthcare reform, Energy policy, etc.)

http://www.gallup.com/poll/117433/Views-Income-Taxes-Among-Positive-1956.aspx

Relevant Graph:
http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/ubznzwpr1eaow_w-4mbbeq.gif

As I said....Tea Parties = minority opinion.

tbender

Apr 14 2009, 11:23 AM

Face it Bryan, these parties are very little about taxes and more about protesting the "conservative" fall from power* -- in a democratically held election.

*Which has also drawn the Beck/Bachmann crazies, the birthers, the racists, etc. All in all, a bunch of "sound and fury, signifying nothing" coherent, logical, or meaningful.

Pizza God

Apr 14 2009, 04:11 PM

I have been protesting this for a few years now, you should know.

Also, most Conservatives I know bash Bush for his part in this too, but now it is out of control.

Do you not see that???

Do you really think it is OK for Obama to double the National Debt in the next 5 years after??? That is 4 times the amount Bush did in office and I objected to that.

I miss Clinton believe it or not, at least he balanced the budget.

tbender

Apr 14 2009, 04:21 PM

Yes, I do...

The transgressions of the past (ignoring healthcare, deregulating, tax breaks for the rich, unnecessary war) now have to be dealt with, and it will cost more money now than it would have previously.

And economically...again, we've been here before. Hoover versus Roosevelt.

tbender

Apr 14 2009, 04:27 PM

Most of those conservatives are cowards who held their tongues when Bush was in office. Or mumbled quietly under their breath and were rebuked by the overlords. Once they realized his reign was over, they all of a sudden got religion again.

Conservatism is dying due to it's own neglect and the fringe inbreeding. None of the current powers that (want) to be are capable of resurrecting it. Or courageous enough to go against the fringe base and heal the movement.

Pizza God

Apr 14 2009, 08:41 PM

Most of those conservatives are cowards who held their tongues when Bush was in office. Or mumbled quietly under their breath and were rebuked by the overlords. Once they realized his reign was over, they all of a sudden got religion again.

I will agree with that. In campaigning for Ron Paul, we came across many "non voters" that were fed up with Bush, they had just given up on the system.

I don't have time at the moment, but I have read (and I think posted) that a majority of American's are Conservative. (think "Blue Dog Democrats")

There are going to be around 2000 Tea Parties tomorrow across this Nation (and even overseas) You wont see it in the liberal media, but I guarantee there will be over a million people protesting out of control government spending.

It is funny, I read a lot of conservative web sites, they rairly mention Obama by name because this protest is not about Obama (even though he is the man in charge at the moment) They just mention "government"

But the Left keeps saying it is all about Obama. I have read several articles in the last few days bashing the Tea Parties because they say it is against Obama.

That is not true, the Tea Parties I know about have asked for no "Anti Obama" signs, they are trying to keep this non-partisan.

kkrasinski

Apr 14 2009, 08:42 PM

Pizza God

Apr 14 2009, 08:44 PM

oh great, am I a terrorist again???

tbender

Apr 15 2009, 10:21 AM

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/th...publicans-.html (http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/04/and-then-they-came-for-the-republicans-.html)

Read that link, and the Greenwald link in Sullivan's piece. (And to see how the fringe reads that report, look up Malkin if you can stomach it. Think she projects much?)
Shorter version of Sullivan/Greenwald: It's pushing a line, but it's the pendulum swinging to the other side.

What do you expect when Beck is not-so-subtly linking Obama to Hitler, Bachmann is calling for revolution, and today's "protests" are named after an event that led into an armed revolt against the government?

And that's just in the mainstream...

Getting the right to drop the extremist rhetoric (before another McVeigh happens) would be nice.

tbender

Apr 15 2009, 10:59 AM

Bonus thought: Why do conservatives feel the need to lump themselves in with real right-wing extremists?

Guilt, perhaps?

Pizza God

Apr 15 2009, 12:34 PM

Bonus thought: Why do conservatives feel the need to lump themselves in with real right-wing extremists?

Guilt, perhaps?

FEMA training in 2001 calling George Washington and Thomas Jefferson Terrorists

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Pizza God

Apr 15 2009, 12:38 PM

And my other thought,

How is it "right wing extremist" to want the government to be responsible and balance the books????

That is what this is all about, can't you see that? Our government is spending us into bankruptcy and you call those that call them on it "right wing extremist"

Well if that is the case, then we are doomed because of people who feel that way.

