Ask Chuck Kennedy

[ChrisEads]

Chuck
If the next ratings update is July 20th and I have a tourney that I played last year on july 18th-19th. Will that stay on the next update or will it get dropped?

[pdorries]

deleted question... nvm

[thediscinmusician]

Question: After a tournament there's an "unofficial" rating, and then after the ratings are turned in, that "rating" changes. Sometimes it's better; sometimes it's worse? Can someone explain to me what they change and how come it just doesnt stay the same? What factors in that change? Thanks for whatever info anyone can give me!

[krupicka]

The official rating changes for some or all of the following reasons: course info was not correct for the unofficial ratings, the unofficial rating system does not know who are valid gators, multiple rounds may have been combined, a player's pdga # might have been incorrect, the official rating system has a slightly different formula.

[ishkatbible]

Originally Posted by jmonny

Could a non-playing, pdga official follow along with a 2-some and by keeping score or monitoring the scorecard be a possible solution to this?

from the competition manual...

1.6. Grouping and Sectioning

C. To promote fairness, groups shall not
be less than three players, except under
extenuating circumstances, as deemed
necessary by the director. In cases where fewer
than three players are required to play together
players, an official is required to accompany
the group and may play as long as this does not
interfere with the competing players.

[jmonny]

Originally Posted by ishkatbible

from the competition manual...

1.6. Grouping and Sectioning

C. To promote fairness, groups shall not
be less than three players, except under
extenuating circumstances, as deemed
necessary by the director. In cases where fewer
than three players are required to play together
players, an official is required to accompany
the group and may play as long as this does not
interfere with the competing players.

Well there you go.

So if a TD is running a small event where there are 3-somes only it would be a good idea for him to have a non-playing official at the ready to help in this case.

[cgkdisc]

If the next ratings update is July 20th and I have a tourney that I played last year on july 18th-19th. Will that stay on the next update or will it get dropped?

They will still be on there because you won't have an event in that update that was played after July 19 because the event deadline for events that can be rated will be two weeks earlier than July 20th.

[DSproAVIAR]

Chuck,

What's the reasoning behind the minimum rating cap?

The high end cap of int women is 800, so the minimum gator cap is guaranteeing that if there is ever an exclusive int/rec women pool, they will never get ratings. That doesn't seem right.

[DSproAVIAR]

Chuck,

Unrelated to previous question-

Say I'm supposed to start the 2nd round of a tournament on #3. All groups are 3somes. I get there and only 1 other player in my group is there. 2 minute horn goes off, then the tee off horn goes off and the 3rd player never shows.

I thought that at this point, we are supposed to wait on the tee with the other player until the next 2 groups pass, and one of us joins up with each group to make 4somes.

I can't find anything about this in the rules or the comp manual.

What is the official procedure here?

[TroMac]

Chuck

At Warm Up For the Am Worlds #2, Grandmasters, Senior Grandmasters, and Junior <13 Boys played three shorter tees at Aumiller. The ratings are listed as playing the same tees. Only Open & Adv Masters played long tees on holes 3-6-11. This was for our 2nd Round, which we played at Aumiller.
Advanced & Jr. Women were playing at Marion for the 2nd round.
Thanks
T-Mac

[cgkdisc]

T-Mac - I sent the correction notice to Gentry for the July update.

[cgkdisc]

What's the reasoning behind the minimum rating cap? The high end cap of int women is 800, so the minimum gator cap is guaranteeing that if there is ever an exclusive int/rec women pool, they will never get ratings. That doesn't seem right.

It's not reasoning but math. We've tested props down to 800 for reliability (standard deviation) with the formulas but have not had enough data until recently to confirm that we can go lower. We hope to work the 750 and higher props into the system later this year and maybe get to 700 eventually.

[cgkdisc]

Say I'm supposed to start the 2nd round of a tournament on #3. All groups are 3somes. I get there and only 1 other player in my group is there. 2 minute horn goes off, then the tee off horn goes off and the 3rd player never shows. I thought that at this point, we are supposed to wait on the tee with the other player until the next 2 groups pass, and one of us joins up with each group to make 4somes. I can't find anything about this in the rules or the comp manual. What is the official procedure here?

There is no official procedure but when that happens, the accepted first choice is to split up with one of you joining the group ahead and the other the group behind if those holes have groups. You can also play as a fivesome with a group close to you for a few holes until it can work out to split up if your group will slow the course down.

