Lets see votes for your favorite course in Michigan. Hickory Hills in Traverse City gets my vote for best course in the state. What do you think? <font color="black"> </font>

You forgot the Tobbagon and Cass Benton???

You also forgot the Beast and Goliath in Ludington.

I would say Tobbagon the Flip City then Hickory Hills and after that Hudson Mills and Cass Benton.

So if i have to vote on the list i guess it would be Flip City but the Tobbagon is HANDS DOWN the best course ever to be played in MI.

I haven't played too many MI courses but you forgot my 3 favorite? I dunno if I can consider that a good list :mad:
1) Hudson Mills Monster
2) BattleCreek
3) Oshtemo

Tobbagan course is the best course ever. No questions about it, anyone that has ever played the course loves it whether they shot a 20 over or a 1 down (**** you Slater). No worries, I will get my 52 next year.

If Toboggan is the best the whole state of Michigan can offer, it has some work to do. Toboggan is a fine course for what it is. But with an SSA around 55-56 and minimal OB hazards, you would think other places in Michigan would have the ideal terrain for a longer and more challenging course that could be made permanent.

Tobbagan course is the best course ever. No questions about it, anyone that has ever played the course loves it whether they shot a 20 over or a 1 down (**** you Slater). No worries, I will get my 52 next year.



Thats not good enough cuz im going to shoot a 51 :eek:

If Toboggan is the best the whole state of Michigan can offer, it has some work to do. Toboggan is a fine course for what it is. But with an SSA around 55-56 and minimal OB hazards, you would think other places in Michigan would have the ideal terrain for a longer and more challenging course that could be made permanent.



You have to have distance accuracy, midrange accuracy AND putting if you want to even come close to shooting 55. Climo has the course record and it is 4 down and that was back in 2000 when i think he was more in his prime and the course was EASIER. Even if you are like 5 feet off the fairway (yes i KNOW the fairways are huge) then you are usually IN JAIL. I would have to say that and the Black to the Championship baskets on the Moster at Hudson Mills are the 2 toughest courses in MI. The new 18 holes at Rolling hills is pretty sweet and the last 12 holes are TOUGH. So that could be number 3.

Are we talking about what our favorite courses are or are we talking about the hardest or most well designed courses. What EXACTLY do we want to know here beacause MI has A LOT of sweet course but they arent all super hard or super long.

Hardest
Tobbagon
Monster Blacks to Champ Baskets
Rolling Hills

Favorite
Tobbagon
Flip City
Beast and Goliath at Ludington
Hudson Mills ALL courses
Cass Benton
Rolling Hills
Hickory Hills

Well Designed
Rolling Hills
Hudson Mills All Courses
Tobbagon
Hickory Hills
Cass Benton

None of those are in order by the way.

The course designers group considered Hudson Mills 24-hole courses just somewhat above average designwise when evaluated for the 2000 Worlds. That was a group of about 8 experienced designers including a few World Champs. Of the Hudson Mills courses, Original 18 is probably the best for its design purpose of a fun recreational, intermediate length course. Kensington Tunnel got the best rating among the permanent courses at PAW2000 (but still behind Toboggan) with Monster ending up last, just slightly behind the Campground layout.

The good news is that the PDGA Course Evaluation Committee has completed a new evaluation system to be introduced in 2005 which will help sort out the course rankings. I assume some of these courses have been improved since PAW2000. I remember Cass Benton was brand new and I thought it had a lot of potential once it was worked in and maybe tweaked based on feedback from Worlds.

Well it sure is WORKED IN!!!!!!!!! More like WORKED over. That is my home course and the casuals there have pretty much DESTROYED IT!!!!!!!!!!! Its one of my favorite courses but the casuals just destroy it and it just gets worse and worse. I think the SSA is around a 51 there. I know i shot a 1 down and it was pre rated at a 984 so 51 would be right about a thousand. I think it still has potential if we could replant some trees and get rid of the FREAKIN casuals that mess it up. I swear if i ever catch one of those little punks he wont ever throw a frisbee again :mad:

Cass-Benton was one of my favorite courses in 2000. Woods-woods-woods-WIDE_OPEN..........crap, a RIVER!!!! :D....woods-open-woods-woods-woods.

I got to play Cass in October and had a blast. The bottle cap pathway was interesting.

Wouldn't the Monster course to "extra long" pins be harder than the Tobbagon course? For DGLO this year, first round +3 was 1002 (I've never shot the tobbagon but it sounds a stroke or 2 easier) Plus, hasn't anyone played Battlecreek? I've never shot underpar out there, it has to be like 55-56 SSA?!

Wouldn't the Monster course to "extra long" pins be harder than the Tobbagon course? For DGLO this year, first round +3 was 1002 (I've never shot the tobbagon but it sounds a stroke or 2 easier) Plus, hasn't anyone played Battlecreek? I've never shot underpar out there, it has to be like 55-56 SSA?!



Kimball Pines in Battle Creek. I hear its REAL TOUGH but having never played or even SEEN it i couldnt tell you.

But getting back to basics, Hickory Hills in TC, MI is a sweet course when looking at course design. The course follows the land perfectly, much like many old school ball golf courses follow the land, such as Crystal Downs, CC. Regardless of how challenging the course is, it is still a technically sound course.