What I was wondering is how you guys are able to figure a disc's characteristics before the mold is even produced. I know that all of you guys have been into disc golf for quite a while so experience does play a part in it. I have heard that it costs a pretty substantial amount to have a mold made so I imagine that you guys aren't just throwing money around making molds at random. I'm not asking for any proprietary secrets here but if this information is, just come on and say so.

What made me ask is I was thinking about how so many drivers look so similar yet have completely different flights. I know that many of them are modifications to other molds to add/take away stability. What happens when you guys decide to make a totaly new disc instead of just add a bead here or add a slight bevel to the lower wing edge there. Just curious.

this got lost in the scoot_er threads so *bump*

What I was wondering is how you guys are able to figure a disc's characteristics before the mold is even produced. I know that all of you guys have been into disc golf for quite a while so experience does play a part in it. I have heard that it costs a pretty substantial amount to have a mold made so I imagine that you guys aren't just throwing money around making molds at random. I'm not asking for any proprietary secrets here but if this information is, just come on and say so.

What made me ask is I was thinking about how so many drivers look so similar yet have completely different flights. I know that many of them are modifications to other molds to add/take away stability. What happens when you guys decide to make a totaly new disc instead of just add a bead here or add a slight bevel to the lower wing edge there. Just curious.



This is good : "I'm not asking for any proprietary secrets here." :eek: :D

I'm sure between the different disc manufactures , you will get some interesting and totally unique data on physics , aerodynamics , molding processes , humidity factors and possibly classified / proprietary information. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I'm sure specific details are proprietary though. :o

Sorry about that.

They just want you to buy their Cool , Great flying toys !!!!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

You cannot build a mold from a disc and be very accurate there is too much shrinkage, even the best tool makers and engineers cannot predict exactly how a disc will shape up and certainaly not how it will fly until it is actually molded.

I can tell you that before we made the sabre ( which was a cross betwen the cyclone and XL) I had no idea of what made a disc fly.
The first ones out of the mold were flat with a very concave wing and were a bit overstable as I threw them while they were still warm, after they cooled down they domed way up and the wing almost vanished and it flipped over and rolled right out of your hand.
I learned within 2 hours of making my first disc what really effected the stability of a disc.

Now Were into weight distribution with the overmolded stuff like the (Odysseys http://www.gdstour.com/) which is the fisrt of about 10 new discs and even into experimenting with several out-side-of-the-box designs.

When I first started making discs I thought there wasnt much more that could be done.
Now I realize we have only scratched the surface of disc technology.
Making discs faster to fly longer has been great, but with extra speed usually means less control.
The trick will be to take a moderately fast disc with a great glide and keep it in the air longer.

Hey if you have about $20K and want to build a mold go for it and even call me for advice.
The more companies the better for the game and the sport.
The problem is the $20k is only for the mold, you then have to find the right polymer and even polymer blends nost of the time to make it weigh,feel and fly right, which could cost a lot more than $20K before its ready to compete with the big boys.

BTW wheres the QK2 that bounces off tall buildings in a single bound and is faster than a locomotive, I heard they are trying to find bigfoot, mo mo the monster, the abominal snowman and sasquatch to throw their discs and sponsor/msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif :eek: :o:grin.

Just kidden Johhny,
Ive offered my help at least 20 times, bring your molds to the US and lets make you some discs.
Your ads are great, your marketing is savvy, do you want some help in polymer development or tooling?
I'd rather see you with a complete line of discs than go out of business.
[email protected]

David, your passion for disc golf is inspiring! I hope 2006 is a great year for Gateway and all disc golf companies that are doing good things for our sport!

I think we have a new philosophy with the Gateway Quest expermental designs.
Build it, mold it, throw it, mess around a bit with polymers, throw it again and see what happens? :D
If we dont like it, face it off and try something else!

I wish I had a CNC mill in my back yard I could have been doing this years ago!

Our new mold builder Steve is a great engineer with some really cool ides and some fun discs.
we could release 12 new discs right now if we wanted to.

we could release 12 new discs right now if we wanted to.



Why not?

we could release 12 new discs right now if we wanted to.



Why not?



How about that beadless Wizard?

For one most of them still need time to get the right polymer blends down.
if we cannot get the right flight from the plastic blends than we change the shape.
Releasing one or 2 at a time is hard enough to do, 12 would be a nightmare.
You have to have time for each model to have its own time in the spotlight.

The Gateway quest line will have a beadless Wizardish disc, but since one version will be over molded it will be side gated.

We will still be producing the beadless wizard from OUR wizard mold, one day soon.

Have you made side-gated discs before? How many gates?

I may just be clueless, but what does side-gated mean?

the gate is the delivery channel for plastic in the mold. I believe discs are made with one gate, in the middle of the disc. The plastic spreads out from the center, radially. Since the new Gateway discs are two-part, they mold one part first, and then "overmold" the second. The first part actually sits inside the mold of the second, and they need to insert the plastic for the outside somewhere else (since the middle is already there, in a solid piece)- they put a gate on the side. I dont know a whole lot about the polymers in disc construction so I dont know which molding issues would be of the most concern in this application. I would think you would need at least a few side gates for a disc to avoid cosmetic issues and short shots.

Hybrid L or Hybrid Hybrid

ce :cool:

No we have not made side gates molds before.
There can be some huge advantages, especially in filling out thick rim parts.
This also allows allows the over molded discs to be produced.
You mold the center first , side gated and them the rim, again from the side.

We have some really cool stuff, right now in the prototyping and developmental stage.

I got to test fly some of the discs, mostly with just shots on the course, but can see some real performance enhancing features for players with a little less armspeed.

I saw the new Odyssey and thought it felt great for my grip of choice (the modified FU grip) since my middle finger can grip against the 'second rim.' David, is that the grip you use or do you go with the power grip? And do you have any in premie weight i could try out for MTA? :eek: i think that would be a cold design to use for an MTA disc -- especially if the dominess adds float...