Bought a 174g today and went to test it out at Course. Not sure what the hype is all about??

My Champ Orc and Sidewinder were blowing way past it off tee pad.
Maybe I need to give it a little longer before I take it out of Bag.

Anyone else have disappointment with new Wraith ??

My only disapoitment with the Wraith is that I'm not throwing it 550 yet.

The Wraith is BY FAR the longest and fastest disc ever made.

I tested one out and threw it like I would my orc or SL .I got poor results,turned it right over.I then threw it at 75% power and it flew just as far as my Orc and SL with less effort.Great Hyzer flip Disc

Bought a 174g today and went to test it out at Course. Not sure what the hype is all about??

My Champ Orc and Sidewinder were blowing way past it off tee pad.
Maybe I need to give it a little longer before I take it out of Bag.

Anyone else have disappointment with new Wraith ??



well i wouldnt say dissapointed but... i think there is a lot of hype going on. I could see the wraith being a great disctance disc for already long throwers but it hasnt been THAT great for me. I threw it on a few holes with some anyhzer and the thing was really fast. But just when I started to believe the hype i threw my orc nice and flat right after it and it went 20' further.

I still think speed ratings also apply to the speed needed to make the disc perform properly.

keep practicing with it you will really learn it and like it. only disappointing thing for me is I cant find one around here in Champion plastic. :D

My Wraith , flys like an overstable Pro-StarFire.

Hope this helps those who are wondering what it does.

It's really Fast. Probably , the fastest thing out there Now.

There is some adjusting that needs to be made , with your throwing technique , when Cranking this disc.

Remember , it's a Fast , Overstable driver.

Adjust to the nose angle on release. Don't over rotate the angle too much. This will keep it on the line intended.

Dang , this disc is a Rocket !!!!!! :D

Would the 174g be a factor in not getting it as far as 170g Orc and 172g Sidewinder ?? Thats all they had at the store.

I will still keep on practicing it

Hmmmmm...........could be a tough call. Both of those , when throw correctly , will get you down the fairway fast !!!!!

You may have to throw your Wraith a little bit higher , with some annie ( Flex Shot ). /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Hope that helps some. !!!

My wraith at 173 does not seem too overstable at all. When thrown about 10 feet off the ground, it flys perfectly straight. I found it very controllable. Maybe it is that I do not have a big arm as somebody said earlier that it needs to be thrown at about 75 percent less speed than an orc.

Yup. I also heard , this disc is to be thrown at 85% as well.

I've been throwing Spirits for a while and the concept is the same...fast discs need to be low to the ground...they are extremely sensitive to nose angle, and with the Spirit it creates lift, so you can throw them chest high over 400' if you have the arm.

The Wraith is indeed fast, but I don't think its the fastest by any means...the Illusion and Venom are still faster.

Thanks for starting yet another useless thread. You are consistant.

Why didn't you just post this under one of the Wraith threads?

I think you can start any thread you want. I'd rather have several specific threads with responses than one generic thread with 900 responses.

Remember, if someone does not feel the thread worthy, they have no obligation to contribute.

lol

Wraith was disappointing today.......



I can't wait to see how it does tomorrow!

Don't worry, there will be another thread about it.

freakin awsome.

For anyone with a big arm the wraith needs to be thrown with hyzer. If I throw it flat, it flips over way to much. A good amount of hyzer on it and it flips up flat, turns over just slightly and goes a country mile. This is the farthest flying disc out right now. Threw mine the other day 675 feet with a nice backwind, about 10 feet off the ground. Throw it easier and smoother than you would your normal driver, and it will freaking fly. I decided to keep one in my bag for when I need to really crank one out there, or for when I am feeling lazy and just need to throw 450 feet at 50 percent power.

I am not a big arm thrower by any means, in fact my go to driver is a sidewinder 3 times out of 4 but the 170 gram pro wraith really works for me if I give it an annie release, a big tug, and keep it low to medium in height. I prefer 166 weight for my drivers but the pro wraith only goes down to 170, but with so much weight in the rim, it seems to "throw lighter" than the actual weight.

I think you can start any thread you want. I'd rather have several specific threads with responses than one generic thread with 900 responses.



What was specific about this thread he created? Same generic stuff as in the other half dozen Wraith threads.



Wraith was disappointing today.......



I can't wait to see how it does tomorrow!



Don't worry, I'm sure he'll create another thread then. :D

http://aone415.com/Emots/chin.gif

I think I'll start another "which is the best putter" thread.


To keep on topic, my friend liked his Wraith so much he sold it on hole #10. :D

Hey, you complainers obviously keep reading all of these, so called, useless threads. What makes you all so important? If I think a topic is stupid, I don't read it. Why don't you just go watch the Lifetime channel instead?

...for when I am feeling lazy and just need to throw 450 feet at 50 percent power.



So can you throw 900' at 100%??? :D

Just kidding, I'm sure you have a bomb I just couldn't resist.

My only disapoitment with the Wraith is that I'm not throwing it 550 yet.

The Wraith is BY FAR the longest and fastest disc ever made.



Is it as fast as a flick? I just can't see how it could be.

Hey, you complainers obviously keep reading all of these, so called, useless threads. What makes you all so important? If I think a topic is stupid, I don't read it. Why don't you just go watch the Lifetime channel instead?

its not the topic thats stupid, its the posts.

Some people don't have anything to add, so they just criticize those that do. I guess South Park isn't on enough....

yeah there nuttin on the tube this afternoon... i think i'll go throw my flash 700' a few times at 50% now. :D

Thanks for starting yet another useless thread. You are consistant.

Why didn't you just post this under one of the Wraith threads?



