I know there has to be a bunch of disc golfers on here who follow ball golf. anyone been watching the Mercedes Championship the last couple of nights? i think V.J. is lookin like he could have another HUGE year.tiger missed a bunch of stupid putts today and yesterday so he's like 5 back i think.

We hate ball golf. Ball golf is our enemy. Ball golfers wear yellow plaid pants. Ball golfers form country clubs that bar blacks and latinos. Ball golfers only talk about money and stock market and inventments. Ball golfers are old. Ball golfers are snobby and snooty. Ball golfers drink too much. We hate ball golf. Unless they have fly 18 then we like ball golf.

right. if you are into stereotyping. ball golf just happens to be the main bases of our sport IMO.

Where do you think disc golf got its inspiration? Soccer??? Your narrow mindedness is disturbing. All due respect, you can't have one without the other bro.

You guys need to check out that profile, LOL...there's no way to debate, that guy's in trouble EVERY day! :D

I love watching golf too. Phil is my boy, but since he isn't playing in hawaii then i root for Tiger. Tiger showed that I think he will return to his winning ways in 2005. On a side note, Nike makes sweet golf polos that are awesome for disc golf tourneys. Ball golf isn't our enemy! I like all sports.

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Why do y'all take Maynard's post as serious. :D

Anyways, I love to watch ball golf and am planning to finally see one in person this year. I heard last week that Vijay's caddy was looking to get out. I heard he makes almost a million for just being a caddy, but it is still not enough to put up with Vijay. :D

VJ rules! he's elevated the concept of dedication and practice to almost super-human levels, and has reaped the rewards of it. and except for one sadly misstated/misinterpreted comment last year, he is above reproach.

i love watching ball golf, because it can teach so much about course management and tourney-play strategies that is easily translated to disc golf.

Tiger's been sidetracked with his woman. after all the hoopla of the wedding wears off and he gets back to taking his profession seriously, he'll be back in first his fair share. but i'm betting 2005 is VJ's year again, although we'll see a bunch of different winners just like in 2004.

no doubt, V.J. has his game dialed in. if anyone will rival him this year i would have to say it will be tiger, or ernie.

VJ rules! he's elevated the concept of dedication and practice to almost super-human levels, and has reaped the rewards of it. and except for one sadly misstated/misinterpreted comment last year, he is above reproach.

i love watching ball golf, because it can teach so much about course management and tourney-play strategies that is easily translated to disc golf.

Tiger's been sidetracked with his woman. after all the hoopla of the wedding wears off and he gets back to taking his profession seriously, he'll be back in first his fair share. but i'm betting 2005 is VJ's year again, although we'll see a bunch of different winners just like in 2004.



Check out this article on Golf fans Singh-ing the blues? Memo to Vijay and company: Have a little fun out there (http://sports.yahoo.com/pga/news;_ylc=X3oDMTBpb3NrODQyBF9TAzk2ODI5OTkyBHNlYwN0 bQ--?slug=ap-timdahlberg&prov=ap&type=lgns)

Vijay Singh is the worst thing to happen to golf. While a dedicated family man and the hardest working man in golf, he is almost unilaterally disliked for his stand-offish personality. Some 20th century European dictators were more likeable than Singh. His sexist comments on Annika Sorenstam two years ago didn't help his image much, either.

The golf world needs a Tiger resurgence or a big year from the vibrant and youthful Sergio Garcia or the wildly popular blue collar man John Daly. Otherwise we'll yawn through yet another dull season.

VJ's having fun, i have no doubt. just because he's not a poster child for teenage antics doesnt mean he's all uptight. for ridiculous celebrating of what youre paid to do we always have the NFL.

Cultural consideration and awareness is something to factor in before passing judgement on Vijay. Oh wait, this is our country and our sport (our meaning the United States), so continue on creating an expectation for others that they have to abide by to be accepted here (US again).

Yea, you're probably right about being more considerate and aware of his culture. While we're at it, I guess we should allow cheating, too.

what cultures cheats? what pga player cheated?

I have no idea what he is referring to.

If you guys knew anything about Vijay Singh, there is a well known incident where he cheated at the 1985 Indonesian Open and subsequently was suspended from the Asian Tour. He says it was as simple as signing an incorrect scorecard, which just gets a tournament DQ in most golf organizations, but doubt remains. He was also banned from the Australian Tour around that same timeframe for failing to pay back debts. While these incidents were a long, long time ago, no man is "above reproach."

my guess is that after last season he probably got those debts payed off. vijay is a class act IMO much more than tiger and his profanity on the course, or daily and his past addictions.

Whenever I watch a tournament with both Vijay and Tiger in it, it seems as though Tiger always places better. Curious about this, I pulled some stats from last year, Vijay's alleged fantastic year.

Common Tournaments

In 2004, there were 18 tournaments in which both Tiger and Vijay competed.

In those 18 common tournaments in 2004:
Tiger placed higher than Vijay 11 times
Vijay placed higher than Tiger 7 times

In those 18 tournaments:
<table border="1"><tr><td>Tiger</td><td>Vijay</td><td>Category
</td></tr><tr><td>1</td><td>3</td><td>Wins
</td></tr><tr><td>9</td><td>4</td><td>Top 5\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>13</td><td>7</td><td>Top 10\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>0</td><td>1</td><td>Missed Cut
</td></tr><tr><td> </tr></td></table>
Yes,
Tiger had 9 of 18 top 5's, and 13 of 18 top 10's, and
Vijay had 4 of 18 top 5's, and 7 of 18 top 10's.


Solo Tournaments

In 2004, Vijay played in 14 tournaments where Tiger didn't play.

In those 14 tournaments:
<table border="1"><tr><td> Vijay</td><td>Category
</td></tr><tr><td>6</td><td>Wins
</td></tr><tr><td>10</td><td>Top 5\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>12</td><td>Top 10\'s
</td></tr><tr><td> </tr></td></table>
Let's put Vijay's Common and Solo tournaments side-by-side to better compare.

