i love the idea of a complaint department
all gripes go here

want to call someone a dippoop
say it here
:cool::cool::p :p :cool::cool:

Thanks Slack. I'll go first.

I've been a TDSA TD for over a year now and the club has still not offered to pay for my fuel and travel expenses to and from my minis. :(....What is the deal??? :confused:

Here's another....

If I sign up new members, why don't I get paid a "finders fee" commision? :(

Where is our "TD of the Year Award" and why can't we at least get a picture of what it looks like?

Who will be my role model now that my role model is gone? :confused:

To be considered a "Wise" man, why must one talk out their butt and have to own a Chevy Avalanche? :confused: ;)

Why are there no free "dog treats" given away at a Treat event? :confused: /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Why does Martin Norris never invite his brother Chuck to be a part of the TDSA?

Why does Doc "The True World Champion" never carry a first aid kit in his bag?

Why does Jay Slack maintain a job when he should be "slacking"? :confused:

Why does Gary Nail never have a hammer available when you need one? ;)

Who is spreading rumours that a 'in-good-standing" TDSA member stole a basket at Haikey? :confused:

Why isn't Aarron Swagert on "The Ultimate Fighter"?

Now that was some funny stuff!

I'd loved to seen the look on his face when the cops got there. :D

Why does Wayne Forest not own a chainsaw? /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Why do you just stand at the fence and bark all the time?

Why does the self proclaimed King of Dogs only have cats at home?

Now that was some funny stuff!

I'd loved to seen the look on his face when the cops got there. :D



Good thing he is a legal citizen. Otherwise he might have got deported. ;)

Why does the self proclaimed King of Dogs only have cats at home?



Nobody can eat just one.

On top of that. Cats don't bark anytime company comes over. :p

Why does Steve Naegele carry a can of frosting in his bag? ;)

Why are there no bikini babes to bring out the cash for the final two on poker night? :confused:

Who is spreading rumours that a 'in-good-standing" TDSA member stole a basket at Haikey? :confused:



Whoever this [censored] is needs to come correct.... :mad:

F-liars can....... to who it is that said it was not on a stand and leaning against my garage wall you can go :oyourself.

And this is a very good reason to please update ALL of your living addresses with the club. :D
That way if there is a news letter you all might get one. :o
And if a TD's address is reported as having a basket then we will know that it most likely should be there and is not stolen! :eek:

The club shouldn't pay for stamps.

Members should be able to pick up a newsletter at a mini. On top of that, I want a full page of space so I can tell it like it is. :cool:

Also, I think there might be a stolen basket in Twoputt's back yard. :o....Somebody needs to call CSI. :D

I really didn't mind the cops showing up, but if there is a rumor going around that I stole it than...nevermind.

Give me the reward money and they can have the basket. :D

The club shouldn't pay for stamps.

Members should be able to pick up a newsletter at a mini. On top of that, I want a full page of space so I can tell it like it is. :cool:

Also, I think there might be a stolen basket in Twoputt's back yard. :o....Somebody needs to call CSI. :D


Yeah right Dog, :D
We cannot even get them to pick up mini schedules and read them most of the time /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
It is the silly season of winter when golf slows down and folks have nothing better to do than verbally or textually abuse each other. :o
In another two or three months every one will be too busy and tired to fight on the boards. :D

I'm not trying to abuse you Martin because I'm afraid that your brother Chuck might show up at my house. ;)

If there were a newsletter I don't think it is our duty to make sure they pick them up at mini's. All we need to do is let them know they are available and the ones that might want one can take one.

To me sending them out by mail would be a waste of money.

If they want one then they should come and get one. If they don't show up at mini's then they should update their address and let us know like the PDGA now requires if you want the magazine or not....Although ours would be free.

As far as fighting on the board goes I don't think anything has been "over the top" as of late and if you feel like it has then wait until I renew John Green's membership. :D

I am not complaining at all, but you know that it would be nice if everyone who wants a news letter published would contribute to it from time to time.
Unlike you some people find it easy to gripe and carp but do not actually do anything constructive. :(
By the way what 18 holes will we get to play on your course for the last round of the spring fling? :confused:
Is Standing Bear going to order a layout change before the first weekend of April or will things be the same as always till after Chandler Stock 2008. :cool:

I just want my own column to gripe about Twoputt. You just give us a report on whose got their hand in the cookie jar and let us know who is showing up and who is not. ;)

We don't need a drama report. We can get that right here. :D

As far as Chandler goes, if the park opens up by then it will be the normal course because they're not planning on new construction for still another year. All this is putting a crimp on the new nine. First he told me to wait until the crew collected all the leaves off the ground and now I got to wait until the course opens up which according to him may be a long time. :(

awesome stuff

what about some good ole fashion name calling ?
real bickering back and forth
that is what i am looking
some he said she said

o and was it a tdsa who notified the police about the basket in thongs yard

o and was it a tdsa who notified the police about the basket in thongs yard



I don't think so. It was probably a person driving by or something. At least there are people keeping an eye out.

pdga's list

First Last Penalty Starting Date Ending Date Infraction
J.D. Hazel Probation 6/26/2008 9/26/2008 Link to Profanity
Joe Anttila Probation 6/17/2008 9/17/2008 Account sharing
Mike Gordon Probation 6/17/2008 9/17/2008 Profanity
Keith Johnson Probation 6/7/2008 9/7/2008 Profanity
Josh Charlton Probation 5/27/2008 8/27/2008 Profanity
Rich Myers Probation 5/16/2008 8/16/2008 Personal Attack
Andy Bawol Probation 5/14/2008 8/14/2008 Personal Attack
Mike Kernan Suspension 5/14/2008 5/14/2009 Personal Attack
Sjur Soleng Probation 5/12/2008 8/12/2008 Link to Profanity
Travis Greenway Probation 5/9/2008 8/9/2008 Link to Profanity
Charles Schwab Probation 4/23/2008 7/23/2008 Off suspension
Larry Thompson Probation 4/22/2008 7/22/2008 Personal Attack
Hawk Corrick Suspension 4/21/2008 7/21/2008 Personal Attack
Jeff Peters Probation 4/4/2008 7/4/2008 Offensive content
Daemon Stahlin Suspension 3/5/2008 3/5/2009 Personal Attack
Rhett Stroh Suspension 12/21/2007 12/21/2008 Personal Attack


i was amazed that no one from tulsa was on this list
or is t dogg still have tulsa status
:(

He is my doubles partner...

...so I count him in.

See how Rhett Stroh is on a years suspension. :D

I think that it is hilarious considering that he was the one constantly scolding/editing the Tulsans when he was a moderator.

