jsut saw this on the schedule..just wondering what it was. its Pro/AM ..so i have some interest

Announcement is posted:
http://www.pdga.com/global-dg-championship

This event does not substitute for the USDGC. The PDGA will soon announce a new event to crown the professional national champion in 2011.

Sounds pretty cool.

While I view the rating system as the best system I have seen for its intended goal, I think using it in this way is stretching it quite a bit. Curious to see how it goes.

This is an intriguing idea, and I'd love to get a tournament involved. We already have a tournament scheduled for that weekend, and were planning to sanction it, as we have for the last couple years, as a C-tier. So the question now is, how hard and fast will that B-tier requirement be?

I don't envision us being able to up this particular tournament to B-tier standards/requirements, and I also don't envision changing the local schedule around to get a "bigger" tournament on that date instead. So are we stuck, or will some stateside C-tiers be given the go-ahead to be involved?

I think it's great. One thing this sport is lacking is enough ways to crown "champions".

Interesting that the qualifying events will be contributing half the entry fees to the global contest.....so they'll be low-payout tournaments (or, at least, lower payout than they might otherwise be). That should cut down the competition a bit and make the global championships at little more attainable.

At this point, it's important to hold on to the B-tier requirement. While it may not be totally accurate, the TDs/clubs who run B-tiers are probably a little more experienced for uploading scores, providing photos and stories for the website, plus there's the $500 added cash requirement which enhances the local payouts since some of the entry fee is going global. This gives the events a little more consistency in terms of minimum expectations across the U.S.

I think it's great. One thing this sport is lacking is enough ways to crown "champions".

Interesting that the qualifying events will be contributing half the entry fees to the global contest.....so they'll be low-payout tournaments (or, at least, lower payout than they might otherwise be). That should cut down the competition a bit and make the global championships at little more attainable.
I imagine that's why they're saying that North American events "must be sanctioned preferably as B-tiers", so that the minimum added cash requirement will off-set the part of the entry fee going toward the global event.

It's only one tournament on one weekend out of the year. It would be sad if interest in this event is lessened because the me-me-me, instant gratification folks can't keep their traps shut and suck it up for one event.

How will ties be broken? Could there be multiple champions?

Interesting that the qualifying events will be contributing half the entry fees to the global contest.....so they'll be low-payout tournaments (or, at least, lower payout than they might otherwise be). That should cut down the competition a bit and make the global championships at little more attainable.
It's really like playing two "C-tiers" simultaneously. The global "C-tier" payout for pros may not have much added cash as a percentage but the local "C-tier" will have at least $500 added which is a good percentage relative to that half of the entry fee.

How will ties be broken? Could there be multiple champions?
Only first place ties will be broken and that will be done using decimal places on the numbers simply to get an official first place. However, unlike regular events, all first place tied players will get equal amounts of cash or prizes since they can't play it off in person.

At this point, it's important to hold on to the B-tier requirement. While it may not be totally accurate, the TDs/clubs who run B-tiers are probably a little more experienced for uploading scores, providing photos and stories for the website, plus there's the $500 added cash requirement which enhances the local payouts since some of the entry fee is going global. This gives the events a little more consistency in terms of minimum expectations across the U.S.

Bringing this discussion from the IowaDG forum....

So, the TD/Club will be responsible for $500 in added cash, plus Sanctioning Fees, possibly Insurance, Shelter rental, paperwork, ect. and there will be no payout onsite to the Ams that play this event because the PDGA is handling payouts? Is the PDGA waiving tourney fees for this event, or will that be another few bucks going out?

Wow, what a fantastic deal for that distributor of the Am payouts and for the press the PDGA will get off this. Maybe I can sign up online for this and give the guy a few more dollars for online registration!

It sounds like the TD/Clubs running the event get totally screwed, unless they have the capability of making thier money back somehow off onsite vending? Is that how this gets pulled off?

Why does this event have a sticky? Can my event have a sticky? Its in 3 weeks not in 10 months.