<table border="1"><tr><td>Common</td><td>Solo</td><td>Category
</td></tr><tr><td>18</td><td>14</td><td># of tournaments
</td></tr><tr><td>3</td><td>6</td><td>Wins
</td></tr><tr><td>4</td><td>10</td><td>Top 5\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>7</td><td>12</td><td>Top 10\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>1</td><td>0</td><td>Missed Cut
</td></tr><tr><td> </tr></td></table>
For completeness, in 2004, Tiger played in 3 tournaments where Vijay didn't play.

In those 3 tournaments:
<table border="1"><tr><td>Tiger</td><td>Category
</td></tr><tr><td>1</td><td>Wins
</td></tr><tr><td>2</td><td>Top 5\'s
</td></tr><tr><td>3</td><td>Top 10\'s
</td></tr><tr><td> </tr></td></table>

These results are for 2004 only. The stats are very similar, and even more favorable to Tiger, when 2003 is included as well.

So far in 2005: 2 tounaments played. 1 common tournament, where Tiger placed higher. 1 Vijay solo tournament, where Vijay won.

Commentary

After looking at these results, a couple things become clear.

The first is, Vijay does markedly better in tournaments that Tiger isn't playing in. There are at least 2 possible explanations for this: 1) The tournaments are weaker, and/or 2) There is something mental/intimidating going on. Number 1 would be fairly easy to prove, while number 2 will remain a matter of debate.

The second thing to notice is that in common tournaments, aside from the 3 wins for Vijay to 1 win for Tiger, Tiger fares much better on the whole. There's only one explanation I can think of for this. Namely, despite the POY honors, despite the money title, despite the World Ranking -- Tiger is simply a better player. Even after Vijay's much-lauded 2004 season.

Beyond comparing results from tournaments in which they both played, I can't think of a more fair way to compare the two players.

charlse howell III just had it bounce out of the cup and into the water. that was the craziest shot i've seen in a LONG TIME. :D

I had looked away and heard the noise it made. I thought it had hit the top of the flag. When I saw the replay, I saw that it came out of the cup and bounced 30ft into the water. Just crazy.

Although much more common in disc golf, especially at the Fountain, for one example.

I saw that! It was his last hole. If it stays in he's tied for the lead... instead it bounces out and rolls into the water.

Luke has been +3 since the match went off the air. Tiger and Tom Lehman are now tied for first... two ahead of Luke.

It was a 3 stroke swing for Howell bouncing out and into the water... should be interesting to see how much money that cost him.

Tiger finished with pars and birdies, Lehman finished with pars and bogeys. Tiger wins by 3. Howels bounce cost him a tie for first. He dropped to a 3 way tie for second. Could have been worse for him.

Yes, Howell definately deserved to make his final chip-in..i dont know if he would have beaten Tiger in the play-off, tho...but who knows, Tiger did get really lucky on his approach shot on the 18th...

Howell would have beat Tiger in a playoff....his game was on sunday more than Tigers.....so many putts the skinny boy missed by centimeters......

Still looking for fantasy golfers! The game doesn't start until Feb. 3rd.


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i'm in.

Last call for new signups!

And for those who are already in, don't forget to get your lineup set for the tournament this weekend.


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Mickelson posted a 60 (-11) today! Nine birdies and an eagle; he holed out for deuce on the par four 17th hole. A strong showing this weekend could be a springboard to another green jacket in Augusta...

I'm glad I have him in Fantasy Golf!

mickelson is smoking everyon at the PB pro-am. he shot 62 at spyglass hill on thursday, for those you do not know about spyglass it is SIC! :D

Match Play predictions: Gotta go with Tiger.

Match Play predictions: Gotta go with Tiger.



Bzzzzzt. El Tigre was upset by Nick O'Hern (who?) in the second round. Singh, Weir, and Padraig Harrington are all history, too.

Go Kirk Triplett! (15th seed in the Ben Hogan bracket)

Bzzzzzt. El Tigre was upset by Nick O'Hern (who?) in the second round.



The kid who had no idea he was playing Tiger in the second round. And who, upon hearing it was Tiger, stated, "Good. That's good. I'm playing well and it's match play. Bring it."

How about Toms? His irons were laser guided those last two days. Two of the shortest hitters off of the tee in the finals. Just goes to show ya, approach and short game are everything!! :D

yeah, david was in the zone :D

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20050306/capt.fljc11203062336.doral_fljc112.jpg

^^^^????^^^^

WTG Tiger, #1 again.

FUNK WINS!!! :Dits always fun to be pulling for a guy all week and then see him in the winners circle come sunday, or in this tournaments case- Monday :)

There is already a 2005 PGA Tour thread here:

2005 PGA Tour (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Board=Miscellaneous&Number=292480&Searchpage=0&Main=292418&Search=true&#Post292480)

I think Vijay is #1 again now.

guess who created that one? :Dmy other profile was deleted so all my posts are gone, so i figured all threads i created would be gone as well. MY APOLOGIES TO YOU JEFF :o

had to post this from the PGA website :D

"He (Funk) laughed about making the 5-minute trip to his house Saturday to take a nap during a rain delay, then waking up to a call from his caddie Mark Long, who told him to hurry up and get back. "

What a luxury, no wonder he won. It was literally in his backyard!!! :D

guess who created that one? :Dmy other profile was deleted so all my posts are gone, so i figured all threads i created would be gone as well.



Hmmm, weird. I can do a search and find the old thread but it doesn't otherwise show up. Guess we'll go with this new one! MY APOLOGIES TO YOU PAUL.

It's time to start thinking Masters predictions. I will go out on a limb and say we will see another classic battle between Tiger and Phil. It will be Phil in a repeat! :eek: GO LEFTY!!!! :D

Singh all the way. ;)

Hmm...I think I'm going to predict the "Big Easy" (Ernie Els) winning the Masters!!

i'd love to see ernie win, he's definatley my favorite of the top 4 ranked players. retief goosen deserves a jacket as well

Watch for Rod Pampling, he will be playing in his first Masters. I had the pleasure of playing a round of golf with Rod.

