I am proposing a course in Indiana.
Safety seems to be the only concern.
What should I look out for when it comes to building a "safe" course?

Thanks

If it's "designed" well you shouldn't have too many issues with safety.

If it's in the actual construction then I guess getting injured from misuse of equiptment in which case you can always draft up a waiver or find out what tools (power and otherwise) the city will allow you to use.

What should I look out for when it comes to building a "safe" course?

Thanks

Please have someone with experience in course design help. Experienced course designers are familiar with safety concerns as well as designing a fair course that is suitable for players of all skill levels. They can also help with presenting proposals to park boards and can provide other information (like cost of tee pads). Many will offer basic advice for free and only charge a fee for full design services.

I want ideas for a course to be safe.
Not for me, but for any Board. Especially the board I am working with. :)
This message was started so that I can use it as a teaching tool.
I am looking for positive feedback online here,PDGA.com


As far as me the Designer, please do not worry!
Been playing many years, +Plus I have a mentor***Bonus!
+ The funds are designated already....Double Bonus!

As far as me the Designer, please do not worry!
Been playing many years

The #1 misconception about disc golf course design is that those who have played disc golf for a long period of time will naturally have the ability to properly design a good course.

Playing experience can be an asset, but good course design comes almost entirely from understanding and applying proper course design principles.

I want ideas for a course to be safe.
Not for me, but for any Board. Especially the board I am working with. :)
This message was started so that I can use it as a teaching tool.
I am looking for positive feedback online here,PDGA.com


As far as me the Designer, please do not worry!
Been playing many years, +Plus I have a mentor***Bonus!
+ The funds are designated already....Double Bonus!


Doesn't your mentor know the basics of safe course design?

Anyway

Don't design a fairway in a busy park where you cant see the basket (no blind shots)
Don't design the fairway close to a shelter , playground ,soccer fields etc. (buffer zones)
Have signs up at non-disc golf areas explaining what disc golf is and where the course is. (putting them up at the course is redundant because discgolfers already know what disc golf is) You can put up a sign at the course explaining the hazard to foot and bike traffic on the course.
Visualize the worst possible shot and work on designing away from that outcome.

Now you can be a master designer...just kidding!
No really if this is the first course your working on work with your mentor so that he can help you design the course right. Going at it blind can only lead to trouble in the long run.

oh here's another tip

The closer you get to pedestrian traffic area the shorter your holes should get (-200').
Reason; The players are more apt to use slower and safer discs on the short holes.
and put your long holes in an area that has little to no pedestrian traffic.

The #1 misconception about disc golf course design is that those who have played disc golf for a long period of time will naturally have the ability to properly design a good course.

Playing experience can be an asset, but good course design comes almost entirely from understanding and applying proper course design principles.


I agree with Jeff, especially if your experience has been playing poorly designed courses. I find that a good starting point for safety considerations is to stand at the proposed teeing area and imagine the flight path possibilities. Put plenty of space between holes and buffers between the course and any roads. Don't have fairways going next to picnic tables (you would think this is common sense, but I have seen such designs!). There is more to it than these few tenets, but these are the types of things that one needs to consider for safety.

When I started designing courses, I got myself a mentor or two and we bounced ideas and concerns off of each other. The fact that you have a mentor in this is a good sign.

There really is too much that goes into designing a safe course to go into in a message board thread. In some parks, there is no design that would be safe, in others almost no reasonable design that would be a problem. The safety issues are normally for non-disc golfers being in play without knowing there is a danger. If there are any areas on the course where other park users may tend to be in the 10% of really bad shots areas, it may be unsafe. A local member of the disc golf course designers group should be able to look over your design and give you some feedback, but providing a checklist of things that make a course design safe without looking at the property and its use patterns through all seasons of the year would be irresponsible.

In other words there's more to designing a course than "hey this looks cool, a hole should go here!"
Alot of designers get all worked up over people taking this approach , for good reason, but I haven't heard one tell a new aspiring designer why they feel that way.

Spend the time.
If you want a great course you are going to have to get personal with the property. Look at the property in different seasons in different conditions and see where all the park goers are and when. This may take a year or more of research but in the long run you'll end up with a better course.
Test run your course if you can with other players (before baskets). I do this and my friends hate me for making them play imaginary courses but its for the good of the sport. If you can play your proposed fairways before cutting do so. It'll tell you if the fairway will work (safety wise in this case) off paper before you actually construct any permanent placements.

I've seen alot of courses that were planned in the "Lets make a course fast" fashion and I can definitely tell they were put together without very much thought or effort.
Take your time and make a course to the best it can be using the property available.

I would strongly recommend lobbying to put the course in an area of the property that will be used only for disc golf. I have been fortunate enough to have this situation for the last 3 courses I designed. I realize that not everyone has this luxury, but I feel that the future of the sport is served best by going in this direction. Most importantly, it increases the safety quotient of the course exponentially because you don't have clueless people walking in your fairways. It also improves the image of the sport.

Some properties are just not suited for course development, mainly because of the safety factor more than anything else. Recognizing this and being able to say "no, we just can't put a safe course on this property" is a noble virtue that will serve disc golf well.

