BoomerFinSooner
Feb 26 2007, 11:00 PM
for those of you who straddle putt out there, why do you do it as opposed to staggered?

i find it more difficult to get distance with no weight shift. what do you think?

ck34
Feb 26 2007, 11:14 PM
The logic is that if you're going to have to straddle anyway on many wooded courses, you might as well make it your standard putt since you can essentially use it anywhere. In addition, I believe the straddle putting motion produces less error side to side than foot forward so you're just working on learning your total power needed to account for hi/lo.

You practice putting this way from as far back as comfortable, then start dropping your left foot back (right handed) a little more to get more power as the distance gets farther. With practice, you can get farther and farther back without dropping your left foot back.

the_kid
Feb 26 2007, 11:42 PM
for those of you who straddle putt out there, why do you do it as opposed to staggered?

i find it more difficult to get distance with no weight shift. what do you think?



I just switched to the Barry straddle about 3 months ago and my putting has greatly improved. I was about 70% from 30' but I used to be the bounce out master so I was hitting solid more than that but I wanted something that would prevent the spitters. After switching I have been pretty much automatic from 30' when the winds weren't 15mph+.

The straddle seems to eliminate the side-to-side error like Chuck said but it also makes the basket look a lot bigger and all you really have to focus on is if you want to nose up or down.

the_kid
Feb 26 2007, 11:43 PM
Oh yeah and if you use your legs you can get to 60' without too much effort which is farther then I like to stagger putt.

the_beastmaster
Feb 27 2007, 12:07 AM
After about a year or so of switching between straddle and stagger and wavering about my decision, I decided on straddling a couple of months ago.

As was said, I find it almost eliminates left to right misses completely. I feel that I am balanced really well in a straddle, and I'm much more consistent in my line and my release, so it's really only a matter of gauging the distance to the basket and minimizing high/low misses. I put with somewhat of a loft (but not as much as Barry) so I usually aim for my disc to apex at the height of the top of the target (below the number plate) with the disc losing altitude before it gets there and almost falling into the chains.

As I get farther out past 35 or 40, I just use my same putt but add some height so I have more loft, but am still coming down at my intended angle. I can putt this way up to about 75' although I'll follow through forward after my release from that distance. It minimizes long comebacks, too -- since I'm basically lofting the disc to drop into the basket, I won't have major fly bys unless I really screw something up. From 70-75, I'll typically make about 1/10, chain out or hit metal another 3 or 4/10, and very rarely do I have more than a 18-20' putt for the comeback.

chessguy13
Feb 27 2007, 12:23 AM
Well put everyone. I love straddle putting; I just need to make sure I have good spin on it maybe flying with a little hyzer. My regular putt however is more of a push putt off my hip which unfortunately far too often ends up way too nose down and short.

MTL21676
Feb 27 2007, 09:33 AM
I straddle putt everything.

My reasoning:

1. As Chuck pointed out, I rarely have to change my stance. Playing NC where almost all courses are wooded, it gives me an advantage around the greens I feel. Just about the only time you cannot straddle is when you land directly between two trees about 3 - 5 feet apart, and I can count on one hand the number of times in a year that happens and I can't straddle.

2. The basket is a vertical target. More than likely when you put stradle your arm motion will be bottom to top (See Barry's Putt) rather than a normal stance where your putt is more likely back to front (see Matt Orum). The area of chains is much bigger from the bottom the band / chain holders to the top of the basket than it is left to right. With this, I seem to make more "bad putts".

3. When I switched, my three putts almost vanished. I still can get pretty close to the basket from 50 - 60 and still make a really good and agressive run at it.

4. Straddle putting is GREAT in the wind. Head wind putts very rarely lift and blow by as much, and tail wind putts get slammed, therefore, you can be really agressive with them.

mikeP
Feb 27 2007, 12:01 PM
I always straddle down here where everyone imitates Climo, so I'm often asked why. All the reasons have been pretty well layed out here already, but I would like to add that the straddle-jump putt (which I actually see Climo do quite often) is more reliable than a foot forward jump putt, and it can take your range out even more.

How do you other guys hit the chains from your straddle? I go for slight right side of the pole, and my disc comes in flat/slightly hyzer, and slightly nose down.

ck34
Feb 27 2007, 01:01 PM
but I would like to add that the straddle-jump putt (which I actually see Climo do quite often) is more reliable than a foot forward jump putt



...as learned from watching frogs evade alligators...