Also, watch out for Zach Johnson, an Iowa native!!

zach has displayed some serious skill on the green FOR SURE :D

Watch out for Sergio as well, however I think the Padraig has a good chance as well. Down with the big four!

Watch for Rod Pampling, he will be playing in his first Masters. I had the pleasure of playing a round of golf with Rod.
McCabe


Tied for 4th!! keep it up Rod!!

Tiger birdied 7-13 this morning to take the lead. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

WOW!!! what a finish!!! :eek:

Almost a big time choke. But then Tiger does not choke.

I wish i could have watched it on TV, had to settle for round by round totals over the net from work today.

That was a sick chip shot that Tiger made on 16 for the birdie

you can say that again... sheesh! that ball was stopped, i swear. nike sure is loving it too! that logo on the ball was sitting there for everyone to see.

msm reported it stopped for 2 secods before it fell in.

You kinda wonder if the cameras were on delay and they held it there for Nike sponsorship.

i was watching live and there is NO WAY it stopped for a whole 2 seconds. ;) they very well may have slowed it for highlight$

I think they (illegally) rounded up from 1.4 seconds... /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

i got to see the putt on the news this morning. Wow, that was cool. The ball did stop right on the rim and then you hear the crowd go 'haaa' then suddenly it falls in. how cool is that.

LOL
first it was a pitch not a putt.
And 2 seconds only applys to putts.
that ball was not at rest 2 seconds.
What I though was cool is how it stalled, the nike swoop was dead center of the camara shot and then it fell.
That is a commerical!
poor Chris D ! so close AGAIN!

tiger is the man

DiMarco will get a major. He is the new Phil. the best player to never win a major. He has been in a playoff for the last two majors, had the ONLY winning record at the Ryder cup out of all the US guys, and was in the match play final this year. That is no fluke.This guy is good and I love his never say die attitude.

DiMarco is the man :D.

woods is rolling, this will be fun to watch.

there is going to be some split screen tiger woods' 05 x-box action on the old course at st. andrews with the british open at my house this weekend.

Anyone...? thoughts?

who's he? a new member of Team Innova?

The dude's a freak...... in much the same way KC is a freak. Pressure just sharpens his edge and increases his focus. That display he put on last Sunday, especially on #18, was incredible. Perfect drive, absolutely perfect approach, and, what, 22 or 23 foot putt dead in the mouth for the one stroke win. Even my wife was whooping. :cool:

I switched to Gillette after seeing this. :D
Tiger Woods (http://www.gillettechampions.com/player.html?flv=standard/en_us/flvs/champions_tv/tiger_interview.flv&amp;w=500&amp;locale=en_us)

Funny...

"You never arrive."

Do ya Kenny? :D

I've lost interest in Tiger. He deserves every accolade he gets and is a true phenom but the Golf channel has over saturated his legend and I've just grown tired of him. I'm sure jealosy plays a part in my feelings too :D

It's funny, I was listening to a sports report on the radio yesterday. They were talking about the current PGA event in Doral. The first thing they say is that Tiger and Phil are 2 shots back, not who is leading.

Tiger is great, no doubt about it. However, these days one would think that he is the only person playing golf.

OMG!!!tiger just made a HUGE putt on the last hole to tie rocco.GO TIGER :D:D

Go Rocco!

:p :D

I bet tiger wins by 3 after tommorows round.

I just made that same bet with my buddy...

I wanted Rocco to win but unless Tiger's knee falls off I doubt it.

I just hope he doesnt take a 6 on the first hole.

I'm a huge Tiger Fan. The smart money is on Tiger.

But c'mon how can ya not root for a guy as nice and as deserving as Rocco?! This will likely be his last ReaL chance at a Major. Tiger has many more in him.

Both great golfers, gonna be a fun round of golf.

Go Rocco!

ROCCO!!!!!!

I wonder what the best therapy/medication money can buy Tiger getting right now is, and what it will be in the morning.

Its like Yeti against Climo....

Q.
I wonder what the best therapy/medication money can buy Tiger getting right now is, and what it will be in the morning.



A. Mrs. Tiger Woods ;)

http://www.thehollywoodgossip.com/images/gallery/elin-nordegren.jpg

Its like Yeti against Climo....



Climo with a bum knee. !

The interesting part is that Rocco wanted to be paired with Tiger. Now he gets the whole course and all of the spectators to just himself and Tiger.

He's going to have a great time no matter what.

Tiger started off with a lot of bogeys this morning and if the does that again then Rocco will take it. My money is on Rocco taking it on the 1st playoff hole.

thought they were playing a full 18... is it sudden death then?

According to USGA rules, they are playing an 18-hole playoff. Lowest score over those 18 holes wins. If it's still tied at that point, they go into sudden death holes.

I'm hoping that Rocco wins... Not only is he a super guy but hes from the 724. REP IT ROCCO!

oh, and how beastly is Tiger?!? un-friggin-real.....

An 18 hole playoff early today after this weekend's televised, prime-time drama is so anti-climactic. Terrible way to break the tie, USGA.

Why not co-champions like double gold medals in the Olympics? No reason ties need to be broken in any sport for the final championship other than maniacal adherence to some person or team being declared number 1.

An 18 hole head-to-head best man wins competition is a terrible tie breaker?!?.. I dont see that, not at all.

Sudden death, you play one bad hole, its over. Thats no fun.

play 18, may the best man win. Give the crowd lots to cheer about. Give golf lovers more of what they want, views of a beautiful course with two of the best from that weekend playing tooth and nail for the title (and a large sum of money).

GO ROCCO!

Why not co-champions like double gold medals in the Olympics? No reason ties need to be broken in any sport for the final championship other than maniacal adherence to some person or team being declared number 1.



Chuck, sometimes I cannot agree with you enough. This is not one of those times.

to quote Herm Edwards... "YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME!"

Not necessary to have only one winner in sports. Why? Not sure this has ever been justified, especially when tiebreaking is many times an inadequate and fluky process. It's a throwback to needing only one person as king, survival of the fittest. You would think by now civilized views would accept co-champions like double golds.

