Dude, calm down and go count the number of ACC teams that have made to the final four over the past, oh say, 30 years and you'll understand why they're always on ESPN. It doesn't take a marketing genius to realize that people want to see the best teams play. Being new to Illinois, its somewhat amusing how excited everyone is here. What can I say, ACC fans are used to it.

And before you go on some rant just do the research or nevermind that might be to much to expect, just rant.

Read on, FlyinHigh!
__________________________________________________ _

Chase,

For the second time, I do not have a Hawkeye sticker on my Jeep. I don't get where all your anger and bitterness is coming from lately, but you might consider seeing someone about it. I will just chalk it up to the falsh-mob mentality that is so prevalent on the blight that is Internet message boards.
__________________________________________________ _

I hope you enjoyed that as much as I did, Flyin. Propers to you for spelling my name correctly. You have a PM, or more accurately, you will shortly. Respond if you want...


I havent gotten it yet. Its not some sort of death threat, is it?? :( :confused:

Death threat? No, but I can't blame you for being cautious, what with someone planning a murder spree starting in Iowa.

http://discontinuum.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=897&st=80#entry22061

Hmmmm.... let me see if I can post the picture here.

http://discontinuum.org/forums/uploads/post-2-1112211346.jpg

Dude, calm down and go count the number of ACC teams that have made to the final four over the past, oh say, 30 years and you'll understand why they're always on ESPN. It doesn't take a marketing genius to realize that people want to see the best teams play. Being new to Illinois, its somewhat amusing how excited everyone is here. What can I say, ACC fans are used to it.

And before you go on some rant just do the research or nevermind that might be to much to expect, just rant.





Finally someone that understands. I hate the ACC, but its the best conference in the country.
Chase, how can you honestly say Roy Williams hasn't done anything?? And you base your statements on facts, come on dude.

Dude, calm down and go count the number of ACC teams that have made to the final four over the past, oh say, 30 years and you'll understand why they're always on ESPN. It doesn't take a marketing genius to realize that people want to see the best teams play. Being new to Illinois, its somewhat amusing how excited everyone is here. What can I say, ACC fans are used to it.

And before you go on some rant just do the research or nevermind that might be to much to expect, just rant.





Finally someone that understands. I hate the ACC, but its the best conference in the country.
Chase, how can you honestly say Roy Williams hasn't done anything?? And you base your statements on facts, come on dude.




Okay.Whats he done then facts boy? The killing spree thing was only a joke, thats why I said Id start in Iowa, working my way south. Everybody knows I would start in the south and work my way north, saving the best for last.

http://discontinuum.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=897&st=80#entry22061

Hmmmm.... let me see if I can post the picture here.

http://discontinuum.org/forums/uploads/post-2-1112211346.jpg





Wow. Thats a sweet piece of plastic.

Are you gonna hate on your coach if your team doesn't win it all? It's about the ride...not 'just' the destination.

I'm a Roy fan...and always will be. He did wonders for our program, and I wish him success at his alma mater.

You, Chase, are inflammatory. Put some more fun into this, and reap the benefits. http://www.madisc.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif

http://discontinuum.org/forums/uploads/post-2-1112211346.jpg

[/QUOTE]


I think this disc is a sign that the Illini will finish the runner-up. If they were going to win it all wouldn't it be on CHAMPION plastic? ;) :D :o


http://sportsfanhome.com/sportsfanhome_patio/house_flags/Illinois%20Fighting%20Illini.jpg = http://www.funny-pictures.biz/images%20for%20web/sucks.jpg

Wow. Thats a sweet piece of plastic.

Thank you. If I get a good offer for it I'll sell it at the Fly 18 Grand Opening in Chicago this weekend. If not, look for it at IOS #1. If it does not sell and the Illini win, I'm sure the price goes up!

I don't know if I'll make another one. When I do a labor intensive job like that, I don't want to do it again, especially if the first one turned out well.

UNC - 75 Illinois - 70

nice bruce

msu over unc

illini over msu

http://sportsfanhome.com/sportsfanhome_patio/house_flags/Illinois%20Fighting%20Illini.jpg = http://www.funny-pictures.biz/images%20for%20web/sucks.jpg



Lmfao!!!

"illinois equals sucks" ?

lern howda speek der son

maybe some new math skills, too :)

And your watching Kansas traitor Roy Williams? And rooting for him to do something he couldnt do in Kansas? First off, Illinois will become a basketball powerhouse.Baby steps, dude.
My guess why the UNC fans arent talking is becuase of the fear they will lose to the second best Big 10 team.

I haven't said much because 98.23% of what you say is complete garbage.
That doesnt sit well with all you ACCers that have said all year the Big 10 was weak.If UNC is so good why didnt they win last year?

Is UNC playing for last year's title this year? Is this a new rule, or are you just following typical chase logic?
In fact, if UNC is such a dynasty where have all the banners gone in recent years? Have you been locked in a cage for awhile? I guess they had to wait for another Pro player to get there. Couldnt be because of Roy Williams because hes a loser.Seriously, what has he won?

Appearing in fifth Final Four with second program (previous four with Kansas). Has the fifth-highest NCAA Tournament winning percentage of active coaches (10 or more games) at .722 (39-15).
Got any other excuses? Michigan St. much like Wisconsin,plays TEAM basketball. I would think being a Kansas fan you would understand what TEAM basketball is all about.A TEAM can beat any individule. All UNC has is individules.They look for the basket themselves, instead of looking for the right shot.If they decide to move the ball around { if Felton can even make it through the game } and actually look for shots, insead of letting McCants chuck at will or just letting Williams dunk, they may beat Mich. St. I wouldnt bet on it though.

Fact: Luther Head averages more shots per game than McCants. Fact: Williams dunking is a high percentage shot, and a sign of good ball movement indicative of good team basketball. Fact: Chase has no grasp on reality or on how to spell the word individual.


You certainly sound like a UNC fan to me, so all of them arent being quiet. You and Flyin should have a closet UNC party, and invite the rest of the Illinois haters over.I said it before your all a bunch of sheep. Go watch the all ACC channel {espn} and count up the number of wrong predictions.

Someone has already addressed this (but, it is a fact that Duke has the highest tv ratings). I would expect a decent response to my statements, but this is Chase so I guess I will get the same old "Illinois plays team basketball; no ACC team plays team basketball; everyone else sucks! NC is all individules (chase spelling of course). Illinois RULES!"

GO PACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Er.... ah..... ( I almost hate to say this.... but since you are talking so much smack here)

GO ACC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Wow, once again, Mark proves cruising the stat pages makes me look stoopid. As if I care. The ACC is overrated and sucks. How about you break this one down, smart guy! As if I could really care what any of you think.Everybody has opinions, so fire away! I enjoy it!

Well I'll give McCoy this much, now i know for sure he has way too much time on his hands! So how many hours do you spend on internet porn?!! :eek: ;)

My opinion is that chase sucks the big one

but this is Chase so I guess I will get the same old "Illinois plays team basketball; no ACC team plays team basketball; everyone else sucks! NC is all individules (chase spelling of course). Illinois RULES!"



The ACC is overrated and sucks. How about you break this one down, smart guy! As if I could really care what any of you think.Everybody has opinions, so fire away! I enjoy it!

close

Well I'll give McCoy this much, now i know for sure he has way too much time on his hands! So how many hours do you spend on internet porn?!! :eek: ;)



It doesn't take long at all....just go to google.com, click images, and type in Illinois Sucks. It should pull up a pic or 100 of cum garglin gutter sluts from the Illini state :o:p :D

Check this out: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=678&e=15&u=/usatoday/20050331/sp_usatoday/indianmascotremainsbenchedforfinalfour.

My opinion is that chase sucks the big one

I never disliked Illinois until chase started posting on this thread. Now I can't stand either.

but this is Chase so I guess I will get the same old "Illinois plays team basketball; no ACC team plays team basketball; everyone else sucks! NC is all individules (chase spelling of course). Illinois RULES!"



The ACC is overrated and sucks. How about you break this one down, smart guy! As if I could really care what any of you think.Everybody has opinions, so fire away! I enjoy it!

close

Chase is almost too predictable. Again, he offered no argument; just his usual babbling about how much the ACC sucks.

The ACC is overrated and sucks. How about you break this one down, smart guy!



Do you think that the ACC spanking the Big Ten 7-2 in this years ACC / Big Ten Challenge has anything to do with the media saying the Big Ten is having a down year?

Now that was early in the year (even Indiana played a good game against UNC)..... and we all know that the season has played out different than many expected..... But it looks to me that both the ACC & The Big Ten had pretty decent seasons. Congrats to Illinois for their comeback against Arizona (although I still feel AZ blew that one) and to Michigan State for sold wins against Kentucky & Dook. Also congrats to NC State for making it to the Sweet 16 (when many thought they wouldn't even make the tournament).... to Dook for making it to the Sweet 16 when most people picked them to finish in the middle of the ACC this year..... and to my Tarheels for making it back to the Final Four. It still amazes me that people give Roy Williams sh*t for not winning a championship. It takes more than being a good coach to win the big one.... and regardless of how they finish in St. Louis, you've got to give Roy credit for doing a great job turning this group of players into a "team". Even last year the players still hadn't bought into Roy's "system"..... yet this year they have and they're playing much better.

On a final note..... I'm one of the biggest Dook haters you'll ever find..... but all of Chase's ramblings almost made me pull for Dook against Michigan State..... notice I said almost :)

LMFAO :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

I give Roy Williams credit for saying on "PTI" that Illinois is and has been the best team in the country all year. Good call ,Roy!

Hey Mark, the feeling is mutual.I dont really know you, but I dont like you either.

Discmandan420.....Why dont you go back to asking dumb assed questions on discgolfforum.com? Oh because your homey jacked everybody and shut down the site. I forgot...How about you just **** off, and dont speak to me again. Thanks!

Uh-oh Chase!

It is a good thing you don't live in Chicago. As an April Fool's prank, The Mike North morning show (WSCR 670 AM), which is a hosted by an ex-hot dog vendor who didn't graduate from high school, is claiming that Luther Head and Dee Brown are experiencing food poisoning and will not be able to play this weekend.

My opinion is that chase still sucks the big one.

Oh, and theres an ignore button baby.

Is everyone overrated? His favorite team must be the mighty Savannah State Tigers or are they even overrated for an 0-28 team.

no. 1 vs no. 1

sweeeeettt

Im glad that I picked that and never had to change my signature.

Looks like the two best teams are going to fight it out for the National Championship on Monday night. In Roy Williams post game interview, he said the great thing is that Illinois & UNC get to actually PLAY for the championship (so the best team won't be settled in the polls).

Just one interesting note....... If UNC beats Illinois, they'll be undefeated at 4-0 against Big Ten teams this year. :D

Just one interesting note....... If UNC beats Illinois, they'll be undefeated at 4-0 against Big Ten teams this year. :D



A point that Jim Nantz and Billy Packer were quick to point out in the waning minutes of North Carolina's game against Michigan State. I guess in the feeble minds of those two dopes, a UNC victory would make the Tarheels the Big 10 champs, too.

<marquee> <font color="lightblue">TAR HEELS </font>86 <font color="orange">Illini </font>76 </marquee>

This is a dream showcase of the 2 best teams...hope it goes to the wire...or beyond.

[Self-centeredness on] Is KU in the middle of this one or what? Old coaches, new coaches... [/self-centeredness off]

Is KU in the middle of this one or what? Old coaches, new coaches...



Looks to me like Bill Self left a better team behind at Illinois. Wonder if he would have been able to get the same results out of them? I know a lot of Illinois fans were p*ssed at Self for leaving..... Wonder what they're thinking now?