<font color="blue"> [personal attack removed] </font>

That would be a pane of glass so to speak.

See how Rhett Stroh is on a years suspension. :D

I think that it is hilarious considering that he was the one constantly scolding/editing the Tulsans when he was a moderator.



If y'all care to remember properly, I was attempting to make the message board a more open place for more members to come to. As in all members of the PDGA and their families, not just the PDGA members who like to swear. It seemed like a good idea at the time.

My initial mission that angered the Tulsa-ites so badly was simple: try to eliminate the posting of the eff-word and the ess-word. It was a pretty simple mission. I wasn't targeting the Tulsa crowd or the Arkie crowd or the South Texas crowd. Those were just the groups that took on the counter-mission of trying to keep posting the eff and ess words because I guess they didn't want more PDGA members utilizing the PDGA message board.

So get over it, I wasn't targeting you. I would do pretty much a daily search of the entire message board (easy to do using the search function like how I found this post), first searching for the eff-word, then the ess-word, then the common filter-defeating misspellings, then the less common, and every once is a while I'd make up some of my own. Your Okie state coordinator was a great source of creative misspellings.

It didn't work. This MB sucks for the average PDGA member who just wants info and doesn't care to attack the PDGA or argue with Chuck or Pat. Y'all won. :D

We didn't win, as you put it Rhett, but some of us did move over to Discgolfers r us. It is a completely peacefull environment. Give it a try, you may like it. Personally, the only thing of value that this site now offers are player ratings and a schedule. ;)

i was amazed that no one from tulsa was on this list
or is t dogg still have tulsa status
:(


better check again...this guy is in the doghouse until 3/29/09 :p congrats red???!!!! :D
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k266/garyE500/twisted%20flyer%20open%2008/TFO08-100.jpg

till 3-29-09

How does someone get put on probation for a post from June?? The mods are really reaching now. Absolutely amazing. These mods have nothing better to do..they need to get a life. I'm guessing this thread was brought back just for this reason...who was it that was put on suspension earlier?
Quite a coincidence if you ask me
Freakin losers :o

till 3-29-09

How does someone get put on probation for a post from June?? The mods are really reaching now. Absolutely amazing. These mods have nothing better to do..they need to get a life. I'm guessing this thread was brought back just for this reason...who was it that was put on suspension earlier?
Quite a coincidence if you ask me
Freakin losers :o


there ya go penny i changed the date :p i'll probably still be writing 08 thru january anyway...and i didn't even pay attention to the date of reds post! why did they wait so long--- hmmmm---does make you wonder???

I hear ya Gary. It usually takes me a while to switch years/gears. :D

As soon as Rhett had access again, he pulled up this thread, all the while knowing Lagrassa would be watching him. It wasn't hard to find at that point. The PDGA just keeps getting better and better. :o

From another thread:
The PDGA: You're going to suck on it...and like it.

The mods and past mods of this board ar nothing but a bunch of
http://www.charlesandhudson.com/archives/hand-tools-list-important.jpg

<font color="blue"> [post containing profanity removed] </font>

^^^^^^^^
Another one looking for the probation list. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

^^^^^^^^
Another one looking for the probation list. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif



its the end of the year who knows i may just save the money

my pdga dues are to support the growth of disc golf
not worry that i may have to go the principles office :cool:

i like dgfrus none of that petty bs

<font color="blue"> [personal attack &amp; profanity removed] </font>

Penny,
I am w/you. This is the past, and my theory is who gives a sheot about it, but evidently it po'd some people off. I will just watch and cannot wait to play some of them oki courses in a few short months.

Peace
:) :) :)

PS ALL you oki boys have a great NYs!

Get ready folks, the new rules go in efect starting tomorrow. After reading the new rules, I have come to the conclusion that at least the last 4 posts on this thread are in violation of the new rules. Most of us are gulitly of rule violations of 1, 2, 3, 4, 7, 9 and 10. :o

Enjoy your new 2009 discussion board! :o:mad:

PDGA Discussion Board Rules - The following will not be allowed:

1. Profanity (including creative misspellings to circumvent the profanity filter)
2. Personal attacks - namecalling, insults, and harassment
3. Physical threats against other members (obvious or veiled)
4. Materials, or links to materials which are not suitable for a minor
5. Account sharing - allowing others to post under your account name
6. Discussion about the solicitation, distribution or manufacture of illegal drugs. This includes posting images of illegal drugs
7. Links to downloads of copyrighted material such as music, movies, TV shows, etc.
8. Causing harm to the message board - inserting malicious code, posting of large files, and/or any other behavior that disrupts normal performance of the message board. This includes spamming (multiple posting of an identical or similar post on one or more of our forums in an attempt to force the message on people who would not otherwise choose to receive it. Alternatively, multiple posting of a nonsense message or "bumping" of old threads for no reason)
9. Any other material deemed offensive by a PDGA member, and agreed by a moderator and/or Executive Director.
10. Constructive criticism is welcomed, however derogatory or negative posts about the PDGA and/or it's members are prohibited, and will not be tolerated on this association funded forum.

looks like another reason to go to DISCGOLFERSRUS

<font color="blue"> [post containing profanity removed] </font>

<font color="blue"> [post containing profanity removed] </font>



Thats 5 vilolations Jay = 1 year suspension :o:D

Well this might just mean I will not be renewing. :(

As a member for several years now I've seen the PDGA go from a member driven fun organization to what appears now to be the creation of an incorporated few with nothing but money on their minds.

Some of these rules I would agree with but with some of these new ones (no anti-PDGA statements) it appears that the conservative right is still mad that Obama was elected and is trying to push their will to control what ever it can.

As a new Admin in the TDSA, I find it hard to continue to volunteer at PDGA events or support an NT or any other PDGA event when the PDGA is now taking steps to eliminate criticism of its organization by its own members.

I find it foolish now to take a weeks vacation to sit out in the heat to run water for an AM or Pro Worlds should it ever return to Tulsa.

I feel these new rules by the PDGA is just another way to provide less responsibility to the PDGA membership and create a group of �yes members� that blindly follow the vision of the few who�s only apparent goal now is to say �Do as I say,�..Don�t do is I do.�

IMO I think the TDSA should take steps to divert some of the cash it pulls in from it's members and non-members away from the PDGA and improve it's website communications and stop bowing down to an organization that now appears to take more than it gives back. The PDGA did not grow on it's own. It grew out of large and small DG clubs that want to grow the sport and have fun doing it.