Lyle O Ross
Feb 27 2007, 01:13 PM
I'm assuming that when people are using the straddle putt, that they really mean the straddle stance with a pitch/lift putt?

Even with a split legged putt you can use the pitch putt for more accuracy. If you read Stokely's stuff, he uses the pitch putt with both styles. He derived his power from pushing off with the back leg instead of a more physical pitch. He used the straddle stance on hills because it gave him a firmer position. Stokely split his legs in such a way to get a firm stance, he doesn't place one leg directly behind the other in line with the basket, i.e. he has almost a straddle/split leg stance. That stance gives him the advantages of each style.

I converted to the pitch/lift style putting because of the obvious reason that two of the top players in the world use it. One thing that I've observed in video footage is that Barry, who prefers the straddle stance, is more likely to doink a putt than Ken who uses a split leg. However, there may be no real correlation.

my_hero
Feb 27 2007, 01:20 PM
I straddle putt everything.

My reasoning:

1. As Chuck pointed out, I rarely have to change my stance. Playing NC where almost all courses are wooded, it gives me an advantage around the greens I feel. Just about the only time you cannot straddle is when you land directly between two trees about 3 - 5 feet apart, and I can count on one hand the number of times in a year that happens and I can't straddle.

2. The basket is a vertical target. More than likely when you put stradle your arm motion will be bottom to top (See Barry's Putt) rather than a normal stance where your putt is more likely back to front (see Matt Orum). The area of chains is much bigger from the bottom the band / chain holders to the top of the basket than it is left to right. With this, I seem to make more "bad putts".

3. When I switched, my three putts almost vanished. I still can get pretty close to the basket from 50 - 60 and still make a really good and agressive run at it.

4. Straddle putting is GREAT in the wind. Head wind putts very rarely lift and blow by as much, and tail wind putts get slammed, therefore, you can be really agressive with them.



The above info is priceless.

I switched to a straddle stance 5+ years ago and have never looked back. For me, it's easier to nail the line....rarely missing left or right. Finding the fine tune knobs for the right height is easier since the target is larger vertically...as MTL stated.

sleepyEDB
Feb 27 2007, 02:53 PM
A very interesting thread...thanks for the info!

I only use the straddle when my lie requires me to (have to get around an obstacle, on a hillside, etc.)

I think I will devote a bit more time to the straddle putt and see how it feels/performs for me vs. the traditional staggered stance.


sleepy

dwmichaels
Feb 27 2007, 04:07 PM
Although the straddle stance is easy, learning how to pitch putt is not so easy. I've tried to learn the pitch putt, but just can't seem to get anything on the disc. When I try to put something on it, I'm obviously doing something wrong because I'm missing left/right, which obviates the putt in the first place.

How about some tips/suggestions from those doing well with the pitch putt & straddle stance?

MTL21676
Feb 27 2007, 04:16 PM
first thing I see many people do with straddle putts wrong is missing low / not getting enough on it. Four things I teach people.

1. I feel that if you don't take the disc so low, you will have better success. To many people try to copy Barry - Barry's putt works for him, but I promise, not going as far down with your movement helps.

2. Don't be afraid to miss high! The putt will drop, don't worry. Aim for the belt, look at the belt.

3. You must putt the disc harder than you think. A 15 footer needs the arm power of about a 25 footer with a "normal" putt.

4. FOLLOW THROUGH!!! Hands down the most important part. Concentrate on this - I use to literally putt with a putter that had it written on it. You release should have a gun point feel to it (meaning you thumb is straight up and your point finger straight out - if you feel the disc come off your middle finger, chances are your release is palm up, which is not good.)

Video tape youself straddle putting. Just put the camera pointing at you. As soon as you make / miss, say the reuslt of the putt / what it felt like.

If you make one and it hit dead center - say - made - felt good, hit dead center. If it sneaks in say - made but a little off left. IF you miss low, say missed low.

Then study the tape and I promise, you will see a difference in the makes a misses. Study what you did right in the one where it was perfect and study the difference in that and the one that barely went in. Look at the bad ones. What is the difference between that and the good one?