Bringing this discussion from the IowaDG forum....
It sounds like the TD/Clubs running the event get totally screwed, unless they have the capability of making thier money back somehow off onsite vending? Is that how this gets pulled off?

I agree, this seems like a terrible idea from the local perspctive. The Global Championships does like 1% of the total work and probably makes 50% of the profit.

Also as a method for determining a champion this seems to rank just below the BCS in terms of fairness of determining a champion.

CHAMPIONS SHOULDN'T BE DETERMINED BY STATS BUT SHOULD BE DETERMINED WITH DIRECT COMPETITION.

Bringing this discussion from the IowaDG forum....

So, the TD/Club will be responsible for $500 in added cash, plus Sanctioning Fees, possibly Insurance, Shelter rental, paperwork, ect. and there will be no payout onsite to the Ams that play this event because the PDGA is handling payouts? Is the PDGA waiving tourney fees for this event, or will that be another few bucks going out?

Wow, what a fantastic deal for that distributor of the Am payouts and for the press the PDGA will get off this. Maybe I can sign up online for this and give the guy a few more dollars for online registration!

It sounds like the TD/Clubs running the event get totally screwed, unless they have the capability of making thier money back somehow off onsite vending? Is that how this gets pulled off?
Where do you get the notion that there will be no payout on site for the Ams? The article specifically states that there will be still be payouts for the individual tournament results like any other event. Wouldn't that be handled on-site like any other event or am I missing something?

The PDGA is only handling the global payouts, which makes total sense given the final results wouldn't be known for at least a day or so anyway.

I agree, this seems like a terrible idea from the local perspctive. The Global Championships does like 1% of the total work and probably makes 50% of the profit.

Also as a method for determining a champion this seems to rank just below the BCS in terms of fairness of determining a champion.

CHAMPIONS SHOULDN'T BE DETERMINED BY STATS BUT SHOULD BE DETERMINED WITH DIRECT COMPETITION.

More than 50%, as the club also has to cover the B tier requirements.

Your champion comment exemplifies the negative, imo. No one will consider this person a "champion" as you could pick any week of the year and crown the player with the highest rated tourney that weekend a "champion." Only direct competition on the same course against the same field would suffice.

IMO, this tourney probably has a lure to many players as they get to loosely compete against a really big field. The competition against a large field will interest some and the looseness and uncertainty of the 'scoring system" will turn off others. After the tourney, complaining about ratings will intensify.

Where do you get the notion that there will be no payout on site for the Ams? The article specifically states that there will be still be payouts for the individual tournament results like any other event. Wouldn't that be handled on-site like any other event or am I missing something?

The PDGA is only handling the global payouts, which makes total sense given the final results wouldn't be known for at least a day or so anyway.

The payouts will be handled by the same person that does all PDGA fullfillments. I am posting here after Chuck had posted this and thoughts on the Iowa DG forum this morning, and the support/backlash that followed.



http://www.iowadg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7231

( it may take a time or two, getting some error 500 screen. Hold the button on the link while pushing it for a second, seems to work that way. )

Will the global amateur payouts be a big money-grab like how the PDGA likes to run Am Worlds?

Is this tournament being produced by the PDGA on the am side? Is the PDGA the grabber in the money-grab scenario?

Will each local tournament be a separate tournament for PDGA points purposes?

It's only one tournament on one weekend out of the year. It would be sad if interest in this event is lessened because the me-me-me, instant gratification folks can't keep their traps shut and suck it up for one event.

Apologies. I tend to have a knee-jerk reaction to all the different ways and divisions we name champions. I'll avoid my usual listing, only to say that perhaps I'm bitter because I'm one of about 17 disc golfers who hasn't yet been crowned a champion of something or the other.