The TDSA does not punish it's membership for derogatory statements and still the TDSA is respected within it's region. In other words. "We don't need no stinkin badges." Our membership is what makes us great, not our leaders.

As for Rhett,��why he appears a year after his suspension to reply to something long forgotten, I don�t know. I remember when he was a mod and I read some of the post surrounding his suspension which I really didn�t agree with. I guess now that he�s back we all have to watch out because though he may no longer be a mod, I�m sure if some of us step on his tail too hard he won�t hesitate to call the MB police on us. :confused:

If it weren't for the NT in Pawhuska and the Worlds in KC, I would seriously consider not renewing this year. I have played in SN events and loved them. Their year end Championships were the BOMB! They take a $1 from each players entries through out the year and give it to the finals for payout. If the PDGA would do this, instead of spending money on some of the things that they currently do, then the Worlds would be a $100,000 purse. But we can't do that, we need to keep those PAID volunteers on staff, the IDGC, with courses paid for from tournament fees, consultants, magazines that fail, paid travel to events, paid travel to boondoggle summits, ect.......... :(

Personally I would love to see Oklahoma invite the Southern Nationals to our State and for us to promote their events.

If it weren't for the NT in Pawhuska and the Worlds in KC, I would seriously consider not renewing this year. I have played in SN events and loved them. Their year end Championships were the BOMB! They take a $1 from each players entries through out the year and give it to the finals for payout. If the PDGA would do this, instead of spending money on some of the things that they currently do, then the Worlds would be a $100,000 purse. But we can't do that, we need to keep those PAID volunteers on staff, the IDGC, with courses paid for from tournament fees, consultants, magazines that fail, paid travel to events, paid travel to boondoggle summits, ect.......... :(

Personally I would love to see Oklahoma invite the Southern Nationals to our State and for us to promote their events.



[censored] it's been a long time since I've been on here, but I feel like I should weigh in.

The Southern Nationals is an awesome series and Oklahoma should asolutely be incorporated in with SNDG. Especially since the finals were in Arkansas and some people got to see how good they are. I played the Southern Nats Finals in Mobile AL and it was incredible. It was a Major Tourney quality event with the price tag of your typical weekend tourney. Jim Orum started it about 12 years ago and it has bloomed to a very successful series.

I suggested to Jim that the Lodge is the perfect setting for a Southern Nationals Finals some day. I think Jim has been soured a little with all the PDGA red tape, and hoops you have to jump through to make a big event happen that the Southern Nationals may be something that is more suited for what is going on in Oklahoma.

The PDGA has it's place but a good healthy competitor is good for business. You never know when a small series like Southern Nationals of 1998 turns out to be the giant that it will be in 2010. The Players obviously like the SN events and don't mind forking over the extra $1 because they see the results of it in the end. People aren't seeing where their money is going with the PDGA so it gets frustrating.

Well said Kev!

With as strong as our State is, especially Tulsa, I thionk the players here would finaly see the benefits of a true players series. The SN seems to cater to the players and not a corporate office and its trappings. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Since you're now in the heart of SN country, we need to talk some more. I am SOLD on their system, I have seen it first hand. :D

Kev, You are right about my sentiments toward the PDGA. I spoke with Brian Graham about 2 weeks ago and he told me at that time that he does not waste his time viewing the message board because it is primarily a bunch of malcontents and he doesn't feel it is worth his time. Personally, I think the message board should be reviewed periodically by all of the PDGA staff or at least one concerned person on staff to occassionally weigh in and keep in touch with the people. By browsing through different sites on the board I was able to gleen a lot of information about the sport and the concerns of disc golfers. I don't think that the governing body of any organization should set itself up in Ivory towers and simply ignore the concerns of the people that they represent or categorically classify all of them as malcontents. I watched the clip on Ripley's believe it or not about Ed Headrick the other day and admired the selfless effort demonstrated by this gentleman to promote a fledgling sport that he had such a passion for. I try to model our efforts here at The Lodge after this same philosophy. If you look at the amount of money that we are dedicating to build a disc golf resort for you guys, the disc golfers, and then consider the payback from this sport on the amount invested, you would have to assume that I am either (1)crazy as a loon or (2)genuinely interested in the furtherance of the sport and willing to make great sacrifices to promote it to youth and newcomers alike. There are actually several reasons for doing what we are here at the lodge with respect to disc golf. We had the land and having been involved with youth all our lives, Deb and I began thinking of some way to create a venue where people, old, young or middle aged (like me) could come and enjoy the country, provide healthy activities and create a very relaxing and hospitable atmosphere. Profiteering was never a consideration and in fact very far from reality.
I have said it all along and I will say it again, the reason we are doing what we are is because of you, the disc golf community. In fact, if the Southern Nationals would consider using our place for their tournament, we would donate the greens fees and camping fees back to the pot as our further support of the tournament. The only reason we even charge greens fees at tournaments anyhow is just to help defray some of the substantial expense and labor of maintaining the property. :cool:

The thought just occurred to me, VOLUNTEER LABOR!
My Gosh, it almost overwhelmed me!
All of the support The Lodge has enjoyed from the TULSA DISC SPORTS ASSOCIATION, the staggering amount of time devoted by volunteers annually to promote the sport of disc golf worldwide simply because of their love of the sport.
My own experience as a newbie has been met with huge support, patience, understanding and mentorship.
FOR LOVE OF THE GAME - (somebody otta make a movie, maybe get Kevin Costner to star in it) JOE ROTAN travels probably tens of thousands of miles a year to promote the sport. DAVE WISE, takes the time any time I call him with a question about something to explain or teach me about things. Devoted a tremendous amount of time to creating and organizing the team event. WAYNE FOREST, a walking encyclopedia of all things disc golf and very respected in the disc golf community, even helped hang insulation from scaffolding in the clubhouse, thanks Wayne. TnT, MICHAEL AND ANDREW TREAT, sincere, capable, loyal, devoted, the true epitomy of a selfless disc golfer. GARY NAIL, the camera guy, follows the sport, at his own expense, so that he can capture the true spirit of disc golf and record it on film. Thanks, Gary. Chris Wagle, Brad Hoi, Dave Pennekamp, Jay Slack, Joyle Deering, Billy Juby, how many countless others have come up to the lodge to help with our efforts on weekends when you could have been doing something else, much thanks guys. And, last but by no means least, KEVIN McCOY, we will always be grateful to you for bringing disc golf to us. You are the MAN! This is what lures people to disc golf, who wouldn't want to be a part of this community. THANKS to everyone and may the new year bring much success for each of you in all that you endeavor. HAPPY NEW YEAR,

THE LODGE CREW

last day of 2008, and Furdog, you whinny [censored]!!!! :eek:, you "for the tax people" should fall in line with the socialist movement of today. You know you send pm's to the pdga board, so I am surprised of your take. Maybee my actions and you watching the great Wise in action, has taught you some lessons. :( don't respond, cuz I won't, and they may not let me :mad:tough [censored]. anyway, another post to make. :o

Ditto to all that Jim.. God bless you and all the TDSA for all the work.. I know I cussed earlier, but I have 2sides :D.. Quick note*** Kev, the coffee ROCS&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; all should try breakfast.... And Jim , I enjoyed meeting Ed at the 96 worlds with Kev, when I found his glasses on another course, he thanked me and gave an Ed card.. :Dsweet// Have a happy Ne3w Year.

