How far back should your wrist be cocked (In your opinon) when you drive?

A week ago I started really trying to pull across my chest, and that got me some distance...but then I tried doing that AND torquing my wrist back a whole lot pre-snap in order to get a larger flick when I threw. I found that every now and then I would get one off, but it seemed that curling my wrist and pulling across my chest opposed each other.. Like I was tensing up too many muscles before I threw..

Can anyone tell me if I am just supposed to keep practicing because cocking your wrist back a lot is GOOD, or am I tensing up too much to ever get a consistant throw?

:confused: HELP! (and thank you)

- Brandon

I don't #$*&$! my wrist at all. My drives are the best part of my game and I try to lock my wrist straight out for my drives. Then, when pulling through, the natural drag on the disc forces my wrist back and when my arm gets out in front of my body, (and I am trying to keep my wrist locked straight) it snaps back puts a lot of spin on the disc.

Try that and see how it works for ya.

How unbelievably stupid is it that this dumb board censors the word coc k. I hope there aren't any 2nd graders reading this. It could ruin them for life!

That seems very logical... I'll give that a try today, and I'll report back.

-Brandon

P.S. It's windy as hell and raining :eek:

Nothing to say besides... holy crap.

That worked like a charm, I was putting in less effort and getting the biggest drives of my life, no joke... I think it is a testament to Bruce Lee when he said the less I try, the better I become (Not exact quote)....

Thank you, sir

Brandon

There are times and places where more snap (c-word) is necessary. In big D drives, I have found that it is not, muscles need to be working towards disc speed, not rotation. However when throwing rollers, more rotation is needed so more wrist (c-word) is called for. Also, for a lot of midrange and putter throws that require more finesse than speed, increased rotation helps so the dreaded (c-word) is needed.
However, as always, different strokes for different folks. Dustin K. (a top pro from IN) (c-word)s his wrist soo much on drives that the disc almost touches the inside of his elbow! So, in finality, there is no "right" way to throw, just experiment and find what works for you.

Yeah Nolan Grider does that too. I tried it for a while and it killed my drives. Now I lock my wrist for every shot except soft, finesse throws. Works great for me.

Y'all should retitle this "The Eddie Griffen Thread." :p

I try to lock my wrist straight out for my drives. Then, when pulling through, the natural drag on the disc forces my wrist back and when my arm gets out in front of my body, (and I am trying to keep my wrist locked straight) it snaps back puts a lot of spin on the disc.




There was this guy named Scott Stokely that tried to teach the same thing. BTW, i can write coc[/b]k. You just have to know how to spell coc[/b]k correctly.....as in he shouldn't try to coc[/b]k his wrist.

Yeah Nolan Grider does that too. I tried it for a while and it killed my drives. Now I lock my wrist for every shot except soft, finesse throws. Works great for me.



I c_ock my wrist as well. When I pull through my whole arm uncoils as well as my wrist. My wrist starts out cocked, but my wrist is loose as I pull through and my tendons stretch even further than my original cocked position before bouncing forward. I don't know if the c_ock is necessary, but it helps my arm feel loaded like a coiled spring.

I'm happy to say that I'm much more satisfied de-cocked than cocked. :eek:

How many guys can say that?
-Bg

I consider anything but a relaxed wrist a bad idea. There is a local pro who does crank his wrist back and out drives me too. That just attests to the fact that you can practice bad habits and eventually make them work. It just takes longer. I prefer proper form whenever I can manage it.

I have video 'd the top pro's and when I watch them in slow motion there are a few things that they all seem to do. Most all of them have huge pull backs as in get that shoulder to move back, so your not just using your arm. When you start to pull back farther you will shank to the right and high, because now you are adding more thrust to the toss. You will adjust your feet to correct this and in time toss the disc where you are aiming. I've seen very long throws without big run ups and with big run ups. Jim Oats who is 6'4" over 200lbs throws with hips and shoulders all one step and he can crush 500' easly, Ken Jarvis under 6' and a buck 30 at most uses 3 steps and hardly any pull back and can throw 700' I am studying his technic now. He uses the least amount of energy than anyone I have watched and he throws a old school viper. There are many types of technics and I feel the less wasted energy the farther you will throw.

The wrist curl that your talking about isn't prevalent, but it is used by a few. You must create arm speed and your release must co and is with your forward body movement. Some thing else I noticed is all do not keep their heads forward looking at their release as they are getting a full pull back which requires your head to follow your shoulders. Its about where your foot lands and doing the drive enough to know where you will be throwing. I advise anyone who is serious to video your self throwing and also video some great pros and analyze them to find out what makes a long toss. Hope I didn't confuse you. :D

When I pull through my whole arm uncoils as well as my wrist. My wrist starts out cocked, but my wrist is loose as I pull through and my tendons stretch even further than my original cocked position before bouncing forward. I don't know if the c_ock is necessary, but it helps my arm feel loaded like a coiled spring.



