This past pro worlds, according to Kenny, was hands down the most remote location for a worlds ever.

99% of the golfers had no cell service throughout the week. Sure, the world survived for well over 2,000 years without this technology, but not being able to contact traveling partners was a little scary. I know that I was waiting on Justin Bunnell to arrive and he never came - we were pretty worried. We had no idea that he stayed with someone else that night until the next day.

Then I read this thead - http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=722256&an=0&page=0#Post7 22256

And I began to think....should something like worlds ever be this remote again?

Don't get me wrong, the courses were AWESOME....but this just lead to lots of discussion about this.

Thoughts?

...needs to be where it will be accessible to the media.

Right now, the PDGA is not exactly inundated with bids from host groups for future WDGCs. Taking a SWAG, I would say that the over/under number for bids for both the Pro and AM WDGCs for a given year is 3, and I believe that we have had to beat the bushes a few times. Des Moines 2004 bid was for Pro Worlds, but when no one [acceptable] stepped up, the Iowa group gracioulsly accepted to run both WDGCs.

When we have the luxury of multiple bidders, then location is one of the criteria that should be considered. But if the PDGA makes constraints on locations, then we might not have even had a Pro WDGC this year? Would that have been better than having a WDGC in a remote location? I for one, would take a week's vacation in the north woods vs. not taking any vacation at all.

Given 20-20 hindsight, setting up a phone number and message board at THQ would have helped things, I am sure, and can be used for any future event that is telecommunicationally constrained.

Certainly better to have a DGC than to have none at all.

I bet if the owners of Highbridge offered a comm. tower easement to the local cell phone service provider at a cut-rate value, there would be plenty of service in a negligible amount of time.

Right now, the PDGA is not exactly inundated with bids from host groups for future WDGCs. Taking a SWAG, I would say that the over/under number for bids for both the Pro and AM WDGCs for a given year is 3, and I believe that we have had to beat the bushes a few times. Des Moines 2004 bid was for Pro Worlds, but when no one [acceptable] stepped up, the Iowa group gracioulsly accepted to run both WDGCs.

When we have the luxury of multiple bidders, then location is one of the criteria that should be considered. But if the PDGA makes constraints on locations, then we might not have even had a Pro WDGC this year? Would that have been better than having a WDGC in a remote location? I for one, would take a week's vacation in the north woods vs. not taking any vacation at all.

Given 20-20 hindsight, setting up a phone number and message board at THQ would have helped things, I am sure, and can be used for any future event that is telecommunicationally constrained.



Do you have information about how the bid process works. I'm just curious. Also do you have information about what a Worlds does for the local economy? I think that information can be usefull for areas with a few good courses and only need to get 1 or 2 more great courses installed to host a Worlds. If the local government can be swayed by the economic benefits of a worlds they may be more apt to install a course.

For the record, there was excellent cell phone service at the Highbridge complex. There was little or no cell phone service at Whitecap and the Bad River Casino.

The Northwoods of Wisconsin is quite the opposite of big city living (or any size city living for that matter). I thought it was a nice to get away from it all and slow down the pace a little.

I'd think cell service would be WAY down the list of priorities for choosing a site. (I think the list starts with "finding someone willing to do it" and goes from there). However, it might be worthwhile for a host area, if cell service is unavailable, to publish that fact as a courtesy to players so they can plan accordingly.

99% of the golfers had no cell service throughout the week.



This statement is misleading. As Discette indicated, a great majority of disc golfers had cell phone access at the Highbridge Hills complex. I got 3 bars up on the hilltop by scoring central. It was only at lodging (Whitecap, Casino, etc.) where there was no access. If you stayed in Hurley or Ashland you had access.

I'm with you Discette. Getting away from it all is a big part of why I enjoy playing tournaments. Where I work, I have a pager, my own phone, cell phone.....I want to take off my leashes for a few days. For me, playing true World class courses would outweigh my ability to contact or be contacted by others outside the venue. I almost got to go to HH this year and volunteer for the last weekend, and it sounds like it would have been a very relaxing vacation.

And for friends and family, as long as they have a number to get a hold of me (the number at the HH complex probably), I would be right as rain :D

I acutally enjoyed the lack of contact with the "real" world. Staying at White Cap was cool, nice 9 hole course right outside. Would have liked some food stores less then 10 miles that take at least 20 minutes to get to. Maybe John could build one on site???