[bruce_brakel]

Originally Posted by DSproAVIAR

Chuck,

What's the reasoning behind the minimum rating cap?

The high end cap of int women is 800, so the minimum gator cap is guaranteeing that if there is ever an exclusive int/rec women pool, they will never get ratings. That doesn't seem right.

The other thing Chuck neglected to mention is that at tournaments that have not had any gators in their pool, like the Intermediate/Rec pool at Women's Nationals, the PDGA ratings guys have often calculated ratings off the players who have enough rounds to be gators. If you are planning on running a tournament with a no-gator pool, you might want to talk to the PDGA office in advance to see if they can flag it for special treatment.

[Fats]

Chuck, it looks like at this weekend's King of the Lake tourney in CA/NV, whoever uploaded the scores neglected to do two things: 1) neglected to separate the two groups into appropriate courses. All pros (and the advanced masters) played one course, and all ams played the other course. Then we swapped. Right now, it appears as though all ratings are as though everyone played one. I know it's just preliminary, but any way to adjust that so even the unofficial results are closer? (This seems to have happened with rounds 3 and 4 on day two) 2) less importantly they put all pars 54. On the first day, the 1st round of ams and 2nd round of pros should have been a par 57. 2nd day, am round one and pro round 2 should have been par 58. That's just so I feel better with a number not around zero.

[cgkdisc]

Please ask the TD to make the adjustments. I don't like to tweak the unofficial numbers without really knowing what the layouts are and potentially messing up what the TD is doing for uploading.

[born2lose]

Hello Chuck,
I have a question that i figured you probably know the answer to. We have no courses around here within 50 miles or so with approved targets. I was wondering how i can run a PDGA event on one of our tone pole courses. Could i put in approved temporary targets (innova discatcher sports) for the tourney and have it sanctioned? What would the process be to run an event like this? We have a club, we have baskets, we have quite a few players that are mostly all PDGA members, we just are sick of driving hours and hours to play sanctioned events on courses we rarely ever play. I would appreciate it if you point me in the right direction on how to begin running an event around here. Thank you for your time.
-Jesse

[cgkdisc]

You can run a sanctioned event on tone poles or portable baskets as long as you do it as an X-tier. Your players will still get points and ratings.

[atlscott]

When figuring out how many rounds to double for ratings calcuations, do you always round up, always round down, round normally (up or down depending on decimal), or is deference given to whichever creates the higher rating?

Thanks for your assistance and sorry for not being more diligent in finding where this has already been posted.

Also, in the instance of casual relief where line of play relief would put a player out of bounds, why can't there be an option for relief that allows for relief behind the lie along the out of bounds line (up to 5 meters)? I only ask because I was "forced" to play from knee deep swampy mud in a casual relief area because line of play relief reached out of bounds before dry ground in that direction. I know I could have taken an unplayable lie but in the case of casual obstacles that seems a little extreme.

While I'm on a roll, can the next rules update state in bold print "only for use with OB relief" in the rule of verticality? I couldn't convince 2 certified officials of this at a tourney this past weekend even after showing them the rule in black and white in the book. They wanted to allow a player to play from a surface 10 feet or so above their disc (which was under something) because they had a difficult time taking a stance where the disc was laying. I asked a longtime area TD and a sponsored pro after the event and neither one seemed to agree with my understanding of the rule.

Thanks again for your time Chuck!

[cgkdisc]

Round up

In the rule update, casual relief may include returning to the previous lie as an option with no penalty. The TD is allowed to specify extended relief or a drop zone as an option under current rules to deal with things like large casual relief areas or where relief would extend into OB like your situation.

I think the stacked playing surface options will be addressed in the upcoming rules revision, but as you point out, there's no allowance for moving vertically to a higher playing surface if your lie is already on a playing surface, even if you don't like it.

[ChrisEads]

So if the Basket is elevated on top of a bench and your disc lands underneath the bench You must mark your lie where your disc is and stretch out and putt out. Correct??

Someone this weekend told me that you could mark your lie on top of the bench straight up from your disc. And putt out from there. Please tell me this not correct

[krupicka]

You need to mark your lie on the playing surface. Generally the bench would not be considered a playing surface. Even if it was a playing surface, you cannot move your disc from one playing surface (the bench) up to a playing surface above. Stacked playing surfaces are covered in the Rules Q&A FAQ.