My experience says that 9 out of 10 times, with straddle putting, the difference is the follow through ( or lack there of)

the_kid
Feb 27 2007, 04:16 PM
I'm assuming that when people are using the straddle putt, that they really mean the straddle stance with a pitch/lift putt?

Even with a split legged putt you can use the pitch putt for more accuracy. If you read Stokely's stuff, he uses the pitch putt with both styles. He derived his power from pushing off with the back leg instead of a more physical pitch. He used the straddle stance on hills because it gave him a firmer position. Stokely split his legs in such a way to get a firm stance, he doesn't place one leg directly behind the other in line with the basket, i.e. he has almost a straddle/split leg stance. That stance gives him the advantages of each style.

I converted to the pitch/lift style putting because of the obvious reason that two of the top players in the world use it. One thing that I've observed in video footage is that Barry, who prefers the straddle stance, is more likely to doink a putt than Ken who uses a split leg. However, there may be no real correlation.



In all the videos i have seen of stokely he didn't seem to pitch. Even so he wasn't the best putter out there by any means.

ck34
Feb 27 2007, 04:18 PM
There's still some spin imparted when pitching. I sort of think like I'm reaching up from doing something on the ground to opening my hand to shake hands with the number plate.

tbender
Feb 27 2007, 04:19 PM
Lyle, the correlation there is Ken is a better putter than Barry.

I straddle (or putt from my knees), and pitch-putt or spin-putt as needed.

The biggest key I've found to getting spin on the putter and keeping it online is to release dead-center-to-left-center (I'm a lefty) with a little hyzer. The hyzer lets me use my wrist more without pulling the putter offline. Excellent for putting in windy and low ceiling situations.

Lyle O Ross
Feb 27 2007, 05:42 PM
Lyle, the correlation there is Ken is a better putter than Barry.

I straddle (or putt from my knees), and pitch-putt or spin-putt as needed.

The biggest key I've found to getting spin on the putter and keeping it online is to release dead-center-to-left-center (I'm a lefty) with a little hyzer. The hyzer lets me use my wrist more without pulling the putter offline. Excellent for putting in windy and low ceiling situations.



No doubt, some of the putts Barry misses are a laugh. However, I might speculate that the split leg is a little more "forgiving" of a bad pitch putt than the straddle, simply because you can get more power into the putt from your leg. Now that seems logical, but it may not be.

I asked Dave Dunipace about the whole pitch putt vs push putt thing (O.K. I didn't quite ask... :D) but he pointed out that the terminology, i.e. pitch, was that used by early guys who defined the stance. It isn't meant to imply that there is no spin simply the down low lifting up to a release point motion.

Stokely didn't try and put any spin on his pitch putt (I'm not saying he was a good putter, but he did study the sport and worked with a lot of players to catalog different play styles). Instead, he used the notch in the joint of his forefinger as a pivot point and thrust the disc at the basket. When he putted he would lift and then stop his lift motion abruptly. As the disk left his hand it pivoted off his finger and that naturally put spin on it. He used that technique because all the motion was at the target so you wouldn't pull the disc off line.

So, he would argue that you should never intentionally use your wrist to put spin on the disc.

I actully do use my wrist to put spin on the disc and use a very different release than Stokely describes. I keep the disc on target using two methods. The first is that I coordinate my wrist motion with my lift so that the momentum is up instead of side to side. Second, I do what all good putters tell you to do, my motion is directed at a target in the basket so that my motion is to that target.

Lyle O Ross
Feb 27 2007, 05:45 PM
There's still some spin imparted when pitching. I sort of think like I'm reaching up from doing something on the ground to opening my hand to shake hands with the number plate.



I like this definition, it implies subtlety. Those who work anything, snap, release etc. to hard often fail. A subtle release that is firm yet smooth seems to be best.

jstites
Feb 27 2007, 11:21 PM
At one point in time, I used nothing but the straddle putt, but anything 50-60', I had trouble reaching and in the attempt my accuracy would falter. So I switched back to a staggered putt. After reading this during the day, I went to the course this evening and experimented with the straddle putt. I had the same problem with distance. I agree the straddle putt is dead on for anything inside 30-40', but long putts are a real weakness for me.

I guess the easy thing to do would be to not have 60' putts, or in the words of Happy Gilmore, "I should just try to get the ball in one shot every time."

