Just got back from brunch with my double secret informant from deep inside Innovaland.

The big news for the USDGC this year is that 888 and the Quarter Mile will not be played! :eek: And even the Clowns Mouth might not get played!! :eek: /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif

Here is the scoop. After hole 4 the course will detour onto the adjacent ball golf course that was used for Worlds in 97. It's not for sure yet how many holes will be out there, but expect more yellow rope to keep it all snug. :D

So anyhows after playing out on the golf course it will route back to hole 5.

After hole 8 the course may turn around and play #16 thereby eliminating the Clowns mouth and all the others around the tennis and colisseum. But if they can't fit that many good holes on the ball golf course, the course will play 8 9 10 Clown 16 etc.

The other big news is that the course is going to start on hole 6! :eek: This makes hole 5 the best finishing hole in the world!! It also allows a big [inappropriate word] grandstand to be erected {huh huh} on that big open area by the 5 basket and the 6 tee. Very cool!!! :cool: :cool: The distance will still be in the same place, but you can watch it from the shack or stay in the grandstand.

In summary the most likely configuration will be like this 6 7 8 9 10 Clown 16 17 18 1 2 3 4 4HolesontheGolfCourse 5. Oh yeah I forgot that hole 7 might go away too and be replaced by a 5th hole out on the ball golf course.

Interesting but the quarter mile, 888, and the coliseum are great holes.

And pretty much the 3 holes (aside from 5) why the course is known so well...they'd never get rid of them. Better now get rid of the clowns mouth, been one of my best holes both years i went.

Check out www.usdgc.com (http://www.usdgc.com) ! The new site has been rolled out and it looks sweet!

Recently we've fielded a lot of questions about qualifying. There are still three more qualifiers in the United States and two in Europe. Details on these qualifiers can be seen at: http://www.usdgc.com/qualify.htm

If you can't make one of the remaining qualifiers, there's a new opportunity this year to play at the USDGC. One sponsor's exempt spot will be offered as the Grand Prize in the August Candy Fundraising drawing. Details can be seen at: http://www.innovadiscs.com/cfr/rewards.html

Good luck,
Harold

link didn't work Harold. This one does though...

2005 INNOVA CFR Sponsor Reward Program (http://www.innovadiscs.com/cfr/rewards.html)

The Skylands Disc Golf Classic will be held in Warwick, NY.

Not Warwick, Mahwah, NY.

Sign up for the WVO....I believe it is the LAST Qualifier before the USDGC. Roughly 40 spots remain for PRO's before the field closes. www.westvirginiaopen.com (http://www.westvirginiaopen.com)

Don't forget the British Open is a USDGC Qualifyer and we have 2 spots left and 10 days to go before all the fun kicks off, pro purse should payout the winner with around $1,000, yep a cool grand of your US of A dollars :cool:The top 5 get place's at the USDGC, think you can cut the mustard, come and join us on the oldest course in England.

Tim
2 spots left and 10 days to go...

All roads lead to Paw Paw - it's just a matter if someone parks their mobile
home in the middle of the road or not.


Clic
k Here to See Who All is Playing the 12th WVO (http://www.pdga.com/tournament/tournament_results.php?TournID=4649)

Less then 28 days till this yeers' West Virginia Open Still have 35 Spots
for Pros & 32 Spots for Ams. Don't delay make your plans now. We have over
25 Open Pros - 10 Pro Women - 16 Pro Masters and a Ton of Baggers. Last year
the field had over 170 Players.

AM's Online Registration
Form (http://www.mollyguard.com/event/18932628)

PRO's Online Registration
Form (http://www.mollyguard.com/event/18931625)

This year same as all the rest we will have the 12th WVO Doubles Event on
Friday September 2nd - for yoens who want to make a long weekend bring your
cousin.

Register Online for 12th WVO
Doubles (http://wvodoubles.mollyguard.com)


Tentative plans now Friday night Poker Tournament - for more information
contact John Biscoe - [email protected]

$40 Entry fee with $10 going to WVO. Hole Sponsor for this yeers' Event
play $30 with - One $20 rebuy.

Harold...

I see that drawings for a given month's prizes, including the drawing in August for a USDGC spot, will be held the last tuesday of the month.

I assume that when we receive our CFR discs for our Sylands Classic NT event and USDGC qualifier we'll receive with the discs the forms one fills out when they purchase a CFR disc?
It would be good to know that so we can advertise those prizes to help sell those discs.

Thanks....

Dan Doyle
Warwick, NY

Here is an email I received from Jonathan Poole earlier this week:

Tanner,

Winthrop course maps are available at
http://www.rhdgc.com/courses/winthrop.html. The only thing that will change
on the Gold Course is the green on #12. That pin will be moving off the
island to free up parking spaces in that lot. Otherwise the course will
remain unchanged from last year.

Jonathan

That is what Jonathan told me at World's as well when I asked him about any changes.

Schweet! I was hopin I'd get to play the clowns mouth!! Maybe I will finally get to play with you Schweb :eek: :)

So does anywone know where they are going to move the pin on that hole, 888 I think? I have been studying all the info I can find on the course- can't wait!

I think the Tee and pin placement aer going to change. Not sure exactly where though.

They should put the pin on top of that HUGE mound of dirt that was off to the left of 888, really make the hole fun, and a biatch to putt at :-D

There are currently 125 players registered.

That big mound is gone but i had the same idea.

Quite a few pics of you on usdgc.com, Mario Van Schweebles! I see that some redneck from Bedford, VA made the field! They'll let anybody into this tournament! Can you play Winthrop gold with a putter only? I'm going to have to sell the rest of my discs to pay for this trip. :eek:

you just need to find a friendly poker game. :eek:

I could play Winthrop probably just as well with just a putter as I do with my whole bag. I doubt I'd be throwing, on average for two years, 35 OB's per year with a putter.
:-D
I suck butt there.

The Innova CFR Sponsor Rewards Program raffled off a spot in the 2005 USDGC this week.

Congratulations to Joshua Johnson of Greenville, NC for being chosen from among hundreds of Champion Fund Raiser Tournament Sponsors. Joshua has won a spot in this year's most anticipated championship. Joshua will be playing among the greats in the game: World Champions, National Champions, Hall of Famers, the European Elite, as well as a collection of the finest disc golfers and promoters from around the United States.

We'll see you in Rock Hill, Josh, October 12-15th.

SC, huh...that doesn't sound fixed at all. ;)

Actually, I bet the odds of someone from that area are pretty good, considering you can walk up and buy yourself almost any CFR you want. Have fun Josh, you're the fan favorite.

oops, I meant Greenville, NC, home of MTL.

I watched as Trey Johnson put all the tickets into a box and tumbled it around and around and around before John McDaniel pulled out the winning ticket.

does the 30 days to register start from the day of the tournament ending that u qualified in? or do i get an invite? either way i need to get that $ in.

30 days from the day you qualify. Get your money in, Jack. Go to the usdgc.com site, there is a link to register online.

i'm in

TT representin

Bard is IN......!

Nice job, Jeff. Trip paid off.

Very TTrim TTrip to Mississippi

can i rent a golf cart at usdgc?

Wasup Schway?

Are you still afloat out there?

Any effect from Ophelia on Winthorp?

How that saying go? " ... yellow rope, water everywhere" :o

Hope you're dry and good.:cool:
Say Hey to Brian & Billy. :D

Wasabe Steely John, Just a liTTle rain and wind where I am at right now. It is supposed to pick up by tonight. Winthrop prolly did feel much of the effects of this Hurricane.

Schweb we got nothin here. All we got from Ophilia is some wind. No rain. Course looks great. Hope to see you in a few weeks.

2 weeks before the usdgc is this event.

This Just in From Bobby Evans

20th annual Sneaky Pete Classic
Oct 1 & 2, 2005
Cedarock park Burlington NC
PDGA A TIER & NCDGCHAMPIONSHIP SERIES EVENT
Must be a current PDGA member to play
$10.00 extra to register the day of the tournament

all pro divisions $85.00
all am divisions $55.00
** first 90 ams recive a pair of Quad-shocks **

pre registration is highly reccomended can register also on
Fri sept 30th @ course

TEE times both days 10am
players meeting sat morning 9:30am sharp

cedarock will be on long pins both days and will play both set of pads.( yellow and blue courses )

also wellspring both sets of pads will be used ( short & long pads )

camping available for free at course

food will be available for a small fee

send checks to bobby evans
1713 Oklahoma ave
burlington NC 27217
336-228-0939

include pdga#, division, address & phone #



WE WANT 180 PLAYERS

can i rent a golf cart at usdgc?



i got my cart in lockdown.... throw a good shot for the camera... you never know who could be watching....

