Personal Rating Calculator

I have implemented a Personal Rating Calculator in Excel.

If you have Excel and would like to try it out, you can get it at http://www.rodneygardner.com in the Frisbee Golf section. A screen-shot of the Calculator is here (http://home.carolina.rr.com/rodneyg/images/ratingcalc.jpg).

The Calculator allows you to enter your rounds (casual or tournament) and then it calculates your Rating using nearly the same calculations as the real PDGA Player Rating.

To use the Calculator:
- Enter the date, course, and score in the grey boxes.
- Hit ENTER or TAB to move out of the score box. (This is important.)
- Click the "Add Score" button.

The Calculator is pre-loaded with some courses in Carolina, Texas, and Iowa. You can add your own courses. There is an "SSA Estimator" included to help you figure out the SSA for your course (using length, known rounds, etc.) Now that the on-line results have round-by-round ratings, you can easily calculate an estimated SSA for any course that was used in a PDGA event.

The Calculator currently holds up to 1000 courses and 1000 rounds, but can easily be expanded (by you) to handle 10,000 rounds.

The Calculator is not endorsed by the PDGA, nor is it related to my work on the Ratings Committee.

The Calculator is supplied as-is, and I won't be held responsible for any damage as a result of using it. It has been tested on Excel 2000 and Excel 2002.

If you have any questions, I will try to answer them here or via e-mail.

[mikel]

this is very nice. Thank You.

Too much time Rodney. BTW: You now have access to the club section on the dsm site. /msgboard/images/clipart/happy.gif

[jose]

Rodney thanks for sharing your time and effort with us.

Rodney, that is very very cool, thanks for going thru all that work.

[danniestacey]

Rodney, that is cool. Do you have anything for league play. I keep track of the scores for the mini's around town. I would like to do ratings for PDGA members, but I would need something to track rounds for multiple people, rounds, and courses. Please let me know if you have anything.

[keithjohnson]

By Dan Howard on Tuesday, April 22, 2003 - 12:53 pm:
Rodney, that is very very cool, thanks for going thru all that work


hey dan finally found a way to figure out a wcp for an all ram round huh?
/msgboard/images/clipart/happy.gif

You're welcome guys. If anyone has trouble figuring out SSAs, don't hesitate to ask. They are certainly the most confusing part of the whole thing until you get used to them.

Daniel, as for league/mini play, I don't have anything built. But you have some options.

First, let's talk about single rounds.

Chuck has a spreadsheet in which you can enter players, their ratings, and their scores. It then gives you an SSA for that round, as well as single-point ratings for all the players. The drawbacks here are that you need 10 or more rated players involved, and it's a bit more work from a data entry standpoint.

The other option is to decide on an SSA for each course, and then just look up the single-point rating for each player based on that SSA and their score. You can look them up here (http://www.pdga.com/discus/messages/534/8202.html?1045092509), or on a spreadsheet that has the same data and the formulas (you can modify the spreadsheet to include non-integer SSAs). The drawback here is that SSA is technically a dynamic number that is based on each round of play. Therefore, using a set SSA will not be as accurate. But under fairly normal conditions, it should be close.

Now, let's talk about overall play across several minis or league rounds.

If I were you, I wouldn't worry about the actual Rating calculation. I would just figure individual round ratings, and use an average of those. You could also throw out 1 or 2 or any set number or percentage of rounds. This is probably good enough for a leage season or series of minis.

Let me know if this doesn't make sense or if I can help further.

C'mon Keith, you know that the WCP for an all Ram round would be significantly lower than normal and completely hose the PDGA database!

I have a question about the course ratings. I would assume there is a updated list somewhere. The one on the PDGA site is still based on 2000 courses and I would be interested in finding out what our current course ratings are. Thanks

[keithjohnson]

true dan,true....hadn't thought about that /msgboard/images/clipart/happy.gif

Larry, there isn't a newer published list. I'm hoping the database will be on-line at some point.

Until then, you can work things backward from tournament results to get the SSAs from last year's tournaments. If you'd like an example, just give me the tournament and I'll go through it here.

Rodney, an example would be Mardi Gras Madness 2003. Results are in the latest points update. Thanks!

Goby, round-by-round rating info isn't available on-line for this year yet. But here's an example from last year.

Take Mardi Gras 2002. Pick someone. I'll pick Rivers Sherrod. He shot:
58 - 949
52 - 1005
57 - 958

So now you can go here (http://www.pdga.com/discus/messages/534/8202.html?1045092509) and find the score in the left column. Then go across until you find the rating. Once you find that, look up the SSA at the top of that column.