So, could someone explain where power comes from in regards to the straddle putt? All of my buddies can do it, but cannot figure out why I cannot. I think Chuck Kennedy eluded to what I need, but I did not follow completely. Someone please help!

dwmichaels
Feb 28 2007, 01:24 AM
What I have a hard time with is getting spin and power on the disc as well as an up/down flight path. If you're imparting spin, how do you not risk missing left or right by releasing early/late?

What grip is predominant with pitch putting? Index finger on the rim or under the plate?

MTL21676
Feb 28 2007, 09:24 AM
What I have a hard time with is getting spin and power on the disc as well as an up/down flight path. If you're imparting spin, how do you not risk missing left or right by releasing early/late?

What grip is predominant with pitch putting? Index finger on the rim or under the plate?



I don't put much spin on the disc at all - it's all arm motion. I putt with flipper discs due to this.

As far as what everyone else does, I can't answer that. I put my finger on the rim.

the_kid
Feb 28 2007, 10:16 AM
What I have a hard time with is getting spin and power on the disc as well as an up/down flight path. If you're imparting spin, how do you not risk missing left or right by releasing early/late?

What grip is predominant with pitch putting? Index finger on the rim or under the plate?



I don't put much spin on the disc at all - it's all arm motion. I putt with flipper discs due to this.

As far as what everyone else does, I can't answer that. I put my finger on the rim.



I ususally do the same except I use a newer Wizard. I can throw the disc with very low spin and it still flies straight with almosto no fade so idon't think a lot of spin in necessary,

gregbrowning
Feb 28 2007, 11:53 AM
A quick lesson and explanation of why to straddle putt from My_Hero was enough to get me to change. I agree, it is more difficult to get the distance that I could get in a split stance, but from 40' in I never miss left/right anymore, only high/low (usually low :confused:).

I think he is still trying to get that Aviar-X out of my hands and put a Challenger in its place, though. :D

ck34
Feb 28 2007, 12:05 PM
but from 40' in I never miss left/right anymore, only high/low (usually low ).




Same problem here. I realized that I had been looking at too low of a reference point on the basket, typically the basket rim. I now look at the red focus tape or higher and it's helped.

Boneman
Feb 28 2007, 01:09 PM
but from 40' in I never miss left/right anymore, only high/low (usually low ).




Same problem here. I realized that I had been looking at too low of a reference point on the basket, typically the basket rim. I now look at the red focus tape or higher and it's helped.


I focus on a point about 5-6 inches below the top of the post. Seems to have helped me. I'm also experimenting with looking at the chains in front of the post, rather than the post. This also seems to be working.

I practice with both stances, but the point I aim at is always the same.

One problem I have with the straddle is that I tend to loft the disc higher. This is a problem on our local course, because we have low ceiling trees around the baskets. Sometimes the straddle just doesn't seem like the best choice. With a staggered stance, I can get a flatter, lower throw. Occasionally I even have to air bounce the disc around trees/branches.

For you guys who straddle putt ... do you play on wide open courses all the time?

MikeMC
Feb 28 2007, 01:24 PM
I've been playing around with several techniques and find things I like about each. I do straddle withing 25 feet because I find it very easy to make these using this technique. My balance is great and steady compared to the staggered footing.

In the end, I'm reverting back to the technique that I used 25 years ago. I actually throw and don't putt. I throw standing perpendicular to the target and step through, put a little anheiser on it, and put the nose up very slightly. When I release, my hand and arm are pointed exactly where I want the start of the line to be. I need to adjust if it's windy. I had been trying a heiser and worked towards a predictably flight pattern and aim accordingly but I found that a little tricky. When I do an anheiser, it goes exactly where I aim and straightens out just before the basket. The disc goes very straight with a slight S curve and then catches a little air bounce and floats down. It's a touch throw but I love it. The nose up means I need to get the speed/distance right as well but I'm going through periods where I'm hitting 30% from 80 feet. If I miss, the disc is within 10 feet. I can use this technique from 150 feet and have quality runs (within 3 feet of chains at worst) and easy come back putts. It's not an easy technique but with practice I can gain consistancy. 25 years ago, within 100 feet was a putt for me and I'd hit a lot of putts from that distance. It doesn't work for me within 25 feet because I need to short arm it.

