The Lifetime Eagle Membership fee of $2000 is a JOKE! Get with it and make this fee something reasonable, or make it a tiered fee based on a players age. I'll be 32 in 2009, and if I went with Am (NO MAGAZINE, cuz I rarely get mine anyway) fee of $40, it would take 50 years to make up that $2000 payment (or 31 years at $65 pro fee!). ISN'T A LIFETIME MEMBERSHIP SUPPOSED TO BE AT A SIGNIFICANT DISCOUNT?! It's not even different for AM versus PRO. I just checked the eagle club members and there are only 26!!!!!!!!!! That proves how ridiculous the fee is! And most of the top PDGA members, supporters, and names in disc golf are NOT lifetime members. I didn't see Ken Climo, Nate Doss, Avery Jenkins, Des Reading, Brian Calhoun, Chuck Kennedy, John Houck, Gary Dropcho, Don Hoffman, etc on the list!

I won't even get into whether or not the PDGA will be around in that many years, so annual increases aren't considered.

With SOOOO many people just buying the annual membership, why can't the PDGA reduce the lifetime fee, make it more attractive, but most of all make it more reasonable. The one-time $2000 from 26 people can't help out the PDGA too much, compared to $40-$75 from thousands of people on an annual basis.

A quick googling online shows that for various organizations, a lifetime fee generally is in the 10x-25x range. 50x is outrageous.

I think it's quite reasonable and would join in a flash if my wife would just look the other way long enough. Since she got laid off this year, thats not likely.

Just like membership, there are two ways to look at this:

(a) Cost/benefit analysis for how much you save (or don't) over a lifetime of membership;

(b) As an expression of deep support, at a moment in time when you can afford it, for disc golf and the PDGA.

I've always viewed it, from its inception, as (b).

Lifetime members are like super Ace club members. If you multiply what the annual Ace club or even Birdie club contributions might be in the next 20 years, it easily falls in the 10x-25x range.

The 10x-25x figure is based on normal current membership costs, not what an elevated membership might cost over the next 20 years.

I realize that. But the lifetime membership in our case was not intended to be a great discount but just as much of a donation and financial support more like Ace and Birdie clubs. I'm pretty sure that was the orientation when I heard the discussion at a Summit meeting.

Lifetime members are like super Ace club members. If you multiply what the annual Ace club or even Birdie club contributions might be in the next 20 years, it easily falls in the 10x-25x range.



dont know if that comparison flies chuck

comparing 'uber' memberships to regular ones don't equate in the equation when comparing to other orgs like he did.

Besides... if that were the case then why wouldn't you just keep renewing your ace/birdie memberships so you could @ least get the free stuff (disc, shirt, whatever) instead of just getting 2 discs w/ the eagle option (assuming you only get 2 discs up front and not each year... maybe that would be something for the PDGA to do... custom LIFER disc every year as a reminder thank you)

Just passing on what I believe the original intent was for the Lifetime membership. It is what it is and some have done it. I haven't looked at the list closely but my thought would be that those who have done so were older and had the money and not necessarily the remaining life expectancy to justify it on that basis. Some of those were also granted by the Board such as Jeff Homburg for all of his volunteer efforts doing the tech measurements all those years.

I didn't vote because none of the answers reasonated with me. I do not think it is intended to be a discount. Dedicated players with a reasonable amount of disposable cash can make a statement about their love of both the game and organization by making the large donation. In exchange for the large donation they do not have to send in a new membership every year. I don't think people join public radio at a large level simply because they get the DVD box set and the fancy dinner at a local restaurant. They do so because they strongly believe in pubic radio. I have a kid in college and another soon to follow. I love public radio but love it at the commuter mug level. The same goes for the PDGA. If things go very very well in my life and I have less built in expenses in my life I might get the DVD set for public radio and consider a lifetime membership in the PDGA. If I was able to give that much I wouldn't really care about the schwag.

All organizations rely on supporters with means. I am glad that there are radio listeners and disc golfers who have the ability to support on a greater level than me.

