We recently had rounds in a foot of snow and there was some speculation as to whether a player purposes created footprints along a slope to prevent a disc from sliding - both before a throw and after as a disc slid back down towards him (there was a thin crust of ice on top of the snow and discs were sliding after nearly every throw.)

This is altering a course, but only altering a temporary aspect of the course. How should this have been penalized, even if the player did it nonchalantly to not appear to be doing anything wrong?

well....?

DQ

Do we now need rules to govern how or where we can or cannot walk in the snow during play?

I dont know..maybe we should, as this was altering the course..

Do we now need rules to govern how or where we can or cannot walk in the snow during play?


Yes. Same with dirt and grass. I can't tell you how many times I've seen players matting down grass before a tournament to give themselves a better skip.

Do we now need rules to govern how or where we can or cannot walk in the snow during play?


Yes. Same with dirt and grass. I can't tell you how many times I've seen players matting down grass before a tournament to give themselves a better skip.



Ok well how about pounding your feet into the snow to get better grip?

THis is a good topic, as it is not covered in the rules.

In theory, you altar the course every time you take a step, whether it be dirt, grass, mud, gravel, snow, etc. that your step lands upon.

I think snow is like a casual obstacle..... So it is sort of grey area and should be determined by the group following these guidelines...

803.5 C. Casual Obstacles: A player may obtain
relief only from the following obstacles:
casual water, loose leaves or debris,
broken branches no longer connected
to a tree, motor vehicles, harmful
insects or animals, players� equipment,
spectators, or any item or area specifi cally
designated by the director before the
round. Obstacles may not be moved if
any part of the obstacle is between the lie
and the hole. The type of relief a player
may obtain is based on the location of the
obstacle and is limited as follows:
(1) Casual obstacles between the lie and
the hole: A player may move obstacles
which became a factor during the round
as described by 803.05 B.
(2) Casual obstacles to stance or throwing
motion: The player must first attempt to
remove the obstacle unless a portion of
the obstacle is also between the lie and
the hole. If it is impractical to move the
obstacle, or if a portion of the obstacle
is also between the lie and the hole,
the player�s lie may be relocated to the
nearest lie which is no closer to the hole,
is on the line of play, and is not more than
fi ve meters from the original lie, as agreed
to by a majority of the group or an offi cial
(unless greater casual relief is announced
by the director). Alternatively, the player
may declare an unplayable lie and
proceed in accordance with 803.06.
(3) Casual obstacles to a run-up: The
player may move the obstacle provided no
part of the obstacle is between the lie and
the hole. No other relief is provided.
D. In situations where it is unclear if
an object may be moved or other relief
obtained, it shall be determined by a
majority of the group or an offi cial.
E. A player shall receive one penalty
throw, without a warning, for violation of
an obstacle or relief rule.
F. A player who purposely damages
anything on the course shall receive two
penalty throws, without a warning, if
observed by two or more players of the
group or an offi cial. The player may also
be disqualifi ed from the tournament, in
accordance with section 804.05 A (2).

As for the idea that you could view the players mere presence on the course as damage, that would mean the game could not take place..... The ground is our playing surface or court so to speak. Things that project above or lay upon this surface are called obstacles. These obstacles are what makes disc golf challenging, as well as sometimes nearly impossible. Asuming that snow is an obstacle, you could squish it as long as the rules were followed, ie do not squish it between the hole and your lie ect.....

A similar topic was covered in another rules thread (I've tried to post the link below):

http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=383216&page=0&fpart=all& vc=1

The topic was "Using objects to help your stance" and I think digging your foot into the dirt (could be snow) was discussed.

Cheers,
Steve

WOW, ive never thought about this....might be kinda sleezy..after all, fallen twig is temporary, and you wouldnt build wall to block a roll...
I did see a top world player bring two discs to his lie...he then pretended he was carefully choosing which one to use...After a couple seconds, i saw him peer downwards and drop his nonchosen disc onto a small, skinny plant, thus flattening it out of his putting line...Pretty slick. I did not call it, but i mentioned it later, as a "dont do that again"

Another thing you could have said when he dropped the one disc while standing at his lie is

"Nice Throw"

:D

This is only an issue for the FIRST group to arrive at the hole. After that there will already be foot prints.

The key to keeping your disc from sliding on the snow/crust
is spin..you need to have absolutely NO spin on your disc when it reaches the snow..any left over spin will cause the disc to start sliding.

walking in the snow is not altering the course BUT if he did it on purpose to prevent his disc from sliding down a hill then he should be shot.
Anything removed in front of your lie is forbidden(2 stroke penalty)but altering a course on purpose is instant death.
I think that should also be a rule:cheaters will be shot(oops, wrong thread)