I see your point but look at it this way, If you had a chance to beat the best in the world would you settle for a tie or would you want that chance to beat him out right? Plus, your talking about a HUGE difference in pay.

I feel all first place ties should be broken (Herm Edwards - "You play to win the game."), but the 18 hole playoff on the following day like today's US Open is terrible, likewise a sudden-death playoff isn't very sporting either. I like the way the R&amp;A does it across the pond for their Open, having a 4-hole playoff. I personally feel this is the best way to do a tie-breaker in golf.

dont take this the wrong way, I'm just trying to dig deeper into why you feel this way Chuck.....
_______________________________________

... then why even keep score?

If there is a co-winner then why not make everyone a winner?
You play, you win. One tie we all tie. Place CLEARLY doesnt matter.

Can you honestly tell me you have never thrown off, or played a sudden death hole, for a trophy or spot at an event? You know you have.

Why didn't you just conceed the position via civilized view if you think that place does not matter in any sporting event? You didnt because we all want to win, thats why. As much as you say you think this and that, deep down in that hole we have that goes rarely tapped, we all want the "w"...

Thats what the spirit of competition is all about Chuck! Topping the other competitors! Then, when its said and done, look your foe in the eye and shake hands and call it a day.

Winner goes home happy, loser gets that fire that drives us to want to compete another day.

Herm Edwards was right... "We play to win the game."

Chuck,
That is a bad mentality. Winner is one. One person, one team, one animal. This is a growing trend in DG as well. Reward everyone so noone leaves the sport. Yeah, everyone wins. This isn't little league.
I do agree however, that there should have been a four hole playoff yesterday. There was over 50,000 live spectators plus millions of home viewers. Would have been great for golf. I dont know how many people stayed overnight to watch this next day.

I'm not saying I have a strong belief in the co-champions thing. Just throwing it out there for discussion. It's just such an ingrained concept of domination, survival of the fittest in life that I'm not sure is needed in sports. We don't usually break ties below #1 in most sports but the reason to do so should be just as compelling as for #1 if you follow the domination idea and determining a pecking order. The U.S. Open would have been just as compelling if Tiger got the chance to become Co-Champ with the final putt as going into a playoff of any kind and it would have been more fair.

the us open for playoff spectating is weird. I went to Oakmont last year with my pops (since its ten minutes from my house) on father's day for the final round. We were made aware upon entry that should there be a playoff we would have to get our voucher WHEN WE LEFT THAT DAY and pay a much reduced rate to see mondays action. Well, that didnt happen when the smoker, who couldnt even make the cut this year, won at Oakmont.

I still totally disagree. 18 holes for the glory. You've come this far... put on the gloves and go a full title bout. None of this wishy washy sudden death and/or 4 hole crap. We arent playing for a $500 weekend one day prize here. ITS THE US OPEN OF GOLF. A MAJOR.

If you tied at the USDGC would you want a sudden death playoff? A 4 Holer? NO, you'd want your skills to have a chance to even themselves out over 18 to ensure one bad hole didnt KILL your chance at a once in a lifetime opportunity. If you disagree with that, well lets hope you are one day placed in that position, then we'll see how you TRULY feel.

and thanks for clarifying Chuck, although I still respectfully disagree.

I say four hole yesterday, because they didnt have enough light for the 18. All those spectators would have been going crazy!
Since its today, 18 holes is fine. Been there done that, not for millions, but a difference of a $1,000.

The fact that society would put such importance on winning any tournament by requiring 18 more holes in golf or a full extra game in any sport is pretty sad. Call them Co-Champs and move on. There's always another tournament, another season, another year, new champions.

The fact that society would put such importance on winning any tournament by requiring 18 more holes in golf or a full extra game in any sport is pretty sad. Call them Co-Champs and move on. There's always another tournament, another season, another year, new champions.



WTF? Are you against dodgeball as well. Look up the definition of 'sport.'

The fact that society would put such importance on winning any tournament by requiring 18 more holes in golf or a full extra game in any sport is pretty sad. Call them Co-Champs and move on. There's always another tournament, another season, another year, new champions.



A previously poster put it best: Chuck, sometimes I cannot agree with you enough. This is not one of those times.

Ask any pro golfer and he'll tell you that nothing matters more than an event victory, and especially a major. Not the money, getting a top 10 finish, the quality of the course, qualifying for the Ryder Cup, earning next year's Tour card, etc.; they all pale in comparison to getting the win.

A pro golfer's career is measured by his tour victories and majors, if any. Nothing else is more important.

You're all arguing that it should be that way because it is that way, not WHY it should continue to be that way. I'm saying there's no compelling reason not to have co-champions for sports and the precedent is already there at the highest level - Olympics.

OK whatever. Why even play? We're all champions for showing up..... If your not playing to beat the field, you're playing a casual round. Olympics is different. Its about Unitty.

I'm a huge Tiger Fan. The smart money is on Tiger.

But c'mon how can ya not root for a guy as nice and as deserving as Rocco?! This will likely be his last ReaL chance at a Major. Tiger has many more in him.

Both great golfers, gonna be a fun round of golf.

Go Rocco!



I'm with you! Go Tigocco!

Why not co-champions like double gold medals in the Olympics? No reason ties need to be broken in any sport for the final championship other than maniacal adherence to some person or team being declared number 1.



There's no "I" in "Golf." :D

Chuck, it's a sport. It needs to end in victory. There is no shame in having a victor, you know that right?

Frankly, it's bizarre to conceive otherwise.

Frankly, it's bizarre to conceive otherwise.



:eek:... :cool:

11 minutes til tee time!
GO ROCCO.... REP THE 724!

US OPEN LIVE PLAYOFF SCORING (http://www.majorschampionships.com/usopen/2008/scoring/)

WOW, anyone else get that weird no sound interview that lasted about four minutes. All i heard was birds chirping, and couple of swings, and just Rocco's mouth moving.

i know you like to think outside the box and all Chuck and I can usually at least see both sides to a viewpoint but I just cant here... can you think what the superbowl would be like if both teams played and called it a tie? how about the stanley cup or NBA finals? world series of poker?

