Ask Chuck Kennedy

[cgkdisc]

Seems like the US Master title is the first one and the second one is the Master winner at the US Womens Championship.

[Marc Theodore]

Hi Chuck,
The Parma Open just concluded yesterday, Oct 8. We played two rounds on a 21 hole layout (par 63 with 3 temp holes). I noticed that the unofficial results show "to par" numbers based on an 18 hole, par 54 layout. Is this something that gets worked out with the TD as results move toward "Final?" Thanks!

[cgkdisc]

Yes. The TD didn't update the default 18 hole value in the score upload area to 21 holes. However, TDs usually get the hole count right when they submit the official TD report to the PDGA to process official ratings.

[lisle]

Hey Chuck,

Will last week's USDGC rounds be rated?

[Conar7]

I played in my first tournament at the end of July, with 2 rounds. When the original results of the tournament were posted, each round had a rating for all players. I have been waiting and expecting to receive a rating with the last couple ratings updates but have not up to this point. I hadn't checked in a while, but now the tournament results have no round ratings. This was the Three Rivers Open in Fort Wayne, on July 24. Is there a reason I am not getting a rating now, and if so, how come?

Thanks!!

[jmonny]

Originally Posted by Conar7

I played in my first tournament at the end of July, with 2 rounds. When the original results of the tournament were posted, each round had a rating for all players. I have been waiting and expecting to receive a rating with the last couple ratings updates but have not up to this point. I hadn't checked in a while, but now the tournament results have no round ratings. This was the Three Rivers Open in Fort Wayne, on July 24. Is there a reason I am not getting a rating now, and if so, how come?

Thanks!!

The ratings you saw before were the Unofficial round ratings that are generated when the scores are posted. The ratings do not become official until the TD report is completed & turned in. Then there is a period where no ratings are shown until the next update. You should get an official rating at the next update and the Official round ratings will return to the event results page.

[cgkdisc]

lisle - Will last week's USDGC rounds be rated?

TBD. They will not be in the Oct 25th update. We want to evaluate the results compared with the T&D rounds in the 2010 USDGC and PDGA rounds with regular rules. If we recommend they not be rated, we'll ask the Board to discuss and make a determination one way or the other in their November meeting.

[krupicka]

Why would they not be rated?

[cgkdisc]

Sufficient statistical indicators that T&D applied on most holes is a "different" game where using players who have ratings in our regular game to produce T&D ratings is statistically skewed, sort of like using our player ratings to produce SSA and ratings for rounds of ball golf.

[PhillyDogg]

Hiya Chuck.... Do you think the smoking ban will hold up if someone decides to challenge it? As a smoker, I don't think it is a good rule. What happens when a person, that is allergic to bees, argues that sweetened drinks attract bees and are also a health risk? And lets not forget honey, peanuts, chocolate, raw fruits, cologne/perfume, Tide laundry detergent, latex, Tylenol, pets(SMELL AND HAIR LEFT BY ANIMALS), other dairy products, etc..... I think the PDGA better think twice about the smoking ban. Unless they are also banning every drink except water.....I'm guessing the PDGA won't have a leg to sand on. If people don't like the smoke, go somewhere else. 100% of the tournaments are held outdoors, deal with the smoke or move away. I could understand if each tournament was inside a 30x30 indoor shed. Drop this RULE and move on to something important. Otherwise, sit and wait for the lawsuits to pile up.....

[sammyshaheen]

PhillyDogg
It's hard to simply move away from smokers second hand
smoke sometimes. Some tee boxes are cramped quarters. Many areas
are tight and we walk single file sometimes. Second hand smoke is
bad and the public is on a witch hunt against it. This battle the smokers
will not win.

There will be no lawsuits against this. The PDGA has standards that we
and you agree to when playing in their sanctioned events. A dress code will
also fall into these guidelines.

I am sure Southern Nationals will not be implementing a smoking ban anytime
soon. The SN numbers will certainly grow with some of the changes being made
at PDGA headquarters.