I'm in the local minority here in Jayhawkland, but I'm glad Roy's home. :cool:

Good luck to y'all this evening!

Is KU in the middle of this one or what? Old coaches, new coaches...



Looks to me like Bill Self left a better team behind at Illinois. Wonder if he would have been able to get the same results out of them? I know a lot of Illinois fans were p*ssed at Self for leaving..... Wonder what they're thinking now?





I still am ****** about Bill Self. Not that I didnt have faith in Weber, but Self in known as a great recruiter, Weber is unproven. I think in the long run Self knows it will be alot easier to keep making the tourney at Kansas.Its not as if they have any trouble getting in star talent.

Are you saying you prefer Self to Williams? I still think Self is superior to Roy and that Roy's departure was really a lucky move for the Jayhawks. I am starting to doubt my assessment a bit, but time will tell.

Yes, Yes boys and girls. The day most of us have wished for has come. Who is the best in the land? This is THE game. Tip in 2 hours!!! :cool:

Is KU in the middle of this one or what? Old coaches, new coaches...



Looks to me like Bill Self left a better team behind at Illinois. Wonder if he would have been able to get the same results out of them? I know a lot of Illinois fans were p*ssed at Self for leaving..... Wonder what they're thinking now?





I still am ****** about Bill Self. Not that I didnt have faith in Weber, but Self in known as a great recruiter, Weber is unproven. I think in the long run Self knows it will be alot easier to keep making the tourney at Kansas.Its not as if they have any trouble getting in star talent.

Weber shouldn't have too much trouble recruiting after this year.

Almost time for the best game of the season.

My girlfriend wins an H2 if UNC wins, and they are up big at half! Go UNC!!!

WHOOOOOOOOOOOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

noooooooooooooooooooo chase, you were wrong :D

ACC.......

Another Carolina Championship!!!!!!!

How bout that one Chase?

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 37-2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>

UNC - 75 Illinois - 70



Holy crap, that is so weird that i predicted the EXACT score, too bad i couldnt predict more of the other tourney games right.

UNC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Congrat to UNC
Illinois fans talked all that smack and Illinois got smacked.

ACC.......

Another Carolina Championship!!!!!!!

How bout that one Chase?

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 37-2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>





It sucks. What did you think Id say? I dont think anyone in the country could have stopped Sean May. Even if Augustine wouldnt have been robbed on three calls, I dont think it would have mattered. May was unreal.I was happy with the comeback, but UNC showed the heart to stay with it { Although noone in here would say they choked if Illinois won} Congrats to them for a job well done and on a great cap to the season. :(

Congrat to UNC
Illinois fans talked all that smack and Illinois got smacked.



Like you and your Arizona posts right?

Word!!!

Boom baby! I made $200! :D

TAR HEELS!!

Chase we now know which team is better, and it looks like you owe me some plastic. 3 Champion Orcs and 2 KC Aviars. I'll PM you my address.

Congratulations Roy!!!

Congrat to UNC
Illinois fans talked all that smack and Illinois got smacked.



Like you and your Arizona posts right?



I had one post unlike your whole year worth of posting.

Killin spree, lmao!!!
You just don't see it coming. Notice how all the NC fans are just sitting back not saying much! I am not a NC fan, but out of the teams left, NC is the powerhouse. You keep trying to compare Illinois to a powerhouse. Illinois has had a good year, BFD! NC does that on a regular basis!!! And plays in a twice as hard conference. Get over it, youll still have a good year with TWO losses on that record!



Chase, chase, I warned ya about this one. But I am not going to rub it in. But maybe next year you Big Ten people will realize the strength of the ACC. I hate it too, but they are the best conference. But still Illinois had a GREAT year!
Congrads to Roy, and his boys and all UNC fans. What a great team, what a great game!

they might have shut down salim, but they won't be able to shut down UNC's best player (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11871)

i can't believe he missed a shot...

they might have shut down salim, but they won't be able to shut down UNC's best player (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=11871)

i can't believe he missed a shot...



hey, he had an off night

**** I guess I have to get in line to pile on Chase! lol :D

TAKE A NUMBER PLEASE! I'm number 93 hollar at me when its my turn ;)

j/k :p

<marquee> TAR<font color="lightblue">HEELS</font> NATIONAL CHAMPS! F-YOU DOOK! :D</marquee>

Is it my turn yet?

Unfortunately the NBA watch is now on in Chapel Hill as we wait to see how many of this year's underclassmen decide to leave college early and turn pro. If everybody returns next year, the Tarheels should once again have a great team, but the reality of the situation is that's probably not the case. Rashad McCants is most likely gone and will announce his decision soon. May & Felton's play have made them potential first round picks..... plus a lot of the "experts" have freshman Marvin Williams as one of the top picks based on his potential. Add in the 3 graduating seniors and it's possible that UNC will have to replace 7 players from this year's team........ We better enjoy this one for a while :eek:

Time to head to Chapel Hill and buy some new shirts!!!!

Don't worry too much Robbie. They'll just reload.

Mad Town (i think it was you) - you owe me $10,000. I will take a check. PM me for my address.

Are you high? The bet was with Madtown, but it was for $1000. He bet you that Illinois would make it to the Final Four. In that case, shouldn't you have already sent a check to Madison?

Mad Town (i think it was you) - you owe me $10,000. I will take a check. PM me for my address.



Good luck with that...MILLZ YOU STILL OWE ME $10,000 from our discussion board bet

Is it my turn yet?



Yeah, its your turn. Talk [*****] to me. That way the beating will be justified. I am serious. Go ahead. You have no bio, but Ill find out who you are and then Ill wait , possibly years, to find you.I never forget. Ive been saving a punch up for seven years for somebody. What you and this retard Topdog dont realize is that there are plenty of people Ive bantered with in here over the season, and thier shittalking is fine with me.People like you who wandered in here from your crappy discgolf.com forum or started posting a week ago havent earned the right to do it.
P.S.---Im not a internet toughguy.Ill [*****] you up in reality.

Unfortunately the NBA watch is now on in Chapel Hill as we wait to see how many of this year's underclassmen decide to leave college early and turn pro. If everybody returns next year, the Tarheels should once again have a great team, but the reality of the situation is that's probably not the case. Rashad McCants is most likely gone and will announce his decision soon. May & Felton's play have made them potential first round picks..... plus a lot of the "experts" have freshman Marvin Williams as one of the top picks based on his potential. Add in the 3 graduating seniors and it's possible that UNC will have to replace 7 players from this year's team........ We better enjoy this one for a while :eek:

Time to head to Chapel Hill and buy some new shirts!!!!




McCants and Felton arent 1st rounders. May is a lock, after that tournament, and Williams was a 1st rounder last year, so Id think his stock only rose.Hes the most talented player on that team. Mays better now, but if hes even a Elton Brand in the NBA Id be suprised.Either way hes a national champion.

Are you saying you prefer Self to Williams? I still think Self is superior to Roy and that Roy's departure was really a lucky move for the Jayhawks. I am starting to doubt my assessment a bit, but time will tell.


I'm a Roy fan for life! He ran a clean program with a great family atmosphere...and developed one of the top NCAA Division I teams in his tenure. These are kids away from home, away from family... They are not "Open" players...they're JV...they're amateurs/young'uns...(basically :p).

Perhaps Bill Self will be superior and I'm certainly hoping so...cuz 4 Final 4s in Roy's 14 seasons made for one helluva ride. Good for him to finally get over the hump!

Looks like Self is bringing in some awesome/unselfish all-around players... He's got Danny Manning to help build it... Sounds like he likes the AD and the community... KU's future looks mighty bright! Couple that with the fact that Bill Self is exactly one day older than me, and we've got a winner! http://www.madisc.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif

Chase...at halftime with Carolina up 13 I bet my girlfriend a buck that Illinois would come back and win. That lead was too big IMO...could have made NC a bit too overconfident... Illi dammn near did it...!!! What a great game, what a great run Illi had going, what a tremendous season to build upon...

With the exception of '88 /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif, this was THE best NCAA tourney...tons of GREAT games with the 2 best teams meeting each other in the end for the Final Showdown!

McCants and Felton arent 1st rounders. May is a lock, after that tournament, and Williams was a 1st rounder last year, so Id think his stock only rose.Hes the most talented player on that team. Mays better now, but if hes even a Elton Brand in the NBA Id be suprised.Either way hes a national champion.



I heard Roy say in an interview this morning that McCants has already decided he's going pro...... Now for Felton & May.... I think Felton's game is perfect for the NBA. Who wouldn't want somebody like that bringing the ball up the court so quickly for their team? And now that he's developed an outside shot, I see him becoming a very good NBA point guard. I agree with you on May though and it'll be interesting to see how he does in the pros..... He's one of those great college players whose size may make the transition to the pros difficult..... since he's soo small for the center position and not quick enough to go against a lot of the forwards in the NBA.

Either way, I'm sure Roy will help them evaluate their options and see where they would end up in the draft. If they're potential lottery picks, it would be hard to turn down the big cash.

Let me just start by saying last nights game was every bit the hype. Congrats to NC on their title. I also bet that none of you Illini haters even thought Illinois would make it a battle. I just would like to say congrats also to the Illini on a tremendous season that i will not soon forget We all got the show we wanted in Illinois vs. NC, and what a show it was. College basketball is something magical. The effort, determination, and passion with which all the players play. The pure excitement of the tourney itself. All for the title. Not for millions(no doubt many are auditioning though), not for a salary bonus, for the love of the game. I wish next season started tommorow!

**** I guess I have to get in line to pile on Chase! lol :D

TAKE A NUMBER PLEASE! I'm number 93 hollar at me when its my turn ;)

j/k :p

<marquee> TAR<font color="lightblue">HEELS</font> NATIONAL CHAMPS! F-YOU DOOK! :D</marquee>




Go ahead. If youve got something to say, say it. As I said earlier, I can take it. I will only respect it from the people that have been going at it with me all year though. Except from MTL. He hasnt been much of a poster on here, and is probably bandwagoning but, I like him.

Whats funny is the fact that because I have supported my team, people come out of the woodwork to bash me for it. As if the Fighting Illini make it to the Final 4 or let alone the National Championship enough that someone shouldnt be estatic when they do. For the most part it doesnt matter to me what most of you say, as this is a disc golf website, and when It comes to DG theres maybe 4 players posting on here that can beat me.Maybe 5....So, when you see me at tourneys make sure to tell people that I was the guy that backed Illinois against anyone, and posted like mad about it, not really giving 2 [*****] what any of you thought about it. Its not like that matters to me. If the same thing happens next year expect the same posts.

Yes, I still think the ACC is overrated. All UNC did was prove they were the strongest team from that division. They also proved the right to be National Champs by beating Illinois.I think I proved my point that the Big 10 was underrated. I mean, if UNC would have maintained a 15 point lead throughout the second half and won I would say they had the most dominate team, as it happened they didnt. They won the game, in my opinion, because shots didnt fall at the end { actually for most the game} when they had to and UNC played a tenatious defense in the final 25 seconds, with Felton making a huge steal to seal it. It sucks, but I respect the team that won the game. All that matters is they did what they could.They just came up a little short.

McCants and Felton arent 1st rounders. May is a lock, after that tournament, and Williams was a 1st rounder last year, so Id think his stock only rose.Hes the most talented player on that team. Mays better now, but if hes even a Elton Brand in the NBA Id be suprised.Either way hes a national champion.