My comment about the payout is from a TD's perspective. Low payouts tend to produce low turnouts, not to mention lots of gripes, unless the TD can offer something of tremendous value in place of payouts. The $500 added cash will help the pros, but for the Ams, it looks like an event with half the normal payout. Around here, that means a lot of players bypassing the event. Sure, the handful at the top of their division who think they have a shot at the global prizes may play, but for the rest, it's just a weak-payout tournament.

But I could be wrong. Lord knows, I've been wrong before. I applaud any effort to try something new. And I'd probably be less cynical if the word "championship" wasn't included in this project.

Will the Global TD be establishing a standard entry fee or can I charge my players a $10 entry fee, send it all to the PDGA, [1/2 entry fee + $3 per player + sanctioning and insurance = yes, I'd be sending it all] and they are in for the Global payout being paid out of the other players' entry fees?

The payouts will be handled by the same person that does all PDGA fullfillments. I am posting here after Chuck had posted this and thoughts on the Iowa DG forum this morning, and the support/backlash that followed.



http://www.iowadg.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7231

( it may take a time or two, getting some error 500 screen. Hold the button on the link while pushing it for a second, seems to work that way. )
Ok, I've read the thread you linked to, and my question remains: Where are you getting the notion that the PDGA clearinghouse guy is handling the local side payouts?

Let's break this down here...
50% of entry fee goes toward GLOBAL payout (PDGA/Breiner handling ams)
50% of entry fee goes toward LOCAL payout (local vendors handling ams)

I'm assuming when they're talking entry fee, they are referring to the net entry as always. So "entry" doesn't include the PDGA per player fee, any other local series fees, rental/reservation fees, etc.

So, at minimum, if a tournament is charging $35 for Adv, $3 goes to PDGA (B-tier fee), $16 goes to local payout, and $16 goes to global payout. If there are other local fees, they'd come out equally from both sides of the payout equation.

I really don't understand the outrage.

Will the Global TD be establishing a standard entry fee or can I charge my players a $10 entry fee, send it all to the PDGA, [1/2 entry fee + $3 per player + sanctioning and insurance = yes, I'd be sending it all] and they are in for the Global payout being paid out of the other players' entry fees?

Good thinking, Bruce. I'll go the extra mile, though, and propose a $0 entry fee and $5 parking fee (just enough to pay the PDGA taille) for each player at a shrewd TD's arm of the event.

Because that is what Chuck posted. You must not have read it well enough.

Also, because as a TD and being in the business, I dont invest my time and money into an event for someone else to make the majority of money off it. Im not a manufactor, so I dont make money off every single sanctioned event that is run in the world. Again, only 2 groups of people do that. Them and the PDGA.

I like the idea of the event, just feel like it should be run like any other PDGA event.

Because that is what Chuck posted. You must not have read it well enough.

Also, because as a TD and being in the business, I dont invest my time and money into an event for someone else to make the majority of money off it. Im not a manufactor, so I dont make money off every single sanctioned event that is run in the world. Again, only 2 groups of people do that. Them and the PDGA.

I like the idea of the event, just feel like it should be run like any other PDGA event.
Could you quote where Chuck says it then? Because the only times I see where he's referencing Breiner handling payouts is in terms of the GLOBAL payouts.

I think you're reading too much into what he wrote out of bias against Breiner (and just to be clear, I couldn't care less what your beef is with Breiner, nor am I trying in any way to support/defend him or any past actions).

Breiner only handles global payouts which will mostly be checks for pros and has nothing to with the local event merch payouts unless the local TDs need help with that.

I've just posted the Player Details Draft info here: http://www.pdga.com/pdga-documents/pdga-gdgc-player-details-draft

Bruce, the amount going to the global purse for Ams is $15 which will primarily cover the player pack and some going toward payouts. You can set your Am entry fees however much up to the max amounts allowed for B-tiers which is $50 for Advanced divisions and $30 for Intermediate. So the local TDs could get up to $35 from the three Advanced divisions and up to $15 from the Intermediates separate from PDGA fees if they choose.

It has changed since this morning if that is the case. If not, it would have been defended from the get go. On the other site, that was a major issue, not just with me but with the DSM Worlds staff as well.

