JoakimBL
Apr 24 2012, 10:25 AM
The following situation came up on the final hole of a tournament i just played, and there was some discussion about what the correct call should be.
The hole is 600 feet downhill with a small stream running across about 140 feet short of the basket. There is a small gallery on the green watching the final four teeing of, and one throw hits a tree above the the stream. A spectator (A player from another division) is standing nearby, sees the disc in the water floating away, but neither the gallery on the green or the group, can see where the disc landed. He picks it up, and leaves it were it went OB.
The spectator who saved the disc told the group when they arrived what had happened. The group made their decision, and I don't think there was any drama there, but other players were discussing what the call should be. Looking in the rule book, I can't find a definitive answer.
According to 803.03 F the disc came to rest OB. It was subsequently moved. 803.07 A is about a disc in flight, and 803.07 B is regarding the movement on the disc on the playing surface, which the stream is not, according to the definition. 803.09 D determines where the lie is, if moved by a player, but in this case it was a spectator (Assuming that a player is no longer a player, when he has holed out the last hole)
803.03 Marking the Lie:
F. A disc thrown in water shall be deemed to be at rest once it is floating or is moving only by the action of the water or the wind on the water.
803.07 Interference:
A. A thrown disc that hits another player, spectator, or animal shall be played where it comes to rest. A thrown disc that is intentionally deflected or was caught and moved shall be marked as close as possible to the point of contact, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. Alternatively, for intentional interference only, the thrower has the option of taking a re-throw. [...]
B. If a disc at rest on the playing surface or supported by the target is moved, the disc shall be replaced as close as possible to its original location, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. [...]
803.09 Out-of-Bounds:
D. If the in-bounds status of a disc is uncertain, either a majority of the group or an official shall make the determination. If the thrower moves the disc before a determination has been made, the disc shall be considered out-of-bounds, and he or she shall proceed in accordance with 803.09B counting all throws made prior to the determination of the in-bounds status of the original lie. If a player other than the thrower moves the disc before a determination has been made, the disc shall be considered in-bounds, and play for the thrower and the mover of the disc shall proceed under the rules of interference, 803.07 B and C.
Should the next throw be played where the group found the disc, or should it be played as OB. Or could this be classified as Intentional Interference, and give the player a re-throw? (which by the way is not clear to me, whether or not the original throw will count towards the score or not)
The hole is 600 feet downhill with a small stream running across about 140 feet short of the basket. There is a small gallery on the green watching the final four teeing of, and one throw hits a tree above the the stream. A spectator (A player from another division) is standing nearby, sees the disc in the water floating away, but neither the gallery on the green or the group, can see where the disc landed. He picks it up, and leaves it were it went OB.
The spectator who saved the disc told the group when they arrived what had happened. The group made their decision, and I don't think there was any drama there, but other players were discussing what the call should be. Looking in the rule book, I can't find a definitive answer.
According to 803.03 F the disc came to rest OB. It was subsequently moved. 803.07 A is about a disc in flight, and 803.07 B is regarding the movement on the disc on the playing surface, which the stream is not, according to the definition. 803.09 D determines where the lie is, if moved by a player, but in this case it was a spectator (Assuming that a player is no longer a player, when he has holed out the last hole)
803.03 Marking the Lie:
F. A disc thrown in water shall be deemed to be at rest once it is floating or is moving only by the action of the water or the wind on the water.
803.07 Interference:
A. A thrown disc that hits another player, spectator, or animal shall be played where it comes to rest. A thrown disc that is intentionally deflected or was caught and moved shall be marked as close as possible to the point of contact, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. Alternatively, for intentional interference only, the thrower has the option of taking a re-throw. [...]
B. If a disc at rest on the playing surface or supported by the target is moved, the disc shall be replaced as close as possible to its original location, as determined by a majority of the group or an official. [...]
803.09 Out-of-Bounds:
D. If the in-bounds status of a disc is uncertain, either a majority of the group or an official shall make the determination. If the thrower moves the disc before a determination has been made, the disc shall be considered out-of-bounds, and he or she shall proceed in accordance with 803.09B counting all throws made prior to the determination of the in-bounds status of the original lie. If a player other than the thrower moves the disc before a determination has been made, the disc shall be considered in-bounds, and play for the thrower and the mover of the disc shall proceed under the rules of interference, 803.07 B and C.
Should the next throw be played where the group found the disc, or should it be played as OB. Or could this be classified as Intentional Interference, and give the player a re-throw? (which by the way is not clear to me, whether or not the original throw will count towards the score or not)