I heard Roy say in an interview this morning that McCants has already decided he's going pro...... Now for Felton & May.... I think Felton's game is perfect for the NBA. Who wouldn't want somebody like that bringing the ball up the court so quickly for their team? And now that he's developed an outside shot, I see him becoming a very good NBA point guard. I agree with you on May though and it'll be interesting to see how he does in the pros..... He's one of those great college players whose size may make the transition to the pros difficult..... since he's soo small for the center position and not quick enough to go against a lot of the forwards in the NBA.

Either way, I'm sure Roy will help them evaluate their options and see where they would end up in the draft. If they're potential lottery picks, it would be hard to turn down the big cash.





No doubt Felton will be in the NBA. Hes one of the best point guards in college. Every bit as good as Paul. I dont think hell go in the 1st round, but hes going to be around for a long time.As for May, its not like the Elton Brand thing was a insult. He has more size than Brand, but could ballon up to Olive Miller status if he doesnt watch himself. Id love to sit here and bash Carolina, but there isnt much to bash. I really { and if you do post history youll see} didnt dislike Carolina untill all the media hype set in and Mark Southard started rewriting my posts to make me look stoopid. Well done ,[*****]! I always liked them to go to the NC, but hoped Illinois would win.I was wrong.Not like its the first time, nor will it be the last. Great season for both, better finish for Carolina.

TAR HEELS!!

Chase we now know which team is better, and it looks like you owe me some plastic. 3 Champion Orcs and 2 KC Aviars. I'll PM you my address.




Actually, in the last PM you sent, you said 3 Ch. discs and 2 KCs. You never said what discs, I was the one that said I was only interested in Orcs and aviars. If thats what you want thats what Ill send, but you were never specific in the PMs.

Are you high? The bet was with Madtown, but it was for $1000. He bet you that Illinois would make it to the Final Four. In that case, shouldn't you have already sent a check to Madison?



No, im not high. Im FlyinHigh. I believe the bet was $10,000, but even if its $1,000, i will most certainly take that. And no, the bet wasnt for Illinois to make the Final Four. The bet was (i wish the thread were still alive) " I will bet you $10,000 ($1,000) that Illinois will WIN IT ALL!!!" and i took the bet. MadTown, i would like my check in the next couple days, please. Thanks.

**** I guess I have to get in line to pile on Chase! lol :D

TAKE A NUMBER PLEASE! I'm number 93 hollar at me when its my turn ;)

j/k :p

<marquee> TAR<font color="lightblue">HEELS</font> NATIONAL CHAMPS! F-YOU DOOK! :D</marquee>




Go ahead. If youve got something to say, say it. As I said earlier, I can take it. I will only respect it from the people that have been going at it with me all year though. Except from MTL. He hasnt been much of a poster on here, and is probably bandwagoning but, I like him.

Whats funny is the fact that because I have supported my team, people come out of the woodwork to bash me for it. As if the Fighting Illini make it to the Final 4 or let alone the National Championship enough that someone shouldnt be estatic when they do. For the most part it doesnt matter to me what most of you say, as this is a disc golf website, and when It comes to DG theres maybe 4 players posting on here that can beat me.Maybe 5....So, when you see me at tourneys make sure to tell people that I was the guy that backed Illinois against anyone, and posted like mad about it, not really giving 2 what any of you thought about it. Its not like that matters to me. If the same thing happens next year expect the same posts.

Yes, I still think the ACC is overrated. All UNC did was prove they were the strongest team from that division. They also proved the right to be National Champs by beating Illinois.I think I proved my point that the Big 10 was underrated. I mean, if UNC would have maintained a 15 point lead throughout the second half and won I would say they had the most dominate team, as it happened they didnt. They won the game, in my opinion, because shots didnt fall at the end { actually for most the game} when they had to and UNC played a tenatious defense in the final 25 seconds, with Felton making a huge steal to seal it. It sucks, but I respect the team that won the game. All that matters is they did what they could.They just came up a little short.



CHASE the ILLINI were good! **** good season, probably the best team Illinois has EVER had. I'm glad you came in and took it. I've been in your shoes before except it was much worse. Something like
[b]<font color="brown">RUBBERS 55 </font>
<font color="red">SOONERS 19 </font>

Oh, Ive been there before also. But, theres always next year. If Williams stays then I think they go wire to wire at No.1. Without { the more likely} they can have a run at it again, as Brown and Augustine will be back. Hopefully. Im sure of Augustine, and hopefully he can do something next year to redeem himself for the worst night Ive ever seen from him. How bout' that Jack Ingram though McCoy? He showed up!

I really {and if you do post history you'll see} didn't dislike Carolina until all the media hype set in and Mark Southard started rewriting my posts to make me look stupid. Well done, [*****]!

I wasn't intending to make you look stupid. You made a number of comments that I simply argued against. I apologize if you took personal offense. I was just smack talking a little bit.

Accepted, congrats, and enjoy the plastic. I hope it flies terrible....but I picked it so I know it wont.

Accepted, congrats, and enjoy the plastic. I hope it flies terrible....but I picked it so I know it wont.

Nice... You obviously haven't ever seen me play. I plan on beating the crap out of those discs.

Oh, Ive been there before also. But, theres always next year. If Williams stays then I think they go wire to wire at No.1. Without { the more likely} they can have a run at it again, as Brown and Augustine will be back. Hopefully. Im sure of Augustine, and hopefully he can do something next year to redeem himself for the worst night Ive ever seen from him. How bout' that Jack Ingram though McCoy? He showed up!



Why the hell would Williams stay in college? He's probably a lottery pick, definatly first rounder. If Jack Ingram would have stayed at the University of Tulsa I think they would have been better than 9-20. Did you know that wasn't Ingram's first Championship game? He was on TU's team when they won the 2001 NIT CHAMPIONSHIP, he only got 2pts then...Just 5 years ago TU was in the Elite 8, 4 points from the Final Four. Boy how times have changed from the Bill Self days. TU has a Mighican St assistant coach Doug Wojcik now, So I have a feeling that TU will be back soon. :D

The NIT final is not a championship game. :p

Its a Championship for the Not Invited Tournament ;)

It used to be the National Championship game ;)

As I remember it right you never took the bet. You said "Whoa better call 1-800-BETS-OFF". Good luck next year Iowa BOY! :eek:

I did take the bet. I didnt expect you to pay up anyways.

As I was shopping for my UNC NCAA Champion shirts in Chapel Hill, I saw one of the funniest shirts I've seen in quite a while......... It said..... "Reduce carbs...... flush a Dukey.... it's Atkins friendly"

As I was shopping for my UNC NCAA Champion shirts in Chapel Hill, I saw one of the funniest shirts I've seen in quite a while......... It said..... "Reduce carbs...... flush a Dukey.... it's Atkins friendly"


LMAO!!

I didn't write this...... but I wish I did :D

WHY WE HATE DUKE - A Comprehensive Analysis

Mike Krzyzewski and his players don�t understand the antipathy. They
know it�s out there, but they truly don�t know why. Fans of all schools
love to hate Duke, with growing enthusiasm it seems, and the trend is
baffling the great coach to no end.


Truly, it is difficult to accept that a group of purportedly intelligent
persons could at once be so repugnant yet oblivious to the intentional
impudence that makes them so. However, I suppose it is possible to be
so steeped in conceit and self-righteousness as to become blind to one�s
own flaws.


At any rate, as a lifelong basketball fan, and as a graduate of both the
University of North Carolina and the Duke University School of Law, I
feel infinitely qualified to allay the consternation. Although many
writers, in piecemeal fashion, occasionally opine as to isolated reasons
behind the ABD (�anybody but Duke�) movement, I am aware of no
comprehensive piece that fully enumerates the multitude of interrelated
reasons why this basketball program is loathed so intensely by so many.
I will attempt to do so herein.


I. The Duke Persona.


First is the persona shared by the coach, his team, and the supporting
student body. A rarely seen blend of obscene arrogance and shameless
hypocrisy is the cornerstone of Duke basketball. Whether it is
Christian Laettner wagging his tongue after a lay-up, Brian Davis
tauntingly skipping across the floor after a break away dunk, or Chris
Duhon matter-of-factly stating that all other ACC teams simply compete
for second place in the annual conference tournament, (ironically said
before Maryland defeated Duke for last year�s title), the rank conceit
and condescension are insufferable.


As for the equally unrelenting hypocrisy, examples abound year after
year. In every close game, for instance, Coach K spews profanities at
game officials for the extremely rare call against his team, while, at
the same time, starring in a television commercial promoting the
importance of good sportsmanship. Admittedly, his boorish behavior
gets results, as every ACC official seems to react to each outburst by
calling an offensive foul against the opposition at the next possible
opportunity. Nevertheless, Krzyzewski, unabashed and blind to his
hypocrisy, stated during last year�s ACC tournament that nothing is
gained from working the officials, and it is therefore something that he
does not do.


The language this coach spouts is truly appalling, even by competitive
sports standards, yet the media anointed him to sainthood status long
ago. Gary Williams shouts game profanities with similar regularity and
is understandably criticized by the media for doing so. Bobby Knight is
similarly blasted for his well-publicized misconduct. And yet Coach K *
a Knight disciple by the way * is not only given a free pass but
worshiped as the great gentleman * �an officer and a gentleman� as one
commentator said during a game break last year. Somehow the media
equates the man with class, when, in reality, he is two letters removed
from the word.


Duke students and fans similarly experience difficulty with consistency.
As all basketball fans know, the student body is legendary for its
efforts to humiliate opposing players. They, for example, threw snack
cakes at Dennis Scott because he once had a weight problem; they dressed
as Frankenstein in an Eric Montross replica jersey; they named an �All
Acne Team� of opposing players and further named Mike O�Koren the Oxy 10
poster boy; record albums were thrown at an N.C. State player accused of
stealing a stereo; Maryland forward Herman Veal was showered with
condoms and women�s panties after being accused of sexual misconduct, (a
charge of which he was exonerated); Steve Francis received a serenade of
�SAT� because of academic struggles. The list goes on and on. All of
these stunts, mind you, were performed on regional, often national,
television * the better to publicize the �creative genius� of the Duke
student body.


In the face of this churlish history, J.J. Redick, last season,
complained of opposing fans� insensitivity towards Duke players. �Just
from this year,� he whined, �there have been so many incidents from
other team�s fans, saying rude and crude remarks to us.� Which is the
more amazing: that Redick would be surprised/troubled by opposing fans�
comments or that he would show the temerity to complain of the perceived
unfairness publicly?


Only a few years earlier, during Matt Doherty�s first year as UNC head
coach, Doherty concluded a closed team huddle, in a raucous environment
where his team struggled to hear his words, with the statement, �Duke
still has the ugliest cheerleaders in the ACC.� Somehow word of this
statement reached the media, whereupon the Duke students and alumni
immediately exploded in outrage. How, they asked, could a coach utter
such a callous remark? Surely such insensitivity could not be
tolerated, they said.


Unbelievable, but true. Somehow, in the Duke mindset, a half-century of
mocking the physical appearances of individual, teen-aged players, on
national television is good-natured fun, while a coach�s private comment
to his own players about a group of cheerleaders is grounds for
persecution. Bringing its hypocrisy full-circle, only weeks ago, the
Duke student body, in its Maryland pre-game �cheer card,� (yes, they
actually print and circulate such a thing), encouraged the student body
to continue to spout cheers and jeers about how ugly they believe Steve
Blake to have been.


Beyond the hypocrisy, it is difficult to select the word that best
describes the Duke students who attend the school�s home games.
Haughty, impudent, smug, egg-headed nerds * all capture elements, but
none come close to painting the full descriptive picture. The
Washington Post, roughly twenty years ago, coined a useful but dated
phrase in labeling the students, �Yuppie Brats.� Still, a full
understanding of their detestable nature can be gathered only through
experience, not description.