Might as well start a "The Wraith was fast last week" thread or maybe start a "my aviar flipped over on me thread"...not that these have anything to do with existing threads.

I took several test throws matching my Flash, Discwing and Wraith, with and against a light breeze Friday evening. The Flash won downwind. There was no clear winner upwind.

I'm saying, "Most Overhyped Disc of the Century," but Brett and Dan think otherwise, so maybe it just flies better for some throwing styles than others.

The Wraith is badass.

That's all I have to say about that.

I took several test throws matching my Flash, Discwing and Wraith, with and against a light breeze Friday evening. The Flash won downwind. There was no clear winner upwind.

I'm saying, "Most Overhyped Disc of the Century," but Brett and Dan think otherwise, so maybe it just flies better for some throwing styles than others.





Yeah right. Thats the Quarter K. That junker got more hype than the wheel.

My only disapoitment with the Wraith is that I'm not throwing it 550 yet.

The Wraith is BY FAR the longest and fastest disc ever made.



Is it as fast as a flick? I just can't see how it could be.


Why does good Innova plastic always have to get compared to Discrap plastic. The Wraith is the fastest thin out, PERIOD

...for when I am feeling lazy and just need to throw 450 feet at 50 percent power.



So can you throw 900' at 100%??? :D

Just kidding, I'm sure you have a bomb I just couldn't resist.


1000 feet at 100 % Buddy :D. Just kidding, if I throw it at 100 % power it wont work. I dont think I throw anything at 100 % power. I probrably throw the wraith at about 60-65% in reality. Thanks for cracking a joke though, at least a few guys on here have a good humor.

I threw a Disc at 100% power or maybe more since I changed my style for just Pure DIstance and cranked one out over 500' a few days ago...

Just wanted to add :)

-Scott Lewis

Because not everyone throws innova and they are just trying to get an idea based on what they already throw. Hey you never know they may go out and buy one. I have thrown one and I admit it is FAST but not as fast as a Flick, Illusion, Venom. :o

flick, illusion, venom are all flatter and faster. too much low speed fade for me. domey seems to yeild more d, rather than speed. unless there is a headwind maybe

flick, illusion, venom are all flatter and faster. too much low speed fade for me. domey seems to yeild more d, rather than speed. unless there is a headwind maybe



Domey discs have more drag, and more lift. They glide more. They fly more slowly.
Flat discs have less drag, but less lift, they glide less. They fly faster.

The modern tech drivers are right in the middle of this. The ideal disc would have 0 drag and a weight/lift ratio less than 1. A disc with those traits would never hit the ground(literally, that disc would also defy physicists the world over). A certain amount of domeyness will generate a certain amount of life at a certain speed. Domeyer discs generate more lift, but require more speed to generate the lift. Really domey discs would then, by conjecture, also be understable because the percent difference between the 2 wings (consider a line splitting the disc in half along the disc's percieved wind, as splitting the disc into 2 wings) is higher as lift is non linear verses wing speed.

Now there are other things that come into play, as the lift is actually a differential across the wings of the disc, so some flatter wing discs (such as an xpress) can still be understable. Another factor that comes into play is weight distribution across the wing. A disc that has more weight towards the edges will require more torque to change it's flight angle due to gyroscopic effects, and will tend to fly more overstable. This is why heavier discs fly more overstable than their lighter counterparts (for a constant snap angular velocity). Now people can argue that you get more spin on a lighter disc, and while this is true, more spin just increases the lift differential on the 'wings'.

Summary:
Lower profile discs will be faster than thicker profile discs. They will suffer in glide, however.

This is the farthest flying disc out right now. Threw mine the other day 675 feet with a nice backwind, about 10 feet off the ground.



How does a person go about measuring a 675' shot? Back to back football fields....or do you work for a utilities company and have a roller distance counter....or is it a case of 225 paces?

Its called message board distance.

This is true, everybody throws further when their talking on the message board...on the course its a different story :D

No kidding...yesterday i took my Wraith out to the local football field...i threw it at like 22-23%, and the thing went like 727 feet!!! Its just out of control! I had to take it out of my bag because it just goes to far!!!

Not me. I can consistently throw 200', with an occasional pop to 666'. Why would I lie about that? ;)

Usually the ones who can actually throw 670 ft and change don't go around posting it on Message Boards like this. I doubt if you will ever find Sinclair come on here talking how he can throw an illusion 750ft.

Good point! Also, if you have to post 8 times a day saying how great you are EVEN AFTER TAKING THE LAST 27 YEARS OFF, maybe you're...I don't know....compensating? :eek: :D :D

speed so fast it blurs, high speed stability that leads to very straight flight, and a dependable low speed fade at the end that doesn't kick in till after a whole lot of carry ... what's not to like when this disc is thrown well? :confused:

plus, i hear the hot-stamped CFR Wraith's (not the INNcolor picture discs) will sell soon for $15.99

i'd be disappointed with this disc only if i preferred throwing other brands :o :D

Because not everyone throws innova and they are just trying to get an idea based on what they already throw. Hey you never know they may go out and buy one. I have thrown one and I admit it is FAST but not as fast as a Flick, Illusion, Venom. :o



No joke...this thing has a little more glide, but its by far not the fastest disc out.

Usually the ones who can actually throw 670 ft and change don't go around posting it on Message Boards like this. I doubt if you will ever find Sinclair come on here talking how he can throw an illusion 750ft.



...or Sabres 600'!!!

