Ask Chuck Kennedy

[OSTERTIP]

The difference between a tee and any other place on the fairway is that everyone starts play from the tee. Once you've thrown, the idea is to play from where it lies. The player is supposed to deal with whatever challenges are presented without additional assistance such as placing a towel. That's the fundamental nature of the game. The game doesn't force anyone to make a particular shot nor use a particular stance. But it does restrict some options such as landing just one inch closer to the pin means you can't jump putt but the options for the stance you do use for putting are overall quite unrestricted.

Not being able to put down a towel on your line of play is keeping in the spirit of 'play it from where it lies.' On the other hand, what's the difference between a player in shorts putting down a cotton towel to kneel on and a player who wore corduroy jeans kneeling to putt?

I understand what you are saying, but I agree more with your last statement, what's the difference between thick pants and placing a towel down? None, if you ask me. So if a player started the round with knee pads on, the player could use them any where on the course to protect their knees from rocks or whatever.?.?

[OSTERTIP]

So if a player was to call this on someone, what rule would they say was broken?

[cgkdisc]

I think you need to read the Q&A on Building a Lie to see the various rules involved. If you want to specifically refer to any words, look at the last line of that Q&A which I interpret as meaning you can't use a towel behind your lie but can use one if it's under another supporting point that's not behind your lie.

[OSTERTIP]

That cleared up everything, not behind your lie, but can be any other supporting point. Thanks Chuck!

[gotcha]

I think you need to read the Q&A on Building a Lie to see the various rules involved. If you want to specifically refer to any words, look at the last line of that Q&A which I interpret as meaning you can't use a towel behind your lie but can use one if it's under another supporting point that's not behind your lie.

Hey Chuck. Please interpret the second to the last sentence in the RC's answer to the Building a Lie question:

"One can’t “build a stance” except as allowed under 802.04 (Artificial Devices) A."

[cgkdisc]

No more to say. The last sentence indicates the RC doesn't consider a towel an artificial device under 802.04A or he wouldn't have written the last statement. We'll get the answer at some point.

[gotcha]

No more to say. The last sentence indicates the RC doesn't consider a towel an artificial device under 802.04A or he wouldn't have written the last statement. We'll get the answer at some point.

Both the rule book and the RC recognize a towel as an artificial device (802.04 A) as this item is allowed as such on the teeing surface. The rule does not exclude the towel as an artificial device once off the tee.

My question was regarding your interpretation of that particular statement where the RC clearly allows usage of Artificial Devices on the line of play behind one's mark.

Enough said on this thread. This particular topic of discussion has spread like a disease across the message board...

[my_hero]

Chuck, What should we do about THIS?

[stack]

Chuck, What should we do about THIS?

use the FORCE!

[cgkdisc]

Chuck, What should we do about THIS?

What's that line about putting your head between your legs and kissing something goodbye? In this case, you could legally put a towel where you'll lie...

Seriously though, I think one of man's highest priorities, whether you're religious or not, should be figuring out how to extend our population across the galaxy. The only true win for all of this billions of years effort to evolve both as a species and civilization is if you continue to survive. Only makes sense to get some people launched to far away places as soon as technically possible and hedge our bets. I heard they need a rating system near Orion...

[my_hero]

Great answer. That's why i asked. At least you didnt say just throw a DevilHawk with counter spin to counteract the Death Star!

[accidentalROLLER]

What's that line about putting your head between your legs and kissing something goodbye? In this case, you could legally put a towel where you'll lie...

Seriously though, I think one of man's highest priorities, whether you're religious or not, should be figuring out how to extend our population across the galaxy. The only true win for all of this billions of years effort to evolve both as a species and civilization is if you continue to survive. Only makes sense to get some people launched to far away places as soon as technically possible and hedge our bets. I heard they need a rating system near Orion...

I would like to nominate Jeff Lagrassa to go to pluto.

[mikeP]

What's that line about putting your head between your legs and kissing something goodbye? In this case, you could legally put a towel where you'll lie...

Seriously though, I think one of man's highest priorities, whether you're religious or not, should be figuring out how to extend our population across the galaxy. The only true win for all of this billions of years effort to evolve both as a species and civilization is if you continue to survive. Only makes sense to get some people launched to far away places as soon as technically possible and hedge our bets. I heard they need a rating system near Orion...

