Ask Dave Dunipace About Innova Discs - Page 381

davei · May 04 2010, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HMont

Hey Dave, what discs do you recommend for the hyzer flip shot and would a champion plastic work or are they too stable?

Can't really answer that question without knowing how much power you have and what your preferred style is.

Any unstable disc will do it depending on power, release angle, and angle of attack. Higher power players need more stable discs for longer distances and accuracy, but could still use flippier discs if they know how to control them.

Champion plastic will work as well as any other. Domier discs work better for me as they tend to take a longer time coming back after they have flipped.

For medium power ranges like mine (350-450), Sidewinders and Roadrunner work well. Pro Wraiths and Katanas can work too, but I don't particularly like Pro plastic. If I am feeling whimpy, I can always use an R-Pro Boss to go long with a hyzer flip. If I am feeling a little froggy, I can use a Pro Boss, or Star Katana for a long drive thrill.

zj1002 · May 04 2010, 09:55 PM

Dave,

I just ordered some Champion Mako X-Outs from Discgolfvalues.com. I was curious if you had a chance to throw them and wanted to know how they turned out compared to their star counterparts(domey/flat/more stable/etc.)

Thanks,
-ZJ

exczar · May 04 2010, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davei

For medium power ranges like mine (350-450)

LOL - For a SGM, I wouldn't say that is "medium" power, I would say that it is darn good power!

davei · May 05 2010, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zj1002

Dave,

I just ordered some Champion Mako X-Outs from Discgolfvalues.com. I was curious if you had a chance to throw them and wanted to know how they turned out compared to their star counterparts(domey/flat/more stable/etc.)

Thanks,
-ZJ

Sorry, if I did, I don't remember the exact results. We expected them to be a little more stable than the Star. My only real experience has been with the Star.

gokayaksteven · May 05 2010, 07:41 PM

hey Dave-
do the star katanas get more overstable as they get 168 or lower? if so, how low should one go in the star katana and boss to get that overstability of the starlite process?
thanks

davei · May 06 2010, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gokayaksteven

hey Dave-
do the star katanas get more overstable as they get 168 or lower? if so, how low should one go in the star katana and boss to get that overstability of the starlite process?
thanks

We really haven't had an opportunity to do any Starlite in Star Katanas, so I don't know about the stability. The Boss is likely to be Starlite at 165-167gms.
Starlite Katanas would likely be in the high 50s to low 60s.

rizbee · May 06 2010, 08:59 AM

Hi Dave - I really like light, gummy drivers - they seem to hyzer flip nicely and carry well for me. One thing I have noticed is that in most cases these discs have very flat tops. Case in point - a 150g Champion Orc I am looking at right now has no noticeable dome in the flight plate. It has a flat, almost sunken top. Do you think this flat top will make the disc more stable than one would expect it to be, given the light weight?

Thanks, as always.

veganray · May 06 2010, 09:54 AM

If I may, rizbee: I have found those flat-to-concave-topped 150g gummies to be somewhat more overstable than would be expected for their mold & weight. This is particularly apparent in Teebirds, Vikings, & Beasts. Same trait is present (to a somewhat lesser extent) in those Orcs, which you will love, BTW, making them pretty darned straight flyers start to finish.

davei · May 06 2010, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rizbee

Hi Dave - I really like light, gummy drivers - they seem to hyzer flip nicely and carry well for me. One thing I have noticed is that in most cases these discs have very flat tops. Case in point - a 150g Champion Orc I am looking at right now has no noticeable dome in the flight plate. It has a flat, almost sunken top. Do you think this flat top will make the disc more stable than one would expect it to be, given the light weight?

Thanks, as always.

The high speed stability can't accurately be predicted by the dome or lack thereof. However, you can predict that the low speed over stability will be
exaggerated. Furthermore, there is some predictive correlation with respect to the flatter tops in one model of one material to be more high speed stable. But again, is not a reliable predictor.

Having spewed all this drivel, I would personally look for a medium dome. On another note: gummy plastic is particularly difficult to maintain consistency with.

ishkatbible · May 06 2010, 01:36 PM

speaking of dome/no dome tops... what was the deal with zipper-tops? i was going through my box-o-goodies that have been retired and found a 160-something zipper-top valk.
did that type of top do anything different for the disc? was it to hard to keep making?

davei · May 06 2010, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishkatbible

speaking of dome/no dome tops... what was the deal with zipper-tops? i was going through my box-o-goodies that have been retired and found a 160-something zipper-top valk.
did that type of top do anything different for the disc? was it to hard to keep making?

It has no effect on flight, but sometimes feels better in the hand. It is an artifact of new molds sometimes. It goes away after one or two runs.