The number of people that can throw over 600' is VERY VERY small...hell, if you ever actually measure how far you drive, you'd be very surprised.

it's kind of funny how much time is being spent trying to downplay the Wraith's attributes. in the end this disc's success will lie with how well it flies. Success = 11 :D

Try this on for size. Go look at what the pros are using. While occassionally one will mention one of these new discs (Wraith, Orc, Flash, illusion whatever) most of them are using the TBird, XLs occasionally a Wildcat. My guess is that distance gained (marginal) is not worth the loss in consistency. Barry is the only big name player that I've seen jump up to a new high tech disc, the Beast.

I agree, all the old school guys stick to what they know. Chris Sprague, Innova team member and 2005 World Doubles Champion, however, threw a proto-Wraith a couple weeks ago at the Iowa State Championships on a few holes and was about a foot from aceing a 450' hole a couple times, and he loves it. Therefore he sold me on it.

Schweb uses the Orc. I hear the Coyote has made it into a lot of pro bags too...

Try this on for size. Go look at what the pros are using. While occassionally one will mention one of these new discs (Wraith, Orc, Flash, illusion whatever) most of them are using the TBird, XLs occasionally a Wildcat. My guess is that distance gained (marginal) is not worth the loss in consistency. Barry is the only big name player that I've seen jump up to a new high tech disc, the Beast.



George Smith uses mostly Spirits. But I still get your point.

Schweb uses the Orc. I hear the Coyote has made it into a lot of pro bags too...

He threw my spirit father though. :o

Its called message board distance.


Ok just to get this out for future reference I can throw 482' and that has been measured at worlds. Also my longest recorded drive was 541' so if I ever say I can throw more than that you can call me a liar on message board D. Heck I was called a liar for sayiong I throw my putter 375' :D:D

Its called message board distance.


Ok just to get this out for future reference I can throw 482' and that has been measured at worlds. Also my longest recorded drive was 541' so if I ever say I can throw more than that you can call me a liar on message board D. Heck I was called a liar for sayiong I throw my putter 375' :D:D



375 with a putter is actually believable. I was out with a couple juniors and parked a 300 foot hole with my buzzz and they called me a showoff (because I throw mids to drive holes under the 350 foot line) so I grabbed my medium wizard on the same hole and hit basket. With the exception of a new Drone or new Demon, I'm pretty sure every disc out there can get out to around 300 feet. Big arms can prolly throw a new Demon or Drone that far, but I have yet to crack 250 with those discs. The 400 foot mark seems to be the point where most mortals need to be throwing a new tech driver to reach.

Its called message board distance.


Ok just to get this out for future reference I can throw 482' and that has been measured at worlds. Also my longest recorded drive was 541' so if I ever say I can throw more than that you can call me a liar on message board D. Heck I was called a liar for sayiong I throw my putter 375' :D:D



375 with a putter is actually believable. I was out with a couple juniors and parked a 300 foot hole with my buzzz and they called me a showoff (because I throw mids to drive holes under the 350 foot line) so I grabbed my medium wizard on the same hole and hit basket. With the exception of a new Drone or new Demon, I'm pretty sure every disc out there can get out to around 300 feet. Big arms can prolly throw a new Demon or Drone that far, but I have yet to crack 250 with those discs. The 400 foot mark seems to be the point where most mortals need to be throwing a new tech driver to reach.

Dude the demon rocks on 300' hyzers. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Ha Scooter ,
OK we will put that in the memory banks here so we know you won't be fibbing in future about D :)

By the way just curious because I am relatively new to the Sport. but when you say you average 482 ft. how do you measure that exact preciseness ??

an Aero went 475....

an Aero went 475....



And did a mere mortal AM player throw this?

Ha Scooter ,
OK we will put that in the memory banks here so we know you won't be fibbing in future about D :)

By the way just curious because I am relatively new to the Sport. but when you say you average 482 ft. how do you measure that exact preciseness ??

I don't AVG 482' it was just my most recent measurement in a D contest. You could measure with a wheel or a range finder.

Schweb uses the Orc. I hear the Coyote has made it into a lot of pro bags too...

He threw my spirit father though. :o



are you suggesting we should look for Schweb to switch to Gateway soon? /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
he probably gets better D out of the Wraith anyway...

This is the farthest flying disc out right now. Threw mine the other day 675 feet with a nice backwind, about 10 feet off the ground.



How does a person go about measuring a 675' shot? Back to back football fields....or do you work for a utilities company and have a roller distance counter....or is it a case of 225 paces?


Because the shot was thrown at a course that is on a ball golf course called Mission Trails in San Diego. I used the fairway markers that are on the hole, and then walked off the distance from the front of the ball golf green to where my disc was., = 675 feet +or- 10 feet. Today I played the same course again, but just because I can throw that disc that far does not mean that I think it is the best driver out. I will stick to my DX and Champion Teebirds as my main drivers. For some the Wraith will be a huge game booster, for others it is just not predictable and reliable enough to use comfortably.

Its called message board distance.


Explain that one for me. If you mean that you dont think I can throw that far, well, I can. But, my best throw at a WFDF Overall tourney was only 182 meters

I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.

Good point! Also, if you have to post 8 times a day saying how great you are EVEN AFTER TAKING THE LAST 27 YEARS OFF, maybe you're...I don't know....compensating? :eek: :D :D


Last 8 years off actually, think before you talk you NOODLE ARM AM.

back after an 8 year layoff and making friends fast...

Bob. I may be an ******* , but I'm not a f'ng *******. hehe

There are many different characters in disc golf; do not let the afore meantioned group get to you. Ignore them and carry on.

You want to attract them? Put a Discraft item in your bag.

375 with a putter is actually very believable. If an amatuer like me can throw it for 200, a pro can probably double that.