And yet the sports media, for reasons that baffle, glorify this same
group. Led by Dick Vitale, who affectionately refers to the student
section of Cameron Indoor Stadium as the �Cameron Crazies,� sports
telecasters and analysts regularly imply, and often directly state, that
the Duke student body is what�s �great� about college basketball. These
same commentators credit the students for their creative and clever game
rituals, and they seemingly cannot say enough times what a �classy�
program Duke is.


It�s an insane commentary on students who, as opposing players are
introduced, chant such creative phrases as, �Antawn sucks.� Another
Duke trademark is the united chant of �[*****]� in response to any
unfavorable official�s call. Before losing to UNC in 1989, the student
body, referring to Carolina�s star center J.R. Reid, raised a sign that
read, �J.R. Can�t Reid This.� The same statement was chanted, even
though Reid was actually a quite intelligent and scholastically
accomplished student athlete.



This is the stuff of class?


Now back to the hypocrisy factor. Dean Smith was badly troubled by the
latter incident, which he understandably construed as a racial slur.
Because Coach Smith had also recruited two of Duke�s big men, Christian
Laettner and Danny Ferry, he coincidentally knew what these players
scored on the SAT. In a press conference, he rebutted the crowd�s
baseless innuendo by explaining that J.R. Reid and frontcourt mate Scott
Williams accomplished a higher combined SAT score than did Laettner and
Ferry, both white. Smith took pains to avoid disclosing any specific
scores, nor did he provide any individual comparisons. In response,
the same group that slanderously labeled Reid illiterate berated Smith
for his audacity in disclosing the completely true, but purportedly
�private,� information of its players.


Still unconvinced? Consider the case of J.R. Reid�s frontcourt running
mate, Scott Williams. By all accounts, a great person, Williams
suffered the worst imaginable tragedy when he lost both his parents in a
murder-suicide shooting. Several of the good-natured, creative Dukies
responded at the next Duke-UNC game with clever shouts of �Orphan,
Orphan!� as Williams was introduced.


Enough said.


II. Coach K.


Why else is Duke despised? No essay on the subject is complete without
extensive discussion of the coach. The man who models the haughty
demeanor that his players so perfectly emulate is an egotist to no end.
This past summer�s experience is a prime example. Krzyzewski was
approached by the Los Angeles Lakers and offered a coaching position.
Admittedly, the story is worthy of news in the sports world, but what
followed was truly absurd. Coach K issued media statements on a daily
basis to advise of his intent to continue with his deliberations. Local
newscasts actually led with the story throughout the week long affair.
At a time when American soldiers were dying daily and a presidential
election was but weeks away, news outlets actually led one to believe
that the latest in a series of K�s disingenuous flirtations with the NBA
was front page news. Of course, in the end, Krzyzewski did what he has
always done: chose to remain at his cherished college post, fully aware
that he, like the overwhelming majority of his players, would enjoy zero
success at the next level.


The man�s ego is such that it prevents him from ever accepting
criticism. Take the 1994-95 season as an example. That was the year
that Duke suffered an ignominious record of 13-18. Knowing when to
fold them, K sat out the majority of the season, citing an ailing back
(or hip or some body part), and delegated head coaching duties to
assistant coach Pete Gaudet. Any standup guy would have accepted
responsibility for the season that unfolded with his players, at his
school, following his game plans. Classy Coach K, however, insisted
that the season�s win-loss record be stricken from his career totals.


And if you think this was an isolated incident, think again. The man is
a champion buck passer. When I attended the school during the 1989-92
time period, Duke squeaked by in a couple of regular season games, after
which there was some question about the team�s leadership and direction.
Always looking for a fall guy, Coach K, in a post-game press conference,
actually turned on his own student body, who, he barked, had grown
complacent in its support. �I think we need to understand what the hell
is going on here at Duke University,� was one of the quotes. This he
said of the same students who camp out for weeks for the chance to
support this team with their boorish displays.


This has proven to be a recurring Krzyzewski excuse, one that he
resorted to even this year as his students remained as boisterous and
obnoxious as ever in their game time antics. No doubt, there is plenty
for which to criticize these students, but support of the team is not
one. K�s tendency to turn on his fellow vermin is a testament to his
amazingly self-centered, one-dimensional mindset.


And let us not forget the man�s tendency to fault game officials for
unfair calls * the same officials who regularly enable his team to make
more free throws in a season than their opponents are allowed to attempt
* more on that later.


III. Media Bias.


The general public�s unawareness of the foregoing is perpetuated by the
sports media�s irrational love for anything associated with Duke
basketball. For reasons unimaginable, sportscasters, commentators, and
writers constantly turn blind eyes to the plethora of reasons to despise
the place, all while perpetuating the myths that Coach K and his Cameron
Crazies are embodiments of class. Indeed, the media has become so
jaded in its bias that it has taken to viewing Duke players as the
victims of unfair and undeserved hostility.


A perfect example was aired by ESPN immediately after Duke�s second loss
to Maryland this season. The network devoted a lengthy segment to the
subject of how low opposing fans will go to get inside poor JJ Redick�s
head. The segment started by showing JJ shooting alone in a quite and
dark gym that he considers his quite and comfortable home, the absurd
implication being that Duke offers a calm and reverent venue. Next,
game clips of rival fans, mostly from Maryland, are shown shouting at
Redick. From there, JJ himself, in a sickeningly sanctimonious tone of
voice, bemoans the startling comments that he has heard from opposing
school�s students and fans. Midway through the piece, Chris Collins, of
all people, offers his opinions as to what is and is not acceptable from
a sportsmanship standpoint. The segment ends with JJ reading poetry and
scripture, which he explains help him through his tribulations. All of
this, mind you, from a player whose supporting student body annually
raises the bar for the most despicable courtside conduct in the country.
The entire segment was preposterous, yet, at no point, did ESPN even
hint at the possible irony.


Well, JJ, to your inspirational book of poetry, please allow me to
contribute the following gems of wisdom, which hopefully will further
assist you in enduring your life�s toils:


People who live in glass houses, should not throw stones.


You reap what you sow.


What goes around comes around.


As with its misguided adulation of the Duke student body and players,
the media for some odd reason goes to absurd extremes to worship
Krzyzewski as the ultimate role model. A classic case in point came in
the 2001 season. Duke, in a home game against Georgia Tech, runs its
lead to 44 points with under a minute to play, due largely to three
point shooting that continued long after the game had passed the point
of gratuitous humiliation. Finally, as the clock went under thirty
seconds, Duke graciously holds the ball for its final possession in lieu
of a final field goal attempt. Mike Patrick, in his annoyingly dogmatic
tone of voice, shouts, �Doesn�t that just show what a classy guy Mike
Krzyzewski is? He doesn�t want to embarrass anybody.� It was as if the
difference between a 44 and 46 point nationally televised drubbing was
somehow a magnanimous show of sportsmanship.


The extent to which the media has become blind in its love for this
program is astounding. Remember a few seasons ago when Duke came back
from ten points down to Maryland in the final minute of play? A great
comeback, no doubt, but Mike Patrick once again lost all grips on
reality by emphatically stating how it was the most amazing thing he had
ever seen. Apparently, Mike missed it when Carolina came back from
eight points down in seventeen seconds, with no three-point shot
available * against Duke, by the way.


To this day, we are still afflicted with video clips of Christian
Laettner�s buzzer beating shot against Kentucky in the 1992 regional
finals. Undoubtedly, it will remain firmly etched in the middle of
CBS�s road to the final four for perpetuity. And why? A dramatic shot?
Sure. But how many more spectacular * and far more significant *
tournament shots have there been? How about a freshman named Jordan
hitting the game winner in the 1982 National Championship game? N.C.
State�s Lorenzo Charles dunking home the championship winner the very
next year in one of the great Cinderella stories? Laettner�s shot was
good, but please, for the love of Pete, spare us further viewing of this
well-worn piece of film.


IV. Bias of Game Officials.


The media bias, while annoying to be sure, pales in comparison, and
significance, to that of the game�s officials. By now, most have heard
how Duke�s basketball team has experienced seasons where its players
convert more free throws than their opponents attempt. Admittedly, this
fact, standing alone, is not necessarily cause for criticism, as smaller
and lesser talented teams are more likely to foul their bigger, quicker,
more talented adversaries. In Duke�s case, however, the actual numbers,
when viewed in appropriate context, are staggering. In 2000-01, the
last championship season, Duke actually attempted 1,002 free throws,
compared to its opponents� 701 attempts. Think about that statistic
for a moment * over one thousand free throws. During that season, Duke
players were assessed with 659 fouls; the opposition, 848. The year
before, Duke converted on 618 free throws, 81 more than its opponents
attempted.


Certainly, the foregoing statistics are absurd in themselves, but the
issue becomes truly inexplicable when one considers the team�s
traditionally aggressive approach to the game. Krzyzewski, remember,
shuns the zone defense, insisting instead that his players confront even
superior athletes with his signature, hard-nosed man-to-man. By its
nature, man-to-man is a more physical defensive style, one that usually
generates a higher foul count than the more passive zone alternatives,
but somehow not for Duke. Instead, Duke players routinely waltz to the
charity stripe at twice the rate of their opponents, all while hacking,
slapping, and hand-checking opponents up and down the court.


Remember too that Duke regularly leads the conference in steals and
blocked shots * other tell-tale signs of aggressive play * and still
enjoys prodigious advantages in foul tallies. Going back to the title
year, for example, Duke had 411 steals compared to its opponents� 282;
Duke blocked 196 shots, its opponents, 117. Inside players, meanwhile,
feast off of a constant barrage of moving picks and not-so subtle
pushes. Danny Ferry, for example, was allowed to shove his way to
better collegiate rebound stats than any number of superior inside
players who have subsequently, in pro ball, easily exposed his dearth of
true skills.


During the mid-1980�s, an ACC coach anonymously explained Duke�s
defensive philosophy as follows: all five defensive players foul all
five opposing offensive players at the same time, leaving officials too
confused and stunned to respond. Since then, Duke�s impunity has
evolved to the point where the game�s rules simply do not apply to the
school. Referees absolutely refuse to blow the whistle when Daniel
Ewing and Redick push off defenders with their left hands; Duke guards
are never penalized for extending their arms laterally to obstruct
opposing players� movements; moving interior screens are simply
expected; Shelden Williams swings his elbows into opposing player�s
faces throughout games in which he collects a total of 3 personal fouls,
(none as a result of his headhunting); Coach K screams himself hoarse
with profanity with never a technical called. And who could forget this
year�s first UNC-Duke game where K presumptuously ambled onto the court,
in the middle of play, to talk strategy with Redick. As Billy Packer
himself noted, it was undisputable grounds for a technical foul, but the
refs never thought of blowing the whistle.


The foul disparities become more baffling still, when one considers
Duke�s prevailing offensive approach. In recent years, Duke has
emphasized the three point shot. For roughly the past five seasons, the
offensive philosophy reminds one of the 1980s Loyola-Maramount squads as
Duke players repeatedly jack up one long-range shot after another.
Usually, such a team approach produces low foul counts for the
opposition, as outside shooters are rarely fouled. Nevertheless, Duke�s
free throw advantage continues unabated, even as JJ Redick runs and guns
in a fashion that would make Rick Pitino proud.