I dont think its necessarily a case of 'its the way it always has been so thats the way it should be' i think its more of... it just makes sense and is almost natural.

to say Co-Champ is an oxymoron much as is Pro Disc Golf Association Amateur ;)

I also totally agree that they should've just played 4/5 holes yesterday while everyone was hyped up, watching (there and on TV) instead of drawing it out

Tiger up 1 after 2...

Co Champions?
I have to quote a movie here:
"what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul. "

Rocco up 1 after 3

Co Champions?
I have to quote a movie here:
"what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul. "



I FRIGGIN LOVE BILLY MADISON. Gill, ten punk points for you son!

C'MON ROCCO!!! TAME THE BEAST!

US OPEN LIVE PLAYOFF SCORING (http://www.majorschampionships.com/usopen/2008/scoring/)



Thanks Stella!

no prob Hero....

btw, all square thru 5.....

Rocco Mediate__5 4 2 4 5 20
Tiger Woods____4 4 4 4 4 20

you can watch it on the computer

http://sports.espn.go.com/broadband/espn360/player

if your work doesnt block it you can... :(

and msnbc has it live, which I can get to, but the video and audio is so aZe#[email protected] up you cant even bear to watch two minutes of it....

Tiger is beginning to break Rocco down!!

Go Tigger!

its Rocco's time to shine M to the Cizzle.

TAME THAT BEAST. TWO STROKES AINT A THANG ROCCO!!!!!!!!!!

ONE STROKE AINT A THANG ROCCO.... GET IT!

thru 8
Rocco Mediate__5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 31
Tiger Woods____4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 30

Rocco Mediate 5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 6 37
Tiger Woods 4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 5 35

GO GIMP GO :D

if 360 doesn't work go to the usopen.com site.

wow... Tiger is going in for the kill now!

Rocco Mediate 5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 6 5 42
Tiger Woods 4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 5 4 39

three up. ouch. C'MON ROCCO!

now only two! I CANT WAIT TO GET HOME AND WATCH THIS ON DVR!

looks like Tiger's lead could be gone on 12!

did anyone else hear what Tiger just yelled after hitting out of the sand?! never heard something like that one TV and wonder if its only cause im listening/watching online

HE said it on TV also :)

I heard him, sounded like he said God ****!!

k... just curious... yeah it sounded like it was almost a G.D. but he kind of cut it off @ the end

hitting a shot like that then telling God to **** your game isnt going to help things much ;)

Tiger ALWAYS cusses

I have NBC's audio only, their video feed is struggling

Tiger ALWAYS cusses



i dont even want to hear you say anything about people saying stupid things... i was seriously close to hitting you this weekend

Wit said it perfectly "no wonder MTL is single"

Tiger ALWAYS cusses



i dont even want to hear you say anything about people saying stupid things... i was seriously close to hitting you this weekend

Wit said it perfectly "no wonder MTL is single"



<font color="green"> BIG change </font>

hey ROCco

:eek:

Tiger w/ an amazing comeback/approach... Rocco answers with a great putt!!!

Rocco winning by 1 going into the final 3 holes!!

ROCCO!!!!

Rocco up 1 with 3 to go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is exciting... :)

Per my Audio they are teeing on #16

Per my Video they are teeing on the short par 4 still

Wow this match up is something else.

This is exciting... :)



no kidding... almost as exciting as listening to maceman and following the Dots @ USDGC!!!

Wow this match up is something else.



not really...... I mean look at the one leged man trying to keep up with Rocco..... let be reel tiger is the best ever it shows nothing for anyone beating tiger when he is broke but shows a lot for tiger to beat everyone else at there best :eek: :eek: not taking anything away from rocco for beating everyone else just saying^^^^^

Rocco Mediate 5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 6 5 3 4 4 3 3 3 62
Tiger Woods 4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 5 4 4 5 4 4 4 3 63

Rocco hits decent off the tee on 17... Tiger keeps it in the middle

this is crazy... i dont even like ball golf! :P

Rocco Mediate 5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 6 5 3 4 4 3 3 3 62
Tiger Woods 4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 5 4 4 5 4 4 4 3 63

Rocco Mediate 5 4 2 4 5 4 4 3 6 5 3 4 4 3 3 3 62
Tiger Woods 4 4 4 4 4 3 3 4 5 4 4 5 4 4 4 3 63

Rocco hits decent off the tee on 17... Tiger keeps it in the middle

this is crazy... i dont even like ball golf! :P



LOL I sure have enjoyed watching this one :D

A hurt Tiger Woods is still better than most professionals, especially at Torrey Pines. Just think if he were healthy he would have beat the field by ten strokes.

This is the best 18-hole playoff I've ever seen.

Wow this match up is something else.



not really...... I mean look at the one leged man trying to keep up with Rocco..... let be reel tiger is the best ever it shows nothing for anyone beating tiger when he is broke but shows a lot for tiger to beat everyone else at there best :eek: :eek: not taking anything away from rocco for beating everyone else just saying^^^^^



whatever

If Rocco wins he will not only be the oldest US Open winner ever, but he will be the oldest MAJOR CHAMPIONSHIP WINNER ever, he deserves credit for even being in this playoff, and Tiger is far from being one-legged and broke down.

Wow this match up is something else.



not really...... I mean look at the one leged man trying to keep up with Rocco..... let be reel tiger is the best ever it shows nothing for anyone beating tiger when he is broke but shows a lot for tiger to beat everyone else at there best :eek: :eek: not taking anything away from rocco for beating everyone else just saying^^^^^



whatever

If Rocco wins he will not only be the oldest US Open winner ever, but he will be the oldest MAJOR CHAMPIONSHIP WINNER ever, he deserves credit for even being in this playoff, and Tiger is far from being one-legged and broke down.