Hey my money is on this guy Mike Conners, I've seen this guy throw like 600 ft. and he can put like a machine.....and watch when he throws his rocs like 450 ft.......this guy is insane!!!!

.....and watch when he throws his rocs like 450 ft.......this guy is insane!!!!


Pshaw. We gots little kids in Cali that throw Rocs 450. If you ain't bringin' six-fiddy with a driver, don't bother bringin' it! Four-fiddy is an Aviar shot. :)

Hey my money is on this guy Mike Conners, I've seen this guy throw like 600 ft. and he can put like a machine.....and watch when he throws his rocs like 450 ft.......this guy is insane!!!!

This course does not require long drives, it requires a great HEAD GAME and accuracy. It makes no difference how far you throw it. Yellow rope loves long throwers.

Hey my money is on this guy Mike Conners, I've seen this guy throw like 600 ft. and he can put like a machine.....and watch when he throws his rocs like 450 ft.......this guy is insane!!!!

This course does not require long drives, it requires a great HEAD GAME and accuracy. It makes no difference how far you throw it. Yellow rope loves long throwers.



Larry Leonard accepting the second of his 3rd place checks at the USDGC "After watching all these boys throw in the long drive contest, all I can say is thank God for yellow rope" :D

<font color="red">BANG BANG </font>

My money is still on Mike Conners!!!! :D Did I mention he can throw 600 ft. with accuracy!! ;)

Thanks Billy, but 600ft with accuracy? Maybe when he11 freezes over!! :p :p

Wow, 600 ft. with accuracy!! Thats is very Benneresque.......
Gotta like that.
But I'd like the Champ to win it again and represent us old guys real well.

However, honestly I would also like to see a minority come out on top and shake the Disc Golf World up a little bit. Conners could do a lot for that community by winning. He would be a positive role model for many inner city youths and influence many of them to come out and get invovled in the Sport !!
Alot of them would say if he can be the best at that Sport and make 10 grand then I can do it also.

I just signed up!!! Good grief, by no means do I have expectations of winning this thing, that thought never even crossed my mind. It was hard enough to spend $230 on a tournament entry fee when I know I won't see a payout spot, but I can't pass up the opportunity to play in the freaking USDGC! It would be the highlight of my season to finish in the top HALF of this tournament.

It will feel good to finish the year off right by competing in the USDGC :cool:

mc

GO GET EM' TIGER!!! :cool:

C'mon Schwebby, you know that distance can be a big help at the USDGC. You just have to be very accurate when you let go of your disc!

Motto for me this year, " Don't get mad, get Par!"

Leyviar out......

I know, but just look at Larry Leonard, he doesnt throw over 400 very often and he has finished 3rd twice.

True!.....b/c he rarely misses a 50 footer. :) :p

So, let me get this straight. Throw 400 feet accurately, make all putts within 50 feet - get third place. Okay, sounds like I should be getting ready for a solid finish somewhere around 60th - I hope.

Looking forward to what has been explained to me as "the first time you will really feel like you are being treated like a professional"

glad to see you going Jose. good luck

Thanks Chris - Hicks said he was going to go and try to qualify on Monday but moving to Tulsa and getting a new job has put a stop to that.

Jose, the road trip is ON!

I'm in Vegas and my name just posted on the USDGC players list...It does not get much better than this!

Yesssssssssssssssss!

If I could pick anybody to play with (besides my homie McCoy) I would pick the pro's pro Schweby.

I'm so @*%^#$% pumped it's hard to describe!

Mike - I wish I could be out there with ya. Congrats big man you go get your marriage thing on.

Road trip to Rock Hill will be cool, I talked to Kelly Ganzel this weekend.

Schweby is cool. First time I ever played with him was in KC and just about the first thing he said to me was "Jose, how old are you?" I tell him I am 35. He replies, "Good I am not the old man on the card?"

Mike - I wish I could be out there with ya. Congrats big man you go get your marriage thing on.

Road trip to Rock Hill will be cool, I talked to Kelly Ganzel this weekend.

Schweby is cool. First time I ever played with him was in KC and just about the first thing he said to me was "Jose, how old are you?" I tell him I am 35. He replies, "Good I am not the old man on the card?"

Thats right, I have only been in that situation once since I have been playing. It is tough to be the oldest at at 32. :(

You old fart! It was fun this past weekend being the small arm of each group...sorta. I used to always be the big arm. I'm not throwing much shorter, everyone else is just throwing much farther. Stinkin Wraiths.

But I aint throwin the Wraith YET.

I am twice as old as some of the young guns here in Okieland. I have actually enjoyed seeing some of the younger crowd progress so quickly - Coda, Aleksey, Devon etc.

I have to admit, I am throwing the Wraith.

Only Twenty more days until the Fun begins. Believe me This Is THE BEST. I look Forward to this event every year even though I am just a caddy. Top highlights from last year for me where.

1.Meeting all the great People I had never Met.( Boobs, S. ashby, The Champ, Barry,etc.

2. Learning about everyones superstitions (schweby and his mini rotation!!)

3. Watching all the great Golf.

4. THE WIND ON SATURDAY

5. Playing Horse on the Wingate INN course in the middle of the night with Boobs and JJ. ( Anyone else want to join In this year I DARE YA).

6. MIke Jo's PuTT on 18 was Sick.

7. Mace's speech at the players meeting.

8. The Long D contest w/ Avery going across the Road!

9. Pete May playing Ping Pong with a Lunch Tray.

I am so excited I'm donating $50 on monday just to say "I tried"

hell yeah!

Two weeks away! Sweeeeeeet! Can't wait to see the "new" layout. :) :) :D

so whose gonna win?

Me, I could really use $10,000 right about now.

Me, I could really use $10,000 right about now.


Who couldn't? /msgboard/images/graemlins/ooo.gif :o;) :D

--Josh

Bill Gates.

Not sure if all pins are in their tournament position, but everything from 3-14, and 17 and 18 are in the tournament positions now. Holes 9 and 10 are elevated.

I should have a map available soon for those looking to practice the course.

The total length this year is 9853 feet.

Who is going to be playing the course this week?

It's looking really nice. The crew were cutting all the shule on hole 5 next to the water, so nothing to stop rollers and skips into the lake. Harold and Stan flagged hole 9 575 ft, par 4. Hole 10, 563ft, par 4 is not what was played last year, but similar to the previous year, except the tee is beyond the parking lot (past split rail fence) for the stone house. The stone house is beautimous now that it has been remodeled. Hole 11, Par 4, 734ft is the tee for the quarter mile, playing to the target that is visible just over the rise. From there, head up to the coliseum towards the big Winthrop Coliseum sign. There is a Tee pad off the edge of the sidewalk, this hole plays to a basket that is at the end of the quarter mile hole. This is a par 5, 901 foot hole.

It's time to start talking USDGC! Just 10 days away til the Monday qualifier!

Spent alot of the morning hanging <font color="yellow"> YELLOW </font> rope. There are some times when it's great just to be a spectator at an event. You guys are gonna love the <font color="yellow">YELLOW </font> rope this year. :D

Hole 13 (formerly 888) is going to give players fits. :DBout time to pull the Upside down, floogle, thumber roller out of the bag or start learning it. :D

is there still a dress code at USDGC? because i think all my collared shirts were used to soak up rainwater in my house after a hurricane. oh wait, i did save my marshall street polo. do you think it will smell funky after 4 days? :o

I've got a few if you need em Mike. Just get up here and you'll be fine.

Just make sure it is clean before we leave :DOtherwise you will be riding in the back! I hope you where not already make excuses for your game stinking.

Hey Matt, What is the new layout of 888? Is the quarter mile no longer (in existence)? Any changes to 17? Thanks! Can't wait to get there.

Joe

Joe,

Did you get my PM?