I had never seen anyone else use this technique so I was very surprised when I was on the Discraft website and watched a video/clinic on Making Long Putts and saw Mark Ellis and the 1999 World Pro Champion, Ron Russel using pretty much the same technique. I do more the Ron Russle style but with a little air bounce that Mark describes. Here's the link to the site/video: http://www.discraft.com/resources.html

They give good explanations of the technique and what they like about it. It's a great technique and sure is pretty to watch.

MTL21676
Feb 28 2007, 01:34 PM
For you guys who straddle putt ... do you play on wide open courses all the time?



95% of the course I play on are wooded.

the_kid
Feb 28 2007, 02:46 PM
For you guys who straddle putt ... do you play on wide open courses all the time?



95% of the course I play on are wooded.



I'm from Texas so about 50-50. They are wide open though just not heavily wooded.

Boneman
Feb 28 2007, 02:55 PM
I guess my situation is different. These high mountain courses in Colorado have a lot trees with very low branches. Even when you park a hole, you often have to putt under or around, up or down hill.
Our mountain courses are very different from all the lower elevation courses I've played. The sage brush makes throwing rollers out of the question too! And I love to throw rollers! :p
We DO have 5 ski areas within 30 min drive though! :cool:

the_beastmaster
Feb 28 2007, 03:21 PM
I play almost all wooded courses. Most of that is old growth though, so there's not a ton of low ceiling stuff. I have to putt around stuff way more often than I have to putt below stuff.

crusher
Mar 01 2007, 07:57 AM
You might want to consider what your non throwing arm is doing while straddling. I know that if I let my right shoulder(I'm a lefty) turn to the right it will pull my putt to the right. If you leave your non throwing shoulder square to the target you won't pull your putts.

the_kid
Mar 01 2007, 10:15 AM
You might want to consider what your non throwing arm is doing while straddling. I know that if I let my right shoulder(I'm a lefty) turn to the right it will pull my putt to the right. If you leave your non throwing shoulder square to the target you won't pull your putts.



Yup. I actually hold my disc lightly with my non throwing hand and then let go when I am about to putt. I also keep it square though and that seems to work.

All this talking about golf makes me want to play. I had 4 events in a row and I am currently working of a 4 week break. :confused:

bravo
Mar 01 2007, 11:19 AM
whos talking about golf? im reading and others are typing. :D:D

Ruder
Mar 01 2007, 08:49 PM
The trick to a good staggered putt is to use the same mechanics as you would in a straddle putt.

That is why it is good to learn the straddle putt.

MTL21676
Mar 01 2007, 09:15 PM
very good point. While stances are different, speeds are different and all that, if you look at most players putts the release is the same.

Kenny and Barry's putt is very similar with the exception of the stance.

eddie_ogburn
Mar 01 2007, 10:47 PM
The trick to a good staggered putt is to use the same mechanics as you would in a straddle putt.

That is why it is good to learn the straddle putt.



Exactly. I've recently switched to a mix stlye Ken Climo pitch putt with a Cam Todd stance and motion. While talking to Cam about his putting style one round he said the less motion in your putt, the less there is to mess up. Below is a good clip of Climo's style. He metions 'less variables' which is what Cam was referring to. Mine is the same except a little less weight shift and I don't bring the putter quite down as far as he does. It's worked real well for me lately.

<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vPQR_FFLqqY"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vPQR_FFLqqY" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>

mikeP
Mar 02 2007, 10:03 AM
1. Putting with little spin:

I actually do the opposite of MTL and use a new stable/overstable putter (I've used wizards, big bead Aviars, and now the Banger GT) and putt it very flat or with slight nose down/anhyzer. The disc flies straight with very little spin and usually starts to fade right as it is making contact with the basket. It goes from my hand to the basket on a dead straight line that arcs a little bit above the basket (for 25-30').

2. Straddle putting outside 60':

For this a falling/jump straddle is all you need to bridge the gap. This is where Chuck's frog Vs. alligator post comes to mind. Feel the leg power of your straddle stance. Keep your arm motion up and down just like usual, but explode out of your stance using your legs and continue forward on your follow through. This will give you the extra power you need, coming from your legs instead of over-emphasizing your arm motion. This ensures that you will be near the basket if you miss as well. For these longer putts I also think more loft instead of line drive and use a more beat/ less stable putter.