I am deeply annoyed by this amount, in part because I DO want to support my favorite past time ever. $2000 is just plain ridiculous. It creates a gap in the core demographics of the sport. It is not something the average player can afford (probably not something 98% of the players would not have to save or budget severely for). The fee should be reasonable if for no other reason than to let the average player afford it! What does it say for an organization if their lifetime membership fee is unattainable by nearly all their members?! The 26 lifetime members, of which I don't recall your name either, prove it's a joke. 26 of 37133 ever players is 0.07%!!!! All I can say is WTF(?!) on that one

I get philantropy, karma, giving more than recieving, all that good stuff. But even with the gracious attitude I have toward giving, the fee is ridiculous, and it does annnoy me greatly!

12765 current and 37133 total members of the PDGA. I'd take a guess that the 'hay-day' of the PDGA haw been 1995 thru now, and we'll just round it to the past 15 years. So, only roughly 1/3 of members stay renewed and current. I don't feel like digging for the reports, but how many new or renewals were received each of those years? And how many of the current players have stayed current for more than 5 years? Or the average number of years a current player has been current? (Chuck, you're the statistics man, [but I did notice not a lifetime member])

I just don't get it. I don't see any 'loss' of revenue in lowering the fee by 50% or more. Even at 10x the annual fee (i.e. $50 x 10 = $500), most players will not spend that much either. I'm guessing the HUGE majority will pay the annual fee on a year by year basis, and that will continue to be the main source of fees income. Have you seen the demographics lately, or the typical player on the course? High School and College-age males don't want to spend $500 on a 'membership card' for anywhere other than the champagne room at the gentlemen's club. For me it's not about the tangible goods, I don't want the gifts either. I want a reasonable priced lifetime membership to show my support and enthusiasm for the sport.

I would LOVE to be a lifetime member! No way in HELL I will pay $2000 though!

Tim,

how about taking an amount that you can handle and use it locally, at your local course? it would take millions of donations to the PDGA to get $100 out to every course at our current rate of disbursement. (thats not a criticism, btw, to anyone who thinks it is)

your events compensate the pdga quite nicely. they have a groundskeeper at their "international center" courses. does your local course? i suspect that local courses need our, the players, money more than the PDGA does. the PDGA will get theirs other ways.

showing your love locally will go a long long way. it will be visible to those who play on your local courses. it will be apparent to those governmental bodies responsible for most of our local courses.

Chuck is correct on the purpose of the lifetime membership. It was a much higher level of donation meant to be a statement of support, not a discount membership to save money. Based on the $150 Ace club membership I normally choose to pay, I could possibly break even on a lifetime membership, but then would not get the annual disc and surprise that goes with the Ace club membership.

If I hadn't been laid off, I probably would have joined the Eagle club last year. I am afraid it will be quite some time before I have any substantial amount of disposable cash, even if I find a job at my previous salary.

I take every amount I can afford and use it on my local course. I can say that running the WPDGC means much more money out of my pocket than I had ever imagined, especially with increased fuel and raw material costs associated with construction and maintenance. And that's along with my point. I'd spend $2000 on my course (or any course) LONG before I would on an organization membership. However, to run sanctioned events on my course, receive discounted entry fees for the small amount of sanctioned events I do play in, and stay part of the 'network' of disc golf afforded through the PDGA, I would want to be a lifetime member, if the fee were attractive.

So, how about this - join the WPDGC for $150, and I'll renew your membership AND give you a CFR fundraiser disc (not a plain old dx). That offer stands for anyone and everyone.

The fee should be reasonable if for no other reason than to let the average player afford it! What does it say for an organization if their lifetime membership fee is unattainable by nearly all their members?!



This is key.

Many of the long-term members are the same ones who frequently volunteer time and money.
A good portion of the Lifetime Members are from this same group.
I've been a member for 10 years and see the same names over and over supporting our sport.
When so few donate so much, it is clear something is unbalanced.

Sure, Chuck's point of allowing folks to contribute makes sense if all things were equal, but when most of the membership cannot afford the highest tier, it can create an elitist group with feelings of entitlement as well as alienate the younger members and those with low incomes.

The Lifetime Membership does not grow the sport.

Tim,

If Lifetime membership were about saving money then I believe the PDGA board that introduced the plan would have chosen a different amount. Like it has been said though, Lifetime Membership in the PDGA is not about anything other than showing support. I feel this is true in any organization. Other organizations set their fees according to their needs and IF they offer lifetime memberships, they do so for those that want to support the organization in a more financial way than just being a regular member. Others want to support their organization by giving more time. If you are a true supporter of the PDGA, then give what you can, time or money. Most people don't have both. However, those that give their time are much more valuable than those of us who were able to give a little money to show our support.