You have hit on an interesting point when you acknowledge that your tendons are streching. It is the streching of the tendons that leads to an explosive action, such as a disc golf shot.

I stumbled upon THIS ARTICLE (http://www.performbetter.com/catalog/matriarch/OnePiecePage.asp_Q_PageID_E_58_A_PageName_E_Articl ePlyometrics1) about plyometric training when I was looking for info on improving my vertical jumping (I play a ton of hoops along with Dgolf). As I read the article however, it really made me think about a disc golf shot in a knew way. This article does a great job of describing the importance of "preloading" the tendons to maximize an explosive motion. I highly recomend that anybody who has the time read it. I have not really changed anything as far as for on account of reading this, but I have become much more aware of what is happening during a shot (drives and putts alike!)

I have linked to 'Article I' which is a general description of what plyometrics is all about, then there are 2 more articles that get more specific to basketball and the types of excercises that will increase jumping ability.

As far as the debate about cocking your wrist or not, that is one of the more interesting fundamental choices a disc golfer makes when choosing their form and/or style. I seem to go back and forth on cocking or not every couple of years. I once asked my friend who is a really small guy that has been able to throw really far since almost day 1 why he throws farther than me, yet it is clear that I can throw the disc faster.

He said, "It's easy, I wrap the disc in my wrist..."

I advise anyone who is serious to video your self throwing and also video some great pros and analyze them to find out what makes a long toss.



I completely agree... Though I haven't gotten the opportunity to film myself, I have been watching throws by Ken Climo...

Let me just say his form is absolutely clean. Squeaky clean. I have also seen videos of other top competetors, and nobody comes close... they all seem herky jerky in one way or another. Climo is not. The one thing that really helped and effected me was to hold your back straight, to really try to straighten your shoulders a little before you throw. That allows the more powerful muscles in your back and legs to do most of the work, and it has been a boon for me.

I agree that throw analysis is essential to becoming a better player, but most people without cameras could easily improve their technique simply by watching Climo. Find one thing about his throw that you don't do, get out to a field or your course, and work on that one thing for a day, a week, or however long... Your mechanics will quickly solidify, and you will see your throws going further and straighter with less effort.

-Brandon

I advise anyone who is serious to video your self throwing and also video some great pros and analyze them to find out what makes a long toss.



I completely agree... Though I haven't gotten the opportunity to film myself, I have been watching throws by Ken Climo...

Let me just say his form is absolutely clean. Squeaky clean. I have also seen videos of other top competetors, and nobody comes close... they all seem herky jerky in one way or another. Climo is not. The one thing that really helped and effected me was to hold your back straight, to really try to straighten your shoulders a little before you throw. That allows the more powerful muscles in your back and legs to do most of the work, and it has been a boon for me.

I agree that throw analysis is essential to becoming a better player, but most people without cameras could easily improve their technique simply by watching Climo. Find one thing about his throw that you don't do, get out to a field or your course, and work on that one thing for a day, a week, or however long... Your mechanics will quickly solidify, and you will see your throws going further and straighter with less effort.

-Brandon



Speed Flick !!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Hey!! One of you computer wiz's ought to put a link to KC's drive...about now. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif :cool:

Hey!! One of you computer wiz's ought to put a link to KC's drive...about now. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif :cool:




Here is the directory (http://www.discgolfreview.com/resources/videos/) for the videos. The Ken Climo ones are KClimo..... not that I didn't trust you guys to figure that out. But just in case. :cool:

Man, his form is flawless. It's like he's floating when he throws.

-Bg

Something to consider is the phycial difference between the various players and the effect it has on selecting the best technique. When you are tall, have big hands, and strength, you might want a different technique than someone who is successful but is physically smaller. For instance, some grips are easier for me than others. I focus on what the grip is trying to acheive and see if I can produce those results.

My observation is that consistancy is critical. Ken Climo always preaches simplification. That's because the more involved your technique is, the more opportunities for something to go wrong. It's not throwing a disc 500 feet that is important, it's consistantly throwing it 500 feet with accuracy and control. You can be effective with consistancy alone. In the long run, being able to execute flawlessly over and over again that makes a winner. Ken's drive is very clean. Not much to go wrong there. I look at Nate Doss and his feet are swinging to the side with no control. I would bet that this occasionally results in drives going off track. And when you get to that level, or any level, that's the difference.

People who aren't consistant will describe themsleves as "streaky". Other people would call them inconsistant.

Not to take anything away from your observations, but Nate Doss is currently 5th in the player ratings at 1031.

Well, some people learn the wrong way REALLY well. Not saying that is the case with Nate, but it is true with a lot of people.