Virtually every Duke game is a perfect example of the favoritism the
players receive, but this year�s classic case study has to be the first
of the Duke -- Virginia Tech games. Played at Duke, the game began with
Shelden Williams driving his elbow at freshman center Deron Washington�s
head, causing him to hit the deck. No foul was called, Williams scored
an uncontested first two points of the game, and the tone was set.
Throughout the game, Williams pushed, elbowed, and bullied his way
through VT�s younger frontcourt players, with officials doing nothing.
In the same game, however, the officials whistled an astounding
thirty-four team fouls on Virginia Tech, many of which would have gone
uncalled in a church league game. An amazing twenty-two fouls -- nearly
enough to foul out four players -- were called in the first half alone.
Not surprisingly, Duke won the game by 35 points, 30 of which were
scored from the foul line. In an interesting contrast, when the same
two teams met only weeks later in Blacksburg, the team foul tallies were
essentially even. The result? A Virginia Tech win, (after which JJ
Redick�s father complained publicly about the student body�s poor
sportsmanship.)


To make matters worse, during the first game, the Duke students began
chanting, �Please stop fouling,� as if Tech was attempting to have its
entire team disqualified. As the son of a V.M.I. graduate, I have no
love for Virginia Tech, but could there be a greater example of the
absurd lengths to which officials go with their favoritism?


A. The Duke Flop.


A principal reason for the disparity in foul totals is the outrageous
manner in which game officials apply the ever-subjective offensive foul
rule. You know the scenario: An opposing player blows by a slower Duke
defender while being closely guarded thirty feet from the basket. As
the player races to the hoop for a lay-up, another Duke player jumps
into his path, often while the offensive player is in the air,
deliberately causing a dangerous collision near the basket. The late
arriving defender falls over backwards, arms flailing, with a
melodramatic shriek. As sure as the sun sets in the West, one of the
three game referees will run to the scene, often from far out of
position, hand clasped behind his head, whistle sounding loudly, all
with Krzyzewski�s pumping fist signaling his approval in the background.
Of course, when the opposition attempts to return the favor, the call is
just as surely a block or, at best, a no call.


While many times the Duke player accomplishes his goal of creating a
violent collision, any given game brings several additional defensive
�plays� in which a Duke defender drops to the floor when his opponent so
much as breathes on him. The Duke team is so thoroughly trained to
resort to this regularly rewarded tactic that it is common so see them
fall anywhere on the court * near the basket, at mid-court, in the
backcourt, sometimes while the offensive player is simply dribbling
laterally, making no effort to move towards the basket. During the
closing seconds of its last loss to Maryland, for instance, a Duke
defender actually flopped beneath Maryland�s defensive goal on an
inbounds play. It seems only a matter of time before a Duke player is
awarded a charge call for taking a seat at the scorer�s table. Any time
is a good time for a Duke defender to dive under the feet of an
offensive player in an effort to manufacture offensive fouls.


This patented �Duke flop� is without doubt the most maddening innovation
of the Coach K era, (with his players� tendency to slap the floor at
midcourt in a purported show of defensive solidarity running a close
second). Over the course of an average game, the Duke opponent sees
five to six baskets, or ten to twelve points (fifteen to eighteen if we
count the three-point play that should have resulted), erased by this
grossly one-sided call. Duke, meanwhile, receives an additional five to
six free throws as opponents are regularly whistled for blocks. Year
after year, legendary athletes, from Jordan to Bias to Duncan to Carter,
are unfairly handicapped by the spectrum of inferior Duke players
jumping into their paths and flopping backwards, even if contact is
avoided. Indeed, it is not unusual for slow-motion replays to show Duke
defenders beginning their staged falls, before, occasionally in the
total absence of, actual contact.


Much to the chagrin of flop-leader Shane Battier, it was because of this
infuriating nonsense that the NBA actually amended its rules to prohibit
offensive fouls from being called as the result of charges within five
feet of the basket. And for great reason: games should not turn on the
basis of inferior athletes deliberately diving into an opposing player�s
path in order to manufacture an offensive foul call. This is not
basketball. It breaks the flow of any game, angers fans, and endangers
athletes. In a broader sense, it perverts the game by shaving points
from opposing teams� scores while simultaneously saddling their players
with fouls that should never be charged.


B. Bastardizing Game Effects of Pro-Duke Officiating.


Think the officials� bias is inconsequential or overstated? Think
again. While the numbers themselves tell the story, decades of history
provide extensive anecdotal evidence of the college ref�s embellishing
impact. How many of the all time Duke basketball greats promptly
proceeded to fizzle at the next level where game rules are actually
enforced in an unbiased manner and where defenders must actually defend
their opponents? Mark Alarie, Johnny Dawkins, David Henderson, Billy
King, Robert Brickey, Phil Henderson, Kevin Strickland, Danny Ferry,
Alaa Abdelnaby, Brian Davis, Antonio Lang, Cherokee Parks, William
Avery, Shane Battier, Dahntay Jones, Chris Carawell, Mike Dunleavy --
the list is seemingly endless. Past Duke rosters read like a �Who�s
Who?� of professional basketball jokes, most of whom are quickly shipped
out to European leagues because of their inability to make it in the
NBA. With the sole exceptions of Grant Hill (on those rare seasons when
he does not * like his college mentor -- sit out entire seasons for
injuries), Elton Brand, and Carlos Boozer, it would be fair to say that
every Coach K era Duke basketball star has, at the pro level, either
completely failed or substantially under performed vis-�-vis his college
record, with Danny Ferry perhaps best symbolizing the stuff of the Duke
basketball reality check.


Even all-time media darling Christian Laettner has unwittingly exposed
the extent to which his collegiate success depended upon Coach K�s
striped worshipers. Laettner�s career NBA numbers (12.7 points, 6.7
rebounds per game) are reasonably respectable, even if accumulated while
being traded more frequently than Krzyzewski�s hair dye schedule.
However, his career, which includes but a single All-Star game, falls
far short of the greatness that hoops analysts projected on the basis of
his golden boy college years. And does anyone seriously believe that
the trend of pro duds will end with JJ Redick and Randolph Shavlick?


Compare the post-collegiate accomplishments of the following UNC grads
from the same time period: Michael Jordan, James Worthy, Sam Perkins,
Brad Daugherty, Kenny Smith, Jerry Stackhouse, Rasheed Wallace, Antawn
Jameson, Vince Carter. The group has collected enough NBA rings,
All-Star appearances, and MVP awards to fill the Dean Dome.
Nevertheless, each of these players, with the possible exception of
Worthy, who went pro before Krzyzewski was given his sainthood status,
struggled against the one-sided neutralizing effect of the collegiate
officials.


Other absurd examples of the Duke flop�s bastardizing effect on the game
abound. When I attended Duke, for example, the student body rejoiced as
Christian Laettner actually got the better of a vaunted LSU center named
Shaquille O�Neal. Two seasons earlier, Christian finished with better
numbers than Alonzo Mourning. These unfathomable outcomes were all due
to the inane manner with which the college official favors Duke above
any other team.


The mystery to all of this is why college refs would show such
transparent favoritism to a program of haughty whiners. Remember Phil
Henderson�s publicized mid-season tirade about Lenny Wirtz? How about
Krzyzewski�s tendency to hold mid-court tantrums, replete with
profanity, any time his team falls behind in a game? Just last season,
the man experienced a seemingly endless meltdown, which would have made
any spoiled three year-old envious, as his team lost at home to Georgia
Tech. Who could forget K�s classless screaming to refs �you killed us�
after his team�s 2004 semifinal loss to UConn. Or Matt Christiansen
physically accosting a referee in the aftermath of an earlier Duke
tournament loss, only to be recognized weeks later by Coach K as the
player who most exemplifies Duke basketball. And still the refs treat
these spoiled louts as if they were their own fair-haired children.


At any rate, it is because of the Duke players� inability to adjust to
the shock of objectively enforced rules that so many fail in the NBA,
and in Europe (e.g., Casey Saunders� cut by a Swedish team), and quickly
return * where else * to Duke to rejoin Coach K as an assistant coach.
Any given year brings us a team of real world flops who take on the role
of assistant coach. Currently, two of Duke�s more obnoxious alumni *
Chris Collins and Steve Wojokowski * join Johnny Dawkins in this
capacity. Others, such as Tommy Amaker, Quinn Snyder, David Henderson,
have found homes as equally underachieving college head coaches.


V. The Fans.


No essay on the subject can be complete without discussion of the
mindless Duke fan base that has emerged over the past decade or so. As
distinguished from the obnoxious student body that at least has a reason
to support the team, these are the fair-weather fans who simply root for
whichever team enjoys a winning tradition at a given point in time.
They are the folks we see in four-wheel drives donning Blue Devil
baseball caps and championship bumper stickers. Neither the Duke fan
nor his close friends or family members attended Duke, but they have all
purchased Blue Devil apparel from a Durham County Wal-Mart.


Unheard of during Krzyzewski�s early years, this growing collection of
gullible dupes also buys into the media�s misplaced love for Duke by
believing that the program and its coach are class unmatched. Most of
the fans are North Carolinians, who, perhaps not unreasonably, assume
that the school�s central state location is reason enough to justify an
allegiance to it. Because the Blue Devil fan has no firsthand
experience with the school, he has no idea that the vast majority of the
student body is imported, with a large percentage comprising smug
Northeastern carpetbaggers who constantly mock North Carolina and its
native residents. The Duke fan honestly believes that Mike Krzyzewski
is handsome and marvels at his ability to coach ACC basketball for a
quarter of a century without sprouting a single grey hair.


VI. The players.


Without question, one could compose a lengthy book on the subject of
despicable Duke players. It�s far easier to identify the few who do not
turn our stomachs. I, for example, generally had no problems with the
starting five of K�s first final four team, (although Michael Jordan
wannabe David Henderson bordered on the annoying). I later met Jay
Bilas, a law school classmate of mine, and he is definitely a likeable
guy * I�d even agree with classy. My sense was that Mark Alarie, Johnny
Dawkins, (while he was a player anyway), and Tommy Amaker were similarly
unobjectionable. But aside from this small group, the roster from any
of the Krzyzewski era teams reads like an historical survey of all-time
NCAA tools.


The list is so inexhaustible that it is necessary to discuss the most
hated Duke players by categories. First is what I describe as the Wojo
prototype. Usually two to three on any Duke team, this is the player
with average to below-average skills who, after ANY made basket, runs
down the court with arms fully extended at his side, fists clutched,
brows furrowed, and garbage effusing from a mouth opened as wide as
humanly possible. The facial expression is a cross between that of a
trash-talking punk and a toddler in mid temper-tantrum. The prototype
was perhaps perfected by two of the current assistant coaches, Steve
Wojokowski and Chris Collins, with the current representatives being JJ
Redick and, my favorite, Lee Melchionni. In an effort to put a
favorable spin on these clearly detestable players, basketball
commentators developed a euphemism for this particular type of
Krzyzewski-bred jerk: �the emotional leader of the team.�


Admittedly, other schools occasionally have players of the Wojo mold:
former N.C. State player Chris Corchiani and current Maryland swingman
Nick Caner-Medley come to mind. But no other school has ever put
forward such a consistent and unending string of infuriating tools. In
addition to the previously mentioned annoying gnats, we�ve seen Danny
Ferry, Quinn Snyder, Bobby Hurley, Greg Koubek, Thomas Hill, Brian
Davis, Christian Laettner, Bobby Hurley, Cherokee Parks, and a herd of
other past and present players gallop down the court with that same smug
look. I have no doubt that the reason Wojo himself was plucked from the
radio booth and given the honor of an assistant coach position was his
ability to mentor current Duke students in mastering the nuances of this
prickly player profile.