I heard that the small Mellen grocery store ran out of stock for many items because they didn't believe that over 400 people were coming to the area. The stores that believed stocked up and reaped the rewards. The skeptics lost out on a great opportunity which pumped probably $500,000 into the economy directly and convention bureaus multiply that impact by four or so making it $2 millon overall. John's now getting local businesses coming out of the woodwork to support him for the future now that they saw what happened.

Next time, John will have more cabins available for rental onsite and plans to add a pump to the irrigation system put in for ball golf to get drinking water directly to many of the holes. Not sure about a grocery store but certainly more dry goods available for sale.

That deli was awesome!!

Smoked Turkey and Bacon Sandwhich baby!

Do you have information about how the bid process works. I'm just curious. Also do you have information about what a Worlds does for the local economy? I think that information can be usefull for areas with a few good courses and only need to get 1 or 2 more great courses installed to host a Worlds. If the local government can be swayed by the economic benefits of a worlds they may be more apt to install a course.



I have submitted a bid, and I have assisted a group with their development of an ultimately successful bid, but I would contact the PDGA office if you have any thoughts of submitting a bid.

I heard that the small Mellen grocery store ran out of stock for many items because they didn't believe that over 400 people were coming to the area. The stores that believed stocked up and reaped the rewards. The skeptics lost out on a great opportunity which pumped probably $500,000 into the economy directly and convention bureaus multiply that impact by four or so making it $2 millon overall. John's now getting local businesses coming out of the woodwork to support him for the future now that they saw what happened.

Next time, John will have more cabins available for rental onsite and plans to add a pump to the irrigation system put in for ball golf to get drinking water directly to many of the holes. Not sure about a grocery store but certainly more dry goods available for sale.



Are you saying the Worlds generated $2 Million in extra income for the area? If so, why aren't cities lining up to host the Worlds?

Because the TD, host club or facility, and others who volunteer take a big financial and/or time hit. We estimate Whitecap Lodge grossed over $150,000 from Pro Worlds and didn't contribute a cent toward sponsorship although asked three separate times. They likely haven't made that much for the five previous summers combined based on what they said when we were lining them up for lodging.

Actually, in 2005 Viginia Beach Convention Bureau approached the PDGA to host the 2007 Pro Worlds. We visited their location and the courses were not up to standards for Am Worlds yet and they did not have a group of players willing or with enough big event experience in the local club scene to take on the task of running a major event. Highbridge and I stepped in to help the PDGA by doing PW2007. Otherwise, I think the PDGA might have been forced to run it in Augusta again this year with no one bidding. There's no question that I would have preferred hosting Pro Worlds after 2008 instead of 2007 so more work could have been completed there.

We estimate Whitecap Lodge grossed over $150,000 from Pro Worlds



With that amount of income, they should have forked over clean towels each day, and espn. :p

That deli was awesome!!

Smoked Turkey and Bacon Sandwhich baby!



Yeah I had about 5 of those during worlds. :D

We estimate Whitecap Lodge grossed over $150,000 from Pro Worlds



With that amount of income, they should have forked over clean towels each day, and espn. :p



Yeah we were swined! Our room was supposed to sleep 8 and cost $600 but instead it slept 5 and cost $800.

Excluding finals, were there any noticable spectators? The little woman and I thought about driving from IN to HH but after looking over the course thought it wouldnt be the best of ideas...(Where do we stay for the week, where would we set up shop and watch the groups come through or follow a particular group around the course(s).) Dont know where spectator-ship would fall on the list of things such as phone service and other amenities. Just a thought.

Our backup lodging location, the Days Inn in Hurley, had room left with internet and pool plus it was near the larger town of Ironwood. We had more spectators than most would have expected at such a location. We charged $5 for parking to non-players on Sunday finals and took in $185. That's 37 car loads. Not a huge number. But with the remaining players I'm guessing we might have had 200-250 watching the Finals. Having Cale in the Finals probably pulled additional spectators to drive up from the Twin Cities.

Once to the general location, the Highbridge site was a pleasant 20 minute drive from Ashland, where I wish I would have stayed. Ashland had all the amenities you could want. The 20 minute drive took you to all the courses at once. You did not have to drive between rounds. It was easy to get to the courses, warm up, and play. I have been to many Worlds where the drive between rounds was much longer than 20 minutes. The three courses I played, Blueberry, Gold, and Granite, were all world class. I believe I preferred Granite Ridge, but all courses were excellent overall. I had a hard time believing all the time, money, creativity, and energy that went into creating Highbridge. Really fantastic.