3. Straddle putting and low ceilings:

This one is a little tougher to remedy. I find that putts like this are tough with any stance, especially if you are outside the circle. First thing I do is get really low in my stance, but not so low that my hand is hitting the ground on my normal up down putting motion. Then I switch putters. I normally use a pro D Banger GT, which is stiff and drops rather fast. For low ceilings I would switch to my jump putt putter (soft Banger GT) which has more carry and is less stable. I would then release smooth and quick, putting a little more spin on it than usual. That is if I have to choose the low gap. If there was any sort of higher hole to hit I would choose a drop/stall putt instead.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 10:37 AM
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is carrying a lighter version of your regular putter for longer and uphill putts. I learned this from Dave Greenwell who used a 150 class putter from 60 feet when we talked about it. For me, just 5 grams lighter is enough to keep my motion the same on uphill regular putts or from farther out. It allows you to keep your same motion and energy and get more height or distance. I'll also use it for low ceiling shots where I can get more glide at a lower arc.

tbender
Mar 02 2007, 10:52 AM
3. Straddle putting and low ceilings:



Putt from your knees. You gain an extra 18-24" of ceiling.

I can get out to about 45-50' from my knees. Anything further with a low ceiling and it's a layup.

citysmasher
Mar 02 2007, 02:17 PM
The straddle putt is very hard on your lower back.

I cannot straddle putt practice for any length of time at all.

If you have a bad back, you may find this for yourself.

the_beastmaster
Mar 02 2007, 02:47 PM
The straddle putt is very hard on your lower back.

I cannot straddle putt practice for any length of time at all.

If you have a bad back, you may find this for yourself.



I've noticed this as well. I like the straddle much more than a staggered stance, but practicing has been a little hard on me. I'm only 23, but I'm 6'6" and 290, and that's a good bit of weight to throw around.

I can putt for 45 minutes to an hour at most, and I'll start to feel it in my lower back a bit. I also get tired a little quicker (compared to practicing staggered stance putts or even playing a round of golf), and my form will start to get sloppy.

I haven't noticed it while playing in tournaments though, just when practicing for a substantial length of time and throwing a couple hundred putts.

the_kid
Mar 02 2007, 02:56 PM
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is carrying a lighter version of your regular putter for longer and uphill putts. I learned this from Dave Greenwell who used a 150 class putter from 60 feet when we talked about it. For me, just 5 grams lighter is enough to keep my motion the same on uphill regular putts or from farther out. It allows you to keep your same motion and energy and get more height or distance. I'll also use it for low ceiling shots where I can get more glide at a lower arc.



See that wouldn't work for all people though. I personally prefer uphill putts because you can throw them harder and there isn't too much worry about flying by.

For a 30ft putt that is 5ft up just aim 1-2ft higher than normal.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 03:16 PM
What about physics doesn't work for all people? Lighter means the same profile disc will fly slightly higher and/or farther when thrown with the same release speed and trajectory for the distances involved with putting.

the_kid
Mar 02 2007, 09:56 PM
What about physics doesn't work for all people? Lighter means the same profile disc will fly slightly higher and/or farther when thrown with the same release speed and trajectory for the distances involved with putting.



I meant that it doesn't "work" for all people meaning that a lot of people don't like switching putter weights.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 10:06 PM
Don't like or haven't tried? I offered an option for people to try that has sound fundamentals. If you don't like it after trying it, then fine. Rejecting it before trying it makes no sense. No one is such a good putter that testing possible ways to improve is a waste of time.

the_kid
Mar 02 2007, 10:09 PM
Don't like or haven't tried? I offered an option for people to try that has sound fundamentals. If you don't like it after trying it, then fine. Rejecting it before trying it makes no sense. No one is such a good putter that testing possible ways to improve is a waste of time.



Ok well I don't see a need to change putters because I think that creats too much inconsistacies. I mean if you are used to 175g and go to 170g you will release a little later due to the decrease in weight.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 10:11 PM
I mean if you are used to 175g and go to 170g you will release a little later due to the decrease in weight.




Exactly. You made my point. A little later, means a little higher, means a few more in, on uphill and longer putts. Thanks.

the_kid
Mar 02 2007, 10:32 PM
I mean if you are used to 175g and go to 170g you will release a little later due to the decrease in weight.