TeeBob · May 06 2010, 03:06 PM

Hey Dave;

Are there any plans to ever make, or have yall ever made Skeeters in Champion plastic? I have seen some X-outs but am skeptical.

davei · May 06 2010, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TeeBob

Hey Dave;

Are there any plans to ever make, or have yall ever made Skeeters in Champion plastic? I have seen some X-outs but am skeptical.

Skeeters come in DX, R-Pro, and Star as regular offerings. We have not made any regular runs in Champion, but from my experience with Skeeters, I think that would be a good disc. It would probably be a tad bit more high speed stable. Molding time and opportunity is a problem for us right now, but I can see that happening in the future.

quickdisc · May 06 2010, 06:51 PM

Are Champion Makos only Fundraiser Discs ?

davei · May 06 2010, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by quickdisc

Are Champion Makos only Fundraiser Discs ?

Not sure if they are CFR only or TFR and custom stamping, but they are not mainstream.

TeeBob · May 06 2010, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davei

It would probably be a tad bit more high speed stable.

Yes, yes exactly what i was thinking.

I love my star and dx but not keen on R-Pro.

agyba · May 07 2010, 06:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishkatbible

speaking of dome/no dome tops... what was the deal with zipper-tops? i was going through my box-o-goodies that have been retired and found a 160-something zipper-top valk.
did that type of top do anything different for the disc? was it to hard to keep making?

What is a 'zipper-top'? First time I have heard that term. Any pics?

davei · May 07 2010, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by agyba

What is a 'zipper-top'? First time I have heard that term. Any pics?

They have a faint vinyl record look and feel.

rizbee · May 07 2010, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by veganray

If I may, rizbee: I have found those flat-to-concave-topped 150g gummies to be somewhat more overstable than would be expected for their mold & weight. This is particularly apparent in Teebirds, Vikings, & Beasts. Same trait is present (to a somewhat lesser extent) in those Orcs, which you will love, BTW, making them pretty darned straight flyers start to finish.

Ray - Yes, that 150g gummy Orc is da bomb! Hyzer-flips up to a remarkably straight flight. My fellow competitiors will be seeing a lot of it this weekend. I haven't had a chance to try out the others, but will over the next few weeks.

Dave - I would agree that one characteristic of the low-weight, flat-top gummy drivers I have thrown is exaggerated low-speed stability. People that I play with often comment on just that trait of the 150g gummy Sidewinder I throw. It's too bad they aren't consistent molders, but I'm happy to pick over the X-outs!

vadiscgolf · May 07 2010, 05:43 PM

Are the new r pro Rocs the regular rancho mold or something else? Thanks

ishkatbible · May 07 2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davei

They have a faint vinyl record look and feel.

yeah and if you run your nail across the top you get a zipper sound.

have any of the newer discs that were first/second runs had the zipper top? maybe that could be something for collectors to look for.

davei · May 07 2010, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vadiscgolf

Are the new r pro Rocs the regular rancho mold or something else? Thanks

I believe they were made with the Rancho + mold.

davei · May 07 2010, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishkatbible

yeah and if you run your nail across the top you get a zipper sound.

have any of the newer discs that were first/second runs had the zipper top? maybe that could be something for collectors to look for.

Very few of the newer molds, but I do recall some that didn't last through the first run.

gippy · May 07 2010, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishkatbible

yeah and if you run your nail across the top you get a zipper sound.

have any of the newer discs that were first/second runs had the zipper top? maybe that could be something for collectors to look for.

The Tee-Rex had this and I find they where more overstable then the ones with out it. The ones with the Big Star Stamp and the ones that where stamped with Tee-Rex not Teerex had the "record top".

Dave,
Did the Teerex get retooled after the 1st runs? They seem not so overstable as the 1st ones. They seem to fly like longer faster Teebird or Eagle IMO.

davei · May 07 2010, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gippy

The Tee-Rex had this and I find they where more overstable then the ones with out it. The ones with the Big Star Stamp and the ones that where stamped with Tee-Rex not Teerex had the "record top".

Dave,
Did the Teerex get retooled after the 1st runs? They seem not so overstable as the 1st ones. They seem to fly like longer faster Teebird or Eagle IMO.

The TeeRex got retooled twice after we found a defective duplicate part that wasn't a duplicate. It was really only the 2nd and 3rd runs that weren't quite as stable as they should have been. Subsequent runs with the new part, seem fine. That same defective part had been screwing with Vikings for a while too. We got that fixed too.

thediscinmusician · May 10 2010, 06:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davei

They have a faint vinyl record look and feel.

My first and ONLY ace is with a "zipper-top" Valkyrie. I just pulled it down off the wall to make that cool sound. Mine is a JK 4x Champion tie-dye valkyrie.

Furthur · May 10 2010, 10:16 AM

I had a couple of blood red champ Valks that made that zipper sound. They were some of the 1st discs I ever bought.