Next, we have the Dahntay prototype. Named for Dahntay Jones, this
player is a master of unabashed thuggery. He regularly resorts to
dangerous, flagrant fouls, the majority of which are somehow never
called. You may, for example, recall Dahntay himself striking Raymond
Felton with a vicious elbow to the face during Felton�s freshman year.
No foul was called, (but the referees did order Felton out of the game
until his bleeding was stopped.) This �accidental� contact,
incidentally, occurred almost a year after Jones broke the jaw of Wake
Forest forward Justin Gray. The Dahntay prototype is physically what
Krzyzewski is verbally: an out-of-control absurdity who gets a season
long free pass from game officials and a blind eye from the media.
Other classic examples of these elbow-throwing, cheap shot artists
include Danny Ferry, Greg Newton, Elton Brand, Matt Christianson, Casey
Saunders, and, of course, Shelden Williams.


Then there is the Duhon prototype. A long-time Duke tradition,
virtually every player from Danny Ferry forward fits this mold: haughty,
smug, pompous players who look as though everyone around them is an
untouchable piece of garbage. A further reflection of the coach, the
best examples here often unfold off court. A few years back, for
instance, Carlos Boozer left an ACC tournament game after being called
for a foul. Unbeknownst to him, the camera followed as he sat on the
bench, arrogantly staring forward. A water boy immediately stepped
behind him and touched his shoulder with a cup of Gatorade, apparently
forbidden from speaking to him. Boozer simply stared forward for a good
twenty seconds, to good to say, �No thank you,� or to even shake his
head. Dahntay Jones� impromptu set of pushups in front of the
television camera immediately after a dunk against UVA is another good
example. I mentioned earlier Duhon�s smug proclamation that all other
ACC schools simply compete for second place. Another great illustration
is the prevailing tendency of Duke players to whine about the cruel
manner with which opposing fans treat them, as if nothing short of
homage is expected. But, above all, it is the unmistakable look of
unadulterated conceit that has made the following illustrative players
so easy to despise: Phil Henderson, Grant Hill, Brian Davis, Christian
Laettner, Elton Brand, JJ Redick, Daniel Ewing, and, of course, Chris
Duhon himself. The aforementioned Wojo and Collins, of course, also
cross over into this list.


All of the foregoing prototypes are the direct results of Krzyzewski�s
two-faced approach to the game. The saddest aspect of it all is the
manner with which the K factor can convert even normal human beings into
detestable asses. A case in point is Johnny Dawkins. As remarked
earlier, I personally had few problems with this guy as a player. He
struck me as a solid, overachieving player with a great shot and a
vertical leap I could only dream of; a respectable counterpart to UNC�s
Kenny Smith. But, oh, how things changed as the man morphed into a
Krzyzewski clown, uh, clone. These days, every time the camera shows
�Coach Dawkins,� he has that foul, contemptuous, chip-on-the-shoulder
scowl permanently etched on his face, the look of a man so conceited
that he resents even being required to prove his superiority.




VII. The Place is PHONY.


As the extensive evidence of Duke hypocrisy suggests, Duke, its
students, players, fans, and coaches, are a bit on the disingenuous
side. And yet few people appreciate that the school is fake to its
core.


I still recall my orientation during which a second year law student
took us on a short tour of the west campus. As we walked between the
gothic buildings, she explained the school�s origin by advising that
James B. Duke had a love affair for Princeton University. He actually
tried to buy the place, but Princeton was not looking to sell. After
being rebuffed, Mr. Duke decided he would build his own Princeton.
Hence, stone-carved gothic architecture was added to what was then
Trinity College.


Additional efforts were taken to cause the twentieth century buildings
to appear much older than they are, our guide explained. For example,
acid was placed on the stairs in order to cause them to have a time worn
appearance. I couldn�t believe Duke wanted to publicize this history,
but it confirmed what I already suspected: that Duke, from its
inception, has tried to be something that it is not.


No one epitomizes this phony tradition better than Coach K. From his
jet-black dyed hair, to his hypocritical attempts to paint himself as a
model citizen, K nauseates me each and every fall. Indeed, he ascends
to new zeniths of abhorrence each year as he does things like star in
American Express commercials in which he claims an interest in helping
players develop as human beings.


If the man were simply a boorish lout, I would not take as strong an
offense to him. Bobby Knight, for instance, is about as foul mannered
as they come, but he doesn�t pretend to be something he�s not. Ditto
for Gary Williams, John Cheney, and other coaches who are rough along
the edges but first to admit it. Only K, and his disciples, go through
life as obscene, self-centered, smug, haughty jerks while pretending to
be the sport�s Snow White.


VIII. Obstinate Refusal to Accept/Act Upon Constructive Criticism.


Last but far from least, we loathe Duke University because its arrogance
prohibits it from recognizing and correcting its most serious
deficiencies. What other explanation can there be for the fact that
Duke has still, without a doubt, the absolute, number one, undisputed,
UGLIEST cheerleaders in the ACC?

Wow. I am drunk, but that was, by far, the best things i could have heard tonight. Props to you!!!

A piece of literary genius. It should win a pulitzer. :eek:

THAT is a great read! If the author's name was in there, I missed it.

As a lifelong KU fan and alum, I've seen some of my favorite teams beaten by Dook. Our 85-86 team was beyond amazing...lost to 'them' in the Final 4. :( Too bad, cuz I believe it was the year 'before' the 3-point stripe went in and we had some supreme long-distance shooters in Calvin Thompson and Ron Kellogg. It was also Danny Manning's freshman year...

I HATE Dook! :mad: Frankly, they're fun to hate...kinda like Missouri and Quin Snyder...http://madisc.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif

...kinda like Missouri and Quin Snyder...http://madisc.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif


Preach on Doc!

Wow. I never knew all the factors involved that makes me hate Duke. Now, lets see the UNC spread.I agree Duke is sheot, and UNC runs a much more admirable program, but a Duke fan could probably write the same.

Watch and see all the crybaby UNC fans slam this.

Wow. I never knew all the factors involved that makes me hate Duke. Now, lets see the UNC spread.I agree Duke is sheot, and UNC runs a much more admirable program, but a Duke fan could probably write the same.

Watch and see all the crybaby UNC fans slam this.



All we'll be crying about is the mass exodus of our underclassmen players to the NBA...... 1 gone..... 3 more most likely to follow. Sounds like Chris Paul is bailing on WF as well.

Wow, after reading that, I don't know who sucks more: Duke or OU ;)

...kinda like Missouri and Quin Snyder...http://madisc.org/discus/clipart/proud.gif


Preach on Doc!



dude, that guy looks shadier than a sex offender at a petting zoo.

I don't think the euphoria of a national championship has worn off enough for them to cry just yet.

dude, that guy looks shadier than a sex offender at a petting zoo.


Lmao!!

Dunn, that has got to be the best work of prose I have read in my entire life. You accurately summed up why Puke sucks SO bad. Kudos. And all Dookey fans cry on this. UNC #1...always has been....always will be.

You need to read more then!

That might be some of the worst reasoning I have ever read, and having been an undergrad tutor, I've seen the bottom of the barrel!
The most fallacious example being to show the conspiracy that Duke gets more free throws and this CAN'T be possible because of their aggresive defense and perimeter offense; as if there is some great axiom of basketball that prohibits the possibility of such an occurence.
and I quote:
"... at no point in your incoherent rambling did you even approach what can be considered a rational thought. All these people here are now dumber for having listened to you. I award you no points, and may God have mercy upon your soul."

and this CAN'T be possible


You would think, right? Puke gets the refs calls their way and that's a fact jack. Dook should have WAY more Oscars than wins.

The most fallacious example being to show the conspiracy that Duke gets more free throws and this CAN'T be possible because of their aggresive defense and perimeter offense;

speaking of fallacious arguments... in all factual actuality a perimeter offense begets less fouls. who gets fouled more, jump shooters or slashers (players driving to the basket)? perimeter offense's purpose is for perimeter ball movement to create an open shot, whereas an interior attacking offense's purpose is to create scoring opportunities by breaking down the interior of the defense, when this occurs the defense usually fouls or gives up easy shots.

wheres the Why We Hate UNC thread?

How are you going hate on the NATIONAL CHAMPS?

Ten reasons why Coach K should be the next pope:

1. He's a Catholic with a Polish last name, like the last one.

2. Many think he is ordained by God

3. He pontificates frequently

4. Would be a great opportunity to move St. Peter's Basilica to Duke Chapel

5. On the Court 'bestows blessings' using the Lord's name often

6. His staff always dressed in clergy-black

7. Wojo would make such a cute alter boy!

8. Duke's 'class act'program and choir-boy image would help the Church's tarnished reputation

9. Says he's not a basketball coach anyway, he's a leader

10. Only lives 8 miles from the Southern part of Heaven...(or 18 miles, depending on what your definition of heaven is:-)

that may very well be how it happens, my point is that this anecdote does not PROVE anything, certainly not conspiracy by the ref's.
here's another great one:
Smith ( whom I respect a great deal) defended JR Reid's SAT scores by saying that his and a teammates combined were higher than two duke players combined. SO? The point was that JR wasn't bright, how does this dispell that notion? Take two players with 1100 average @ Duke, probably underestimating, JR scores ~800, all you need is a player with a 1400 to match them, 1400 not hard to find on the bench at UNC, on the floor? So what does this prove...nothing,
however I did watch him on ESPN dream job, wow!

a lump of ***** and albert einstein would probably have a high aggregate SAT score too!

[email protected] TTator....... I didn't know you were a Dooky :D
I'm surprised they let you stay in the TTowers.

I grew up watching/liking Duke, got to meet the '91 team in G'boro regionals. Always liked Dean, just never pulled for them. Lately I find myself pulling for the Pack, its just so fulfilling when they actually pull out those wins.

[email protected] TTator....... I didn't know you were a Dooky :D
I'm surprised they let you stay in the TTowers.



We aren't all sportin' Marco Blue in the TTowers RD...

What's my name?!?

POLO

BLAMO!!!!

How bout them <font color="red"> JAYHAWKS!!!!!! </font>
http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20061126/capt.017bb6d7eedc435b8d777e802c2a0726.florida_kans as_basketball_nvmt123.jpg

Later Gators! :cool:

That overtime cost me coupla hours of sleep...WHOAH! :eek:

Hmm...

here's my logic about Kansas.

Kansas just beat hands down the best team in the country.
Oral Roberts beat Kansas
Layola-Marymount beat Oral Roberts
Miss. St beat Layola-Marymount
Miss St. lost to Winthrop AND Clemson
Withrop lost to UNC AND Maryland.
UNC lost to Gonzaga
Gonzaga lost to Butler

Clemson, Butler, and Maryland are undefeated. By this obvious logic, they should all be number 1 in the country.

You're better at imitations... /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif ...than logic.

Jayhawks all the way this year!

Story of our lives!!! KU loses to an unranked team!

Glad they had it on ESPNU - which I can't get even with our Digital Cable+ - so I cound't see the debacle... :mad:

The Chickenhawks better watch out for this man:

http://www.aggiesports.com/images/031706/8302_600.jpg

The Aggies are on a mission....Big XII title or bust.

Chap

The Aggies are on a mission....Big XII title or bust.


That's gonna be a bust Chappy!

How about Wichita St. First taking down LSU, then Syracuse!!

their the best team in Kansas ;)

Aggies, KU, hah.

By the end of the season, the youngest team in the conference will be the best team in the conference. :p

Eric, y'all are Jekyll/Hyde. Where is the consistency?

Chapman, y'all are **** good, but play someone for chrissakes. ;)

Are the 'Horns young? Heck, we don't have ANY seniors... I'm going to watch the 'Hawks blow up the USC Condoms this evening...free tix ala DG'er Nate Marshall! Nate! UDa MAN!! :cool:

Texas have couple of jc transfers that rarely play, but the starting lineup is four freshman and a sophomore. The next guys coming in are two more freshman, and another sophomore.

