I need to vent here ....

I tried to upgrade my event to an A Tier in December (over 6 months away), for which I've raised a boatload of cash and was told by the PDGA that I can't becuase A Tiers need to be scheduled by December of preceeding year. There is no conflict with other events and no discernible reason for the PDGA to not allow an A-Tier on the weekend in question. I was told that an email was sent to all interested TDs requesting that they scheudle in September of the preceeding year (that would be 15 months prior to my event, not realistic). I never received the email, so I guess I didn't qualify as an interested TD. I've had to deal with a non-existant state coordinator, for which I've contact the PDGA and they haven't done anything about it (they said they'd look into it and never followed back up) and now I'm being told "while there are no conflicts we still can't change your event to an A Tier".

Shame on you PDGA. I am trying to help the sport and the players by running high quaility events with a lot of cash and the PDGA seems like they are working against me. I fully understand that I should have requested the A Tier in September of 2009 for an event in December of 2010 (which is absurd in and of itself), but if there are no conflicts I don't understand why the PDGA can't work with me. Guess I'll just have to contact the Southern National guys and get on their radar.

Nice Customer Service PDGA :mad:

Not sure why you wouldn't want to still run a kick-*** B-tier with added cash like an A-tier? There are no A-tiers in December and the touring pros will be looking at the best payout B-tiers if they are playing then.

Not sure why you wouldn't want to still run a kick-*** B-tier with added cash like an A-tier? There are no A-tiers in December and the touring pros will be looking at the best payout B-tiers if they are playing then.

Cause I want the name recognition an A Tier offers. You just proved my point. There are no A Tiers schedule in December. December in South Texas is one of the single best places to be to play disc golf. The courses will look great, the weather will be great (compared to terrible weather in other places). Its a no brainer.

Cause I want the name recognition an A Tier offers. You just proved my point. There are no A Tiers schedule in December. December in South Texas is one of the single best places to be to play disc golf. The courses will look great, the weather will be great (compared to terrible weather in other places). Its a no brainer.

Just run it as an SN event.


An A-tier would have been awesome and probably would have brought a lot of Pros which a B-tier just won't do...........Crowley is the closest I can think of and that only vrought out the usual TX/OK guys.

San Antonio courses in winter are awesome. Have you tried going all the way to the PDGA director? I have emailed him and I think he is similar to a unicorn ie a myth.

San Antonio courses in winter are awesome. Have you tried going all the way to the PDGA director? I have emailed him and I think he is similar to a unicorn ie a myth.

He knows how to use E-mail.....I have talked to him and he has contacted by sponsors before!

The PDGA Tour Standards document clearly state the deadline for getting sanctioning for a PDGA A (Super Tour) is December 1st. It has been that way for several years now. Now TD is basically blaming the PDGA for actually sticking to the published policy and not making an exception for their event. Maybe the PDGA does not want to make an exception for an unproven TD or a new event (since the schedule does not show a Fly Ink Open in Dec. 2009). Bottom line - if a you want to run an A-Tier - you are way too late for 2010. The good news is your are in time to get in on the 2011 planning. Be sure to contact your State Rep now, so they know to include you.

BTW, A-Tier sanctioning isn't always just about the added cash. It is about experienced organizers with proven track records that can anchor the annual PDGA schedule. Since these events (& NT's) drive the rest of the calendar, it is vital they are set well in advance. Not a problem that needs to be solved. (if anything, they could move it to November 1st or even October 1st.)

This advance sanctioning policy also helps increase the odds that the PDGA will get well run A-Tier events. If an event is indeed well planned, the PDGA could reasonable expect experienced organizers would have the information available 15 months in Advance. Organizers that decide one day to "run an A-tour" may have great intentions but without proven track records, the PDGA should error on the side of caution. As stated before, you are still welcome to be a B-Tier with awesome added cash.



If you publicize your added cash, the pros will come. There are also a lot of players looking for event/points in December. Plus, the PDGA just saved you a bunch of money in PDGA sanctioning and per player fees you would have to pay as an A-Tier. Now any non-members in your area can play without having to join the PDGA first. All the money you save NOT paying the extra PDGA fees can bump your awesome payout even more.