Kirk

Hey Mr. YOOOOOOOOO. I did. See you in RHSC

Hi, Matt. I might come down with a friend possibly on Wednesday. How has the course changed from the course that is mapped on rhdgc.com? I know you mentioned the changes for 10, 11, and 12. Are holes 1, 2, 15, 16 in tournament position yet?

This (http://www.innovadiscs.com/usdgc/map2005.jpg) should answer your questions.

Matt

888 is going to be HARDER this year, requiring a super-accurate 3rd shot to get a putt at a basket that lies quite close to OB, and has a hedge on the other side. The green is about as well protected as it gets, with the exception of throwing long past the basket, no protection there, and you'll be going OB, but at least you can make a putt from your 1 meter relief.

Thanks Matt! What I see is that 10, 11, 12 and 13 have changed from last year. Will "par" drop since there is no 1/4 mile hole, or is 13 now a par 5? Man I wish I was a lefty! :D

That raises the question; anybody got maps of all the year to year changes to the course?

Matt, thanks for posting information and the course map.

If the Course map answers a few questions, then the CADDY BOOK (http://www.usdgc.com/caddybookweb.pdf) should answer all the rest.

Yes, this year, we have each hole mapped, and distances from key places and objects for distances to the basket and to the tee. No fluff, just pure data. And all the general rules and the hole specific rules are at the beginning so you can cross-check what you believe with what is reality.

Beware, knowing the distances might make you realize you just don't throw em that far when there's OB on both sides of the fairway!

Your best bet is to right click, save the file then view it. Please do not keep opening it up on the site as it is a large file and as with any popular large file, we'll be burning some serious bandwidth.

Print one out and study it on your plane flight, or as you nap at the reststop, or in between rounds at the Charlotte Open!

Enjoy, only 9 days left!

Matt,
Will this be printed out for the at the tournament. (players pack or otherwise) This is great for all of us Loopers (caddies)

Caddy book notes:

- On the triple-mando, if a disc passes through the mando and then cut-rolls back beyond the mando line (outside the mando), according to the PDGA rules of play, this disc has not "passed the mandatory". But also by the PDGA rules of play, this disc has not "missed the mandatory". By the letter of the rule, and without further clarification, it appears the player would therefore need to pass through the mando "again". This is covered by the caddy book OB discussion "shorts shot of the mandatory. . .", though could be a point of confusion considering how the disc got there.

- On hole 17, I'm not sure the caddy book OB discussion is clear enough that *all* OB shots (prior to successfully landing in-bounds) must re-tee, even shots that pass over in-bounds. It says "Next shot is from drop zone", but the obvious next question is "Even if it crosses over in-bounds?". It should *need* to be asked, but it always is. Maybe it's just me.

- On hole 9, the mando drop zone is the tee. So even approach shots (lefty hyzer, lefty turnover, righty bad miss to the left) must return all the way to the tee. Hmmm.

Yes Travis, there will be a printed version at the tournament.

Travis study this thang baby....cause when we play on monday there will be a quiz!!!! :D

True Dat. Hopefully I will pass, and then I can call myself TTreefrog. :D

- On the triple-mando, if a disc passes through the mando and then cut-rolls back beyond the mando line (outside the mando), according to the PDGA rules of play, this disc has not "passed the mandatory". But also by the PDGA rules of play, this disc has not "missed the mandatory". By the letter of the rule, and without further clarification, it appears the player would therefore need to pass through the mando "again". This is covered by the caddy book OB discussion "shorts shot of the mandatory. . .", though could be a point of confusion considering how the disc got there.



After further review, I think this situation applies to *any* mando, not just the triple. In other words, any disc passing the mandatory line on the correct side but then coming back across the mandatory line on the incorrect side has neither made nor missed the mandatory.

So, sorry, I guess this comment reflects a deficiency in the mando rules, not specific to the triple-mando situation.

I figured this would be the hottest thread around, since the tourney is only SIX DAYS AWAY! My personal goal is to keep the OB strokes to a minimum. :eek:

Even better would be to birdie hole 1! :D;)

Hey Rodney -

As the mandatory rule is written, the determining factor in many situations is where the disc comes to rest. Specifically, if the disc comes to rest on the tee side of the mandatory, the mandatory has neither been passed nor missed regardless of the path the disc took. The player would still have to complete the mandatory (single, double, or triple) even if the shot passed or went through the �good� part of the mandatory.

This is consistent with the current rules rubric that ignores the concept of unwinding. Relative to the mandatory, nothing has happened if the disc comes to rest short of mandatory line. The disc has to cross the good section and come to rest beyond the line for the mandatory to �passed.� To be �missed�, the disc has to cross the bad section(s) and come rest beyond the mandatory line. If the disc comes to rest beyond the line after crossing the good area from the direction of the tee, the mandatory is passed. Essentially, your disc has to come to rest beyond the mandatory line for a determination to occur. If your disc comes to rest on the tee side of the mandatory line, it�s as if you threw short of the mandatory.

For example:

1. A disc that passes a single mandatory on the correct side and then curls back across the incorrect side of the line has neither made nor missed the mandatory.
2. A disc that passes a single mandatory on the incorrect side and then curls back across the correct side of the line has neither made nor missed the mandatory.
3. A disc that passes between a double mandatory and then curls back across one of the incorrect side lines has neither made nor missed the mandatory.
4. A disc that passes outside a double mandatory and the curls back between the mandatory objects has neither made nor missed the mandatory.
5. A disc that passes outside a double mandatory and then curls back around the other incorrect side has neither made nor missed the mandatory.
6. Plus all the variations of shots crossing and then returning over the same portion of the mandatory line

Many of these scenarios are counterintuitive, and I can think of some that would be down right unfair, but that is what we will be working with next week. Fortunately, these situations are relatively rare.


Take care,
Harold

PS. The mandatory sign on #9 is in the wrong spot. It will be moved back much closer to the tee. This should hopefully make the ground rule make more sense. Let me know of any other items that we can clarify.

Thanks Harold. As you say, these situations are pretty uncommon. I wonder how many players would rule them correctly? I wonder how many *officials* would rule them correctly.

Thanks for the clarification on #9's mando.

Will you have a string OB on the in-bounds side of the fence on #2 (and other fences)? This avoids the "over the fence but leaning on the fence" problem.

Also, I think I mentioned it 2 years ago, but on #2 the string OB for the parking lot was actually on the ground on the parking lot side of the cement parking blocks. This created a situation where a disc slid on the ground up to the line, and the group was forced to give "benefit of the doubt" to the thrower on whether the disc ever actually hit the string. This was bad. Having the string on the grass side of the cement blocks would get rid of this problem. Let me know if I need to clarify this further.

The only other thing I thought of, and I've never seen it even close to happening, is a disc landing on the little shack thing on #2. Without the 2m penalty, it seems to me that you would take your mark directly "behind" the little shack with no penalty. But I'm not sure how obvious that would be.

If you were to use the rules of basic geometry such that the inside of the fence is considered a plane, then touching the outside of the fence would still be considered OB.

as long as you SAY the inside of the fence is the ob line...
MOST td's just say "the fence" is OB opening up the proverbial can of worms that the "intention" was the inside of the fence...
but the correct ruling if a td just says "the fence" is to mark it wherever it hit the fence on the way back towards in bounds as the ob "line" is inbounds...

semantics is also why i use the inside(grass to concrete side)of parking lot curbing and sidewalks as the ob lines for tournaments i have run...
it definately helps eliminate arguements and questions from group to group

If you were to use the rules of basic geometry such that the inside of the fence is considered a plane, then touching the outside of the fence would still be considered OB.



Yeah, but the ground rules simply state "beyond the fence", which leaves it open to interpretation.

Further, some people, not me, will argue that a disc hitting the OB side of the fence will stick through a fence-hole to break the plane, or even that the fence flexes through the plane on contact.

All of which can be avoided with a string or painted line.

Further, some people, not me, will argue that a disc hitting the OB side of the fence will stick through a fence-hole to break the plane, or even that the fence flexes through the plane on contact.


The "old pros" will argue that point vehemently if it's a chain-link fence, every time. Even though the shot was absolutely OB with no chance of ever being IB, it is considered to good form (not by me) to argue technicalities in order to "get over".

I like to argue technicalities before-hand so that every player in every group that hits that fence like that gets the same ruling.

isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???

