player ratings and results.

[TheGatewayKid]

i feel that i'm easily a 950+ golfer but i've still yet to have a thousand rated round and after the string of three A-tiers i've played as an amateur my current rating will definitely plummet. i can't stand the ratings system. i've always thought of it to be unimportant but so many players bring it up wherever i go. the whole practice rounds vs. tournament rounds is absolutely killing me. why i can't play as SOLID in tournament rounds as i constantly do in every practice round i play just kills me. i have no idea what to do. i've almost come to conclusion that at the age of 20 i'm already past my disc golf prime. i have been steadily getting worse results over the past 3 or so years. WHAT DO I DO???

[friysch]

From my limited tourney experience and from watching guys that do play a lot of tournaments, I've decided that at some point, you just have to do it. I don't really think there is a trick to it. Just be as focused as you possibly can and play well. In the two tournies I've played, most of the guys that end up playing badly either lack focus on routine shots (usually 15 foot putts or they'll throw in the one place that you just cannot throw and still card a good score on the hole) or they continually "go for broke" when it usually costs them strokes.

If you aren't playing open, you don't need tons of birdies to compete really well. Par is a good score on pretty much any hole as an am golfer. Obviously if you want to become a pro, you need to putt really well and you need to birdie the holes that should be birdied, but not so in the Am fields. Most players that I've seen fold during tournaments in the advanced division run at putts that they cannot make even 1 in 10 from and 3 putt. If you do that even twice a round, you're 20 points lower than what you think should be ratings wise.

That's my take at least.

MC

[jmonny]

After looking at your tournament results my advice would be to compete more often and in more lower (C/B) tier events. You haven't played many events (14) for 4+ years of competition and most of them are "big" championship events. C-tiers have more of a casual or monthly feel about them as opposd to the big pressure of A-tiers and world championships. You get more points for A-tiers but they don't help your rating any extra. Most important, the more you compete, the less nerves play a part and you'll play your normal "casual" game. Hope this makes sense.

[DSproAVIAR]

Most important, the more you compete, the less nerves play a part and you'll play your normal "casual" game. Hope this makes sense.

Yup. Become comfortable when throwing your shot in a tourny. A good way to become comfortable with your shot is to play lots and lots of tournaments.

[Alacrity]

I have had some discussions with local players about bag tags and tournament play. One player stated that since he had been beating me recently, he felt he should do well at some upcoming tournaments. I tried to explain to him that it is a completely different mindset with different results. When I play a casual round for a couple of $'s and a bag tag challenge, I am still thinking about practice shots. Going for shots I would not necessarily try in a true competitive round. My focus is very different and my game is different. In your case I think you are playing good casual rounds, but you are not maintaining focus during a tournament round. These are just suggestions, and I am not sure they are true for every player but.....

- Set a goal before the round and map out what you need to do to get there. Don't set an unrealistic goal and have a contingency plan in place. For instance, don't plan on shooting 15 down. Also, if you had planned to pick up birds on certain holes, be ready to implement a plan to pick up your error on the next set of holes. If you are not hitting all the bird holes during practice, don't expect them during a tournament.

- If you get stuck in a tight spot, avoid doing anything you would not do during practice. If you cannot throw a thumber 150 feet straight up, don't plan on doing it during a tournament round. If you have not thrown a roller shot 650 feet, don't plan on it suddenly happening to get yourself out of a sticky spot.

- Once you miss a putt, go over the mistake you made in your head, correct your mistake and LEAVE IT BEHIND. For the majority of players getting mad does not help their game. This is not always true, I do know a couple of players that focus better when they are angry. The problem is holding on to that for a full round and not angering the other players you are with.

- If you get in the zone, forget your goal and go for everything you can get. I can remember struggling during a tournament and having a hard time getting anything to work. Suddenly something clicked and I hit seven birds in a row. I didn't stop just because I had met my goal I was on fire and took every advantage I could. I have had this happen at several events and did not let up.