Just run it as an SN event.


An A-tier would have been awesome and probably would have brought a lot of Pros which a B-tier just won't do...........Crowley is the closest I can think of and that only vrought out the usual TX/OK guys.

That is my next course of action but I was hoping $1500 added cash + A Tier + Texas in December + Live Oak's awesome courses would create a tremendous event with the likes of the top pros. That said I am still hoping to draw in on one of the deepest talent pools in the county (texas) and I know with Brad at the top of his game and the usual suspects around here it will still be great. Should I put you on the pre-reg list matt?

That is my next course of action but I was hoping $1500 added cash + A Tier + Texas in December + Live Oak's awesome courses would create a tremendous event with the likes of the top pros. That said I am still hoping to draw in on one of the deepest talent pools in the county (texas) and I know with Brad at the top of his game and the usual suspects around here it will still be great. Should I put you on the pre-reg list matt?

Yes, the 1st 3-time LOSO Champ will be there!


Like my wishful thinking?

The PDGA Tour Standards document clearly state the deadline for getting sanctioning for a PDGA A (Super Tour) is December 1st. It has been that way for several years now. Now TD is basically blaming the PDGA for actually sticking to the published policy and not making an exception for their event. Maybe the PDGA does not want to make an exception for an unproven TD or a new event (since the schedule does not show a Fly Ink Open in Dec. 2009). Bottom line - if a you want to run an A-Tier - you are way too late for 2010. The good news is your are in time to get in on the 2011 planning. Be sure to contact your State Rep now, so they know to include you.

BTW, A-Tier sanctioning isn't always just about the added cash. It is about experienced organizers with proven track records that can anchor the annual PDGA schedule. Since these events (& NT's) drive the rest of the calendar, it is vital they are set well in advance. Not a problem that needs to be solved. (if anything, they could move it to November 1st or even October 1st.)

This advance sanctioning policy also helps increase the odds that the PDGA will get well run A-Tier events. If an event is indeed well planned, the PDGA could reasonable expect experienced organizers would have the information available 15 months in Advance. Organizers that decide one day to "run an A-tour" may have great intentions but without proven track records, the PDGA should error on the side of caution. As stated before, you are still welcome to be a B-Tier with awesome added cash.



If you publicize your added cash, the pros will come. There are also a lot of players looking for event/points in December. Plus, the PDGA just saved you a bunch of money in PDGA sanctioning and per player fees you would have to pay as an A-Tier. Now any non-members in your area can play without having to join the PDGA first. All the money you save NOT paying the extra PDGA fees can bump your awesome payout even more.



15 months???????

Houston ran Worlds with like 9 months notice and it went pretty well if you ask me.........besides the payout. lol

Also there has been a well established B-tier at this sight for al long as I can remember which draws a full field (or close since I don't want to make false claims) on three courses.

This same city is trying to install new courses in an attempt to have Worlds in the future and also has one of the most supportive local governments I have seen with the Mayor actually being a casual player.

Somehow I knew you'd come he defense of the PDGA :)

The PDGA Tour Standards document clearly state the deadline for getting sanctioning for a PDGA A (Super Tour) is December 1st. It has been that way for several years now. Now TD is basically blaming the PDGA for actually sticking to the published policy and not making an exception for their event. Maybe the PDGA does not want to make an exception for an unproven TD or a new event (since the schedule does not show a Fly Ink Open in Dec. 2009). Bottom line - if a you want to run an A-Tier - you are way too late for 2010. The good news is your are in time to get in on the 2011 planning. Be sure to contact your State Rep now, so they know to include you.
I fully ackowledge that the document states the deadline. I also understand that not everything is black and white and with no A-Tiers planned in December I don't see any logic in not allowing the upgrade. I haven't yet gotten an a good reason for not allowing this event other than the tour standards say it has to be done by December. I'd think the PDGA would want more A Tiers, especially in Texas (Their largest or second largest market) in December. I've played in A Tiers events that didn't even sniff my non-sanctioned and c Tier events. Also, no personal disrespect to the state coordinator in Texas, as I've heard he's a really great guy, but he's all but given up this year and didn't coordinate anything. As stated I contacted Brian Ghram about this and haven't heard a resolution to situation. I've even voluteered to run if they allowed for elections for that spot this year. [/QUOTE]