I think the event itself has alot of appeal, and presented in a better fashion, much like a normal PDGA event has a chance. I think the idea is great. I could see running an event like this, but dont like the requirement aspects.

And it was the 9th post or whatever on the Iowa DG site where Chuck said Briener Inc would be handling global payouts.

After reading the report, 33% pro payout and a custom stamped player package disc? Who is stamping and sending the discs? Are they required for the player pack and if so, will that be a money down thing paid for at the same time as the sanctioning fees?

It has changed since this morning if that is the case. If not, it would have been defended from the get go. On the other site, that was a major issue, not just with me but with the DSM Worlds staff as well.

I think the event itself has alot of appeal, and presented in a better fashion, much like a normal PDGA event has a chance. I think the idea is great. I could see running an event like this, but dont like the requirement aspects.

And it was the 9th post or whatever on the Iowa DG site where Chuck said Briener Inc would be handling global payouts.
Apparently we're talking past each other. I never questioned the bolded part. My question is/was what gives/gave you the impression that Breiner is handling the local payouts at each individual event?

According to everything I've read on the subject today (here, iowadg, etc), Breiner is handling 50% or less (based on Chuck's statement of $15 max per am) of the payouts. Local vendors handle the other half, including normal performance-based payouts at the individual event. Setting aside your and the DSM Worlds staff's feelings about Breiner, what is the objection to the way the payout is proposed to be handled? Or is it simply that Breiner is the PDGA's vendor and you'd prefer someone else?

After reading the report, 33% pro payout and a custom stamped player package disc? Who is stamping and sending the discs? Are they required for the player pack and if so, will that be a money down thing paid for at the same time as the sanctioning fees?
Don't know yet which manufacturer will be doing at least one collectible event disc and that is the minimum I can promise now. We haven't even started talking with sponsors, and considering the potential numbers involved, I'm thinking we might get a few more things for the global player packs. TDs won't have any money involved with player packs since they will be paid for from the global Am purse money including shipping. The only cost for the TDs will be if they decide to buy more of the discs at wholesale for additional local sales.

clusterf*ck called. when is the actual winner of this scheme to be determined? td's have repeatedly shown themselves incapable of posting results correctly- is it going to wait until a ratings update? this is a much bigger cookie than the current setup can digest imo.

Already thought of that. All TDs have to do is upload the scores. They don't even have to set any course layouts because the default in there is 18 holes and everyone plays the same course three times. The unofficial ratings work perfectly well with that format. Even if the unofficial ratings fluctuate for the same score each round, and they will, that's why we're playing three rounds so the cumulated values will be much better than one round. We're doing a review of the ratings calculation factors and even those will be improved by next August if needed. In addition, the upload system may be revamped by then along with a spiffy new layout that will automatically sweep the round ratings into the new virtual event display. Winners and cashers will be posted Monday afternoon day after the event. If TDs don't post final results by Noon EDT, their event drops out of the global standings.

In an attempt to stay positive. "Nice try."

Realistically, this will never work in the Southern Nationals region.
1. Sanctioning fees and $10 privilege-to-play fees will kill attendance.
2. Three rounds on the same course, same layout? Only Maple Hill caliber courses can lure the players for that.
3. Did anyone check the schedule? We (New Orleans) will be hosting the Southern Nationals Am Championships that same weekend on three different courses. Huge payout, obscene players' packs and Burbon Street to drown your sorrows.

Does the pDGA purposely schedule these events to conflict with our established events? The NT Vibram Open was scheduled the same weekend as the S N Pro Championships. Mr. Dodge has a good relationship with us and claims he wasn't aware of the conflict.
What excuse do Dave Gentry and Brian Graham have for not informing him of the historical dates of the SNPC? They don't care plain and simple.

