Hey all,

I am wanting to increase my forehand distance. I can now put a Wraith ~330' max distance (flat, no S curve). I'm very accurate with my forehand and would like to use it more often, but without more distance, it's difficult.

I know there are some out there that can put forehands out there 400'+. What do you do? Are there any videos that can help? I have fairly good form and grip. Not much of a reach back, though.

I would appreciate any and all advice on this. My goal is to have similar distance forehand and backhand (~400').

Thanks!

Daniel

Hey all,

I am wanting to increase my forehand distance. I can now put a Wraith ~330' max distance (flat, no S curve). I'm very accurate with my forehand and would like to use it more often, but without more distance, it's difficult.

I know there are some out there that can put forehands out there 400'+. What do you do? Are there any videos that can help? I have fairly good form and grip. Not much of a reach back, though.

I would appreciate any and all advice on this. My goal is to have similar distance forehand and backhand (~400').

Thanks!

Daniel


If you have 400ft backhand distance and 330ft accurate forehand distance, I want to attend your clinic. Seriously.

Take a look at this thread (http://www.pdga.com/msgboard/showflat.php?Board=Throwing%20Techniques&Number=563024&Searchpage=0&Main=541335&Search=true&#Post563024) ...Geoff Bennett is by far the best forehand thrower (for distance and accuracy) I have seen.

Ask anyone that knows me. Last night at leagues I parked a 330' hole with my forehand and can get backhand throws to 400'. Learning to throw FH is something I have always preached to anyone starting out. If you can learn to throw FH and BH, then you will beat many people very quickly. :eek:

I believe that one can be much more accurate on the same shot with a FH with an overstable disc than a BH turnover. One word--predictable. :cool:My $.02.

Daniel Ledford
#26519

Good sir.

With you hitting 400 with your backhand...
you already know the principles you need to know to accomplish the same with your forehand.

The way I learned how to get my forehand out to that point was to read every article Blake_T has on backhanding, and I applied all of them to my forehand. Well, there's just not that many articles on the forehand. With the obvious exception of the snap, there's no difference. Flat level throw, long reach back (well reaching back is irrelevent as long as you get your hips turned), etc...

Now admitidly I've the opposite difficulties as you...can't get my backhand beyond 300. Yet this is due to me still trying to figure out the snap and getting over the fact that it feels like I'm batting lefty. Now that tourny season is basically done for me this year, I'll be working on these and next year...look out! :D

Oh...just one more thing. Don't eliminate the possibility of using stable & understable discs with your forehand. You get rid of Off Axis Tourque, you can control these discs using a forehand. I use a beaten Pro Starfire-L to every now and then bust 450 on the practice field. Can't do that with my Champ Starfire-X.

Scott Stokely used to be one of the most awesome forehand throwers in the country. And while I know there are a lot of people who don't agree with all he teaches in his video/dvd's, I think the method and style he uses to throw a forehand are solid. If you want to improve distance, you have to improve style/form ... check out his video/dvd on forehand driving. He's got some good tips, and the style to back it up.
Tips like the three step runup (which is not really a "run" it's three steps. Arm position and disc angle, reach back, getting your elbow in front of your hand, chest square and pointing at the basket, and follow through. When you see him throw it looks effortless and easy ... and I think that's what you have to do to get more distance.

For me, my best forehand form very closely resembles a baseball swing. For max distance wrist, elbow, shoulders, hips (disc selection) and legs all play a big part of the throw.

The best way to develop a forhand throw is to abandon the run/walk up. I remain flat footed on all my forehand drives. Accuracy- check, distance- check, impressive- check! If anything, before I throw I pick up my front foot and set it right back down. This eliminates all the mechanics of the run up. Start small, then work up to your run up. If you can not be accurate with a 100 foot flick, why bother with a 400 foot flick? And throw something stable! Overstable !

I think it all has to do with how you are built. When I first started throwing golf discs, the first day I was able to throw 250 or even close to 300 with a sidearm, it was just real strong right from the start. But at that time, my backhand was like 150 feet max. (I didn't know about the X step). It was just real weakness of the muscles or something. Ever since then, even when I figured out the backhand, it was not strong for me. Now I got old, and my backhand maxes at 300, but I never lost anything on the sidearm yet.

Other people have amazing strength with a backhand but have no strength sidearm. They aren't built for it, maybe they have weak wrists and strong backs, they can throw backhand strong but will never throw good sidearm because of their own mechanics.

