And I am scared to death of brand new Z plastic!!!

Ok ok...it's not that bad.

Let me explain myself - I throw primarily Innova - but I found have been opening myself up to more and more Discraft lately after I found this 1st run Flash (171, light blue plastic with a red "FIRST RUN" stamp). I found it buried in some mud, under a log, and it had been well used - but not abused. I LOVED this disc, and it made me give other Discraft plastic a chance.

I now throw a D-Challenger, and a Cryztal Challenger. I traded for a new Z Avenger, but the Z plastic was too hard, like a waxed shell almost, and I couldn't grip it. I traded it away for a Champ. Orc, and I'm much happier with that plastic.

SO - what I am asking, I guess - are there any differences between the first run Flashes and the current production Flashes? And, is the plastic that the Z Avenger made of the same plastic that the current Flash will be made with ?

I miss my Flash so bad....it was soooooooooooo straight!!! Not overstable at all - no high speed turn. As long as my Orcs!

:(

On a happy note, I threw my Wraith 460 - parked the opening 4.

But I'm still sad.

i have a couple well used first run blue flashes that i have collected over the months. i would be happy to flip one your way for the appropriate consideration. PM me.

I lost 2 of my 1st Run Flashes..
I only throw Teebirds for regular Drives now because they are the most controllable driver i've ever thrown and i have poor accuracy.

The Z-avenger I have is a 1st RUn Buzzz type plastic. Seems to be close to what your saying Although the 1st run buzzz and my Avenger Seem to be super grippy..
Usually later runs(especially clear ones) are a different plastic it seems...
I would think that any Z-flash you buy will be pretty much the same plastic as the first runs... The clear plastic all feels the same for discraft.. IT's the Pearly stuff that is differnt i guess..

-Scott Lewis

Scott -

That Purple Z Avenger you have is the one that I HAD.

I didn't like it - I wouldn't have been able to throw it.

The one that I lost tonight was VERY close to regular Innova champion plastic.

I did find it originally, in a very hard to get to part of Idlewild Disc Golf Course in Northern Kentucky, at hole 5, above and left of the 1st landing area. It was covered in mud, and under a log. I'm not sure if that had something to do with the comdition of the plastic, but it was definitely seasoned better than the Z Avenger I gave you.

The only Z plastic I've ever seen or held was that Flash, the Avenger you have now, and my Cryztal Challenger. They are all as different as can be plastic-wise.

Keith

Maybe next time I reply to a post I should Probably check and see who it is that Started it :)..

sorry about that... :o:o:o

-Scott Lewis

The Z-plastic seems to soften as time goes on. In other words, it ages like a fine wine. I think you found someone's bottle of fine wine.....and then lost it, or drank it. ;)

My Z-Avenger is slowly softening.....i love it. The TX heat could speed that process up. :D

You might also look into getting a Z-Tracker. The plastic seems very similar to me to what you are describing. The disc is super straight, but it might not be quite as long as your Flash was.

the Z-Tracker cannot in any way replace a Z-Flash. very different things.

besides, Kool will receive a used first run blue and a new first run orange on monday.

I guess while we are talking about my beloved First Run Blue Flash....hereafter known as FRBF. How would most people compare a FRBF to a regular production Champion Orc? I know what I think, I just wanted to see if other people's perceptions were the same as mine.

I'd love a standardized rating system for discs for all manufacterers! That'll never happen I know, but we can dream!

Keith

I've thrown several first run flashes and have found them to be a bit more overstable than newer ones. They are almost like orcs stability wise. One of mine, an orange 174 first run is very overstable, almost like a firebird or crush. I personally like the newer flashes better.

Is there any truth to the rumor that these discs are are affected stabilitywise by thier color? It sounds so silly, but I think I've read that a couple of different times now.

What colors were more overstable? Less stable?

Keith

yeah color stability was an issue with a couple of the discs...

the flash...blue was the least stable

crush was color dependant too

It does sound silly, but if you think about it fora little bit it makes sense....
Most Molding Runs are the same color right? Or many from a single run are a certain color. So it's safe to say that that run CAN havea different Plastic Fill rate or a DIfferent Temperature and Humidity at which it was Molded Or COoled down. These things effect the disc from what i've heard so you could say that Certain colors would effet the disc.

IT's also possible that they use a different Formula ration when they do different colors. So the plastic could be different and would also have different cooling requirements.

When talking to MIttenz(Mullet Sonderfan :D) HE had told me that the Tennis Ball Colored Buzzz's that were out in the Winter Were horrible and the Blue ones at the time were MONEY...

Just some stuff i've picked up from asking people.

-Scott Lewis

p.s. I'll also second that 1st RUn Flashes were more overstable than newer ones.