Highest SSA Courses - 2004 Rank

[ck34]

Here are the top 10 SSA permanent course layouts that can be played without a special setup for an event. I'm not sure about #10 Still Waters Farm if someone would like to confirm that one.

Rank	Permanent Course Location	Event	City	State	SSA
1	Renaissance Park	2003 Disc Landing Fall Finale	Charlotte	North Carolina	69.9
2	Sarasota Golf Club	2004 Sarasota Sky Pilots Open	Sarasota	Florida	69.6
3	Idlewild	2004 Disc \'n Dat Bluegrass Open	Burlington	Kentucky	68.5
4	Warwick Town Park	2002 NYDGC	Warwick	New York	64.9
5	Patapsco Valley State Park	2002 Patapsco Picnic Rnd 1	Ellicott City	Maryland	64.4
6	Knob Hill Park	2003 Pittsburgh Flying Disc Open	Warrendale	Pennsylvania	64.0
7	Tyler State Park	2004 Eric Yetter Memorial	Newtown	Pennsylvania	63.7
7	The Woodshed	2000 W VA Open	Paw Paw	West Virginia	63.7
9	Whippin\' Post	2004 Morgan County Hoedown	Paw Paw	West Virginia	63.1
10	Still Waters Farm Disc Golf Course	2004 TPC at Stillwaters Farm	Govan	South Carolina	63.0

[ck34]

Here are the top SSA temporary course layouts that I believe can only be played when set up for an event. I'm not sure about the stats on Canton. I'ts possible that was a 24-hole layout and would not make the list.

Rank	Temporary Course Layouts	Event	City	State	SSA
1	Winthrop Univ. Rec. Area	2004 United States Disc Golf Championship	Rock Hill	South Carolina	75.2
2	Akitas Run	2001 Ozark Open	Vichy	Missouri	71.3
2	El Rio Golf Course	2004 Tumbleweed Open	Tucson	Arizona	71.3
4	Silver Creek Ski area	2000 CO Champ	Fraser	Colorado	67.3
5	The Crucible	2003 Flying Eye Invitational	Athens	Georgia	65.5
6	Willow Metropark	2004 California State Ch of Michigan - Sat	Huron	Michigan	65.0
7	Canton	2003 Hall of Chains Classic	Canton	Ohio	64.8
8	La Mirada Regional Park	2004 Golden State Classic	La Mirada	California	63.1

[disctance00]

Chuck, What does SSA stand for?

[ck34]

Scratch Scoring Average, which is what a 1000-rated player would be expected to shoot on average.

[disctance00]

Thanks

[discusgrasses]

where can i find a complete list of course ssa's

[MTL21676]

I played in Still Waters Farm.

It is a permanent par 71 18 hole course located in the middle on nowhere, SC.

The course features lots of 2 and 3 shot holes, USDGC like rope and some water.

The SSA is correct - Walt Haney shot like 66 68 and killed everyone.

[ck34]

where can i find a complete list of course ssa's

You can get them by state by looking them up. Just bring up the scores for an event earlier in the year that has official ratings. Click on the Course Statistics link near the top. That will show you the SSAs for the courses at the event. Then, you'll have the option to look up courses in each state. There's currently no plan to provide SSAs for all courses in a master list.

[sandalbagger]

Knob Hill in the top 10!!!! woohooo

PFDO coming up next weekend. Knob Hill and the long awaited Moraine State Park. Im curious to see if Moraine will crack the top 5 list.

[Moderator005]

Looking at the results from the Pittsburgh Flying Disc Open on 7/16/05 when the pins were in mostly B and C positions, Moraine State Park had an SSA of about 59 from the shorter White tees, and close to 66 from the longer Blue tees. The latter layout puts Moraine in the top 10 SSA permanent course layouts in the world.

PFDS members recently moved most poleholes into the 'A' pin position so the course is playing a few strokes easier right now. If you are planning a trip to the Pittsburgh area, DO NOT miss the chance to play this world class disc golf course!

[paerley]

Any chance we can see another update to this after the results from the DMDGS finals are added? I refuse to believe that Mason County Pump Storage - Goliath has a SSA below 63 (as 62 and 61 have only been shot 1 time each) [ and the ssa from the first event there was 67.4 ].

Maybe there's a minimum number of rounds required for this?

[ck34]

SSAs are all online for rated events. Just find your course by state: www.pdga.com/tournament/course_ratings_by_course.php

[Moderator005]

Chuck's list is really more of an informal one. There's no minimum number of rounds to be included.

With regards to the Mason County Pump Storage - Goliath course, it usually plays as 21 or 24 holes, while most of the courses in Chuck's list achieve a high SSA over only 18 holes.

[paerley]

Yeah, it's 24 holes. I didn't realize that was for 18. ****, those are some tough courses.

[sandalbagger]

Moraine ended up being 67.23 just off of our par of 66 we had established for a 1000 rated player. nice

[Moderator005]

Looking at the results from the Pittsburgh Flying Disc Open on 6/17/06, Moraine State Park again had an SSA of about 59 from the shorter White tees, and 66.5 from the longer Gold tees. There was a mixture of pin positions.