BTW, the way I measure my drives is by looking at the length of a hole. Hole 1 is 200 feet; if i can reach it or pass it, I'm throwing for 200 ft.

Bob,
I doubt that anyone will ever fear you. Your game and mine are independent events. Your discussion of balls has nothing to do with the game. And, if people do avoid a course or a tournament due to you, it probably has nothing to do with your ability.

One more thing: Who's yer daddy?

I think Bob has some severe issues if he gets this riled up over a post on a message board. Very sad that some people's egos are so closely attached to what anonymous posters write on a disc golf forum.

I applaud competitiveness; however, if it negatively affects others, it needs to be curbed. My ex-wife no longer plays disc due to bad experiences she has had with locals at her course (different state).

That should never happen. One should never be harrassed by other players for any reason.

If he's this excitable about balls or whatever the heck he was talking about (lost interest and quit reading), can you imagine how he behaves during rounds?

yeah, 375 with a putter is definitely doable... I can get my glo E wizard out near 300 (my avg D is 325-360)... i've seen them put past 400...all technique and great balance between spin and velocity.

Bob,

Welcome back to the game...

I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.



Dude you can't even spell your own name.

i was waiting for somebody to point that out... lol

I was looking forward to playing some DG when I go out to visit family in San Diego, but if Bob & Rhett are the norm for players in the area I may leave my discs at home. :(

I threw a Wraith about 15 times the other day, and while it went pretty far, it got flippier the more I threw it, Not worth the extra 20' if it sprays. The candy version should be better for big arms.

I'll stick with the crystal Tsunami its more accurate, and goes about as far.

This is the farthest flying disc out right now. Threw mine the other day 675 feet with a nice backwind, about 10 feet off the ground.



How does a person go about measuring a 675' shot? Back to back football fields....or do you work for a utilities company and have a roller distance counter....or is it a case of 225 paces?



Well...........apparently you never have Seen Bobby Benner throw. He can throw 440 with an Aviar. I have witnessed this.

Watched Bob throw a Roc , a Regular Roc , 560 feet.
Have you ever played on a Long Ball Golf Course , where Distance is More accurate , than on a Disc Golf Course ?

Guess not. :(

I can flip my 172 gram Wraith over. Did it two days ago.

Really depends on the person. How much style they have.

How much tallented technique that have.

How much power , snap and spin they have.

I have also witnessed , weak arms , that can't throw distance drivers 200.................. :(

Please do not judge someone you have never met.

This guy would Crush some World Champions if he spent 1/2 the time they do training to play.

Call me.............

I was looking forward to playing some DG when I go out to visit family in San Diego, but if Bob & Rhett are the norm for players in the area I may leave my discs at home. :(



They are not the norm, nor is quickdisc. Most of us are chill to play with. That said, Rhett, Bob, and Donny are not as obnoxious in real life-Wait...actually Donny is.

Its called message board distance.



Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Bobby Benner , Kicks asss on Distance Drives. This has been witnessed by numerous people who have handed him Cash for being Non-believers !!!!!!!! :D

Don't judge a Nightmare !!!!!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif He has always been able to out throw some of the Best Distance Players Ever !!!!!!

Seen him in Competition.............. :eek: WOW !!!!!!!!

I was looking forward to playing some DG when I go out to visit family in San Diego, but if Bob & Rhett are the norm for players in the area I may leave my discs at home. :(


What did I do???

I think Bob has some severe issues if he gets this riled up over a post on a message board. Very sad that some people's egos are so closely attached to what anonymous posters write on a disc golf forum.



I agree , but why be anonymous , unless you have something to hide ?

I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.



Dude you can't even spell your own name.



Another anonymous poster ? Must be AM. They are always jealous !!!!! :D

I was looking forward to playing some DG when I go out to visit family in San Diego, but if Bob & Rhett are the norm for players in the area I may leave my discs at home. :(



Hey Kipp ,

I'm a regular player , and you would always have fun , playing rounds with me. I keep things light hearted , not like this National Enquire Discussion Board !!!!! :D

I threw a Wraith about 15 times the other day, and while it went pretty far, it got flippier the more I threw it, Not worth the extra 20' if it sprays. The candy version should be better for big arms.

Figures , coming from an Innova hater.

In 4 months , you have changed your mind about disc manufactures , only to get sponsored by someone , anyone.

Good luck !!!! :(

I'll stick with the crystal Tsunami its more accurate, and goes about as far.

How am I anonymous, my username is my actual name. :confused:

I was looking forward to playing some DG when I go out to visit family in San Diego, but if Bob & Rhett are the norm for players in the area I may leave my discs at home. :(



They are not the norm, nor is quickdisc. Most of us are chill to play with. That said, Rhett, Bob, and Donny are not as obnoxious in real life-Wait...actually Donny is.



Opps..............Sorry Dave.............We are not to engage each other on the PDGA discussion board any more !!!!! :D

All three of those guys , Don't smoke either !!!!! :eek:

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Yes, because the distance a man can throw is the true measure of his value as a human being. :D

I have not tried it yet but I will...In my last sanctioned tournament, I played with a guy I have been competing against for a few years...he was throwing the Wraith better than anything I've EVER seen him throw...he claims it was all about the disc, he likes the feel and the consistency of how it flies...I was impressed.

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Yes, because the distance a man can throw is the true measure of his value as a human being. :D



Wow..........more Am's...............

Bob Benner is a great person with excellent values.

I knew his parents well and they raised a terrific man.

He is just tired of people in this Sport who always Complain , because they don't have the GOD given tallent. That's right.

He has always been able to Crank drives.

Ask Ken and Marc Jarvis. Ken will be the next World Distance Champion.