Anyways, isn't this the Economic Thread???

(I will read the articles you posted later, right now I have to make a $200 order and dough)

tbender

Apr 15 2009, 01:14 PM

I see it, and I understand that we don't exist in a vacuum. Again, Hoover vs Roosevelt. The balance budget idea is great when we aren't facing a depression.

I'm also not calling anyone a right wing extremist. Folks are doing that themselves. And co-opting American revolutionary themes incorrectly and is one way to do it. You have representation, just this time your chosen side lost the election.

Another great point from Sullivan (note: he's an intellectual conservative, which means he's been disowned by the base.) Post titled Left Behind? (http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/04/left-behind.html#more)

You're jumping to the same conclusion that Malkin has, though I doubt you came to it in the same manner. She's demonized the left for years and this is a projection of her tactics upon herself. You're a libertarian.

Maybe you should look at the rhetoric being thrown around by conservatives and realize that for every legitimate point made, there are a number of illegitimate points overshadowing them. And those idiotic, misguided, and based-in-fiction points are the ones that are being focused on by the conservatives themselves!

Pizza God

Apr 15 2009, 02:39 PM

It frustrates me as much as encourages me that many of the Republican Party leaders are jumping on the bandwagon. Too little, too late in my opinion.

I just opened an email from the Texas GOP's Tina Benkiser, She does exactly what you are talking about, blame the Democrats instead of admitting they are only making it worse.

In my opinion, if that is what make people wake up, then so be it.

The Republican party is trying to figure out where they stand, are they the Rockefeller, Neo-Con, big government party, or are they the Goldwater, Reagan, Taft, small government party. (I must note there are differences in Foreign policy between these three Republicans, Reagan being the weakest of these three)

I am pushing and waking up the small government part of the party. In Texas, I fully expect that, if you have seen what I have seen you might agree.

One last note, on the way to work this morning I heard Glenn Beck talking to a caller say "Obama is no different than Bush" In other words, Beck said that Bush was no better than Obama in his policies. But then he was bashing Bush for the last few years I have been listening to him.

tbender

Apr 15 2009, 02:41 PM

And the extremist report wasn't a liberal hit-job...

Left-wing extremist report (http://www.fas.org/irp/eprint/leftwing.pdf)

Released in January.

tbender

Apr 15 2009, 03:07 PM

The Republican party is trying to figure out where they stand, are they the Rockefeller, Neo-Con, big government party, or are they the Goldwater, Reagan, Taft, small government party. (I must note there are differences in Foreign policy between these three Republicans, Reagan being the weakest of these three).

This is the crux of the problem on the right. And I would add that they've let social issues dominate the platform for far too long...creating the rise of the NeoCons and their faux conservative agenda.

Problem is, the leadership on the right has maneuvered itself into this position by pandering to the base while the base turned off moderates and true independents. And that leadership either can't see it or can't stop pandering for fear of losing the last 25%-30%.

A strong, well-reasoned opposition is necessary in our system. Unfortunately, the NeoCons destroyed that concept and now they are out of power and blaming everyone but themselves. Including tossing out or emasculating the few smart conservatives still around.

It will take a long walk in the woods before the Republican party finds relevance, at least nationally, again. It will take a leader willing to risk the wrath of the Limbaugh-led base when it makes sense, to come up with a new definition of conservativism in today's world. Right now, no such leader exists. The current ones and the up-and-comers are rooted deeply in the doctrine that has been soundly thumped in two federal election cycles.

tbender

Apr 16 2009, 10:58 AM

Lyle O Ross

Apr 16 2009, 04:29 PM

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 02:09 PM

IMF warns over parallels to Great Depression (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/recession/5166956/IMF-warns-over-parallels-to-Great-Depression.html)

Does anyone realize they are doing the same things done to cause the Great Depression? Apparently no, they are doing the same things that may in fact get us out of this slump, but will just cause more and bigger bubbles that will have to collapse eventually.

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 02:47 PM

The balance budget idea is great when we aren't facing a depression.

The alternative is Keynesian economics, which is one of the things that prolonged the Great Depression and principles that caused our current recession.

You have representation,

While I agree we have representation, that is not what the main subject of the Tea Parties. I agree that some people feel that way, but they are in the vast majority. The Majority of the people protesting in the Tea Parties are protesting outrageous spending policies. If you look at any picture with signs in it, you will find a majority of the signs deal with that subject. The Tea Parties were about demonstrating against the government spending, it was only a symbol, it was taken from The Ron Paul campaign where we held a Tea Party on the anniversary of the actual Tea Party. The ideas on those were basically the same, we wanted to throw overboard all the bad policies of our government INCLUDING debt spending.