Doing this, you'll find that his rating falls right between a 52 and 53 SSA for each round, so whatever course was used for rounds 1, 2, and 3, the SSA is around 52.5.

Or, you can use the SSA Estimator on my Personal Rating Calculator. Just use "Method 2" on the estimator, and put in his Round Rating and his Score, and it will give the estimated SSA.

Note that we get the same answer, 52.5, whether we use Rivers or anyone else in his division. Other divisions will give different SSAs if they used different course configs. The important thing is don't use his overall player rating, use the round-by-round rating that shows what he "played at" for that round, along with his actual score.

Now, *importantly*, these assume 18 holes. If it was a different number of holes, you'd have to enter that number of holes on the Estimator.

Let me know if you have questions.

[magilla]

Rodney,
With the SSA calculator, I know its not "Offical". But how does it differ from the PDGA System? For example, Stafford Lake...
I am a rating of 951 and shoot 51 in first round. In contrast Avery Jenkins, 1011 shoots a 52.
How are these scores balanced. Does the PDGA drop a % of top or bottom scores to get an Average..
The way I figure it WCP would be 46 if you took my score (3 better than course record) or 53 if you took Averys...
Now seeing how Stafford is my Home Course I shoot MUCH better there than my Rating would show...

Im just waiting fo the "offical" SSAs to come out so I can see what weve got here.
I made an effort to sort out or different layouts so we could get accurate WCP for ALL future events.

Thanks and keep up the good work../msgboard/images/clipart/happy.gif

Magilla
NorCal Series
PDGA Coordinator (Calif-North)

Mike, it looks like you're sort of confusing a couple things. Let me try to straighten it out.

Terms used in this explanation:
Player Rating - Your actual PDGA rating.
Round Rating - Your "played at" level for the round.

You have a 951 Player Rating and shot 51. According to YOUR PLAY ONLY, it looks like the course SSA is 46.7.

Avery has a 1011 Player Rating and shot52. According to HIS PLAY ONLY, it looks like the course SSA is 53.2.

After looking at (at least) 10 other players, we would have a bunch of SSAs based on each person's play. In the real system, you can view it as these individual SSAs being averaged into the actual single SSA.

Let's say that we figure each person, then average all those SSAs, and the overall comes out to 52.5. That is the official SSA for THAT ROUND for that course.

Now, for fun, we can go back and see the Round Ratings for each player.

You shot 51 on a 52.5, so your Round Rating is 1014.

Avery shot 52 on a 52.5, so his Round Rating is 1005.

And so on for each person in the tournament.

Then, to bring it full circle, your Round Ratings over all your rounds are averaged (after tossing out the bottom 15%) to give you your updated Player Rating.

That's what goes on behind the scenes (at least conceptually) and how the SSAs get calculated, the Round Ratings get displayed, and the Player Ratings get updated.

Shift gears back to this thread now.

What I'm saying here is that all the full-field round-by-round SSAs aren't displayed anywhere. However, since each person has a Round Rating, and we know their score, we can figure out what the official SSA was for any round. (We also need to know the number of holes.)

If we use you, we plug your 1014 Round Rating and your 51 into the program and it says 52.5 for an SSA.

If we use Avery, we plug his 1005 Round Rating and his 52 into the program and it says 52.5.

And it would say 52.5 for each player that played the same config that round.

Hope that helps answer your question. As for your SSAs for Stafford, you're going to have to wait to see the Round Ratings. Or bribe me into calculating them off of the results.

Let me know if you have further questions.

[magilla]

/msgboard/images/clipart/proud.gif
Thanks Rodney that clears up my questions...

As for Bribery, Unless your planning a Trip to NorCals Wine Country, theres not much I can do for you../msgboard/images/clipart/happy.gif
But when you come this way Ill make it worth your while...

See your Stafford thread.

I was just there in September. My wife is begging to go back. But she wants to take our moms instead of me. The nerve.

Worse yet, North Carolina is a "no ship" state.

Hey this has been posted a few times I bet, but I can't find it. What is the formula for calculating player ratings?

Booty, you will soon have e-mail at your Yahoo account. If that's not right, e-mail me.

[chris]

I think you should also factor in how difficult it is to shoot better rounds. Like let's say the SSA is 50 for a course, you have a spread of almost 10 points per stroke which stays consistent for whatever score u shoot. But as you shoot a better and better round it's harder to make up that extra stroke. If your shooting right around 50 (WCP) , it's fairly easy to make up that extra stroke and shoot a 49, but let's say your shooting 44's. In order to shoot a 43 it is a lot harder since you have to nail almost every duece hole possible, and then to shoot a 42 and 41 it's increases even more in difficulty. I would think once you get so far away from the SSA the points should go up more drastically, like 15 points or so. Because how easy is it to make that extra 20' putt u missed to go from your 50 to that 49 compared to playing perfect and hitting that extra fairway ace to go from the 42 to the 41.