[16670]

Originally Posted by PhillyDogg

Hiya Chuck.... Do you think the smoking ban will hold up if someone decides to challenge it? As a smoker, I don't think it is a good rule. What happens when a person, that is allergic to bees, argues that sweetened drinks attract bees and are also a health risk? And lets not forget honey, peanuts, chocolate, raw fruits, cologne/perfume, Tide laundry detergent, latex, Tylenol, pets(SMELL AND HAIR LEFT BY ANIMALS), other dairy products, etc..... I think the PDGA better think twice about the smoking ban. Unless they are also banning every drink except water.....I'm guessing the PDGA won't have a leg to sand on. If people don't like the smoke, go somewhere else. 100% of the tournaments are held outdoors, deal with the smoke or move away. I could understand if each tournament was inside a 30x30 indoor shed. Drop this RULE and move on to something important. Otherwise, sit and wait for the lawsuits to pile up.....

It has nothing to do with a health issue...its an image issue..somehow the PDGA has decided that all its members that play in its "elite events" should be transformed into rolemodels for all the viewing public and younger members.

I personaly think this is a mistake but the board has spoken..join the 10-15 in my area that have decided not to renew next year.not to mention the 3-4 tourneys that a smoker has ran the last few years that will not be sanctioned in 2012.to me this is the smokers way of letting the board know that there decision has a negative effect.If every smoker chose not to renew in 2012 the pdga might see its first decline in membership and review its decision.

Also another question about the e-cig that was banned.does the Pdga understand that these devices can be perscribed by a physician and gotten through a pharmacy.What will the Pdga do when someone shows up at a elite tourny with one and gets booted for following a doctors written orders?

[cgkdisc]

PhillyDog - The non-smoking policy for Majors has to do with whether a sport's ruling body can make rules regarding how the sport is played in sanctioned competition, regardless of the reason for the rule, whether it makes sense, is stupid or ill-advised in some players' opinions. Unless the rule requires players to do something illegal in that municipality, a sport does have the right to restrict even legal behaviors as specified in their rules.

For example, even though we have the constitutional right for freedom of speech, disc golf has a warning/penalty for speaking at the time another player is making their throw. No one is likely to take that temporary restriction in disc or ball golf regarding freedom of speech to court.

There's no written constitutional right to smoke. However, wafting second hand smoke on other people is apparently covered under battery laws in some states from what I understand and that's been upheld when tested. If any suit might be filed, it could potentially be a player suing another player for exposure to their second hand smoke and the PDGA could even be included for not having a rule against it.

I'm a non-smoker and appreciate the new restriction as a player. However, had I been on the Board, I'm not sure which way I would have voted. Fortunately, I didn't have to. To me, using the blanket Throw & Distance penalty at a Major (USDGC) is a much bigger rule issue that I would vote against for the future.

[Dana]

So what is the SSA looking like from the "USDGC"? Are you going to reccomend that the rounds not be rated?

[cgkdisc]

Don't have all the information processed yet. Might not be until next week after the ratings update is posted.

[bazkitcase5]

I personally would like to see the rounds count. I understand the reasons for not doing so and it is hard to argue otherwise, but I do not think those who played the course intelligently and properly, with the hopes of the rounds counting towards their rating, should be penalized.

Players came into the tournament knowing what course was to be played and what the course rules were and those who made the better decisions and played the best should be rewarded with their ratings.

Maybe in the future, a tournament like this could be required to have X tier status, like mulligan tournaments do, but as it was set up, some of us went into the tournament expecting our rounds to be rated.

[Patrick P]

Originally Posted by 16670

I personaly think this is a mistake but the board has spoken..join the 10-15 in my area that have decided not to renew next year.not to mention the 3-4 tourneys that a smoker has ran the last few years that will not be sanctioned in 2012.to me this is the smokers way of letting the board know that there decision has a negative effect.If every smoker chose not to renew in 2012 the pdga might see its first decline in membership and review its decision.

Ah, we really are going to miss the inconsiderate self-centered people like you...not. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DksSPZTZES0

[PhillyDogg]

Originally Posted by cgkdisc

PhillyDog - The non-smoking policy for Majors has to do with whether a sport's ruling body can make rules regarding how the sport is played in sanctioned competition, regardless of the reason for the rule, whether it makes sense, is stupid or ill-advised in some players' opinions. Unless the rule requires players to do something illegal in that municipality, a sport does have the right to restrict even legal behaviors as specified in their rules.

