ChrisWoj
Aug 08 2007, 05:55 PM
Okay, so I've got a question here. My brother has a beast of a snap. I've seen the kid get hyzer-flip out of a Max, he uses Firebirds as his straight drivers, and he complains CONSTANTLY about how TeeRexs, Wraiths, Destroyers are all too flippy for him.

And he has never reached a 410 foot wide open hole out at our local course.

I'm sure you've all had some local kid like him that can pump the [censored] out of the overstable stuff with no control, thats not him, he can control it. But he just can't translate all of this snap into distance. Not at all.

Anybody have any recommendations on how to teach him to throw the flippier plastic? I'm at a loss. I've been trying for a few months (ever since he came out at the end of track 3 inches taller and a ton more physically mature than he was when he stopped playing for cross country in August last year) and it seems hopeless.


-Chris.

Big E
Aug 08 2007, 06:05 PM
I donít know if this will help.... but it has helped me tremendously I use a fan grip on accuracy shots and on more stable discs I want to flip I use a power grip. I also donít pull back as far, trying to not turn away from the target as much as I would for a max distance throw. This is the way I throw my cheetah and avenger SS.

MichaelWebster
Aug 08 2007, 06:20 PM
as stated above, try not to reach back as far. try not reaching back much at all, have him pull the disc back to his chest only. also he needs to practice not rolling his wrist. its difficult at first but eventually it needs to be done.

boredatwork
Aug 08 2007, 06:42 PM
sounds like he might be generating a lot of off-axis torque when throwing so hard. Really far drives don't require a lot of effort just perfectly timed body rotation and quickness at "the hit". It's possible he is using his arm to throw and just using too much muscles in an effort to throw far.

Throwing in an open field can help. Understable drivers help too, just don't throw them so freakin hard =) start at 200 foot drives and ask him to focus on releasing the disc totally flat and not using full power.

don't really know if this is new information to you or if it will be helpful. Once i learned to throw putters 250 feet and TeeBirds 350 feet, keeping balance and maximizing distance with less effort became possible. the run up should be relaxed and light on the feet.

Watch the faces of world class sprinters and you'll notice how relaxed they look even at full speed. They are able to focus their effort on the correct muscle groups and make their movements efficient this way. Try asking your brother to walk up slowly and overall use less effort.

Once a golfer develops smoothness and proper rhythm then distance will come naturally. Watch Cale Leiviska, he's a little guy that throws a mile and never looks like he's throwing too hard!

lien83
Aug 08 2007, 07:06 PM
also he needs to practice not rolling his wrist. its difficult at first but eventually it needs to be done.



Not rolling your wrist is key!!! Talk to a DDC player that throws 110 gram frisbees on a line hyzer and they will tell you that is the key. Try and get him to release the disc with his palm facing the ground...a rolled wrist's palm is always facing the sky on follow through. It is a good action to exagerate.

PatrickSmith
Aug 09 2007, 10:46 AM
Is he getting proper height on his drives?

crusher
Aug 09 2007, 12:38 PM
Tell him to stop throwing drivers and learn how to golf with a mid range disc. Go to a field and put cones out at 200' and 300', make him land within ten feet at least 705 of the time. And while he is doing this, only allow him to take 1 step. This sounds unorthodox, but I guarantee that it will help him with this problem.

MTL21676
Aug 09 2007, 12:55 PM
The best way to break a habit is to force that person to stop doing it.

Like when I teach players with great sidearms, I make them not throw it and learn the annyhyzer.

Aug 09 2007, 03:08 PM
Slow down !!!!!!

Give him a predator to throw.......

gang4010
Aug 09 2007, 06:10 PM
Play catch with Aviars from 220-280' - multiple, repeated attempts will force the learning curve. Back up a few steps and go to a roc. Learning to control the intial angle of release with a clean snap and less torque with these types of discs will bring greater understanding and ease to throwing drivers really FAR :)

Greg_R
Aug 09 2007, 08:09 PM
It is very likely that he is torquing his wrist. Put away all the drivers for now and have him throw some putters and approach discs (preferably understable). Work on straight, low shots. With proper technique he should be able to hyzer a putter on a low line to about 225-250ft. Any wrist roll will result in an immediate flip (where a driver can mask bad form). I worked on this for a summer and it really helped my driving distance improve.

ChrisWoj
Aug 14 2007, 02:18 AM
Thats the odd part, he throws Ching Rocs with great accuracy to 300-350. He throws his Wizards very well to distances up to 300. But even though he throws the [censored] out of all of his drivers, flipping even the most overstable plastic we hand him at least slightly (except a brand new max weight spirit)... he can't get them to fly farther than 380.

And believe me, he doesn't roll his wrist. I watched him earlier today, and looked at some video and photos... he doesn't roll them at all. Palm down all the way and then out at the follow through.

Greg_R
Aug 14 2007, 06:30 PM
At what height is he throwing these Rocs and Wizards? If he is throwing a Roc 10-15ft off the ground for 350ft then OK... if he is launching them up into the air then that is masking a form issue. Perhaps he is curling his hand in toward the disc (i.e. wrist is bent in slightly)? This will put a ton of snap on the disc but will flip over the drivers at higher speeds (at least that's been my experience). Another issue might be lack of smooth acceleration / perfect release. Have him work on throwing Eagles and Teebirds (i.e. discs with more glide) in a field. Have him throw with a 1 step run up and concentrate on a smooth release and slowing things down.

circle_2
Aug 14 2007, 09:28 PM
Does he have a bent~arm or straight~arm reach back?
...sounds like he needs to relax even more before uncoiling.

With significantly slower and simpler footwork - try having him stay relaxed until the disc has (more slowly than before) moved forward/around at ~1/2 foot (a la priming the pump) from maximum reachback or rotation......THEN uncoil. Try this around 50-60% strength - then progressively step up the power while concentrating on gripping tighter and continuing to accelerate THROUGH the hit.

If he indeed possesses sheer power then there's a breakdown (or two) in his technique somewhere...right?





Did I mention I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night? :)
.02

Luke Butch
Aug 14 2007, 11:49 PM
have him learn to throw putters on all different types of shots.

throwing something like an ultrastar will help him understand his mechanics a lot better to.

I don't throw that far, but I can use a open(fan?) grip and throw a putter 280-300ft accurately. its not about power, although that is needed somewhat.

Greg_R
Aug 22 2007, 07:20 PM
throwing something like an ultrastar will help him understand his mechanics a lot better to.

An Ultrastar masked many of my form issues... it did not help me at all (just an opinion).

Smokey102977
Aug 28 2007, 10:09 PM
Take the run-up out of the game. Try to do a one-step throw. This will allow you to determine if the torque is coming from the arm or the body. I have seen many track guys launch the discs without a run-up.