You all enjoy your low payout, low turnout global love circle.

steve timm

It's unfortunate that the SNAC had the same schedule. I suggested a way for SNAC to participate but it was rejected by the few posters today. It was the only suitable date for the global event but more will hopefully follow. I suspect there are a few southern locations that will host events as part of this GDGC even if mostly pros show up. Even if only a few Ams enter they'll be playing in a big field globally. You could potentially do a pro only event as part of the global shindig. And of course keeping it positive, being able to participate in events like this is just another potential member benefit for joining the PDGA.

Chuck

You know that your suggestion that the SNAC be part of the Global Ratings Love Circle would never fly with our members. With the $75 sanctioning fee, $15 per head going to the Global Glacial payout and the $3 per head charge, the pDGA would be collecting $3,362 plus those precious privilege-to-pay fees that would be at lease another another $1,200. We probably couldn't even come up with enough 'gators to enter into your secret ratings computer

All our players would get is the frustration of playing the same course for three rounds a special stamped disc! That pDGA Koolaid may look like lemonade but it does not pass the smell test.

Best of luck, call us stupid southerners but we will have our little gathering and post over $30,000 in value with our event and laugh.

The rest of you AM players, just play in one SN event, get your points, register and come "pass a good time" with the best hosts in the best city in the world.

steve timm

I know the SNAC has been and will continue to be a great event. If we could have scheduled around it or included it we would have. Some players play their home course three or more times in a day regularly. International players expect to play the same course three or four times as a normal tourney format. Ask many pros and they are fine playing the same course three times. I agree that a higher SSA course three times is better. But then that will hopefully be an innovation for future events like this.

Apparently we're talking past each other. I never questioned the bolded part. My question is/was what gives/gave you the impression that Breiner is handling the local payouts at each individual event?

According to everything I've read on the subject today (here, iowadg, etc), Breiner is handling 50% or less (based on Chuck's statement of $15 max per am) of the payouts. Local vendors handle the other half, including normal performance-based payouts at the individual event. Setting aside your and the DSM Worlds staff's feelings about Breiner, what is the objection to the way the payout is proposed to be handled? Or is it simply that Breiner is the PDGA's vendor and you'd prefer someone else?

Well, when its all said and done, there really is no local payout unless you raise the cost of entry fees.. You have to raise $500...not every person has sponsors. So your running a proposed CFR sale to add that money...at least you will be once Chuck thinks that over and decides to post about how Innova will take a stand and produce special discs that you will be able to sell millions of...

My biggest problem with the event is that there is no reason to run it over another event, expecially if I know I am doing anything to support Briener Inc., but in all honesty, in terms of the payout, it doesnt matter who is doing it. Its too much for the PDGA and not enough for the people that matter...the workers, voluteers and players. %50 PDGA payout? Thats a HUGE amount of money that should be benefiting the Club/TD willing to take a chance and run this event. Okay, so you can forget about making anything from the player package, not a big deal, we usually dont anyways unless we offer vouchers, which we rarely do. So I got $500 in and no player packs, because I HAD to get some Global custom stamped discs. I didnt have to pay for them, but half the am purse is going to them and to the global payout, which by the way, will make the payout miniscule at best. Now people have figured that out, so theres more loss of interest. $15? ( If you jack up the entry. )

What is the PDGA payout per player again?

I have rented a shelter, paid for sanctioning fees, bought insurance and printed off flyers and scorecards and everything else, now Im in for about $700. Where is that money coming back at? Its not. You have no recreational level players involved, so you have 2 divisions to make money back off of, and both divisions will be smaller than normal. ( For our event here, anyways ) Its a huge payday for the PDGA partners and a huge media day for the PDGA. "Carbon Footprint" and all that crap. I dont see why this is a viable event for anyone to run. If I have to go to sponsors and ask for the $500, then I am taking that money and that sponsor from another event.