They are young and extremely ugly at times, but at times they look very promising. Realistically, they are shooting for third and I suspect they will be a lot like KU last year: beat some great teams and look like final four material, then stink up the joint.

We're getting the 'stinking up the joint' outta the way FIRST...I pray............. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Aggies, KU, hah.

By the end of the season, the youngest team in the conference will be the best team in the conference. :p

Eric, y'all are Jekyll/Hyde. Where is the consistency?

Chapman, y'all are **** good, but play someone for chrissakes. ;)



We play at LSU tomorrow and UCLA in Los Angeles (Wooden Classic) coming up on Saturday, so we'll see how good we are. The non-con schedule is not quite as bad as it was the past few years.

Chap

How come Mizzou didn't get Huggins? :D

A&M lookin' real tough...Big 12 will be up for grabs!

Hey, Mike Anderson's looking pretty good right now! 40 minutes of hell! Huggins who? :)

Got to watch a great game at our club meeting last night...

UNI 57
Iowa 55
@ Iowa

just another reason to fire alford, blows an 11 pt lead with 5 min left @ home... hawks held a 10 pt lead virtually the entire 2nd half

young or not, this crap is gettin old... same crap happened earlier this year vs. az st.... we cant finish anything and we havent even beaten a real team yet... its gonna be a long year here in hawkeye country

The Chickenhawks better watch out for this man:

http://www.aggiesports.com/images/031706/8302_600.jpg

The Aggies are on a mission....Big XII title or bust.

Chap


We'll find out if the mission is back in control today !!! :D

54 - 54 with 6:29 remaining. :D

Helluva game! Congrats to both as A&M looks tough...and UCLA was the better team today.

My boyz better get their kaka together...not looking very impressive AT ALL...(Florida, aside). Though, 15 blocks did break the school record today. I didn't think that losing Giles would be a factor...but unless the Russion dude, Sasha Kaun, gets his poop together...we're gonna be sucking wind if we get in foul trouble; in the paint.
I have more faith than I sound like...we WILL prevail.
<font color="red">GO</font> <font color="blue">'HAWKS</font><font color="red">!!</font>

<font color="red">GO</font> <font color="blue">'HAWKS</font><font color="red">!!</font>

If you are watching the Cowgirls, you are missing a real nail biter !!! :eek: :)

OT time for another cold one. :)
<font color="orange"> HOOK 'EM HORNS !!! </font>
Augustine - Player of the game !
LSU - 75 TEXAS - 76

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g75/albertlirette/augustin_dj_121006_400.jpg
The Longhorns edge LSU in overtime, 76-75
D.J. Augustin scores 25 points to lead all scorers !!!
Great one at the Toyota Center in Houston. :D:D:D

D.J. Augustine wins Big 12 Rookie of the Week !
:) :D:cool::D
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g75/albertlirette/810426.jpg

their the best team in Kansas ;)



Not so fast....some folks in Wichita might beg to differ.

Chap

Helluva game! Congrats to both as A&M looks tough...and UCLA was the better team today.



Pretty good performance on the road, and much better than the LSU game the other night...which was closer than the final score indicated. Neutral floor might have been a little different than the obviously pro-UCLA crowd in LA.

Still, Ags looked good. They're still a young team...should get better as the year goes on. It's going to be a great Big XII season. The Ags, Sips (Longhorns for those of you not from Texas :cool:), and Chickenhawks all have pretty good squads, but all have a few warts also. Oh yeah, and Okie State's not bad. Mizzou and K-State are probably a notch below, but both are much improved. Baylor is supposed to be much improved as well, although that loss to South Carolina has to sting a little.

Chap

their the best team in Kansas ;)



Not so fast....some folks in Wichita might beg to differ.

Chap



FEAR the Valley.

their the best team in Kansas ;)



Not so fast....some folks in Wichita might beg to differ.

Chap


I'm pretty sure Keldog WAS talking about Wichita State Chappy!....and yes, they are one hell of a team, ranked 8!!

their the best team in Kansas ;)



Not so fast....some folks in Wichita might beg to differ.

Chap


I'm pretty sure Keldog WAS talking about Wichita State Chappy!....and yes, they are one hell of a team, ranked 8!!


Where's that Shocker coach from again? Where did Dean Smith play hoops in college?? Yup. :D:cool:

<font color="orange">Tennessee 79-Oklahoma State 77! WOOOOF! </font>

Where did that avatar come from? I didn't put in on there.

their the best team in Kansas ;)



Not so fast....some folks in Wichita might beg to differ.

Chap


I'm pretty sure Keldog WAS talking about Wichita State Chappy!....and yes, they are one hell of a team, ranked 8!!


Where's that Shocker coach from again? Where did Dean Smith play hoops in college?? Yup. :D:cool:



Turgeon's from Topeka. :) And BTW, he's a LARRY BROWN protege, not Roy Williams, before anyone starts that crapola again.

On the other hand, KU has a nice Oklahoma State guy at the helm now. Think KU might have had the most influence on college basketball from the Big XII? Think again (and think Iba, and I don't mean Moe or Gene)!

Chap

Useless A&M hoops trivia: Mike Clifford may have shot 8% from the FT line for the season (not a typo), but he held Danny Ferry scoreless in the NCAA tournament as a senior in 1987.

Chap

<font color="orange">Tennessee 79-Oklahoma State 77! WOOOOF! </font>



How bout them Vols?

Knocked off undefeated Memphis and now Oklahoma State. Maybe there's a top 25 ranking in the future.

they should already be top 25..we'll have another good test against a good Texas team in Knoxville on the 23rd...

Man, that is a nice dunk.

Payback. This saturday. ;)

we were already Top25 before we lost to Butler, which we then lost to North Carolina the very next game.

better get used to that mccaine. we going to light you guys up in knoxvegas. :D

they should already be top 25..we'll have another good test against a good Texas team in Knoxville on the 23rd...


Texas might make it into the top 25 by then but........
tonight it's time for <font color="red"> Razorbacks </font> at <font color="orange"> Longhorns</font> !!! :cool:

http://cache.texassports.com//image_lib/durant_kevin_122006_400.jpg
Kevin Durant (pictured) scores 28 points to lead the Longhorns to an 80-76 home victory over the Razorbacks.
<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM HORNS</font> !!! :D

good game. watched the whole thing and was very impressed by their shooting and Durant is a man child. That kids hits the weight room for the next 4 years and he will be looking like Larry Johnson.

Big game today and not too long to wait. This one will be to close to call. :D

Oh Yeah, another OT game!!!

<font color="orange">Vols 111, Horns 105 in ot. BOOOOM! </font>

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070111/capt.ksow10701110335.oklahoma_st_kansas_basketball _ksow107.jpg
:D

/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

http://myspace-211.vo.llnwd.net/01472/11/23/1472143211_m.jpg
I think the Headline on this pic ^ would go perfect for this KU BB pic.(Just instead of Football~>Basketball and Not OSU~>Kansas)
http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070111/capt.ksow10701110335.oklahoma_st_kansas_basketball _ksow107.jpg

****, that's just wrong!

Next year the game will be in Stillwater... /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Look for Pitt to roll the Mouseketeers in Morgantown on Wednesday! :o

KU got a big dose of this man on Saturday:

http://media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper657/stills/973bhu49.jpg

...and the T-Sippers wil get theirs tonight.

KU fought the Law...and the Law won. Good game for 38 minutes...
My <font color="blue">boyz</font> need to treat an 11 point lead like they are tied; or better yet; behind...and just tighten the screws down instead of playing a 'soft' prevent defense. :mad:

There is some irony that the A&M hoops is good.

I'm waiting for them to try to TM "the Sixth Man."

Is Kaun finally waken up??

Still snoozin'...& still taking up a LOT of space in the paint!

See Kev, I told ya! 19 & 0 @ Kitty Kats !!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Yep NIT bound for the KATS, if the POKES don't win a road game it looks like OKIE'S only team in the NCAA tourney will be



http://www.mid-con.com/images/reference/logos/fullsize/oral-roberts.jpg

:D:D:D

ROCK CHALK!!!!!!

Gig 'em!

I tell you now, I do not want to see my team anywhere close to Winthrop in the bracket. These guys are 28-4 with losses to UNC, Maryland, Wisconsin, and Texas A&M, all on the road and most were close games. They were perfect thru the Big South tournament and regular season, plus got some decent road wins at Mississippi St. and Old Dominion. I like them to get a 12 or 11 seed which will be the best seed ever for a Big South team, but they will be a threat to any 4-6 seed the committee throws at them in the first round. I'm jumping on the bandwagon as of right now, as a Big South guy (Radford).

Gig 'em!


Aggies got gigged by the Cowboys but, I just heard the announcer say
Kevin Durant wins player of the year.
<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM !!! </font>

ROCK CHALK!!!!!!

<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM !!! </font>

Gig 'em!


Aggies got gigged by the Cowboys but, I just heard the announcer say
Kevin Durant wins player of the year.
<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM !!! </font>



Good, the Ags will be well rested for the tourney that MATTERS.

Chap

Gig 'em!


Aggies got gigged by the Cowboys but, I just heard the announcer say
Kevin Durant wins player of the year.
<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM !!! </font>



Good, the Ags will be well rested for the tourney that MATTERS.

Chap



Blah, blah, blah!!

Gig 'em!


Aggies got gigged by the Cowboys but, I just heard the announcer say
Kevin Durant wins player of the year.
<font color="orange"> HOOK-EM !!! </font>



Good, the Ags will be well rested for the tourney that MATTERS.

Chap



Blah, blah, blah!!



Think KU can win a first round game this year?

Those Rattlers are pretty decent! Or will it be the Purple Eagles?

Chap

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:D

I tell you now, I do not want to see my team anywhere close to Winthrop in the bracket. These guys are 28-4 with losses to UNC, Maryland, Wisconsin, and Texas A&M, all on the road and most were close games. They were perfect thru the Big South tournament and regular season, plus got some decent road wins at Mississippi St. and Old Dominion. I like them to get a 12 or 11 seed which will be the best seed ever for a Big South team, but they will be a threat to any 4-6 seed the committee throws at them in the first round. I'm jumping on the bandwagon as of right now, as a Big South guy (Radford).



If Winthrop played the right teams, I might have put them through several rounds as this year's Cinderella. But while I have no doubt they'll whup Notre Dame, I just can't see them beating a very talented Oregon team that scores a ton of points, and playing in Spokane, WA. I could even see Oregon beating Florida and making the Final Four. :eek:

Yea, I'm with you. I like Winthrop to beat Notre Dame, then give Oregon fits. But I also like Oregon to win that region and make the final 4.

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So who does everyone like in their final four?

Do you think TX will knock out UNC?

I think these are some probable first round upsets:

Old Dominion
Davidson
GT
Holy Cross?
Gonzaga
Arkansas
Oral Roberts?
Texas Tech

I forgot Winthrop! USDGC BABY!!!! :D

Deano... :cool:

georgetown wins it all

Holy Cross?



Do not disrespect the Salukis.


:)

God wouldn't let you down would he? :DTAKE THE EAGLES!

http://www.aggieathletics.com/specialsites/centralregional/teams/oru/oralrob.jpg

remember Oral Roberts went to KANSAS at Fog Allen and whooped em and only lost by 11 @ Georgetown and were in that game until the last 2 minutes


BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELIEVE IT! :D

So,Kev......you got ORU in the champ game against Notre Dame,right?

:D

ORU can't get by Tejas in the great 8 Durant and Augustine are too sick.