Yeah, that's right. I pay $40 a year just to use this message board. And yes I voted for Obama but I haven't seen any new tax yet. All I know is that I've lost $15 grand so far in my 401k thanks to you "pyramid scheme" people on the red side.

How much have you lost working for the city?

And as far as "action" goes I haven't seen any from you lately either. Why can't you be more like Standingbear? :D

So far this week Andrew Treat, Jake Regier, &amp; Jay Slack have hit the probabation list. I guess I'll probably be next.

More is more buddy and if you want me to share the wealth with you then get in line. I'm offering free bail outs at Chandlerstock this year and based on your business skills, you sound like your in need of one. ;)

Jim, you should get ahold of Jim Orum (originator of the SN Series)........you and him would get along great, might be kinda cool if a NT was also a SN qualifier :)

Alma Greens and Hell on the Border have been SN events for awhile now and will definitely continue as SN qualifiers

biggest reason we dual sanction with the PDGA........it seems to attract players

non-pdga sanctioned seems to draw 30ish, sanction it with the PDGA and they seem to draw 70+ (here in Ft. Smith)

SNPC are in Little Rock for the 2nd year in a row, always on Labor Day week-end (Sept. 5 &amp; 6 for 2009)

I believe that Memphis is trying to host SNPC for 2010

There is also a Southern Nationals Am Championship (Aug 22-23, 2009, Hartselle, Alabama)

also traditionally there has been a SN Doubles Championship

the event value for the Am's was close to $17,000 in 2008 (114 players)
the pro's was over $28,000 (140ish players).....several of us witnessed that event first hand and can attest for it's superior quality beyond just a fat purse

each of the $1 collected in SN events stays with the division that paid it in plus the SN has a great bagtag program that adds cash plus the fundraising that the host clubs obtain

I'm not ready to just write the PDGA off, it's the players that make my decision to support the PDGA thru sanctioning

personally I will continue as a member, because these things that are wrong with the PDGA will have a better chance to be addressed and fixed from the inside than the outside and I have too much time invested to just abandon the PDGA

I suggest to e-mail the PDGA with your constructive critisisms, it will more likely be addressed than posting here

that's the part that bothers me also about #10 in the new MB rules, any form of critisism is to subjective, what may be viewed as legitimate or as constructive can likely be viewed as negative depending on who is making that decision

kinda ironic, Bill Trousdale was telling me about back in the 80's when he was a regional coordinator with the PDGA and Oklahoma and Texas basically quit sanctioning and he couldn't get any PDGA events out of those areas, Now in his area (Central Arkansas) it seems that the events there don't want to PDGA sanction yet still get great turn-outs (and pay-outs)

Niles, Michigan on the course, who woulda thought we would have bumped into Mr.Hedrick there. lol That was also the 1st time I met him. I got to chat with Ed a few times before he passed and he was a cool DUDE for sure.

Deb just pointed out to me that I did not acknowledge John and Carla Barton in my earlier post. I think it may because I have come to think of them more as family than volunteers. Anytime and EVERY time I need help doing something here, they are always the first to show up ready to work. Thanks John, Carla, Zach and Austin, you guys are the best. Happy New Year.

So far this week Andrew Treat, Jake Regier, &amp; Jay Slack have hit the probabation list. I guess I'll probably be next.




go for it maybe this could be the new thing, the club with the most members on probation :D

Hey Kev, can you hook me up with Jim Orum? I would like to meet him. Maybe you could give him my number or vice versa.

So far this week Andrew Treat, Jake Regier, &amp; Jay Slack have hit the probabation list. I guess I'll probably be next.




go for it maybe this could be the new thing, the club with the most members on probation :D



No, just go to DGRUS, freedom of speech still exists there. :D

All I have to say about the PDGA is that this was the first year of an almost complete overhaul. There are so many new faces in new places and there have been some growing pains.

I'm always going to renew because I play many sanctioned events. They kind of have us by the nads on that one. With the Magazine flop this year, it made the jump to $75 a little more frustrating.

You can check out Southern Nats info at SNDG.org (http://SNDG.org)

Jim you have mail

you are all talk little [censored]!!!! And I wouldnt share my $$ GAINS or losses with yo chump azzz. But I do know you better have Standingbear get your firewood this year, cuz you get none of my wood. :o:p

I agree that the PDGA needs our patience right now. It is just that from a business perspective, I see weaknesses and the impression I keep getting is that, Hey, I have this job. Sometimes it takes an outsider looking in to recognize opportunity missed. I just wonder about the negotiating skills of the PDGA. Is the business experience and certainly the degree of business acumen to conduct business opportunities diplomatically with companies who have the ability to truly help with the growth of this sport, as proficient as they should be. :confused:

10. Constructive criticism is welcomed, however derogatory or negative posts about the PDGA and/or it's members are prohibited, and will not be tolerated on this association funded forum.

Unbelievable. On another note: Why couldn't the magazine be more like SI or maybe even Golf Digest instead of Hightlights for Kids? What is up with the giant font?

I agree that the PDGA needs our patience right now. It is just that from a business perspective, I see weaknesses and the impression I keep getting is that, Hey, I have this job. Sometimes it takes an outsider looking in to recognize opportunity missed. I just wonder about the negotiating skills of the PDGA. Is the business experience and certainly the degree of business acumen to conduct business opportunities diplomatically with companies who have the ability to truly help with the growth of this sport, as proficient as they should be. :confused:



Jim,
First of all you and your family have a wonderful NYs. Also, remember that this business/discgolf game is growing. Things will be run as the PTB(powers to be) sees it. You jumped on the seen and now see some of the politics. These will never leave you and... Best thing you and all can do is put on the BEST NT that the PDGA has ever seen across the country. That is a tall order. Not surmountable but a tall order. It all takes $$s, sweat, belief, and wanting to to the best you can. Yes, you will definitely learn, ask KMAC or the
WISE man. On a similar note,I have been reading about the players cup. This is sad, but reality. One of the best venues that a tourny could be held, and is NO longer an option. Your land and venue are prime for this, but the longer you are in this game, the more you will see the good in people, rather than the negs., which are always there. It will all work out. Stay foucused and all you s/b concerned with is 4 months from now when the big boys roll into THE LODGE. To me I believe you and the LODGE will be the BOMB for its first NT.