Here is a video made about the Tea Party in 2007, it was a precursor of what went on last week.
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In the article listed does not take into account that at least the Republican budget FROZE spending. meaning it did not increase spending as Obama's plan did. It was still too much.

Besides, it is up to congress to figure where to spent our taxes, it is up to them to figure where they need to cut, not the people who where protesting.

One last point on this, the idea of the tea party grew and was taken in many directions. Some were organized by grassroots, others by political organizations.

Denton - Organized and supported by Republican party of Denton
Carrollton - Organized by the grass roots, no party affiliation, no speeches
Dallas, organized by an independent, no office holder was allowed to speak. Mark Davis from one of the Radio stations jumped on board and help promote it and was the MC.
Ft. Worth, organized by the same people who did the first one a few months ago.
Austin, organized by AFP (Americans for Prosperity) and EmpowerTexas.
San Antonio, organized by a local 912 group that made a good promo video that Glenn Beck loved. Glenn Beck helped promote it, but did not speak at the rally because he felt he was getting too much attention. He did help them get some speakers and Ted Negent on board. No Politicians were allowed to speak.
Castle Hills - organized by a local business owner. (that I know)

Oh and I have watched several speeches done at Tea Parties, several of the speeches mentioned, VOTE THEM OUT meaning vote out all incumbents that voted for these bailouts and overspending.

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 02:51 PM

And the extremist report wasn't a liberal hit-job...

Left-wing extremist report (http://www.fas.org/irp/eprint/leftwing.pdf)

Released in January.

Yes, I have seen that and new about it.

A lot of this was about timing. However read the two reports. They are different in the way they talk about the subject.

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 02:56 PM

This is the crux of the problem on the right. And I would add that they've let social issues dominate the platform for far too long...creating the rise of the NeoCons and their faux conservative agenda.

We agree 100% here and as a Conservative, that really bugs me. In fact I try to stay out of social issues conversations at meetings.

A strong, well-reasoned opposition is necessary in our system. Unfortunately, the NeoCons destroyed that concept and now they are out of power and blaming everyone but themselves. Including tossing out or emasculating the few smart conservatives still around.

Again, I agree with you.

The question is, can the fiscal conservative wing of the party take back control, or does the neo-con part of the party have the sheeple in place.

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 05:20 PM

Robert Reich's take on Tax Day (http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/blogs/robert_reich/2009/04/a-short-citizens-guide-to-kook.php)

Someone needs to get him a couple of phonebooks and a megaphone. He needs to be more than an advisor in the administration.

Well first off he starts off by insulting me and about 1 million people who showed up to the tea parties.

point 1 - I didn't hear anyone say we pay too much taxes right now, I hear people saying at current spending levels and current debt, each of us currently owe $35,000, that is every man, woman and child.

point 2 - What he does not mention is a lot of the deductions from years ago are not there anymore. Less deduction, less needed to have a high percentage.

Lets talk about pre 1913 - The Income tax rate was 0%. That is because there was NO income tax. Even when the Income tax rate was raised during WWI, the rate was only a few percentage points applied to everyone.

And no one is arguing that the rich pay a majority of the taxes, they make the most. it is just that the government keep raising the minimum amount and now gives negative taxes to those with kids (EIC) You like how they call it "Credit" instead of what it is, welfare or wealth redistribution. (and no, I am not happy that I take it, I look forward to paying taxes again)

Point 3 contradicts his first point where our taxes are in fact rising.

Point 4 again is not the point, you really can't cut taxes without cutting spending. That is the point of the Tea Parties was that spending it out of control.

Point 5 is a Keynesian theory that is really being proven wrong now. The "ratio of debt to the gross domestic product" that he talks about being important is the worst it has EVER been. http://static.10gen.com/businessinsider/~~/f?id=4979e68630b7d9800073dbcd&maxX=400&maxY=308

So I would say he is wrong again, the debt we are running up is bad. then the comment about the government doing something about health care. Government is the problem, not the solution. The high prices of health care are BECAUSE of government. It will only get worse if Obama gets his way.

point 6 "We have a patriotic duty to pay taxes" Ha, and the Obama administration is a fine example of this, the question is not how many in the administration didn't pay all there taxes, but who actually did pay there taxes.