[chris]

BTW, barry's rating is 1047 for his first 6 tournaments of this year, that has to be some sort of record!!

[ck34]

Probably not. With Climo's rating at 1044 for 12 months of events, it's likely he's had stretches of 6 events with an average rating higher than 1047, but it's not something we check. We are interested to see last week's Tower report because Barry's last round of -14 could be one of the best of all time. If he keeps up this torrid pace, he has a chance to be the first player to have a rating higher than Climo since ratings started in 1998.

14 down at Tower is sick... 3 holes were put in to fill the players. Barry shot -12 on the permanent course and birdied 2 of the 3 temps, beating his own course record of -9 last year.

1st event that I played that did not have a players package for anyone. Must have been a good payout...I did not wait around as the course played me like a chump.

[chris]

I think it only comes out to be around 1075 or 1080, not quite the 1090's he was shooting at the Memorial

"only" lol /msgboard/images/clipart/proud.gif

[ck34]

It may be Chris. Too bad he missed that 35-foot putt on 13. Since many who played that day are included to determine the SSA calculation and it played pretty tough, it's possible that SSA might be just high enough to get Barry's rating to 1090 for that round. I know he'd be over 1100 if just my poor round was used for the SSA calcs...

[MTL21676]

Rodney....do u have a link to get excel....would love to try to use the ratings calculator but cant find where to download excel

Robert,

Excel isn't free. I don't believe there is any kind of free trial download or anything like that.

There may be clones for various platforms, but I'm not well versed in any of those. Sorry.

[Dick]

excel is a microsoft program, you can't get it for free(ethically at least). you can buy just excel at compusa etc. for like 80 or 90$

student pricing is even cheaper, check your school bookstore.

[MTL21676]

well i feel dumb...can maybe someone do it for me and tell me what it is.....heres my PDGA rounds

Buckhorn at Harris Lake, NC (White tees) 59, 61, 59
Zebulon PArk, NC...59, 67
Cedar Hills, NC....59, 66
Valley Springs, NC...57, 48, 55, 50

Thanks!

[ck34]

Here are some links to download Microsoft Office compatible shareware that will run Excel files.

http://www.software602.com/products/pcs/

http://www.openoffice.org/

[chris]

How do you guys figure out the SSA of a course after a tournament? Do you find the the ssa of each player and then average them all together??
Example:
Name Rating Score SSA
Haney 1021 47 49
Rico 1031 47 50
Heeren 1000 51 51
Warren 990 51 50
Average 50.0
Or is there a different way to do it?
I also tried just taking the average of everyone's player rating (1010) , then taking the average of all the scores (49) and looked up the ssa for that (50), it seems to work.
I was just wondering how you are suppose to do it.

Chris, in general terms, both of those produce similar results to the actual computation.

I believe the "average the individual SSAs" would be closer to how it is actually done. There are a few details (number of holes, not using all the players, etc) that make it more complicated, but it's similar.

I've never really thought of the "average rating and average score" method. I think it would be close, but something tells me that that's not quite as good a way to think of it.

[chris]

Well, I was just trying to figure out the Tower Ridge SSA since Barry shot a 49 the last round (-14) and I wanted to see how close to a 1090 round it actually was. Also I can't figure out how they woulda came up with the ratings for Tower Ridge's 2nd round last year, according to the pdga page only 1 person shot better than their actually rating, and no one shot over 1000.

[tanner]

Rodney, my excel program won't "create Control'ComboBox1'".....so I can't enter new score. any suggestions?

Tanner, are you on a Mac? If so, I have a Mac version that I can get to you, and it should work with just a couple of adjustments.

[chris]

Hey, I was just wondering if 12 hole rounds are calculated into our ratings. I just played a tournament where the format was 3 rounds of 12 holes (It's still 36 holes but do they count?)
Also even if they don't count is there a way to calculate a rating for a 12 hole round??

[ck34]

Only rounds reported with 14 holes or more are calculated for PDGA ratings. Savvy TDs will report 12-hole rounds as 24s if they know this. Or, in the case of one TD, he broke the three 12s into two 18s for the TD report sent to the PDGA.

The math will work in the SSA calculation template for 12 hole layouts but isn't considered valid to combine with rounds with more holes in the official ratings

[bruce_brakel]

Bummer for Chris. That -11 was probably a 1050ish kind of round!

[klemrock]

Not a bummer. Savvy TD will report as advised.