RhynoBoy · May 10 2010, 12:14 PM

Dave,

I think it's really cool that you made some "older" models in the Champion Glow lineup for CFR. The Gazelles and Leopards are great discs, and under-appreciated by some disc golfers today. I think another cool disc to see in the Champion Glow lineup would be the Cheetah. Would that be a possibility?

Thanks for your time,

Chris Tyler

davei · May 10 2010, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RhynoBoy

Dave,

I think it's really cool that you made some "older" models in the Champion Glow lineup for CFR. The Gazelles and Leopards are great discs, and under-appreciated by some disc golfers today. I think another cool disc to see in the Champion Glow lineup would be the Cheetah. Would that be a possibility?

Thanks for your time,

Chris Tyler

That would be a possibility. But right now, scheduling would be difficult at best.

gokayaksteven · May 10 2010, 04:56 PM

Dave -
i love the flights of my dx rocs, i carry 3-4 in different stages of wear, but am not as into the grip or feel of the mold. I love the feel of the buzz, but it is not quite stable enough for my taste. Can you suggest a dx-plastic replacement for the roc? I love the feel of the cro. would this work?

May 04 2010, 09:55 PM	#11402
zj1002 Community Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 11	Champion Mako Dave, I just ordered some Champion Mako X-Outs from Discgolfvalues.com. I was curious if you had a chance to throw them and wanted to know how they turned out compared to their star counterparts(domey/flat/more stable/etc.) Thanks, -ZJ

May 06 2010, 08:59 AM	#11407
rizbee PDGA Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: San Marcos, CA Posts: 2,402	Hi Dave - I really like light, gummy drivers - they seem to hyzer flip nicely and carry well for me. One thing I have noticed is that in most cases these discs have very flat tops. Case in point - a 150g Champion Orc I am looking at right now has no noticeable dome in the flight plate. It has a flat, almost sunken top. Do you think this flat top will make the disc more stable than one would expect it to be, given the light weight? Thanks, as always. __________________ "Gentlemen, we can rebuild him. We have the technology. We have the capability to build the world's first bionic disc golfer. Rizbee will be that golfer. Better than he was before. Better, stronger, birdie-er." - Oscar Goldman

May 06 2010, 01:36 PM	#11410
ishkatbible PDGA Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: San Antonio Tx Posts: 517	speaking of dome/no dome tops... what was the deal with zipper-tops? i was going through my box-o-goodies that have been retired and found a 160-something zipper-top valk. did that type of top do anything different for the disc? was it to hard to keep making? __________________ FullContactDiscGolf.com

May 06 2010, 06:51 PM	#11414
quickdisc PDGA Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: America\'s Finest City SD,CA. Posts: 6,186	Champion Makos. Are Champion Makos only Fundraiser Discs ?

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May 05 2010, 07:41 PM	#11405
gokayaksteven PDGA Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: telluride, co Posts: 1,489	hey Dave- do the star katanas get more overstable as they get 168 or lower? if so, how low should one go in the star katana and boss to get that overstability of the starlite process? thanks

May 06 2010, 09:54 AM	#11408
veganray Community Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: The defense table Posts: 2,177	If I may, rizbee: I have found those flat-to-concave-topped 150g gummies to be somewhat more overstable than would be expected for their mold & weight. This is particularly apparent in Teebirds, Vikings, & Beasts. Same trait is present (to a somewhat lesser extent) in those Orcs, which you will love, BTW, making them pretty darned straight flyers start to finish.

May 06 2010, 03:06 PM	#11412
TeeBob PDGA Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pflugerville Posts: 13	Hey Dave; Are there any plans to ever make, or have yall ever made Skeeters in Champion plastic? I have seen some X-outs but am skeptical.

May 07 2010, 05:43 PM	#11420
vadiscgolf PDGA Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The Grange Posts: 183	Are the new r pro Rocs the regular rancho mold or something else? Thanks

May 10 2010, 10:16 AM	#11427
Furthur PDGA Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 776	I had a couple of blood red champ Valks that made that zipper sound. They were some of the 1st discs I ever bought.

May 10 2010, 12:14 PM	#11428
RhynoBoy PDGA Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: The Sunflower State Posts: 519	Dave, I think it's really cool that you made some "older" models in the Champion Glow lineup for CFR. The Gazelles and Leopards are great discs, and under-appreciated by some disc golfers today. I think another cool disc to see in the Champion Glow lineup would be the Cheetah. Would that be a possibility? Thanks for your time, Chris Tyler

May 10 2010, 04:56 PM	#11430
gokayaksteven PDGA Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: telluride, co Posts: 1,489	Dave - i love the flights of my dx rocs, i carry 3-4 in different stages of wear, but am not as into the grip or feel of the mold. I love the feel of the buzz, but it is not quite stable enough for my taste. Can you suggest a dx-plastic replacement for the roc? I love the feel of the cro. would this work?