though i have always heard that brian schweberger had an insanely good thumber, i had to witness it to believe it. the kind of practice shots i saw him throwing a few days ago in burlington, nc were incredible. so with that said, schwebe or anyone else, any tips for me on perfecting a thumber? though i used to throw lots of thumbers with orcs and teebirds, i've recently switched my bag to gateway and after more than a month or so still have absolutely no idea of an ideal thumber disc. besides finding a good disc for this shot, i fear that my technique is somehow flawed. PLEASE HELP ME SCHWEBE, i want to be able and bomb thumbers like you!

Throw a speed Demon for your thumbers!!! Orcs and Teebirds are not overstable enough to throw a long distance thumber anyway!!! Might be good for hard right tunnel thumbers but not for distance thumbers!!!

yeah, speed demons and spirits go as far as anything. i'll throw an s illusion for a quicker flip and more accuracy.

2-3 years ago i threw firebirds as thumber discs, but more recently i've switched to almost all gateway plastic. i threw a speed demon dt for forehand and thumbers, and decided to give a blurr a try. my speed demon was getting a bit touchy with a lot of forehand snap. so far i've loved the blurr...seems like it has a bit more glide than the speed demon. i've been throwing it for 2-3 months...so we'll see how long it holds its stability.

Small,
My favorite thumber disc is the Blaze. Give that a try, for more distance go with the Blurr, Illusion, Rage or the Spirit in (E) plastic. I'd stay away from the Sabre and Hybrid for overhand shots.

sweet biz scott. i look forward to playing with you some more now that i'm gateway as well. laters.

the more stable the better....Keep the disc as vertical as possible for big distance and swing(right to left)...A crow hop is needed to gain bigger D. Schweb uses a tennis serve technique to get out there, but, he is also over 6'3. Dont forget a solid follow through( as with any discgolf throw). good luck, and dont forget to warm up th overhand...It is very dangerous to throw with a cold shoulder and elbow...Use a full size towel to dry throw before the round...If you get a shoting pain in the neck, stop throwing thumbers...

I'm curious just how good his thumber is. I've heard so many ridiculous things about them. I've got a pretty good one myself (ask anybody that played Mid Nats with me last year, or anybody thats played Willow Metropark in Michigan with me) and although my range is limited to about 250-75 accurate, I'm usually underneath.

Does anybody have any video of this? I want to know just how good these things are...

schwebby has pure control over his thumber and can use it in places you would think possible...he also bombs it.350 ft.

check out the skylands dvd- he busts some out on that.

this is from 2005, but should serve the purpose.

Schweb's thumber (http://www.discgolfreview.com/resources/analysis/brianschweberger5.shtml)

though i have always heard that brian schweberger had an insanely good thumber, i had to witness it to believe it. the kind of practice shots i saw him throwing a few days ago in burlington, nc were incredible. so with that said, schwebe or anyone else, any tips for me on perfecting a thumber? though i used to throw lots of thumbers with orcs and teebirds, i've recently switched my bag to gateway and after more than a month or so still have absolutely no idea of an ideal thumber disc. besides finding a good disc for this shot, i fear that my technique is somehow flawed. PLEASE HELP ME SCHWEBE, i want to be able and bomb thumbers like you!




So far for speed glide and control Demons are what is working best for me. Speed demons, Illusions, blaze, all those other discs that have been recomended dont stand up to the demon. Rims are to wide or to narrow for me to get a good grip on. next time you are in the raleigh area i will lwt you throw some of mine!

doesn't look like he has responded - ask the question on the schweb raise post count thread under players and he will answer you.

though i have always heard that brian schweberger had an insanely good thumber, i had to witness it to believe it. the kind of practice shots i saw him throwing a few days ago in burlington, nc were incredible. so with that said, schwebe or anyone else, any tips for me on perfecting a thumber? though i used to throw lots of thumbers with orcs and teebirds, i've recently switched my bag to gateway and after more than a month or so still have absolutely no idea of an ideal thumber disc. besides finding a good disc for this shot, i fear that my technique is somehow flawed. PLEASE HELP ME SCHWEBE, i want to be able and bomb thumbers like you!




So far for speed glide and control Demons are what is working best for me. Speed demons, Illusions, blaze, all those other discs that have been recomended dont stand up to the demon. Rims are to wide or to narrow for me to get a good grip on. next time you are in the raleigh area i will lwt you throw some of mine!



For thumber distance you need a disc that is the right speed, and too fast or too slow and you lose distance. The speed demon is too fast. It flips right away and is done with. Same goes for most distance drivers. If you are thumbing with a Demon then you too are losing distance becasue the disc is too slow with too high of a profile. It flips slow, so it will get more air than a speed demon, but a disc that is a little faster will yield more D. I think the best thumber discs are #1: Champion Banshee--this is the thumber distance king. It does a huge S in the air when thrown correctly. It goes out to the left and comes back right getting big D (I birdied a 400' hole during a tournament with one). #2: Champion Firebird: the older the better. CEs were awesome, Pro Line candy ones are a close 2nd. The firebird is a little faster than a Banshee, so it works faster, in a straighter line. I throw all Discraft now and the Z Tracker and Z Extreme work well for thumbers too, though I still don't get the results that I could with the Banshee or Firebird.