One drawback to this approach is that once the course goes in and the land is cleared better, other groups see the land and want it for themselves. You may want to keep the fairways narrow and leave as many trees as possible to reduce the land's visible potential for other uses.

One drawback to this approach is that once the course goes in and the land is cleared better, other groups see the land and want it for themselves. You may want to keep the fairways narrow and leave as many trees as possible to reduce the land's visible potential for other uses.

This has nothing to do with safety. This is a matter of mutual trust between the designer and the property owner. Certainly, any agreement can be breached, but I don't see any need to design the course in anticipation of the agreement being breached. That's just paranoia. Besides, if you keep the fairways narrow, you will have a short course.

This reminds me of how the US Gov't kept entering into treaties with Native Americans, only to breach them later when it served their desires. This is of course despicable behaviour and if you think the landowner is going to treat disc golf in this manner, then don't build the course.

Such a thing is highly unlikely to happen at New Quarter Park in Williamsburg because the course brings money and prestige to the park. If a course is making the property and its owner look good, then they are not likely to screw things up by allowing bike paths and walking trails to infiltrate the course and create an unsafe situation.

Thanks everyone for the feedback.
I'm sure the board would find some of this useful.
As for me, I think the course I designed is already safe. But it is not my fault that the Park supeintendent is tired of getting sued everytime somebody gets hurt. Plus I am the first person to tell him about DG.
My goal with this thread was to eventually show them(the Board), but with all of the BS about ME not knowing enough I don't think I will. Seems counterproductive since I want them to believe in me and my design. I was just looking for people to write the same things I have Already told them!

By the way
My mentor happens to be one of the premeir course designers in the nation---for sure!
So once again Please do not worry about me!

Thanks

The #1 misconception about disc golf course design is that those who have played disc golf for a long period of time will naturally have the ability to properly design a good course.

Playing experience can be an asset, but good course design comes almost entirely from understanding and applying proper course design principles.


If a person knows how a disc can fly, then it becomes much easier. Agree?
The #1 misconception here is that I know nothing, which is wrong.
This board however is clueless. You would get that if you had read the whole post.
Thanks for your comment LaGrassa....I guess!

I think that I read every line of every post on this thread and believe I have a clue on course design and poorly designed courses. I have played over 500 courses in 35 states and three countries with an eye toward design considerations more than casual play. I always look for how design decisions affect the playability of a course and use of the land.

The fact that you present yourself as knowing everything causes me more concern than any idea that you know nothing.

You are correct that my comment on clearing land had nothing to do with safety, but I stand by my comment since I know of at least three courses that have been taken away or encroached upon where the land had been unusable prior to the disc golfers clearing it for a course.

I hope your project goes well and that you take comments from your mentor with more grace than you take them here.

Sorry this has rubbed you the wrong way, AceEagle1.

But as a member of The Disc Golf Course Designers (DGCD) group I can tell you that this is practically the #1 issue we deal with. Time and time again we see local players, disc golf pros, boy scouts, high school students, park service employees, etc. (who typically have no exposure to course design principles) think that they naturally have the ability to properly design a good disc golf course. Just this week I heard of a course that is going in a few hours from me at a high school, which was reportedly designed by the gym teacher. And not surprisingly, the layout is said to be boring and features many common design flaws, including safety hazards.

I highly recommend that anyone who is interested in course design to check out the Disc Golf Course Designers Group homepage (http://www.discgolfcoursedesigners.org/discgolfwiki/index.php5?title=Main_Page) and consider becoming a member. There are no professional requirements for becoming a member and the group is open to all. I am convinced however that by being a DGCD member which includes having access to the course design guidelines & documents as well as the Yahoo group discussion with fellow DGCD members, it may mean the difference between an average design and a great one, and may help to ensure that safety and liability concerns for your course layout are minimized.

Thanks everyone for the feedback.
I'm sure the board would find some of this useful.
As for me, I think the course I designed is already safe. But it is not my fault that the Park supeintendent is tired of getting sued everytime somebody gets hurt. Plus I am the first person to tell him about DG.
My goal with this thread was to eventually show them(the Board), but with all of the BS about ME not knowing enough I don't think I will. Seems counterproductive since I want them to believe in me and my design. I was just looking for people to write the same things I have Already told them!

By the way
My mentor happens to be one of the premeir course designers in the nation---for sure!
So once again Please do not worry about me!

Thanks


How are we supposed to know what you told the board? HAHA! I'm kidding of course.

In all seriousness there are alot of great articles out there that are better to use for presentations than message board quotes. If anything this whole thread shows and proves how concerned the disc golf designer community is with safety to begin with.

Here's what I suggest;
Don't use what we all we posted here as your presentation to the board.
Look up the Chuck Kennedy and John Houck stuff on this site and Millenium discs. Trust me it's a good start if you want presentation material.

Thanks for the comments.
I will look into joining the Course Design Group.

Next time I start a thread, I promise to write everything upfront. That way maybe people will not think I am going in blind. I have never claimed to know it all, however I am 100% positive that I know more then the Parks board. I am also 100% positive that you guy's do too.

I will reread what has been written and absorb all of the good.

Thanks.