If the inside of the fence is a plane then the only way a disc on the outside of the fence could touch the plane would be if there were a hole in the fence big enough for the arc of the disc to stick through and touch the plane. Then the "tie" would go to the runner better known as benefit of the doubt.

The easiest way is to say if you go over the fence you are out and touching the inside of the fence doesn't count.

ah...but then you would have the semantic arguing of a disc flying over ob fence...striking a tree on the "good" side of the fence and then falling down and leaning on the fence making it no good in your world :D

isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.

No problem.

It came to rest outside the fence. That is out.

All you have to do is stipulate that if you come to rest outside the fence you are out and touching the outside of the fence does not constitute being inbounds.

Didn't anybody take High School Geometry???

yes i did and thats why i say the "DISC" has to be on the "inside" of the fence to be in bounds...
otherwise the people that say hitting the fence is inbounds if the td just says "fence is ob" would ALWAYS be correct under the pdga rules as currently written :D

isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.



oh contraire mr. rhett....

everyone reads them...they just don't comprehend them :D

maybe it'll rain and the grass will turn back to green.......
other then that the course is in great shape!!!

maybe it'll rain and the grass will turn back to green.......
other then that the course is in great shape!!!

Yeah, what the FriZZmullet said.

You know, I think they already had a rope inside the fence last year. Nevermind.

I believe we ran string along the fences most likely to cause confusion. We will review these again to try to avert any controversies.

The utility house on #2 was a good catch. I will add that to the Marshall's list. It's unlikely that anyone will land on top, but if they do, it will still be plenty challenging for someone to play from directly behind this structure in accordance with 803.03E.

In the notes I prepare for the Marshall's, we discuss that the line for fences is the OB side of the fence. We also utilize the "stream" principle for the flexing fence. In a stream, the water ebbs and flows, and the boundary defined by the water would change with the flow. Likewise, as the disc hits the fence, the plane flexes away precluding a determination that the disc broke the plane.

We also review with the marshalls that the criteria for marking is not necessarily the same as for determining OB. For OB, the presumption is in the player's favor, i.e. in bounds. This is not the case for a beneficial spot. The player does not automatically receive the benefit of the doubt for a favorable spot.

Take care,
Harold

In the notes I prepare for the Marshall's, we discuss that the line for fences is the OB side of the fence. We also utilize the "stream" principle for the flexing fence. In a stream, the water ebbs and flows, and the boundary defined by the water would change with the flow. Likewise, as the disc hits the fence, the plane flexes away precluding a determination that the disc broke the plane.

Take care,
Harold



so in other words you are saying that a top rules making guy likes to make rulings that are confusing to the people that like to play by the rules right?
:eek:
:p
:D

Hey Keith - I am not sure that I would put it that way. I think that we are actually in agreement. We are simply using different language. You prefer "inside"; I prefer "beyond."

Take care,
Harold

i almost agree with you harold :D

it just seems that in most events i play in that the fence is curved or angled and saying "beyond" could still have it be on the "out of bounds" side not on the inbounds side...

but i will ALWAYS take advantage of a td's calling things that are gray because the rules will ALWAYS back me up in the black and white writing because the "intention or spirit of the rule" isn't in the black and white part even though you and the other's on the rules committee hoped it would be interpreted that way...

i'm ALWAYS asking the td if there is ambiguity about an ob line just so EVERYONE is playing by the same line...as invariably several groups that aren't at the players meetings will play it several diferent ways and it takes all the arguing and whining out of play when lines are CLEARLY defined

take it easy and i hope one day to be able to ask you ob lines questions in person again :D

This interpretation is poor with regard to whether a mandatory has been passed or not. It may be USDGC version which is fine for clarity, but the nature of the mando being passed or not should be based on the flight path of the disc and not where it lands, unlike OB rules which rely on the final resting place of the disc. The instant the disc passes either the good side or bad side, then the mando has been successfully or unsuccessfully completed. Where the disc ends up is irrelevant.

The parallel to this is the WFDF rule for completing mandatories in Discathon. Once the disc has passed the plane(s), the runner has successfully completed the single or double mando. Here is the WFDF reference. They even have diagrams:
www.wfdf.org/index.php?page=rules/art5.htm#503.07 (http://www.wfdf.org/index.php?page=rules/art5.htm#503.07)

Hey Chuck - I am not sure that I am "interpreting" anything. The mandatory rule as written is pretty straight forward. It is not always fair or intuitive, but it is easy to apply.

I read the WFDF Discathon rule. I agree that it is more intuitive in most situations, but I can see some problems for disc golf.

Take care,
Harold

The disc golf rule can be interpreted like the WFDf rule, but the RC doesn't seem to read it that way. The rule specifies "a" set of conditions where the mando is completed but doesn't specify it is the "only" way. By not specifying that it's the "only" set of conditions, allows the interpretation that just crossing the correct line as writen elsewhere in the rule is also sufficient to complete it. A logician would be able to explain the need for the word "only" to be included in the wording to specifically limit the completion to exactly the only set of conditions that must be met for completion.

I only got a B in the class but I at least completed it. I could have gotten an A but it still wouldn't have been the "only" way I could have completed it. I could also have completed it with a grade of C. In each of these cases, I would have completed the logic class, because there wasn't "only" one way specified for me to pass it.

Hey Chuck, strangely, I am struck in a manner that would have been appropriate had you said, "Do the chickens have large talons?"

Napoleon Stan-o-mite!

The course was playing hard today. headwinds on 9, 10, 11, 12. They were playing quite hard.

I got distance markers (minis) in the ground along the ropes at 400, 300, and 200 ft on these 4 holes. It should make it a lot easier to read your distance.

There were some rumblers rolling through today, so at least a little rain fell today. Supposed to be some more the next two days, so let's all do the rain dance. Trust me, dry greens equal BIG SKIPS.

isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.



oh contraire mr. rhett....

everyone reads them...they just don't comprehend them :D

In the first place, it's au contraire; in the second place, the correct abbreviation for monsieur is "M.", not "Mr"; and in the third place, the reason that nobody comprehends your posts is that they're incomprehensible gibberish. :p

(CNN) -- Tropical Storm Tammy came ashore just south of the Georgia-Florida border Wednesday evening, hours after popping up off Florida's northeast coast, the National Hurricane Center said.

Packing sustained winds of near 50 mph (80 kph) with higher gusts, the storm was expected to move inland into southeastern Georgia, forecasters said.

Forecasters said it could bring 3 to 5 inches (8 to 13 centimeters) of rain to parts of Georgia and the Carolinas, with isolated amounts of up to 10 inches.

That'll be all gone and fogotten by then. It will just make the grass green and the pond wet.

Hey Chcuk - I am not seeing the section in the rule where simply crossing the correct line is sufficient to complete it.

Tajke care,
Harold

803.11C has two sentences. The first one states one combination of events that defines completing the mando but since it does not specify it's the "only" combination, it allows others. The second sentence can be construed as another condition that successfully completes the mando. The fact that the second sentence would really be all that's needed (since the first sentence would be a subset of conditions more broadly covered by sentence 2), does not negate it from a logic standpoint. It just means fewer words would be required to write this rule in the future.

My opinion is that paragraph C is ambiguous as is the flexible fence o.b. line situation. The best thing is to get a clear ruling from the TD in advance on those things and then just play it that way, like Rhett suggests.

Sometimes court rules, uniform codes and some states' statutes will have official commentaries. Some of our rules could really use something like that. 90% [fn. 1] of the players will never read a rules book, so making it a little longer with a few diagrams and examples would not make it any more burdensome for most players.

If the rules committee had thought of the disc curling back scenario, and they wanted a consistant application of the rule, it would have been easy to address that situation. The fact that they did not means that they had no official intent regarding that rule at the time they wrote it, and that a TD now could properly call it either way.

[fn. 1: 90% is just a number wildly thrown out there and is not based on scientific research methadologies. :D]

The first sentence in 803.11C defines how a mandatory is "considered to have (been) passed." The throw must meet a set of three conditions.

The second sentence states how the mandatory is to be treated once the set of conditions in the first sentence have been met. In other words, you can't ignore the mandatory for the rest of the hole until the conditions in sentence one have been met.

Since the second sentence is not a definition of the passage of the mandatory, only a direction on how to proceed, it cannot be treated as an alternate condition of passage.