Just saying giving tons of credit to someone for beating some one that is not at the top of there game is not something that will be remembered...... remember when tiger was just recovering from knee surgery and he lost :p

Wit said it perfectly "no wonder MTL is single"



I'm single b/c I dumped my gf! :D

BigE.. it will be remembered. It will be remembered because at the beginning of the week NO ONE gave Rocco a chance to be playing for the top. Heck, peeps thought he may not even make the cut, like Angel, HA. Hes like 180th or so something crazy in the world. we call that the long shot....

and hes a players player. that speaks loads.

Tiger's TIger. bum knee or not hes expected to play well. that may not be fair, but thats how it is

1 up 1 to play. I'm praying Tiger doesnt get the Eagle.

what if they have to keep playing?!? WOW.... that never hit me until now. 90 holes of golf to a tie.

DONT LET IT HAPPEN ROCCO... SHUT THE DOOR and GET IT!

Tiger not at the top of his game? I think not, he is in a playoff for the US Open isn't he? How did he fare in the Open last year with an un-operated-on knee?

Tiger in the middle of fairway on 18. He should be abou 180 out.

please dont eagle Tiger!!!!!!! Rocco cant reach it safely.

this time one week ago Rocco was in playoff (11 players for 7 spots) during QUALIFYING

M to the C keep the play by play coming... I cant watch and its killin me!!!!!!!

eagle for the win?

tigers on in 2

Tiger in the middle of fairway on 18. He should be abou 180 out.



217... and hiTTing an iron

30-40 feet for eagle

eagle to tie maybe

"Rocco with a very nice third shot to about 20 feet left of the hole. Each player will have an uphill run at it from there. If they both make, we have a playoff. If they both two-putt, we also have a playoff. If one makes and the other doesn't, this thing is over. Easy as that."

Post deleted by JoshC

I CANT WAIT TO GET HOME AND WATCH THIS ON DVR!

"Woods pushes it to the right and knocks the eagle attempt about 3 feet past the hole. Has that left for birdie."

makable 20 footer

"Rocco for the win ... and he misses on the left side, hits it a few feet past the hole."

C'mon Rocco!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wow got back just in time

"Woods makes a short putt for birdie."

SUDDEN DEATH!!!!!!!!!

NNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. where does the sudden death start?

hopefully hole 1 cuz Rocco has Tiger in the first 5 holes.

sudden death.

I believe it's hole 10 and then 18 if necessary.

7, 8, &amp; 18 in rotation

Co-Champs...

LOL

tiger was -1 on those and rocco was even

GO TIGER!!!!!!!!
This is a great match.i think tiger will get him on hole 8

c'mon Rocco... TAME THAT TIGER N'AT!

co-champ= no champ

exactly

tiger in the fairway and roccos in the trap.

Rocco's tee shot is in the bunker and against on the lip on the first hole of sudden death...this match is over.

uh-oh

Thanks for keeping us posted on the happenings. I'm dying here at work not being able to watch it. Keep it up MC!!

Rocco hitting out of the fairway (180 to the hole)... hits it into the crowd :(

rocco looks like he is hurting after hes second shot.Looks like tiger might get him.rocco is in the crowd on his second shot.

I think tiger is going to park it.COME ON TIGER.what a great battle.Give some props to rocco for shoting good.

Tiger puts it on the green... Rocco may be finished :(

even if he loses I highly doubt Rocco would've ever wanted to take something like a co champ option

Rocco takes a drop.

Rocco's ball found a "car" on the fairway and gets a drop.

Good run Rocco... Good run indeed.

once again the master takes it home. Is there anything Tiger cant do on a golf course? Right now I dont think so.

That was a ok chip shot by rocco.

Rocco for a 20 footer on the green... Rocco needs to make his and Tiger to miss

I think tiger should lay up kinda.Because i dont think rocco will make his putt.

"Instead of dropping two club lengths from the bleachers, there is a drop zone some 10 yards away that Mediate will get to drop his ball in. Great break"

Tiger missed his putt for the win.But wait rocco still has to make his putt.

Rocco's ball found a "car" on the fairway and gets a drop.



yup... except this drop zone &amp; hazard was established before the tournament and you dont hear any complaining about it because of that. the announcer did mention its amazing how much these drop zones have helped the speed of play this weekend

Rocco misses his putt.

Rocco misses

great show Roc

Tiger WINS

and it was off the fairway, past the cart path

What a great battle.

tiger wins with a par on hole 7

Co-Champs would have been more fair. Unsatisfying for a single hole fluke to decide it. They could probably play that hole 20 times and Tiger might not lose more than one time. Fluky, fluky, fluky.

Tiger wins!!! No co champs this time!

****!

Unsatisfying for a single hole fluke to decide it.



.... Chuck, if you didnt realize they played 91 holes. Thats alot of flukes. This was a battle and Tiger outlasted like we all thought he would. Rocco just showed him what guts and playing for the love of the game can get you..... and Tiger threw Rocco much of the same right back, guts and love of the game.

what drama. hope that worlds 08 is like this. What a DVD that would make. WOWZER

Co-Champs would have been more fair. Unsatisfying for a single hole fluke to decide it. They could probably play that hole 20 times and Tiger might not lose more than one time. Fluky, fluky, fluky.



They played 91 holes!!! At some point you have to draw the line!!!

And please Chuck abandon this "co-champ" line of thinking. It is antithesis to everything that the ideals of competition and sport are defined by.

Very memorable finish. What will it do to Rocco's celebrity when he hits the Champions Tour in a few years?

Though this probably was Rocco's last chance at a PGA major victory, you have to give it to the BEST that's ever played...

http://www.nbc5i.com/2008/0616/16614956.jpg

It's funny, I was listening to a sports report on the radio yesterday. They were talking about the current PGA event in Doral. The first thing they say is that Tiger and Phil are 2 shots back, not who is leading.

Tiger is great, no doubt about it. However, these days one would think that he is the only person playing golf.



2008 US open champ

Why even play? We're all champions for showing up..... If your not playing to beat the field, you're playing a casual round.


