sorry- if there is another thread for this already please direct (lazy)

thanks

The best wind disc sorta depends on how you throw. These are my experiences FYI:

Although I don't have one, I was very impressed by a couple years of the USDGC candy-type rocs. That's probably the best combo of reliability and durability and distance. But not price :)

Worlds Fundraiser SE Rocs are stable (and also $$$$), but I liked the above ones better.

The Z-wasp may also be very good for this, haven't tried. I would try this first, actually, cuz price probably cheaper.

And although it's a sharp disc, I've considered the DX-KC Whippet/Whippet X a mid-range/upshot disc, and very reliable, although it's more flexy and skippy than the blunter midranges. Not as enamoured with the new Candy-Champion type plastic, although it's OK I guess.

That's the best ones that comes to mind.

Personal experiences with other discs:
Gator - usually not stable/far enough, although there's a candy-type gator which sounds promising
Spider - not stable enough
Sentinel - possible, kinda sharpish, flexy
MRX - not stable enough
Z-Xtreme - Actually more of a driver, sharp and flexy for "midrange" disc, possible candidate, but I liked the Whippett-types better
Gateway Demon - too stable for me and not durable, doesn't go far enough. If more durable plastic and you're a MAN, then maybe.
Gateway Chief - maybe a candidate, maybe not stable enough?
#1 and #2 Hyzer - too sharp, doesn't go far enough for me.

I never tried a Ching disc, so can't help you there.
Probably forgot a disc or two, but that's what comes to mind.

P.S. When buying an overstable midrange, you might want to factor in how they work as forehand/sidearm rollers (which I would think would be your main get-out-of-trouble forehand disc that still has some reasonable chance of ending up next to the basket, instead of rolling into MORE trouble).

In other words some of these midranges will probably roll better for you than others, so if you are deciding between two or more candidates, the rollability would be a logical tie-breaker.

For me, I think midranges with flatter tops are generally more useful forehand rollers than domier ones.

I personally like forehand-rolling brand new DX rocs the best, although it may be different for you. Anyway, something to think about.

P.S.S. Also think about how well a disc grips for you in the rain.

z-wasp
10X kc roc

flat top ching roc
Q MF
Brand New KC Roc
2001 CE roc
2003-now Champion Roc

The best is a heavy 1st Run Z Wasp. Just won't turn over.

Any heavy Z Wasp is a good choice if you're not lucky enough to have 1st runs.

Drone?

If you need a midrange that will hold its stability in a head wind there is no better disc than the Drone :D

Have you guys even thrown the Demon? It's the best disc ever made. Don't listen to the people who say it isn't durrable because I've cracked a couple ROCs in the time that I've had my one demon. Also, they are not that hard to get out to 250-300 if you know how to use it. I never play wind without my Speed Demon and Demon. Those are the only discs I need for headwinds.

Now if you're talking about tailwinds, light or beat mids would work good. Look into the Breeze, Stingray, Element, any other understable midrange.

The best is a heavy 1st Run Z Wasp. Just won't turn over.


do the 1st run z-wasps say "1st run", or is there another distinguishing characteristic on them, because i have an orange at near-max-weight and it won't turn over for any wind. what does the drone fly like, and is it available in premium plastic or just dx?

The Z-Wasp works well if you want to throw into a breeze, but to throw into a wind, the Demon is the disc. You might want to carry both, unless you happen to be a single-brand guy.

Champion Whippet or 04 Glo Roc.

I'm pretty sure that it's a Demon, the old g5i are awesome. The plastic mine is in is super stiff, but still fairly durable as long as your not nailing trees about 5 feet in front of you with all the power you can put into it.

The Z-Wasp would be my choice, but the new DRONE is very, very overstable. It's like having a Predator for a midrange disc.

CE Rocs. Seriously. Ive tried Wasps and Buzz's and they dont hold a candle to CE Rocs.

In my short time playing I have tried many different disc's for midrange use during windy conditions.

I have two first run z-wasps(178g) and the one that is in my bag will hold up into a 10-20 mph head wind...but much more than that and it will start to flip over and not come back.