C.A throw is considered to have passed the mandatory if it passes the correct side of the mandatory, crosses the mandatory line from the direction of the tee, and comes to rest lying completely beyond that line. Once the mandatory has been passed on the correct side, the mandatory is to be ignored for the remainder of play on that hole.

The Homie course has a mando where some [I'm a potty-mouth!] cut down a tree to make a hole easier. It would be possible to pass that mando correctly, hit a tree, and ricochet back to the unpassed side of the mando line there.

Maybe I should flummox Brian Cummings by asking for an official interpretation of that rule during the players' meeting! :D

sorry. maybe the administrator will remove this quadruple post. Everything froze up last night and I hit post more than once trying to get it to post.

sorry, triple post.

sorry. double post.

There, the intent of the mando, regardless of the intent of the rule, is that you should not be allowed to cut off the corner of the dogleg with a top shelf shot. Most of the time the purpose of the mandos I've seen is for safety or to keep the players out of certain parts of the park or to preserve the intended design of the hole by lessening the trampling of the schule. In those situations the purpose of the mando suggests that you should have to pass it on the correct side any time you are throwing from the unpassed side, even if you passed it once already.

When a mando is there mainly to force a skill, create a cognitive moment or just amuse the tournament staff, like the Clown's Mouth, a TD could say, "The moment you passed it on the correct side, after that you can ignore it for the rest of the hole," and his ruling would be based on the language of the rule. If the second sentence of C said, "Once the mando has been completed ..." it would be harder to find any ambiguity. Then I could not find any ambiguity unless someone was paying me! :D

Wanna say that just ONE more time, Bruce? :D:D:D

The only mando I know of @ Cedar Lake is on hole 8 (or something like that). It is a long-ish dogleg to the right. The "back door" has always been there, but if you don't have a 400'+ hyzer, you're going to land in the nastiest schule ever. THICK waist high thorns and poison ivy! A safety issue for all concerned.
Last year, I passed the mando and got kicked back on the right side (the mando is on the left side of the tree). I then threw a thumber over the schule to the fairway as I had already passed the mando.
There was a hole where someone had cut down a tree. No offense to the designers, but all the cutter did was take stupid flukieness out.

Do I need to post this three times?

Do I need to post this three times?



You could. This thread hasn't talked about the USDGC for a few hours. No sense in changing that. :)

Hey Chcuk - I am not seeing the section in the rule where simply crossing the correct line is sufficient to complete it.

Tajke care,
Harold



i've flustered harold so much with inside and outside ob's that he's pounding on the keys and mispelling chuck's name and take in his posts :D:D

isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.



oh contraire mr. rhett....

everyone reads them...they just don't comprehend them :D

In the first place, it's au contraire; <font color="blue"> correct </font> in the second place, the correct abbreviation for monsieur is "M.", not "Mr"; <font color="blue"> i always refer to him as mr. rhett or mr. stroh being an abbreviation for MISTER </font> and in the third place, the reason that nobody comprehends your posts is that they're incomprehensible gibberish. :p <font color="blue"> again,mr.felix you are correct! </font>



<font color="red"> and now back on topic: </font>


i wish i was playing in the usdgc :mad:

if only felix would sponsor me :eek: :D

Rain could not have come at a better time. Days before the Charlotte Open, and enough time before the USDGC to green it up but to not make it sloppy. We haven't had rain in 2 months or so. We should get 1-2 inches ending friday or saturday.

This may not be a big deal to you, but it means my photos will be much greener!

I hate to interrupt this rules thread, but I have a couple of questions about the USDGC.

1) When will Wednesday's pairings/tee times be announced?
2) When will Thursday's pairings/tee times be announced?

Wednesday's pairings are always announced at the Players meeting.
Thursday's should be available at the website and at the Wingate Inn Wednesday after rounds are over and all scoring has been tallied, confirmed, and all that.

I have never been down to the USDGC but would love to make it down for some spectating. Question: If I decide to drive down spur of the moment do you think I would be able to find a motel room, and where would be a good place/area to stay?
Thanks.

Thanks. Two more questions... Are players shuffled into groups according to scores after Wednesday's rounds or are the groups on Thursday randomly selected? If Players are shuffled according to score after Wednesday's round, does the group with the worst scores tee off first Thursday morning?

Accommodations for USDGC (http://www.usdgc.com/accommodations.htm)

Thanks. Two more questions... Are players shuffled into groups according to scores after Wednesday's rounds or are the groups on Thursday randomly selected? If Players are shuffled according to score after Wednesday's round, does the group with the worst scores tee off first Thursday morning?

By score, and the worst scores tee off first on Thursday.

Players are grouped according to score. This is so Harold has his afternoons off. :D

Actually, Harold has been whooping up on everyone else here at the factory this year. He's playing some solid golf these days.

Actually, Harold has been whooping up on everyone else here at the factory this year. He's playing some solid golf these days.



nice recovery.

Thanks. Another coupla questions. When, approximately are the first and last tee times? How long do the rounds usually take?

usually around 7:20 and 2:45. Rounds are probbaly 4 - 4.5 hours

7:30ish for the first. Last year the last was at about 2:40pm.

180 players, 4 per card, is 45 tee times. at 6 per hour, that's
8:20 - 6th
10:20 - 18th
12:20 - 30th
2:20 - 42nd
2:50 - 45th

Hope that helps.

Great clarification MaTThew

I hope I get paired with Schweb the first round so that he has to deal with "The Rhett Factor". :)

Normally I'd say something like "I'll meet you on the lead card".... :) ....but I'm thinking an 8:30 tee-time would be pretty good for me.

HAs anybody else seen the printable caddie book made for USDGC on the Website... Really Cool I wish Every Big Tourney had these to look at.. Good Job!!!!

ce

I hope I get paired with Schweb the first round so that he has to deal with "The Rhett Factor". :)

Normally I'd say something like "I'll meet you on the lead card".... :) ....but I'm thinking an 8:30 tee-time would be pretty good for me.

That would be cool...could possibly the highest rated Poster Group of all time.

HAs anybody else seen the printable caddie book made for USDGC on the Website... Really Cool I wish Every Big Tourney had these to look at.. Good Job!!!!

ce

Golden State Classic does a very nice job with a Caddy book as well.

Mad Props on the Caddy Book Matt!

I hope I get paired with Schweb the first round so that he has to deal with "The Rhett Factor". :)

Normally I'd say something like "I'll meet you on the lead card".... :) ....but I'm thinking an 8:30 tee-time would be pretty good for me.

That would be cool...could possibly the highest rated Poster Group of all time.



Maybe MTL will qualify on Monday and get stuck in your group!

That caddy book is cool, but...
Just a suggestion, instead of distances to obstacles, what about circles coming backwards from the basket? Like, you are 50' away here, 100' away here, like that?
Am Nationals had different colored reflectors at 100', 200', 300' and on both sides of the fairway. Saved me once or twice.
Either way it looks great. Nice job.

Tafe,
We've also got markers on the ropes for distances of 400, 300, 200 on holes 9-12, which are the holes without a lot of obstacles or terrain that allows you to read the distance as easily.

[QUOTE]
isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.



oh contraire mr. rhett....

everyone reads them...they just don't comprehend them :D

In the first place, it's au contraire; <font color="blue"> correct </font> in the second place, the correct abbreviation for monsieur is "M.", not "Mr"; <font color="blue"> i always refer to him as mr. rhett or mr. stroh being an abbreviation for MISTER </font>

Then you should have indicated that by separating the au contraire from the "Mr." either by separating the phrases with a comma or by italicizing the au contraire, since the absence of a visual clue to mark the change from French to English implies that the entire phrase is to be construed as a single, unilingual locution. By failing to do so, you rendered what might otherwise have been an intelligent post into incomprehensible gibberish. :p


if only felix would sponsor me :eek: :D

The $2 sponsorship I promised you two years ago is available (plus interest AND the $2 Russell owes me, mind you) any time you want to claim it. You can claim your $4.24 at any time by forking over the collared shirt and five CE Rhynos, as promised, and bending over and grab your ankles so I can deliver the two swift kicks you've got coming. :p

i have never been more pleased to see the phrase, "two swift kicks", in my life....WOW!!!!

Felix don't play.

[QUOTE]
isn't that what i said 3 posts ago???