Just keep in mind that you put pressure on yourself during a tournament that you would not put on yourself during a practice or casual round. Learn to relax and focus and you will come around. One good suggestion is play more tournaments. You can practice focus during those

[skaZZirf]

Nice points...
We as a group are extremely competitive during casual rounds and usually play for $. This helps for tourney golf...While living in N.C. we took score on scorecards every single round we played...Even on duece or die courses...If you play all your rounds like you are in an event, you can play without problems when the time comes...most important point brought up in the above post was controlling your urge to go for everything...If you realistically cant make the putt, why are you trying...If you're gonna try, give it a Barry shultz floater so your comeback putt is a tapper...

[jmonny]

Mike Moser advises people to play every round like an event round with no extra shots or putts, even casual rounds. Anyone can get a shot down on the 3rd or 4th try so it gives you a false sense of skill. If you can't execute it on the first try then what good is it. Learn to make it happen on the first try and walk on.

[skaZZirf]

yup...And i have played with guys whos second shot is always pure...however, everytime they play the hole they use the disc they through first(and badly) instead of switching. Almost like it doesnt occur to them...give yourself a ritual, like a batter in the MLB, and use it in casual rounds, as well events...dont do new things in events.

[Vanessa]

t is so easy to play a practice round and think "I wouldn't really miss that putt" or "I wouldn't really shank it into the OB" or whatever "... if it was a real round". And then you get an unrealistic picture of what you feel that you "deserve". That's not because you have ego problems or are a bad person, it's just human nature!

Sure, you have to practice sometimes, but separate practice rounds from "real" rounds.

Play lots of rounds like they are for real. Score every round. Play for $ or pizza or bag tags or whatever gets your competitive juices going. Don't take second shots, even when you missed a putt because you were putting on one foot while still straightening up and had your bag on your shoulder and it was sliding down.

In our family we use our ratings (and sometimes our history of play on a given course) to determine a "handicap" to let us all compete on an even footing.

[winonaradiosteve]

Maybe off-topic and/or stated somewhere else, but why can't a system or computer formula be devised that would automatically update a players rating after each and very tournament is officially entered into the database? Therefore giving each player the most accurate rating possible and probably even saving someone alot of time doing that work every 3 months.

[ck34]

Player skill levels don't jump up and down like a stock ticker. All that online processing would do is make player's ratings jump around more than they do. The average PDGA player only has 4 new rounds every 3 months to include in each update. TDs still don't have the hang of entering course layouts and there are manual steps that require human oversight to get the reports processed properly. For example, Dave has to check to make sure new members are entered in reports and player PDGA numbers are correct. Course layouts have to be validated. We also combine or don't combine rounds to make sure as many players get ratings and sometimes enter fixed SSA values for international locations with few propagators. So, there are things we do to make sure as many players get ratings and they're done as accurately as we can based on the information we get.

[flyingplastic23]

like the intial poster I felt like I wasnt playing up to my ability, at the suggestions of some pros i started reading. Yes, reading. One book I suggest is Bob Rotella "Golf is not a game of Perfect." I got it from the library and liked it so much I went out and bought my own copy so I can refer to it and mark it up. He has other books "Golf is a game of confidence," "the golfers mind" and "putting out of your mind" I picked up a few more the other day. It is written about ball golf but is EASILY adapted to disc golf. These books help you learn to start thinking differently out on the course. For example before i might have thought "i hope i can hit this line," After reading the book, i said to myself "I will hit this line," and then i did. Just like anyone else tho, you still have bad holes or bad rounds, but learning how to think more positively will help that bad streak not last as long. If you think you are playing poorly again, get the book back out. They are really good, I reccomend you pick yourself up one!

Also what I have done in the last season is to have a sit down with myself. I set out what I wanted to accomplish for the season and how I was going to do it. I practice regularly and give myself real life situations, putting from one knee behind a tree sort of a deal. Today I am going to go play a whole round with putters and rocs only. I changed how i think about the game and made a real commitment mentally, that has helped me tremendously, I hope it shows in the next ratings update!

[magilla]

Hey Chuck...

Why wouldnt the temp ratings ofr the KOA come up when I entered the scores?? (actually Steve Ganz entered the scores)
Would it be because the round is 19 holes?
Im sure that they will be dealt with at the next update but I was just wondering..