Put him , head to head , with anyone , yes anyone , in the World , with Identical Conditions ........Yes , Identical Conditions and we have a Honest Champion !!!!!!!!

That is How I consider Bob Benner. He has more moral values in his balls than most of the players today !!!!!

If you want to pick on someone , you possibly have a chance to beat , pick on me !!!!!!

Bob Benner is WAY out of your league !!!!!!!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

geeez, are you gonna leave some room for someone else to jump on his nuts?

I have not tried it yet but I will...In my last sanctioned tournament, I played with a guy I have been competing against for a few years...he was throwing the Wraith better than anything I've EVER seen him throw...he claims it was all about the disc, he likes the feel and the consistency of how it flies...I was impressed.



It does. Just don't throw with 100%. More like 78-85% at the most. Let the disc do some of the work. Don't just throw it like another Projectile ( ie: Flick) . Seen someone get hit with a Z Flick ( Discraft Disc ) and they went to the Hospital.
A Overstable Projectile.

I am trying different weights in the Pro -Wraith.

I personally still like the Pro -Starfire !!!!!!!! HHHmmmmmm !!!!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

That's me though.

Don't force the Wraith over too much. It will hold the turn on a power flex. Throw it Flat and work from there. !!!!! :D

geeez, are you gonna leave some room for someone else to jump on his nuts?



Nope, sorry about that Mike. I'm in an Internet class now , showing folks verbage.

Bob Benner is a cool guy and if you ever met him , you would know why people are jealous !!!!!!! :D

After reading this entire thread I'm starting to think that Bob Benner is really Bixby. How is the Cranium Safety Device working for you Bob?

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Yes, because the distance a man can throw is the true measure of his value as a human being. :D



Wow..........more Am's...............

Bob Benner is a great person with excellent values.

I knew his parents well and they raised a terrific man.


Donny, you're a pro, right? Since you are making all these anti-am assumptions and accusation, should we also assume that all pros are as clueless as you are here??? WTF, man???

You don't get it. Bruce was making a point that juts because someone can throw far, it doesn't mean you know jack about that person. Bob might be the best frickin' person in the history of mankind since Jesus himself, but being able to outdrive anyone else with disc doesn't prove it.

You keep saying "he can outdrive you anyday of the week, so shut up and respect him." The two things don't go together. There are plenty of cool people that are great at this game and that stink at this game. Just like there are people who can throw a country mile and are a-holes, and people who can't throw 250 and are a-holes.

<font color="red"> Post deleted by Monitor </font>

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Yes, because the distance a man can throw is the true measure of his value as a human being. :D



That and how many beers he can chug! :D

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat.

Yes, because the distance a man can throw is the true measure of his value as a human being. :D



Wow..........more Am's...............

Bob Benner is a great person with excellent values.

I knew his parents well and they raised a terrific man.


Donny, you're a pro, right? Since you are making all these anti-am assumptions and accusation, should we also assume that all pros are as clueless as you are here??? WTF, man???

You don't get it. Bruce was making a point that juts because someone can throw far, it doesn't mean you know jack about that person. Bob might be the best frickin' person in the history of mankind since Jesus himself, but being able to outdrive anyone else with disc doesn't prove it.

You keep saying "he can outdrive you anyday of the week, so shut up and respect him." The two things don't go together. There are plenty of cool people that are great at this game and that stink at this game. Just like there are people who can throw a country mile and are a-holes, and people who can't throw 250 and are a-holes.



Actually, while Donnie went down a certain path, the reality is that Bob stated a distance he could throw and said he liked a disc. For that he got trashed. This is now the norm here, due in part to MB bragging, and in many cases the trashers are also the braggers.

BTW - I can throw 30,000 feet... well I could if I could get the window open after takeoff.

There are plenty of cool people that are great at this game and that stink at this game. Just like there are people who can throw a country mile and are a-holes, and people who can't throw 250 and are a-holes.



I'm pretty sure I just got described somewhere in there. :D

And there are always message boarders that are just waiting to figure out who they can get a rise out of when they jump on them.

Bob Benner is a great person with excellent values.

I knew his parents well and they raised a terrific man.




<font color="purple"> as evidence, please consider the following: </font>



I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.



bobbi may be the coolest thing since godzilla, but he sure does come off like an arrogant prick on the board. and that has nothing to do with comparitive disc golf talent... just has to do with being a prick on the board. which he obviously excels at. he may have taken some time off of golf, but his prick skills are completely up to snuff. i would give him a 1025 prick rating, easy... without even dropping any rounds. he should change his name to 1025 rated prick

I now have this picture in my head of quickdisc as the little toadie on that Christmas Story movie...you know the little guy who follows the bully around (Bob may not be a bully, but he has a mouth like one, judging from his profanity-laden posts). He may be a fine person, but his numerous posts about how wonderful this Bob guy is just give me that impression. Either that, or they're dating.

I am looking forward to meeting Bob. I hope he doesn't take it wrong that I haven't deemed him Jesus2 because he can throw 650 feet. :)

I have a feeling he will be a cool guy, but six-fiddy doesn't mean he will.

I am looking forward to meeting Bob. I hope he doesn't take it wrong that I haven't deemed him Jesus2 because he can throw 650 feet. :)

I have a feeling he will be a cool guy, but six-fiddy doesn't mean he will.


