My answer is yes.

I'm for it although that would mean I would have to get off my ***** and get BONIFIED :D

My answer is yes.


Why do you think this is a good idea?

I think it is a good idea that all Pro Players pass a Rules test. Not that they all should be Certified Officials.

What I already take too many tests. Also I think some people will be suprised to see how many fail. :confused:

At least start with those who qualify for tour cards. There's a lot of volunteer time to score the tests to pull this off.

Since we have to "officiate" ourselves on the course, everyone should be an official.

I totally agree. The test is not hard at all. It just wants to know that you have a brain and can find appropriate rulings using the rule book. Any pro that does not know the rules or how to find them isn't much of a "professional" are they?
On a tangent (sort of), I think we need to form two different organizations. One for those that want to keep playing mini-golf in parks and take a lackadaisical approach to everything. And one for those that want to see this sport evolve into true golf and be more professional. We are incompatible and having one assoc. for everything just doesn't work.

At least start with those who qualify for tour cards. There's a lot of volunteer time to score the tests to pull this off.



If having a touring card actually meant something, you might have a point.

The other problem I see would be what about the AMs who wish to play up at some events?

In concept, though, yes, Pros should be responsible for knowing the rules.

The ams playing up would experience an environment where all of the players knew and expected everyone to play by the rules. Quite different from what I see many places now.

If you want to play up, you have to pass your TD test first. Most people toss the idea around for some time, so it's not like it will be a complete surprise.

As far as volunteers to check the test, I believe it costs $10 for the test, where does that money go?

Tanner, this is an excellent suggestion. I've played pro tournaments from coast-to-coast and i've observed that the rules are enforced differently everywhere. A lot of this can be directly attributed to the players never being required to know all the rules, and/or the fact that a sense of honor about the rules and calling others on infractions has never been implemented by the PDGA.

On top of that, the stupid PDGA rules committee seems to change rules on the drop of the hat, and has done NOTHING in recent years to change the vagueness of many of the official rules. I've been calling for a rewrite of the official rules since my run for Regional Director in 2003.

If you want to play up, you have to pass your TD test first. Most people toss the idea around for some time, so it's not like it will be a complete surprise.

As far as volunteers to check the test, I believe it costs $10 for the test, where does that money go?



Tanner, I'm talking about those 5-8 Am's that step up on Pro only weekend events. You are adding another hoop for anyone that wants to play open. If playing Open was a qualifiable division it would be a different story. Right now, Open is just that, open to anybody that wants the experience.

The $10 goes to send the test, check the test, file the information and send out officials packet/agreement

I hear ya Yeti. Probably not going to fly. It's all good for me, I'm taking it, and will not have the shule pulled over my eyes again. :D

My answer is yes.



Absolutely.

To get around the challenge of expense in grading them, we could design multiple choice questions. There are nearly an infinite number of ways to alter multiple choice questions so that we would have a set vast enough that no two people would likely end up taking the same test. It would all be online too.

<font color="purple"> But what about the guys that don't have a computer? </font>

One suggestion, join the 21st century and go to your buddies crib and take it there... :p

Current PDGA members on the PDGA Affiliate Club�s roster are able to take the PDGA officials test with no fee.

http://www.pdga.com/club_affiliate/club_affiliate.php

This is how we were able to certify extra TDs needed for the PDGA Worlds in 2004.

Interesting idea and good in theory.
However, I do not think it will fly because it will mean SOMEONE has to grade and track the test-takers.
And of course, some Pros will refuse to take the test.

In reference to another thread, I think it is a better - and more enforceable idea - to make Pros carry a rule book during sanctioned events.

Klem, you're right, it would be some work to implement. But, I think it's one of those things that must be done in order to get disc golf to that rhetorical 'next level' of which some speak. And, like I said, before you could implement it, there would have to be a real effort to clarify the many loopholes and vague definitions that riddle the PDGA rules as they read currently.

If you were to implement it though, there's a lot of pros who already have official's cards, and if a pro is stupid enough to refuse to take the test, he shouldn't be allowed to play. TD's get more crap from pros and lose money on most pro divisions anyway, so I doubt there will be too many TD's who shed a tear over the pros who refuse to take the test. I know I wouldn't.

Nope, I'm not right. I've thought some more about this and its mixing apples and oranges.

It would be great if every Pro carried a rule book.
But some players are just players.
Some do not want to - and should not be forced to - be concerned with observing each person in their group, watching for rule violations.
Some players are just there to play, and that's cool.

As long as someone is each group has a rule book, all is good.
Besides, the list of Certified Officials is huge and includes many active touring Pros, so this is not really a pressing issue IMHO.

I have been a certified official since 97. For myself , I have had alot of folks , ask me questions , about shots , that were not clearly defined. Provisional shots , came in to play , during those times, and the TD , ultimately made the ruling on them. This helps the player (s) in question , not to take it out on you personally , while playing. Some harbor , resentment , for some reason , on bad shots or bad breaks and it has an adverse effect on the rest of the group !!!!!!!

If having a touring card actually meant something, you might have a point.

Having a touring card does hold certain privleges. One that I know of is that NT events have to hold a certain number of pro slots open for tour card members until shortly before the tourney.

How about this...to be classified a professional by the pdga, you must be certified. If you are an am, you can still play open and not be certified. This will make the majority of open players officials. If you don't want to take the test, you don't want to play open.

As far as carrying a rule book, to make a call, you should be forced to reference a rule book. This is, you don't have to carry one, but someone in your group will have to have one, or an official will need to have one near you, or we could place one on every teepad before every tournament, and then we would have to pick them up afterward so we don't violate the littering policy :D

This is just my opinion.

As far as carrying a rule book, to make a call, you should be forced to reference a rule book.

I take it, then, that you would require that a player reference the rulebook in order to, e.g., take casual relief, declare an unsafe lie, rule a disc lost or OB or that a throw missed a mandatory, mark a lie for a disc at rest in bounds within 1m of OB, move a casual obstacle to stance, throwing motion, or run-up, move an obstacle between the lie and the hole that became a factor during the round, take a stance behind a large solid obstacle that prevents the player from taking a legal stance within 30 cm directly behind the marker disc, declare an unsfafe lie, etc.�all of which are rules calls?

I don't have an opinon on Pro players being certified as I am not Pro, but I feel that making every player carry a rulebook is a bit extreme. As long as there is one in each group, that should suffice, since we all know that rulings have to be a GROUP decision anyway.

Very first rule in the rulebook:
<font color="green"> 801.01 COURTESY
A. Players should not throw until they are certain that the thrown disc will not distract another player or potentially injure anyone present. Players should watch the other members of their group throw in order to aid in locating errant throws and to ensure compliance with the rules. </font>

To not know, follow or call the rules can in some instances be an unfair advantage. The opposite can also be true at times...

Good point, Nick. Competitive players do watch others in their group to make sure everyone abides by the rules and nobody gets an unfair advantage.
But I do not foresee all Pros uniformly conforming to being Officials, nor do I expect all TDs to enforce the rule at the registration table.

Basic : 801.01 COURTESY

Players know. It is tough to watch everyone in your group , all the time. Mostly, we are concentrating on our own shots and trying not to disturb or distract other members in our group , or for myself sometimes , disturbing other groups by laughing loudly !!!!! :eek:
:D