I have also used the demon...but never could really get it out there past 200 usually. This disc...unless it is beat to crap should never turn over into a headwind.

Champion Whippet...this thing flies pretty similar to the demon...but with a bit more distance to it. Again...this is a disc that should never flip over into a headwind...unless it is beat to crap.

Now...I have not tried a Drone yet...but from all that I have read/heard it seems to fly kind of like a demon/whippet clone. Which should be the MRX...but retooled. This disc should be a pretty good option too. I am hoping to pick up one of these in BG next weekend.

1st run Z Wasps have a ghost-stamped "Z" in the middle of the top. Just like the "Z" on 1st run Z Xtremes, Hawks and Talons.
I do have a few if you're interested. PM me.

Demons are great for shots that WONT turn over into headwinds. If you are looking for more distance, try a Blaze, They are SOOO underrated its stupid. Into a headwind, they act just like a longer Roc/Wasp/ElementX...its such a great disc that not too many people know about...its stupid!

I've gotta say the best wind midrange are the super rocs. I got a whole bunch of X-out's from Mark at discgolfvalues, and they are a fair bit more overstable than any KC/Dx rocs I've thrown and I try to carry 2 or 3 each round, very sweet disc.

CE ROC

CHAMP SHARK

a big fat champ gator, baby

CE BRICK

:D

the champ whippet hands down, "what wind?"
and, as previously mentioned, the speed demon...also a nice piece of stablity.

(sometimes i use a monster for a FH midranger in windy conditions)

Most of our sponsored players who use the demon for their mid range shots have 3-4 in the bag (new, slightly used and really broken in). Top pro's can throw demons well over 350 and can also get the broken in ones to fly and land straight.
*
We have recently begun to market our Blaze as a mid to long range driver and I use it for most headwind shots between 275-375. For those with less power it should work fairly close to the demon in terms of over stability.
For moderate headwinds the Evolution Pro-Line Element X (ELX) can be pretty beefy and still very controllable, but it requires proper technique( no turbulance on release)

my wind midrange right now is a 05 CE ROC X-out.
That thing is stable... if i had to pick a disc though. it'd probably be a whippet, but definately want to see what that drone can do :)

-Scott lewis

Demon. No question. A new one will fly into any headwind I have ever encountered and hold its flight path. And the more you beat one up the longer it gets while still hyzering at the end. With maybe the Drone in second (I haven't thrown one yet but it looks just like a Demon so I assume it also flys like it).

Demon. No question. A new one will fly into any headwind I have ever encountered and hold its flight path. And the more you beat one up the longer it gets while still hyzering at the end. With maybe the Drone in second (I haven't thrown one yet but it looks just like a Demon so I assume it also flys like it).




There is no difference between a Demon and a Whippet X. A Drone is just another Whippet X. If you havent thrown the drone what makes it so Demon like? Until they put a Demon in Evouloution Plastic { I refuse to call it CE} then wouldnt it be better to compare with a Whippet X?

firebird!!

Champion Whippet for howling wind
Champion Banshee for somewhat less howling wind

Demon. No question. A new one will fly into any headwind I have ever encountered and hold its flight path. And the more you beat one up the longer it gets while still hyzering at the end. With maybe the Drone in second (I haven't thrown one yet but it looks just like a Demon so I assume it also flys like it).



How much has the Demon's mold changed since it's debut? I have a few blue, 1st run Demons, and they look and feel NOTHING like a Drone.

To me, the Drone is a re-tooled MRV/MRX that is ridiculously overstable. The 30mph winds this weekend didn't seem to effect it at all.

I love wind with all its capricious swirls and gusts but I do not fear it for I have made a pact with the Demon. It is far and away (like my lies) my favorite into the wind mid-range (with accent on the mid-range).

/weenie armed

My_Hero:
Pretty sure the Demon has been changed a bit since the Protos...the wing is a little more concave and the nose is a little more blunt. Plus the dome is different........LOL.......I said blunt....