Are you saying the Worlds generated $2 Million in extra income for the area? If so, why aren't cities lining up to host the Worlds?



Actually, this is economic activity caused by the estimated $500,000 of "extra income". The idea is that when Little Ronny Disco spends $5 celebrating at Joe's Crab Shack, Joe uses $2 of it to buy more crab and $3 to pay salaries, etc. Those $3 salaries get used to a gallon of gas at Bob's Fillin' station, $2 of which goes to the gasoline wholesaler and $1 goes in Bob's pocket which he then spends on a candy bar, and on and on and on. In the end, that $500k flows thru the local economy at a rate of approximately 4x.

But, while $2 million sounds like a lot, 1) the $500k estimated spending seems a bit high (see below) and 2) for a mid- to large metro are that's not so much.

I wonder, how the $500k number was reached. This would mean that counting only the 312 competitors, they would have spent, on average, $1600 out of pocket into the local area. If you add some staff, spectators, etc say bringing the number up to 350, then the average expenditure would be $1425 (still pretty high). While some may have spent that much and some may have spent more, it seems a high average amount. One poster said they paid more than their expected lodging rate, $160 instead of $75. Lodging prices which you can easily account for 30% of vacation expense makes a week in Ashland look very budget friendly. For every player who spent $2000 raising the average, there are others who spent only $500 or even less, dropping the average more dramatically.

Actually, the area itself didn't benefit as much as a metro area might have since much of the travel expenditure was dispersed via the internet for air fares, several states for those traveling by car and the Twin Cities likely benefited the most from rental cars. Too bad our national sponsor Enterprise could not find a way to provide any support to the event considering the number of cars rented at MSP airport. Hopefully, players coming by car took advantage of the map I created showing the Microtel locations on the way.

This past pro worlds, according to Kenny, was hands down the most remote location for a worlds ever.



More remote than when World Doubles were held in San Saba? Did you have to drive the final 15 miles to the course on a dirt road?

Did more people sleep in tents than in an actual room at Highbridge?

For the record, there was excellent cell phone service at the Highbridge complex. <font color="red">as long as you don't have sprint :p
i had NO cell phone service from basically the location of duluth,mn from sunday 7/29 driving in til sunday 8/5 driving back to minneapolis
</font> There was little or no cell phone service at Whitecap and the Bad River Casino. <font color="red"> even though you could see the cell tower 1000 ft from the casino :eek: </font>


The Northwoods of Wisconsin is quite the opposite of big city living (or any size city living for that matter). I thought it was a nice to get away from it all and slow down the pace a little.



<font color="blue">i spent my 1 round day walking thru the town, taking pictures, talking to the locals and standing in lake superior....the only thing missing was the family to spend it with....even with all the lack of service, i would go back there and play EVERY year if that's where worlds was as the combo of courses was outstanding(although i would probably opt to come in last card in open so i could play blueberry twice instead of w/bear) :D </font>

Last year when I upgraded cell phones, I determined which provider had the best service coverage at both Highbridge and the IDGC. T-Mobile was the winner although Cellular One actually handles the signal at Highbridge. (I formerly had Sprint which was basically dead at both locations). I get cell service in the casino parking lot. I realize players can't change providers just to make the trip to Highbridge. I wonder if those temp phones you can buy with a fixed number of minutes from T-Mobile might be the way to go if you're on the road to Highbridge for more than a week?

Keith, once The Bear gets done, the Masters could play Blueberry in some future format with no problem with Open playing The Bear (no Woodlands part), Gold and Granite and skipping Blueberry.

I have Sprint with the roaming package. I had good digital roaming coverage at Highbridge Hills .

I have Verizon. I had great signal at Highbridge, in Ashland and Mellen, but no service between them or at the casino.

John did an amazing job, and so did you chuck! I drove there from Grand Forks, ND and went through duluth on my way. The courses were great, even though I never played a hole. I was a spectator and loved every minute of it. The campgrounds were definately the way to go. Everybody there was playing mini disc and having a great time. I even remember one guy sleeping ON his tent out in the wheat field next to the campground. Why are you even complaining about cell service? I turned my phone off, it was a great vacation being unattached to it. Granted I wasn't playing or looking for players...but if your at pro worlds and don't know where your supposed to be....you shouldn't be there at all. John is working on even more courses and ammenities at this complex, which I think is amazing considering there are already 5 courses. Lets bring pro worlds here more often, heck, every year. They have proved it is world class.