Nobody reads your posts, Keith.



oh contraire mr. rhett....

everyone reads them...they just don't comprehend them :D

In the first place, it's au contraire; <font color="blue"> correct </font> in the second place, the correct abbreviation for monsieur is "M.", not "Mr"; <font color="blue"> i always refer to him as mr. rhett or mr. stroh being an abbreviation for MISTER </font>

Then you should have indicated that by separating the au contraire from the "Mr." either by separating the phrases with a comma or by italicizing the au contraire, since the absence of a visual clue to mark the change from French to English implies that the entire phrase is to be construed as a single, unilingual locution. By failing to do so, you rendered what might otherwise have been an intelligent post into incomprehensible gibberish. :p


if only felix would sponsor me :eek: :D

The $2 sponsorship I promised you two years ago is available (plus interest AND the $2 Russell owes me, mind you) any time you want to claim it. You can claim your $4.24 at any time by forking over the collared shirt and five CE Rhynos, as promised, and bending over and grab your ankles so I can deliver the two swift kicks you've got coming. :p



:eek: :D

Registration is currently at 191 players, which does include the five monday qualifiers.

191 players = 48 groups = 8 hours of tee times

First tee will be at 7:30am and the last group will tee off at 3:20pm, for the first three rounds.

There will be a cut following the third round with 150 players advancing to play the final round on Saturday.

First tee on saturday morning will be at 8:00am with the leaders teeing off at 2:10pm.

So Wingate is full Thur-Sat.
Anyone looking to share the room they've got?

http://wwc.weatherbug.com/images/bugtoday/tammy_rains.gif

Oh yeah. 2-4 inches of rain will help the course out a LOT!

I imagine tee times will be 9 minutes apart this year. to make sure groups finish in time. Not positive, but it would cut 48 minutes from that last tee time, making it about 2:30 for last tee.

From running Brin's numbers, it may need to be 9 minutes.

Wow, 191 players! That's 2% of the current PDGA members!

Felix Sung, message board HoFer.

Am Nationals had different colored reflectors at 100', 200', 300' and on both sides of the fairway. Saved me once or twice.



In ball golf, the markers are typically at 100,150, and 200 yards.

I don't know about you, but a distance marker at 100 feet seems really unnecessary, imo. I think distance markers at 200,300 and 400 feet would be prudent. Indeed, that's what Matt indicated they would be at.

I'm looking at the caddy guide, and I don't really understand hole 13. It looks like you have to throw about 350 feet to a 20 foot wide landing zone with OB on both sides, or else end up in the middle of a big pack of trees.

Is there no safe way to play this hole? Or are you forced to just "chuck and pray"?

It's about 60 feet wide (at the widest point). as a righty, you'd throw a stable hyzer over the road, hyzer back in bounds, but hopefully not get that big skip and go across the sidewalk. I've seen people skip just inbounds on one side and the next place the disc touched was on the sidewalk, nasty skips. Just don't flip your shot over or you get to walk about 6 steps and throw your THIRD shot.

Or you could throw a nice big anhyzer through a small gap that us lefties have to throw through. This, I think, is a great shot for a righty, it means their disc will be flying in to the fairway on the curve of the fairway, not across it. You can get some massive distance taking the anhyzer route on this hole, but it will only net you an extra 40-50 feet over a well placed hyzer shot.

That line of trees is well groomed, the trunks offer a variety of gaps between 35-80 feet (you throw down the road, mainly). Basically, you don't want to throw too high or too low, trouble awaits from either direction.

Taking the anhyzer route, you can turn a shot over too much and risk a roll out of bounds, but at least you are rolling forward. If you turn the disc too much, it'll probably hit those trees and drop.


As a lefty, I will 9 out of 10 times throw a high hyzer over the left gap, looking for the skip to add a little yardage at the end.

I threw a big turnover with my CFR wraith yesterday, outside the parking lot trees, it found a gap and nestled next to the last tree in the fairway that is marked on the caddy guide.

i would pray then chuck. then pray again.

sorry, i have no useful insight into Hole 13. back to my CBT on network topology...

wait, is that the hole Al Schack took a quadruple circle 12 on in 2001? that was right after a miraculous double circle 5 (on par 5 12). if he got a 12, i can only imagine what i'd get. *Homeresque shudder*

First, I know Mr. Duvall believes in the power of prayer, so if that is the only strategy, I'm sure it is the intended strategy.

I thought I had heard people talking about this hole saying basically you have to throw o.b. and hyzer back i.b. What is the rule on o.b. on that hole? I did not see it in the caddy book. Re-tee? Last in bounds? Your choice?

The caddy book is right here: http://www.usdgc.com/caddybookweb.pdf but it is a big file and takes a minute to load with cable.

I'd be happy to try and go two-fiddy, two-fiddy, two-fiddy, buck-n-a-quarter, putt and leave the hero-OBs to the big arms. But it looks like 250 off the tee doesn't leave you anywhere decent at all.

Oh well. I'm glad I'm getting there early enough to play it a couple of times first. :)

I optimized the caddy book down to 3 mb, so it should only take 34 seconds now, bruce.

Hole 13 is last in-bounds or over in-bounds.

I'd be happy to try and go two-fiddy, two-fiddy, two-fiddy, buck-n-a-quarter, putt and leave the hero-OBs to the big arms. But it looks like 250 off the tee doesn't leave you anywhere decent at all.

Oh well. I'm glad I'm getting there early enough to play it a couple of times first. :)



C'mon don't be skeered pull out your big arm and GO BIG!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

C'mon don't be skeered pull out your big arm and GO BIG!!! /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif


If it was more than 20 feet wide I would! :D

BIG HYZER we do it all the time in Tejas. :D

When I throw a spike hyzer that won't skip, I'm lucky to get two-fiddy. :)

Maybe a forehand roller down the road with a gummy Valk....

We have a hole like that at Bass 630' with a 35ft fairway in dry conditions when it gets wet it shrinks to 20' with road on the left and water on the right. /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

it's not 20 feet wide. that's twice as wide as the TRIPLE MANDO. This fairway is at least, ohhhh, three times as wide.

Seriously, it's probably 40 feet wide at the narrowest point, which is like 200 feet from the teepad and in. from there it averages about 50-60 wide the rest of the way, maybe more, never thought to measure the width of the fairway.

If it were 20 feet wide it would be 45 times longer than it is wide, that would be, as Mike Tyson would say... Woodikwiss!

44.4 times.

At 50 it's only 17.76 times longer than it is wide. Much better. :)

The caddy book makes those trees look pretty tight, but I guess they really aren't that bad at all.

Thanks for all the info.

It's just disc golf, Rhett. Relax, have fun, and the total asterisk-kicking you are about to receive will go a lot easier.

Man oh man are you guys lucky! Good luck men! I saw this course last year and have envious thoughts. Then the thoughts turn to the wind on one of the days last year. 35-40mph I bet. Scary stuff!

Hole 13 isnt as bad as the caddy guide makes it seem. Dont get me wrong, it is in no way easy, but it isnt quite as bad to try to navigate as it seems. I have only been playing 3 yrs. or so, and absolutely love Winthrop Gold...and have played it many times...and have only landed OB on 13 twice really. If your going RIGHT, and let it fly out over the Parking Lot maybe 10-15 ft. from the curb, your good.....most times....of course i have seen many BIG ARM guys go much wider and higher an get tons farther, but with the new pavement and natural curve, most shots that hit in the asphalt, will skip up and in bounds. BUT like has been said before, if it goes out and stays out, your throwing the 3rd shot from maybe 6-10 ft. off the tee pad, since you have to cross over early.

I have never actually tried down the left, thought about it many times, but havent tried it out...but there is a lot more room to go that way and come back in bounds if you make the disc come back for you. As for the trees, there is a good bit of room to the left of the trees of course, and moderate gaps between trees themselves...it is the shots near the end of the main stretch that can be tricky now with the new basket placement, especailly if your on the front side of the "ditch/Hill" near the end. But atleast your not crossing over the entire OB parking area this year from the bottom of a low area.
ALL in ALL it is a fun hole, and seems scarier on paper than in person...now that i say that, i am sure to throw one OB when i play it next.
Probably Monday at open Qualifiers, not expecting to make it in of course, i just love Winthrop Gold and the chance to play anytime i can...so i will look at it as a DONATION to the USDGC / PDGA on my part, and in return i get to throw some plastic instead of go to work. :)

Good luck to everyone.