I have been using the demon up to about 320 in a headwind but this weekend I was loving the blaze (three course records in 3 rounds). Ok sorry had to say it but I think that the blaze definantly has enough stability to get 350' straight into a headwind. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I have been using the demon up to about 320 in a headwind but this weekend I was loving the blaze (three course records in 3 rounds). Ok sorry had to say it but I think that the blaze definantly has enough stability to get 350' straight into a headwind. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif



You are sounding like an echo!! (Read my post a few pages back!) But yeah, in headwinds the Blaze becomes a long straight shot!

My_Hero:
Pretty sure the Demon has been changed a bit since the Protos...the wing is a little more concave and the nose is a little more blunt. Plus the dome is different........LOL.......I said blunt....



Last night i compared the 1st run Demon's to the "test" Drone. Not the same. Similar, but the Drone's rim has more transition(curve) than the Demon's.

In terms of stability they may be very comparable. I do remember the Demon being sickly overstable!!!!!

My_Hero:
Pretty sure the Demon has been changed a bit since the Protos...the wing is a little more concave and the nose is a little more blunt. Plus the dome is different........LOL.......I said blunt....



Last night i compared the 1st run Demon's to the "test" Drone. Not the same. Similar, but the Drone's rim has more transition(curve) than the Demon's.

In terms of stability they may be very comparable. I do remember the Demon being sickly overstable!!!!!



Yeah, I'd say that since the protos/1st runs Demons have more of a transition on the rim, thats what I meant by blunt. I'll try and get you a profile pic somtime for comparison.

are the drones only going to be available in D plastic? i got one a couple of weeks ago, and love it, but i'd love it even more in Z plastic since it's already getting beat up...the D plastic seems alot more sturdy than the D buzzz plastic, though. any clue if the new plastic blend will be used in D buzzzes soon?

I threw my proto-Drone [a couple of rounds] in some heavy Colorado Mtn wind yesterday (weather front was blowing in, at about 7000 ft alt., 4 inches of snow this morning). All i can say is that IF it were made of Z plastic it would be SICK! I like it ... but I didn't feel that it was that much more stable than my 177+ Z Wasps. I would like it to be ... and so, in Z plastic it would be a fantastic disc (rather than good disc) in heavy winds. IMO
I really want to try some of the new Gateway discs ... had anyone been at work this afternoon when I called, I would have ordered some. LOL
Oh, btw, the new D plastic is very nice. The trees I tested it on agree, and didn't beat it up much. :)

I threw my proto-Drone [a couple of rounds] in some heavy Colorado Mtn wind yesterday (weather front was blowing in, at about 7000 ft alt., 4 inches of snow this morning). All i can say is that IF it were made of Z plastic it would be SICK! I like it ... but I didn't feel that it was that much more stable than my 177+ Z Wasps. I would like it to be ... and so, in Z plastic it would be a fantastic disc (rather than good disc) in heavy winds. IMO
I really want to try some of the new Gateway discs ... had anyone been at work this afternoon when I called, I would have ordered some. LOL
Oh, btw, the new D plastic is very nice. The trees I tested it on agree, and didn't beat it up much. :)



If you can't reach anyone, just email Justin and he'll set you straight: [email protected]

I played 70 holes today due to the 70 degree weather we had here today in IL and have to say I am liking my demon more and more. I used to not throw it because it was too overstable for me, but in the past year I have developed some decent snap and can now throw it fairly well. Well the winds were pretty strong today, probably 15mph with gusts towards 20. Nothing REALLY extreme, but enough to really mess with discs. So a guy asks if I want to play 9 holes with only 2 discs, so I replied we should just go for 1 disc. I looked in my bag and first pulled out my element X, but a gust of wind hit my face and my mind began to envision a lot of drives turning over hard and running way off line. And since the course I was playing was fairly wooded, I needed to be able to throw straight and a hyzer finish is preferrable to the lay out. I had not used the demon except for a few shots since putting it back in my bag in November, so I was worried that it would be a complete flop. I am happy to say I shot a 28 on the back, nothing special, but not bad for a 1 disc round with a disc I had never really used much before. I was even able to put some decent drives out with it and parked a 270 foot hole with it. I will admit I haven't thrown many other stable midrange discs, but I am very happy with my demon and need to get a few more just like it.