firebird.....

i like the flick..im pretty accurate anything 330 and under..i just hold tight and let it rip making sure the disc comes out straight..i used to pitch in baseball so it came natural. same technique

I'm a 175g Champ Eagle user. For dead-on accuracy under 300 feet they are quite glorious.

though i have always heard that brian schweberger had an insanely good thumber, i had to witness it to believe it. the kind of practice shots i saw him throwing a few days ago in burlington, nc were incredible. so with that said, schwebe or anyone else, any tips for me on perfecting a thumber? though i used to throw lots of thumbers with orcs and teebirds, i've recently switched my bag to gateway and after more than a month or so still have absolutely no idea of an ideal thumber disc. besides finding a good disc for this shot, i fear that my technique is somehow flawed. PLEASE HELP ME SCHWEBE, i want to be able and bomb thumbers like you!




So far for speed glide and control Demons are what is working best for me. Speed demons, Illusions, blaze, all those other discs that have been recomended dont stand up to the demon. Rims are to wide or to narrow for me to get a good grip on. next time you are in the raleigh area i will lwt you throw some of mine!



For thumber distance you need a disc that is the right speed, and too fast or too slow and you lose distance. The speed demon is too fast. It flips right away and is done with. Same goes for most distance drivers. If you are thumbing with a Demon then you too are losing distance becasue the disc is too slow with too high of a profile. It flips slow, so it will get more air than a speed demon, but a disc that is a little faster will yield more D. I think the best thumber discs are #1: Champion Banshee--this is the thumber distance king. It does a huge S in the air when thrown correctly. It goes out to the left and comes back right getting big D (I birdied a 400' hole during a tournament with one). #2: Champion Firebird: the older the better. CEs were awesome, Pro Line candy ones are a close 2nd. The firebird is a little faster than a Banshee, so it works faster, in a straighter line. I throw all Discraft now and the Z Tracker and Z Extreme work well for thumbers too, though I still don't get the results that I could with the Banshee or Firebird.



True about the Fire bird. When I threw all discraft I used Z Xtra's I dont think they make them any more but they worked realy well. As far as Demons I think the guy asked about what discs to use. I would say Fire Bird as well, BUT, the Demon is a great thumber Disc if you choose Gateway.

Are we talking Demon or Speed Demon?

ANY overhand shot is a get out of trouble shot for me...got to go with a Firebird or Predator. Back when they had little value, I used to use a light 2nd run CE Valk...or a heavier one for more control.

I throw alot of thumbers and use a 167 champ firebird. I've tried low and high wieghts and I seem to throw the lighter's much further. Remember though that once you figure out the standard thumber there are alot of variations to it. I've thrown it in crazy situtations with a high reliability. Albeit I don't throw it 400' I promise you that

Are we talking Demon or Speed Demon?

ANY overhand shot is a get out of trouble shot for me...got to go with a Firebird or Predator. Back when they had little value, I used to use a light 2nd run CE Valk...or a heavier one for more control.



Demon

Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Star, Champion whatever, as long as its overstable, not like the FL's, or the 9x flippy FB's. Really though; it's all about the GRIP. You can throw long shots, short shots, and skip thumbers all with the Firebird. However, to re-iterate; it's all about the GRIP.

Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Star, Champion whatever, as long as its overstable, not like the FL's, or the 9x flippy FB's. Really though; it's all about the GRIP. You can throw long shots, short shots, and skip thumbers all with the Firebird. However, to re-iterate; it's all about the GRIP.



This is the truth if you only throw Innova.

[QUOTE]
[QUOTE]

I think the best thumber discs are #1: Champion Banshee--this is the thumber distance king. It does a huge S in the air when thrown correctly. It goes out to the left and comes back right getting big D (I birdied a 400' hole during a tournament with one).



You are correct sir. Slower, but more accurate than the Firebird.

Mike Robinson thumbs Blazes, and Sabres for fast turning non-distance thumbers.

I used to use a champ t-bird and loved it but that was pretty much for some pretty specific tech requirements at a wooded course. I switched to the Z-Wildcat a few years ago and have been really happy with that for speed and stability. It seems that when i really get a hold of it though, it even gets a 3rd flip.

I did get a perf in my favorite one though and am trying out the Crush as i have those coming out my ears from palyers packs and schwag...Really liking it so far. Most shots I need it on are in the 280 range but I have a few that go 300-315 consistantly.

If you want to try something fun, get an Epic and learn to tune it. If you have the air to use it, it is pretty easy to start approaching 375-385. A friend I throw with hits 400+ regularly. Makes me sick ;)

As far as style, i have thrown my elbow and shoulder out in cold weather so I am a bit more cautious and clean in my style-and probably nota s agressive as I used to be in reaching for distances.... I like to think for power shots of being in center field and throwing over hand to home plate...Of course that would be aiming 1/3rd up the first base line. The thumb pad on the rim is the whole key regardless of the style.

Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Firebird, Star, Champion whatever, as long as its overstable, not like the FL's, or the 9x flippy FB's. Really though; it's all about the GRIP. You can throw long shots, short shots, and skip thumbers all with the Firebird. However, to re-iterate; it's all about the GRIP.