It's just mechanics. It's the way I'm built, The back of my arm is weak, for some reason I have no snap with a backhand, it's always been weak. Even in the old Wham-O days of the 1970's when all I ever did was throw frisbee, my backhand was weak but my chicken wing was killer. I could throw 200+ with a big ultimate lid and chicken wing, but not backhand.

It depends on how you are built.

Form and follow thru!
Thats the name of the game!

I dont think I'm built for it but every sport (baseball, racquetball) Ive ever played at a higher level uses the same muscle set and form as a forehand throw. But like Dave D. said the harder you want to throw, the tighter your grip needs to be when throwing forehand. I do notice that when I'm trying to teach someone to throw forehand, the disc seems to flop around in their hand.

I hold it loose when I throw forehand. I don't tighten anything, just the weight of the disc is all there is. No pressure with the thumb at all

I hold it loose when I throw forehand. I don't tighten anything, just the weight of the disc is all there is. No pressure with the thumb at all


It is all in the release. A tight grip will only increase the shank factor. When you do it right you will feel it roll right off of your lead finger. Usually followed by a loud audible snap. BOOM! The natural stance of a 2 finger flinger will also allow the thrower to keep eye contact on their target. It can be extremely useful!

For the best distance and spin (little or no wobble, including putters), I always pinch the disc between my thumb and middle finger as hard as I can. This tends to increase speed and puts the nose flat/down on release for some reason that I don't know or understand. If I don't pinch the disc, it is wobbly and I tend to get a nose up flight.

Daniel

I don't have shanking problems. In fact I use 3 fingers under the rim so that I can get a firmer grip and a more stable release. I throw forehand 90% of the time. I'm 46 years old and I can still throw 380' - 400' forehand - and my player rating is 100 points higher than Morgan (I just thought I'd get in on the bashing).

If your icon could blink, your argument would be more persuasive. :p

I use only one finger (the one next to the thumb) and the thumb. There is no doubt in my mind that a tighter grip increases distance for me and does not increase wobble; but of course, just like for backhands, the tight grip comes right before the rip. My grip is loose until then.

I don't have shanking problems. In fact I use 3 fingers under the rim so that I can get a firmer grip and a more stable release. I throw forehand 90% of the time. I'm 46 years old and I can still throw 380' - 400' forehand - and my player rating is 100 points higher than Morgan (I just thought I'd get in on the bashing).



I'm sorry you feel the need to "win" on this, maybe you should stop being so paranoid.

And oh yeah...you CAN'T throw 400 sidearm so stop bullshitting us

Pay me $10 for every foot over 400' I throw and I'll pay you $10 for every foot under 400' I throw. Sound like a bet? There are others that post here that have seen me throw and they would surely back me up on this. Last spring on a football field I threw a disc 422'. No tailwind only a slight crosswind. It was easy to measure and accurate.

Aside from being very modest, Mr. Koski does indeed have a boomer of a forehand!

thanks pat

No problem Rich. Just setting the record straight.

A boomer of a forehand is 350. World distance record is 523 by a mutant freak named Scott Stokeley under special conditions of being in the desert at altitude under perfect conditions and it was his best throw in his life, and did I say we was a mutant freak with by far the best sidearm in history?

No, you can't throw 400 feet with a sidearm. No freakin way.

I aced hole #1 at my home course, 338' and I hit it on the fly. I can throw 350' all day long. But when I practice pure distance I'll reach 400' a least twice during practice. I can and I'm willing to bet. We'd have to do it soon beacause I'm not getting any younger.

P.S. If my player rating was 881 I'd find a lot of things amazing. I'll see if I can get some video of a 400' shot that I can post.

I really don't give a #$*&$!''

The name of this topic has just changed from "Improving forehand distance" to "The Rick Koski Show, All About Rich. The world revolves around Rich. <font color="blue"> [offensive content removed] </font> "

Jeez, you're an angry old fart! Anyway, there are many new discs coming out which allow people who throw forehand to get some crazy distance. An earlier post mentioned Geoff Bennett. He uses his new D-craft Pulse for shots between 475-610 feet! Forehand shots over 400 feet are not some extraordinary feat for a good player. Wake up, dude!