IMO: This is a great idea, but its got major flaws, much like everything the PDGA does because it really only benefits the PDGA, its image and the partners involved at the highest levels. What does it do for the player? Compete on a global level? Thats what the multiple World Championships are supposed to for. All this does is allow the PDGA to make more money on ( now) any given weekend, more than it already does, and its going to create conflicts with events planned for that weekend that dont buy into this pyramid scheme. Most states have started thier 2011 calendar and this is going to bump events.

This should be an optional XC=Tier event. The PDGA should waive almost all fees for this event, and it should be an opportunity for some events that fit the qualifications set. The TD/Clubs should have more like a %75 payout on site with a smaller portion going towards Global payout. Discs should be offered, but not mandatory. The TD/Club has about $150 in with the set-up like this. If they want a bigger turnout or WANT to add more, they can.

The whole "Pros playing all the World theroy" doesnt work either, as they will all band up in one place, like always. Thats great if its your event, but its also because you raised more added cash than everyone else, which is just what the PDGA and its partners are hoping for. Then you have more fees to pay.

Who makes out on this event? The people that work to pull it off on a local level or the PDGA and the manufactors?

I know the SNAC has been and will continue to be a great event. If we could have scheduled around it or included it we would have. Some players play their home course three or more times in a day regularly. International players expect to play the same course three or four times as a normal tourney format. Ask many pros and they are fine playing the same course three times. I agree that a higher SSA course three times is better. But then that will hopefully be an innovation for future events like this.

What Pros want to play the same layout 3 times in a row? That sounds made up Chuck.

What Pros want to play the same layout 3 times in a row? That sounds made up Chuck.
It's the most common format for pros outside the U.S. The USDGC, Vibram and a few other NTs (not just this year) are some others, but as I said, a longer course would be preferred. The only reason it's not more common in the U.S is that TDs want to show off their courses and amateurs prefer variety. But ask the touring pros or regional pros who have to travel to events and they are happy with no more than two layouts if possible. They're pros and want to play well so practice is important. The less practice required the better since there's not enough money in this sport to justify more time than necessary.

Methinks the potential for collusion is double-plus high. I wouldn't be surprised to magically see several of the highest rated rounds in history coming from this "event".

why does this event have a sticky?

why does this event have a sticky?

Now I am getting messages from the moderator asking don't I have anything better to do with my time than ask questions about the sticky and to give it a rest. Seems that isn't the role the moderator. Seems the role of the moderator is to look for offensive content, not ask MB users why they are posting certian questions. It was a legit question and the MB is valueable marketing tool for TDs and having a sticky gets you a lot of visibility. Notice I just asked why it has a sticky, I never asked for the sticky to be removed.

It's the most common format for pros outside the U.S. The USDGC, Vibram and a few other NTs (not just this year) are some others, but as I said, a longer course would be preferred. The only reason it's not more common in the U.S is that TDs want to show off their courses and amateurs prefer variety. But ask the touring pros or regional pros who have to travel to events and they are happy with no more than two layouts if possible. They're pros and want to play well so practice is important. The less practice required the better since there's not enough money in this sport to justify more time than necessary.

I would say the exact opposite is true. I have never once ever heard a single player (pro or am) say the want to play the exact same layout more than once. Glad Chuck is the spokesman for all Pro players now!

Did I say I was the spokesman for Pros? I relayed the reality of events outside the U.S. and what surveys and conversations with top pros have indicated regarding formats let alone the USDGC and other NTs. But then I must remember Texas is the center of the DG universe, right? Riiiighhtt...

Did I say I was the spokesman for Pros? I relayed the reality of events outside the U.S. and what surveys and conversations with top pros have indicated regarding formats let alone the USDGC and other NTs. But then I must remember Texas is the center of the DG universe, right? Riiiighhtt...

"But ask the touring pros or regional pros who have to travel to events and they are happy with no more than two layouts if possible. They're pros and want to play well so practice is important. The less practice required the better since there's not enough money in this sport to justify more time than necessary."

What does Texas have to do with this? Nothing. Am I not allowed to question without this being a Texas thing. I think enough people have stated the flaws with this event and the fact that it buts up against SN isn't a coincident.