This is the truth if you only throw Innova.



I mostly do throw only Innova, however the Firebird works so well I haven't even bothered trying anything else since I started using it. Like the old addage, "If it ain't broke don't try to fix it."
It's so versatile you can hit most distances, and get it to stop or skip, or roll just by changing trajectory a little. Just throw it a little higher, or lower, softer or harder and you can get whatever you need out of it without adding another variable like changing discs. Works for me anyways. With that said, it's also a very tight turning disc which makes it great for wooded courses like Moraine, and Deer Lakes in PA, or even a little more open like Hobson Groves for that matter.

I have been using a ProLine Beast and a First run Sidewinder on most of my thumbers. It seems like to me that the Beast will go up and back down fairly straight while the Sidewinder will break more to the right kind of like when I throw a Monster with a thumber. It is a fun shot to have because you can vary the throw so much and get great results from bad starting points.

I have been using a ProLine Beast and a First run Sidewinder on most of my thumbers. It seems like to me that the Beast will go up and back down fairly straight while the Sidewinder will break more to the right kind of like when I throw a Monster with a thumber. It is a fun shot to have because you can vary the throw so much and get great results from bad starting points.




I get down with a 173 Champion Blue or Orange Firebird and i am confident from 400 and in and if anybody has played with me will tell u i have it down pretty accruate eagles work good too but when there is no wind

http://www.discraft.com/res_overhand07_p1.html

Here is a decent article about the thumber, and other overhand throws... and no... I'm not biased. :)

sure you, are and you should be

Nice article. Speaking of overhand, does Jaime Wilson still play there in Austin?

I've heard of Jaime and his killer overhand, but he's a little before my time (I don't think he's played much during this decade).

Jaime is still around but very seldom he has one if not the farthest thumber I have ever seen and I have seen allot of thumbers. Curt Gatilin that Jim refers to in his non bias article :) as well as Chris Rountree.

Anyone ever try a Whippet? I too use a Firebird for most thumber shots, but for pure distance i cant beat my semi beat in KC Pro Whippet. When thrown correctly this things just keeps going, but it has to be a nice and high one to get out there and do it's work. Firebirds work alot better for me for line drive shots and more controlled thumbers.

I once saw 10 or so Champion Whippets sitting at Play it Again sports for several months on sale, and no one would touch them... I would look at them (nice wreath type stamp by the way) but just couldn't talk myself into buying one. Then the word got out that the Champion models make great thumber discs... I went back and low and behold they were all gone! Then a friend bought a bunch of X-out's for us and we all got one.. They are great thumber discs.... I never threw consistient thumbers until I started throwing a champ whippet...

I have a champ, but it does not work as well for me as the slightly beat in KC Pro. Only bad thing about the KC's is they are made with the really hard white plastic and it doesnt seem to take the ground poundings from thumbers very well.

I heard that the pro models warp a bit from the intense landing the thumber has... So I have not tried one... I have some friends that can throw a long way with thw whippet thumber

Star Whippet X (https://www.discgolfvalues.com/store/view_product.php?product=CFR_WPX)

These make a great thumber and keep on ticking

Mony Koz from CO throws 90% thumbers consistenly from 250-475 foot thumbers depending on the hole. He just shot -13 with 14 birdies the last round in the Denver Classic throwing all thumbers on all the birdies. He's a rare example b/c he used to play minor league ball and has a cannon but he throws all Flicks and Reapers depending on the shot. The more overstable the better in CO...may be different at sea level. Flicks the best that I've seen and they take forever to wear

Am guessing it would take a barrel-roll/Epic kind of flight pattern to go 425'+...am I right?

Am guessing it would take a barrel-roll/Epic kind of flight pattern to go 425'+...am I right?

Monty Koz does have a CANNON arm. Definitely NOT an exaggeration! The first time I watched him throw almost an entire round of thumbers, was the moment I decided I needed to learn that shot. Personally, I prefer lightweight Flicks for thumbers.

nanook

would someone mind explaining the difference between a 'thumber' and a 'tomahawk'?

both are overhand shots, exactly the same except the disc is facing the opposite direction for each (they have exactly opposite flights).

thumber - put your thumb inside the rim.
tommy - fingers inside the rim (probably the same way you throw your sidearm).

there are different variations of each, but those are the basic differences.

...and most folks are better at one over the other.
Thumber here...just can't connect/snap with a Tomahawk grip.

Ditto. I've got a pretty damned-good thumber --- can typically get them out there about 290-300'. But can't throw a tomahawk for the life of me.

Ditto. I've got a pretty damned-good thumber --- can typically get them out there about 290-300'. But can't throw a tomahawk for the life of me.

