Ask Dave Dunipace About Innova Discs

[rangel]

Yes, I believe the more you handle the Star plastic, the grippier it gets. If you have very dry hands, you might need a stunt stand in with clammy hands to handle your plastic for you.

Ain't no clammy nothin gettin a hold of my plastic

AviarX. My SOLF and my SJLS are both yellow and my SOLS is white. To me, the grippiness is very much the same and definately to my liking. At the store, all of the SMSs had the same feel. I think there was red, yellow, white, and blue (maybe).

I decided to take my SMS to the office this week. Try and break it in much like a baseball player breaks in a glove or a new game ball. Can't hurt. Besides, nobody in my office understands disc golf anyway.

[gnduke]

I must have one of the other Vikings, I use mine for long slight turnover shots. Nose down there is very little fade back.

[rob10657]

Another vote for simple stamps. Of the 2006 rocs, i prefer the star baby rocs for there stability. I also got a 2007 spectator roc that has a swirl of 2 different colors, thats pretty cool to.

[Edfredo]

Thanks for asking our opinion on the rocs. So here is mine, I love the Ontario Mold so anything in that mold will make me happy. I have some SB Orcs from Am Worlds that are somewhat see through that I love to death. If you could that going in an Ontario mold I would be in Roc Heaven Also LOVE the idea of the money in the mold. I know it would be hard to do but what a GREAT Disc, sparkles would be pretty sweet too. Something with a simple stamp and sparkles would be nice. My opinions, thanks
Scott

[davei]

The feedback on the 2007 Rocs is very useful. Please keep it coming.

[DSproAVIAR]

Ok then, how about running USDGC fundraiser DX Ontarios? Or the Ontario configuration, at least. Or just call it the Roc-L or something like that. I'm sure you could get $20 for those.

[c_trotter]

Ok then, how about running USDGC fundraiser DX Ontarios? Or the Ontario configuration, at least. Or just call it the Roc-L or something like that. I'm sure you could get $20 for those.

Good idea. I would love me some NEW dx Ontarios!!!

[EricJKopit]

Ontario mold Roc in Glow Champion could be interesting...

Bottom stamp Big Bird?

[crotts]

a bottom stamped champion/star roc would be awesome. i love the 05 SB Rocs. the ontario mold is awesome. the 06 SB Ontarios i didn't like as much because they are not stiff. Ontario's should be stiff plastic. if you run the Ontario in Champion or Star i will buy several, even more if they are stiff.

just my $.02

: ) :

[flynvegas]

I also liked the '03 bird stamp. Much better than the Baby Roc.

Whamo did some sparkle Frisbee's back in the late 70's early 80's. I like that idea.

Swirl plastic is sweet. The CFR discs Mark has been selling recently have some great color mixing along the rim.

[poisonelf]

This looks like the Hammerhead, which was a more extreme version of the third generation Hammer. Or it might be the third generation Hammer. I don't remember any Hammer/Griffin mix. The Griffin was a small diameter, overstable, thick nosed disc that flew a bit like a Whippet. The Hammerhead was a roller. The third generation Hammer was large diameter and a little overstable.

I've been speaking to the guy who is trying to sell this disc on Ebay but he won't sell it without knowing what it is first (he doesn't want to tell someone the wrong thing). The rim on this is wider than any of the hammers I own (its between 1.7-1.9).

[sleepyEDB]

The Viking is in no danger of being dropped even though the sales are not strong. It is one of my favorites.

Well, I guess that answers my question!

Recently we ran a new run of Champion Vikings that, although they are the same as the ones I have been throwing, are different than what an associate had tried out. It could be that the relative unpopularity had to do with a poor batch of Vikings that was out there. When he was describing the Viking from his recollection, it was totally different than my experience. So, we went out and tested the new batch. He liked the new ones alot, and didn't like the old at all.

In light of this, I will be making a Star Viking in the more stable configuration, and we will continue with the new type Champion. I don't have a time frame for production yet unfortunately.

Some very good info in there. I will definitely try and get my hands on a new Champ Viking to put through the paces.

Thanks Dave!


sleepy

[davei]

I've been speaking to the guy who is trying to sell this disc on Ebay but he won't sell it without knowing what it is first (he doesn't want to tell someone the wrong thing). The rim on this is wider than any of the hammers I own (its between 1.7-1.9).