Peace and happy NYs to your whole bunch.


Ron ;)

Peace,

I think I got 1 copy this year.
I think....
Its been so long since I have seen a mag. :(
D.P. :D

Well this might just mean I will not be renewing. :(

As a member for several years now I've seen the PDGA go from a member driven fun organization to what appears now to be the creation of an incorporated few with nothing but money on their minds.

Some of these rules I would agree with but with some of these new ones (no anti-PDGA statements) it appears that the conservative right is still mad that Obama was elected and is trying to push their will to control what ever it can.

As a new Admin in the TDSA, I find it hard to continue to volunteer at PDGA events or support an NT or any other PDGA event when the PDGA is now taking steps to eliminate criticism of its organization by its own members.

I find it foolish now to take a weeks vacation to sit out in the heat to run water for an AM or Pro Worlds should it ever return to Tulsa.

I feel these new rules by the PDGA is just another way to provide less responsibility to the PDGA membership and create a group of �yes members� that blindly follow the vision of the few who�s only apparent goal now is to say �Do as I say,�..Don�t do is I do.�

IMO I think the TDSA should take steps to divert some of the cash it pulls in from it's members and non-members away from the PDGA and improve it's website communications and stop bowing down to an organization that now appears to take more than it gives back. The PDGA did not grow on it's own. It grew out of large and small DG clubs that want to grow the sport and have fun doing it.

The TDSA does not punish it's membership for derogatory statements and still the TDSA is respected within it's region. In other words. "We don't need no stinkin badges." Our membership is what makes us great, not our leaders.

As for Rhett,��why he appears a year after his suspension to reply to something long forgotten, I don�t know. I remember when he was a mod and I read some of the post surrounding his suspension which I really didn�t agree with. I guess now that he�s back we all have to watch out because though he may no longer be a mod, I�m sure if some of us step on his tail too hard he won�t hesitate to call the MB police on us. :confused:





word

wow i thought i could not post

they pdga club has the right to do what they want about this
i feel put the power in the hands of the members and this thing will do fine

not a few people focused on what is said on a message board
give me a break

because we may be getting new members but we are loosing more

how many great disc glofers have left the sport (pdga) in the last five years
if you are just a member to save 5 bucks on a tourney and at the end of the day you are just member of a club like sams
a coupon club
so lets be members say nothing and just take a five dollar discount when we play a tourney
no me G
this board allows all members a forum to express there views in a free country about the game and events surrounding the game
likes and dislikes
grow up
promote the sport and let the members sat what they got to say
sont like it dont read it

I for one will not be renewing this year. Last year I stood up for the PDGA on many threads regarding "renewing for the betterment of the sport" and "its OK to be a blind YES man to the PDGA" and "get the magazine option, it will be great"

Boy was I wrong on that magazine one, are they offering refunds for those of us that only got 1 magazine all year long? /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif


The MB was really the most valuable benefit for my membership dollars, but with statements like these

I spoke with Brian Graham about 2 weeks ago and he told me at that time that he does not waste his time viewing the message board because it is primarily a bunch of malcontents and he doesn't feel it is worth his time.

and the ridiculous moderating combined with a more enjoyable and free message board at DGrUS, I'll just keep my money and spend it on a round of ball golf. I would get more satisfaction from that than a years membership to the PDGA.

I have been a paid member for 7 straight years and will not be renewing, I know that I am just one member but it might be worth the Executive Director's time to pay attention.

Here's one for you:

The PDGA collects all our membership fees, mine being $75. And we pay them again at every tournament, that is alot of money. Then play pro worlds and first place is like $5500, give me a break. Where does all that money go, we know it's not this site. The have alot of work on the finacial side of this, invest or at least put some back into our sport. I want to start my own PDGA so I can offer very little for the amount you pay, and watch the money roll in. IT is B S!!!

Shana can't even get a correct password to even get on the board, STILL!! PayDon'tGetAnything (PDGA)

STILL!! PayDon'tGetAnything (PDGA)

awesome post coda


send me your money and watch it grow

Boy - There sure is a lot of discontent around the Tulsa area regarding the PDGA. The obvious thing to do is to get representation from Tulsa on the board. Personally, I'd like to see someone like Wayne Forrest representing us. Has he ever been on the national board before? It is not too early to start working on his "campaign".

I've noticed that PDGA Board meeting minutes are available online. Check out this link: http://www.pdga.com/board-minutes

I'm planning to review board minutes to try to understand the PDGA workings better. If our organization is not working well for us, perhaps we should try to change it from the inside before jumping ship completely.

IT MAY NOT BE MUCH THAT YOU GET FROM THE PDGA...BUT IN HOLE AS A GROUP IT IS ORGANIZED AND FORMATTED FOR THE PLAYERS TO BE COMPETITIVE AT ALL LEVELS OF PLAY...AS FOR SOME OF THE RULES, COST AND PAY OUTS THEY DON'T MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY...BUT IT IS WHAT IT IS AND IF YOU WANT TO MAKE IT BETTER VOICE YOUR OPINIONS...AND DON'T MAKE IT SOUND LIKE A COMPLAINT...THEY MAY FOLLOW AN OPINION OF A GROUP...BUT NOT A NEGATIVE COMPLAINT FOR AN INDIVIDUAL....

I don't understand the comments on payouts..

IF you follow the PDGA format you pay out 100%...

Maybe people don't like the payout splits between places.

I can tell you that from my perspective as whole, you guys are a tough bunch to handle/moderate/keep happy.

That is the nature of a disc golfer, rebels who don't care much for authority...

We are represented by Joe Rotan as our State Coordinator. I feel very comfortable with Joe in that role as he has a lot of experience and he isn't afraid to contact Kevin or others if he needs advice.

I agree we should all read the minutes when they are posted. I think you will see that the meetings are orderly and outside of a few message board rules I think pretty fair.

What exactly do you want the PDGA to do for you in 2009???

I will start the list by saying I want a process in place for getting Disc Golf on Television. I want outside consultants hired or something.

Feel free to add your wishes and we can get Joe to carry our message...

All and all folks, this is a pretty well ran organization that provides a lot of services.