For me:
Golf disc = darn good thumber :), very weak tomahawk :(
Ultimate lid = darn good tomahawk :), very weak thumber :(

nanook

Tying to thumber an ultimate lid is very difficult. I always had more luck with the tomahawk there.

i throw a lot of thumbers for short shots, long shots, low ceiling right turn shots, skip thumbers and you have to understand that each disc will give you a different result. so try out all of your discs. I personally throw an understable disc(champion beast) for a skip thumber or a hard right turning thumber. i throw firebirds and flicks for longer and quicker turning shots (if you throw them high enough they will barrell roll). and for all of the people who say they can throw a thumber and not a tomahawk here's the key: you have to release the disc where the disc is almost straight up and down with a lot of SNAP...and i mean SNAP!!!! you might want to try it out first releasing it like a pancake shot where the bottom of the disc is facing between perpendicular and upside down

ex if you are right handed grip it like a 2 finger forhand (with out the stabilizer) and when you release it should look like this
if the 0 is your head
. \
0 I
}
I
and yes you need to act like you are throwing from center field to home plate and give it a little crow hop!!!!!

try that out for your tomahawk hopefully that will work

sorry for the crappy illustration but thats as good as art gets for me lol

both are overhand shots, exactly the same except the disc is facing the opposite direction for each (they have exactly opposite flights).

thumber - put your thumb inside the rim.
tommy - fingers inside the rim (probably the same way you throw your sidearm).

there are different variations of each, but those are the basic differences.



Thank you! This helps alot

I have tried multiple discs and I find that the Epic is by far the best for me. Long distance discs that are also good are the whippet, leopard, and Illusion. Depending on the shot an XL or lightweight Viking is good. I use my Epic on downhill shots, it's very accurate and does not stray off course quite so easy, I can get well over 500 ft on a long downhill thumber and still stay accurate, and I don't even have a big arm.

Other discs i've seen used with some success are the Cyclone, Wraith, Avenger, and Aerobie Sharpshooter.

The next time I go out I'm gonna try out the Frisbee S.

Z-Flick!!!!!!!!!!!!

Isn't this a "hook thumb" that everyones talking about? Basically the opposite of tomahawk. A thumber is a different shot according to DLG. He taught the thumber to me and it's a great utility shot, but a totally different motion.

Isn't this a "hook thumb" that everyones talking about? Basically the opposite of tomahawk. A thumber is a different shot according to DLG. He taught the thumber to me and it's a great utility shot, but a totally different motion.

Yes it is a "Hook Thumber"

i have been trying the thumber but the disc either leaves too early or becomes a roller. i can't quite get the grip right.

you have to wrap your first digit of your index finger around the rim

I also throw a lot of thumbers for "get-out-of-trouble" and holes that are around 275ft with a good high route. I'm a huge fan of KC Banshees and got my first thumber ace last fall from about 270ft with one. I've hit the top of baskets quite a few times throwing Banshee Thumbers. They are very predictable but I also throw Firebirds & Whippets on occasion.

i have had some success using a champ teerex-x for thumbers, valkyries and orcs work ok. i just want the shot mainly as a utility throw, not neccesarily my main distance one.

Right now for me z- flick consistently 350-375ft champ firebird 320-360ft (more predictable) champ monster 280-310

Schweb, I use a Teerex or a Destroyer mainly for my thumbers, I get good results. But I was curious do less stable discs take longer to roll over in flight? What do you think is the best disc for distance?

Thanks,

I am by no means a hue thumber thrower but for my utility shots and "just gotta' thumb this one" shots I found the FLX Pred to be awesome it fits my hand good and the flight is very predictible........it is the only discraft disc in my bag :DI just use what works :cool:

Schweb, I use a Teerex or a Destroyer mainly for my thumbers, I get good results. But I was curious do less stable discs take longer to roll over in flight? What do you think is the best disc for distance?

Thanks,



are you asking this because your thumbers are flipping quick or corkscrewing? just curious because I put a lot of torq on my thumbers and those discs are too fast to throw a good thumber with. I've found that you can't just have an overstable disc (think firechicken, pred, monster)... it also can't be too fast if you put a lot of power into it.
Not sure if this all makes sense but its what works for me.

Schweb, I use a Teerex or a Destroyer mainly for my thumbers, I get good results. But I was curious do less stable discs take longer to roll over in flight? What do you think is the best disc for distance?





Hey Scott, I have come to the conclusion that overstable have a longer roll and flight. If you are looking for a quicker flight, I would suggest a Star Leopard. Whippets are the slowest to roll over and have the longest flight in my research. Stack is right on with his comments, and a good thumber to take advice from.

Stack, Tyson, thanks for the comments! I think I understand your comments, for the best results (longer flight and slower roll) use a stable disc but not too fast of a disc. So maybe my destroyer is a bad idea, I need to pull the Firechicken out of retirement......

Schweb, I use a Teerex or a Destroyer mainly for my thumbers, I get good results. But I was curious do less stable discs take longer to roll over in flight? What do you think is the best disc for distance?

Thanks,



are you asking this because your thumbers are flipping quick or corkscrewing? just curious because I put a lot of torq on my thumbers and those discs are too fast to throw a good thumber with. I've found that you can't just have an overstable disc (think firechicken, pred, monster)... it also can't be too fast if you put a lot of power into it.
Not sure if this all makes sense but its what works for me.


I agree 100% I didn't know much about how speed affected flight and tried a few with a QuestAT Double D (sickeningly overstable) figuring it would be a good thumber disc for distance... totally wrong. Discs that are overstable because of speed are not good, you want discs that are overstable because of wing configuration.

the thing i have problems with on thumbers is sometimes it doesn't turnover. it becomes a roller or slips out of my hand.

wrap the first digit of your index finger around the rim of the disc and that will eliminate the disc from slipping out of your hand.

the roller part, is something you have to deal with if you are going to throw overhand shots.