Having Co-Champs is not about having more winners but truly making winning singularly meaningful. If a sport determines that four rounds or seven games is appropriate to decide their champion, then anything less doesn't cut it which includes all tiebreakers. If a single winner can't be determined after the specified number of games or tournament format, then either call them Co-Champs on No-Champs. Playing on 18-hole round isn't any more legit after four rounds than it would be if Rocco and Tiger got together any other time and played 18 to determine the best U.S. player.

If anything, the fear of ending up co-champs would be the incentive to play that much harder to win outright. When gladiators fought to the death and both died, who was the winner? The fans? In bag tags or Chess or possibly boxing(?), you have to defeat the person to win it. Tie the current champ and they retain the title. Either no title should be awarded with ties or all tied are awarded. It's the only fair competitive thing to do. Anything else is a sham title subject to flukery not skill.

I feel confident lumping Woods 'in' with Gretzky and Climo...&amp; STILL giving the edge to KC.

Herm Edwards was right... "We play to win the game."


Would someone PLEASE remind Herm that he said this...sheesh. /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Why even play? We're all champions for showing up..... If your not playing to beat the field, you're playing a casual round.


Having Co-Champs is not about having more winners but truly making winning singularly meaningful. If a sport determines that four rounds or seven games is appropriate to decide their champion, then anything less doesn't cut it which includes all tiebreakers. If a single winner can't be determined after the specified number of games or tournament format, then either call them Co-Champs on No-Champs. Playing on 18-hole round isn't any more legit after four rounds than it would be if Rocco and Tiger got together any other time and played 18 to determine the best U.S. player.

If anything, the fear of ending up co-champs would be the incentive to play that much harder to win outright. When gladiators fought to the death and both died, who was the winner? The fans? In bag tags or Chess or possibly boxing(?), you have to defeat the person to win it. Tie the current champ and they retain the title. Either no title should be awarded with ties or all tied are awarded. It's the only fair competitive thing to do. Anything else is a sham title subject to flukery not skill.



what might you and others label as the most memorable USDGC finish ever? Other than Kenny's amazing final round last year that is fresh on our minds... I think most would agree it was the Barry - Kenny battle with all of the playoff holes. If they had a co-champs dont you think that would be looked back upon as one of the worst finishes ever?

start a poll... i'd be amazed to see more than 3 in 100 that would agree with you.

I don't expect agreement with many holding tradition bound perspectives. However, the precedent is already there in several sports that agree that someone or team needs to completely win the competition as designed in terms of the number of games, points, minutes, whatever to unseat the current champ or proclaim a new one. Either that or they award co-titles. Anything beyond that to attempt a tiebreak is cheating everyone from a valid, fully complete competition. I'm surprised those who truly believe that fairly determining a true winner in any sport with a complete competition would not support that perspective?

Either play another 4 rounds in the case of golf, another best of 7 if the teams are tied at the end of regulation in the seventh game or call them co-champs, or if one of the tied people or teams is defending champ, they remain champ, or do not declare a winner at all in the case of the gladiators who kill each other. Tiebreaks are a convenient and cheesey way to force resolution into a winner and loser when it's not truly the case.

In the case of Kenny and Barry, of course it was exciting to watch but you were really watching a sudden death competition, not the US Championship, although they decided to call the winner of the separate sudden death competition the US Champ. If I heard correctly, they had agreed to split the cash before the playoff which is not uncommon at this level.

That's kind of like soccer. To increase "excitement," they just skip having a "game" like many sports with scoring. They start with the equivalent of a 90-minute tiebreaker for any hope of getting a score most of the time. And they still need to tiebreak that tiebreak sometimes. (This was just to bug LaGrassa :p No disrespect intended for the favorite sport of millions).

Tiger in the middle of fairway on 18. He should be abou 180 out.



217... and hiTTing an iron



3 iron..

What Tiger does is so much more difficult than what Climo does there is no comparison.

Agreed.

But if disc golf ever gets to the level where you have to be 1000 rated to compete in pro events...

OK, I have officially changed my stance on the 18 hole playoff format. I am all for it now. I watched online while at work yesterday, then watched it all again on ESPN Classic last night. Great stuff.

Having Co-Champs is not about having more winners but truly making winning singularly meaningful.


your choice of adverb is hilarious

If a single winner can't be determined after the specified number of games or tournament format, then either call them Co-Champs on No-Champs. Playing on 18-hole round isn't any more legit after four rounds than it would be if Rocco and Tiger got together any other time and played 18 to determine the best U.S. player.

If anything, the fear of ending up co-champs would be the incentive to play that much harder to win outright. When gladiators fought to the death and both died, who was the winner? The fans? In bag tags or Chess or possibly boxing(?), you have to defeat the person to win it. Tie the current champ and they retain the title. Either no title should be awarded with ties or all tied are awarded. It's the only fair competitive thing to do. Anything else is a sham title subject to flukery not skill.

I vote for the following mess of the English language.....


Having Co-Champs is not about having more winners but truly making winning singularly meaningful



isn't "co" more than one and singularly respentative of one entity?!? am I the only one that's confused? :confused:

So typical of many posters who aren't able to counter with a reasoned response. You can't provide a compelling argument to counter the point of view and try to belittle the post or poster. No one has put forth a defense of tiebreaking on logical merits, just tradition and convenience.

There is defense needed when the offense stumbles before the ball is snapped.

I believe most true sportsmen would prefer a single champion. Your analogy to the gladiators is pretty much off base because if I'm not mistaken, those men (or possibly some women) weren't there because they paid to compete to see who is best. They were there because they were slaves doing whatever their masters told them to do, or die. Most would probably choose to at least try to their best and die trying, rather than be slaughtered at the whim of a maniacal tyrant.

Chuck, you really need to get out more and get some fresh air and sunshine on your skin. I've heard it can provide healthy benefits and ease the mental suffering of overly-stressed people.

No one has put forth a defense of tiebreaking on logical merits, just tradition and convenience.



what are you looking for exactly Chuck?!? IN A SPORT A WINNER IS TO BE DECIDED, thats not tradition, thats fact. THATS THE WHOLE SPIRIT OF COMPETITION, to crown A winner... NOT WINNERS. I DO NOT SEE WHY YOU CANT GRASP THIS.

what more do you need in regards to reason Chuck? You MUST have something in mind. Please, enlighten as you are ALWAYS right.

and to add, this is the most absurd conversation on this MB that I have ever had the grace of laying my eyes upon.