[discglfr]

Heeren, I really have to wonder about you sometimes. Did you drive 100 mph to get home and the second you did, jump on this board and ask that question? Your golf game certainly amazes me but your undying devotion to this board with *silly* questions and remarks is really astonishing.

Jim, I can't see how you would be able to 'fix' the scoring in order for that ratings to work. Simply because you would have to know what holes everyone shot on to divide it into two 18s. BUT, like my group did, some people just threw in scores where ever and stopped following the scorecards because they were confusing. The REALLY confusing part was when someone had hole 12 in the middle of the card and someone else might have hole 12 in the front of the card. So many groups just started all scores in one spot and put them in that order regardless of what the hole said on the card.

Chris, great shooting this weekend but you really need to get a life.

[klemrock]

Terry, all players followed the order of the card for the first round. For the second and third rounds, the hole on which each group started was circled with a highlighter on each card.
THANKS for coming down to the Flatland once again - its always good to have hearty Wisconsin players come and take our money. http://www.pdga.com/discus/clipart/happy.gif

[bruce_brakel]

Terry, for purposes of generating ratings that are correct on the average, Jim could just take the second round, divide it by two, and increase the first and third rounds by that many strokes.

Whether you shoot a 50-48 or a 34-32-32, you've still shot 98 on 36 holes. Your average rating for those 36 holes won't change significantly if the 34-32-32 is reported as 50-48 or a 51-47.

Jim, if Chuck says you can do it, do it. I started to hand calculate ratings at work and then my computer crashed. But I think my "52-51" will help and not hurt my rating.

[ck34]

It's not the solution we would encourage but submitting the scores as a single 36-hole round is acceptable under the circumstances.

[discglfr]

I believe I follow everyone's logic here that everyone DID play the first 24 holes the same. However, saying just THOSE 24 holes is one round would not necessarily be fair either. I shot well during the later 24 holes so I would personally want my scores for THOSE holes, skipping the first 12. The ONE round of 36 SOMEHOW seems more fair than the a 24/12 split.


BTW Jim, great time, great event, and great course. Keep me posted on more Waukegan events because I'll be there.

[klemrock]

Thanks Chuck, that will help bunches. Every time I run an event, I learn something.
Thanks Terry! Will there be a Wisconsin Hallowen tourney anywhere?

[sandalman]

in estimating the rating of a round, would it be reasonable to average all of the player's current ratings, average their scores, and input that data into the personal rating calculator to derive a course ssa... then add the course using those values and add your own round score in the round log?

seems like it makes sense, but i'm wondering if there is a better way... else i wait til mid-december to see how the approach compares to the "official" numbers the pdga releases

[chris]

That's how I figure out ratings for a round. It will give pretty accurate ratings, but I find out they're always 1 or 2 points off when the actual rating comes out.

[ck34]

Averaging is reasonable since the majority of courses played average in the 50 SSA neighborhood. However, using the average method for courses with SSAs less than say 46 or more than 54 will not match the official PDGA process as well because the compression factor gets involved.

[pterodactyl]

I shot the lowest last round at the Worlds this year and didn't get a rating on it since it was only 12 holes. I was looking forward to that round washing out one of my lousy rounds :(.

[chris]

I know how you feel, I shot a -11 on a 12 hole round with an ace, were the ssa was around -4 but it won't count since they can't do ratings for 12 holes :(

[pterodactyl]

Ouch! On the positive side, lower ratings mean that some may underestimate your abilities. It's a kind of uncontrollable sandbagging.

[neonnoodle]

At least now we are attempting to control it. It beats just yelling out "SANDBAGGER" at awards ceremonies.... :(

Every time I click on add it takes me to a screen and asks me for a vba project password. What is the password or what is my problem?

Every time I click on add it takes me to a screen and asks me for a vba project password. What is the password or what is my problem?



Hmmm, sorry about that.

Since it's trying to get into the vba project, that means it's blowing up for some reason.

Does it do anything before it asks for that password? And after you get out of the password prompt, does it give any further error message?

Possibilities:
- Are you on a Mac?
- Are you using an Excel version other than 97 or 2000 or 2002?
- When entering data, make sure you enter a valid date, a course that's in the dropdown list, a valid number for the score, and then hit the "tab" key to get out of the "Score" box before clicking the "Add Score" button.
- It's possible there's some security setting you have enabled that isn't allowing the code to execute properly.

If none of these help, e-mail me (rodneyg@carolina.rr.com) the Excel file and the exact steps you're trying to do, and I'll try to figure it out. Worst case I can give you the password that will unlock the code so that we can see the actual error message.

[jmonny]

When can we expect our next PDGA Rating update?

When can we expect our next PDGA Rating update?



Don't quote me, but I think there is an update planned for December 15.