I find that the more of a line-drive the shot is, the more tendency for it to roll after hitting the ground. The higher the arc, the less action after the landing. I have no idea if this is consistent with other people.

I find that the more of a line-drive the shot is, the more tendency for it to roll after hitting the ground. The higher the arc, the less action after the landing. I have no idea if this is consistent with other people.



thats the way it generally works for me... although I can still get it to roll or not depending on the angle of release (normally .around 1 o'clock... but adjusting towards 12 or 2 changes things some)

Picked up a couple Star Whippet X-eses after the good word from the MuLLeTT about its thumberie goodness.

TThanks Schweb!

no problemo

Swheb do you have a pic of your thumber grip....with that index finger around the rim....I think I understand but I need all the help I can get with the thumber shot...thanks.

schwebby's grip

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h315/tyson99duke/bschweberger-th1-1.jpg (http://s67.photobucket.com/albums/h315/tyson99duke/?action=view&current=bschweberger-th1-1.jpg)

That is what I was thinking....thanks for the quick reply and pic it really helped. :DNow I gotta go try the new grip.

what grip had you used? and do you have any 'biomechanical' break downs of you throwing thumbers or just backhands (from your thesis work)?

They are all backhand and none are me.....(I wanted people who could really throw)....But I hold my finger on the filghtplate side kinda pinched between the thumb and the rest of the hand.

that is a very strange feeling grip to me, you must have giant hands? i have large hands but i feel i have no grip on it doing it that way.

Hey Dogg, The Pro Schwebb taught me how to do this. Notice the Thumb, he holds it tight. Makes a big difference.

Mini Thumber,

how do you normally grip for thumbers kyle? do you not hook the pointer finger? post a pick of how you normally grip and one with you trying to do it like schweb

i have tried the grip like schweb's in the picture. my thumb and index finger doesn't feel right. but if i put my along the inside of the rim and the index finger on the flight plate, it is more comfortable.

I dont think you can acquire Max D without wrapping your index finger.

I dont think you can acquire Max D without wrapping your index finger.



he speaks the truth! ;)

i could always throw thumbers 'far' using the pointer finger on the flight plate technique... but if I use the hook grip I def. get more D. I still use the pointer finger out most of the time since I feel like I personally have more control over it but i'm sure thats a mental or learned thing since Crump/Schweb both have great control/touch using the hook grip.

I dont think you can acquire Max D without wrapping your index finger.



Wrapping your index also brings the accuracy with the heat.

Its very similar to a backhand power grip vs. fan grip. Some people feel more touch with a fan grip, but the power grip has accuracy and power.

how do you normally grip for thumbers kyle? do you not hook the pointer finger? post a pick of how you normally grip and one with you trying to do it like schweb



I will try and take a picture when i get my camera charged up, but i keep my index finger on the outside and i squeeze my thumb and the point between my proximal and intermediate phalanges of my index finger. And I don't think i am losing power with this grip.

i am trying the technique schweb talked about and have added some real nice D. it took a while to get used to the feel of it, but it really seems to get out of my hand quickly.

heres my grip

http://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

heres my grip
http://flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/



That's the exact grip I use --- and I think I have an above average thumber.

I tried the Shweby grip yesterday a few times --- and maybe my hand are too small, or too fat, or something. But this grip didn't allow me to grip the disc tight enough to get any snap on it.

I'll practice it a bit more, but it's not looking promising right out of the gate.

You're not alone Rooster I am having the same issues with that grip...

i preaty much just pinch the disc between my thumb and thebig nuckle of the pointer finger, this allows the disc to be rocked back towards my arm during the wind up thus allowing greater snap with the wrist or more travel or tourqe upon release.
i can succesfully reach 350-375 ft accurately with this style grip.

sounds like fromthe last several posts we share the same grip. The crease (or line) on the inside of my thumb fits on to the inner edge of the rim, then pinch the thumb and middle if the index finger together.. sorry for not using more scientific descriptive type words. There are several different type grips for the javelin and atleast 3 types have been used to throw over 300ft...

I always gripped the cords with the middle and thumb and my index finger was extended up the length of the javelin. I tried a fork grip but I couldn't get enough snap and it left some awesome blisters if I used it too much. I also used the index and thumb pinch grip when it was really hot out since my normal grip seemed to slip a little when the sweat came on.

I know that has nothing to do with disc golf but I thought I would share :D

There is only one other overhand thrower I've ever seen who appeared to be anywhere as good as Schweb, Stokley! I don't know if he was as long as Schweb but there is lots of video of him bombing thumbers in his video set. He is dead accurate and very long by my eye. I don't know what his grip was but it might be worth looking at.

There is this one section where he throws thumber after thumber at this basket bouncing each one withing a few feet of the target. Just amazing. BTW - check out Schwebbie's first hole in the final 9 at Iowa Worlds. 350 feet over a mass of trees. Nails the long bird.