I think the ratings alone, which have led some of you to getting sponsored, are reason enough to join. I just received my new Flying Disc Golf magazine which makes my fifth for the year. I think this is the best one yet..

I question brining the magazine back in house. They should make the magazine mandatory, contract with someone who is in that business and publish X number of copies on a periodic basis. Bringing that inhouse is going to be a major asset drain and everyone should be doing what they do best..

Just my thoughts... Complaining here is fine but don't think Brian Graham is reading this with his Sunday morning cup of coffee, he isn't.

If you want change, get organized, utilize your state coordinator and touring pro's to communicate what you want.

Mike on the payout side of things,I think players are upset with the fact that the PDGA collects a LOT of money in memberships, tournament fees, and now website traffic. We as a membership just don't see where it is all going.
As for the individual payouts, they can only be as much as the TD has raised and the players have paid in entries, because the PDGA sure didn't send you any money, did they? But you had better get your fees paid or they will suspend you. :o

As an example Mike, when we hosted Worlds here, the PDGA gave us a 4K stipen and then wanted all of our finances so that we could split any profits made with them. Now think about this for a moment, 4,000 towards worlds???????????
We had to do fund raising to raise 10s of thousands of dollars to offset expenses. They simply sent us 4K and want half of the profits, which by the way we sent them over 5K.
So basicaly they gave us nothing in cash and made a 1,000 profit. This helped offset a small ortion of their air travel and personal expenses. The club comped their rooms. And all of the mechandise that allowed us to raise funds was provided by a disc company, Innova, of which I thank for the fundraising opportunity, the PDGA had nothing to offer, except their presence at the event. They did send in a course evaluation team, that came in and went to all of the courses, told us everthing that needed to be changed(of which none of it changed), then they flew back out of town, on the membership's dime. See where I'm going with this one.

We raise that much alone(4,000) for one NT event. :o I also think that if they would commit either extra money to the NT series or at Worlds for both Pro and Am, that the players may be less crtical of them. As it is now, we, the membership have watched them waste our money on things like Sports Loop, over paid non-delivering consultants and the new magazine. While all the time responding that we, the membership just don't have a clue. :confused:
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that there is a LOT of money going in and very little coming out, at least towards events. Yes, we have the board (maintained by volunteers), yes, we have the ratings system (developed and maintianed by volunteers), yes the decisions are made by the BOD (another group of volunteers.)

It is my opinion that the current leadership has been more than lacking in their dealings with the membership on several issues. From this board to their holier than thou attitude of, do as we say. we know whats best for you.

They can take this as constructive critisim or as a negative post, It doesn't matter to me, probation is not something I fear from them. :p

Personally I think the PDGA needs to stick to managing the affairs of their organization and outsource business negotiations. I had a company called Team Works Media out of Chicago who is the midwest representative for ESPN looking at getting involved with disc golf and trying to get it on TV. Discussions were going quite well till the PDGA bro't up some comment about a previous deal where they had paid out $50,000 to some promoter and got nothing. After I had worked very hard to develop this contact, exchanged ideas on how to approach the concept, it wasn't going to cost the PDGA a dime and we would have a real media company involved with disc golf, the deal fell through when they talked to the PDGA. Instead of expressing gratitude for a very legitimate company to show interest in disc golf, the PDGA offended them when they commented on their very negative experience and stated to my group, "Well, don't expect us to write you a $50,000 check cause that isn't gonna happen". Talk about looking a gift horse in the mouth. My guys have said they have no desire to work with the PDGA. I am supposed to fly to Chicago later this month to try to repair the damage done by the PDGA and try to discuss how to pursue large scale media exposure of this sport. It is my strong feeling that if we are going to promote this sport, something like a negotiating team should be put together outside the PDGA staff. I don't have a problem seeking PDGA approval of any deals before signing them if, and only if, the PDGA actually has the authority over the deal. Again, my guys have stated they do not see why we NEED the PDGA.

When I first got involved with this sport, I saw great potential for the advancement of the sport. For the most part, disc golfers just want to play golf. My idea was to get involved with the business side of the sport and try to advance the sport to a higher level of exposure and consequently money to the players. I personally think the PDGA lacks this level of negotiating skills.

Imagine if we finally get the media exposure we deserve. The changes we would go thru would be awesome. You have to think that the major disc companies INNOVA\Discraft would be scared of more corporate companies like Nike, Addidas, Wilson, etc. taking over the disc industry!

Here is where your money is the financial report. I agree with many of the things you guys are saying. I have had this exact conversation many times on the way to tournies with Hickman.

Until someone steps up and makes a bigger/better tour and organization. We are stuck with what we have.

Here is your financial report.

http://www.pdga.com/files/documents/08PDGABudget-Detailed.pdf

Thanks for the report Smitty, we definitely need to raise the bar here. That is exactly what I have been trying to do. My problem is, as a business owner, I am not accustomed to developing a business deal only to have the voice of inexperience get involved and rain on my deal. I am not against the PDGA, I just don't think I want to rely on their business acumen in the future to consumate a deal that is totally good for the sport.

Is it possible to raise the bar under the current administration? Until recently I was under the impression that the PDGA tho't they controlled the sport of disc golf.
I would personally like to be able to assemble a team of professionals to work with to promote the sport. I have had many good conversations with professional businessmen that are very active in this sport that share this same ambition. The problem is that the PDGA has everyone intimidated, like if you don't succumb to their wishes you get punished somehow. I don't like this opinion but it has been expressed to me by several people. I say we do what is best for the furtherance of the sport. I am not trying to be a rebel here but what this sport needs is more free enterprise and less regulatory control.

Mike on the payout side of things,I think players are upset with the fact that the PDGA collects a LOT of money in memberships, tournament fees, and now website traffic. We as a membership just don't see where it is all going.
As for the individual payouts, they can only be as much as the TD has raised and the players have paid in entries, because the PDGA sure didn't send you any money, did they? But you had better get your fees paid or they will suspend you. :o

As an example Mike, when we hosted Worlds here, the PDGA gave us a 4K stipen and then wanted all of our finances so that we could split any profits made with them. Now think about this for a moment, 4,000 towards worlds???????????
We had to do fund raising to raise 10s of thousands of dollars to offset expenses. They simply sent us 4K and want half of the profits, which by the way we sent them over 5K.
So basicaly they gave us nothing in cash and made a 1,000 profit. This helped offset a small ortion of their air travel and personal expenses. The club comped their rooms. And all of the mechandise that allowed us to raise funds was provided by a disc company, Innova, of which I thank for the fundraising opportunity, the PDGA had nothing to offer, except their presence at the event. They did send in a course evaluation team, that came in and went to all of the courses, told us everthing that needed to be changed(of which none of it changed), then they flew back out of town, on the membership's dime. See where I'm going with this one.

