Ask Dave Dunipace About Innova Discs

[davei]

William, yes the Champion Starfire is that disc. The second generation Champion Starfires are about as stable as TeeBirds, but faster. The first generation wasn't quite there so we tweaked it successfully. We also have a new Pro Starfire that is more stable than an Orc in the true sense of the term. That is: straighter from start to finish. It has about the same high speed turn as a Champ Orc, but less low speed overstability.

[discndat]

So when's the Pro Starfire going to be on the East Coast? Is it going to be a regular production disc? Sounds like a winner of a disc, as always.

[davei]

discndat, the Pro Starfire should be on the East Coast in a week. It is slated to be a regular production disc.

[jaymo]

Dave, Just saw the product release stuff for Feb. Dx Orc stamp looks good. Champ Gators will make alot of people happy.

Keep up the good work.

Hi Dave,

What is your opinion on the elimination of the two meter rule?

Also, I believe you have said some people at Innova Champion Discs say "In-NO-va" (as in Inside a Nova) and some say "In-NUH-va" (as in innovation). Do you have a preference?

[mikeP]

Dave,

Although I throw large diameter discs such as the Roc and its clones, I really prefer the grip, feel, and lines of flight of smaller diameter discs. I think this is a real area in need of improvement as far as discs currently available on the market go. I like the Champion Panther a lot, but I would definetely like it a bit more stable/overstable. Maybe a bigger bead or a more concave bottow wingtip would do the trick. None of the other small diameter mids compare in terms of distance/carry of the larger discs in my opinion.

I remember you mentioning some of the same preferences and concerns some time back on the board concerning small diameter mids and I was wondering if this is still an idea in the works.

[davei]

I have never liked the 2 meter rule. Too flukey, whether a disc sticks or not from the same shot. I was disappointed that the board over ruled the rules committee. I pronounce it INN o va, with the stress on the first syllable, but others in the company pronounce it- in NO va.

[davei]

discspeed, yes, I am still working on it. If I am lucky, I will have it soon. If not, I will keep trying.

[discchucker]

Dave:

Have you guys thought about doing the INNColor Printing on the CE Mini's? I think that would be pretty cool. Just a thought.

JT

[mikeP]

discspeed, yes, I am still working on it. If I am lucky, I will have it soon. If not, I will keep trying.

This will be a true step forward. I think that small diameter discs fly truer and that sooner or later the bigger discs will become extinct altogether. By the way, I just got ahold of a new clear Orc, 174g. Feels nice and grippy like the Sidewinders. I love this new plastic, great work Dave!

I have never liked the 2 meter rule. Too flukey, whether a disc sticks or not from the same shot. I was disappointed that the board over ruled the rules committee.

My thoughts exactly Dave, glad to hear someone with your experience and expertise also sees it the same way. Of course, the expertise and experience of the Rules Committee is nothing to sneeze at, though apparently the Board felt it knew better than the RC what was best...

I pronounce it INN o va, with the stress on the first syllable, but others in the company pronounce it- in NO va

So then the founder of the company prefers Innova as in innovation? Did you come up with the name? It seems quite apt.

And, as a self-serving segway, let me add I really like discspeed's requests regarding midranges and am glad you are looking at what he is asking for. Do you expect the Champion Panther will be in production for the forseeable future? If so, that and a more stable version thereof might be the midranges for me...

Dave, any plans for a Champion or DX Bulldog?

[mf100forever]

Dx Bulldog , do you mean Pro?

[davei]

discchucker, we are doing INNColor minis now.

[davei]

robj, I think Harlold came up with the INNOVA name. We liked it for the double meaning of innovation and in nova. The Champion Panther is a keeper.

[davei]

Paul, both the Bulldog and Hydra can only be done in DX. The other plastics would be too heavy.

[thetruthxl]

Although I throw large diameter discs such as the Roc and its clones, I really prefer the grip, feel, and lines of flight of smaller diameter discs.

discspeed is right, dave. Alot of us feel that innova is falling behind in the midrange dept.
Any plans to create this gem?...I mean in mass production that everyone can get their hands on?

[justingill]

discchucker, we are doing INNColor minis now.