Some of us that are members deeply appreciate the givers of time. You are the ones that run tournaments and keep the courses looking pristine. Thanks for what you do. Your time is more valuable than money, you only have it once. You can get money anytime.

Tom Lowry
PDGA #2446
Lifetime Member

When I have an extra $2000 bucks to give to disc-golf, I will buy baskets for a new course near my house.

Excellent response.
Wouldn't that be the best use for $2K?
If a member donates that kind of cash, perhaps the PDGA should give the money to the whatever nearby club is currently ready to install a course.
The donor might then be able to name the course.

Seriously, who wouldn't want to propagate this sport in such a direct way?
You can have a cool jacket and let your friends drool over it,
OR
You can have a course built and have your friends all play it!

The Disc Golf Foundation has their matching baskets program: www.discgolffoundation.net/links.html (http://www.discgolffoundation.net/links.html)

The IDGC Endowment Fund: www.pdga.com/files/documents/IDGCEndowmentFundBrochure.pdf (http://www.pdga.com/files/documents/IDGCEndowmentFundBrochure.pdf)

Both need and accept donations that go directly toward baskets and course construction.

Excellent response.
Wouldn't that be the best use for $2K?
If a member donates that kind of cash, perhaps the PDGA should give the money to the whatever nearby club is currently ready to install a course.
The donor might then be able to name the course.

Seriously, who wouldn't want to propagate this sport in such a direct way?
You can have a cool jacket and let your friends drool over it,
OR
You can have a course built and have your friends all play it!






Or some of us just do both.

I have designed, paid for and installed 3 private 18 hole courses in the last 2 years. If you are ever in Duncan, OK give me a call and I'll take you out to play one or all of them.

The company I own has also donated CASH to the purse of at least 5 tournaments each year starting in 2004. About $5,000 each year in total cash donations. Ask some of the folks that play these events if they like the jacket.

What other complaints do you have about the way people spend THEIR OWN money.

You guys might want to consider finding a few ways to enhance the sport rather than worrying over a couple of bucks that are not yours or that you don't have.

You are absolutely correct, Chuck.
I was just trying to suggest an additional alternative to have cash immediately and directly benefit the sport.


What other complaints do you have about the way people spend THEIR OWN money.



Never really complained about that - just made some observations and suggestions.
I also tried to point out that our sport depends (too much) on the few folks like you who inject a huge amount of work into the sport when most cannot or do not.
I am very glad you are privileged enough to have the time and money to donate to disc golf. Thank you for your dedication.

You are absolutely correct, Chuck.
I was just trying to suggest an additional alternative to have cash immediately and directly benefit the sport.


What other complaints do you have about the way people spend THEIR OWN money.



Never really complained about that - just made some observations and suggestions.
I also tried to point out that our sport depends (too much) on the few folks like you who inject a huge amount of work into the sport when most cannot or do not.
I am very glad you are privileged enough to have the time and money to donate to disc golf. Thank you for your dedication.



i agree that I didn't see it as people complaining how the PDGA spends other peoples money... more than some would likely pay for lifetime memberships if the cost was justifiable (thus helping the PDGA and the member)

If lifetime membership were $1000 I'd jump all over it.

If lifetime membership were $1000 I'd jump all over it.



I would jump on it if it were around $750, but I might actually consider it at $1000.

If lifetime membership were $1000 I'd jump all over it.



I would jump on it if it were around $750, but I might actually consider it at $1000.



Yeah and at $750 they are receiving 10 years in fees that they can put to use NOW! Also many of those players may have ended up not renewing at some point so the PDGA will be able to keep its current membership up.

Oh well if you expect the PDGA to know how to use its money you haven't been a member long enough. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Again, with the new year approaching, I'll throw it out there. If you believe courses benefit much more from your money than the PDGA does, contact WPDGC. $150 and we'll renew your membership AND send you a CFR disc! For Pros, this is a better deal than AMS. Either way WPDGC and you still come out ahead, and the money directly benefits the course.

Check out tons of course info on the websites in my signature. Contact info on my webpage.

Throw in an extra $100 to be used directly in the installation and beautification of all 27 holes, and you'll get to design and name your very own permanent tee sign for any available hole on the course.

Better yet, renew through YOUR LOCAL CLUB and benefit disc golf in your own community!