MTL21676
Aug 18 2010, 12:01 AM
At the USDGC and larger events, you see flags now. It seems to be this is a trendy thing as we have all see that what USDGC does, it seems everyone is obligated to do as well.
Well, the more and more I think about it, I am mainly opposed to flags on top of a basket.
I would like to now point out why I have this opinion in my typical long and drawn out response.
First off, as an avid and former amateur competitive ball golfer, the point of a flag is simply to show the golfer where on the putting surface the hole is located. Nothing more nothing less. Does it on occasion help or hurt a golfer? Of course. I've hit the flag stick stopping shots that would go 40 feet long and are now tap ins and I've hit flags that knocked it 15 feet away when it would have landed next to the cup. Heck, the flag stick pretty much is the reason David Toms won the 2001 PGA Championship over Phil Mickelson has in round three he recorded a hole in one due to one and more than likely would have taken a 3 on the hole without the flag stick being there - he won by 1 stoke.
The simple act of pulling the flag stick out of the cup being mandated when on the green pretty much proves the point of it - it's not to assist the golfer on bad shots and it's certainly not meant to punish a golfer who get's the bad break off the stick. It's simply there to show us where the hole is. Now there are other things the flag does. It helps read the wind in the distance and more recently, have devices on the flags that assist with GPS finders. And on most courses, you will see different colored flags to show if the pin location is on the front middle or back third of the green.
So with all this in mind, why is this exact same thing used in disc golf?
We certainly don't need the flag to help show where the hole is located as the target is not only can easily be seen, it can be color coated in coordination with the pin location (most courses with two sets of permanent baskets have different colors or models to show the difference in each course - I See this as basically the same thing the different color flags accomplish in ball golf).
I can see the argument for help reading the wind, but I feel wind is much more of an important factor in our game and is much more of a skill for us to read the wind. Also, we are dealing in feet as opposed to yards, so the target with the wind is no where near as far as the flag in golf.
And beyond all this, how many times have you seen a disc hit the flag? I see a tee shot or approach hitting the flag not a big deal - it's basically the same effect as a ball hitting the flag stick or a disc hitting the pole or the basket or any other part of the target that is needed to have the target there in the first place that doesn't assist in the holing out process. But I would say while it's obviously much easier to hit a flag with a disc than with a ball due to just simply the diameter of the objects, they probably occur at about the same rate due to the flag being much smaller than in ball golf and so many other things for the disc to hit that ball golfers would not have on a green.
Also, there are some pins (and the only one I can think of is number 14 in Kinston, NC) where the pin is located in a ditch or behind a large drop off and the flag assists the golfers in locating the pin. But we are talking in the roughly 110 courses I've played, this is the only basket I can't see due to lower elevation. Plenty of times you can't see it due to trees, bushes, doglegs, etc, but as far as vertical challenges, it is obviously well well below ball golf as it is required for all ball golf holes and slim to none disc golf holes.
However what get's me comes on the putting area. Disc golf has no rule that requires these flags be removed when putting. If you are ever at USDGC where you have not only raised baskets but also wind, stop and watch one windy green for about 30 min to an hour and I almost bet you will see one person sail a putt over the basket due to error, wind or both that hit the flag and come to rest.
I really don't think we should have them anyway simply b/c as I've said, the targets are big enough, there really is rarely a visual issue and finally wind reading is more important in disc golf, therefore should be more left to the player rather than a device to aid that. But I'm ok with it before you get to the putting area.
Isn't putting easy enough? Aren't there TONS of areas you can hit on a basket that stop your putt without it going in? If we borrowing the idea and concept from ball golf here, shouldn't it be made to be removed from the basket once you are in putting range because it is no longer necessary?
I have never really heard a discussion about this and watching the Vibram this weekend made it pop in my mind. What are your thoughts?
Well, the more and more I think about it, I am mainly opposed to flags on top of a basket.
I would like to now point out why I have this opinion in my typical long and drawn out response.
First off, as an avid and former amateur competitive ball golfer, the point of a flag is simply to show the golfer where on the putting surface the hole is located. Nothing more nothing less. Does it on occasion help or hurt a golfer? Of course. I've hit the flag stick stopping shots that would go 40 feet long and are now tap ins and I've hit flags that knocked it 15 feet away when it would have landed next to the cup. Heck, the flag stick pretty much is the reason David Toms won the 2001 PGA Championship over Phil Mickelson has in round three he recorded a hole in one due to one and more than likely would have taken a 3 on the hole without the flag stick being there - he won by 1 stoke.
The simple act of pulling the flag stick out of the cup being mandated when on the green pretty much proves the point of it - it's not to assist the golfer on bad shots and it's certainly not meant to punish a golfer who get's the bad break off the stick. It's simply there to show us where the hole is. Now there are other things the flag does. It helps read the wind in the distance and more recently, have devices on the flags that assist with GPS finders. And on most courses, you will see different colored flags to show if the pin location is on the front middle or back third of the green.
So with all this in mind, why is this exact same thing used in disc golf?
We certainly don't need the flag to help show where the hole is located as the target is not only can easily be seen, it can be color coated in coordination with the pin location (most courses with two sets of permanent baskets have different colors or models to show the difference in each course - I See this as basically the same thing the different color flags accomplish in ball golf).
I can see the argument for help reading the wind, but I feel wind is much more of an important factor in our game and is much more of a skill for us to read the wind. Also, we are dealing in feet as opposed to yards, so the target with the wind is no where near as far as the flag in golf.
And beyond all this, how many times have you seen a disc hit the flag? I see a tee shot or approach hitting the flag not a big deal - it's basically the same effect as a ball hitting the flag stick or a disc hitting the pole or the basket or any other part of the target that is needed to have the target there in the first place that doesn't assist in the holing out process. But I would say while it's obviously much easier to hit a flag with a disc than with a ball due to just simply the diameter of the objects, they probably occur at about the same rate due to the flag being much smaller than in ball golf and so many other things for the disc to hit that ball golfers would not have on a green.
Also, there are some pins (and the only one I can think of is number 14 in Kinston, NC) where the pin is located in a ditch or behind a large drop off and the flag assists the golfers in locating the pin. But we are talking in the roughly 110 courses I've played, this is the only basket I can't see due to lower elevation. Plenty of times you can't see it due to trees, bushes, doglegs, etc, but as far as vertical challenges, it is obviously well well below ball golf as it is required for all ball golf holes and slim to none disc golf holes.
However what get's me comes on the putting area. Disc golf has no rule that requires these flags be removed when putting. If you are ever at USDGC where you have not only raised baskets but also wind, stop and watch one windy green for about 30 min to an hour and I almost bet you will see one person sail a putt over the basket due to error, wind or both that hit the flag and come to rest.
I really don't think we should have them anyway simply b/c as I've said, the targets are big enough, there really is rarely a visual issue and finally wind reading is more important in disc golf, therefore should be more left to the player rather than a device to aid that. But I'm ok with it before you get to the putting area.
Isn't putting easy enough? Aren't there TONS of areas you can hit on a basket that stop your putt without it going in? If we borrowing the idea and concept from ball golf here, shouldn't it be made to be removed from the basket once you are in putting range because it is no longer necessary?
I have never really heard a discussion about this and watching the Vibram this weekend made it pop in my mind. What are your thoughts?