Rhett, I lokk forward to meeting you also, have heard alot of cool things about you. If everyone was to look back at this thread, I was the one getting ripped on after I stated what I think about a disc and how it flies for me. Trust me, i would trade my distance for a kick butt short game in a heartbeat ! I have a good short game, but it could be better. I treat everyone with fairness, and those who treat me with respect, get respect. I was not treated with respect after by original comments on the Wraith, and I was not bragging about how far I threw it either. People want info on discs, they ask questions. Then when they get an opinion from someone, they are quick to judge them and hait on them. The fact is, I never tried to start anything here, all these other guys did ! And when they get out of line, I will tell them how I feel, yet I am the prick and they are not ? Whats wrong there ? If I say I can throw an Aviar 450 feet, that isn't bragging either, it's being truthful and honest. So for anyone wondering how this thread got to this point, go back and start at the beggining, and then decide if my first post was wrong, I think you will find that I was doing nothing more than giving my opinions,thoughts, and success on and with this disc. This was a case of the guys who can dish it out but can't take it. many of you need to think before you wrongly judge someone, or make negative comments about someone. I see this alot on these message boards, it is wrong. If you look back at this thread and see that I was wrong about my original post and comments, let me know how I could have stated what I did better.

Talk about of topic. Hey while were not on the subject, did anyone see the latest StarWars movie. How was it..., I mean, as long as nobody has anything to say about how dissapointing the wraith is (I don't think its dissapointing).

Bob, I don't think it was your initial post but your response to everyone's jokes about message board distance. Someone can get on this board and say they throw 550' but then don't even break 500' in a distance competition. It happens, so you can't believe everything someone types, even if it's true in your case. ;)

And the "Discrap" stuff gets old even to someone whose bag is 75% Innova.

I'm disappointed with the fact that I haven't bought a Wraith yet.

hate

I was trying to give Donny a hard time.

Good point! Also, if you have to post 8 times a day saying how great you are EVEN AFTER TAKING THE LAST 27 YEARS OFF, maybe you're...I don't know....compensating? :eek: :D :D


Last 8 years off actually, think before you talk you NOODLE ARM AM.



I want to represent these "Noodle Arms" and kick your ARSE on the course. BTW I am not even a pro so don't be skeered. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I got angry at this thread and threw my mini 300 Meters.

Most of the time, message boarders judge you not by the amount of useful information you can provide, but how you respond to others that don't agree with your opinions.

My wraith was not disappointing today.

Just got mine in the mail and im leaving right now to try it out.

Most of the time, message boarders judge you not by the amount of useful information you can provide, but how you respond to others that don't agree with your opinions.

My wraith was not disappointing today.



:D Hey Gary.............You mean the stuff on the message board is not always true ? :D Say it isn't so !!!!! :D

Most of the time !!!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Just got mine in the mail and im leaving right now to try it out.



Hey Aaron , let us know if you can flip it over ( Turn it over )

I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.


Not all discs by other companies are copycats. in fact I believe We ( Gateway) jumped out in front in the high speed driver game with the Speed Demon, Spirit and Illusion.
We still have the longest wing( besides the epic), but the wraith is getting close in linear length.
If I'm not mistaken I was told the wraith most resembles the Illusion and spirit, which we've been selling for well over a year.

I can appreciate your loyalty to your company, but without discraft pushing the envelope on plastic, there might not have ever been any CE stuff produced.

Competition is good for all the players and while it may appear that others are copying some of innovas discs, I know Jim at Discraft and myself at Gateway try hard to develop proprietary products to seperate us from them.
If you ever checked out our entire lineup I thing you would have a hard time matching up our discs with an exact copy of one of theres.

Bob Benner is a great person with excellent values.

I knew his parents well and they raised a terrific man.




<font color="purple"> as evidence, please consider the following: </font>



I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.



bobbi may be the coolest thing since godzilla, but he sure does come off like an arrogant prick on the board. and that has nothing to do with comparitive disc golf talent... just has to do with being a prick on the board. which he obviously excels at. he may have taken some time off of golf, but his prick skills are completely up to snuff. i would give him a 1025 prick rating, easy... without even dropping any rounds. he should change his name to 1025 rated prick



Absolutely hilarious Sandalman!!!

I cant believe how many of you guys are such F$%king A55Holes. You know nothing of me and yet you say that I can not throw over 600 feet. I was not bragging, I was saying what I think of the Wraith and how it flies for me. Some of you need to grow up, get an arm, and quite haiting on the players who have been around the sport way longer than you, who know about it, and have played more holes than you ever will. If someone can do something you cant, it isn't bragging. I was simply stating how the wraith flies for me. All you weenie arms can stick to your Discflip, Discrap, Copycraft SH*T. Someday you will see the light. Go learn how to throw now. Oh, I have never once said how great I was, I dont have to. People that know me know that I can crush and kick A55. You dont know me, never have and never will. But if you ever get to play against me, you will fear me because I will get in your head and make you choke on your own Balls.


Not all discs by other companies are copycats. in fact I believe We ( Gateway) jumped out in front in the high speed driver game with the Speed Demon, Spirit and Illusion.
We still have the longest wing( besides the epic), but the wraith is getting close in linear length.
If I'm not mistaken I was told the wraith most resembles the Illusion and spirit, which we've been selling for well over a year.

I can appreciate your loyalty to your company, but without discraft pushing the envelope on plastic, there might not have ever been any CE stuff produced.

Competition is good for all the players and while it may appear that others are copying some of innovas discs, I know Jim at Discraft and myself at Gateway try hard to develop proprietary products to seperate us from them.
If you ever checked out our entire lineup I thing you would have a hard time matching up our discs with an exact copy of one of theres.


Dave I looked at the wing and it is pretty flat but not tooooo similar to an Illusions wing. Still close though

All I know is Bob posted up picks in the innova bag thread and all I had to do is ask for help. I dont know him from Adam, come to think of it, I dont know Adam either but i'm sure he only bit the apple so eve would stop bieochin at him.