BTW, A-Tier sanctioning isn't always just about the added cash. It is about experienced organizers with proven track records that can anchor the annual PDGA schedule. Since these events (& NT's) drive the rest of the calendar, it is vital they are set well in advance. Not a problem that needs to be solved. (if anything, they could move it to November 1st or even October 1st.)
No disagreement here. What's anchoring the schedule this December? Oh yeah, nothing. There's an opportunity to logically look at the schedule and realize there is a gap with no A tiers in December. I would totally understand if there was another event or something causing a conflict but just to say can't do it cause the standards say so is standards run amuck. I work in IT and I see this kind of bureaucratic non-sense as the basis for dumb decisions all the time.

This advance sanctioning policy also helps increase the odds that the PDGA will get well run A-Tier events. If an event is indeed well planned, the PDGA could reasonable expect experienced organizers would have the information available 15 months in Advance. Organizers that decide one day to "run an A-tour" may have great intentions but without proven track records, the PDGA should error on the side of caution. As stated before, you are still welcome to be a B-Tier with awesome added cash. [QUOTE]
This statement is comical. Does the PDGA attend every A Tier? Do they even know what goes on at A Tiers? The answer is NO. As I stated earlier, I've been to A Tiers that didn't even come close to the quality of events that I run as non sanctioned events and A tiers. The tier level (other than NT) has more to do with the amount of added cash than anything. The reason I scheduled the event as a B Teir is I wasn't sure if I could get $1500 in added cash. Thanks to hours and hours of hard work I was lucky enough to secure a large cash sponsor. This is called prudent planning versus sticking my neck out on the line for an A-Tier 15 months in advance without sponsorships secured. What happens when I schedule an A Tier 15 months in advance and then realize I'm stretched to thin? ITs too late to back out cause I've already advertised at least an A Tier. That's when you end up with a poorly run event.


[QUOTE=discette;1427606]
If you publicize your added cash, the pros will come. There are also a lot of players looking for event/points in December. Plus, the PDGA just saved you a bunch of money in PDGA sanctioning and per player fees you would have to pay as an A-Tier. Now any non-members in your area can play without having to join the PDGA first. All the money you save NOT paying the extra PDGA fees can bump your awesome payout even more.
Well that why some of the qualifying events for this event (its also a series final) where non sanctioned.

TX needs to succeed from the PDGA!!! Smilie

TX needs to succeed from the PDGA!!! Smilie

Matt it is:
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Southern Nationals would love to add you to the schedule.


steve timm

TX needs to succeed from the PDGA!!! Smilie

Matt it is secede.

Southern Nationals would love to add the event to the schedule.


steve timm

If Houston was Givin a break it is because of the long tradition of running events.And the Number of people they have who have run Worlds ,NTs ,A tiers.
I know you are pumped up and I love to see that.But like I was told along time ago (Be patient).

Matt it is secede.

Southern Nationals would love to add the event to the schedule.


steve timm

LOL I pulled a Nageeb!

That is what you get when you let your mind flow and never check what you wrote.

TX needs to succeed from the PDGA!!! Smilie

"Secede"?

*

There are pros & cons to scheduling the big events on the calendar for the year, prior to the start of the year. Since B & C tiers must schedule around the Majors, NTs, & A tiers, these need to get on the calendar first. It makes sense to come out with a complete calendar of big events all at once.

Of course, there are also downsides. For A-tiers late in the year, it may mean committing almost a year in advance. For B & C tiers early in the year, it means having to wait until just a couple months before the event to see if there'll be a conflicting NT or A. We can't get a January event on the schedule until December.