Funny, the best distance with my sidearm still comes with a Firebird. I have tried the teerex, wraith, monster, orc, starfire, predator,flick, avenger, sidewinder, and a whole slew of others... My firebird will still be out in front. It is all about the s-curve. For those on this thread still interested on adding distance with your sidearm, grab a stack of plastic you are comfortable with and go practice. Play the anhyzer, adjust the height, watch it work. Figure out what went wrong, adjust and do it again. Eventually you will find yourself happy with the resluts! And please, mess around with a 2 finger roller, very dependable, very fun to throw!

I really don't give a #$*&amp;$!''

The name of this topic has just changed from "Improving forehand distance" to "The Rick Koski Show, All About Rich. The world revolves around Rich. <font color="blue"> [offensive content removed] </font> "


Weirdo

Words like forehand and jerk off should never be used in the same post :o

And please, mess around with a 2 finger roller, very dependable, very fun to throw!



I used to throw nothing but sidearm (Like Sprague, I'm naturally left handed, but only throw forehand that way), and while I've moved to backhand for most everything I throw, I can still crank out a 375 or so with a nice S shot from my orcs. I recently started throwing forehand rollers, and while I'm only in the 250-300 range, what I can do when rolling a firebird is so cool. There are tons of shots that are now open to me when before I didn't have any way to get near the basket.

Rich,

What disc do you use for distance? I want to find something just a bit more understable than the Wraith, but not as flippy as a beast. Maybe a DX orc...hmm...loved 'em for backhand D. What do all of you use?

My distance throws are a little different from the traditional forehand throw. I throw at about a 3/4 arm position like some baseball pitchers. Because of this I can generate incredible power but I have to use more stable discs like 172-174G Flicks or Monsters. If I throw a Wrath in that arm position I can get a good long forehand roller but to air it out it has to be something that will finish right. So the flight is S shaped. I have been experimenting with Wraiths lately and they really go. I can probably throw them further than a Flick but they are a lot less predictable (especially with wind). There is something very comforting about a disc that is super predictable.

Rich,

What disc do you use for distance? I want to find something just a bit more understable than the Wraith, but not as flippy as a beast. Maybe a DX orc...hmm...loved 'em for backhand D. What do all of you use?


Dx Orc, hell no. Try a nice beat in champion Orc.
If you want to have some fun, try playing the hyzer-anny flip with a sidewinder in a tailwind, you might suprise yourself!

There is something very comforting about a disc that is super predictable.



agreed....hence why us flickers love firebirds, monsters and flicks.

Rich...I've been hyzer flipping pro wraiths for D. Cool lines, but not very predictable as you say. I seem to like Z flashes for a bit more predictability with the D.....not too much as it is a flash! They seem to be perfect though for throwing flat and at about 200ft they anny flip from the snap and then come back.

Oh....BTW....Rich does have a sweet flick. I can attest. Also, my max D forehand is 420ft. Can't seem to break that mark.

Do any of you guys have video of your forehand drives? If so, I'd really like to study your forms...

Daniel

Do you remember Dennis Eckersly, the pitcher for the Oakland A's back in the day???????
Watch him! I bet that guy could boom a forhand shot!
Arm speed, arm speed, arm speed.

A boomer of a forehand is 350. World distance record is 523 by a mutant freak named Scott Stokeley under special conditions of being in the desert at altitude under perfect conditions and it was his best throw in his life, and did I say we was a mutant freak with by far the best sidearm in history?

No, you can't throw 400 feet with a sidearm. No freakin way.


Just because the record is only 520s (much less than a backhand) doesn't mean that typical forehand distance has to be that much less. I've only been throwing a forehand consistently since June and I can pop out a 375-390 with my 171 Star Wraith... and I think I'll top that when I get the line right for the big distance S-curve with my 175 Star Max... It really isn't that hard.

Its all a matter of the mechanics of the throw. I've watched Geoff Bennett throw over 400 with no effort on a basket high straight shot... and watching him I figured out a few things... 1. lead with your elbow, 2. snap hard at the wrist, 3. follow all the way through.

It really isn't that complex.


edit: before anybody gets the wrong idea, that isn't my accurate max d... accurately I can throw 350, past that I'm inconsistent.

Those 3 things you listed are very important. I've noticed that throwing backhand is similar to forehand in the fact that the majority of your arm speed needs to be generated right before the hit. While the motion is different, you need to really accelerate your forearm before the hit, then follow through.

