802.04 Artificial Devices
A. During a round, a player shall not use any artificial device that may assist in making a throw, ..... The use of devices which assist in determining distances over 10 meters, such as range finders and GPS devices are prohibited.

B. A player shall receive two penalty throws, without a warning, if, during any portion of a round, he or she is observed by two players or an official to be using or carrying an artificial device that is determined by the director to violate section 802.04 A

So with the use of iPhones becoming more and more prevalent, there are already some apps that allow you to guess at distances. The latest revision of iPhones have GPS ability. So does carrying an iPhone result in a 2 stroke penality or DQ if seen using it during the round? I believe the distance apps will be using the camera which means that if a player uses his/her camera there is a strong chance they could use the picture to cheat.

Since an iPhone is a mutli-use artificial device, it would have to be used as a device that may assist in making a throw in order for it to fall under 802.04A, IMO.

Right now, one can carry a 10m tape measure, but what is to stop someone from using it to measure distances greater than 10m? Rule 802.04.

All that to say, unless an artificial device has the sole purpose of determining distances, and may determine distances greater than 10m without being easily detected (like using a 10m tape measure twice to get 20m, for example), then just the carrying of a device that _could_ be used in such a fashion is not a de facto violation of that rule, again IMO.

From the PDGA Competition Manual:

3.1D Players are not permitted to have active cell phones or audible pagers on the course during any competitive round.

Bill and Suzette,

Neither answer addresses the quesion.

Bill, it does not say intent, it says carry for 2 strokes, and use for possible DQ.

Suzette, I can make the cell phone portion inactive (ringer off and Airplane mode off) and still use most apps and GPS functions.

If a player is able to use cell phone apps or the camera, I would consider the cell phone to be "active".

I actually would interpret an active cell phone as a phone with an audible ringer and allow phones on silent/vibrate. This would be analogous to audible pagers, but for the sake of the argument, I'll assume that it is active on the cellular network. This is clearly the intention of the rule. If an iTouch had GPS capabilities, we'd be asking the same question as it isn't a phone, but it can function as a scorekeeper, MP3 player, and not too far off as a rangefinder. Due to technology changes, this rule needs to be looked at and possibly revised.

Yeah, to allow the use of range finders.
But I've made this point before...
Bob

Jerry,

Yeah, I know, but the rule itself is inconsistent. Part A says "shall not _use_" and, as you noted, part B says "using or carrying".

I stand by what I said before. If someone is carrying a device whose sole function violates 802.04, I as a TD would have a problem. If someone had a multifunction device, there would need to be the part B "two players or an official" to witness its use as a range finder in order to have an issue.

The rule book is one thing.
The competition manual is another.

Is there a penalty for violating something in the competiton manual that isn't a rule in the rule book?

From the Comp Manual:

Section 3: Player Code of Conduct
3.1. General
A. All tournament players must abide by the information
given in the PDGA Competition Manual and the PDGA
Rules of Play. Any player in non-compliance may be
disqualified, or may not be allowed to participate in the
tournament at any time.

I personally don't have the ability to distinguish between 350' and 375' but a rangefinder won't help me as I personally don't have the skill to throw 350' instead of 375'. :)

I personally don't have the ability to distinguish between 350' and 375' but a rangefinder won't help me as I personally don't have the skill to throw 350' instead of 375'. :)

i can see how a range finder could really help someone. off the tee box, a sign that says 315 feet tells me what disc to throw, and a sign that says 295 feet tells me to grab a different disc. after that, i'm on my own to guess how far to throw which disc. a known difference of 20 feet will affect MY disc selection, and MAY give me the advantage over some one else.

Okay, so here is one reason why I posted this question. I am talking to an iPhone app company that holds ball golf courses. The great thing about their program is that once the course is in their database, you can grab it to see hole layouts, distances from tees, suggest flight paths, find your way to the next tee and a couple of other handy things. The downside is that you can also use it to determine distances from your lie to the pin. This is a function that is a big seller for ball golf. I am trying to talk them into disabling this function for disc golf courses. They have stated that they could be off, on average, by as much as 21 meters, so while it gives you a general idea, it could be off by quite a bit on approach shots.

No need to turn it off for disc golf courses. It could be quite useful for casual play. You just have to trust people not to use those apps on their phone during tournaments.