President Teddy Roosevelt was a progressive borderline socialist. That is partly why he left the Republican Party and formed the Bull Moose Party. I admire Roosevelt, but do not like his fiscal policies. He sounds just like Ralph Nader.

Inheritance tax is double taxation now, when Teddy Roosevelt was alive, there was NO income tax. So yet another bad example.

Now the last paragraph in his op-ed is the only one that makes sense, not because he says that person does not support America, but the fact that our tax code (which would be 23 feet high if stacked up) is crazy and needs to be simplified.

Pizza God

Apr 19 2009, 05:30 PM

I'm sorry, but what about Reagan says small government and low spending? You'll have to do better than giving me their marketing and slogans Za. They were the orginal borrow and spend government. And hey, they set the tone for the world and look, we're all broke. We know what the GOP is, it has been clear for 30 years now, it's the borrow and spend on the rich and big business part while Rome burns.

What it comes down to is, if it's them spending on their power base (please see quotes from Bush on who their power base is), then it's all good. If it's spending on anything other than that they are up in arms.

Now this is one of the things addressed in the Tea Parties. Like I stated before, several of the speakers mention that this did not start with Obama, or even Bush (they will not admit that even Reagan was the worse at one point)

In fact, most people will not even admit that the last time we actually had a balanced budget was during the Clinton Administration, with a Republican Congress. Clinton was a Fiscal Conservative how he ran this country. That is the only thing I admire him for.

Reagan, who was suppose to be about small government, nearly doubled the National debt and doubled the amount of regulations.

Bush Jr doubled the National debt in office.

Obama doubled the budget deficit in his first 100 days as compared to Bush's biggest deficit.

As I think I posted here once before, at a Republican meeting with Congressman Michael Burgess, an Accountant asked him at what point is our country bankrupt, he leaned over and whispered "we are already there" to him. (I was sitting next to him so I heard it all) Then Congressman Burgess talked about how it is getting harder for the Treasury to sell the T-notes. The Federal Reserve is having to buy them just to keep the price up, otherwise no one would buy them. (the Federal Reserve holds about 50% of our national debt. China holds 20% as the 2nd largest holder of our debt)

Pizza God

Apr 25 2009, 02:41 AM

tbender

Apr 29 2009, 01:38 PM

http://www.tnr.com/story_print.html?id=82c53220-7594-4ece-a136-a3b2f54243ec

Finally tracked it down...

Link to John Chait's take down of the beloved Republican tome, The Forgotten Man by Amity Shlaes.

Pizza God

Apr 30 2009, 02:18 AM

One thing that that article does not point out is that when Keynesian Economics is applied to a recession and the government does things to curb the recession, it builds a Bubble.

I did not see him say that at any point. that is the major problem with Keynesian economics. Bush I and Bush II both followed Keynesian Economics and you yourself bash them for what they did in office.

Obama has taken it to a whole other level creating bubbles so big, if and WHEN they burst, it "could be" the end of the United States.

Question for you Tony, do you prefer the Neo-Con big government Republican's that have run the Republican party into the ground, or do you prefer the Classic Liberal, Small Government, libertarian leaning Republican Party that is making a comeback??????

Which is worse in your opinion.

for me, I miss the days of the Blue dog Democrat Clinton over the Radical Left Leaning Obama.

Pizza God

May 01 2009, 10:05 PM

Should we Kill the FED? (http://vdare.com/buchanan/090402_fed.htm)

Herbert Hoover, contrary to the myth that he was a small-government conservative, renounced laissez-faire, raised taxes, launched public works projects, extended emergency loans to failing businesses and lent money to the states for relief programs.
Hoover did what Obama is doing.
Indeed, in 1932, FDR lacerated Hoover for having presided over (http://www.mackinac.org/article.aspx?ID=4026) the "greatest spending administration in peacetime in all of history." His running mate, John Nance Garner, accused Hoover of "leading the country down the path of socialism (http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,954983-4,00.html)." And "Cactus Jack" was right.

tbender

May 04 2009, 04:16 PM

oClassic Liberal, Small Government, libertarian leaning Republican Party that is making a comeback??????

Answer via quote...sadly, this Republican party never really existed...

I'd settle for an opposition party capable of reasoned arguments, coherent policies, and 21st century real-world understanding.

Right now, the Republicans have none of that in spades.