Hey Dave i was just curious, if it was even practical, about how much would a custom run of 100 INNcolor Minis be? I am interested in making our bag tags as minis this year. Kind of a yearly throphy thing. Every year you get a bag tag and at the end of the year you get to keep it and then get a new design next year. Whatta ya think??

[davei]

troof, it will be mass production if I am successful.

[davei]

Justin, if you are interested, contact sam.ferrans@innovadiscs.com

Dave, I have a couple 8x rocs that have a picture of Climo
on the disc. How many of these were made ?

[davei]

Sorry Scott, I have no idea. I don't even remember the Rocs you are talking about. Sounds like a custom run, but I don't know.

[circle_2]

Dave, why in your opinion does a thumbtrak contribute to a Rhyno being so doggone dependable flightwise? It's a remarkable disc...one that I would not choose to be without. I'm impressed at what all can be done with them...they really hold a nice line, whether backhand or sidearm...nice into the wind, too.

Do the other thumbtrak discs behave similarily? I've not thrown them...

[rangel]

Dave,

I'm putting a couple questions on this post Your opinion (and those of others) would be most appreciated.

First. I threw one of my best rounds Saturday at my "home" course. One of the changes I made that day was throwing an Archangel (DX) instead of my Champion Orc. The AA went as far or farther than my Orc on at least five different holes. The AA can (for me) be a big Anhyzer, so I was being very careful to throw it flat. I normally throw the Orc with some Anhyzer to produce an S shot. Also, most of those throws were made on some type of downhill (slight to moderate) fairway.

I am pretty much a noodle arm....never having thrown a disc (on my practice soccer field) more than 340'. Here is my question. Is the AA a better distance disc for some? Is the AA a better downhill (or down wind) disc? Or was I just being more efficient (having a good day)?

Second. I have been throwing some other discs (all Innova) lately, and I am really starting to appreciate the numbers (speed, glide, turn, fade). Does anyone have a feel for what happens to the numbers as a disc gets old or "broken in"? Not just the fade, but all four numbers.

Thank you for being patient with this long note.

[davei]

circle 2, the Thumtrac discs all work the same way. They provide a grip for the thum, and at higher air speeds, they counteract the natural tendency, of a disc to turn over, with an aerodynamic stabilizer. The faster the disc flies, the more the disc wants to turn, but the larger the stabilizer effect. The spoiler provides a downward vector on the rear of the disc which is translated 90 degrees into the spin, which means it acts downward on the left side, counteracting the natural turnover.

[davei]

Rod, the Orc is a better disc for higher speed throwers. The Archangel is better for lower speed throwers. The Archangel has more turn and glide, which makes it a natural downwind distance and roller disc. As a disc gets worn it tends to turn over more at high speeds. The other numbers don't change much. The low speed fade looks as if it becomes less, but I think this is an artifact of the high speed turn, bringing the nose down, which in turn decreases the fade. Bending the nose of the disc will produce the "wear effect" more rapidly. Bent noses can be restored.

[Sharky]

Hello where have you been

The Sidewinder, sidewinder, sidewinder........

[rangel]

Dave,
Thanks. I understand your comments about the fade being affected by the turn. (I throw a lot of anhyzer shots.)

If my (low) power rating means I find the AA a longer disc than the Orc, then would the Sidewinder (Sharky's understated hint) be a longer disc still?

Thanks again.

[rangel]

Sharky.
My plates and I have been out thowin' in the snow, in the cold, and (now) in the mud. Actually, this is my first winter out with my discs and I had a blast....even on the day where the wind chill was 8.

Good thing those plates are inside my arm....or they would get COOOLLLLDDDD.

[slo]

...the Thumtrac discs all work the same way. They provide a grip for the thumb, and at higher air speeds, they counteract the natural tendency, of a disc to turn over, with an aerodynamic stabilizer. The faster the disc flies, the more the disc wants to turn, but the larger the stabilizer effect. The spoiler provides a downward vector on the rear of the disc which is translated 90 degrees into the spin, which means it acts downward on the left side, counteracting the natural turnover.

Is there a reason for not having a thumbtrac on a driver? That's where I fancy the majority of high speed throws are generated.

...I used to putt with a Piranha, but it certainly wasn't to counterbalance high speed...I can double-helix an Aero from inside 20 feet, 4COL.