I agree there should be one champion determined in the manner decided by the sport. My disagreement is when the winner is not decided that way via a less than complete competition, i.e. tiebreaks that do not include the whole series of games, rounds, whatever. In the event of ties, either do the full competition again or no champ.

I don't understand why you think this is anti-winner, anti-competition. I would prefer ties to be no-champs rather than co-champs. Neither competitor rose to the top in the competition format provided for that sport. So what? They split the purse and hopefully there's a winner the following year. It happens regularly over the years when there's a war or strike shortened season. Why is it that those records or champions have an asterisk? It's because they didn't feel they completed the full competition format. What would be so wrong about not having a champion when a tie occurs when there are already years without a champion?

I've played several tiebreaks over my career and without question, most were biased toward one competitor just like Tiger getting hole 7 at Torrey. I've lost with the other player throwing a four ricochet ace that is in the World records site maintained by Hosfeld. Neither win nor loss by tiebreak has ever felt right.

when we were 4 years old and our parents wanted to make us feel good they would not let us know we wernt last ina race because they didnt want to hurt our feelings. as we grow up we learn what it meens to loose, then we learn what it takes to win. then we all attempt to be a winner. rocco played excepionally well however not well enough. his game was not nearly as consistant as tigers game therfore he lost to tiger, but he beat many others.
whats the old attage?" 2nd place is just the first place looser" asecond place is nothing to be ashamed of in the arena of ball golf when tiger is present. do you think rocco would rather not have had the opportunity to play heads up against tiger with the whole world watching? i know if i had the opportunity to play against any top sportsmen one on one with the world watching , and if i was able to holed my own in the limelight that my loosing the competition would pale to overall expierience. im proud to see an underdog compete at the top , heck it gives me hope to have the same chance.

I agree there should be one champion determined in the manner decided by the sport. My disagreement is when the winner is not decided that way via a less than complete competition, i.e. tiebreaks that do not include the whole series of games, rounds, whatever. In the event of ties, either do the full competition again or no champ.

I don't understand why you think this is anti-winner, anti-competition. I would prefer ties to be no-champs rather than co-champs. Neither competitor rose to the top in the competition format provided for that sport. So what? They split the purse and hopefully there's a winner the following year. It happens regularly over the years when there's a war or strike shortened season. Why is it that those records or champions have an asterisk? It's because they didn't feel they completed the full competition format. What would be so wrong about not having a champion when a tie occurs when there are already years without a champion?

I've played several tiebreaks over my career and without question, most were biased toward one competitor just like Tiger getting hole 7 at Torrey. I've lost with the other player throwing a four ricochet ace that is in the World records site maintained by Hosfeld. Neither win nor loss by tiebreak has ever felt right.


Then why even have a disc golf Worlds? Why not the player with the best stats that year be the champ? Why have play-offs in professional sports? Reg. season champs are champs.
Chuck, that is not a compelling argument. We have these things to determine A Champion. The best of the best. If 2 people are tied at the end of regular competition, both of them are not the best, unless they played exactly the same on every hole by having identical shots. The longer people compete against each other, the higher the odds that the best player will win in the end. This is why we have Playoffs in almost all sports, and this is why we have tie breakers. The only way to be the best is to beat the entire field of competition until there is no one left to beat, no matter the location or format.

hey Chuck... so in the election w/ Gore &amp; Bush you felt like they both should have been Co-Presidents?!

another thought... what about Brian's trip to Japan? you are fine with the pdga bucking up to send him over... what if he was a co-director? PDGA paying for 2 flights over to Japan?! :O

again... as i've said before im very good at thinking outside the box ... but i'm out there now and I still dont even see where you are coming from. (sorry)

this is a very Gaylord Focker mentality Chuck... (this whole thing reminds me of Meet the parents when you see all of the 'participation' awards and 9th place ribbons that Gaylord had won)

The only disagreement with anyone here is whether tiebreaks are valid. If they are then just have the top two teams or players after the regular season play sudden death or one 18-hole round in the case of the U.S. Open for the title. If the tiebreaker process itself is valid, then why play the game(s)? If playing the required amount of games again is not feasible, as it normally would not be, then have no winner. Actually, I retract the co-champs or double golds and would prefer double silvers be awarded since no one won the specified competition format outright. Everyone seems so obsessed with having an outright winner in some way or another at the risk of luck or unfairness creeping in to the results that they violate the very principles of a thorough competition for convenience, not competitive validity.

I wonder how good Tiger would be at New Zealand's Golf Cross?

http://www.golfcross.com/

http://www.golfcross.com/home.html

As an avid DGer and BGer, I'd like to give it a shot.

probably excellent considering that he only has to hit a soccer goal instead of a small hole in the ground but as good as his chip shot is he may come up short because a good layup in golf is to not go past the basket and count on the backspin unless you are playing Golden Tee. :D

...but if Tiger were closer to the hole(net), then his opponent would be out and would get to adjust the net to better his angle and worsen Tigers.

http://www.golfcross.com/

http://www.golfcross.com/home.html

As an avid DGer and BGer, I'd like to give it a shot.



I second that... I'd be more than willing to play a round or two!

Let's go to NZ! We could hook up with DGer and friend Mark Dakiv. I see he's back in Canada now but he was living in NZ back in the early 2000's.

http://www.pdga.com/tournament/playerstats.php?PDGANum=12505&amp;year=2008

Everyone seems so obsessed with having an outright winner in some way or another at the risk of luck or unfairness creeping in to the results that they violate the very principles of a thorough competition for convenience, not competitive validity.



So luck or chance is only a factor in a tie-breaker? A bad bounce of the ball or lucky kick of the disc isn't fluky during the competition....only during a tie-break? There are very few games and sports which do not involve luck or chance to a certain degree.