The latter layout surely puts Moraine in the top 10 SSA permanent course layouts in the world.

[morgan]

So, this layout is permanent, except when it's not there.

[AviarX]

Idlewild Longs SSA: 70.42

2006 Disc 'n Dat Bluegrass Open -- Burlington, KY (greater Cincinnati area)

view course statistics: here

Here are the top 10 SSA permanent course layouts that can be played without a special setup for an event. I'm not sure about #10 Still Waters Farm if someone would like to confirm that one.

[dave_marchant]

Idlewild Longs SSA: 70.42

2006 Disc 'n Dat Bluegrass Open -- Burlington, KY (greater Cincinnati area)

view course statistics: here

You got Renaissance by .01! FriZZak Open ratings.

[ck34]

It's the extra 60 feet on I4

[mattdisc]

Needs to updated to include Nockamixon State Park

[AviarX]

[QUOTE]

You got Renaissance by .01! FriZZak Open ratings.

It's the extra 60 feet on I4

do you mean hole 4 (lengthened 64 ft)?

post 2004 hole 2 now has the long across the pond pin and 13 long was lengthened across the creek too and i am not sure we had 16 long pin in place yet for 2004. the walls defining OB by the creek for the greens of hole 3, 15, and 16 long also added a few more challenges into the mix as well...

[Moderator005]

Needs to updated to include Nockamixon State Park

Indeed!

As indicated by the thread title, Chuck's list is from 2004.

[ck34]

Something that probably needs to be considered from a design and operations standpoint is what is acceptable for the length of a round in PDGA play for a course to be played twice in a day. My sense is that 4 hours is the maximum per round to be done twice. That's 8 hours on the course which is about the same as the old school courses where sometimes people play three 18s in a day at 2.5 hours per round for 7.5 hours.

If a course takes more than 4 hours per round, then it should probably move into the one round a day category which is more suitable for stagger start rounds with tee times. Even the Winthrop Gold course takes less than 4 hours to play with an SSA around 68 and it's only played once per day. The other alternative is to play a much shorter course or shorter tees on that course if rounds go over 4 hours from the longs.

We're going to have a challenge for Worlds next year because even our Gold course in the 60 SSA range is rugged enough to take 4 hours to play. At last year's Mid-Nationals, players in the Green division (775-824) took almost 5 hours to play from the shorter White tees. We were planning to boost the SSA to almost 63 on the Gold course for PW2007 but we'll probably need to test the timing during a warmup event a few months ahead of time. Some Open players will potentially play two courses with SSAs of 61 and 63 each taking 4 hours with 90 minutes inbetween.

[Moderator005]

It would be a real shame if tournament length of rounds could possibly affect the design and operations (tee and pin choices) of courses. At a relaxed pace (even taking a full 30 seconds on most shots) I can play casual rounds by myself on most SSA 45-54 courses in less than two hours. Even as part of a group of 2-4 regulars that I shoot with, that amount of time barely rises. On courses with an SSA of 54 to 66, I've rarely exceeded 3 hours. I play the pro par 66 Moraine S.P. course outside of Pittsburgh and it rarely exceeds 3 hours.

I don't know what it is about tournament golf, but the pace of play has gotten ridiculously slow. I've heard horror stories of 6 and 7-hour rounds at a very popular tournament in my region. Slow play is part of the reason I don't play tournament disc golf anymore.

[ck34]

I'm not saying it should necessarily prevent people from developing courses that exceed 4 hours when more than say 50% loaded for events. However, it should be a consideration as part of many other design issues. After all, ball golfers don't normally expect to play more than one round in a day. I'm not sure our expectations should be much different for our SSA 65+ courses.

One reason for adding the White tees on our Gold course is the time it takes to play from the Gold tees. The Gold course is already the least popular of the courses at Highbridge due to length and scale of the holes. The shortest two courses rule in popularity. But at least playing a 6500-7000 ft round from the Whites is similar in time for playing the Blues at a typical public course.

[AviarX]

Here are the top 10 SSA permanent course layouts that can be played without a special setup for an event. I'm not sure about #10 Still Waters Farm if someone would like to confirm that one.

Chuck, could you update this chart to bring it to date? i think Idlewild's 70.42 may now be at the top(?)

also, is there a way to get the course statistics page to rank all courses rather than just one course as is the case here ?

[ck34]

I'll see about getting an update. Interestingly, I just played #10 on the list yesterday in Govan, SC. This course is in jeopardy of being pulled and Sarasota has been pulled so we'll have some changes to the list.

[ChrisWoj]

The Gold course is already the least popular of the courses at Highbridge due to length and scale of the holes.

Say it aint so Chuck! Say it aint so!

<3 Gold.

[keldog]

WHAT?
Gold is the one to play!I hope to go in 2007,if you havn't been there your missing OUT.