Pizza God

May 06 2009, 07:50 PM

This might belong in the Jokes Thread :D

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Pizza God

May 13 2009, 12:46 AM

Pizza God

May 24 2009, 07:28 PM

Scary stuff, this is what I worry about and have been warning about.

Dollar deepens slide after Fed meeting minutes (http://www.marketwatch.com/story/dollar-weakness-continues?siteid=rss)

Pizza God

May 27 2009, 05:10 PM

China warns Federal Reserve over 'printing money' (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/financialcrisis/5379285/China-warns-Federal-Reserve-over-printing-money.html)

There is a good reason I am alarmed at the FED.

Richard Fisher, president of the Dallas Federal Reserve Bank, said: "Senior officials of the Chinese government grilled me about whether or not we are going to monetise the actions of our legislature."

Lyle O Ross

May 29 2009, 11:58 AM

I don't see your problem here Za. Look, we are a capitalist society. Under that principle, and completely consistent with Libertarianism, the Chinese own a large part of this country. They own our government bonds and much of our manufacturing capacity. Should they not have a say in how our money gets handled if over-regulation or production of money strongly impacts the value of their investment?

You can't have it both ways Za, either we're a free market system, or we have some government control that in theory represents the people. Right now, the Chinese actions are completely consistent with the actions of those that have run this country for the past 30 years. We need to ask ourselves, do we want a country and an economic system that is for sale? If, as we've acted on for the past 30 years, the answer is yes, then we cannot complain.

Pizza God

May 29 2009, 04:11 PM

Lyle O Ross

Jun 01 2009, 01:53 PM

I have a problem with the fact that China can now destroy our country in one second. Just sell off all the treasury notes they own.

Between China and the FED, it is the ONLY thing keeping this country going. The last Treasury Bond sale, the FED had to buy a majority of the bonds. They were not selling.

Also, if you keep up with this things, in this last week, we nearly lost our AAA rating and the rates on our bonds increased. (the price dropped on the cash value resulting in a higher yield, meaning that we are a higher risk than before.

You misunderstand me Bryan, I agree with your position here, but your position is inconsistent with basic Libertarian philosophies. To keep such a thing from happening, you have to manage your currency, and regulate your economy, neither of which you support. Of course, disallowing the GOP's notion that you could spend billions on corporate welfare on borrowed money would have helped also.

Pizza God

Jun 04 2009, 09:46 PM

I advocate sound money and a free market economy. Anything that moves us in that direction is a good thing. But with that said, we will never get there.

Pizza God

Jun 11 2009, 05:11 PM

Fed Would Be Shut Down If It Were Audited, Expert Says (http://www.cnbc.com/id/31204170)

Pizza God

Jun 11 2009, 08:29 PM

June 11, 2009 Audit the Fed Bill Reaches Crucial Benchmark Washington, D.C. - Congressman Ron Paul's Federal Reserve Transparency Act, HR 1207, has reached and surpassed the level of 218 cosponsors in the House of Representatives, which means it is now cosponsored by a majority of the members. The 218th cosponsor was Dennis Kucinich (OH-10), and the bill has since received its 222nd cosponsor. �The tremendous grass-roots and bipartisan support in Congress for HR 1207 is an indicator of how mainstream America is fed up with Fed secrecy,� said Congressman Paul. �I look forward to this issue receiving greater public exposure.� Hearings on Federal Reserve transparency are expected within the next month, as part of the Financial Services Committee's series of hearings on regulatory reform.

Lyle O Ross

Jun 12 2009, 11:56 AM

Pizza God

Jun 13 2009, 01:57 AM

Wow look! Za and I agree on something. Too sweet. Best thing out of congress since the New Deal!

BTW - watch the Daily Show from Wednesday. Great interview with the guy who predicted the mortgage melt down and got laughed at by the pundits. Nothing like being right.

That was Peter Schiff, Ron Paul's AUSTRIAN Economic Adviser. Yes, the Austrian Economists knew this was coming and had been saying it for years.

Jim Rogers and Marc Faber are two other Austrian minded investors that were warning about the Mortgage meltdown.

All 3 are predicting massive Inflation because of the amount of money the FED has put into circulation.