BUT

There is a potential problem with having the "full year at once" requirement, then allowing exceptions. If you do it for one, will others then wait, missing the December 1 deadline thinking they can sanction as an A-tier later in the year? Might many others decide to sanction as a B-tier and then bump up later if they can gather the money?

I have to agree, the calendar that they print up with National Tour dates, and A tiers has to be done by the start of the year, you can't just add them in.

In Houston's case for the worlds, there was a snafu and they stepped up. It was asked as a favor and they supplied the Worlds that year, it was because of lack of support to host the worlds that the team stepped up, give kudos to them, but that is not the norm, nor should it ever be.

I think that Discette hit the head on the response for this though.

The other thing that I can't help but to think is that you really need that much time to make it work, and if your that set on it, do it the first week of 2011 then you are good to go.....

I feel your pain Jerry. I plan to run a B-tier again in March (for the 9th year of the event) and as David pointed out - I'll have to wait until December before the PDGA will release the A-Tier schedule and allow me to schedule the date officially. While I can imagine how stressful it must be to commit to running an A-tier a year in advance, I think I would prefer that to being forced into last minute scheduling with the city parks department and all tournament printed items (shirts, discs, fliers, etc). It's especially frustrating in that I can't secure additional funding from the city because their deadline for assistance is early October.

I'm sure everything will work out in the long run - I just wish we, and the PDGA, could find an easier way to coordinate these events.

you could also run a c tier. what's the difference besides more fees and points?

or just run the event unsanctioned. If you are successful, they will come running. look at marshal street( now the vibram open).

I understand the PDGA needs to be careful with A tier events, but we aren't talking NT here and we are talking 6 months notice. It shouldn't be a problem. Talk to the tour manager directly by phone at the office(david) and if that doesn't work maybe try to talk to Graham. Just don't mention my name. trust me on this....:D

Just don't mention my name. trust me on this....:D
Tell him I sent you; everything should go smooth as pound of wet liver. ;)

you could also run a c tier. what's the difference .....

I understand the PDGA needs to be careful with A tier events, but we aren't talking NT here and we are talking 6 months notice. It shouldn't be a problem.....


The difference is that maybe someone else has already done their homework and followed the letter of the rules as they pertain to the event scheduling and sanctioning. You can get away with this type of behavior for B Tiers and below, but the A-Tiers are viewed with much more scrutiny (or should be, some I still question.....) and should be held to a higher standard. In fact the older PDGA minutes indicate in the last decade that A-Tiers and above were to be treated differently. They have evolved as such (rules, must be PDGA current, more holes....) so in order to ensure that the consistency is in play you should be able to request adhering to these rules.

Its not rocket science, and in some cases the A-Tiers are not as they should be, but to lax in the enforcement of the rules for sanctioning is not something that shold be done at the request of a TD, it should be in a tough situation for the PDGA to decide if an alternate plan is needed due to extreme situations....(I am thinking weather, earthquakes, oils, hurricanes, tornadoes, freak ice berg meltings, massive hornets infestations, death of TD here folks and a back up plan needs to be made should be the time to alter it)

Seems like you have a reasonable request here. Also with the
the great weather in Texas during December it just seems perfect.
I would contact Gentry directly for sure and if not go straight to Brian G.

If that does not work start your planning for 2011. Get it on the books
early. The people will come. Nothing going on in December.

Seems like you have a reasonable request here. Also with the
the great weather in Texas during December it just seems perfect.
I would contact Gentry directly for sure and if not go straight to Brian G.

If that does not work start your planning for 2011. Get it on the books
early. The people will come. Nothing going on in December.

Just got the word from Gentry. A Tier status granted. :D Very reasonable guy.

Sweet.

....and they all lived happily ever after.

Well done.

JC is the man!

Yes, I'm bored at work and going through stale threads...

Just got the word from Gentry. A Tier status granted. :D Very reasonable guy.

Agreed! He was very nice when I talked to him at Vibram before taking the NT rules exam.

Can't wait for the A-tier at LIVE OAK!!! In December no less