What discs to use? Aiming of thumbers or forehand grip shots? which way will they fade? How will understable overstable discs behave in the air?

good info on another thread "the thumb"
and article at discraft

Adam,

You've asked a lot of questions in your questions (but all very reasonable), and you will get a LOT of responses.

First of all, make sure you're used to 'overhand throwing' prior to really uncorking a few (read: warm up)

Second, no "one disc" is best - each person will throw any 1 disc slightly differently (due to arm angle, launch speed, etc.) than another person. Get suggestions from others but make the decision for yourself. Trial and error is best.

Generally, any "conventional" disc (for a right-handed thrower) will go out left to right and finish right to left (to end up about on the initial launch-line) when throwing a disc-top-toward-you tomahawk; reverse everything for a disc-top-away-from-you thumber.
The Epic will be reverse of this...the Epic's tomahawk will start out left to right, circle up to its apex and tail off (again) left to right; the Epic thumber is reverse (in direction) of that.

Karl

Ps: It'll be interesting to see how many different types of discs are suggested :cool:.

Pps: If you can, check out FDM # 3 for an article on throwing overhands
(yeah, shameless self-promo...but it's still a good article!)

I consider myself an expert on overhands, about the only part of my game I can say this about. For tommahawks (or thumbers) the more overstable disc the slower the flip and more distance you will get. I can throw my flat top firebird 375+. But I use different discs for shorter distances(champion monster for 350+-) (beat max for 325ft+/-) starfire (300ish) all the way down to a beat sidewinder for 250ish shots. With thumbers I only use 3 discs, flick, firbird and beat max. The reason I do this is because the speed of the flip determines the distance (plus wind factors) So arm speed and release angle are the keys,so I can change distances with out changing arm speed or release angle much. Also the slower the flip the straighter they will fly, so you have to adjust your aim. Last tip is that if you pull out a disc too overstable it wont flip over all the way and the results may not be good..... generally I have to use slightly less stable discs for tomahawks.
STORY- when i first learned to throw tomahawks I used one in a tournament on a hole 220ft blocked by trees. I threw a tomahawk that was online; but me and my group couldnt find it. After the tournament someone had turned in my firebird and when i asked were it was, it was laying next to the basket on a completely different hole about 150ft behind the hole i was shooting. I didn't try to throw it hard since the hole was 220ft, but i am guessing it turned over very slow and went really far. This is when i decided i needed some field test work with this shot.

What discs to use?


Elite Z eXtreme. It is by far the best discs to use for overhands. It is both the most stable discs made and one of the slowest. This allows it to stay in the air forever and flip really slow giving you max distance. I only throw it for thumbers. It takes some getting used to but once you master it the disc will become your most prized possession. :D


Aiming of thumbers or forehand grip shots? which way will they fade?


Again I use the eXtreme. I aim directly at the target or just slightly to the left of it for thumbers. The discs moves far left and then swings back to the right at the end. Shots thrown low will roll/skip/bounce in various direction and for various distances once they hit the ground. Shots throw high in the air will stay put close to where they hit the ground (in most cases).

For tomahawks I use a very understable disc since I generally don't throw them as far. I use a monarch because it is fast but somewhat understable. I aim far right of the basket. The monarch flips right away and makes a hard left turn. I throw the thumber any distance up to 375'. I throw the tomahawk from 200' - 275'.


How will understable overstable discs behave in the air?


An understable disc will flip faster, therefore giving you less distance. The faster the disc flips the faster it wants to get to the ground. The slower a disc turns, the longer it can stay in the air. That is how you get the most distance.

Firebird! (For a tumber) just to the left of the basket. If you try to use a fast driver it will flip way too fst and you wont get good D out of it. And I might have to try out the understable driver for a tommy there Jerry. Ive been using the same firebird I use for Thumbers and I get more D then I do with thumbers but its kinda inconsistent. Tommys just seem to be harder to replicate a good shot time after time (for me). But a thumber is a life/stroke saver, learn it, love it!

i am more consistent throwing a tomahawk than a thumber, but both are equally important to me to learn. i don't get a lot of distance from either, but it is a good utility shot to get over or around things.

What discs to use?



Firebird
MAX
Just about any driver Gateway makes. :) Blurr, Spirit , Illusion etc are all good overhand disc.

I personally use a Champ MAX for my thumbs. Its faster than a firebird and seems to fly further. Innova Star MAX (http://www.innovadiscs.com/discs/starmax.html)

Regards
-Cradams

Z Xtreme for max D thumbers, since it has a tendency to "fall" out of the air (at least for me), land on its top, and slide forward finish.
Champ or Star Firebird for pinpoint accuracy thumbers, which tend to land on an edge and fall over without much skip or slide.

Viper for anything under 300' (slow and consistent)
Firebird beyond that.

Z Xtreme for max D thumbers, since it has a tendency to "fall" out of the air (at least for me), land on its top, and slide forward finish.



Try throwing it up more versus out and you might get some extra D and that extra flip to keep it from landing on it's top.

I don't have great distance with the thumber, maxing out around 250 ft. (~325 ft. message board D), so that might be the issue. It seems like when I throw them UP versus OUT, they tend to stall more in the air and drop shorter. Any thoughts?

I don't have great distance with the thumber, maxing out around 250 ft. (~325 ft. message board D), so that might be the issue. It seems like when I throw them UP versus OUT, they tend to stall more in the air and drop shorter. Any thoughts?



throw harder? seriously though, I throw a lot of thumbers & really put a lot into the throw, my max D in warm weather is about 325 (actual D) I liken the power needed to that of a center fielder at the warning track trying to throw to home plate. I also throw them very high, a lot of times to go up & over large trees, if the fairway is tight I always look to the sky for an overhand route. Usually followed by a "wow, never thought of that route" by someone in my group.

I don't have great distance with the thumber, maxing out around 250 ft. (~325 ft. message board D), so that might be the issue. It seems like when I throw them UP versus OUT, they tend to stall more in the air and drop shorter. Any thoughts?



I added extra distance by using a pilates band to build up strength and as important stamina. When you throw them up you really have the snal them hard to get that flip you are after. I stand on the band with my heal and mimic the thumber throw. Similar to the other analogy I throw it like I am an outfiled throwing it from as far away as a I can to home plate. For tunnel thumbers I throw it similar to a short stop throwing across the diamond. Remember, the thumber doesn't always have be used to go over trees, it is pretty handy and going through/under then too :o

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Q3JZk38yc6U/SXCjdR2Jc6I/AAAAAAAADYw/pgWd2S4Cv_k/s400/pilates_band.jpg

That band wont help you throw farther, but it can help with your joints. If youy want to add D to your thumber you need to throw, play catch with a friend with a baseball or football... Eventually start backing up and throwing a little farther. The more sport specific you get the better.