Pizza God

Jun 14 2009, 02:00 AM

After we broke through the 218 cosponsor threshold on H.R. 1207, I didn't think today could get any better. However, we have even more news.
Sen. Jim DeMint (R-SC) today became the first cosponsor of S 604, H.R. 1207's companion legislation. We still have a long way to go before we pass real legislation to Audit the Fed, but this is yet another major step toward our ultimate goal.
Sen. DeMint is highly respected and one of the most principled conservatives in Washington. Bernie Sanders (I-VT), 604's lead sponsor, is a firebrand Independent progressive. To see these two guys on a bill together has to tell you that something special is going on.

Bernie Sanders is a self described Socialist that caucuses with the Democrats. And of course DeMint is on of the most conservatives in the Senate. This is good....

I need to post the article if I can find it again about how if this bill is passed and the FED is Audited, it may be the end of the FED. The point of the article is that it would be a bad thing.

I can't remember if I posted it here, but the FED has hired a former Enron lobbyist to represent them!!!!

Pizza God

Jun 17 2009, 01:00 PM

There are some things that I find very interesting happening right now.

This video was promoted by Glenn Beck yesterday.

Yes, this is OUR FED chairman between 2005 to 2007, if you remember correctly, I have posted video's of the same time frame of Ron Paul grilling the Chairman over these same issues and warning him of what was coming.

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If I have time today, I need to research a meeting being held this week between Russia, China and a few other countries talking about forming a world currency, in other words, dropping the Dollar.

But like I said, I need to research it some more to find out exactly what this meeting is about.

Pizza God

Jun 18 2009, 12:22 AM

Ron Paul on Obama's plan

Yes, this belongs in this Thread over the Ron Paul thread.

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Pizza God

Jun 18 2009, 12:51 AM

Pretty good video showing who was saying what when.

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Pizza God

Jun 29 2009, 03:04 PM

This was released today. This is one of the things I worry about more than anything else. As most of you know, I have been keeping a close eye on this subject.

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Pizza God

Jun 30 2009, 12:16 AM

Central bankers urge move from stimulus to reform (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EU_ECONOMY_CENTRAL_BANKS?SITE=WDUN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT)

there are several key quotes from this article.

.......governments need to come up with plans to put their economies on a more sustainable footing, based less on debt in the rich world and exports in developing nations.

As soon as stable growth returns, governments should cut spending and raise taxes to put policy on a stable path,

If all the money fails to sufficiently restore the health of the banking sector, "the result would be a massive build-up of public debt without a return to robust growth" - or another risky bubble.

If you read between the lines, they basically admit they caused the problem to begin with.

Pizza God

Jul 22 2009, 05:05 PM

A Florida Democrat grills Bernanke.
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The questionable actions of the FED are starting to be shown.

Pizza God

Jul 23 2009, 09:23 PM

This picture was supposedly taken at the last world Central Bank meeting.

http://i629.photobucket.com/albums/uu14/PizzaGod/discgolf/UID.jpg

Pizza God

Jul 24 2009, 08:50 PM

That coin was from the G8 meeting.

This story even mentions it.

World Prepares to Dump the Dollar (http://www.thetrumpet.com/index.php?q=6347.4807.0.0)

This is not some conspiracy crap, this is FACT.

We can only theorize what will happen if they do start up a world currency standard.

Pizza God

Oct 06 2009, 11:25 PM

UN calls for new reserve currency (http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gIxkD4gVqrrAaL_byxq75287MWHg)

Now what do YOU think that would do to the dollar??

Iran quit using the Dollar in favor of the Euro for Oil, several other OPEC countries have been talking about doing the same thing.

Gold topped $1040 today (I heard on the radio)

The Dollar has been loosing value against other currencies lately.

And Obama thinks we are coming out of the Recession.

If the indicators I am watching come true, we are in for a huge depression. Scary thought.

Pizza God

Oct 06 2009, 11:26 PM

Dollar Living on Its Reputation and Borrowed Time (http://finance.yahoo.com/tech-ticker/article/349687/Dollar-Living-on-Its-Reputation-and-Borrowed-Time?tickers=gld)

Pizza God

Oct 07 2009, 08:22 PM

BTW, all these articles and news reports are based on the same article out of the UK

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Fossil

Oct 15 2009, 12:24 PM

Look at One Trillion Dollars! (http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=12754)

Lyle O Ross

Oct 23 2009, 07:04 PM

Hey Za,

Take a look at this weeks Frontline at pbs.org. Very good. It shows how the Fed ignored clear warnings of the coming meltdown in the 1990s. Alan Greenspan went mano-e-mano with a regulator who pointed out what was coming and won...