[Tkeith]

I went from 1011 to 995, OUCH! that hurts

TK

[xterramatt]

I feel your pain Tim. I went from 984 to 968 the day after I came in 11th at an NT! The thing I hate about ratings is that they should be current.

I think we need a t-shirt that say "My rating is, like, soooo 3 months ago!"

[gang4010]

- Set a goal before the round and map out what you need to do to get there. Don't set an unrealistic goal and have a contingency plan in place. For instance, don't plan on shooting 15 down. Also, if you had planned to pick up birds on certain holes, be ready to implement a plan to pick up your error on the next set of holes. If you are not hitting all the bird holes during practice, don't expect them during a tournament.

This is a difficult and distracting thing to do. Setting goals and expectations for performance often provides a greater distraction and obstacle - and as such - should be avoided. If you feel the need for goals - pick ones that are easily attainable - and removed from the end result. Tell yourself to "have good balance" or to " have good feet", or to just " be smooth". These are things that inherently lead to scoring well, and relaxing, and are more easily found (and re-found)
during the course of a round. As opposed to dwelling on how many birdies you've gotten vs how many you "planned" on getting.

- If you get stuck in a tight spot, avoid doing anything you would not do during practice. If you cannot throw a thumber 150 feet straight up, don't plan on doing it during a tournament round. If you have not thrown a roller shot 650 feet, don't plan on it suddenly happening to get yourself out of a sticky spot.

This is excellent advice. And is most important - play your game - not someone elses. Don't try shots that are outside your known capacity to perform.

- Once you miss a putt, go over the mistake you made in your head, correct your mistake and LEAVE IT BEHIND. For the majority of players getting mad does not help their game. This is not always true, I do know a couple of players that focus better when they are angry. The problem is holding on to that for a full round and not angering the other players you are with.

Good advice except the part about going over it in your head!! Once it's done - it's done - all you can do is go on to the next shot. One of my favorite things to tell new players is this. A bad shot is nothing more than an OPPORTUNITY to throw a really great shot on your next throw If you throw a poor shot - walk on and concentrate on the next one.

- If you get in the zone, forget your goal and go for everything you can get.

See there's that distraction thing - having a plan - and then having it change - is just one more distraction to manage. Focus on the basics - let the score be what it'll be.

Just keep in mind that you put pressure on yourself during a tournament that you would not put on yourself during a practice or casual round. Learn to relax and focus and you will come around. One good suggestion is play more tournaments. You can practice focus during those

The most important parts here are that YOU are the only one that can put pressure on YOU. No-one else will do it for you - unless you let them. Learning to relax and focus (while easier said than done) is sometimes more easily attained when you think about it this way. If you took your full allotment of time for every shot in a round of golf (and say you average par 54). The full amount of concentration time would be 27 minutes. The actual amount of time actually spent "throwing" (if you say 5 seconds per) would be more like 6-1/2 minutes. Somewhere in between these 2 #'s is the amount of time you need to concentrate and execute. The rest of that 2.5-4 hour round is all distraction management.

[JackCO]

I believe playing a lot of tournament style rounds is a good idea to become comfortable, but I think it is necessary to play practice style rounds too. Trying many different shot styles on a single hole. A lot of players learn to play their home course(s) very well, throwing the same shots over and over everyday and they don't learn anything new. They get good scores in practice it makes them think they can do well anywhere, only to go to a different tournament course and blowup.

[ChrisWoj]

i feel that i'm easily a 950+ golfer but i've still yet to have a thousand rated round and after the string of three A-tiers i've played as an amateur my current rating will definitely plummet. i can't stand the ratings system. i've always thought of it to be unimportant but so many players bring it up wherever i go. the whole practice rounds vs. tournament rounds is absolutely killing me. why i can't play as SOLID in tournament rounds as i constantly do in every practice round i play just kills me. i have no idea what to do. i've almost come to conclusion that at the age of 20 i'm already past my disc golf prime. i have been steadily getting worse results over the past 3 or so years. WHAT DO I DO???