It would be a rare event that was perceived as flawless at the start. Note "perceived." Remember how "flawed" the USDGC was in the beginning with the yellow rope, the "island" green with throw and distance penalties, a pin in the sand five feet from water, bamboo barriers, the triple mando and elevated pins? You would have thought these flaws would have disappeared by now.

I would say the exact opposite is true. I have never once ever heard a single player (pro or am) say the want to play the exact same layout more than once. Glad Chuck is the spokesman for all Pro players now!

I know plenty. Around here this 4 rounds on the same layout is common, and is my personal preference. Earlewood Classic is 4 rounds on the same layout---pretty much the same layout we've been playing for almost 20 years---and filled in, what, 4 minutes last year?

I see many problems with this whole scheme....but playing the same layout 3 rounds seems to be the least of them.

I know plenty. Around here this 4 rounds on the same layout is common, and is my personal preference. Earlewood Classic is 4 rounds on the same layout---pretty much the same layout we've been playing for almost 20 years---and filled in, what, 4 minutes last year?

I see many problems with this whole scheme....but playing the same layout 3 rounds seems to be the least of them.
This.

My preference as a player is always to get multiple cracks at the same course rather than changing things around. I want the opportunity to correct mistakes or repeat good shots from the previous round. And then there is the argument Chuck mentioned about being able to come into an event from out of town and be able to familiarize myself with the course with a single walk-through or practice round.

I played a round with a Texas native (;)) at a tournament earlier this year. On Sunday of this event, they moved some pins around from where they'd been set on Saturday (as well as most of the previous couple weeks). I happened to be playing with this Texas native on Sunday morning and I heard him mumble on more than one occasion something to the effect of "why couldn't we just play the same pins as yesterday?"

But I don't mean to make it a Texas thing, it's more a coincidence. I've been playing that particular event for a few years now (they do the same thing every year) and I've heard it every single year from one or two of my Sunday morning groupmates...even players that not only have played the tournament before, but are locals who know and have the opportunity to play all these pin placements regularly.

I really don't see the objection to playing the exact same layout in consecutive rounds. Especially if the layout chosen is done so to provide the optimal challenge and variety that the course has to offer (i.e. it "showcases" the course).

A lot of people are viewing the biggest positive of this whole thing as a negative. The Global money does not get whisked away never to be seen again. It has a chance of coming back to any local player.

People generally overestimate the value of a large payout with a small probability. So, if $15 is going to the Global payout, and that means a player has a one-in-a-thousand chance of a $15,000 payday, then players will tend to value that payout as if it is worth more than $15. A lot more, if I read my Economics book correctly.

So, all the money that goes into the Global pool is not lost, it is actually multiplied, psychologically.

I'm assuming, perhaps wrongly, that the global payout will not be so steep as to result in a $15,000 payout. Which would, at any rate, drown the Am winner in plastic.

Part of my skepticism is that the majority of the players, who don't feel they have a prayer of finishing at the top globally, won't be terribly interested in playing a local tournament with a much lower-than-normal payout.

And that it won't be interesting enough for a majority of TDs to join in, either.

Interest and inquiries among TDs is moving along nicely including from a few international sites with several commitments and several pending. We made a requested change already with global Am payouts. TDs may request to have any global payouts to Ams be cashed thru them or thru their local vendor who is handling local Am payouts rather than thru the PDGA.

I think this event will be easier in some ways for TDs. Since it's 100% pre-reg closing on the Tuesday before, TDs can have the groupings and tee assignments ready to go in advance with only a quick player meeting. Not only is the number of divisions is limited but these will likely be the most experienced players among divisions. TDs will know exactly what trophies they need for local awards a few days before it starts. TDs will get the money from PDGA Sign-up for local payouts and not have to relay any fees to the PDGA. PDGA Sign-up will just transfer them to the PDGA.