I can just picture Bob working on taking pics for me while the Barbies were simultaniously working on posting up insults to him. I see youve been away from the sport for awhile, Bob. Your going to be amazed at the amout of distance claims and discputes. Its kind of fun,tho....

AND (I SWEAR!)I can drive OVER 700 feet, flat and level in a slight tailwind (with my car).

Just like Tom Hanks has to urinate in all his movies Bob has to mention his distance on every post.
:eek:

Aint no thang but a chicken wing on a string

Tom Hanks urinates in all his movies?

Just got mine in the mail and im leaving right now to try it out.



Hey Aaron , let us know if you can flip it over ( Turn it over )



Yep. My first drive with it turned into a cut roller. I like it tho. It reminds me of this gummy 162 gram Beast i used to own, but its faster.

I'd say that Bob overreacted as a newbie. It happens. Other people overreacted, not knowing him, by calling bull. I wouldn't blame Bob for coming to his own defense, he doesn't seem like he has anything to prove, but people made him prove it. So he got [I'm a potty-mouth!]. He's new here, even if he's an old player. I think anyone who is new to the board gets branded a newbie in the sport. Especially someone who you can't find any tournament stats on (I know, I tried and was interested).

Give the guy a break and maybe he'll benefit the board in the long run. If y'all don't [I'm a potty-mouth!] him off before then...

I myself have had some of my best drives with the Wraith. I think I may have broken 475 today. Not sure, I'll have to measure.

Wow ... good hardy laughs while catching up on this thread!

No one seems to be mentioning the difference between the Champion and the Proline Wraiths. I watched quite a few drives from big-arms throwing both versions at the WVO and the Champion seemed significantly more overstable than the Proline version. I actually saw one big-arm turn over the Proline like it was a 150 dx valk. I guess this isn't a surprise knowing history between the two lines of plastic, but I thought it was worth mentioning.

I have an idea to end all this bickering.
Bob I noticed in your bio that you are a Grocery Manager. Last time I checked Grocery Managers made some decent coin. So I suggest that you pick up 10 Wraiths and start practicing your distance throws. In-between practicing and Managing the Grocery store I would also recommend you pony up the $ and renew your PDGA membership. After that is done my next suggestion is sending in your $ for Pro Worlds in Augusta. Then just a little more $ will get you into the distance competition. All of us that will be there will watch you crank some 600'+ drives and Ooo and Ahhh at your amazing display of disc golf talent. Then we will head to the local watering hole and forget any of this ugliness ever happened. ;)

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat

Perhaps he will be sainted for his distance then. Seriously, the point everyone is trying to make is that he is not contributing to the thread; rather, he blew it all to hell.

Reminds me of all the women I meet that feel like I need to know that they were once a cheerleader 10 years ago when they were in high school or junior high. They overlook the past that it didn't prepare them for their job as a professional hamburger maker or grocery sacker.

All this talk about distance, out throwing people, and balls....could he be compensating for something else?

im surprised the disc pimp hasnt had much to say on this one....

Again , don't be so quick to judge a guy , who could out throw you in a heartbeat

Perhaps he will be sainted for his distance then. Seriously, the point everyone is trying to make is that he is not contributing to the thread; rather, he blew it all to hell.

Reminds me of all the women I meet that feel like I need to know that they were once a cheerleader 10 years ago when they were in high school or junior high. They overlook the past that it didn't prepare them for their job as a professional hamburger maker or grocery sacker.

All this talk about distance, out throwing people, and balls....could he be compensating for something else?



Hank, youre random as hell

I have an idea to end all this bickering.
Bob I noticed in your bio that you are a Grocery Manager. Last time I checked Grocery Managers made some decent coin. So I suggest that you pick up 10 Wraiths and start practicing your distance throws. In-between practicing and Managing the Grocery store I would also recommend you pony up the $ and renew your PDGA membership. After that is done my next suggestion is sending in your $ for Pro Worlds in Augusta. Then just a little more $ will get you into the distance competition. All of us that will be there will watch you crank some 600'+ drives and Ooo and Ahhh at your amazing display of disc golf talent. Then we will head to the local watering hole and forget any of this ugliness ever happened. ;)


Sounds good. the only thing is I am dedicated to my Wife and soon to be son right now. I am hoping to play some tourneys starting in 2006. I hold nothing against anyone here, and even though alot of words have been spoken I look forward to meeting as many of you as I can. I never mean to brag about my distance, I only tell you what a disc does and doesn't do for me. I am always willing to help a new player with his game, give advise when needed, and take advise when needed. About the Discraft issue, well, it's a long story. I did however throw a few of Carlo Pelgs discs today while playing and actually had some decent results with them, especially the Predator. Lets take this thread where it should have gone in the first place. Also, I think we all need to start respecting each other more and start trying to get this sport where it needs to go. So, I am sorry for any insults that I might have made, and I hope everyone else that participated in this nonscence feels the same. If the sport is ever going to get to where I hope it does, we all need to help it get there together as a whole.

How am I anonymous, my username is my actual name. :confused:



yeah sure. that's just a clever ploy "Brad" :D/msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif :D

Bob, now you sound way too classy for this message board. :D

Doubles and Singles Events at Idlewild (http://www.cincinnatidiscgolf.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=563&amp;start=1)

Wow ... good hardy laughs while catching up on this thread!

No one seems to be mentioning the difference between the Champion and the Proline Wraiths. I watched quite a few drives from big-arms throwing both versions at the WVO and the Champion seemed significantly more overstable than the Proline version. I actually saw one big-arm turn over the Proline like it was a 150 dx valk. I guess this isn't a surprise knowing history between the two lines of plastic, but I thought it was worth mentioning.


