Player A throws a drive that is on the border of OB (it is not yet determined if it's OB or not.) Player B's throw hits player A's disc and knocks it clearly OB.


Now the rules state: If a disc at rest on the playing surface or supported by the target is moved, the disc shall be replaced as close as possible to its original location, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. If a marker disc is moved, the marker disc shall be replaced as close as possible to its original location, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. (If the two meter penalty is in effect, see also 803.08 C and D for movement of a disc above the playing surface.)

With this in mind, it's still soley up to the group's majority whether the disc came to rest OB? As such, no benefit is gvien to the thrower, even if the rest of player A's group "determined" it was OB, even if no decision could have been made prior to seeing the disc moved.

Could potentially lead to a problem if players are not honorable and use the rule to cost player A *potentially* an extra stroke.

Bad Karma from the group not being honorable will cost them more than the one shot they gain.

I think this plays across several rules.

The first being 803.09.D where the status of a disc at rest has been moved prior to it's out of bounds status has been determined. If the player that threw the disc moves the disc, then it's OB, if anyone else moves the disc, it's inbounds.
If the disc is moved by another player, then you proceed to 803.07.B & C.

803.07.B states the the disc will be placed where it came to rest as nearly as can be determined, and 803.07.C says that movement caused by a competitively thrown disc is not penalized, so the player that threw the second disc gets no penalty.

From that, I'd say that it goes back to where it was and must be considered in bounds.

I have a question that came up this weekend.

Player throws his drive to about 15 feet short of the pin than his putt hits the side and rolls about 60 ft down the hill behind the basket and goes in the water. The player picks up his mini not realizing the disc made it to the OB water. what are the players options??

a. can the player re-mark his previous lie (with group consesus on closest location) take a 1 stroke penalty and re-putt.

B. go spot from 1 meter from last IB location?

what I am curious is if once you pick up your spotter do you have to play from last IB location?

Picking up your mini or picking up your disc after you've thrown is of no consequence under the rules. If you pick up your mini and then want to play the last lie under the o.b. rule or the lost disc rule, you play from the approximate spot.

thank you Bruce that is what I was telling these masters players this weekend and they said I was wrong. But I made the 65ft up the hill putt anyways. :D

That is a rule carried over from the Doubles rules and does not apply in singles play. It probably should be re-examined as a doubles rule as well, but it would lead to a back-up somewhere where partners could not agree on a spot.

thanks I knew I wasn't drunk!! YET

803.09 B. A player whose disc is considered out-of-bounds shall receive one penalty throw. The player may elect to play the next shot from:
(1) The previous lie as evidenced by the marker disc or, if the marker disc has been moved from an approximate lie, as agreed to by the majority of the group or an official; or
(2) A lie that is up to one meter away from and perpendicular to the point where the disc last crossed into out-of-bounds, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. This holds true even if the direction takes the lie closer to the hole; or
(3) Within the designated Drop Zone, if provided. These options may be limited by the tournament director as a special condition (see 804.01).

The key being: The player may elect to play the next shot from:
Assuming you made your putt in either location...score is the same! Drive+putt+OBpenalty+putt! Good putt! :D
Ben

thanks I knew I was right about that ruling but you know those 1000+ rated masters think they know it all. :D:p