You're failing to take into account that a rating doesn't just tell you where you are physically. It tells you about your ENTIRE game, including the mental maturity of your game. Obviously you feel like you're far better than a 930 rated golfer, but in tournament play you aren't getting that. So maybe even though you've got all the skills of a 950+ rated golfer, you don't have the mental game of a 950+ rated golfer yet.

Really when I look at my rating right now, I'm looking more and more at where it is compared to a year ago as a sign of growth. And I'm looking at those occasional bursts of brilliance (today, in a money round, I hit four putts from outside 50 and didn't miss one inside the circle, that isn't what my game is right now, but it is a sign of what my game could be). Those bursts of brilliance show me what I CAN do, but they aren't necessarily a sign of where my game is today.

As a result of my rating's progression, I see where I've come from. And as a result of the occasional hot round, I can see where it is going. In six months we'll see if it all matches up, and if I don't get hurt or walk away for a period of time, it should.

Just keep those things in mind and don't get down on yourself. Nobody peaks at 20.

[TaylorLipo]

Chris you're right on about focussing on your future potential, thats the way I've always looked at it. Just don't forget your Ibuprofen!!!!

[ck34]

Here's a table showing the very first ratings of the top 15 players from the 1998 Pro Worlds versus their ratings now 10 years later. Some of those now in the top weren't even teenagers then and others are still kicking into their 50s. Kind of shows how players have gotten better while KC still sets the standard for overall top level consistency only having not been the top rated player for a few rating periods over the years.

Rating	Name	. .	Rating	Last	First
1032	Ken Climo	. .	1038	Climo	Ken
1026	Scott Stokely	. .	1035	Rico	Steve
1017	Scott Martin	. .	1032	Lundmark	Jesper
1014	Geoff Lissaman	. .	1031	Nodland	Darrell
1014	Mike Randolph	. .	1031	Feldberg	David
1009	Mike Moser	. .	1030	Doss	Nathan
1000	Brad Hammock	. .	1030	Schultz	Barry
1000	Jim Myers	. .	1029	Anthon	Josh
999	Dave Greenwell	. .	1028	McCray	John E
997	Stan McDaniel	. .	1026	Jenkins	Avery
997	Rick Voakes	. .	1024	Gurthie	Garrett
997	Mark Holland	. .	1024	Pursio	Timo
997	Jim Stilgenbauer	. .	1024	Leiviska	Cale
996	Steven Rico	. .	1022	Moser	Michael
996	Barry Schultz	. .	1022	Hatfield	Coda
. .	. .	. .	1022	Oates	Jim
. .
987	Jim Oates	. .	1017	Hammock	Brad
973	John E. McCray	. .	1015	Randolph	Mike
. .	. .	. .	1011	Greenwell	David
. .	. .	. .	1011	Martin	Scott
. .	. .	. .	1004	Myers	Jim
. .	. .	. .	1002	Stilgenbauer	Jim
. .	. .	. .	999	McDaniel	Stan
. .	. .	. .	997	Voakes	Rick

[Martin_Bohn]