The midrange I use really depends on what I am trying to accomplish.

I actually use three midranges in wind:

1. Cobra
2. MRV
3. Demon

On short upshots in moderate head wind (100 to 150 feet) I actually use my Cobra (Storm equivalent, don't know Gateway). It gives me better control and under those conditions I don't have to throw it so hard that it turns over. At this distance my Aviar-X turns over in moderate wind. Under moderate winds and 150 to 250 feet I go up to the MRV (Roc equivalent, don't know Gateway). It gives me that extra stability to not flip over. Under heavy wind I use the MRV on those short up shots (unless it's really howling). But then I go up to the Demon for my drives. I have a beat Demon that I use. Fresh from the box is too overstable even in heavy wind. When the wind is howling (20 miles an hour or greater) I go to the Demon for every thing (sometimes I even putt with it). I've driven with it in a gale and had it run straight.

However, you need wicked good snap to get a good throw out of the Demon. You also need to beat it to get a good flight out of it. I hate that in any disc. But I can't argue that there is any other midrange out there that compares.

BTW - the Gator is slightly more stable than the MRV/Roc combo but only comes in DX. It also doesn't glide as well and for that reason I've not used it too much.

If you like that cobra you should really pick up an Element from Gateway!! :cool:

Discraft XTREME. Not a driver, more of a midrange. Will stand up to any wind, spike into the ground and stop on a dime.

My set up:

S Element
Z Buzzz
S Element X
Z Extreme

the gator is available in champion plastic, in case you hadn't heard. i need to get some gateway plastic, everyone seems to be digging it recently.

I think I'm gonna have to try a Champ Gator. I thought my Proline Gremlins were good in the wind until yesterday when from 150' out I got blown way over the basket then it evidently rolled down a hill 70 more feet. Then on the way back the wind blew it down leaving me with a 15' putt which I managed to make.

Discraft XTREME. Not a driver, more of a midrange. Will stand up to any wind, spike into the ground and stop on a dime.




True, it can be used as a mid range disc. It is a driver though, i use mine for 225' - 300' hyzer drives.

If you like that cobra you should really pick up an Element from Gateway!! :cool:



I second that!

Brand new 180g DX Roc thrown with power but without any flutter is the best mid-range into the wind.

Brand new 180g DX Roc thrown with power but without any flutter is the best mid-range into the wind.



With a throw like that, any stable midrange is perfect!

you must not play in texas or the midwest very often. you'd be surprised what a tornado will do to a 180 dx roc, even if thrown perfectly with no flutter. the roc may be one of the best discs made, but it certainly has its niche, along with most other discs on the market. just my opinion.

IMHO--

For Hyser Approaches in any wind -- KC Pro Banshee
For Hyser Skip Shots in any wind -- KC Pro Banshee
For Dead Straight Shots under 240' -- Pro Line Rhyno
For Dead Straight Shots over 240' -- Z Buzz
For Anhyser in any wind -- I Pray.

you must not play in texas or the midwest very often. you'd be surprised what a tornado will do to a 180 dx roc, even if thrown perfectly with no flutter.


You must not play in tornadoes very often, because not even a Z-Extreme or a CFR Viper can stand up to them. :)

I am continually amazed at how overstable a brand new DX Roc is. If you are looking to throw an actual mid-range into the wind, then it great. If you are talking about 40 MPH winds and throwing overstable drivers instead, than that is a different story.

sorry for the thread drift, but we're on the topic of rocs...I bought a used bottom stamp dx roc about 5 years ago and it's my go to mid and long putter, but i recently bought a new dx roc same weight and color, but it hit a parking lot once and it's less stable than my old one, has anyone else had that happen? I can still use them both into most wind though

The lower rim 'bead' (damaged in your case) helps deliver a fair amount of overstablity...

The Drone is a very pleasant surprise. When first threw the proto's I didn't forsee a use for that kinda flight. Now that I've gone out to the course and tried it, I find myself going to it for certain shots. The new pro D plastic is the best feeling plastic I've felt in a long while. Try a Drone, you will like!!!!