Thanks Fallguy! Good luck on Monday and I hope you stay in bounds on 13!
Just a couple of days left. BooYah! Anyone local know what the wind will be doing next week? ;)

is there anywhere on here with guesses who will win this year?

I know an Okie showing up to qualify...he's a current world champ.

Question: Last weekend I was chatting with a player at Twisted Acres on OKC about throwing OB. The way I understand it is, if you throw OB you can pick 1 of 2 options...You can choose to re-tee -OR- take the shot from the line of flight it went out placing your mini 1 meter from there. At USDGC, Can you opt to re-tee whenever you want after throwing OB??

Thx,
mc

is there anywhere on here with guesses who will win this year?



Climo is money.

I know an Okie showing up to qualify...he's a current world champ.



Mitch Mc ought to tear it up!

I didn't know MIGHTY MITCH was gonna be there??

I didn't know MIGHTY MITCH was gonna be there??


Who are you talking about? I just figured that's who you were referring to.
My bad? :o:D

Mr. Hatfield.

Mr. Hatfield.



Mr. Hatfield is a NO SHOW!!!! :(

Travis, read a few posts up before you post...he is showing up, TO QUALIFY.

You might not know this but there are 5 qualifying spots available :confused:

Mr. Hatfield.


Oh, THAT World Champion. :D

i think it will be Schweberger!

Monday qualifier.

I will be there bright and early at 7:30 to start taking the first last chance qualifiers.

And no one is a shoe in for the last 5 spots. I've heard of folks from as far away as California flying in just to try and qualify. Lot of big names still left out there showing interest. This should be the biggest turnout yet for the last 5 spots. Kinda fitting seeing as this is the biggest USDGC so far.

2 years ago when they started this the 5 folks who got in all cashed with Mike Randolph taking a top 10 spot.
Last years hero was Michael Johansen tying for 6th after getting in on Monday.

Who's it going to be this year?

Wow, qualifying sounds tuff...glad I got in when I did!!

Monday qualifier.

I will be there bright and early at 7:30 to start taking the first last chance qualifiers.



UGH! Are they going to be clogging up the course on Monday with this last minute qualifier? :( I hope they are playing somewhere else as I am getting into town on Sunday specifically to practice the course on Monday.

If they are going to be clogging the course, can a registered USDGC competitor enter this shindig? Is it 2 rounds?

Maybe I should go check out the USDGC website. :)

Travis, read a few posts up before you post...he is showing up, TO QUALIFY.

You might not know this but there are 5 qualifying spots available :confused:



hes already qualified though

Yeah, but he missed his window to register...you only have 30 days to register AFTER you qualify.

i thought if you had qualified then you couldnt have another chance at qualifying

If you don't register within 30 days I'm pretty sure you have to qualify again.

what im saying is, that if you have already qualified, then that exculdes you from qualifying anymore, even if you havent payed the entry in the 30 days. only what i heard.

Thats kind of harsh isn't it??

It's hard enough just to qualify...so if you do qualify and don't send in your registration and entry fee withing the 30 days you are S.O.L.??

I'm sure someone can clarify...cuz if that's the case there is no point in a qualified player going to Monday qualifiers.

what im saying is, that if you have already qualified, then that exculdes you from qualifying anymore, even if you havent payed the entry in the 30 days. only what i heard.



Can Keith, Chuck, Matt or someone else answer this question??

He better get going :D
Any player missing their deadline for entry automatically forfeits eligibility and may not re-qualify. Players missing a registration deadline will remain eligible for Monday Qualifying or special invitation, and can be chosen as a State or National Representative.
Click here for the full list of qualifying events

That should clear it up. Any other questions can be found on the site. See everyone Monday ;)

Cool, I was getting ready to call Coda and tell him...but if that's the case he will probably have to qualify on Monday.

what im saying is, that if you have already qualified, then that exculdes you from qualifying anymore, even if you havent payed the entry in the 30 days. only what i heard.



Can Keith, Chuck, Matt or someone else answer this question??



I am not Keith, Chuck or Matt but I found this on the USDGC site under Qualifying Procedures of all places...

"Players earning eligibility at USDGC Regional Qualifiers have 30 days to submit an application for entry along with full payment to guarantee their spot in the field. This time period begins immediately following the completion of each respective event.

Any player missing their deadline for entry automatically forfeits eligibility and may not re-qualify. Players missing a registration deadline will remain eligible for Monday Qualifying or special invitation, and can be chosen as a State or National Representative."

Thank you Si, I somehow missed that on the USDGC website.

Well I Hope he does Come and he qualifies, He deserves to be there. It really sucks that he did not take advantage of his invite when he got it. The Last I heard from Boobs, Coda was he was not comeing. I don't believe he is in Charlotte this weekend with Mckoy or Alexis.

Yes I do know about the Monday Qualifier cause i am donating to it :o

Rhett the course will be open on Monday to those already qualified. You do not have to pay or have tee times.

The way qualifying works. There are not set tee times. Once a group of 3 or more players can be formed then they will go off starting at hole 1. Next group goes off once another batch of 3 or more is formed. This may be in 10 minutes or a half hour.

Qualified players may tee off at any time including going off with a group trying to qualify. There is a mutual respect thing when on the course. Those trying to qualify will try not to interfere with those already qualified and wanting to practice. At the same time those already qualified show the same respect in not tying up a hole throwing thier entire bag when a group trying to qualify is coming through. If this is the case let the group play through and then continue your practice.

Special cases have been made in the past when only 2 are ready to qualify and no 3rd can be imediatley found. At this time we determine if one already qualified can go off as the 3rd in the group.

This also arises when one of the group decides to forfeit thier round, come back to hole 1 and retry. You may try as much and often as you like. $50 for the 1st go at it, $25 for each additional round. Your lowest score is what is kept. Ex. Sam Nicholson took a 5 on hole 1 last year, turned around went back to the teepad and repaid and started over. His second round got him in.

Another example of Monday qualifiers. Former world adv. champ Tony Wilson played 2 1/2 rounds. Went back to the motel to reat. His dad called every half hour to make sure his score was holding up. When he was on the bubble he came back and tried again and got in.

Monday could get very interesting, If all those great golfers show up we could see a playoff just to get in to the tourney,

There are only Five Spots open, if there is a tie for the fifth spot there will be a playoff.

Does it get any better than this?

I am picking SCHWEB to TAKE IT.

Boobs is staying with me. No Coda.

Rick, one thing I wasn't sure you thought of...

What if a group of three qualifiers goes off, and one of them gives up and decides to restart. What checks and balances are there for those other 2 players who are now out on the course qualifying with only a single player to keep them in check, and they may be buddies?

Just something to consider.

Rick how in gods name do you have time to be on the puter right now.

Thanks for the info. :)

I was hoping it wasn't something like a 2-round one-day tourney.

Matt that has come up and we have dealt with each situation on an individual basis. There have been times when a qualified player has joined the group. Or Warren, myself or one of the other staff on hand will finish with the group to keep them honest. Or a trusted spectator following the group will watch over them. In the first 2 years there has never been a problem or indication of any cheating. When these situations arise we'll look at it and make the call.

Travis this is the beauty of preplanning. Most everything is done except small details and we'll deal with those at 3:30 when Warren and I get together.

Rhett hope that helped. You have nothing to worry about as far as practice goes and you will be simply amazed at the way you're treated as a competitor even before the rounds start. You are in for a true treat next week.

I can hardly wait! :)

Rhett... you will be simply amazed at the way you're treated as a competitor even before the rounds start. You are in for a true treat next week.



I second those sentiments.
You will leave with memories that will last a lifetime.
I will never forget the emotions welling up inside of me as I finished my final round.
That last walk up that 18th fairway is something else.
Have a great time!!! :D

Question: Last weekend I was chatting with a player at Twisted Acres on OKC about throwing OB. The way I understand it is, if you throw OB you can pick 1 of 2 options...You can choose to re-tee -OR- take the shot from the line of flight it went out placing your mini 1 meter from there. At USDGC, Can you opt to re-tee whenever you want after throwing OB??

Not necessarily: the TD may limit your options as a special condition, as on #s 4 and 17.