It sounds like the 3rd generatiion Hammer. Especially if it doesn't have the big bead on the bottom.

[yolatengo77]

I've bought a lot of the Rocs over the years (and especially last year), and I'd like to see a few things:

#1 Make fewer to keep demand/collectibility high. Knowing what I know now about demand for these discs I would have bought fewer last year had I known they wouldn't sell out. Collectibility = Good.

#2 I Like the simple designs, as cool as the bamboo hole is, I don't like the way it looks on a disc, looks hokey imo (fun to play though). The 2001 X-outs, 2002 Star, 2005 Small Stamp with Flags and Stars, and the 2006 Celtic are some of my favorites just because they're simple and clean.

#3 Publish the mold/materials used some place besides this thread. The engineer in me likes documentation and knowing exactly what I'm holding/collecting. This will also make them more collectible since it further differentiates the discs between different stamps.

#4 Use different materials. How about a SS/floppy Roc since some people putt with them, or maybe something very stiff? I'm sure you've got some plastic in the lab that would be fun in a limited run. I'd buy it!

Keep up the good work Dave, I love reading this thread every day, thank you for your time.

Jerry S.

[Furthur]

a bottom stamped champion/star roc would be awesome. i love the 05 SB Rocs. the ontario mold is awesome. the 06 SB Ontarios i didn't like as much because they are not stiff. Ontario's should be stiff plastic. if you run the Ontario in Champion or Star i will buy several, even more if they are stiff.

just my $.02

: ) :

Totally agree. I dug the stiffness of the 05, not the floppiness of the 06.

[schraj]

If I had to choose my what my roc would look like, my first suggestion would be a simple stamp. Some of my favorite stamps have been the mini-star like on the old glow rocs, and first run sidewinders, and the ring stamp on some champion gators, or possibly a RoR type stamp.

My second choice would be color mixes. I really dig the swirls in some of the new star plastic. I've also seen some champion plastic that i would describe as starburst colored, with a light color on the flight plate, and a darker color in the rim.

As far as the numbers produced, I don't mind the large volumes because I do buy some to throw, but I think it would be nice if there were a small run of one type/stamp and a larger run of a different type/stamp so both throwers and collectors would be happy.

[davei]

There will definitely be less USDGC Rocs offered this year.

[boredatwork]

I am pleasantly surprised that everyone else agrees that simple stamps are better!
My favorite rocs are moderately stiff (not super stiff) champion plastic with simple stamps and heavy weight.
The '05 flag stamps were rad. The celtic stamps were awesome too, just wish they came in champ plastic!

[rob10657]

The innova glow star stamp would be SWEEEET! They would need to work something in there to make them "USDGC" but that would be easy.

[omegaputt]

A bar stamp with USDGC in the middel

[ivjamesm]

I don't want to start rumors with my first post, but I have to ask since you appear to be the guy to ask. I have been told that the Champion Aviar is being discontinued. Is this so? If so all I can say is OH THE HUMANITY!

[shaolintrained]

Dave, I think that it is awesome that you're producing less Rocs this year. Also, I think a good idea would be diversity amongst the Rocs. Produce a simple roc, possibly in low numbers; a detailed stamp for the rest of us; a Roc dedicated to those who intend to throw them; and so on.
And I was wondering how you distributed the Signiture STAR Wraiths. Feldberg told me that he received a box of 25 of his own Wraiths, where did the rest go, and where can I find them now (besides ebay)?

[Greatzky2]

A very simple Anime style stamp would be sweet.
like adiscgolfer throwing or an anime version of the Roc stamp.

-Scott Lewis

[davei]

I don't want to start rumors with my first post, but I have to ask since you appear to be the guy to ask. I have been told that the Champion Aviar is being discontinued. Is this so? If so all I can say is OH THE HUMANITY!

Technically, yes, but we still have to make some for the Champion 3 Pack. Those will be in the high 60s to low 70s.

[davei]

Dave, I think that it is awesome that you're producing less Rocs this year. Also, I think a good idea would be diversity amongst the Rocs. Produce a simple roc, possibly in low numbers; a detailed stamp for the rest of us; a Roc dedicated to those who intend to throw them; and so on.
And I was wondering how you distributed the Signiture STAR Wraiths. Feldberg told me that he received a box of 25 of his own Wraiths, where did the rest go, and where can I find them now (besides ebay)?

All of the Champion Champions should have gotten 100 signiture discs.