Exactly. You made my point. A little later, means a little higher, means a few more in, on uphill and longer putts. Thanks.



No a little later means to the right. We all have also noticed that uphill putts seem to hyzer less so being off a little right means the difference between a make and miss.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 10:35 PM
It's not a miss right if your straddle mechanics are already good. Your toss is a little higher in the vertical pitch.

the_kid
Mar 02 2007, 10:52 PM
It's not a miss right if your straddle mechanics are already good. Your toss is a little higher in the vertical pitch.

The disc is still "rolling" out of you hand and a late release will still lead to the disc coming out farther right.

ck34
Mar 02 2007, 11:06 PM
Not if you're pitching vertically. Arm motion for a good straddle pitch had better be more vertical than moving laterally at release and a disc weight variance within a 20g range shouldn't change that.

the_kid
Mar 03 2007, 12:51 AM
Not if you're pitching vertically. Arm motion for a good straddle pitch had better be more vertical than moving laterally at release and a disc weight variance within a 20g range shouldn't change that.



Uh yeah it does and plus the lighter disc's flightplate will be softer and not as good for pitching.

ck34
Mar 03 2007, 01:02 AM
Uh yeah it does and plus the lighter disc's flightplate will be softer and not as good for pitching.



Must be using the wrong model of putter then. No problem with Classic Rocs.

Ruder
Mar 03 2007, 10:01 PM
I personally would not want to dramatically change my weight in mid game on my most important disc. Why not just use a very beat up version of the same mold and same weight if anything?

Professional bowlers do not go from a 16 lb ball to a 12 lb ball in mid game - this is the same concept.

I just switch between magnet and challenger when need depending on conditions. It works for me because I know my discs well enough and how they fly to pick and choose between them and I'm sure this wouldn't work for everyone.

ck34
Mar 03 2007, 10:06 PM
Professional bowlers do not go from a 16 lb ball to a 12 lb ball in mid game - this is the same concept.



You don't know that pro bowlers wouldn't change ball weights if they had to bowl uphill in some frames or from farther away. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

axis
Mar 04 2007, 09:41 AM
Greetings,
I worry about the weights of my discs, but then I realized the rule describing an official baseball: ďIt shall weigh not less than five nor more than 5 1/4 ounces avoirdupois". Thatís a 7 gram spread on a baseball thatís an ounce lighter than our discs! If 7 grams donít matter on a 5 ounce ball, how can a few grams matter on a 6 ounce disc? Maybe they do, but are a few grams really significant, compared to other factors, e.g. the air/wind and throwing motion.
Thanks,
Axis

jrsnapp
Mar 04 2007, 12:55 PM
For me, the weight difference is a factor when it comes to headwind versus tailwind. From what I've been told and experienced, you want something heavier and more overstable for headwinds and something lighter (for me, easier to manage) and understable for tailwinds.

In baseball, the weight rule is effect so no one is to have an advantage (ie - adding pine tar, using sandpaper, ect). Everyone has the same option. If a baseball needed to be thrown further, they might would have to consider changing the weight. In Disc Golf, there are many different weights to choose from (again, same options within the rules), it just comes down to personal preference of the when throwing in different conditions. This is just my humble opinion.

robertsummers
Apr 14 2007, 01:04 AM
I switched to a pitch putt over the last few weeks and in practice and in casual rounds (without winds) has been amazing. I have been hitting putts a lot more often from every distance and here are the reasons why so far. First off since switching I rarely miss left or right at least inside of at least 20' or so. Also it gives me the confidence to go for it because if I miss from anywhere I usually have a fairly easy second putt because the angle usually causes it to flop next to the basket so I don't worry about putting too hard or rolls on hyzer putts. It also gives me a bigger target, I have had a lot more putts that miss chains fall in and also high putts(next to the top) that normally pop out just fall straight down which once again gives me confidence. I don't straddle putt I have been coming from about my waist or belly button, but think it shows a lot of promise as of now, we'll see in the first non-windy tournament if it really helps or not. I still like firm putting for wind, but no wind or light wind I don't see me switching inside of 30' or so anytime soon.

my_hero
Apr 17 2007, 06:10 PM
One thing I haven't seen mentioned is carrying a lighter version of your regular putter for longer and uphill putts. I learned this from Dave Greenwell who used a 150 class putter from 60 feet when we talked about it. For me, just 5 grams lighter is enough to keep my motion the same on uphill regular putts or from farther out. It allows you to keep your same motion and energy and get more height or distance. I'll also use it for low ceiling shots where I can get more glide at a lower arc.