For example, even though we have the constitutional right for freedom of speech, disc golf has a warning/penalty for speaking at the time another player is making their throw. No one is likely to take that temporary restriction in disc or ball golf regarding freedom of speech to court.

There's no written constitutional right to smoke. However, wafting second hand smoke on other people is apparently covered under battery laws in some states from what I understand and that's been upheld when tested. If any suit might be filed, it could potentially be a player suing another player for exposure to their second hand smoke and the PDGA could even be included for not having a rule against it.

I'm a non-smoker and appreciate the new restriction as a player. However, had I been on the Board, I'm not sure which way I would have voted. Fortunately, I didn't have to. To me, using the blanket Throw & Distance penalty at a Major (USDGC) is a much bigger rule issue that I would vote against for the future.

You never addressed the sweetened drink issue though. But anyway....

Lets pose this this question....How would the PDGA feel about mandatory drug testing before and after any tournament?? I'm guessing there is no way the PDGA Board would ever approve this. The membership would drop by 50% in a heartbeat. If this is smoking ban is about the "IMAGE", lets institute the drug testing. Major sports do it, why not us? We need a good image and don't want to be known as "potheads". I think the Boards decision is more of a personal choice rather than an image choice. If not, bring on the drug tests. Don't tell me that it wouldn't be cost effective either. Anyone who cashes can forfeit their prize if they fail to pay for the tests.

And by the way, I am one of the smokers that will stay 50 ft behind my group when I smoke. Anyone that knows me will verify that. I purposely stay away from non smokers. I know it bothers people. If we are in a tight area, I will not light up. So don't think that I'm some sort of ******* that stands next to another golfer and blows smoke towards a player that is driving or putting.

[cgkdisc]

Regarding drug testing, the World Flying Disc Federation has already agreed to abide by the WADA drug testing rules. The PDGA has discussed it at the Summit meeting. Looks like drug testing would only be pursued by necessity if the PDGA gets invited to participate in World level events where it's required such as World Games or Olympics way down the road.

I did address the sweetened drink issue if you re-read my first paragraph. A sport's ruling body can establish rules of play that don't violate local laws at their choice. They haven't chosen to deal with sweetened drinks. The insurance policy covers such issues should a court feel the PDGA was negligent for not addressing it. But that's highly unlikely.

[16670]

i know that drug testing is not going to happen for everyone..but why not just drug test all the board members?I really want to know that the people that are making decisions arent "high"lets put that in the next "survey" if 90% agree with that im guessing it would go through. anyone disagree?

[cgkdisc]

It would only seem fair that those who want to vote whether to drug test the Board members must also pass a drug test before being allowed to cast their vote. I know I wouldn't pass it since I'm on beta blocker heart medication which is illegal on the WADA list for several precision type sports including golf. Disc golf would likely be added to that list if we participated in WADA drug testing.

[pterodactyl]

Chuck, I'm bored and the message board isn't helping much. So I was wondering about your signature "rater of the tossed arc"; it doesn't make sense to me. You don't toss the arc. The arc is the resulting shape of tossing the disc. Please explain.

[cgkdisc]

Rating the results of another player's tossed arc.


(posted just so you had bit of excitement on this D-Board today)

[quickdisc]

http://www.pdga.com/announcements/2012-smoking-policy

[pterodactyl]

Originally Posted by cgkdisc

Rating the results of another player's tossed arc.


(posted just so you had bit of excitement on this D-Board today)

But are you/they actually throwing an arc? It seems like a grammatical reference problem to me.

[cgkdisc]

If you prefer, it could be short for Archon...

Why is throwing an arc or arcing shot any different from throwing a hyzer which is the shape of a throw not an object?

[ishkatbible]

any word on when the 4th round ratings for uswdgc will be fixed/entered for intermediate and rec?

[pterodactyl]

Originally Posted by cgkdisc

If you prefer, it could be short for Archon...

Why is throwing an arc or arcing shot any different from throwing a hyzer which is the shape of a throw not an object?

Raiders of the lost ark! Duh!+Doh!

[cgkdisc]

---

ishkatbible - any word on when the 4th round ratings for uswdgc will be fixed/entered for intermediate and rec?

Checking on it.

[ishkatbible]

Originally Posted by cgkdisc

Checking on it.

thanks