There is only one other overhand thrower I've ever seen who appeared to be anywhere as good as Schweb, Stokley! I don't know if he was as long as Schweb but there is lots of video of him bombing thumbers in his video set. He is dead accurate and very long by my eye. I don't know what his grip was but it might be worth looking at.

There is this one section where he throws thumber after thumber at this basket bouncing each one withing a few feet of the target. Just amazing. BTW - check out Schwebbie's first hole in the final 9 at Iowa Worlds. 350 feet over a mass of trees. Nails the long bird.



as someone who almost religiously throws thumbers I can tell you that this is the beauty of the thumber... you can put one after another right near the basket... especially if you are allowed to throw one after another.

I've used the thumber for CTPs for a basket where hundreds of throws were taken at a basket and of the top 5 people that made it to the finals I had a few inside the 5th place persons and one was an ace (right in front of Schweb and Feldberg which was the coolest part) I had just begun playing that year before.

i def. dont think i'm the most accurate thumber thrower and that particular instance was at a shorter range (although I can do the same ~300 as well).

give me (or any other good thumber thrower) a wide open hole ~300' away and put us up against almost any other backhand throwers with a stack of discs and we'll put a lot more closer more consistently.

its the magic of the thumb! ;)

BTW... is Stokely still around?! it seems like any type of throw people mention his name comes up as the biggest BOMBER of that type... i haven't been playing long enough to see him but he sounds like an animal!

Stokley threw out his elbow

thumber lesson from schwebbie at the 6 minute mark of clip one in this thread (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Board=Other%20PDGA%20Topics&Number=82 8132&Searchpage=0&Main=828132&Search=true&#Post828 132)

Stokley threw out his elbow



And that may be one of the problems with relying too heavily on the overhand throw...

stokely threw more sidearm than overhands the times i saw him play, of course the sidearm is what hurts my elbow the most.

yeah elbow pain is one of the main reasons i have been developing my backhand throw. i used to throw sidearm predominantly. throwing overhand doesn't bother me at all. probably from playing football helped develop that.

never saw Stokely throw many overhands, would have loved to see it though

i suppose this is a bit of a side tangent... but I'm wondering, does everyone get hurt throwing sidearm (and I guess possibly overhand) because its actually that rough on your body, or is this an issue of Disc Golfers just not knowing how to ease their bodies into that sort of exercise? my general impression is that the vast majority of disc golf injuries are simply a matter of a disc golfers not knowing or not caring to warm up properly...

I'm sure in some circumstances, like Stokely's, it could be an actual overuse issue, but I don't think thats the case for most people. Any chance you could weigh in on this one Schweb? Maybe tell us how you warm up for the overhand shots? How about someone out there that thinks they have a decent warm up technique or set of stretches for sidearm throwers? I think that would fix around 80% of dg related injuries all by itself.

Must be an issue with the old folks, that's why I'll always BYoung. ;)

i suppose this is a bit of a side tangent... but I'm wondering, does everyone get hurt throwing sidearm (and I guess possibly overhand) because its actually that rough on your body, or is this an issue of Disc Golfers just not knowing how to ease their bodies into that sort of exercise? my general impression is that the vast majority of disc golf injuries are simply a matter of a disc golfers not knowing or not caring to warm up properly...

I'm sure in some circumstances, like Stokely's, it could be an actual overuse issue, but I don't think thats the case for most people. Any chance you could weigh in on this one Schweb? Maybe tell us how you warm up for the overhand shots? How about someone out there that thinks they have a decent warm up technique or set of stretches for sidearm throwers? I think that would fix around 80% of dg related injuries all by itself.

I have commented on this very thing several times but I will post it again.
I always stretch out my arms and back very well b4 I throw. As far as warming up for overhands I take a bigger than average golf towel, hold it by one corner and do my throwing motions with it, The towel creates great resistance without abusing your joints and muscles right out of the gate.

Is there scientific evidence that stretching prevents injuries?

Stretching is over-rated as a 'day of' thing. Schwebby is actually preventing injury far better with his towel activity than with the action of stretching out his arms and his back. The act of "warming up" your muscles is great for injury prevention. Stretching is actually more of a long-term thing for increasing your range of motion: if he stretches out his back and arms every time he golfs, naturally he'll have a wider range of motion before a strain occurs because of the regular stretching over time, however as a "one time" thing stretching won't prevent any injuries and shouldn't be counted on to do so.

I threw 175 Pro Line monster as thumber. It is pretty nice far and fast but when it lands and it rolls often cuz of big lip. I am thinking of switching it to firebird. Can anyone tell me which is best firebird kind. I am curious about anyone who already try champion excaliber for thumber? how is it?

Star Firebirds are very nice, the latest run of Champ Firebirds are not as stable as the older runs. Star Excal is fast but not as long as as firebird or whippet X

Schweb -- any opinions on how old KC Banshees compare to some of the other discs you've mentioned -- 8X/9X/10X KC Banshees have long been my favorite hammer/thumber discs (with old LF Polaris 1.2s and early EXP-1s being a close behind them)... I'm just wandering if it is worth spending the time to work with other molds... (other opinions welcome). thanks.

i use a supercolor surge for my thumbers & can accuratly place it upto 300ft.