See that wouldn't work for all people though. I personally prefer uphill putts because you can throw them harder and there isn't too much worry about flying by.

For a 30ft putt that is 5ft up just aim 1-2ft higher than normal.



Another tip for uphill straddle putts, or any stance really as long as it's an uphill putt is to make the bottom of your chin parallel to the slope you are putting up . This will help those of you that constantly throw uphillers into the cage.

Changing to a lighter disc is a good idea if the above tip doesn't work for you.

Apr 17 2007, 06:35 PM
Go heavy, it will only make you stronger.
Go light, it will only help you identify flaws in your form.
Split the difference, be strong and have good form .. After that, it does not matter what the disc weighs.

markpeterson
Apr 19 2007, 01:03 AM
Maybe you 2 should have a putting contest. Hehe. I have a bad back( 5 herniatied discs) and straddle putts with bent knees and a stiff straight spine works well. No pain in the motion of putting. Straddle putts really save me more strokes by rarely 3 putting. I don't have long come backs. I always teach people to practice with an extra wide straddle stance because its hard to do. Then when you try what you are comfortable with , it seems a little easier. It's all about being relaxed, and a good straddle form is very relaxing ( to me anyway ).

youngster
Jun 16 2009, 06:28 PM
i like to straddle putt most of the time. and the thought came to me if i were say within 20 feet of the basket. could i set my straddle putt, let's say, 2 feet behing the marker. when you make your throw the movement of weight through your body makes you take a
foot-and-a-half step. would this be a falling putt? because you could show full balance with the foot that you stepped with 6 inches from behind the marker.

krupicka
Jun 16 2009, 06:36 PM
You need to be 30cm behind the marker with a supporting point when you release the disc.

unclemercy
Jun 17 2009, 12:43 AM
you are allowed a twenty nine centimeter step. also, in a straddle, your opposite foot may be in front of your mini marked foot, but no closer to the hole than your actual mark made by your mini. i hope this is clear. after all, these are the official suggested guidelines.

exczar
Jun 17 2009, 01:08 AM
There he goes again. Substitute "rules" for "suggested guidelines" and you will be fine.

How do I do the ignore user with this new fangled bulletin board?

Jeff_LaG
Jun 17 2009, 06:27 AM
How do I do the ignore user with this new fangled bulletin board?

User CP > Edit Ignore List

Merkaba311
Jun 17 2009, 01:09 PM
i like to straddle putt most of the time. and the thought came to me if i were say within 20 feet of the basket. could i set my straddle putt, let's say, 2 feet behing the marker. when you make your throw the movement of weight through your body makes you take a
foot-and-a-half step. would this be a falling putt? because you could show full balance with the foot that you stepped with 6 inches from behind the marker.

The key is that when the disc is released your foot has to be planted within 30cm directly behind the marker. As long as you don't step ahead of the marker with your non-plant foot, you can basically get as creative as you like when it comes to putting inside the circle. You could start back six feet from your marker and walk towards it and stop when your planting foot is "in play" and release your disc and it would be legal as long as you don't step over your marker.

There he goes again. Substitute "rules" for "suggested guidelines" and you will be fine.

How do I do the ignore user with this new fangled bulletin board?

I don't know what user you're referring to but ignoring "youngsters" (pun intended) isn't going to help them learn the rules.

Many people found a love for disc golf because of their disdain for rules in general...I know I did. Our passion attracts "alternative" people more so than most activities. Don't forget we all play to have fun ;) The hukking of plastic unites all of us here.

exczar
Jun 17 2009, 02:58 PM
User CP > Edit Ignore List


Are you telling me this as a Moderator, or as an ordinary user, heh heh...

unclemercy
Jun 17 2009, 03:13 PM
i am so emotional over all of this. before you put me on ignore, i think it only fair that i let you know that just because you write he he, or whatever, it does not make your posts humorous. you prove this time and time again. i think it is a rule.