Here's a table showing the very first ratings of the top 15 players from the 1998 Pro Worlds versus their ratings now 10 years later. Some of those now in the top weren't even teenagers then and others are still kicking into their 50s. Kind of shows how players have gotten better while KC still sets the standard for overall top level consistency only having not been the top rated player for a few rating periods over the years.
<table> <tr> <td>Rating</td><td>Name</td><td>. .</td><td>Rating</td><td>Last</td><td>First </td></tr> <tr> <td>1032</td><td>Ken Climo</td><td>. .</td><td>1038</td><td>Climo</td><td>Ken </td></tr> <tr> <td>1026</td><td>Scott Stokely</td><td>. .</td><td>1035</td><td>Rico</td><td>Steve </td></tr> <tr> <td>1017</td><td>Scott Martin</td><td>. .</td><td>1032</td><td>Lundmark</td><td>Jesper </td></tr> <tr> <td>1014</td><td>Geoff Lissaman</td><td>. .</td><td>1031</td><td>Nodland</td><td>Darrell </td></tr> <tr> <td>1014</td><td>Mike Randolph</td><td>. .</td><td>1031</td><td>Feldberg</td><td>David </td></tr> <tr> <td>1009</td><td>Mike Moser</td><td>. .</td><td>1030</td><td>Doss</td><td>Nathan </td></tr> <tr> <td>1000</td><td>Brad Hammock</td><td>. .</td><td>1030</td><td>Schultz</td><td>Barry </td></tr> <tr> <td>1000</td><td>Jim Myers</td><td>. .</td><td>1029</td><td>Anthon</td><td>Josh </td></tr> <tr> <td>999</td><td>Dave Greenwell</td><td>. .</td><td>1028</td><td>McCray</td><td>John E </td></tr> <tr> <td>997</td><td>Stan McDaniel</td><td>. .</td><td>1026</td><td>Jenkins</td><td>Avery </td></tr> <tr> <td>997</td><td>Rick Voakes</td><td>. .</td><td>1024</td><td>Gurthie</td><td>Garrett </td></tr> <tr> <td>997</td><td>Mark Holland</td><td>. .</td><td>1024</td><td>Pursio</td><td>Timo </td></tr> <tr> <td>997</td><td>Jim Stilgenbauer</td><td>. .</td><td>1024</td><td>Leiviska</td><td>Cale </td></tr> <tr> <td>996</td><td>Steven Rico</td><td>. .</td><td>1022</td><td>Moser</td><td>Michael </td></tr> <tr> <td>996</td><td>Barry Schultz</td><td>. .</td><td>1022</td><td>Hatfield</td><td>Coda </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>1022</td><td>Oates</td><td>Jim </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td></td><td></td><td></td><td></td><td> </td></tr> <tr> <td>987</td><td>Jim Oates</td><td>. .</td><td>1017</td><td>Hammock</td><td>Brad </td></tr> <tr> <td>973</td><td>John E. McCray</td><td>. .</td><td>1015</td><td>Randolph</td><td>Mike </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>1011</td><td>Greenwell</td><td>David </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>1011</td><td>Martin</td><td>Scott </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>1004</td><td>Myers</td><td>Jim </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>1002</td><td>Stilgenbauer</td><td>Jim </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>999</td><td>McDaniel</td><td>Stan </td></tr> <tr> <td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>. .</td><td>997</td><td>Voakes</td><td>Rick </td></tr> </table>

you know what i see from this chuck? that there are more players playing at a higher level than ten years ago. not that the players are so much better, just that the "player pool" is deeper, wider, bigger, therefore generating more "high scores" for the open division, thus creating a larger data base to form your criteria from. its all good though, no matter how you slice it.

[JHBlader86]

The best advice I've been given was from Shawn Sinclair. On our very first lesson the first thing he taught me was the KISS method. Keep It Simple Stupid. Dont do something you wouldnt do in practice, and dont try anything fancy. Add that to some form technique changes, and my game improved alot. Too bad it's winter so it's hard to find time to practice now.

[my_hero]

Will the ratings of this event most likely change when all of the PDGA #'s are entered in?

http://www.pdga.com/tournament/tourn...rnID=7521#Open

Who is responsible for filling in the blanks if it's submitted like this? The TD, or the PDGA?

[tbender]

Considering that those results are unofficial, I'd say the ratings will definitely change.

Responsibility lies with the TD, but only for getting the information on the TD report, not on the unofficial results.

You could try to nudge the TD into doing it on those results...

[my_hero]

You could try to nudge the TD into doing it on those results...

Moving mountains is not my forte'.

[twoods14862]

What dictates a rated round (aside from being bad) from counting towards your player rating ?

[Gregg]

Player skill levels don't jump up and down like a stock ticker.

they should...

[bruce_brakel]

The intraday trading on my rating could get pretty hot if they did.

[gnduke]

He birdied the second hole, and made a good looking drive on the third. The futures are already trending up by 25 points.....

[Stiick]

All solid points..

1. Always play to win.
2. Practice or play...don't mix the two.

(If you want to practice putting, then do that an only that)