I wonder if the HIV virus had this discussion before jumping from monkeys to humans...HIV 1:"we really need to expand our concept of a host". HIV 2:"yeah, monkeys are a dead end in our evolution". HIV 1:"we need a longer lived host so that we can enjoy dormancy for perhaps decades instead of years"...

[cgkdisc]

Yep. Survival of the fittest. Must have been those few cells that evolved to communicate...

[stack]

Chuck... what is the lowest rated round you've ever seen/heard of? I'm not talking about someone purposely tanking a round... im talking about someone actually playing.

does it get to a point when ratings arent tracked for someone?

i think i've seen an example of this but im not sure.

[cgkdisc]

Chuck... what is the lowest rated round you've ever seen/heard of?

Roger has the file to search this, but the person on the bottom of this page might be a contender for that title.
www.pdga.com/tournament/tournament_results.php?TournID=5508&year=2008&incl ude_ratings=1#Recreational%20Women

[stack]

thats the reason I ask... i just played in a tourney where someone had a round rated a 74 and they have 2 tourneys they played in last summer where ratings arent even showing but if they did those rounds would be in the 100's as well... the reason I ask about if someone could be too low to be ranked is because i would think they should have a rating if they've played since last summer.

here's the tourney...
http://www.pdga.com/tournament/tournamen...atings=1#Novice

[cgkdisc]

Mathematically, it's possible to get negative round ratings and actually have a negative rating...

[stack]

but does that explain why this person wouldn't have a rating and when you click 'show ratings' on the tourneys from last summer ratings appear for everyone but them. Just curious if there is a mercy rule or something where things dont get tabulated if they are too low.

btw... is 74 the lowest rated round you've ever heard of?

[cgkdisc]

No "mercy" rule at this point other than the fact we drop rounds more than 100 points below your average.

I think what happened is the person wasn't current at the time or isn't currently. One of those events was a DNF. Not sure what the story is but not getting ratings is common for some of the beginner divisions if they play different layouts and there aren't enough props to produce them.

[BeckyT]

I have a question about round ratings.

If you played the exact same course layout for two rounds (2 seperate days) and shot the same both rounds your round rating should be the same for both rounds right... or am I confused?

Thanks!

[ck34]

Each round is calculated separately for the unofficial ratings you see during a tournament or right after when the scores are first posted. Normal variation and wind differences account for the same score having different ratings both rounds.

However, unless the TD tells us otherwise, all of the scores from rounds where divisions played the same course will be processed to produce official ratings where everyone will get the same rating for the same score. When the wind was quite different for the same layout, the TD should tell us and then we'll rate those rounds separately because the course actually did play tougher in the wind and the same score should get a better rating.

[Giles]

Is wind always viewed as making the course more difficult or do you look at the scores to dictate the effect?

[ck34]

The numbers are what they are. More wind usually means higher scores. Might not have as much effect on some wooded courses. All calculations are done from the scores and player ratings. We don't know what the weather was like unless maybe we played the event.

[vwkeepontruckin]

Chuck:

Could you look at the scores from last weekend for the two C Tiers in St. Louis. I think the scores feature two pools, but aren't listed that way. Pros played at Souix Passage on Saturday, but our scores are right along side the AMs playing JB. Also, Steve Bennett is listed instead of Geoff Bennett.

Thanks.

[cgkdisc]

I put Masters and Open together for all four rounds over both days.

[vwkeepontruckin]

I put Masters and Open together for all four rounds over both days.

That would be correct! Thanks.

[vwkeepontruckin]

That would be correct! Thanks.

AM scores from JB are still listed with our SP rounds. As of right now, it reads that 1 and 2 in Advanced would have won Open.

Unless, you are telling me you have it fixed on your end and it will be correct when official. In that case, my bad.

[cgkdisc]

I can't fix scores easily without the TD report. All I can do is change which groups played together. Contact the TD to correct unofficial scores.

[underparmike]

Yo Chuck, glad to hear that you made it through another Pon Farr. Who was the lucky Vulcan who got to mate with you this seventh year?

on a not-so-serious note, our illustrious TD of the Pot of Gold screwed up the ratings by not noting that the pros played a different course in Round 2. Open, Masters, Grandmasters, and Advanced all played a different course in the second round. Anything we can do to get that corrected?

i probably wouldn't care but i believe the USDGC actually invites TD's to use player ratngs to decide who gets an invite in the event of a tie. imagine that...a ratings system rife with errors like Mr. Timm's determing who gets to play in the national championship. sounds like a conspiracy theory waiting to hatch.

you pro players from the POG, you can thank me later.