The Champion or CFR Wraith is much more high speed stable than the pro line. The Champion Wraith holds up well into a headwind, and can be thrown with a slight anhyzer release with a backwind.

im surprised the disc pimp hasnt had much to say on this one....



With his arm, he probably threw his 13 miles and is now retrieving it.

Wow ... good hardy laughs while catching up on this thread!

No one seems to be mentioning the difference between the Champion and the Proline Wraiths. I watched quite a few drives from big-arms throwing both versions at the WVO and the Champion seemed significantly more overstable than the Proline version. I actually saw one big-arm turn over the Proline like it was a 150 dx valk. I guess this isn't a surprise knowing history between the two lines of plastic, but I thought it was worth mentioning.


The Champion or CFR Wraith is much more high speed stable than the pro line. The Champion Wraith holds up well into a headwind, and can be thrown with a slight anhyzer release with a backwind.


One more thing. Like many Champion Line Discs, the CFR Wraith does not have the glide and carry like the Pro Wraith has, but if you like the Pro Wraith with the wind and want the same disc for light to medium headwinds than the CFR Wraith might be a great disc for you.

Are these CFR and Champion Wraiths available online? I havent really checked...

Hank, youre random as hell

Yeah, I am. I was trying for an anology, but I got too wordy. I think I just need sleep.

I'm glad that the thread has gotten back on track to discussing the subject though.

Schweb uses the Orc. I hear the Coyote has made it into a lot of pro bags too...

He threw my spirit father though. :o



are you suggesting we should look for Schweb to switch to Gateway soon? /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif
he probably gets better D out of the Wraith anyway...

No switching here, and I will not be geTTing into the Wraith until next year, the Orc flies way to well for me right now, to start trying something new b4 the USDGC.

They coyote is a breeze copy :eek:

no so innovative anymore?

I gave the Wraith some game time at the Blast. Every time I threw with my ordinary flat, level release it flipped like a Romanian gymnast. When I threw it with hyzer it went really far straight and finished left. So I guess for players with hyzer form this is a good long disc on a hole that is shaped for that flight path. Because I don't throw Innova Pro Line [all the Innova in my bag is Champion] I was shocked by how easily this blend gets chewed up. No wonder I sell so much of this Pro Line stuff!

They coyote is a breeze copy :eek:



not even close

They coyote is a breeze copy :eek:



not even close

I thought the Breeze was a beadless Panther! :D

I was thinking the same thing. For those that throw the orc well, why would you be looking for another disc?

Me, I have never been able to control the orc. The wraith is a very straight, predictable disc when thrown about shoulder level. The trick is to not try and muscle it; if you do, it just kinda dies on you.

The Wraith has replaced my pro orcs. It flies just as far but isnt quite as flippy at high speeds. Now that I have the release angle down on it, it is a very consistent disc for me. Just a touch of anhyzer, nose down, and low. I use it for my main distance disc if there is no wind or maybe a slight breeze. I can't flick it though, it flips too much. I started throwing my Champ Orcs and SF's for distance flicks. Pro Starfire for downwind, or when I need it to finish very straight or slightly right. Champ Orc for headwinds and stronger left finishes, within reason. Cant wait to try the SB Orcs.

I like the wraith, but it is still not my go to driver. My z wildcat, z xpress, and X avenger are fighting for that spot. Guess most of the holes in my area require straight shots.

I thought the Breeze was a beadless Panther! :D


That was pretty funny! :D

The Wraith has replaced my pro orcs. It flies just as far but isnt quite as flippy at high speeds. Now that I have the release angle down on it, it is a very consistent disc for me. Just a touch of anhyzer, nose down, and low.



I've been getting good results with this approach as well, but it will take a bit more time (and just a wee bit more wear) to really get time over the sidewinders and stARFires

The Wraith has replaced my pro orcs. It flies just as far but isnt quite as flippy at high speeds. Now that I have the release angle down on it, it is a very consistent disc for me. Just a touch of anhyzer, nose down, and low.



I've been getting good results with this approach as well, but it will take a bit more time (and just a wee bit more wear) to really get time over the sidewinders and stARFires



What weights are you guys using?

I'm benching 275.

Im currently doing 3 sets of 175, 12 reps each.

I can curl roughly 12oz.

What weights are you guys using?



Drivers license weight. And I'm sticking to it.

We had to weight for a long time on letter hole "L". Their was a big back up. Your probably not getting this. Well, it was not two funny either.

They only come 170-175, right?

They only come 170-175, right?


I think I heard that there were about 4 of 5000 that were less than 170, with one being 168 and 3 being 169.

This is a great disc for those long shots.

This disc will outdrive any disc that I have ever thrown. All I have to do (lhbh) is throw it just left of my target and it will straighten out and hyzer right at the end. For my turnover shots(lhbh) throw it right at the target and it will turn over and hyzer right at the bucket. I have been waiting for a disc llike this for a long time!

I'm waiting patiently for mine to show up. Until then, please stay off of my front porch!

i tried out one of these at winthrop today and i bombed it a few times. on hole 9 (listed at 650 but i dont think it is) i had a jump putt after throwing a huge s curve on my drive. it went about 50' farther than a cfr starfire i threw pretty well.

no u didn't

Although I've only thrown it about 15 times, my new CFR Wraith has yet to go any further than my trusty old X-Clone. I like it though so I'll keep at it. Time will tell.

CFR is more stable than the Pro line. But once this disc is beat in a little its going to be the CHIT