We raise that much alone(4,000) for one NT event. :o I also think that if they would commit either extra money to the NT series or at Worlds for both Pro and Am, that the players may be less crtical of them. As it is now, we, the membership have watched them waste our money on things like Sports Loop, over paid non-delivering consultants and the new magazine. While all the time responding that we, the membership just don't have a clue. :confused:
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that there is a LOT of money going in and very little coming out, at least towards events. Yes, we have the board (maintained by volunteers), yes, we have the ratings system (developed and maintianed by volunteers), yes the decisions are made by the BOD (another group of volunteers.)

It is my opinion that the current leadership has been more than lacking in their dealings with the membership on several issues. From this board to their holier than thou attitude of, do as we say. we know whats best for you.

They can take this as constructive critisim or as a negative post, It doesn't matter to me, probation is not something I fear from them. :p



Nice post Dave. Well put, and delivered in a mature manner.

Well so far it's been a good year. Other than the New Year's Eve massacere of Slack and Regier, no other TDSA members have hit the probation list so far. :)

Who will be the first in 09? ;)

Having finished DFL all my life you all know I really temped on this one. :D

me read this:

Coda,

We have received a user complaint about your PDGA DISCussion Board avatar and agree that is not appropriate. We kindly request that you please choose a more appropriate avatar, If you would like to appeal this decision, please contact Brian Graham, the PDGA Executive Director. He can be reached at: BGraham@pdga.com

Regards,
PDGA DISCussion Board Moderating Team

Bunch of B S!!!!

BAhahahaha!!!! :cool:

You have officially been neutered. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Had you been an Am instead of a SuperPro you probably would have got probation.

Wise was probably the one that turned you in. ;)

if you look in the CC of the email it was Larry Kruse who turned me in!! hope they like the next one

That's right buddy. Make a stand for your rights. The board needs more "Rebel Rousers" like you to stand up to the PDGA. :)

Your just trying to get me kicked off the board!!!

IT WAS AN OK AVITAR....IT LEFT SOMETHING TO THE IMAGINATION....I'VE SEEN OTHERS THAT WERE WORSE....I HOPE MY AVITAR DOESN'T GET ME INTO TROUBLE....

Your just trying to get me kicked off the board!!!



It appears you're on your way without our help. :p :D

Your just trying to get me kicked off the board!!!



Don't worry. If your mouth gets put on probation you can always learn to be like me and talk out of your butt. :)

... you can always learn to be like me and talk out of your butt. :)


... no pictures , please ! ...

http://www.merel.us/Joker/Photos/AnimalShots/images/Two%20Faced_jpg.jpg

Looks like a good place for me to say ... well gee, thanks guys. I appreciate representing you and gotta say that I think being a board member is nearly as much fun as a trip to the dentist. Those of you that know me personally also know that I give more than I should to help the sport. I don't want to seem simple but I guess I must be because even Rodney Dangerfield gets more respect than the PDGA around here. I hope that when it's your turn to step up, the critics are more knowledgeable. And I hope that you step up instead of simply complaining. I am surprised that youall forgot I am from Oklahoma, but I guess I shouldn't be....There are only 7 Board members . All are regular folks with regular lives. All donate a lot of their days trying to make this sport better.

Ron, I wouldn't take it personally. A lot of this is aimed at the PDGA as a whole and some of their decisions over the past 2-3 years. You haven't been there long enough to cause any of this. But you have been around long enough to know that there were changes needed or you wouldn't have stepped up. We in Oklahoma are proud of you being on the board. A lot of the complaints are not about board decisions, they are about decisions coming down from the director and his attitude about them.

Should we assume by your comments that you are happy with everything that the PDGA has accomplished the last few years? I see some of the positves as ratings, the EDGE Program, and the overall increase in the number of courses but I'm not sure that is a direct result of the PDGA.

So you're happy with the Sports Loop deal? Happy with the FDM mag deal? Happy with the financials of the last Worlds?

What avenues do we have to complain Ron? Contact the PDGA? :confused: Thats most of the problem, they aren't listening. Please tell us what avenue we can use to voice our opinions or concerns.

While I have not stepped up to the PDGA level, I have worked hard for the local area for a while now. I have recieved a lot of critisim for my tactics. I can let it bother me or use it to my advantage and try to improve things. Or I can take it as, the entire membership is ungratefull and no one likes us. :(

I know you are all just regular folks, as you put it. But so is the membership and as sinmple as we are, we see a lot of $$ going into the PDGA and lot being spent on things we have the right to question.

Are you stating that because 7 regular folks have donated their time, that everyone should just be greatfull and agree every decision they make? Come on Ron, I know you're not that simple. Even you, I assume questions a lot of what your local, State and Federal governments do? But I guess since they stepped up we should just not question anything? :p

Thanks for taking the time to look in on us, this is proof some are watching and listening. Remember Ron, nothing worth while is easy. ;)

Dave makes some good points.

It is sad to see the PDGA in this situation.

I think new leadership is key.

The current leadership would, as it seems, not be able to handle the rush if our sport were to become wildly popular.

Ok I have a fairly thick skin. Half of our current leadership, as you put it, was voted in last fall. I believe that the people in there now are considerably more able to improve how the PDGA functions. Blaming the current PDGA leadership for member driven and probably message board driven decisions from several years ago is pointless. I guess restating that both Sportsloop and FDM caused considerable headaches that we do not wish to repeat would be pointless as well. Do we think that both venues had tons of potential? Yep. Do we want to promote Disc Golf in both television and print? Yep. At the same time the PDGA wants to insure that what we can do to keep this crap from happening to our members again, gets done. My phone has an answering machine to catch the calls if I can't. I take this work very seriously, to the point of giving up a weeks pay to go to each summit. With a one income family of 5 this is pretty serious.
I try to solve ANY problems that are
1.)current
2.)Brought to my attention by the people having a problem.
3.) Something I can fix.
If I can't fix it I will try to get someone who can. If it is just carping, great, but if you have a real issue, contact me and I will do what I can .

The only DG event I would like to see nationally televised would be the USDGC. If we could just get one then that IMO would be the one to get. People can gripe about all the tellevised hot dog eating, rock, paper, sissor, and thumb wrestling championships that get on ESPN but I'm sure it costs alot more to set up multiple camera's for multple angles in a local park or heavily wooded area.