Note that if the TD does not limit your options, you actually have three options, not two: the previous lie, where last in bounds (with 1m relief), the designated drop zone. (Note that the presence of a drop zone does not necessairly limit your options: on hole 4, for example, the caddy book specifically mandates throwing from the drop zone for throws in that come to rest in the OB "pond"; it does not specifically mandate throwing from the drop zone on throws that come to rest OB on the left short of the "pond."

Will they have the Pumpkin Discs for sale at the pro shop?

Travis this is the beauty of preplanning. Most everything is done except small details and we'll deal with those at 3:30 when Warren and I get together.

Rhett hope that helped. You have nothing to worry about as far as practice goes and you will be simply amazed at the way you're treated as a competitor even before the rounds start. You are in for a true treat next week.




mmmm Pre-Planning a word everyone should know but doesn't.


Rhett,

Rick is right on. From the time you see the Rock Hill " Home of the United Disc Golf Championship" State maintained sign to the Basket at the entrance to Hooters(i go for the wings only /msgboard/images/graemlins/smirk.gif) to the players parking to the Wingate Inn staff. Oh god i gotta stop I could go on until the finals.

I didnt see any when I was there last year. But I bet the Mace Bros can take care of you no matter the request on plastic. They were both very curtious and helpful.

Darn, I wish I was going!

Hi Harold,

Sorry to bother you but I'm trying to understand the flow of play based on the information provided in the Caddy Book, and there are a couple of possible scenarios where the flow of play isn't entirely clear to me.

For hole #4, the instructions are:
Street and beyond out-of-bounds. Roped area on the left out-of-bounds. Fenced maintenance area out-of-bounds. Roped "pond" near green out-of-bounds. To speed play, subsequent throw after OB in the "pond" is from drop zone. Mandatory left near tee. Drop zone for mandatory is the tee pad. [emphasis original]



If I'm am interpreting this correctly, I would presume that the drop zone option is not available to players who throw OB into areas other than the OB "pond." Is that the case, or may anyone who throws OB elsewhere on the hole elect to throw from the drop zone?

Also, from the diagram in the caddy book, it appears that a throw made from the "green" side of the pond could conceivably wind up in the OB pond.

For hole 17, the instructions specify that once one's disc has come to rest inside the hay bales, normal OB rules apply, so that if one's approach were to end up OB, one is not required to return to the drop zone and negotiate the OB again. On hole 4, however, the instructions simply state that the subsequent throw after an OB in the "pond" is from the drop zone. If, owing to a freak wind or a crazy roll, a player's putt were to end up in the OB pond, is the player be required to make his/her subsequent throw from the drop zone as well?

Thanks for your reply.

I will never forget the emotions welling up inside of me as I finished my final round.


I'll never forget those emotions either as I was walking up hole18, take a 5, and miss the cut by 1. :(

Now I have to worry about beating "ol man am-bagger" Rhett.....S**T! :D

Now I have to worry about beating "ol man am-bagger" Rhett.....S**T! :D


That's right! :cool:

Hey Felix -

Your first presumption is correct. That drop zone is only for shots that go into the OB "pond" near the green. Shots from the green side that end up in this pond also go to the drop zone. We have, however, put a semi circle of pavers on the lower side of the green to reduce the chance of a putt rolling into this pond.

Take care,
Harold

Will they have the Pumpkin Discs for sale at the pro shop?



When I went to pick up my tournament discs on Weds. Ed was stamping the pumkin discs. If for some odd reason the Pro shop doesn't have them either Mace or myself should be able to get some for you. Another beautiful thing about Rock Hill. Winthrop Gold and Innova close by. It's Disc Golf heaven.

Being treated well at the USDGC. I was helping with registrations last year before the tournament. A gentleman from Kentucky came to sign in and after talking to him for a few minutes he told me. This is by far the greatest tournament I've ever had the privelage of attending. I have been treated like a true professional by everyone so far and am completely amazed at the way they take care of us. And it's only Tuesday!

A few others have mentioned the final walk up 18. Wait til you stand on 1's teepad for the first time and Andy calls off your name and where you're from. Then those gathered applaud you. Spectators and fellow competitors alike. And that feeling is carried over on every hole.

This is my perspective and I've never played in the event. It's also the reason I take a week off from work every year to volunteer, vend and just be a part of it.

Heres my top ten predictions (in no order)

Climo
Schultz
Lundmark
L. Leonard
Haney
Schweb
Jernigan
Bubis
Mccray
Brinster
Arthur

One interesting Note: Six players out of the USDGC top ten played the C. Open the week before Last year. All finished in the top 11 of that tourney.

You seem to have left off Mitch Sonderfan...
Oh wait, your list doesn't go down to 145. :-D

You seem to have left off Mitch Sonderfan...
Oh wait, your list doesn't go down to 145. :-D



Well i thought you were pulling a Hysell!!

Heres my top ten predictions (in no order)

Climo
Schultz
Lundmark
L. Leonard
Haney
Schweb
Jernigan
Bubis
Mccray
Brinster
Arthur

One interesting Note: Six players out of the USDGC top ten played the C. Open the week before Last year. All finished in the top 11 of that tourney.



Looks like an "objective" opinion of predictions...most those guys are east coasters.

You also left out young Matto and ET who has been there for close to 10 days getting ready. Oh yeah I will also crack the top 10! 110 :cool:

Top 145? You WISH! :D

Matt's (http://www.sharkysshots.com/albums/userpics/10002/worlds0022.jpg) lurking! ;)

Heres my top ten predictions (in no order)

Climo
Schultz
Lundmark
L. Leonard
Haney
Schweb
Jernigan
Bubis
Mccray
Brinster
Arthur

One interesting Note: Six players out of the USDGC top ten played the C. Open the week before Last year. All finished in the top 11 of that tourney.



Looks like an "objective" opinion of predictions...most those guys are east coasters.



Actually I looked at how people played last year, how people are playing right now, looked at some trends, etc and yes some of it was based on who i would like to see win.

Here are some more.

A monday qualifier will finish top twenty.

Most first timers will struggle.

888 will destroy peoples confidence.

If there is a Ping Pong tourney Pete May will destroy all that try to beat him.

I'm leaving at 9:30 tomorrow morning. See y'all there! :)

Heres my top ten predictions (in no order)

Climo
Schultz
Lundmark
L. Leonard
Haney
Schweb
Jernigan
Bubis
Mccray
Brinster
Arthur

One interesting Note: Six players out of the USDGC top ten played the C. Open the week before Last year. All finished in the top 11 of that tourney.



No Feldberg? He's playing well lately. I think he'll make the top 10.

I think Mike Olse from Austin has a good chance of making that top 10 list as well.

JJ injured his back a month or so ago and he still is struggling with it.

Feldburg most def top twenty. Nice guy too, Met him for the first time at dogwood and within 5min he offered me and JJ a place to stay if we could Make the Beaver fling

JJ injured his back a month or so ago and he still is struggling with it.



He back is better, besides I am carrying His bag all week.

You can't leave out Chris Sprague from Iowa. He's been playing tough all year. I think he tied for 7th last year. he will be in the top 10 for sure.

It is going to be rather hard (IMO) to pick favorites with OVER 62......1000 rated players.......looks like a very possible TIGHT field here..oh yeah by the way tis raining hear this morning. Come on TK, good luck qualifying this morning. GO MARYLAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D:D:D

That's OK TK is a mudder anyway :DGo Maryland, good luck Craig, a top ten pick for sure! (No pressure :D)

OVER 62......1000 rated players.......



More than half of all players (114) over 999 in the world.

Can't believe you left Mike Johanson off of that list. Apparently you are not from around here. Check out the Charlotte Open scores (this year and all others), and last years USDGC. Definately top 10, top 5 for sure if I was betting. Did I mention he is local.

I agree with Mike Jo....what about the reigning worlds champ, that Nathan Doss fella? Got to give him a vote for top 10 with his worlds perfomance.

Peace

Has anyone heard any qualifying scores yet???

I shot a 66 today!!!!!!!!!

Chris, Are you in Rock Hill? Trying to get in? Good luck to you if so!

This is probably a stupid question, but does the course change at all this week or is it the same pads and cans through out? 66 - nice shotin', who did you play with and how did they shot?

The course does NOT change......only the weather changes.