I have the Longhorns over the Turles....I guarantee no one has those two playing each other in the championship game

BEEEEEEEEEEEELIEVE IT! :D:cool:

I have the Longhorns over the Turles....I guarantee no one has those two playing each other in the championship game




I wouldn't bet against you on that. There is likely no one in the world predicting that Texas faces Maryland in the finals, even Terps fans. :o

I think there is a very good chance two number one seeds could end up in the championship game this year.

I'm gonna get some kind of <font color="red">J</font><font color="blue">A</font><font color="red">Y</font><font color="blue">H</font><font color="red">A</font><font color="blue">W</font><font color="red">K</font> tattoo if my boyz bring it home. Who's YOUR team?

has Oregon vs. Kansas and Georgetown vs. Ohio St in the final 4, then Kansas over Ohio St. in the final. My sleeper team is Nevada to make into the round of 8.

I'm gonna get some kind of <font color="red">J</font><font color="blue">A</font><font color="red">Y</font><font color="blue">H</font><font color="red">A</font><font color="blue">W</font><font color="red">K</font> tattoo if my boyz bring it home. Who's YOUR team?



men kissing would be a great tattoo representing the Jayhawks :o

can you say probation?

Nevada player Kyle Shiloh suffered a bad hamstring injury last weekend. But even if they get past Creighton and Memphis, there's no way they beat Texas A & M. In fact, I predict the Aggies beat Ohio St. and make the final four!

I'm gonna get some kind of <font color="red">J</font><font color="blue">A</font><font color="red">Y</font><font color="blue">H</font><font color="red">A</font><font color="blue">W</font><font color="red">K</font> tattoo if my boyz bring it home. Who's YOUR team?



men kissing would be a great tattoo representing the Jayhawks :o



HA! This coming from an "Oral" Roberts' fan.

ORU DID play an important role in getting my boyz PO'd. Beating us on our home floor and all...had to turn it into a positive...a #1 Seed. Thank you Tulsa, once again!

FYI: 3/14 is now an official holiday, you should all inform your ladies of the newest holiday which comes the day before the NCAA tourney starts.

:mad:

Circle 2, the Jayhawks had better come to play this year. I always look at their talent and pick them to go far. They usually disappoint. I'm picking them again this year.

Tony, how on earth did Southern Illinois get a four seed. I looked them up. They have beat virtually no one and lost to the mediocre Pigs and Hoosiers. They are headed for a quick exit. They might win one more game than Duke will though. Speaking of the ACC, they are the most overrated conference in the land. NC State made it to the finals cause everyone but Carolina and Maryland was as lame as they were. I haven't seen Georgia Tech play, but they probably blow also. ;)

North Texas (UNT) plays Memphis Friday at 12:30, might have to actually watch that game if it is on TV.

Only the second time in school history that North Texas has made the big dance.

I was there in 1988 in Salt Lake City rooting on my Eagles.

If I had known about Fridays game before yesterday, I might have tried to make it to New Orleans to watch the 2nd ever final 64 game in North Texas history. As broke as I am right now, it is prolly good I don't care about basketball.

(I can't even tell you how the Maveriks are doing)

Take the TURTLES!!!!!!!

They have been coasting through the year under the radar...but they are ready to explode!

Tony, how on earth did Southern Illinois get a four seed. I looked them up. They have beat virtually no one and lost to the mediocre Pigs and Hoosiers. They are headed for a quick exit. They might win one more game than Duke will though.



Southern Illinois will beat the Patriot league patsy (I'm a Patriot league alum :D) but lose to Virginia Tech.

And indeed, Dook won't even get past Virginia Commonwealth. :cool:

Speaking of the Big XII, the only two teams worth a **** are Kansas, which has been upset in the first round the past two years, and UT, which has one SOLID player and a bunch of scrubs? Too bad there isn't another conference vs conference tournament for the ACC to dominate. :o

Heels will win it all <font color="white"> or be the first #1 seed to lose to a #16 seed </font>

James,

It is odd to see that low of a number attached to a school like SIU. I'm sure carryover from last year helped their AP/Coaches ranking (which seems to help seeding ::cough::see NCAA 6-seed / ACC 7-seed Duke::cough::).

They did beat Va Tech (in Orlando). SIU suffers from the typical mid-major problem -- no one will schedule them. Even Illinois won't play them in Champaign, but will play every other team in the state...which is why I want Illinois to upset VT and have to play SIU.

Plus, they owned the Valley, which was better than last year, just more even top-to-bottom (thus the drop from 4 bids to 2 this year).

SIU's problem is A&M's problem. They bring the D, but can they score enough?


GT is a year away from being really, really good. I'm hoping they all stay. From the few games I saw, they looked thisclose to being an elite team, just too much youth.

Heels will win it all



UNC won't be the first #1 seed to lose to a #16 seed, but they likely won't get past Texas and certainly not Georgetown.

Maybe we should have let State when the ACC, worked for UCLA.

Speaking of the Big XII, the only two teams worth a **** are Kansas, which has been upset in the first round the past two years, and UT, which has one SOLID player and a bunch of scrubs? Too bad there isn't another conference vs conference tournament for the ACC to dominate. :o

Heels will win it all <font color="white"> or be the first #1 seed to lose to a #16 seed </font>



^^^^^^Obviously knows very little about college basketball^^^^^^^

Tejas is one player and the rest scrubs?????? Augustine is one of the funkiest point guards in the country and Abrhams is one of the top 3-point snipers in the country ....I don't care for either of the Longhorns or the JayHACKS but they are both real good, Tejas reminds me of the CUSE with Mello and Macnemera they could go all the way.

Scrubs may be over the top, but texas would be in the NIT without Durant. Who exactly has texas beaten (http://www.texassports.com/index.php?s=&change_well_id=9995&url_channel_id=16) this year?

G-Town all the way.

We will see whether they are a pretender or not. I hope Carolina gets that cakewalk game in the third round against Texas.

Don't forget Damien James either. He'll be in the league one day with Durant and Augustine.

Circle 2, the Jayhawks had better come to play this year. I always look at their talent and pick them to go far. They usually disappoint. I'm picking them again this year.



My boyz are exuding a different/improved kind of confidence this season...are gelling later rather than earlier...proving to themselves they can come back from deficits...learning from their mistakes. 8 deep, all with next level 'potential' talent. A team.

March Madness is unrivaled in my book. Better than all other sports - pro or college or Olympics. 1 winner...and unfortunately, 64 losers. I hope it's our year.

My gal likes tattoos and I told her this would be the ONLY reason I would consider such a 'permanent' accolade. I WILL smile throughout the whole process - with tears of joy, I'm sure! :D

March Madness is unrivaled in my book. Better than all other sports - pro or college or Olympics.



I'm with you, espically the first two rounds. From lunchtime Thursday until after dinner on Sunday, it is truly great. The only thing that can compare maybe is if the team you root for is in the world series.

I wish the committee would have given us an Indiana/Texas Tech matchup in a 7/10 game, I read an interview with Criag Littlepage (UVA guy-figures?) in my local rag that said the committe did not want to have this matchup, and that is a shame. That matchup alone could have put this tournament over the top. I would have stayed home from work to watch that one if necessary. And could you imagine a week of Bobby Knight press conferences leading up to this possible game? That could have made for some great enterainment for sure.

March Madness is unrivaled in my book. Better than all other sports - pro or college or Olympics.



I'm with you, espically the first two rounds.



48 hoopz games in 4 days...oh yeah! :cool:

The MADNESS has begun!!

Somebody is NOT fearing the Turtle.

Louisville should send the selection committee a fruit basket in exchange for the home games.

If Jared Dudley is so good, how come when I watch BC play, he's a no-show?

TURTLES ROLL!!!!

It looked close cuz they didn't respect the scrubs from Davidson...Curry is the only reason that Davidson didn't get drilled by 30...The Terps will get better as the tourney goes on....


GO ORU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The +10 margin was free throws. Davidson brought their game and fell just a little short. I doubt Maryland didn't respect them.

Looks like ORU got to halftime at a good time. Wazzu was waking up...

davidson got completely dominated inside and on the boards, when they couldnt keep dropping 3s it was over.

Not a good time for Caleb Green to have his worst game of his career...He was just trying to do too much.

Props to Ken Tutt and Caleb Green for 4 good years here in Tulsa and putting ORU back on the map, its been since the 70's since anyone knew who ORU even was.

Go VCU!!!

VCU!

Looks like the inventor of this (http://www.shoutwire.com/viewstory/56953/Beer_Launching_Fridge), who was wearing a DUKE shirt, will be utilizing his invention tonight.

And indeed, Dook won't even get past Virginia Commonwealth. :cool:



Notice that I wrote last night that Duke would lose to VCU. Yea, huh!

As did I, as did I.

my bracket said the Dikes would lose

i graduated from vcu, still go to a few games per year. eric maynor has been stone cold clutch all year, there are few guards anywhere better at getting off the shot in traffic. they are a program on the rise, at least until grant moves on (which looks like it could be sooner instead of later). i had the rams to win in most of my pools.

I think most people picked VCU. :)

I loved the non-timeout call. Maynor knew he was going to hit the shot and Grant had enough trust in him to let it happen. Not many coaches would be able to resist a timeout.

Plus, it never hurts when Duke can't make an unguarded 15' shot.

went 14/16 yesterday, missed on BYU and Duke

I was very impressed with VCU, the VCU/Pitt game should be a great game tomorrow.

15/16 in the bracket I picked on Wed. :)
13/16 in the bracket I picked on Mon for ESPN and forgot to change before tip-off. :(

I'm 14-2 on my one sheet of integrity. I picked ODU and Texas Tech to upset, which didn't occur, but correctly predicted the Duke loss. :cool:

I love it when people brag about how good thier brackets are when almost EVERY high seed wins.

I only got 12 right yesterday.....yet the first days in a point system really dont matter. It's all about not losing elite 8 and final 4 teams.

I love it when people brag about how good thier brackets are when almost EVERY high seed wins.



I hope you're not referring to me, dOOd, because I just explained how I opted for three lower seeds to upset, five if you include 9th-seeded Michigan St. and Xavier beating 8th-seeds. I also have Winthrop, Georgia Tech, and Villanova as lower seeds to beat the higher seeds today. That's a total of 8 out of 32, so don't give me that garbage.

I was just refering in general......

I have the same three today + Pig Sooie over the rubbers.

Pig Sooie over the rubbers.



Good Call!!!!! I like it :D

So what if I went with the "chalk" yesterday, I just didn't see that much upset potential in the first rounds this year. Who know what today will bring though.

Plus Purdue, Holy Cross and Creighton.

A Creighton win kills my bracket, I have Nevada making the round of 8. That Fazekas is the real-deal.

I missed 1 (duke) :p

No money on it this year so went for more upsets. 12-4 start.

This Georgia Tech game is making me sweat.

Had the Running Rebels :cool:

This Georgia Tech game is making me sweat.



#$*&$! youth!

Tony, I don't know if you got to witness the debacle, but they gave the rebs five extra tries in the last two minutes. Eventually, the rebs scored.

REBOUND!!!!!!!!!

I'm hoping for one team to overcome their youth. ;)

CBS Sportsline MMOD Rules!!! This is the coolest thing since the radio coverage of the USDGC.

Looks like some upsets brewing today. Perhaps at least one unexpected?

Tony, I don't know if you got to witness the debacle, but they gave the rebs five extra tries in the last two minutes. Eventually, the rebs scored.

REBOUND!!!!!!!!!

I'm hoping for one team to overcome their youth. ;)



I didn't, but I read that Crittendon was playing like he had never seen a press.

This team has the talent, it needs a little maturity.


That one team has no youth. Durant is really some 25 year old guy Barnes found at the Y. :)

North Texas only lost by 15 in there 2nd ever NCAA finals appearance.

That is better than what I remember back in 1988 :D