I don't know how many spectators show up to watch the USDGC but I would imagine you would need a large crowd (if not thousands) of not just players, bringing in a lot of money to spend to get local or national news attention.

On top of that, remember that events like Nathan's Hot Dog Eating Championship gets like what?...an hour of air time normally on the fourth of July? There's plenty of things that people are willing to tune into but all those things are competing for the same air time just like we look to get the most "air time" out of our shots.

Thank you Ron, that is the quickest response I have seen from anyone directly associated with the BOD. ;)
Other than BG telling someone his personal opinion.

I know you take it seriously or you wouldn't have run for the position.

I'm sure there will be a day soon we can sit down and really talk about it. However, if I see the PDGA doing things I dissagree with I will still continue to post on this board. This is a place for players or I should say (MEMBERS ONLY) to discuss things. If the BOD wants to read or join in, then so be it. There is nothing that I have said or will say, that I wouldn't say in person. Actually Ron, this board is a place that the BOD should look in on, if you want to get a feel for the general membership's concerns and issues as a whole or at least as a region,

Thanks for your time. ;)
See you on the course somewhere.

The PDGA Report. They are making some serious strides to improve their image. I just spoke with John Duesler this morning and I think it is his intention to come to Oklahoma this spring for the purpose of providing a forum for local disc golfers to voice their concerns. In talking to both John and Brian, it is my firm belief that both of these gentlemen truly have very good and sincere intentions and until recently were not made aware of some of the sentiment shared by midwest disc golfers. I take this as a very earnest step to demonstrate their concern for both the sport and the golfers personally. Now, the ball is in our court. As a business owner myself, I choose not to participate in events that are too negative or non-productive. I would encourage any disc golfer that is able to attend this meeting. With all of the dissatisfaction that has obviously been demonstrated by our posts on the TDSA site, it is my opinion that these gentlemen truly feel that a meeting to personally hear your concerns is justified, for which I am grateful. I would like to see the TDSA and area disc golfers well represented in a professional, courteous and productive environment. I think the PDGA is beginning to recognize the valuable asset they have in the diverse backgrounds represented by the players. I see this meeting as a means to establish some very needed dialogue between the players and the governing board. I truly believe that these gentlemen have come to realize the business experience, innovative ideas and most importantly the business acumen that is available to them at the spur of the moment. Hopefully we will be able to identify a network of players that collectively can help take this sport to unprecedented new levels. I have always bragged about how truly impressed I have been with the comraderie, fellowship and support demonstrated to us by the disc golf community. Perhaps we can make this same impression on the PDGA and open new avenues of communication to promote ideas, concepts and events. John Duesler told me himself that he was not personally aware of these concerns until he took the time to read a volume of the posts on the TDSA website. I can see how this could happen as his job does not necessarily involve the previewing of the many threads on the discussion board and determine which are valid. Now that we have this window of opportunity, let's show them our support and concern in the same courteous and professional manner that I have come to enjoy and appreciate from this group.

Jim, since you had the oppotunity to speak with Mr. Duesler........................

What specific concerns are they wanting to address?

Just our general disatisfaction or a detailed list of such?

It was my idea to just get to know the midwest disc golfers a little better in an environment that would be positive and constructive. He thought that was a good idea and wants to schedule it with Brian Graham. I am thinking perhaps an ad-hoc committee to serve as a public relations liason between the board and the players might be something we could look at. That way players have a place to voice their concerns and the PDGA is protected from insignificant issues that may not require their attention. I think we are going to schedule it for here at the lodge and possibly to coincide with the NT. :cool:

It is my opinion that a detailed list, created in advance of the meeting, that could be forwarded to Brian and John would allow them to review the concerns and be prepared to answer questions during the meeting. This would be the perfect opportunity for midwest disc golfers and TDSA admins to demonstrate their political diplomacy. :DI have volunteered to host and moderate. I am thinking we can have Jeremy fix up a really nice dinner and get everybody in a thankful frame of mind prior to the meeting itself. :D :cool:

This is an excerpt of an email I got from the group I have been working with in Chicago to do live broadcast of disc golf. They are an affiliate of ESPN and have expressed interest in working with us to do live broadcast of Disc golf events.

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Cruse &lt;tim@nologyinteractive.com&gt;
To: taydrl@aol.com
Sent: Tue, 13 Jan 2009 2:28 pm
Subject: Chicago

Hi Jim,



Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, but we had a busy end of year and were playing some catch up to start the year. I don�t think that we�ll ever have a time that we�re not busy, but we�re at the point where it�s becoming more �business as usual�.



Can you take a look at flights to Chicago, and suggest a couple of days that will work for you? We�d like to sit down and flush the opportunity out, have you present your ideas to the group and we�ll hopefully have something for you to take back with you. Hopefully what we�re able to provide to you will be something that can get the ball rolling.

Good job Jim Taylor!!! We are very lucky to have a "stand-up" guy like you.

Good morning Mr. Duelser. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Hello Tulsa disc golfers. As the new Director of Marketing and Communications, I am pleased to see your passion for the PDGA and disc golf. We saw it during the great events Kevin, Joe and David Wise and Coda helped organize in the past (culminating with the Worlds and your second NT event this year), and we see it now with your observations on the message board.



To provide a more effective forum of communication, Brian Graham and I are planning to meet with any of the Tulsa disc golfers (and NT Touring Pros) during a Forum at the April NT event at the Lodge. Our goal here is not just to field your concerns, but to begin establishing what could be a more effective way to communicate in the future (i.e. better than just the message board.) This will occur Friday night of the event.



Our suggested format would consist of the following...

a. Opening remarks from our host...Jim Taylor (Thanks Jim!)

b. A Statement from Brian Graham and one from John Duesler generally related to some of your PDGA concerns.

c. Then comments from the following (in either order...)
--The Oklahoma State PDGA Coordinator

--A Tulsa DG Club Representative(s)

d. Then Open Floor to Comments.



I would suggest that you prepare your comments for this meeting, as well as your recommendations for a better relationship with the PDGA in the future.

In the meantime, my phone number is 215-913-0569 and I have a skype account at jdflyer44. I welcome you to use any of these methods to contact me directly.

Thanks and see you in April.

John, thank you for your genuine concern. I applaud your efforts and those of Brian to take this opportunity to reach out to our local disc golfers and create this forum. I think you gentlemen are doing a wonderful job of representing the PDGA in a very positive and professional manner. I look forward to personally meeting you both.

Jim Taylor

This is a good opportunity for all of us, I definitely plan on being in attendance to share any concerns of Arkansas players

Thanks to all that are making this happen and participating

Open communication is exactly what we need