I always stretch my lower back & sides before trying to muscle out a 300footer. If I dont I get some pains on my lower left side (I'm right handed & put a ton of power into the thumber if I have to get it up really high to clear obstacles)

Getting about the same range with a tommy also. I used to use a Wildcat for thumbers/tommys but lost it.

firebird is worth trying out, it replaced the banshee out of my bag.

I've used a champ firebird for many, many years to get 300'-375' consistantly. They are the best disc for my style, 12 o'clock to 1 o'clock release. I've noticed that angle and snap are very important things to pay attention to. If you release at a 11 o'clock to 12 o'clock, more verticle to under, you have to throw something understable so it flips sooner. I seen people get max distance with this style (350-450) but is a little less acurate. I also warm up w/ practice throws as I'm walking to the next hole or waiting to tee **very important** If your not warm you risk major injury!!

Flicks n Firebirds

What about weights? What would be the difference between a 150 Flick and a max weight Flick?

Ive thrown both weight flicks for thumbers, they look simular in flight but the max weight pans slower and for me goes about 50-6-ft farther.

i tried a 150 champion firebird today and got good distance .

Ya'll are missing out if you haven't tried the Z Xtreme. By far the slowest rolling disc that allows for the most distance on thumbers.

As for getting hurt ... the problem I see is that most people don't warm up their arm for the thumber prior to playing. Sure they work on the backhand and what not but I hardly see anyone warming up properly for the thumber. Take a softball and 2 gloves and warm up for a few minutes prior to the round. This will help prevent the elbow problems that are so common with flicks and overhand shots. A baseball pitcher would just go out and try to throw full speed on their first throw ... they have to warm up.

i get good accuracy with z trackers on my thumbers

**very important** If your not warm you risk major injury!!



word indeed! I really messed my shoulder up several months ago throwing thumbers w/out warming up...could barely lift my arm for the next few days, couldnt golf for almost 2 months. My should is finally back in good shape for backhand throws, but I'm still trying to get back in shape for thumbers.

Any suggestions on stretches / low-impact weight routines to help build strength for thumbers?

Shweb posted the best suggestion on a different thread some time ago. Hold a towel in your hand and move your arm through the thumber motion. Start off slow, then do it a little faster. The towel provides the resistance you would feel in a practice throw without the penalty stroke. I usually only through 2-3 thumbers a round and I do the towel warm up on the tee pad right before I throw the shot...

Thanks...I'll try that out. It's not a shot I ever use at my home course, and rarely use at other courses, but it's definitely handy to have in the bag. I'm trying to re-learn it for an event coming up in August at a course where a thumber can save you a stroke or two on a handfull of holes.

Thanks...I'll try that out. It's not a shot I ever use at my home course, and rarely use at other courses, but it's definitely handy to have in the bag. I'm trying to re-learn it for an event coming up in August at a course where a thumber can save you a stroke or two on a handfull of holes.


And what tournoment is that?

Thanks...I'll try that out. It's not a shot I ever use at my home course, and rarely use at other courses, but it's definitely handy to have in the bag. I'm trying to re-learn it for an event coming up in August at a course where a thumber can save you a stroke or two on a handfull of holes.


And what tournoment is that?


CedarVille Open :D

oh ok yeah there are shots there for that.but only in the back course i would say and congrates a rockwall.

Woohoo got my first thumber ace this weekend. 11X Champ Firebird. I never thought the day would come!

oh ok yeah there are shots there for that.but only in the back course i would say and congrates a rockwall.



Back when I had a good thumber (pre-shoulder-blow-out), I would throw it off the tee on Beaver 12, 13, 14 and on Coyote 3 and 15. Favorite was Beaver 14...if you can put one about the same height as the TX flag just to the left of the big tree, it'll usually fall right onto the green :)

This thread happened at the right time because I've been planning on changing my primary thumber disc (Z Xtra). I just got used to it, but knew there were probably better discs out there, so I field tested some discs.

175 Z Xtra
175 Champion Whippet X
175 Star Whippet X
175 DX Whippet X
175 Z Flick
166 Z Flick
175 E Spirit
Epic (for fun)

The max weight Flick and Champion Whippet X were about the same. They both took a long time to turn before dropping which resulted in more distance. The Star Whippet X was also a fairly similar flight, just shorter.

Unfortunately, I think the conclusion is I need 2 thumber discs. 1 to flip quickly, which is more consistent, and 1 for more distance (+40-50 ft) with less consistency. This one will be the max weight Flick because I don't want to beat up a Champion Whippet X.

It also seems like I need to aim more right with these slow flipping discs because they do not "fade" as much right at the end. Is this normal?

It is not the fact that they dont go right as much, but more the fact that they will go right to left more b4 they go right

Yes, that's actually exactly what happens. Thanks.

just wanted to give schweb a shout for his clinic at the wide open! some good stuff on thumbers, forehands and rollers.

Thanks, I enjoyed that clinic very much.

yes, very nice to put a current face next to the mullet photo

i guess i am not not releasing it right or something. it ends up being a roller most times. i need something to flip quicker. i can do tomahawk throws no problem with a champ valkyrie or star orc.

Thanks, I enjoyed that clinic very much.