I used to throw a champion Starfire (X) for forehand distance shots, and was exclusively forehand off the tee. I was throwing about 375' or so consistently, with the occasional >400' boom. Now my shoulder is destroyed from bad form and I only throw forehand on <300' shots with a firebird or pulse.

I have increased my sidearm distance by 20-25' over the last 6-8 weeks. I have been working on form and getting a lot of practice in but what helped me the most is lifting weights. I don't think that you need to be The Rock or anything but being stronger definetly helps. :)

The only time I hurt from throwing forehand is when I throw a lot of understable stuff where I have to keep my elbow in. It hurts the elbow a little.

I got tired of this internet distance stuff long ago. It's only a few inches from the 4 key and the 0 key and the Enter <--- key. Anybody can do that.

Why are you so concerned? I don't care if he can throw 400' or not. Why do you?

Disc golf troll. 881 - Give me a break. You aren't qualified to comment on anything concerning disc golf. You shouldn't even be allowed to point at a disc without getting slapped. Morgan, go crawl back under your bridge. Maybe Nick is the sane one. Now how do I find ignore this user on here?

P.S. I should move to N.Y. I 'd be the highest rated player there.

You brag about your distance and brag about your rating, you must be real short. Only short men need to brag so much, or guys with little wee wees.

Which is it?

Because if it's the latter, you need to increase your "forehand" distance. You need to lengthen your "stroke."

Morgan can throw the Chicken Wing farther than anyone. This is what he used to brag about on this very message board.

I was merely stating a fact.

i remember reading Morgan's old posts about chicken wings and trying to decide what he meant. he would claim they are absolutely the best way to throw far. :confused:

he said he saw them used in ultimate. in my ten years of playing UPA ultimate i don't think i ever saw anyone throw one :confused:

i can throw an Ultrastar 300 feet backhand and maybe 100 feet with a chicken wing :confused: i think i saw a video of Schweb chicken-winging a drive nicely on a golf hole, but what would be really cool to see is someone who putts with a chicken-wing :eek: :D

when i played ultimate i always favored my backhand which was versatile and my forehand was decent but not great. with golf discs i throw putters and midranges best with the forehand, i tend to get the nose up and put too much hyzer on drivers (muscle memory kicks in i guess). anyone have any advice on the transition? i probably throw with too much wrist and not enough arm?

People used to play lots of saxophone in R&amp;B, now all you hear is rap. In 10 years of listening to R&amp;B, I never saw anybody use a saxophone. Must not be any good.

The chicken wing is a lost art because it's hard to do. In ultimate I used the chicken wing mainly for the kickoff, I could throw it from one end zone to the other, and also I used it for high lobs over people hands, I'm tall and can throw one even if somebody is blocking me cause you throw the chicken wing from up high, they can't block you if you are tall. Only two other people I played with used the chicken wing. I think it's sad that people don't use it anymore. Even worse about the saxophone.

And no, you can't throw an ultrastar 300 feet. No, you really can't. Heeeeeelll no.

280 easy. 300 in good conditions given a few tries. 93 measured meters after i had only been playing ultimate for a year and we were given 3 throws with little to no wind. (i had been throwing frisbees since i was a kid though) :p

i can see your point that the chicken wing uses gross muscles but don't you lose the control which a forehand or backhand or traditional overhead has? and isn't distance with a lid all about the wrist?

do you still drive with a chickenwing on long open holes :confused:

The chicken wing doesnt work with golf discs. To make it go straight you would have to stick your elbow too high and rip your arm out of the socket. With lids you throw from much lower down, straight out, no problem.

In ultimate I used the chicken wing mainly for the kickoff, I could throw it from one end zone to the other,



in Ultimate you kick off from the front of the endzone, not the back of it. it is fairly simple to throw it out the back of the endzone although that lets the opposing team call the brick rule and take it out 10 yards from the endzone. It is much better to throw it high and let it stall and fall in the endzone (rather than out the back of it) so you can set up your "d" before the opposing team starts running their offense.

Ultimate fields are 70 yards from endzome to endzome and the endzones are 25 yards deep. so a pull from "kickoff" out the back of the endzone is at least 70 + 25 yards or 285 feet (unless your field measurements are week). (from the back of one endzone to out the back of the other is 360 feet -- if your playing on a properly marked &amp; measured field)

yes i can throw an Ultrastar 300 feet. if you meet me tomorrow and ask me to do it, i might have to throw about ten times to remind my muscle memory what's what with throwing big lids though. while not everyone can do it, it isn't uncommon to see ultimate players throw Ultrastars 300 feet. why the disbelief?

this pic from the UPA website is stretched a little thin given the real width of the field, but:

http://www4.upa.org/images/ultimate/field.jpg

added note: looks like the official brick rule places the disc on the 20 yard line :o

Thank you very much for teaching me how to play ultimate. Now are you going to teach me baseball and checkers too? How to ride a bike?