No course, pin or tee changes are needed during the event and only one course is used unless you have another one nearby that also qualifies on SSA and you need it to handle the number of players signing up. The PDGA is taking care of player packs with no cost to the TD which have the chance to be better than the typical B-tier due to the overall size of the event. The TD can buy only as many tournament stamped discs at wholesale as they need for local sales without needing to design a logo and maybe buy more than they can sell to meet manufacturer purchase minimums. Their event and anything they do extra that stands out will be visible on a global stage, including local sponsors, where the results of their players are just as important to perhaps a few thousand more players at other events around the globe as they are to the local players.

On the positive side, here in the South but not in SN land, that is a relatively thin part of the calendar, so perhaps it will create a few new events.

I'm guessing Harold and/or his team will plan an event somewhere within 75 miles of Rock Hill unless the Charlotte team does one. And the IDGC will use Steady Ed for three rounds. That's one I wouldn't mind playing, but my home course will be involved in MN and I'll be busy updating the website.

Setting aside your and the DSM Worlds staff's feelings about Breiner, what is the objection to the way the payout is proposed to be handled? Or is it simply that Breiner is the PDGA's vendor and you'd prefer someone else?

It's got nothing to do with Briener. I'm the treasurer of the Des Moines Club. I didn't even live in Des Moines in 2004, but competed in the Worlds that year, and decided to move there and get involved with the club 2 years later, but that's another story. My point is I have no beef with Briener. Some in our club still do, but as far as I'm concerned it's water under the bridge. Actually, he was quite proficient at handling the preregistration for our NT two years ago and our A-Tier last year.

I think the root cause for the negativity is that the people that will be running/vending these events were getting worked over and one business was going to have a big payday. I'm not even a vendor, so it's not my bottom line that gets affected - but the concern is real and I was pointing it out so hopefully it wouldn't get out of control.

After I had a while to calm down (for those of you that read iowadg.com) and actually look at this event from a player's perspective, rather than getting engrossed in the business aspect of it, it is a great idea. I had a conversation with our state coordinator, Justin McLuen, that evening at our club meeting and I posed the question....why can't the am monies that are going to be paid out just be redistributed to the local vendors in the form of a check and just let them handle the payout for the global cashers? I don't know if Chuck had the same idea or if the idea was passed along, but the next day I come into work and he had proposed the possibility of this scenario.

I think the idea is good, and I'm willing to try it, especially now since we're looking at ways to NOT step on the toes of those that work hard to put these events on.

The reality is, there will be events like SNAC that won't participate.

Also, it's a minority opinion with regards to less courses is better. The only person complaining about too many courses at our NT was Feldberg, and it was during his bad round at an event that he won. This game is all about variety. I guess if you're happy playing your same course from 1990 year in and year out, more power to ya. Bet you haven't been to Des Moines though.....which is the center of the disc golf universe, whenever all of you get done.

It's not that I personally favor one course only or even feel it's better than two or three. The big issue for this first event is to keep the format simple and consistent so no TD gets embarrassed uploading scores incorrectly, especially with TDs from around the world participating whose English may be limited. In future virtual events that may only include U.S. events, we can risk being more adventurous with course combinations. It will still work but then the TDs have to be on top of it for uploading scores and assigning layouts properly.

Using the exact same course for three rounds, there's almost zero chance for a mistake since only scores will need to be uploaded after rounds. The default course assignment is already there set for 18 holes and doesn't need to be touched. It will be easy for me to help TDs upload if they don't know how as long as they can email me the spreadsheet with scores. No worries about miscommunication regarding who played what course.

We get past this first event successfully and it opens up all kinds of opportunities to get creative. I think a team event will be really cool for example. Now coordinating that will be a challenge but still maybe easier than what Houck faces this weekend in Texas.

Anyone have any information about this 3 day event?

Are you talking about this 3-ROUND event?

http://www.pdga.com/global-dg-championship

If so, there's already another discussion thread on it.

.....which the mods have merged this with, leaving the preceding two posts rather puzzling.