Loved the near roller ace from 80 feet! Should have followed up with thats how I putt.

Yeah, that was preTTy funny.

I've got it on video, I just need to figure out how to get it off the darn camera.

Here's a thumber for y'all. I fired it last night on Loriella park #14.

http://www.tripledisc.com/preview/msdgc/tree3.jpg

http://www.tripledisc.com/preview/msdgc/tree1.jpg

http://www.tripledisc.com/preview/msdgc/tree2.jpg

(Props to Gregory P for the photos.)

awesome!... my thumbers usually take the tree right down... i never thought about throwing it softer so it will just stick in part way! :P

Is that a permanent fixture on the course now?

Is that a permanent fixture on the course now?

shoukd be....I would have left it There

we left it there but it's a fairly busy public course so it could be gone by now. (darn public courses)

I wanted to leave it but some darned do-gooder yanked it down at league last Thurs &amp; returned it. Can't fault the good samaritan effort (I <u>definitely</u> appreciate any returned lost disc &amp; that joker was quite a ways up there), but the tree just isn't the same w/o it.

A six pack of Yuengling says you can't do it again. ;)

I could throw that shot 1,000,000 more times &amp; never do it again. My arm would probably be so tired after 500,000 that I couldn't even get it there. :p

How does domey or flat effect the fligt of a thumber?

Go flat, it will travel much faster vertical. Domey moves too much out of the hand. I can't think of a good thumber disc that is domey. Someone will surely correct me.

i agree, flat is better. I use an older 168 JK pro valk with the big bar logo, super flat and far

yea flater the better
11x Firebirds are the best :cool:
12x are too domey

I was asking how the dome effects the flight

IMHO, dome = longer, but slower &amp; "loopier" (more swing left than back right on a tomahawk) &amp; flat = shorter, but faster, more precise, &amp; laser-straighter

dome should make the thumber flip quicker which equals less distance. Like all throws, master it with one disc, then try new ones.

dome should make the thumber flip quicker which equals less distance. Like all throws, master it with one disc, then try new ones.



This is the opposite of what I experience. I throw thumbers with a fairly domey disc. I didn't used to...I used to throw thumbers with flat Firebirds/Banshees. I also used to throw the shot as my main drive (first year of DG). At some point I put together a skill set and left the thumber as a utility shot. I also stopped carrying a disc just for thumbers. Eventually I came to prefer the Z Predator as my overstable disc, and it is fairly domey. When I still needed a thumber, I pulled out the Pred. At first I thought it worked OK, but I still believed the old discs I used to throw worked better. Now it is years later and I have tried thumbing Banshees and Firebirds, but the Pred goes farther and it more predictable for me now.

As to the post above, the dome on my Pred slows down the flip rather than speeding it up. As mentioned by others above it takes more of a swooping motion. The dome helps it keep altitude while this happens and it goes farther with less effort. Downside of the dome: its more affected by wind and doesn't work as well for low tunnel thumbers. Unbeatable for over the top thumbers though.

dome has little to do with distance. only overstability and height/ angle of release will affect distance. the dome only makes it flip with more of a loop. flatter discs flip in more of a tight spiral. with dome you get more flight DURING the flip, but it also begins flipping earlier in the flight. with flatter discs, they hold their angle longer before beginning to flip, but then flip faster. both can be thrown far. both have their advantages if you know how to throw them. my guess is that you just got used to the flight of the pred and arent as used to your older thumber discs anymore. i can throw flat or domey discs about the same distance, but i prefer flatter discs simply because i can throw them straighter so they are more predictable.

Any suggestions on stretches / low-impact weight routines to help build strength for thumbers?



Use the throwers 10 program. We use it on all of our overhand athelets. Start slowly with little to no resistance. You can pick up a resistance band at any PT clinic. Just stop and ask how much some Theraband costs. Low weight, high reps.

http://www.asmi.org/SportsMed/throwing/thrower10.html

Josh Lenox PT

well i used firebirds for thumbers and worked good, but ive have recently started using a max for my hyzers, i think it will take place of my firebird, it seems to do fine with the thumber. does anyone like the thumber or ahev experience throwing Max thumbers? i heard whippets were great but have not tried it.

i prefer to use an overstable disc that i can hyzer, thumber and side arm with same disc, to cut down on number of plastic and choices in bag. if you used a disc for all three, what would you throw??? monster, firebird, max, pred...

try a tbird they fly very accurate as a thumber.
ialso throw firebird as a thumber.
the two make a great combination for the sidearm backhand and thumber set.

i prefer to use an overstable disc that i can hyzer, thumber and side arm with same disc, to cut down on number of plastic and choices in bag. if you used a disc for all three, what would you throw??? monster, firebird, max, pred...



I use the Z Predator. I've tried all the others, especially the Firebird. For Firebirds I loved the CE FX and the Proline...Stars are good but lose stability fast for a Firebird. Champion ones are all over the place and they do not seem to hold their speed/glide as well as the CE and Proline...

So I throw older, stiff, domey Z Preds. The stability changes ever so slowly and it is a great thumber and forehand disc as well. All in all it flies more like the older Firebirds I learned with than the new Firebirds do.