Thanks again.

Glad to know that this thread has stayed on topic. lol

The Ultrastar is great disc, mainly because it is heavy and sleek, it really cooks. The 175 gram weight is heavy by 1975 standards. Back then we all used Wham-o and the 165 g disc was the heaviest big lid back then, and it was not very sleek in design. Those stupid lines of Headrick and edges slowed it down too much. But even then, when hippies were real hippies and everybody did enough coke to add 30 feet to their drives, I never knew anybody who could throw an ultimate lid 300 feet. No way. The world distance record was still under 400 and that was a freak named Davis Johnson and a 119 gram or a CPI All Star Saucer Tosser. Probably even he couldn't throw a full size ultimate lid 300 feet. So once again, please stop with all the internet distances folks.

There may be guys who can throw an Ultrastar 300 ft.forehand -- but i can only do it backhand. Throwing an ultrastar 300 ft backhand is something i'd guess the top 5% of UPA Ultimate pullers can do (again though note that with the brick rule you generally don't want to pull the kick-off out the back of the endzone). for me it's not any harder than throwing an Aviar 300 ft. It does though require heighth, hyzer, nose a little up, and minimal off-axis torque.

i'll leave you with your disbelief though. it makes us sort of even. i still can't believe you once posted that the chickenwing has more potential for distance than any other throwing technique. :confused:

It did for me back then, and a few other people I knew that could do it right, back in the days of Wham-O. And I'm not the only one, the other guys who threw chicken wing in Ultimate in those days were **** good players and **** good with the chicken wing. If i could get you together with those guys right now and toss with them on a court, you could get some schooling, believe me. But it has nothing to do with golf discs that I know of. They say there are one or two people who throw a chicken wing in disc golf but I never saw the point in it.

I never saw anybody use a saxophone. Must not be any good.



I played a saxophone today, but it wasn't a Wham-O. I'll bet I could chicken wing it a good 15 feet. And that's not message board distance!

i would think a good forehand would be more useful than a chicken wing. don't they share similar lines?

Best throw for a saxophone would be a scooby

Best throw for a saxophone would be a tomahawk



I think you might be Wright.

I beg to differ. I throw a 173 gram Discraft Flick sidearm 400' 8 out of 10 tries. I also use my index finger only on the underside of the disc. No tight grip but I do keep the disc held flat but when I release I put about a 45 degree Anhyzer on it and let the disc flex itsself out. Even in a headwind this disc is terrific. In my opinion the best Sidearm disc on the market. I am from Huntsville, Al and everyone here as nicknamed me "The Flick" because of obvious reasons.

Hello all,

Wasn't sure if any of you were aware but there is a Pro Clinic video on Forehand Drives here (http://www.discraft.com/resources.html).

Well aware, I've watched it several times :D

I just saw the new one on long putters and found it useful as well.

Please keep them coming!

i would think a good forehand would be more useful than a chicken wing. don't they share similar lines?



At least for me the chicken wing has a more graceful turn.

At least for me the chicken wing has a more graceful turn.

For me, the Buffalo wings are just too spicy. Nice avatar.

I got tired of this internet distance stuff long ago. It's only a few inches from the 4 key and the 0 key and the Enter <--- key. Anybody can do that.



Gotta, say, I think this is true.

We have some sick long pros here in Texas and Oklahoma. Big strong boys, with a lot of athleticism.

I have seen only a handful of people who can break 400' (either forehand or backhand) "any time they wish" on flat land.

Fewer, who can throw 5-8 feet off the ground for 350' consistently.

I played with a great amateur the other day. He is about 6'-10" and won the last big tourney in Advanced amateur by 12 strokes. He spoke loosely about being able to drive 550', but freely admitted he never measured.

He never outdrove me on any hole. He was throwing drivers when I was throwing mids and putters.

He could putt like a madman.

I asked him how much distance he had lost due to the cold verse the summer air. He said none. He just said that he just threw harder in the winter... In other words, he never really needed full power any way.