[flynvegas]

Chuck,
When are the 2010 HOF inductees announced?

[cgkdisc]

Announced on PDGA Radio in the 6/24/10 edition:
http://www.pdga.com/pdgaradio

[flynvegas]

Thx, I'll have to get with Speedy to buy this years HOF disc.

[quickdisc]

Hey Chuck ,

I have something that has been bothering me for sometime and I was told to let it Go.

Played a PDGA Sanctioned round with this Guy , Two Minutes were called , and he was loading Bowls of Marijuana into his Pipe. Tournament Director said at the Players meeting , Absolutely no smoking pot during the round.

I Told him I was a PDGA Official and he said he was too !!!! So as I understand this , PDGA Officials should know the Rules !!!

4 Holes into this specific round
I warned him again , but he said he has a Medical Marijuana Card that Allows him to smoke pot anytime without repercussions. I looked at the other members of the group and they shook there heads NO ! He smoked 3 Bowls of Pot between the next 2 Holes. I was ******.
He was warned atleast Twice by me and the TD.

Is there such a Rule that Stipulates , If a Individual has a Medical Marijuana Card Validated , He can be allowed to Smoke Pot anytime ?

I was told to Mind my own business. WTF !!!!!

I'm a PDGA Official , playing a PDGA Sanctioned Event Round !!!! He should have been DQ'd as far as I'm concerned!!!

[quickdisc]

Hey Chuck ,

I have something that has been bothering me for sometime and I was told to let it Go.

Played a PDGA Sanctioned round with this Guy , Two Minutes were called , and he was loading Bowls of Marijuana into his Pipe. Tournament Director said at the Players meeting , Absolutely no smoking pot during the round.

I Told him I was a PDGA Official and he said he was too !!!! So as I understand this , PDGA Officials should know the Rules !!!

4 Holes into this specific round
I warned him again , but he said he has a Medical Marijuana Card that Allows him to smoke pot anytime without repercussions. I looked at the other members of the group and they shook there heads NO ! He smoked 3 Bowls of Pot between the next 2 Holes. I was Very Upset.
He was warned atleast Twice by me and the TD.

Is there such a Rule that Stipulates , If a Individual has a Medical Marijuana Card Validated , He can be allowed to Smoke Pot anytime ?

I was told to Mind my own business. WTF !!!!!

I'm a PDGA Official , playing a PDGA Sanctioned Event Round !!!! He should have been DQ'd as far as I'm concerned!!!

[cgkdisc]

Marijuana cannot be used during the round regardless whether a person has a permit to legally use it in the state. It's the same with alcohol which cannot be consumed by players during the round even if they are old enough and the park allows it. These items can be consumed before, between or after rounds if they can legally do so based on age, license and/or permission granted by the venue. If a player is so disabled that they cannot do without medical marijuana for the length of a round, they are simply too disabled to play. Contact Gentry if you wish to discuss your specific situation: dgentry@pdga.com

[bruce_brakel]

This is what the rules say:

C.The use of illegal substances is forbidden
from the two minute warning until the
player’s scorecard is submitted. Such use
shall result in immediate disqualification.

D. Consumption of alcohol is expressly
forbidden from the two minute warning
until the player’s scorecard is submitted.
Such use shall result in immediate
disqualification at a B Tier or higher event.
(This rule is still in effect at “C Tier” events.
However, the Tournament Director may
elect to issue a warning to the offending
player instead of immediately disqualifying
them. If a player has been issued a warning,
all subsequent violations shall result in

immediate disqualification.)

In my opinion the rule is not as cut and dried as Chuck would interpret it.

Oh, yeah, I meant that bad wordplay!

[bruce_brakel]

You might want to consult the medical marijuana law of your state, which you can probably find in 5 minutes with Google, your state name and the words medical marijuana. It may be that a medical marijuana license only allows use in the holder's home or a licensed facility. You might also want to consult the local park rules. They may have a rule against the consumption of marijuana regardless of whether the person has a license.

Edit: I looked at California medical marijuana laws. If smoking is prohibited in the park, smoking medical marijuana is also prohibited. Smoking medical marijuana is also prohibited within 1000 feet of a school or recreation center.