[EricJKopit]

Dave, any thoughts on a Champion Goblin?

Here's where I'm at:
1. I love the Goblin. I use it mostly for approaches and very long putts. Also good as a wind putter. It's a super-accurate disc. For me, like a fast putter.
2. The star-stamped DX Goblins are the best because they have flatter tops (probably due to hot-stamp process), and are perfectly stable.
3. The domey Goblins (regular production stamp) are a bit more understable, when they get a little beat they are similar to an XD.
4. The Goblins beat fairly quickly (even without significant tree hits). The new DX plastic is decent (nice grip!), but since the Goblin is so perfectly stable to begin with, it tends to get understable fairly quickly compared to other, more overstable, approach discs.
5. The Goblin in Star plastic doesn't feel or fly great. Doesn't seem to have nearly as much glide, also these were very domey and kinda understable. This surprised me, because most other discs in Star are more overstable.
6. The Skeeter is too fast. More of a mid-range driver than a fast putter.
7. Classic Roc is a tad bit too overstable for similar usage. Also, I know a lot of player don't like that thick bead for a "touch" disc.

So, I (we?) need a stable Goblin, but with decent glide, in more durable plastic...Champion???

Dave, what are your thoughts on this? I'm not sure how well received the Goblin is. I know you are marketing this as a "beginner" disc, but a Champion version might have wider appeal?

Thanks,

-E

[davei]

Dave, any thoughts on a Champion Goblin?

Here's where I'm at:
1. I love the Goblin. I use it mostly for approaches and very long putts. Also good as a wind putter. It's a super-accurate disc. For me, like a fast putter.
2. The star-stamped DX Goblins are the best because they have flatter tops (probably due to hot-stamp process), and are perfectly stable.
3. The domey Goblins (regular production stamp) are a bit more understable, when they get a little beat they are similar to an XD.
4. The Goblins beat fairly quickly (even without significant tree hits). The new DX plastic is decent (nice grip!), but since the Goblin is so perfectly stable to begin with, it tends to get understable fairly quickly compared to other, more overstable, approach discs.
5. The Goblin in Star plastic doesn't feel or fly great. Doesn't seem to have nearly as much glide, also these were very domey and kinda understable. This surprised me, because most other discs in Star are more overstable.
6. The Skeeter is too fast. More of a mid-range driver than a fast putter.
7. Classic Roc is a tad bit too overstable for similar usage. Also, I know a lot of player don't like that thick bead for a "touch" disc.

So, I (we?) need a stable Goblin, but with decent glide, in more durable plastic...Champion???

Dave, what are your thoughts on this? I'm not sure how well received the Goblin is. I know you are marketing this as a "beginner" disc, but a Champion version might have wider appeal?

Thanks,

-E

The Goblin has been a slower starter, but does have its fans. We are seeing how it plays out in the market before we introduce any other variations. I think we just screwed up with the Star and need to use a different formula. If the sales pick up a little, we will more inclined to do a Champion run.

[lonhart]

Hi Dave,

I'm glad your a fan of the Viking--it's been one of my favorites (original acquired in 2005?). I was crushed when I lost it in the lake at USDGC, then elated when the crew recovered it on Sunday, then mortified when I realized it did not make the flight back to CA...

While my original was in the drink, I purchased a second Viking, but this was more stable than the first. I haven't read all the Viking comments, but are the more recent versions going to be slightly more stable?

Thanks!
Steve

[davei]

Hi Dave,

I'm glad your a fan of the Viking--it's been one of my favorites (original acquired in 2005?). I was crushed when I lost it in the lake at USDGC, then elated when the crew recovered it on Sunday, then mortified when I realized it did not make the flight back to CA...

While my original was in the drink, I purchased a second Viking, but this was more stable than the first. I haven't read all the Viking comments, but are the more recent versions going to be slightly more stable?

Thanks!
Steve

Yes, the new ones should be consistently more stable. Although I never got a hold of a weak one, I was told by my associate that he had tried several and they were no more stable than a Valkyrie. They should be. It should be relatively difficult to turn them over compared to a Valkyrie. My old ones still are stable enough to throw into a wind using just a little hyzer although they're not as stable as they started.

[circle_2]

Dave, as far as older Innova drivers go, what are the families of molds that share many physical traits/dimensions...though their flights are different? ie Wraith - Tee Rex - Max